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Beaviz81 wrote:It can be taken that way of course, but also the Sisters of Battle seem to be based on the Fishspeakers from Dune, and they had husbands

Sisters are also based on Jeanne d'Arc and Christian nuns.

To reiterare: "The Adepta Sororitas is a penitent order where constant hardship, deprivation and arduous work are part of an unrelenting devotional regime. Its members are fanatical in their commitment. The slightest deviation from approved stricture leads to the most severe chastisement."
- Codex Imperialis

"Part of the puritan lifestyle of the Sisterhood is its isolation and it is generally only the Canoness and her most trusted Sisters Superior who will have dealings with outsiders - even Sisters of another Order. The Sisters are utterly dedicated to one task or discipline and brook no distraction from their studies."
- 2E C:SoB

"It is our creed that the purpose of life is to suffer, for in this way we become one with the Emperor's eternal suffering. Have you not heard that those who suffer are blessed?"
- Canoness in the 3E 40k Rulebook

The above bits of GW fluff do seem to be utterly incompatible with the notion that Sisters are free to engage in physical pleasures whenever they want. Now, the fickle nature of 40k fluff allows us to pursue deviating interpretations - I'm merely pointing out that they do not work in conjunction with what we are presented by the guys who actually wrote the setting, so you'd simply have to decide whether you want to go with the GW version or some licensed novel author's personal idea.

The GW-version never actually mentions that they swear vows of chastity Lynata, the nearest is chastised, and that's punishment. Plus I don't think all Sisters of Battle are Redemptionists.

Of course I don't fancy the idea of slutty nuns, if I did, I wouldn't be here. I mentioned the idea of marriage, heck the example I brought up was even arranged. So look at the Victorian way for women to have sex, one permitted position, never liking it, just for producing offspring.

My personal opinion is that the historical references behind the Imperium indicate abstinence because that's what those societies were like, but I think in actual 40k, any sexual abstinence would be considered sabotage against the Imperium, specifically against the IG. They'd probably go so far as to consider playing WoW to be heresy. I'm basing this on their need for manpower and ridiculous casualties.

Cain Alludes to it frequently. HE mentions having an affiar with a naval officer,
He also has something of a de-facto marriage with Amberly Veil(which she freely admits)
And he was a Commissar in a mixed gender regiment Veil says "The inevitable would happen and Cain would have to make sure all parties are safe"
So yeah, Its happens alot.

Beaviz81 wrote:

Seriously Cthulusspy and TheRobotlol it was from Ciaphas Cain, and seconded by Amberley Veil, but diseases who transfer through blood also does the same through intercourse. How old are you again? Didn't they teach you basic biology at school?

I am fairly sure that poison is a tad different from disease...

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Beaviz81 wrote:

Seriously Cthulusspy and TheRobotlol it was from Ciaphas Cain, and seconded by Amberley Veil, but diseases who transfer through blood also does the same through intercourse. How old are you again? Didn't they teach you basic biology at school?

I am fairly sure that poison is a tad different from disease...

The kicker is that the Space Marines are known to spit acid. So good luck figuring out what their semen would be like, but rest assured it won't be nice.

Beaviz81 wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Beaviz81 wrote:

Seriously Cthulusspy and TheRobotlol it was from Ciaphas Cain, and seconded by Amberley Veil, but diseases who transfer through blood also does the same through intercourse. How old are you again? Didn't they teach you basic biology at school?

I am fairly sure that poison is a tad different from disease...

The kicker is that the Space Marines are known to spit acid. So good luck figuring out what their semen would be like, but rest assured it won't be nice.

I don't think the toxicity of the semen will be that big of a problem compared to this




Replace all references to superman with SM, and you will get the point.

Beaviz81 wrote:Ehm I can see the validity of your argument Melissa, I just think service of the Emperor happens in a lot of ways. It doesn't go against fluff if a SOB marries and has loads of children in my mind, and mind you, nuns IRL rarely exhibit the angry traits of the angry nuns. The closest there were the Sarmartian women who had to kill to marry (a concept I sort of wanted to use).

Seriously Cthulusspy and TheRobotlol it was from Ciaphas Cain, and seconded by Amberley Veil, but diseases who transfer through blood also does the same through intercourse. How old are you again? Didn't they teach you basic biology at school?

Im 100 years old foo!

You think too much Cthulusspy.

Beaviz, mate, I can't think of a single tactical situation in which acid semen can be of any use...

Anyways, my weirdboy powaz foresee the imminent closure of this thread, but...

Fish Speakers, as well as Bene Gesserit, used marriage for political gain, to manoeuvre themselves into positions of power from where to further their organizational goals.

In the decadent, grimdark Empire of the 41st Millenium, the Ecclesiarchy and the Sororitas MAY act the same way, but without hard evidence this is nothing but wild speculation.

What we know about the Sororitas right now depicts them as an elite humanitarian/military corps, subject to heavy political and religious indoctrination. Nothing about them being treasure brides or expert concubines to date.

Agent_Tremolo wrote:Beaviz, mate, I can't think of a single tactical situation in which acid semen can be of any use...

Tell that to noise marines

Nothing of the fluff states the Sororitas to be totally chaste. This is wide open, so a discussion is sort of moot. Sure the fluff could easily be interpreted that way, but it can be interpreted that marriage and childbirth is also a huge burden. I weigh this on historical reasons as well as established fluff, and I personally prefer a wide-open interpretation of the fluff as that makes the most sense for me. Of course the Sororitas living in convents usually didn't indulge in sex, but what's forbidden is also alluring and doesn't need to lead directly to chaos.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Agent_Tremolo wrote:Beaviz, mate, I can't think of a single tactical situation in which acid semen can be of any use...

Tell that to noise marines

Heh Heh Heh.

Lynata wrote:The Cain books are just a - warning, personal opinion following - really piss-poor depiction of the Sororitas, Commissars and the Schola in general. The author either did not bother to read up on the source material or did not care about it when writing his satire, and it shows by a number of contradictions. Wasn't that (ex?)-Sister even an instructor in the Schola? One should think that the teachers there are particularly strict and carefully chosen when purity is such a highly valued good. Not to mention that characters who have lived their entire life in a convent, forsaking physical pleasures out of an obligation to their faith, don't simply drop all that even IF they ever retire.
There's quite simply a lot of stuff not making sense in those books when looking at other 40k material, which is why I cringe every time they are even mentioned in a fluff discussion.

Actually IMO there are not................there is one character depicted that tends to cause these discussions but she is completely at odds (and I do wonder if this was the point of the character) with every other depiciton of the Adepta Sororitas in the Cain Novels, even given that the "in book author" himself really does not like them and tends to be overely harsh when describing their actions. They are without exception shown as deeply religious (even Sister Julian is a Emperor botherer in Cains paralance), fanatical and extremely competant fighters - in fact far more so than a number of other BL novels............ and I have read almost all of them..

I can say that Mr Mitchel does read up on the material having had the pleasure of meeting the author on one occcassion and discussing things like research. ........There are plenty of accurate and informed references in the novels to attest to this.

On other matters - poltical manipulation Bene Gen(whatever the word is) style like in Dune is absolutely how the Order Famulous seems to work:

from the old Codex:

"They serve the nobles and Imperial Commanders of the Imperium as advisors and chatelaines....In this way the Ecclesiarchy maintains a fairly tight control over the most powerful individuals in the Imperium."

Regarding the Sisters as Concubines- this absolutely does not happen now - it was just another element of the of corruption and depravity of Gorge Vandire - again from the old codex:

"The Brides not only served as Vandire's bodyguard, but also as servants and comnpanions. They tasted the High Lord's food, fed him when he fell weak with illness, nursed his frail body and entertained him with singing, dancing and other, more exotic skills."

Mr. Morden that hopefully mean my suggestion about the married Cannoness is good to go? At a personal level, I'm very disappointed that you didn't use the picture of the brilliant Mr. Morden from Babylon 5.

It must also be noted dogma often does nothing other than rile up opposing persons, and worse much fluff comes up looking like pure propaganda. So I'd advice against following it too literally.

Hey Beaviz

Married cannoness - hmm not sure I'd use it myself but its your universe

re Mr Morden - very cool character - the image I use is of Chloe Morden (his daughter) and her "associates"

She is a character I created for an alt universe B5 game supplement

Beaviz81 wrote:Ehm I can see the validity of your argument Melissa, I just think service of the Emperor happens in a lot of ways. It doesn't go against fluff if a SOB

I have not once, in this thread, mentioned Sisters.

Melissia wrote:

Beaviz81 wrote:Ehm I can see the validity of your argument Melissa, I just think service of the Emperor happens in a lot of ways. It doesn't go against fluff if a SOB

I have not once, in this thread, mentioned Sisters.

I know, well Redemtionists ain't that popular in the IoM. Some regards them as worse than Chaos worshipers.

Mr. Morden I found that odd when you dared to create the daughter of Mr. Morden, but why not? And the marriage happened to be the lasgun-version of Charles and Diana.

Beaviz81 wrote:I know, well Redemtionists

I did not once in this thread mention Redemptionists either.

Melissia wrote:

Beaviz81 wrote:I know, well Redemtionists

I did not once in this thread mention Redemptionists either.

Redemtionists are the fellows that doesn't think you should have sex, fun, drink, smoke, do anything cool.

No, redemptionists are perfectly fine with baby making in the emperor's name. They have a problem with hedonism (having sex is not by itself hedonism), mutants, and anyone who isn't a strict orthodox Imperialist.

Ah they are only violently opposed to having fun.

Melissia wrote:No, redemptionists are perfectly fine with baby making in the emperor's name. They have a problem with hedonism (having sex is not by itself hedonism), mutants, and anyone who isn't a strict orthodox Imperialist.

So...IoM Puritans than.

Essentially yes.

Except far more violent and iking flame far too much for healthy minds.

Also with little to no self-preservation instinct.

However I don't think that you are supposed to enjoy the process of baby making if you are a proper Redemptionist

Mr Morden wrote:However I don't think that you are supposed to enjoy the process of baby making if you are a proper Redemptionist

Why not? Service to the Emperor (including continuing production of the population) is its own reward!

Melissia wrote:Essentially yes.

Except far more violent and iking flame far too much for healthy minds.

Also with little to no self-preservation instinct.

...so, like bloody Mary crossed with a Puritan then?

Mellissia just adopt the 19th century Victorian thingy, then you have a proper Redemtionist woman, and I can see some SOBs taking that road. "Yack"

Melissia wrote:

Mr Morden wrote:However I don't think that you are supposed to enjoy the process of baby making if you are a proper Redemptionist

Why not? Service to the Emperor (including continuing production of the population) is its own reward!

For normal Emperor fearing folk yes that may be true but everything I have ever read (from codexes to novels thorugh Necromunda) has the redemptionists as total fanatics - they are even considerd so by the Church itself and have on occassion in some places been proscribed by them . Taking pleasure in anything other than worshping Him seems to be a Sin and even then you better not enjoy it too much.

IMO Redemptionists are totally uncompromising religious fanatics who often hate themselves as much as everyone else and uinlike say the Sisters don't really have an signs that they are any more blessed by Him than anyone else.............

Mr Morden wrote:For normal Emperor fearing folk yes that may be true but everything I have ever read (from codexes to novels thorugh Necromunda) has the redemptionists as total fanatics

Yes, but fanaticism itself dosen't mean that they can't celebrate making a child as an act of worship to the Emperor.

Fanatics are weird, yo.

Beaviz81 wrote:Mellissia just adopt the 19th century Victorian thingy

No.