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Wow, so the boys in dresses just got nasty!

Let's talk about some of the killer combos you can pull out of this book.

First off, the cyclone one terminators as troops is going to be legit.

5 Termies, 1 x l.claw, 4 x SS/TH, cyclone=235points That is a solid, solid scoring unit. Fearless, too.

Terminator command squads with FnP.

Typhoons for 75 points.

Scoring, fearless bikes and land speeders.

You can make a really good, low model count army out of this book.

Let's here some more ideas on how to take advantage of this new FAQ!

I think some very good list can come out of this codex now. Its to bad i sold all ravnwing army, along with all my deathwing terminators :(. makes me very sad haha.


A list that i can see being very strong will be this.

Biel-

Then max out terminators like this till you reach your point limit.

1x- LC-4x TH/SS, cyclone missiles.

And of course one of these units will have a Apothy, and banner.

Reecius wrote:5 Termies, 1 x l.claw, 4 x SS/TH, cyclone=235points That is a solid, solid scoring unit. Fearless, too.

Once again, I'm not a DA player, but DAMN THAT'S CHEAP!
I love the changes to the Meta this may have, admittedly, it's only a limited amount of builds between BT and DA that will work, however, any change is good change... right?

Ravenwing still aren't all there yet though, they're still expensive and still unable to turbo-boost in their scout move. They're of course much better than before however.



*I like how you can see the excitement in Reecius' words!

One of the things I like most about the change is that it makes Belial even more of a badass. He now can actually have a respectable invulnerable save.

@Just Dave
Haha, yes, I am very excited! Not since an edition change have we seen such a mix up in the meta. This is going to be really cool as it just elevated two books from not to hot!

I completely agree man! I'm gonna keep an eye on what happens.
If this weakens the MSU/Transport meta then that's a plus in my books. Surely it can only get better when Grey Knights come out too.

I think this was a really good move by GW, it should help shift some more kits (£££) for free (FaQ).
The only real problem I see is whether they'll reprint the Codices and how people will keep up to date.

Doublewing is surely better than ever now though!

Yeah it is. You can make a nails Deathwing list with only 11 KP that will be very strong against missile spam.

We'll see how it all shakes down, I may be over-reacting, but at the least this introduces two books into the tournament scene in a big way.

Surprising how long it took for something this simple... Good news for me since I started a Deathwing force a few months ago, perhaps not so good for the folks I play against :-)

We are playing a Tournament Chaos army against the new Death Wing now, updates to follow!

This is nice, because it makes my army good again. Too bad I got a bunch of TLC Terminators because TH/SS weren't as good in DA . I'll have to track down some TH/SS Terminators now and finish my LRC. My local Space Wolves and Blood Angels won't know what hit them! Seriously though, this changes a lot. Although the normal units still suck, the updated wargear puts the Deathwing back in the game. Cyclone Launchers are suddenly up to C:SM level but cheaper. TH/SS come in cheaper (I believe) than C:SM too, and are now just as good. Land Raiders are as good because of PotMS, and LRC is better because of a free Multi-melta. Kudos to GW for keeping those of us with older MEQ codices happy and buying! Plus they might sell a bunch of new codices!

My favorite Dark Angle is the Right Angle. I think it'll really change the shape of the game - and it's only 90 points!

Squash wrote:My favorite Dark Angle is the Right Angle. I think it'll really change the shape of the game - and it's only 90 points!

Oh, you.

(In case you didn't get it, look at the title.)

I'm more interested in how such small changes had such a big impact. At a glance it seems that less is more. Now if only they brought back Rites of Battle for Captains and Chapter Masters...

Why are the Bikes Fearless? I missed that.

4++ only in close combat upgraded to 3++ always on one of the most common units in Dark Angels (AFAIK, most people who still you the codex use Deathwing or Ravenwing). Land Raiders got boosted with the new POTMS. Cyclone Racks were updated to the new standard and are cheaper then C:SM. That and a couple other things all put a formerly bottom-tier codex back in competition if you run Deathwing. I think Ravenwing got a fix or two, but I didn't read that closely. I'm too busy jumping for joy that my army is suddenly good.

The new Deathwing is so much tougher than it used to be. I mean damn, you can put down 25 fearless, scoring 2+/3++ (mostly) models on the table, with a grand total of 8-12 (if you bring Typhoons) S8 shots per turn at 48" range.

And one squad will have FNP and +1A. In my quest to "master" (read: play better than incompetently) all the non-Codex Marines chapters, Dark Angels just moved up on my list of marines to play.

Also, @Just Dave: The Neverhood was one of the greatest games ever made, of all time.

Now we just have to wait and see all the grey and red marines, using the dark angels rules while claming that "they have always liked the dark angels"

As an deathwing player this is beyond awsome, th/ss terminators spam is going to be king in turnemants as they will be very good against the current meta. ( misslie/razor spam )

I'm sooooo excited now. And I'm going to shamelessly jump onto the DA bandwagon.

AHA! -jumps for joy-

I honestly thought this was a joke at first or that I had actually fallen asleep and was dreaming. This makes me even more excited to get my list built and finished. But first I need to hunt down some thunder hammers and storm shields and some more magnets. ^_^

@ Darkhound: Ravenwing are Fearless.

The biggest buffs are obviously the Deathwing. It's hard to justify bringing a lot of the other units b/c this unit has the potential to be very good. It also really hinders the SW Missile Spam. It also counters the IG Psycher unit as you can have an entire army of Fearless models.

My initial reaction was to utilize Deathwing Assault, but how viable is it to walk 25-30 Terminators across the table firing Cyclones? How risky would it be deep striking so many Terminators?

I'd love to add in Company Veterans as every model can get a Stormshield and multiple Melta weapons (combi and normal type). However, I'm not seeing a role for them to fulfill other than a Melta Suicide squad which is too pricey, IMO.

Dreadnoughts are still a bit pricey, but getting a Multi Melta in close could be a nice (via drop pod). But again, pricey.

A min sized Ravenwing bike squad with two Melta Guns and then an Multi Melta Attack bike seem reasonable. If you have to go second, just have the unit(s) Outflank.

Is there any other character worth taking? I've looked at Chaplains in Terminator armor and he seems a bit pricey. Saamael doesn't fit welll nor does Azrael (and very expensive).

Belial opens up taking a Command Squad (weird, but seems completely legal) to get another FNP squad, although they don't get Storm Shields.

Big question: is it worth playing a DA army if it's not Deathwing?

Non-deathwing DA? Wouldn't really think so...
They are still expensive 'nilla marines in that respect. You could "abuse" their other advantages. Like specials in 5 man tac squads, cheap typhoons and army wide ld10.

Xca|iber wrote:Also, @Just Dave: The Neverhood was one of the greatest games ever made, of all time.

My respect for you has just soared Xcaliber!

Well, Deathwing in our practice game smashed tournament Chaos in an objective mission. The army is a bit one dimensional (walk forward firing missiles, then hammer time) but it works damn well.

I like this thread. Time to go paint some DA termies

Time to finish painting my two Executioners w/Plasma sponsons.

Da finally have 3++ saves on SS! I love my army

I also think I'm going to get a couple typhoon landspeeders now. DA is becoming a great army again like when the codex was first released!

Are Cyclones better than Assault Cannons?

whitedragon wrote:Are Cyclones better than Assault Cannons?

Well you can't put an assault cannon on a TH/SS termie, though they pretty much do the same job. IMO, the cyclone is more reliable but the assault cannon is more powerful when you get lucky. Of course, you lose out on a 3++ with the assault cannon which can be useful when trying to keep your heavy weapon alive.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Oscarius wrote:Non-deathwing DA? Wouldn't really think so...
They are still expensive 'nilla marines in that respect. You could "abuse" their other advantages. Like specials in 5 man tac squads, cheap typhoons and army wide ld10.

Actually, Ironwing/Greenwing may work well coupled with proper support from DW/RW. As pure you'll be hard pushed to do well but I think using them to form the basis of your army then using DW/RW to act as bullet magnets and deathstars could work quite well.

could someone please post a link to this new info?

Nantukoshade wrote:could someone please post a link to this new info?

they're the GW FAQ/errata ... basically GW's gone F! it lets make marines the same ...

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?categoryId=1000018&pIndex=1&aId=3400019&multiPageMode=true&start=2

then look for every thing with version 1_1 (and 1_2 rule book)

whitedragon wrote:Are Cyclones better than Assault Cannons?

Yes, in this case. As Wizard12 said, you can use it WITH a TH/SS! So it is pretty awesome!

In general though, the Cyclone is better this edition for all MEQs (BTs I would say take both as BT a.cannons can have t.hunters) as it allows you to fire the missiles and s.bolter. More range, flexibility and firepower.

The Mix I like for DW: 1 l.calw, 4 TH/SS, Cyclone or 5 TH/SS. Cyclone

Reecius wrote:

whitedragon wrote:Are Cyclones better than Assault Cannons?

Yes, in this case. As Wizard12 said, you can use it WITH a TH/SS! So it is pretty awesome!

In general though, the Cyclone is better this edition for all MEQs (BTs I would say take both as BT a.cannons can have t.hunters) as it allows you to fire the missiles and s.bolter. More range, flexibility and firepower.

The Mix I like for DW: 1 l.calw, 4 TH/SS, Cyclone or 5 TH/SS. Cyclone

Wizard and Reece:

Thanks, I didn't even think of the Cyclone leaving your hands free for the shield. However, in my mind I'm thinking that mixing and matching your DW squads (since they can all take a mix of wargear) may be better for wound allocation purpose, especially with FNP from an Apothecary?

And Tank Hunting Assault Cannons are scary.