Help a noob make a Dark Elves army.

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**IHateNids**

I am planning on starting WHFB this year, and I am hoping for some help as to where to begin. I am looking for about a 1500 point list to begin with, centered around the Battalion box set

Thanks to all comments

**meleearchers**

If you own an army book I'd recommend taking a look and seeing what units look most appealing to you. Thankfully every unit our book is viable, except maybe RBT

From the battalion I would think about what lords/heroes you want to use. You'll definitely want a sorceress at some point, but never on a cold one, unless you love gambling =D.

Also adding another box of warriors or cosairs to your liking.

Looking towards the future, a cauldron of blood and hydra are too good not to have in your arsenal

**Aerethan**

Here is the 1500 list I am using currently:

Supreme Sorceress, lv4, sacrificial dagger, Dark Magic 285
Death Hag, Cauldron, BSB 225

CORE:
20 Warriors, Shields, Command, Standard of Discipline 170
20 Crossbowmen, Standard, Musician, Shields 235

SPECIAL:
5 Cold One Knights, Musician 143
12 Black Guard, Musician 163
6 Shades, XHW 102

RARE:
1 Hydra 175

Army Total 1498

**happygolucky**

Ah so you want advice from dakka eh? XD

Ok to help with this he will be fighting VC, TK, Lizardmen.

And we are playing casually (as in we are playing what we like to play with armies not "playing with what works" or netlists).

And we shall be plaing 2500pts lists (as I have heard this is standared).

hope this helps with making your armys 'nids.

EDIT: we are currently playing 1500pt games so far untill our armys build up, and we know the rules better.

**Sasa0mg**

Double up on Hydra's, all else is gravy.

**happygolucky**

Is a dreadlord good on a black dragon? none of us will be using cannons or stuff like that and were all going mounted monsters so I assume it would be awesome (just for the record I will have my VC lord mounted on a zombie dragon and the TK player will have his tomb king mounted on a warsphinx).

**tmarichards**

War machines are the biggest threat to him, but if they're not around then by all means give him a go.

**Shadowblade07**

I like mine on a black dragon, give him a black dragon egg, deathpiercer, and I think you can fit the ring of darkness on him awesome combo and generally good all around. Killing blow is always nice for fighting other characters, and black dragon egg is another breath weapon for when you fight a big block of infantry

Never use more than one hydra though, it really takes away from being able to really learn the army, and isn't very much fun for the rest of your gaming group

I play with the models I like as well and make the list fit around them, seems to work well and the games are always fun that way, and with GW going away with 'ard boyz you might see less of the WAAC armies. MIGHT being key word...

**IHateNids**

I was kinda hoping for a army that just walked forward shooting, whilst having fast units down the sides (cold ones or black steeds) and a monster or two in the middle (Black dragon and Hydra = good combo or bad combo?)

**RatWolf**

IHateNids wrote:I was kinda hoping for a army that just walked forward shooting

Play Dwarves then.

**Vulcan**

The problem is that troops with strong shooting capabilities generally don't do well in close combat. Even Dark Elf and Dwarf shooters - with the same statline as warriors in each race - don't do more than middling well in close combat. Elite combat troops tend to rip them up pretty thouroughly.

A unit can either move up and fight or stand back and shoot, for the most part. Units that try and do both at the same time tend to die.

**Aerethan**

Sasa0mg wrote:Double up on Hydra's, all else is gravy.

at 1500? even at 2500 it's cheesy.

And if LM, TK and VC are your main enemies, a dragon is great to take as they don't have cannons.

**tmarichards**

At lower points levels 2 hydras is definitely OTT, but in bigger games I don't think they're the best way to spend the points.

**AnomanderRake**

I tend to run a MSU force heavy on Core, but I've been suffering for lack of heavy-hitters; Sorceresses, Hydras, and good-sized elite infantry or Cold One Knight units are definitely important to the Dark Elves. A Cauldron of Blood and more Executioners are next on my shopping list.

**DaemonJellybaby**

You can quite easily make a cauldron of blood without spending the fortune that is a lump of metal.
The black dragon is fun, all dragons are fun

**Shadowbrand**

I suggest a block of 20 crossbowmen and a block of say 30 or so corsairs. But I'm unsure if those come with the batallion, I know Spearmen do, and their good as well.

Get a block of 10 or so cold one knights And a Sorceress for a lord. Your magic is very important as a Dark Elf.

**IHateNids**

The Battalion is 5 Cold ones 15 spearmen 15 corsairs and 10 crossbowmen IIRC

**helium42**

The battalion has 20 corsairs, 5 cold ones, and 28 warriors with the bits to make them all spears or crossbows, or any combination of.

My thoughts are that crossbowmen are a better unit to take than spearmen, as the crossbows have good range and the crossbowmen can fight almost as well as the spearmen in hand to hand.

What do you all think about corsairs? Are they better taken with the extra hand weapon, or hand crossbow? I like the idea of having extra shooting troops, but the hand crossbows have such a short range, they might not even get to shoot other than as a stand and shoot order when getting charged.

**IHateNids**

I used a stand-and-shoot from a unit of 15 Corsairs (proxy'd) on my friends legit VC grave guard. Wiped them out before the combat started

**tmarichards**

The AHWs are better all round, the handbows are slightly better against other Dark Elves and Daemons.

**happygolucky**

IHateNids wrote:I used a stand-and-shoot from a unit of 15 Corsairs (proxy'd) on my friends legit VC grave guard. Wiped them out before the combat started

Yeah then the vampire came

...

**A Town Called Malus**

I think people often take Corsairs with handbows in small units as flank protection. They can be effective at holding up fast cavalry trying to get down your flank as their Sea Dragon Cloaks make them tough to take down with shooting and if you charge them you're going to get pumped full of bolts first.

With extra hand weapons you put them in a block with good frontage for lots of attacks and to screen units behind them from shooting. With extra hand weapons and a Sea Serpent Standard they put out the same number of attacks as Witch Elves. Instead of the Witches poisoned attacks the Corsairs get an armour save.

Back up an extra hand weapon block with occam's mindrazor from lore of shadows and you have a unit nothing wants to mess with.

**IHateNids**

i might try that. Just found out someone started empire and is gonna have 2 Cannons.

Any anti-cannon advice with de?

**A Town Called Malus**

IHateNids wrote:i might try that. Just found out someone started empire and is gonna have 2 Cannons.

Any anti-cannon advice with de?

Shades are a good investment in that area.

A hero on a dark pegasus with the Pendant of Khaeleth is another idea worth considering. Fly down the flank fast and take them out quickly. If they fire at him then he'll get his ward save which has you roll equal to or under the attacks strength (with 6 always failing). So against a S10 hit from a cannon you'll only take a wound if you roll a 6. I don't know about you but a 1 in 6 chance of being hurt by a cannonball hitting you in the face is good odds to me

**tmarichards**

Hide the Cauldron, and kill the cannons as a matter of priority with magic missile/harpies.

The Dawnstone/Cloak of Hag Graef pegasus rider is also particularly good at killing cannons, especially if your opponent hasn't played him before- people tend to get upset when they realise he has a 3+ save with a re-roll against the cannon...

If he takes an Engineer, killing him with a magic missile can also force a panic check on the 3-4 surrounding war machines, who will often be out of the ld bubbles. They don't flee if they fail the panic tests, but it's one less turn that they get to shoot.

Overall, the cannons are annoying, but they're not really that big of a deal as the Cauldron is fairly survivable and hydras aren't worth taking in most competitive lists. Killing the Steam Tank is a much more pressing concern.

**IHateNids**

it seems good odds to me as well.

TBH i was thinking more like smack them in the face with a fireball.

and i don't intend getting a CoB

**A Town Called Malus**

tmarichards wrote:
Overall, the cannons are annoying, but they're not really that big of a deal as the Cauldron is fairly survivable and hydras aren't worth taking in most competitive lists. Killing the Steam Tank is a much more pressing concern.

Lore of Metal against Steam Tank? Or wouldn't Pit of Shades from Shadow automatically kill it as it doesn't have an initiative value?

**tmarichards**

Pit is great against the Tank, the problem I find vs Empire is the timing- if you try it too early, they will get rid of it with their Scroll/Seal of Destruction, but if you try it too late it's already on top of you.

A Metal level 1 is brilliant for dealing with a tank, and is not a bad addition to a list in any case- personally, I find the Fire level 2 to add more overall but in specific situations like against the Tank the Metal level 1 adds a huge amount more.

[quote=IHateNids

and i don't intend getting a CoB

**happygolucky**

Personally just get assassins to do the job they will be awesome...

And since a new empire book has been released I doubt anyone can say much of how to fight them until a few weeks...

**IHateNids**

If I was going to convert a CoB, i think a mortis engine would be my first stop.

@happygolucky: how do you suppose i get an assassin to the cannons?