Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
2012/07/15 14:44:04
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
I like the HVC on the Harpy. Most of the time units are going to pass the pinning test from the stranglethron, plus the HVC is more likely to take off a hull point and can ID T4 characters. I also prefer the cluster spines usually since it tends to get more hits vs infantry, but Stinger Salvo does give you something you can fire at enemy fliers if you encounter those much.
Usually my harpy swoops around and drops blast templates rather than assaulting so I don't bother w/ the other biomorphs.
/
2012/07/15 15:37:49
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Mysticdog wrote:. I can't tell from the rules vs. FAQ - can Ymgarl with Dormant still charge on the turn they come up? It seems like that is still in effect to me, so at least one unit has a chance to melee before getting shot up.
yes they still can!
Why drink and drive when you can smoke and fly...
2012/07/15 19:28:47
Subject: Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Zookie wrote:The new MC flier rules breathed new life into the harpy. How do you think is the best way to arm a harpy and why? Or if a option is situational what is a situation that you would choose that option?
Heavy Venom cannon or Barbed Strangler?
Stinging Salvo or Cluster Spines?
Adrenal Glands?
Toxic Sacs?
Regeneration?
Honestly, I like the look of the basic 160 harpy with barbed and cluster, flying around with spore mine once and two large blasts each round sounds pretty nice to me, anti-tank or anti-air is done better (atleast tank, air we are kinda screwed against) with someone like the hive guard or a friendly flyrant nearby.
2012/07/16 02:14:20
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Assault squad w melta guns and Sang priest
Assault squad w melta guns
Predator with autocannon and lascannon sponsons
Rough highlight of the game:
:
Game and some things i noticed:
Mission: Relic
Deployment: Hammer and Anvil (long table, this is bad for me)
Psychic powers:
I rolled Iron Arm for my tyrant and something else useless I forgot. This pretty much turned the game for me, having a T9 Tyrant, power fists wounding on 5s saved my butt.
I rolled endurance for one of my broodlords,
I rolled gate of infinity and objuration mechanicum for the other broodlord.
I deployed first, kept my Armored shell tyrant behind a ruin and had the hive guard make a ring around him. The warriors and prime 6 inches behind to get the preferred enemy.
My opponent went first - in 6th edition MANTICORES are amazing, having wounds distributed based on where the blast lands he was able to kill off hive guard closest to his tanks... pick off the gaunt model holding the relic etc.
Old adversary tyrants are great, the hive guard rerolling 1's to hit, really helps getting dice in to try and glance the leman russes. Objuration mechicum helps broodlords survive overwatch and can glance mean things.
Tyranid warriors are much better now with the wound allocation. You no longer have to kill whole models first - wound allocation is just closest to furthest. This is how you maximize your wound allocation:
Tyranid Prime in front -
Heavy bolter wounds, autocannon wounds etc, come in.
Roll your LOOK OUT SIR
Now distribute one heavy bolter/autocannon wound to each tyranid warrior. I ended the game with 4 warriors and a prime each with 1 or 2 wounds left. Only 1 model was actually instant deathed by a demolisher cannon.
The relic mission is pretty fun, no more fearless wounds is AMAZING.
Not sure if I was doing this right but challenges can be quite bad for your monstrous creatures. My Toughness 9 tyrant (rolling high for the iron arm spell) charged a blood angels assault squad. I didn't issue any challenges, so my opponent did. His sarge stepped up and as expected my tyrant slappped 5 wounds on him and killed him (he made a FNP save though). Now I could have potentially killed about 5 marines but instead my opponent was able to tarpit my tyrant using challenges.
Not sure if I was doing this right but challenges can be quite bad for your monstrous creatures. My Toughness 9 tyrant (rolling high for the iron arm spell) charged a blood angels assault squad. I didn't issue any challenges, so my opponent did. His sarge stepped up and as expected my tyrant slappped 5 wounds on him and killed him (he made a FNP save though). Now I could have potentially killed about 5 marines but instead my opponent was able to tarpit my tyrant using challenges.
Consider this however - In the next round you've got a good chance to wipe his unit with your tyrant, while not being shot at at all since you were locked in combat from the previous turn. Plus you've killed his ld9 sarge. Sure he tarpitted you for a player turn of CC but that's almost what you want to happen.
Been out of the game for awhile, trying to find time to get back into it.
2012/07/16 15:20:50
Subject: Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
tetrisphreak wrote:I totally misread that entire post.
Yeah I agree If 1 model is in range of the venomthrope bubble they all get 5+ cover. In addition to that, should they be assaulted the enemy won't receive any bonus attacks for charging and take dangerous terrain tests (that allow armor saves now in 6th, so that's not as good as it was).
This got faq to be more clear also that only the VT gets the benefit of grenades. Every body does still get the Danger Terrain test buff still though. don't forget the VT now gets +2A on the charge when out of Synapse.
2012/07/16 18:57:26
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Zookie wrote:Here are the ways I could find to deal with flyers of different armor values:
you should count glances, not penetrates, as reducing vehicle to 0HP is the main way to kill them now, especially for tyranid.
Crimson Devil wrote: 7th edition 40k is a lot like BDSM these days. Only play with people you know and develop a safe word for when things get too intense. And It doesn't hurt to be a sadist or masochist as well.
5000pts
2000pts
7000pts
2012/07/17 10:44:02
Subject: Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
tetrisphreak wrote:I totally misread that entire post.
Yeah I agree If 1 model is in range of the venomthrope bubble they all get 5+ cover. In addition to that, should they be assaulted the enemy won't receive any bonus attacks for charging and take dangerous terrain tests (that allow armor saves now in 6th, so that's not as good as it was).
This got faq to be more clear also that only the VT gets the benefit of grenades. Every body does still get the Danger Terrain test buff still though. don't forget the VT now gets +2A on the charge when out of Synapse.
Isn't that only upon failing an instinctive behavior test?
Been out of the game for awhile, trying to find time to get back into it.
2012/07/17 11:09:10
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Just wanted to add some initial thoughts of my own.
Flyrant with OA and Double TL devourers:
Was always scary, but now you need 6's to hit him, he now got even more survivable.
Getting Iron Arm is a bonus to make him even more survivable when trying to get to the enemy ranks over the first turn or 2.
Having OA on him allows you to reroll 1's to hit and wound.
This means most of your dice will wound against standard troops. The -1 leadership check is a bonus.
What's even nicer is the new rule with precision shots for characters which makes double TL devourers even more worth taking. With your rerolls to hit and rerolling 1's you have a high chance of producing 6's.
This therefore allows you to use precision shots (rolled 6's to hit) to take out meltas, power fits or anything else scary in the unit.
Doom:
I love this guy. Using precsion shots above will help his survivability when landing. The problem is survival after landing and being shot and doubled out off the table.
If you can try and take out threats to him for his landing turn (with precision shots and whatever else you have available), I find that charging him into a combat with a non power fist or equivilant squad helps him to survive. As now he can't be shot and hopefully he's already aquired additional wounds to increase survivability from his automatic power.
Zoans -
Tasty unit because you can swap out there powers.
I don't think we've seen the back of Mech which appears to still be very viable. So lance is great. Pyromancy looks nice for when facing horde armies.
Tervigon -
Still a strong troop choice. Good for home obejectives.
Gate to Infinity could be fun (Telekenisis) allowing you to move him to other objectives spawning units.
Thats about all i can think of for now.
2012/07/17 13:08:14
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Still unconvinced about harpies unless you go all out for the flying circus. That T5 and a vulnerability to AP4 weapons (autocannons etc) is a problem and the one fun weapon they have is a one-shot use only!
Still think that mass hive guard is almost a must take in most lists, as it was before.
"We didn't underestimate them but they were a lot better than we thought."
Sir Bobby Robson
2012/07/17 13:10:12
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Zookie wrote:Here are the ways I could find to deal with flyers of different armor values:
AV 10
3. Three Hive Guard: 0.66 penetrating hits.
Umm, 6 shots=4 hits, S8= more than 0.66 pen hits...
Hive Guard don't have skyfire (although they do get to ignore Jink)
Stick them in an OA bubble and the ability to re-roll 1s makes them quite a bit more effective. That's one of the reasons I'm taking wings of my tyrant.
"We didn't underestimate them but they were a lot better than we thought."
Sir Bobby Robson
2012/07/17 13:27:15
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Zookie wrote:Here are the ways I could find to deal with flyers of different armor values:
AV 10
3. Three Hive Guard: 0.66 penetrating hits.
Umm, 6 shots=4 hits, S8= more than 0.66 pen hits...
Hive Guard don't have skyfire (although they do get to ignore Jink)
Stick them in an OA bubble and the ability to re-roll 1s makes them quite a bit more effective. That's one of the reasons I'm taking wings of my tyrant.
If your measure of "quite a bit" is taking them from a 16 % chance to hit to a ~18% chance to hit... you and I have different definitions.
My beautiful wife wrote:Trucks = Carnifex snack, Tanks = meals.
2012/07/17 20:01:06
Subject: Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
L0rdF1end wrote:Just wanted to add some initial thoughts of my own.
Flyrant with OA and Double TL devourers:
Was always scary, but now you need 6's to hit him, he now got even more survivable.
Getting Iron Arm is a bonus to make him even more survivable when trying to get to the enemy ranks over the first turn or 2.
Having OA on him allows you to reroll 1's to hit and wound.
This means most of your dice will wound against standard troops. The -1 leadership check is a bonus.
What's even nicer is the new rule with precision shots for characters which makes double TL devourers even more worth taking. With your rerolls to hit and rerolling 1's you have a high chance of producing 6's.
This therefore allows you to use precision shots (rolled 6's to hit) to take out meltas, power fits or anything else scary in the unit.
Doom:
I love this guy. Using precsion shots above will help his survivability when landing. The problem is survival after landing and being shot and doubled out off the table.
If you can try and take out threats to him for his landing turn (with precision shots and whatever else you have available), I find that charging him into a combat with a non power fist or equivilant squad helps him to survive. As now he can't be shot and hopefully he's already aquired additional wounds to increase survivability from his automatic power.
Zoans -
Tasty unit because you can swap out there powers.
I don't think we've seen the back of Mech which appears to still be very viable. So lance is great. Pyromancy looks nice for when facing horde armies.
Tervigon -
Still a strong troop choice. Good for home obejectives.
Gate to Infinity could be fun (Telekenisis) allowing you to move him to other objectives spawning units.
Thats about all i can think of for now.
Largely agree with your analysis of the tyrant, though personally I find him more useful for vector striking and then shooting rear armor on transports at the earliest opportunity. Especially with nids, the sooner your opponent's transports are destroyed the better.
Personally, I still refuse to take the Doom, as it just seems like such an un-nidlike concept.
Zoans still blow the ever-loving gak out of tanks of nearly all varieties, but now they're also useful against buildings/fortifications, which are especially juicy targets when garrisoned. Some of the results on that building damage table can be brutal for a unit inside. I would also remind you that nids do NOT have access to pyromancy, no matter how nice it looks against horde armies.
Yes, Tervigon-spam still looks to be quite the popular choice for net-lists, though it was never quite my cup of tea. If you're a WAAC-type, however, spam away.
We're not evil, we're just hungry.
2012/07/17 21:46:00
Subject: Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
"would also remind you that nids do NOT have access to pyromancy, no matter how nice it looks against horde armies".
Crap, really, so what can they choose from and where is that defined in the rules?
Thanks for the help.
Nevermind, I found it. Biomancy, Telekinesis and Telepathy.
One question though, Doom, He is classed as having Psychich Mastery 1. So does that mean he gets to keep his automatic power (Cataclysm) but can still roll up one power on the diciplines available?
Thanks kindly for clarification.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/07/18 09:32:49
2012/07/18 10:36:39
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
Zookie wrote:Here are the ways I could find to deal with flyers of different armor values:
AV 10
3. Three Hive Guard: 0.66 penetrating hits.
Umm, 6 shots=4 hits, S8= more than 0.66 pen hits...
Hive Guard don't have skyfire (although they do get to ignore Jink)
Stick them in an OA bubble and the ability to re-roll 1s makes them quite a bit more effective. That's one of the reasons I'm taking wings of my tyrant.
If your measure of "quite a bit" is taking them from a 16 % chance to hit to a ~18% chance to hit... you and I have different definitions.
I would be looking at either 4 or 6 hive guard depending on list. So up to 12 shots. Hit on 6 and re-roll 1s. I'm not looking to pen the flyer, just get enough glances (together with the TL devourers on the tyrant) to take them out. I have a good chance of getting 2-3 hits which is not great but 2 rounds of that should down an armour 10/11 flyer. if you take a unt you look at hits per unit not per shot for a realistic game comparison. Tyrant should be able to down a flyer a turn by itself.
I'm taking a tyrant and OA anyway, so no extra points. Just making sure I deploy the guard to take advantage if needed. Generally there will be better targets for them, but sometimes beggars can't be choosers.
"We didn't underestimate them but they were a lot better than we thought."
Sir Bobby Robson
2012/07/18 13:34:46
Subject: Re:Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
L0rdF1end wrote:One question though, Doom, He is classed as having Psychich Mastery 1. So does that mean he gets to keep his automatic power (Cataclysm) but can still roll up one power on the diciplines available?
Nope - trade it in for a roll or keep it.
My beautiful wife wrote:Trucks = Carnifex snack, Tanks = meals.
2012/07/20 19:15:47
Subject: Discussion of Tyranid Tactics in 6th Edition
I tend to end up playing against blob-heavy IG. Doomie loves getting stuck into a big pile of S<8 infantry. Cataclysm is fun when she's exposed (and doesn't it now hit vehicles at full S from a graze?), harvesting loads of W from the target-dense environment, but when she gets into melee isn't she better off with non-shooting powers?
Don't get me wrong, if facing hordes with little or no S8+, Cataclysm rocks. Loads of targets to hit, nowhere for them to run, and all they can do is play attrition. But what about where she's facing a lot of S8+ in hordes (Orks come to mind), low numbers of W to harvest (not uncommon in Eldar), and low numbers with lots of S8 (often the case with Marines)? What decks are good in those situations? I can see an argument for precision strike powers that kill a handful of Marines without burning off 3W to charge up.
Is there scope for Doomie to elevate from a dirty trick that trolls the enemy whilst the main swarm does its thing, and up to a central part of the plan who gets specific buffs from other units to become preposterously robust? Could be interesting to play a Buffalo's Horns in which the flanks stop the prey from escaping her and throw the EW buffs on her, for instance.
/ 
2000pts
