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Was wondering if Dakka would help me build a best in slot army list. You can select a unit from any army, standard FoC applies +1 HQ. No Points Limit. No duplication of units.

I will start with my first single best unit.

HQ
1 -
2 -
3 -
Elite
1 - Fire Dragons x 10, Exarch Tank Hunters, Crack Shot, Fire Pike, WS, ScatterLaser
2 -
3 -
Troop
1 -
2 -
3 -
4 -
5 -
6 -
Fast Attack
1 -
2 -
3 -
Heavy Support
1 -
2 -
3 -

Update - Added WS to unit

Fire Dragons are best in slot at 5x Fire Dragons. 9x Fire Dragons, 1x Exarch is far from best in slot. While technically stronger, you have to figure in the risk versus reward, and risking so many points for so little reward is not best in slot.

So: you can't remove points, you have to consider efficiency, 'cause that's what makes them good.

*sigh* this is what I was worrying about. In their current incarnation 5 x Fire Dragons are the best in slot. If points do not factor, having 10 of them with better weapons becomes a MORE reliable way to kill any tank.

That as the intent, best unit per slot unlimited points. And they still belong there as one of the best elite units in the game.

Well, if you don't consider points at all, then you might as well stick the highest costing unit (from a 2009+ codex) in there and be done with it.

Them Blud Angels of Blud units, Death Company? 30 of them equipped with the most expensive stuff will likely do a lot better at Fire Dragons for destroying tanks, and be better optimized for killing whatever is inside. If I recall correctly a very large portion of them can have power fists.

phyrephly wrote:HQ
1 -
2 -
3 -

Three HQ's?

Scott-S6 wrote:

phyrephly wrote:HQ
1 -
2 -
3 -

Three HQ's?

Yes, as stated in the first post standard FoC plus 1 HQ. Going to be very hard to select only 2 of the best HQ units.

@Mahtamori

So they have power Fists, can they actually catch a tank? Even in a transport with 30 of them? I would rather have those 30 clowns chasing my wave serpent than 10 Fire Dragons shooting at it. With that said, I have a backup to my argument as to WHY I chose Fire Dragons, and a reason why your 30 death-company-blud-angels-of-blud won't work to kill the tank, do you have a constructive argument to add? I don't want this to seem like a flame post, but nothing you have said has been constructive at all.

If you disagree with what I chose, post why you disagree and choose something better. Because from my point of view the 10 Fire Dragons and their exarch are still better at the role I chose for them.

HQs:
Abaddon, Eldrad and Mephiston?

HQ
1 - Abbadon
2 - Eldrad
3 - Mephiston
Elite
1 - Fire Dragons x 10, Exarch Tank Hunters, Crack Shot, Fire Pike, WS, ScatterLaser
2 -
3 -
Troop
1 -
2 -
3 -
4 -
5 -
6 -
Fast Attack
1 -
2 -
3 -
Heavy Support
1 -
2 -
3 -

With this, are you just trying to find 3 best HQs, 3 best elites etc, or do you want a list that would work together....?
If its a list that would work together, who Abbadon and Eldrad are with then becomes an issue (10 Warlocks, with Eldrad and Abbadon attached would be lovely)

Elites- 15x Lootas. 15-45 S7 shots is pretty nice.

T- 16x man BT Crusader Squad with LR DT. Not a "super unit" by any stretch, but squeezing a LR in the T selection is fun.

HQ- Big Mek with KFF (if the scenario rules allow his KFF to affect ALL friendly vehicles (RAW, it does, but most tourneys with allies apply it to only Ork units)) in a vehicle-heavy list.

H- Long Fangs, point for point, are made of win in this slot. Ignoring points? Hmm. Maybe Leman Russ squadron?

FA- Vendetta Squadron?

E/T- Full 10-man Nob Biker Squad. Lots of wounds and lots of kill-y.

T- 6x IG Guard Squads, Platoon Command Squad, 3x HWS, 3x SWS, 7x Chimeras. A LOT of meat in a single slot, where points are not an issue.
-------

Is this for a tourney?

List does not need to work together. Just best-in-slot. This is not for a tourney, it is just meant to be an interesting thread.

HQ
1 - Abbadon
2 - Eldrad, 10 Warlocks
3 - Mephiston
Elite
1 - Fire Dragons x 10, Exarch Tank Hunters, Crack Shot, Fire Pike, WS, ScatterLaser
2 - 15x Lootas
3 -
Troop
1 -
2 -
3 -
4 -
5 -
6 -
Fast Attack
1 -
2 -
3 -
Heavy Support
1 - Leman Russ squadron
2 - Long Fangs
3 -


Discussion:
HQ - Big Mek better than existing?

Leman Russ and Long Fangs to fill Heavy support?

Note - no duplication - kartofelkopf, can you calrify you troop choices?

kartofelkopf wrote:Elites- 15x Lootas. 15-45 S7 shots is pretty nice.

T- 16x man BT Crusader Squad with LR DT. Not a "super unit" by any stretch, but squeezing a LR in the T selection is fun.

HQ- Big Mek with KFF (if the scenario rules allow his KFF to affect ALL friendly vehicles (RAW, it does, but most tourneys with allies apply it to only Ork units)) in a vehicle-heavy list.

H- Long Fangs, point for point, are made of win in this slot. Ignoring points? Hmm. Maybe Leman Russ squadron?

FA- Vendetta Squadron?

E/T- Full 10-man Nob Biker Squad. Lots of wounds and lots of kill-y.

T- 6x IG Guard Squads, Platoon Command Squad, 3x HWS, 3x SWS, 7x Chimeras. A LOT of meat in a single slot, where points are not an issue.
-------

Is this for a tourney?

With Al rahem? so they can all outflank

I'm surprised no one's mention Grey Hunters for Troops yet.

Everything you'd expect from a Space Marine, plus 2 special weapons and Counter-Charge has to put these guys in the top slot?

I'd also submit Thunder Wolf Calvary for #1 FA. Fast, Tough (both through actual toughness and wound allocation shenanigans), Killy and relatively inexpensive.

HQ
1 - Abbadon
2 - Eldrad, 10 Warlocks
3 - Mephiston
Elite
1 - Fire Dragons x 10, Exarch Tank Hunters, Crack Shot, Fire Pike, WS, ScatterLaser
2 - 15x Lootas
3 -
Troop
1 -
2 -
3 -
4 -
5 -
6 -
Fast Attack
1 - Thunder Wolf Calvary
2 -
3 -
Heavy Support
1 - Leman Russ squadron
2 - Long Fangs
3 -

I have added Thunderwolf Cavalry.

Still need troop choices. Anyone think some type of assault terminator should be in the elite slot?

I'd vote Thrakka > Mephiston.

Troops- Plague Marines, Grey Hunters, Khorne Bezerkers.

Fast Attack- Nob Bikers with Painboy + wound allocation shenanigans

HQ
1 - Abbadon
2 - Eldrad, 10 Warlocks
3 - Mephiston
Elite
1 - Fire Dragons x 10, Exarch Tank Hunters, Crack Shot, Fire Pike, WS, ScatterLaser
2 - 15x Lootas
3 -
Troop
1 - Plague Marines, Champion, Powerfist, Meltaguns/Flamers
2 - Grey Hunters (can't comment on config)
3 - Khorne Berzerkers x 20 (don't have codex handy, I believe they can run in sets of twenty)
4 -
5 -
6 -
Fast Attack
1 - Thunder Wolf Calvary
2 - Nob Bikers with Painboy + wound allocation shenanigans
3 -
Heavy Support
1 - Leman Russ squadron
2 - Long Fangs
3 -

Added nobs and troops. Vote on Thraka vs Mephiston?

Fateweaver and Vect+Dias should be in the HQ area as well (and a high consideration on the CTan, if points are of no object)

When not talking points both options are rather broken (especially Fateweavers 6" Fortune + mass spell firepower)
~EDIT~
Also, 3 Vendettas for one FA slot, 20 Scourges for another, 10(20 if you can) Vangaurd Vets for the last. TWC aren't that great all things considered(neither are Biker nobs).
~EDIT~
BA Vindis are probably some of the BiS Heavy support (maybe Trygon Primes / Hammerheads/Monoliths as well)

Firedragons are FAR from BiS for elites (compared to things like S-Priests, Furioso Librarians ((or even F-Dreds with claws)) and chosen)

As for Troops, either Grey Hunters, Hellions, Deff Dreds/Kans, Melta-Vets, Plague Marines or Tervagons take the slot.

Best Dedicated Transport = BA Land Raider Crusader/ Drop Pods.

~EDIT 2~

here is the actual list

HQ1: Fateweaver
HQ2: Njal Stormcaller + Termi Armor
HQ2.5: Bjorn the Fel Handed(Possible to repalce with Logan Grimnar) + Las Cannon
HQ3: Asdrubael Vect + Dias Filled with "Court of the Archon" Full up

Elites1: Furioso Librarian(Wings + Spear) + Drop pod + Deathwind Missile pod + Locator Beacon
Elites2: Furioso Dred + Talons + Meltagun + Drop Pod + Deathwind Missil Pod + locator beacon
Elites3: Sanguinary Priests x 3 Full upgrades (termi armor not Jump packs)

HS1: BA Vindi + upgrades
HS2: Monolith
HS3: Hammerhead + upgrades

FA1: Vendetta x3
FA2: Scourges x20 Splinter cannon x4 + Upgrade character
FA3: (If Bjorn)BA Vangaurd Vets x10 + SS/LC + LRC (if Logan) Grey Knight Teleport squad with Psycannons + upgrades.

Troop1: Plaguemarinesx16(meltagunx2 combi-melta, powerfist) + Rhino+HL/DP
Troop2: Khorn Bezerkers x11(plasma pistol x3) + Rhino+HL/DP
Troop3: Greyhunters x10 (Meltagunx2 Powerfist) + Razorback Lascannon/plasmagun
Troop4: Meltavets x 10 (Democharge) + Chimera with upgrades
Troop5: Death Companyx30 + TH + LR (godhammer) + upgrades
Troop6: (If Bjorn) Thousand Sons x10+Sorcerer(11) with Gift of Chaos+ Rhino+HL/DP (If Logan) Wolf Guard Termis x9+upgrades + Arjac + LRC

Basically you put the Zerkers, the Hunters and the vangaurd vets in the Vendettas (putting a priest with each) Deathcompany is on foot, along with the termies(if you go logan) and fateweaver, letting them all reroll their saves, Bjorn also goes with them. The other two dreds drop in and guide the DSing monolith (with their Drop pods) the Rhinos/razorbacks are all merely for extra guns. Njal rides with the meltavets in the chimera. Vindi drives down the opponents throat chucking str 10 ap 2 5" in their face while the hammerhead sits back safely shooting the str 10 ap1 at any vehicles on the board (it also automagically has cover). Plague marines ride in one of the extra LRCs after turn 1. Scourges are gunline with their 60+ Poisoned shots (and 12" move)

How about adding Fiends of Slaanesh into the elite section, 6 of them with one upgraded with unholy might. They're 30 pts per model, have 6 attacks on the charge, are beasts, and have rending. The model with the unholy might gets S6. That's 36 attacks on the charge, a 19-24 inch charge range because of fleet, and they can hit and run. One of the best elite choices in the game. Also high initiative (5 or 6, I forgot).

HQ - Lysander (cc tank busting monster)
HQ - Kharn (cc tank busting monster)

ELITES - Chaos Champion Terminators (40 pts each before weapons?)
ELITES - Marbo (demotastic)

TROOPS - Beserkers (furious charge cc troop monsters)
TROOPS - Plague Marines (fnp objective holders)

FAST ATTACK - Vendetta Squadron (flying lascannons)
FAST ATTACK - Devil Dog Squadron (fast melta vehicles)

HEAVY - Daemon Prince (Wings) (dp with wings, need I say more?)
HEAVY - Manticore (multiple template throwing ordnance tank)

How about 3 plasma sponsoned executioners with pask for a heavy choice?

Or there is the maxed out infantry platoon with al'rahem. PCS with 4 mg, 5 squads with plasma and commissars, 5 lascannon squads, 2 demo charge squads and 50 conscripts to hide behind. Add 6 chimera and a load of extras where available (krak, meltabombs, power weapons, extra armour etc.)

If outflanking al'rahem doesn't take your fancy then take chenkov and get respawning conscripts. The IG platoon is the best troop choice in the game as it iis huge but not just one squad so has loads of redundancy.

Double Auto-cannon Dred.

125 points for 4 Str7 re-roll misses on BS4 shots.

insanely easy to get cover for too on AV12.

Daemon-Archon Ren wrote:
[...]
Firedragons are FAR from BiS for elites (compared to things like S-Priests, Furioso Librarians ((or even F-Dreds with claws)) and chosen)

Elites1: Furioso Librarian(Wings + Spear) + Drop pod + Deathwind Missile pod + Locator Beacon
Elites2: Furioso Dred + Talons + Meltagun + Drop Pod + Deathwind Missil Pod + locator beacon
Elites3: Sanguinary Priests x 3 Full upgrades (termi armor not Jump packs)

What? Full FD in kited WS squad is such a big threat that your first two elites can't even try to stand up to them.
How is that Dred better? He is slower, less resilient and can't hit as hard..

Elites3 I agree. With every troop available (not FoC Troops) this is a no brainer..

Elites: 8 TH/SS assault terminators, Land Raider Crusader w/MM

580 points of good times

10x Nob Bikers are far better than 15 Lootas.
Lootas go down pretty quickly if targeted. Bikers are more difficult to take down with their cover saves. Lootas may get 15-45 shots but the Bikers will get 30 Twin-linked shots and are far better in Assault.

If points are no object (which is kind of silly) and we can't repeat units, I'd go with the following:

HQ:
Nightbringer
Eldrad + Full Retinue
Farsight + Full Retinue

Elites
Max Bloodcrushers
Max Nob Bikers
Max Wolfguard terminators

Troops
BA assault squad in Landraider redeemer
Full Death Company with jump packs + Lemartes
20 Plague marines
Full size tyranid Warrior brood
10 Wraithguard w/ spirit seer
Maxed IG platoon:
PCS with meltas, fist, comissar, chimera
5x Squad with power weapon, lascannon, plasma, commissar, power weapon, krak grenades, Chimeras
5x Heavy Weapon Squad with lascannons
3x Special Weapons Squads with demo charges
50 Conscripts

Fast Attack
3x Vendettas (Special weapon squads go here)
20 Scourges
Maxed Shrikes

Heavy Support
3x Carnifex with tons of guns
3x Leman Russ exterminator w/ pask
3x Medusas with bastion breachers

What about a tooled up Calgar with all his honour guard, doesn't he get like 3 sets of them?

vorpalhit wrote:What about a tooled up Calgar with all his honour guard, doesn't he get like 3 sets of them?

This is a real important point. Previously it was noted the a maxed out platoon of Imp Guard was the best troop choice. If Calgar gives you thirty hardcore marines which don't take up slots then surely he must be the most effective hq! How many other hq's could stand up to 30 cc armed marines and calgar the titanic god of war ultrasmurf god?

geordie09 wrote:How many other hq's could stand up to 30 cc armed marines and calgar the titanic god of war ultrasmurf god?

Either C'tan. Seriously.

I think in general Calgar plus triple honor guard is better, but either C'tan could just plow through them all.

Polonius wrote:

geordie09 wrote:How many other hq's could stand up to 30 cc armed marines and calgar the titanic god of war ultrasmurf god?

Either C'tan. Seriously.

I think in general Calgar plus triple honor guard is better, but either C'tan could just plow through them all.

Never had to face them... and judging by your opinion of them, I'm glad!

Well, they are T8 (so S4 can't wound them at all, and S6 need 6's to wound), with five wounds and a 4++ save. However, their attacks ignore all saves, including invulnerables. So the C'tan could pick out Calgar, rough him up, and then probably only take a wound back.

Like I said, pound for pound I'd take the honor guards, but in a one to one match up the C'tan would really hurt them.