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Orlanth wrote:

Anvildude wrote:And if you have the GotY edition of Morrowind, you can get Morrowblivion and play both at the same time!

You can?


I know some mods will upgrade Morrowind graphics to the point where they are almost indistinguishable from Oblvion in quality, but I dont see how you can port characters from one province to another unless someon recreates one world in another game engine.

You ought to check it out. It's pretty much exactly what you just described, down to a 't'. Some enterprising folks decided to create Morrowind in those hundreds of acres of non-used land Oblivion has for modders, right down to the quests, items, enemies, all that. Unfortunately, it is in the Oblivion Engine, so I don't believe that there's Mark, Recall, Jump or Levitation style spells, or any Cliff Racers.

Question time. (regarding oblivion)

I've just realised that I should've created a custom class, rather than use a premade one, but should I restart the game in order to do so, or just push through?

I've been playing about an hour or so...

Depends on how much of an impact you think it'll make.

If you really messed up, then i'd go back and re-do it (always have a save just before you leave the sewers; it allows you to skip the tutorial with new characters by loading from that one instead. Just hit default settings for character creation, edit race, birthsign, class etc. and exit the sewer), otherwise it's easier to just go with it.

I picked morrowind
Made a nord mage/warrior
Named him Aevar Stone Singer
Been explorin and lootin

You're using Maces, right? Aevar can't use anything else, you know- not if he's really Aevar.


On Classes... This is your first Elder Scrolls game, so it's understandable- but the thing is, the class doesn't really effect later gameplay as much as you may think. In Morrowind, it did make it rather difficult to get started if you picked a class that differs greatly from your playstyle- but since Class doesn't effect what you do, only how you level up, you can basicaly get away with doing anything with any class in Oblivion, because of the levelled monsters. Just get the gear and the style of play you want, and press on.

That's basically exaclty how they're making Skyrim, after all.

Using a Daedric katana I got for finding that lost mine
Gonna go get his actual mace from Bloodmoon soon

Anvildude wrote:

Orlanth wrote:

Anvildude wrote:And if you have the GotY edition of Morrowind, you can get Morrowblivion and play both at the same time!

You can?


I know some mods will upgrade Morrowind graphics to the point where they are almost indistinguishable from Oblvion in quality, but I dont see how you can port characters from one province to another unless someon recreates one world in another game engine.

You ought to check it out. It's pretty much exactly what you just described, down to a 't'. Some enterprising folks decided to create Morrowind in those hundreds of acres of non-used land Oblivion has for modders, right down to the quests, items, enemies, all that. Unfortunately, it is in the Oblivion Engine, so I don't believe that there's Mark, Recall, Jump or Levitation style spells, or any Cliff Racers.

Interesting, do you play the Nerevarine from the proper start or the guy with the Emperor escaping though his cell?

Not sure. I don't have GotY edition...

I would be nice to see birds perched on rooftops like in real-life or rats scurrying about on the streets.

I think they may actually have that sort of stuff, since they have an 'active ecology' system going on. I don't think that any of the non-Primary NPCs are even scripted; they're just letting the Radiant system figure out what each of them would want to do.

Anvildude wrote:I think they may actually have that sort of stuff, since they have an 'active ecology' system going on. I don't think that any of the non-Primary NPCs are even scripted; they're just letting the Radiant system figure out what each of them would want to do.

Ok now i want to see a bear glitch the hell out on release which will cause it to have a beer in a tavern or just re-skinned an NPC that gives you a quest

Tazz Azrael wrote:

Anvildude wrote:I think they may actually have that sort of stuff, since they have an 'active ecology' system going on. I don't think that any of the non-Primary NPCs are even scripted; they're just letting the Radiant system figure out what each of them would want to do.

Ok now i want to see a bear glitch the hell out on release which will cause it to have a beer in a tavern or just re-skinned an NPC that gives you a quest

Cleveland Show mod anyone? Just give it a shirt and tie and you're done.

Think ill leave this link here for people:

http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/1207390-skyrim-fan-interview/

Its a Q&A session with some of the guys.

Avatar 720 wrote:As long as the DLCs don't have the words "Horse" and "Armour" together in the title, i'm looking forward to them.

As for the modding, continued support would be excellent. The construction set is a very simple and easy to use tool, so I hope any Skyrim tools will be similar.

Okay, someone please explain the whole Horse Armor meme.

GalacticDefender wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:As long as the DLCs don't have the words "Horse" and "Armour" together in the title, i'm looking forward to them.

As for the modding, continued support would be excellent. The construction set is a very simple and easy to use tool, so I hope any Skyrim tools will be similar.

Okay, someone please explain the whole Horse Armor meme.

It isn't a meme... at least i don't think it is.
One of the DLcs for Oblivion was Horse Armour...

purplefood wrote:

GalacticDefender wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:As long as the DLCs don't have the words "Horse" and "Armour" together in the title, i'm looking forward to them.

As for the modding, continued support would be excellent. The construction set is a very simple and easy to use tool, so I hope any Skyrim tools will be similar.

Okay, someone please explain the whole Horse Armor meme.

It isn't a meme... at least i don't think it is.
One of the DLcs for Oblivion was Horse Armour...

Was it not about $10 for that one?

Tazz Azrael wrote:

purplefood wrote:

GalacticDefender wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:As long as the DLCs don't have the words "Horse" and "Armour" together in the title, i'm looking forward to them.

As for the modding, continued support would be excellent. The construction set is a very simple and easy to use tool, so I hope any Skyrim tools will be similar.

Okay, someone please explain the whole Horse Armor meme.

It isn't a meme... at least i don't think it is.
One of the DLcs for Oblivion was Horse Armour...

Was it not about $10 for that one?

Something over-priced yeah...
Also the horses were still stupidly easy to kill.

johnscott10 wrote:Think ill leave this link here for people:

http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/1207390-skyrim-fan-interview/

Its a Q&A session with some of the guys.

Some of this greatly saddens me, and some of it just makes me want to Nerdrage.

"Oh, we took away Mark, Recall and Levitate because it let you get out of situations easily."

What. So it's a bad thing to let your player bugger out when the going gets rough? The Dragonborn can't be a coward? Is that it?

"Each armour set is a single piece, top and bottom."

So you're just going straight Fallout on this. You better let us choose our Gauntlets and Boots. And there'd better be a gajillion different armour sets.

On Enchanting:
"The method in Oblivion worked really well, so--"

Hold on. Stop right there, Mr. Howard. The method in Oblivion did not work well. It was horrible. I'll accept that you probably ought to have a workstation and/or some tools to properly Enchant stuff, but it was pissing terrible having to feed a fresh soul gem to your weapons every twenty swings. Sure, they oughtn't just re-fill themselves out of nowhere, but how about making it a little different, like, they refill themselves faster the more and larger Soul Gems you have in your inventory? Or at least when recharging an item, it wouldn't consume your gem. Making an Enchanted item consumes a gem, because you're putting it in the item. Recharging, it ought to leave the gem intact. Enchanted items should not act like Atronachs, chugging Soulgems like Magicka potions.

And the Constant Effect Clothing was, is, and always will be plain wrong. Constant Effect is a goal that you strive to attain, not something that just 'happens' with a pair of trousers.

Spears. Sad to see they're not making a comeback (especially since they're one of the primary weapons of Nordic peoples in real-life), but I can understand it, from a development point of view. Swords, axes, clubs, etc. generally use the same basic animations. Maybe a tweak here or there. Bows are another one- every bow uses the same animation. Saddening that Crossbows aren't back (is the animation for a Crossbow really that difficult?) but those and spears, I can see, would be two whole animations that would have to be built from scratch. But how about putting in 'slots' in the game so that Modders could make them instead? Just some extra 'weapons type' choices in the Construction Set, with non-specified animations... You could even have one-handed spears, and use that animation style for Daggers as well, instead of having everyone use them to slash with. (still can't believe they changed the design of the Daedric dagger from Morrowind's where it's designed as a slashing weapon but did a lot of damage on the stab, to Oblivion's, where it's designed as a stabbing weapon but did a lot of damage in the slash.)

Medium Armour. Not in the game. Because? "We wanted to focus on two armour types, really show how they're different from each other. Having a third type in between, a whole new style of armour use, would complicate that." Really? You know, Medium Armour isn't supposed to be a completely different style of armour, not in the way Light is different from Heavy (fast and weak, vs. slow and strong). It's for the in-between. For those folks who want to start out with armour that's able to actually take a beating, but won't drown them. It's heavier than Light armour, but not as strong as Heavy armour. It's stronger than Light armour, but not as heavy as Heavy armour. It's in the middle. Hence, Medium.

The proportions thing is nice, though. And it's about time you could give someone a beard.

Hold on. Stop right there, Mr. Howard. The method in Oblivion did not work well. It was horrible. I'll accept that you probably ought to have a workstation and/or some tools to properly Enchant stuff, but it was pissing terrible having to feed a fresh soul gem to your weapons every twenty swings.

It did work well, the fact it depleted fast was not an issue caused by the way enchanting worked, it was caused by attempted balance. Having larger charges with the same system would be completely fine.

Then again, you could always get an NPC to recharge your weapon for you.

Anvildude wrote:

johnscott10 wrote:Think ill leave this link here for people:

http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/1207390-skyrim-fan-interview/

Its a Q&A session with some of the guys.

Some of this greatly saddens me, and some of it just makes me want to Nerdrage.

"Oh, we took away Mark, Recall and Levitate because it let you get out of situations easily."

What. So it's a bad thing to let your player bugger out when the going gets rough? The Dragonborn can't be a coward? Is that it?

"Each armour set is a single piece, top and bottom."

So you're just going straight Fallout on this. You better let us choose our Gauntlets and Boots. And there'd better be a gajillion different armour sets.

On Enchanting:
"The method in Oblivion worked really well, so--"

Hold on. Stop right there, Mr. Howard. The method in Oblivion did not work well. It was horrible. I'll accept that you probably ought to have a workstation and/or some tools to properly Enchant stuff, but it was pissing terrible having to feed a fresh soul gem to your weapons every twenty swings. Sure, they oughtn't just re-fill themselves out of nowhere, but how about making it a little different, like, they refill themselves faster the more and larger Soul Gems you have in your inventory? Or at least when recharging an item, it wouldn't consume your gem. Making an Enchanted item consumes a gem, because you're putting it in the item. Recharging, it ought to leave the gem intact. Enchanted items should not act like Atronachs, chugging Soulgems like Magicka potions.

And the Constant Effect Clothing was, is, and always will be plain wrong. Constant Effect is a goal that you strive to attain, not something that just 'happens' with a pair of trousers.

Spears. Sad to see they're not making a comeback (especially since they're one of the primary weapons of Nordic peoples in real-life), but I can understand it, from a development point of view. Swords, axes, clubs, etc. generally use the same basic animations. Maybe a tweak here or there. Bows are another one- every bow uses the same animation. Saddening that Crossbows aren't back (is the animation for a Crossbow really that difficult?) but those and spears, I can see, would be two whole animations that would have to be built from scratch. But how about putting in 'slots' in the game so that Modders could make them instead? Just some extra 'weapons type' choices in the Construction Set, with non-specified animations... You could even have one-handed spears, and use that animation style for Daggers as well, instead of having everyone use them to slash with. (still can't believe they changed the design of the Daedric dagger from Morrowind's where it's designed as a slashing weapon but did a lot of damage on the stab, to Oblivion's, where it's designed as a stabbing weapon but did a lot of damage in the slash.)

Medium Armour. Not in the game. Because? "We wanted to focus on two armour types, really show how they're different from each other. Having a third type in between, a whole new style of armour use, would complicate that." Really? You know, Medium Armour isn't supposed to be a completely different style of armour, not in the way Light is different from Heavy (fast and weak, vs. slow and strong). It's for the in-between. For those folks who want to start out with armour that's able to actually take a beating, but won't drown them. It's heavier than Light armour, but not as strong as Heavy armour. It's stronger than Light armour, but not as heavy as Heavy armour. It's in the middle. Hence, Medium.

The proportions thing is nice, though. And it's about time you could give someone a beard.

I am ridiculously nerdrage right now, wtf!
theres no reason not to have different pieces unless bethesda was like, Herp derp lazy

Supposedly it's so they can have 'greater design control' to make it look 'better', and so they can load more models on the screen at once.

Hey, Bethesda? Guess what. Computers are Stupid Powerful these days. I don't know about the static processing power of aging 360s, but I'm planning on buying a new computer for Computer Animation and Skyrim. One that should be able to run 15 copies of Oblivion at once. I don't care about my character 'dressing the part' or whatever- that's what NPCs are for. I want to be able to stick an Ebony Pauldron on my right shoulder, Orkish on my left, a pair of Iron Bracers, and run around bare-chested (relatively. I wouldn't mind if there were straps or something attaching the Pauldrons to my character.) Why do you deny me this?


I know there'll be mods for that, and I can even make my own. But that either takes hours of fiddling, or using other people's work- and that invariably involves trawling through the thousands of 'Ballroom Gown Dress Set' and 'Chainmaille Bikini' and 'Sephiroth's Leather Straps' mods to try and find the actual reasonable armours.

Why do you deny me this?

For the exact reason that not everybody can afford to do this:

I'm planning on buying a new computer for Computer Animation and Skyrim.

A large company will not work around a small area of customers who can afford a new PC everytime a new release is made.

Bethesda know that computers can be powerful right now, but they also know that they aren't marketing to a fanbase that can afford a new rig just for Skyrim. Expecting them to be able to ramp up the specs so a few select people with high-end performance PCs can play it without complaining is beyond selfish.

Okay, I guess that sounded a bit whiney. But the thing is, it is possible to scale down the requirements for playing on a lower end computer. And there's such a thing as 'minimum requirements'. I couldn't play Oblivion for a year after I bought it because the hella-old computer my stingy self was using couldn't handle it. And Skyrim is going to be another level more needy in terms of hardware. They aren't marketing to a fanbase that's always going to have top-of-the-line computers, no, but they are marketing to a fanbase in which many of them will have very decent gaming rigs, and some of them will have top of the line equipment- and they're not just selling to this decade of gamers, either. If you make a good game, people will keep buying it. There's still people out there buying Morrowind for the first time, and falling in love with the Elder Scrolls. It'd be nice to at least have the option of greater customizability, or more replayability, to keep people coming back for more, another reason why they should do away with the Oblivion levelling system, and just use sort of 'hard' demarkations between difficulty zones.

That was one of the problems that caused Oblivion to feel so bland- you couldn't really tell when you passed from the Colovian Highlands to the Gold Coast, and the West Weald was incredibly similar to the Nibenay Basin (the only reason I even know the names of those regions (and I can't pull up a mental image of any of them) is because I have the map on the wall)- especially when compared to the differences between, say, the Bitter Coast and the Grazelands, or the Ashlands, or Red Mountain.

I'm hopeful that Skyrim will have more of those different regions, and that it won't just be "This place has tall mountains. This place has slightly shorter mountains that are a more brown color. This place has mountains that are really sharp, and there are a few more waterways through here, but otherwise are about the same as the blueish mountains over there." and will be more "This place has mountains. This place has Fjords, and the only way to get around is with these rickety rope bridges (because there's no Frikkin' Levitate!, this place is a coastal region of gently rolling hills, this place is a massive river valley between two mountain ranges, and this last place is above the clouds and has absolutely no plantlife whatsoever, but Dragons and Draugr like to hang out here.

The single piece armor thing really pisses me off. No reason for it, and I think it is one of the things that made Oblivion truly awesome. But if you want to levitate just use the console I assume they will be including with the PC version of the game.

I doubt you'll even be able to levitate with the console, or at least not properly. The engine probably won't allow it.

And even aside from that, it's the fact that, hey, there's apparently this entire branch of magicks that's just been forgotten since the second coming of Nerevar, just for 'balance'. Sure, it lets you get out of sticky situations, like when you're surrounded by Frost Atronachs. How exactly is that a bad thing? Am I just supposed to keep dying and re-loading the save file until I win? Bye bye immersion! I mean, come on, not even a decent Jump spell, or any way to raise your Acrobatics really high without the game glitching out? And no Slowfall, even! What happens if my delicate little mage gets knocked off a cliff by a clanfear?


I don't Fast Travel in Oblivion, because it breaks the immersion. I'd appreciate it if there was at least the option of taking a boat, or a carriage or something instead of going to the map and being all "Herp derp, I'ma teleport, even though I don't know how".

Lack of Mark and Recall, along with lack of Levitation, really makes me a sad panda

Oh man.............the rest of the game bette be fething stellar thats all Im saying. The lack of being able to customize how you LOOK really bugs me. The could pull it off in Morrowind with no problems....so why is it worse now? Do they know that modern consoles CRUSH what the original xbox and computers that used to run it? If not, someone send them a letter!

I'm going to miss enchanting 100% chameleon if we cant enchant enough pieces of armor

But thats why I try not to get too excited I suppose

I think it's more because of how the models are constructed. In Morrowind, there were separate little chunks for each body part. Little 'hams' for the thighs, separate hips, etc. And each was a full volume, with a top, bottom, sides, etc. It made the models blocky, but meant that you could just replace that bit with the one shaped like armour. With Oblivion's open-ended meshes (made that way because the animation was supposed to be more realistic.) they can't just replace bits, especially on complex joints like shoulders, because it wouldn't be able to cover the full range of motion. Or so they'd want you to think. The gauntlet pairs, though, were just them being lazy. Most of it was just because they didn't bother, because they could easily have made it work.

Anvildude wrote:Or so they'd want you to think. The gauntlet pairs, though, were just them being lazy. Most of it was just because they didn't bother, because they could easily have made it work.

"If its too complex, its not marketable!"