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CNN detailing all the threats against her and the vandalism of her office by tea baggers. Where the F@#% was the secret service?

Peter Wiggin wrote:Y'know....I'm ok with it.

Sorry it had to be this lady, but somebody is gonna have to die to wake this country up a bit. Yes, I know I'm unkind and all kinds of other words. A populace pushed to the breaking point will take matters into their own hands. While I absolutely do not support or advocate violence in any situation save for defense of an innocent, I can understand the mentality that would drive someone to this behavior.

That being said, its in AZ so at least he'll be made to pay for his crimes in a suitably uncomfortable manner.

So, you don't aprove of violence, but you aprove of violence against political parties you disagree with? Amazing. Brilliant.

filbert wrote:Either an automatic rifle or the chap is exceedingly quick at aiming and reloading then.

I doubt it was an automatic rifle. A semi-auto fired by someone who was a good shot could do the same thing.


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olympia wrote:CNN detailing all the threats against her and the vandalism of her office by tea baggers. Where the F@#% was the secret service?

They handle the president only.

I hope she survives. I've been angry at politicians before, and there's a good few irish ones I wouldn't mind seeing bankrupt and unhappy, but this has made me admit that anything I ever said about killing them was in-the-pub bravado.

ShumaGorath wrote:

Peter Wiggin wrote:Y'know....I'm ok with it.

Sorry it had to be this lady, but somebody is gonna have to die to wake this country up a bit. Yes, I know I'm unkind and all kinds of other words. A populace pushed to the breaking point will take matters into their own hands. While I absolutely do not support or advocate violence in any situation save for defense of an innocent, I can understand the mentality that would drive someone to this behavior.

That being said, its in AZ so at least he'll be made to pay for his crimes in a suitably uncomfortable manner.

So, you don't aprove of violence, but you aprove of violence against political parties you disagree with? Amazing. Brilliant.

No, thats not at all what I said. Plus I'm a registered democrat.

Like I said, I don't approve of violence but I understand that its a natural result of the internal pressures that America is undergoing. Its sad that this lady bears the wounds of a disenfranchised society, but somebody is gonna die before things start to change. Its the nature of the beast.


As for the comment about suitibly uncomfortable....its AZ. They have a really mean justice system. I lived in Phoenix for 3 years in school...Sherrif Joe is a real prick. This guy shot a local politician, and will be processed through the system. He's NOT going to have an enjoyable time. Plus, he killed someone and he has to pay for that action. Simple enough neh?

Peter Wiggin wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

Peter Wiggin wrote:Y'know....I'm ok with it.

Sorry it had to be this lady, but somebody is gonna have to die to wake this country up a bit. Yes, I know I'm unkind and all kinds of other words. A populace pushed to the breaking point will take matters into their own hands. While I absolutely do not support or advocate violence in any situation save for defense of an innocent, I can understand the mentality that would drive someone to this behavior.

That being said, its in AZ so at least he'll be made to pay for his crimes in a suitably uncomfortable manner.

So, you don't aprove of violence, but you aprove of violence against political parties you disagree with? Amazing. Brilliant.

No, thats not at all what I said. Plus I'm a registered democrat.

Like I said, I don't approve of violence but I understand that its a natural result of the internal pressures that America is undergoing. Its sad that this lady bears the wounds of a disenfranchised society, but somebody is gonna die before things start to change. Its the nature of the beast.

And how exactly was the teen, that we know nothing about, disenfranchised by something we know nothing about, leading him to commit violence? I mean, I know you love taking giant logical leaps, but claiming this is the direct result of disenfranchisement is foolish.

What if she dies and nothing changes anyway?

olympia wrote:CNN detailing all the threats against her and the vandalism of her office by tea baggers. Where the F@#% was the secret service?

Secret Service doesn't do security for Congress, I think it's the Capitol Police when they're in DC and local police when in their districts. FBI would handle investigating threats.

Y'know, there is a strong chance the shooter was an anarchist. Here in MO, a man at a similar rally was stabbed by an anarchist/mentally deranged man during the summer. The stabber had mistook the victim for our state governor.

Oh, and at the genius who said "Only in America", look at Europe, and most of what I see is news reports about riot after riot.

_Tim?

P.S. Oh yeah, and we'd better get ready to kiss our gun rights away.

ShumaGorath wrote:

Peter Wiggin wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

Peter Wiggin wrote:Y'know....I'm ok with it.

Sorry it had to be this lady, but somebody is gonna have to die to wake this country up a bit. Yes, I know I'm unkind and all kinds of other words. A populace pushed to the breaking point will take matters into their own hands. While I absolutely do not support or advocate violence in any situation save for defense of an innocent, I can understand the mentality that would drive someone to this behavior.

That being said, its in AZ so at least he'll be made to pay for his crimes in a suitably uncomfortable manner.

So, you don't aprove of violence, but you aprove of violence against political parties you disagree with? Amazing. Brilliant.

No, thats not at all what I said. Plus I'm a registered democrat.

Like I said, I don't approve of violence but I understand that its a natural result of the internal pressures that America is undergoing. Its sad that this lady bears the wounds of a disenfranchised society, but somebody is gonna die before things start to change. Its the nature of the beast.

And how exactly was the teen, that we know nothing about, disenfranchised by something we know nothing about, leading him to commit violence? I mean, I know you love taking giant logical leaps, but claiming this is the direct result of disenfranchisement is foolish.

One would HAVE to be either mentally ill or seriously disenfranchised to commit an act of violence from a stance of political motivation. Is this incorrect?

Or perhaps he is just a cold blooded killer. I don't see any other options. Enlighten me if you do.

Sara palin web site with that "innocent funny poster" is down, the fox site with the poster has had it removed.

One would HAVE to be either mentally ill or seriously disenfranchised to commit an act of violence from a stance of political motivation. Is this incorrect?

I don't think you know what the word disenfranchised means. I mean, if you intend to imply that they believe that they are disenfranchised then I can accept that. However belief and reality are not one and the same.

Or perhaps he is just a cold blooded killer. I don't see any other options. Enlighten me if you do.

He's likely some wacked out teabagger teen with no real life options, possible drug habit, likely connection to conservative extremist movements, and the need to throw away his life doing something big. Politically motivated violence doesn't have to stem from disenfranchisement, just idiocy.

I mean, what is a white teen being disenfranchised by? His parents?

ShumaGorath wrote:

One would HAVE to be either mentally ill or seriously disenfranchised to commit an act of violence from a stance of political motivation. Is this incorrect?

I don't think you know what the word disenfranchised means. I mean, if you intend to imply that they believe that they are disenfranchised then I can accept that. However belief and reality are not one and the same.

Or perhaps he is just a cold blooded killer. I don't see any other options. Enlighten me if you do.

He's likely some wacked out teabagger teen with no real life options, possible drug habit, likely connection to conservative extremist movements, and the need to throw away his life doing something big. Politically motivated violence doesn't have to stem from disenfranchisement, just idiocy.

I mean, what is a white teen being disenfranchised by? His parents?

Bolded part for "yes this is what I meant" its entirely possible for me to use words incorrectly. The perception of something IS reality to the one perceiving it.....make sense?

As someone who grew up in suburbia, I can tell you that the FEELING of disenfranchisement is entirely possible by your average white teenager.









Do you think he read The Turner Diaries recently? Hmmmm lol

ShumaGorath: Why exactly do you insist upon blaming it upon the conservatives? Try being a little open minded about this, man. It could really be anyone.

_Tim?

Bolded part for "yes this is what I meant" its entirely possible for me to use words incorrectly. The perception of something IS reality to the one perceiving it.....make sense?

Since I'm not that guy you should probably speak more plainly. Especially when being considerate of the opinions of mass murderers.

As someone who grew up in suburbia, I can tell you that the FEELING of disenfranchisement is entirely possible by your average white teenager.

As someone who grew up in rural Maine I can tell you that the FEELING of disenfranchisement is pretty common to being a teen. I mean, you are disenfranchised until you turn 18, and even then you can't drink. Most people fething deal with it, we don't need to be "considerate" of their opinions when that is the best justification you can come up with.

It'd be kind of funny in a dark and sad way if it was an anarchist; then we can blame the majority of political extremism in this country on them. Yes, I do understand that there are many lunatics who are not anarchists, and not all anarchists are lunatics.

- Toss TNT into the Haymarket Square rally, ensuring that the movement to an 8-hour work day stalls for years? Check

-Assassinate a president who was immensely popular, at a World's Fair? Check

-Assassinate a Congresswoman who was actually trying to do a good job by hearing the voice of common people?

(P.S. I am using the definition that assassination = the murder of an elected official)

Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote:P.S. Oh yeah, and we'd better get ready to kiss our gun rights away.

Which is unlikely, considering she's a pro-gun Democrat. Though I would understand if changes her mind.

Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote:ShumaGorath: Why exactly do you insist upon blaming it upon the conservatives? Try being a little open minded about this, man. It could really be anyone.

_Tim?

Because they created the political environment that allowed for this kind of violence. They have been trying to create a civil war with words for years, it should follow that eventually they are going to convince some downtrodden crazy to use his gun to defend his life against the death panel socialists that want to steal his freedoms and give America to Muslims (which they already did with our muslim president).

Update, She's still alive, federal judge slain in attack.

ShumaGorath wrote:

Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote:ShumaGorath: Why exactly do you insist upon blaming it upon the conservatives? Try being a little open minded about this, man. It could really be anyone.

_Tim?

Because they created the political environment that allowed for this kind of violence. They have been trying to create a civil war with words for years, it should follow that eventually they are going to convince some downtrodden crazy to use his gun to defend his life against the death panel socialists that want to steal his freedoms and give America to Muslims (which they already did with our muslim president).

Actually, BOTH sides of the political spectrum are at fault here. The Conservative talk-show people have been very vocal against the Liberals in the Government, and the Liberals in the Government have not listened to the people, even if the people are wrong. Both sides are at fault here. Just remember, in ANY politically charged environment, some politician always seems to die/be attacked by some whacko with no purpose in life.

_Tim?

ShumaGorath wrote:

Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote:ShumaGorath: Why exactly do you insist upon blaming it upon the conservatives? Try being a little open minded about this, man. It could really be anyone.

_Tim?

Because they created the political environment that allowed for this kind of violence. They have been trying to create a civil war with words for years, it should follow that eventually they are going to convince some downtrodden crazy to use his gun to defend his life against the death panel socialists that want to steal his freedoms and give America to Muslims (which they already did with our muslim president).

Sorry, but the greatest badass to help our country and whose integral decisions lead to our current form of government (Ben Franklin) said that we needed compromise. Democrats and Republicans, Conservatives and Liberals, all working together. That's how our country should and sometimes still does work.

Actually, BOTH sides of the political spectrum are at fault here. The Conservative talk-show people have been very vocal against the Liberals in the Government, and the Liberals in the Government have not listened to the people, even if the people are wrong.

So one side is at fault for taking the demagogues pulpet and lying to the people and the other side is at fault for following the political path it lined out that got it elected? Brilliant.

Both sides are at fault here.

No. Not really. Not at all. One side fans the flames of extremism and ignorance because it's base votes on fear and the other side did was it was voted into place to do. If you think both of those are wrong, then there is something you don't understand about democracy.

Just remember, in ANY politically charged environment, some politician always seems to die/be attacked by some whacko with no purpose in life.

At least one thing in your post made some semblance of sense.

CNN affiliate reports that a pistol with extended mags was weapon used, and the suspected assailant is a 22 year old white male.

micahaphone wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote:ShumaGorath: Why exactly do you insist upon blaming it upon the conservatives? Try being a little open minded about this, man. It could really be anyone.

_Tim?

Because they created the political environment that allowed for this kind of violence. They have been trying to create a civil war with words for years, it should follow that eventually they are going to convince some downtrodden crazy to use his gun to defend his life against the death panel socialists that want to steal his freedoms and give America to Muslims (which they already did with our muslim president).

Sorry, but the greatest badass to help our country and whose integral decisions lead to our current form of government (Ben Franklin) said that we needed compromise. Democrats and Republicans, Conservatives and Liberals, all working together. That's how our country should and sometimes still does work.

Thats not actually relevant to what I said, and if conservatives wanted compromise they wouldn't have used the filibuster to block debate in record numbers. Kinda hard to conciliatory when the other party wont even let you debate something.


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Valhallan42nd wrote:CNN affiliate reports that a pistol with extended mags was weapon used, and the suspected assailant is a 22 year old white male.

At 22 you're looking at a possible military affiliation if he enlisted straight out of high school.

ShumaGorath wrote:

Bolded part for "yes this is what I meant" its entirely possible for me to use words incorrectly. The perception of something IS reality to the one perceiving it.....make sense?

Since I'm not that guy you should probably speak more plainly. Especially when being considerate of the opinions of mass murderers.

As someone who grew up in suburbia, I can tell you that the FEELING of disenfranchisement is entirely possible by your average white teenager.

As someone who grew up in rural Maine I can tell you that the FEELING of disenfranchisement is pretty common to being a teen. I mean, you are disenfranchised until you turn 18, and even then you can't drink. Most people fething deal with it, we don't need to be "considerate" of their opinions when that is the best justification you can come up with.

When have I been considerate of him? I simply stated that I can understand the pressure (internal and external) that would drive a young man to act in this manner. I truly feel that this type of thing is going to happen more in America and that is something I accept. I don't like it, I don't condone it, but I accept it. I also clearly stated that this young man should be fully prosecuted to the extent of the law.

Those are not mutually exclusive, nor is there any kind of logical fallacy involved. I think perhaps I do not articulate things clearly enough. Does this help?

When have I been considerate of him?

simply stated that I can understand the pressure (internal and external) that would drive a young man to act in this manner.

con·sid·er·ate   
[kuhn-sid-er-it] Show IPA
–adjective
1.
showing kindly awareness or regard for another's feelings, circumstances, etc.: a very considerate critic.

Christ alive.

I truly feel that this type of thing is going to happen more in America and that is something I accept. I don't like it, I don't condone it, but I accept it. I also clearly stated that this young man should be fully prosecuted to the extent of the law.

Yeppers.

Or I could say stuff about maggots.

And continue to go 3-10 in every game.

Valhallan42nd wrote:CNN affiliate reports that a pistol with extended mags was weapon used, and the suspected assailant is a 22 year old white male.

Columbine, Oklahoma City, need I list more? Typical white domestic terrorist is typical.

The true expression of our country's found if you ask me. "I don't like it, but I have a gun so what I say is right."



Dammit, don't pull wikipedia into this.

micahaphone wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote:ShumaGorath: Why exactly do you insist upon blaming it upon the conservatives? Try being a little open minded about this, man. It could really be anyone.

_Tim?

Because they created the political environment that allowed for this kind of violence. They have been trying to create a civil war with words for years, it should follow that eventually they are going to convince some downtrodden crazy to use his gun to defend his life against the death panel socialists that want to steal his freedoms and give America to Muslims (which they already did with our muslim president).

Sorry, but the greatest badass to help our country and whose integral decisions lead to our current form of government (Ben Franklin) said that we needed compromise. Democrats and Republicans, Conservatives and Liberals, all working together. That's how our country should and sometimes still does work.

Well said!

@Shuma: You really do not understand the basic rules of politics, do you? When you have frag tons of people gathered outside a governmental building while a key piece of legislation is being voted upon, and that piece of legislation passes with almost all the member of one party voting for it, people are bound to become angry. As Michaphone said, compromise is key, Governments should NEVER try to pass a large, life changing law all at once, people will only become hostile and fearful. Move to fast, expect trouble. Basic rule of politics that applies to any kind of huge bill, good or bad.

_Tim?

Columbine, Oklahoma City, need I list more? Typical white domestic terrorist is typical.

Both columbine and Oklahoma city were incredibly disimilar. You are seriously making yourself out to look pretty ill informed here.

ShumaGorath wrote:

When have I been considerate of him?

simply stated that I can understand the pressure (internal and external) that would drive a young man to act in this manner.

con·sid·er·ate   
[kuhn-sid-er-it] Show IPA
–adjective
1.
showing kindly awareness or regard for another's feelings, circumstances, etc.: a very considerate critic.

And continue to go 3-10 in every game.

Bolded. I am unkind. Semantics?

Hey now, I do really well every time I solo que. I think we are bad luck for each other...the romance is getting tarnished.


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ShumaGorath wrote:

Columbine, Oklahoma City, need I list more? Typical white domestic terrorist is typical.

Both columbine and Oklahoma city were incredibly disimilar. You are seriously making yourself out to look pretty ill informed here.

Broad similarities: They were white, they were American, they commited acts of violence against the perceived figures of persecution and authority.

Correct or incorrect?