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This is the worst thing that has happened to my city since WW2. When I heard the bomb I thought it was thunder, that was before my friend called me and asked if I was allright. Suddenly there was sirens everywhere and the shock hit me: we're under attack.

Now it is slowly sinking in; some guy living not far from me has killed over 17 people (first estimates) and blew up our city center. It is a hard f*cking day to be from Oslo.

Gods be with you, Norge cousins.

I am appalled by these events, hang the goon who killed the youths by the highest tree!

Find the bomber and draw & quarter him!

So BBC news is running with continuous coverage this morning. Death toll is running around 91 at the moment from both events combined. The suspect has been described as visiting Christian fundamentalist websites and being right wing.

Like a lot of places around the government quarters, several of the buildings in Møllergata have gotten their windows blown out. An exception: Games Workshop Oslo. There's shattered glass only meters away from it.
Amidst the tragedy, I find this somewhat funny.

Just heard on the radio, 92 people are confirmed killed. 7 from the bomb blast the rest from the shooting at Utøya. Words can not describe this tradgedy

Monster Rain wrote:I suppose it doesn't matter that Mattyrm was 100% correct?

For the record, and this is directed at all users, I'm using Mr. Monster Rain's words as an example, when events like this unfold it best if people wait until the facts of the situation unfold before leaping to entirely erroneous assumptions. Thanks.

Terrible, terrible news, it's a monstrous act, one that almost defies analysis. Thoughts and best wishes to all the people over there.

So, is the suspect dead or 'helping the police with their enquiries' ?

J.Black wrote:So, is the suspect dead or 'helping the police with their enquiries' ?

He surrendered to armed police when they arrived, I think.

YoMomma wrote:
He surrendered to armed police when they arrived, I think.

I hope they use the cheese grater on his balls....

Trondheim wrote:Just heard on the radio, 92 people are confirmed killed. 7 from the bomb blast the rest from the shooting at Utøya. Words can not describe this tradgedy

I don't have a telly or follow the radio news so only heard the amount of casualties this morning
Am struggling to get my head around the numbers of young people killed and injured at the youth camp.

Am sure Norway must be in a state of shock.
My sympathy and thoughts go out to the victims' loved ones.

@ mattyrm - Regarding my belief that the cause is irrelevant...

...when somebody commits an atrocity of this kind, then in my eyes they become a criminal and in much the same way as criminals lose the right to vote, they also lose the right to represent a cause or in any way voice their opinion.

Root causes that drive people to do such things (which in my mind are slightly different) may be worthy of further examination, but at the end of the day, there will always be nutters and the world would be a better place if everybody stopped reacting to the actions of a few loose cannons.

Just my view though. Peace out

Yeah flash, I know where your coming from, I just feel that understanding the cause can give us something to work with, if we can understand exactly why something occurs, we can take preventative steps. I understood what you were saying.

It was a Christian guy though apparently, Im glad nobody took my bet.

An absolute tragedy. Im stunned that a lone wolf could nail so many people working alone, but that seems to be the case.

Im sure more details will emerge soon.

reds8n wrote:

Monster Rain wrote:I suppose it doesn't matter that Mattyrm was 100% correct?

For the record, and this is directed at all users, I'm using Mr. Monster Rain's words as an example, when events like this unfold it best if people wait until the facts of the situation unfold before leaping to entirely erroneous assumptions. Thanks.

Terrible, terrible news, it's a monstrous act, one that almost defies analysis. Thoughts and best wishes to all the people over there.

Be fair, man. There is a link in that very post that you quoted to a news source saying that a terrorist organization had claimed responsibility.

I'm freely admitting that I was wrong, but I made that statement based on what I had thought to be reliable information. So, again, I was wrong. My bad.

What's the capital punishment situation in Norway? Is this guy going to swing, do you think?

Well my father would blame it on the muslims. But I blame it on the Idiots of Al-Queda and all of it's splinter groups.

I found some writing that said the guy was a right wing extremist. Nothing more than that.

I learnt something one time.
Never judge groups.
Judge individuals.
Because what's the point? All you're going to do is end up irrationally hating people, all because you want to vent out your anger over guys you've never met.

So as far as I can understand it, this is the progression.

1. Person posts story and guesses a Muslim terrorist group would probably be behind it.

2. People start calling poster ignorant and pretending he stated all Muslims are terrorist.

3. Early reports of Muslim group claiming responsibility muddies the water even more, as people use it to continue pointless discussion of statement that was never made and to say "gotcha!".

4. Spend more time defending/attacking an accusation that was never made then focusing on the tragedy that the people in Oslo are dealing with right now.

How about if people want to make a thread about how to clearly delineate between radicals and normal people in a way that everyone can be satisfied so that there is no misunderstanding we start a new thread. either way there is some real gak going down at the moment in Oslo and it has nothing to do with this tangent.

The body count is just absolutely staggering. I just can't wrap my mind around it. And of course the secondary tragedy will be the political one as different groups have already started their pr engines to take advantage of it.

my heart goes out to all those families. No one should have to lose a child, but to lose them over a political, religious or any other nonsensical statement is the worst.

Sick people out there. Not much to say here but, damn.

J.Black wrote:So, is the suspect dead or 'helping the police with their enquiries' ?

Last I heard he was "being cooperative." And while I feel a tremendous amount of sympathy for the victims and anger at the perpetrator...as a lawyer that line really s me off.

People have the right not to cooperate with the police (at least here in the US), and they shouldn't be vilified by the press for simply exercising their rights against self-incrimination (and assuming that there aren't other bombs about to go off, or a conspiracy to commit more attacks).

Note that I see no problem with the "cheese grater to the balls" punishment. Assuming he's found guilty.

So why rake it up again Ahtman?

Just your final point is all that is required here, as you say yourself

either way there is some real gak going down at the moment in Oslo and it has nothing to do with this tangent.

The body count is just absolutely staggering. I just can't wrap my mind around it.

QFT

Having done arctic training in Norway, and knowing a something about firearms and military weapons and tactics, my guess is that many of the kids drowned.

Its hard work to slot 94 people. Id presume that a fair number of them leapt into the water in a panic and drowned. mild hypothermia rears its head nside a few minutes in the water up in Northern Norway, even in summer. I know this from doing icebreaking drills up in Tromso and freezing my balls off.

For a lone wolf, the death toll is staggering, the man obviously planned it well, and the island attack will have left many with no option but to take their chances in the sea.

Anyways, im sure more details will follow. Its a true tragedy.

Matty, witness reports back up that view. Lots of kids jumped into the water when the shooting started, some were shot as they tried to swim to safety.

This is what bothers me the most.

Witnesses said the gunman, wearing a police uniform, was able to shoot unchallenged for a prolonged period.

The sick bastard dressed up as an officer. I heard that some witnesses said that he called some of the kids over, pretending to be an officer of the law there to help before shooting them.

I also hope that they make an amendment to Norwegian laws or that this is not true.

Norway's toughest sentence is 21 years in jail.

The prick needs to be fried.

It seems he thought by killing off future politicians (it was a political party summer camp) he thought he was getting rid of politicians that were not tough on immigration, especially Muslim immigrants which he felt were dangerous.

ahtman, It was a government funded camp. not a *political party camp*

I guess more like summer camp for disadvantaged youths.

Also, I heard that 85 people were killed by one person!

They said that some people heard gunshots from multiple directions. I've never been there but I do know that gunshots like to echo.

Doctadeth wrote:ahtman, It was a government funded camp. not a *political party camp*

I guess more like summer camp for disadvantaged youths.

Did I say the shooter was a reasonable person and thinking logically? Also, from the AP:

attending a summer camp of the youth wing of Norway's ruling Labour Party on an idyllic island.

That sure sounds like a political party camp to me.