Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Well with the book out and the FAQ up I think it is time the collective hivemind of DakkaDakka got to work coming up with tactics for the 6th edition. So I wanted to launch a centralized discussion of this topic.

Before we begin lets set some ground rules.

Please post:

Tactics that are new to 6th edition (i.e. tactic that rely on new rules, new psych powers, deployment set ups, etc., or tactics to counter something new to 6th edition, like fliers of fortifications)
Ways to better use specific units or unit combinations in 6th edition.
Ways to adapt old 5th edition tactics to the new rule (i.e. how would a person with an old 5th edition null deployment army make the most of the new rules).
Ways to counter new threats we will face from other armies in 6th edition.

Please do NOT post:

Information based on rumors. We have the book, we have the FAQ, these should be our only sources.
Complaints about 6th edition changes. This discussion is about rethinking how to play Tyranids effectively in this edition, not complaining that this or that was weakened or strengthened.
Questions/answers about what is in the new rule book or asking to look things up for you. This discussion is assuming you have access to the new book.
Non constructive criticism of others tactics. Don't just say that a tactic is dumb, or that it would never work. If you think a tactic is a bad idea please explain why and if possible offer an alternative way that the original poster could archive the affect they were going for.

One last thing. Try to keep an open mind. With a new edition armies will function somewhat differently now. So let's not dismiss anything out of hand and encourage new ideas.With that said let's roll up our sleeves and figure out how to make Tyranid's a feared army in 6th edition!

There are now a lots of randomness in the beginning of a game (power, warlodf trait), so tactics will have to be adapted "on the spot".
Anyway :
Nidzilla is back ? : "ground" MC don't need to be attached to infantry models to get cover anymore ( as far as I can read in the RB, they benefit cover just like a normal model). As for flying MC, "Swoop mode" can take care of that.

Gargoyles : with swoop mode MC don't need them for cover anymore. Though with "Hammer of wrath", you can have some nice uses for them,

What are the Tyranids options for anti-air? I remember reading that apparently they have no skyfire weapons and cannot use Bastion Turrets...

Turning my Tervigon into a Psychic Power beast by buying both additional psychic powers and then swapping the 3 in total for random psychic powers.
Pulled adrenal glands off everything. No longer worth the point cost.
Toxin sacs now make sense on MCs so that has some interesting potential.
Dropped Warp Blast off my zoanthropes in favor of a chance at random psychic power, but kept Warp Lance
Hive Tyrant now has an armored shell and Old Adversary. Will be grouping him with a brood of devourer termagaunts
I tossed a Broodlord into my Genestealers so I could gain another psychic power.

I have a harpy with twin linked venom cannons which I hope to use as more of an anti-air unit in and of itself, but I need to reread the FMC rules before committing to that.
Weaker cover saves make Biovores better too in my opinion.

Well with most of my armies I am worried about anti-air, but I am thinking of a hive tyrant with the 2+ armour save, bone sword and whiplash, with the personal traits. March him around by himself challenging everyone he can. Combine this with a tervigon giving him FNP or using Biomancy for Iron Arm or Endurance (hell any of the Biomancy spells).

Or perhaps using the Swarmlord with the Hallucination spell. The swarmlord and hive tyrant can make a reserve army work very well, except for the nerf to arriving from reserve.

I think that perhaps genestealers might be used with Infiltrate rather than outflank, but 6 minimum sized broodlord squads with the Psychic Shriek would cause a lot of damage to non-vehicles.

Trygons will still wreck vehicles even without the 2d6 because of smash and the ability to easier hit vehicles.

But again, the whole weakness against fliers will cause the tyranids pain, I am thinking having either Tyrannofexes (long range gun and 2+ armour save) and/or Hive Guard with either a swarmlord or Hive tyrant to grant preferred enemy (the hive tyrant might be preferable here) Ofcourse this will be a nice tactic aganist non-fliers, having 9 hive guard with preferred enemy firing at even easier to kill tanks

Adrenal Gland would still make since on Tervigons fo gaunt support. It allows them to re-roll wounds on the charge against T4 models and possible glance which is huge now taking hull points.

Just Dave wrote:What are the Tyranids options for anti-air? I remember reading that apparently they have no skyfire weapons and cannot use Bastion Turrets...

Tyranid anti-air is looking pretty grim. Our flying monstrous creatures can't actually damage fliers easily with a vector strike. The Flyrant is Str 6, and the Harpy is Str 5. Does that mean we have to glance Fliers to death with our vector strikes?

The other option is massed fire - hoping for 6's to hit. The problem is we can't easily spam high strength shooting in order to glance or penetrate their. One option is the twin-linked brainleech Tyrant.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Dannyevilguy wrote:Turning my Tervigon into a Psychic Power beast by buying both additional psychic powers and then swapping the 3 in total for random psychic powers.
Pulled adrenal glands off everything. No longer worth the point cost.
Toxin sacs now make sense on MCs so that has some interesting potential.
Dropped Warp Blast off my zoanthropes in favor of a chance at random psychic power, but kept Warp Lance
Hive Tyrant now has an armored shell and Old Adversary. Will be grouping him with a brood of devourer termagaunts
I tossed a Broodlord into my Genestealers so I could gain another psychic power.

I have a harpy with twin linked venom cannons which I hope to use as more of an anti-air unit in and of itself, but I need to reread the FMC rules before committing to that.
Weaker cover saves make Biovores better too in my opinion.

The Tyranid FAQ reads like you have to replace all the powers with random powers drawn from the new psychic disciplines or replace none at all. You can't replace one but not the other power.

nocturnalreaper wrote:Adrenal Gland would still make since on Tervigons fo gaunt support. It allows them to re-roll wounds on the charge against T4 models and possible glance which is huge now taking hull points.

Very good point there.

I do find it frustating that the Ravaners (who have Acute Senses) cannot outflank.

EDIT: reread the FAQ and it does say 'for each power' not 'for any power'. Which does seem to imply its all or none. Dangit.

Is it me, or are Ripper Swarms now rather awesome?
- fearless by default, so you don't have to worry about Synapse
- Rage after Ld 5, meaning they could have 6 attacks each on the charge!
- They don't suffer from Fearless wounds any more, meaning they are great at tarpitting
- Only 12pts including the ability to deep strike, I see them as great to use to cause issues for weapons that would Instant Death us with target saturation of instant-deathable units, or drop them neer the Zanthropes or Doom as psuedo bodyguards

MIKEtheMERCILESS wrote:Is it me, or are Ripper Swarms now rather awesome?
- fearless by default, so you don't have to worry about Synapse
- Rage after Ld 5, meaning they could have 6 attacks each on the charge!
- They don't suffer from Fearless wounds any more, meaning they are great at tarpitting
- Only 12pts including the ability to deep strike, I see them as great to use to cause issues for weapons that would Instant Death us with target saturation of instant-deathable units, or drop them neer the Zanthropes or Doom as psuedo bodyguards

I would love to believe that rippers became useable, but wouldn't they still take wounds from their mindless ability when outside of synapse?

Broodlord with poison and implant attacks could be an interesting combo both for challanges and picking off anything you don't like in a squad. (precision strikes)

Hive Tyrant with preferred enemy bubble will make your army much better at shooting as it slogs across the field.

Trygon outside synapse gets 8 attacks on charge + hammer.

Old one eye gets a free str 10 hit at Init 10.

Also don't forget boneswords are one of the only weapons left that ignore all armor.


Edit. Also a tyrant with indescrible horror means a charging unit must pass a LD test to charge in, and then pass another to attack due to fear.

I was thinking about using the parasite, as i just believe he has a lot going for him as he can now direct his attacks on 6 which conveniently activate his spawning ability also if his ability's are activate on hammer of wrath?

Just Dave wrote:What are the Tyranids options for anti-air? I remember reading that apparently they have no skyfire weapons and cannot use Bastion Turrets...

I think a dakka fex could fill this roll you would average 3.6 streanth 6 hits could have a good chance of dropping a flyer.

For anti air ill take my chances snap fire on our beloved hive gaurds. Or buff the tyrant d3 str to vector strike a flyer.

I am concerned that the lack of assault from reserve greatly enables the "hide in a corner" approach many take when fighting bugs. I can't tell from the rules vs. FAQ - can Ymgarl with Dormant still charge on the turn they come up? It seems like that is still in effect to me, so at least one unit has a chance to melee before getting shot up.

It seems like bugs have to play shooty now. And as some have mentioned, the change to Preferred Enemy makes this a lot more viable. The TFex was a good vehicle killer, I think it is weakened by the vehicle changes, but it still has good chances to knock flyer effectiveness down.

HT with old Adversary seems almost mandatory now. Maybe even three of them The new expanded FOC makes that possible (or even a 4th!). HT with Hive Commander went from being great to being pretty weak.

How about this for 2000 points:

HT with TL Devour, Armored Shell, Old Adversary -250
HT with TL Devour, Armored Shell, Old Adversary - 250
HT with TL Devour, Armored Shell, Old Adversary - 250

3 HG 150
3 HG 150
Doom in pod with VC (I like to keep the pod a threat, YMMV) 150

12 Devilgants - 120
12 Devilgants - 120
12 Devilgants - 120
12 Devilgants - 120
(I like having more units to split fire with - 20+ is often a lot of wasted FP)
Tervigon as troops, Adrenal, Poison, Catalyst
That leaves 125 points... Another unit of Devilguants, more HG, a GS with broolord group. Terrain ?
60 models, 4 synapse, 85 wounds.... pretty much everything with preferred enemy.

rollawaythestone wrote:The Tyranid FAQ reads like you have to replace all the powers with random powers drawn from the new psychic disciplines or replace none at all. You can't replace one but not the other power.

This has me a touch worried. The only thing that even compares to Warp Lands is Molten Beam, which is Pyromancy so Tyranids can't get it (and isn't even as good as Warp Lance). Warp Lance has been a staple anti tank power for me. Every game my Zoanthropes pull their weight because of it. While I can't see myself replacing it now, what is coming in the new Tyranid book worries me, because even if GW give them their own discipline that by chance includes something akin to Warp Lance, it being random really hurts. Short of having something else that can even semi reliably kill a heavy tank, it's going to really hurt my army.

-Loki- wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:The Tyranid FAQ reads like you have to replace all the powers with random powers drawn from the new psychic disciplines or replace none at all. You can't replace one but not the other power.

This has me a touch worried. The only thing that even compares to Warp Lands is Molten Beam, which is Pyromancy so Tyranids can't get it (and isn't even as good as Warp Lance). Warp Lance has been a staple anti tank power for me. Every game my Zoanthropes pull their weight because of it. While I can't see myself replacing it now, what is coming in the new Tyranid book worries me, because even if GW give them their own discipline that by chance includes something akin to Warp Lance, it being random really hurts. Short of having something else that can even semi reliably kill a heavy tank, it's going to really hurt my army.

why don't you just keep the warp lance? and if you have a squad of 2 or more zoanthorpes, can't one keep its powers and the other(s) replace them (if you wanted to take that gamble)?

Trygons, out of Synapse range with toxin sacs, now that's a good combination. 8 attacks (4 with smash) with rerolls, 2s with rerolls and ignoring armour. Hammer and no 'no retreat'. Oh yeah and Fear.

I am also looking forward to experimenting between Swarmlord and Hive tyrant for ultimate cage fighter champion. Flying circuses filled with flying hive tyrants and harpies. I'd say MC lists became even more viable this edition.

3 tyranofexxes and 3 groups Hive guard with an old adverserial HT with Heavy Venom cannon to give them preferred enemy. Back that up with a tervigon and you can fit that into a 1750. 4 6W MCs with 2+ saves and some FNP maybe even the better regeneration

Seems like a lot of us are on the same page.
Here's what I'm thinking for 2k - Walk a HT w/Old Advesary with 2 or 3 units of 3 Hive Guards.
Run 3 Tervigons as troops, giving them Adrenal and Poison(Adrenal for the possible chance to glance tanks)
2 Regular Trygons
And a Harpy. Seems to me this guy is becoming more of a legit choice! Which makes me happy because I loooove flying nids.

What do you all think of Flyrants now? I've been wanting to run one for a good while now, along with Shrikes. But after getting completely shot off the board and barely pulling out a win in 6th, I'm not so sure that's gonna be a good idea.

-Loki- wrote:

rollawaythestone wrote:The Tyranid FAQ reads like you have to replace all the powers with random powers drawn from the new psychic disciplines or replace none at all. You can't replace one but not the other power.

This has me a touch worried. The only thing that even compares to Warp Lands is Molten Beam, which is Pyromancy so Tyranids can't get it (and isn't even as good as Warp Lance). Warp Lance has been a staple anti tank power for me. Every game my Zoanthropes pull their weight because of it. While I can't see myself replacing it now, what is coming in the new Tyranid book worries me, because even if GW give them their own discipline that by chance includes something akin to Warp Lance, it being random really hurts. Short of having something else that can even semi reliably kill a heavy tank, it's going to really hurt my army.

Yeah, I can see that the Zoanthrope is the one Psyker we have that probably will not consistently switch out it's powers in our codex.

I see Flyrant seems to be in vogue at the moment, which is great - but since I have no rulebook (Royal Mail rant #82733), is there any new special rule for Flying Monsterous Creaters that makes them more survivable against heavy weapons? New psychic powers that increase it's durability?

On paper it sounds to me an easy vp for the enemy (and ~250pt loss for us) as the heavy weapons are focused before your very large flying monstrocity hits their lines...

@MIKE, yea that's my concerns. I'm hoping a harpy along with the Flyrant would cause for excellent early game threat, but I do feel like it's just throwing points at the enemy.

FMCs will be able to swoop and dive giving them a bit more survivalbility(giving the flying a 5+ cover save and causing the enemy to have to snapfire).

And the Iron Arm and Endurance Biomancy abilities for the Flyrant would help as well(assuming that's what you roll for...)

I believe telekinesis power #3 is how we will deal with fliers. A brood of zoeys swapping out there powers are bound to get one roll of a 3. Auto hits, Forcing to snap fire and a free haywire hit. Jink all you want, bye bye birdie.

I just had a thought, if you took a unit of Zoanthropes and swapped out their powers for Telekinesis, then you could have the gate of infinity and an offensive power (or perhaps keep one/two with its original powers since it seems to be that you can swap out powers per model, not per unit) and then you can use one to teleport the group around the table with the other using his powers to blow up tanks and whatnot.

This ofcourse means you'll end up having one zoanthrope not doing much, but it means they have a huge amount of more mobility than they do even with a spore. There is the risk also of one being lost in the warp ofcourse.

Hay, wait... Can the Doom use his Spirit Leech coming out of reserve? What does "can't use special powers" even mean?

Since Spirit Leech can occur even in the enemy turn - I'd say it can use it from reserve.

I really dislike the whole concept of random powers. If I want my models to teleport alá Warp Spiders, I'd give them teleportation powers. Not jump packs that also might accidentally turn into a lascannon without warning, and then into a short-range psyker-eating device. It's too unreliable. What happens if you, say, roll that special shooty Telekinesis power, hoping to teleport, when there's nothing to shoot at? Does it auto-fail? Remember that there is a chance to situate the blast on the psyker who fired it. Thankfully, they still have Warp Field.

EDIT: Also, Broodlord.

Frozen Ocean wrote:Since Spirit Leech can occur even in the enemy turn - I'd say it can use it from reserve.

I really dislike the whole concept of random powers. If I want my models to teleport alá Warp Spiders, I'd give them teleportation powers. Not jump packs that also might accidentally turn into a lascannon without warning, and then into a short-range psyker-eating device. It's too unreliable. What happens if you, say, roll that special shooty Telekinesis power, hoping to teleport, when there's nothing to shoot at? Does it auto-fail? Remember that there is a chance to situate the blast on the psyker who fired it. Thankfully, they still have Warp Field.

EDIT: Also, Broodlord.

Either you're using a lot of hyperbole or you're not understanding how you roll for powers, you don't do it at each turn. You roll for your powers at the beginning of the game

Oh, well, that's much better. It's still silly, though.

(Sorry, I don't have a rulebook, yet! My source is a rulebook-having friend in IM who can't be bothered to describe things properly, it seems DX )

I finally got to spend some time with a book today. Broodlords and /maybe/ HT's seem the best options for new psychic powers, all the rest seem to get more from the reliably good powers they already have. The Tervigon will be casting FNP. The Zoanthropes and Doom already have a great psychic attacks, better than anything they are likely to get from the cards. The Hive Tyrant's Paroxysm is an excellent power, the only reason not to take it is if your HT plans to be going after a lot of vehicles (which it might!). The Broodlord's Gaze power is great, but it also has a higher rate of failure - getting some of the biomancy abilities could essentially garauntee the Broodlord gets into combat, and may shield his unit on the way from incoming fire (toughness 6-8, or 6-8 attacks on the charge!)

I really think Objuration Mechanicum is the best way to handle fliers for the time being. It's a malediction, so isn't effected by snapfire, and has a 5/6 chance of causing a hull point and a 1/36 chance of blowing the flyer up. The power is also good to cast on infantry before an assault.