Tomb Kings Incoming/pictures page 9 onwards

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**streamdragon**

With only 4 attacks, you're almost always better off doing the crush, you'd be hard pressed to fit a small template over less than 4 models. Obvious exceptions are made for single model units (like other monsters) or anything with only one rank. But even against 10 guys (2 ranks of 5) on 25mm bases (like say, Chaos Warriors) you're going to get more than 4 models under a template.

I'll assume that since it uses a template the hits are randomized as per shooting (and thus somehow allows a LoS! save), but even still...

**vonjankmon**

I think the thing with Thundercrush is what str is strikes at. It uses the Sphinx str 5, well just wow...

It's something like a str 2 hit, that seems a bit more inline with things. I could still do some damage but it really lowers the insane infantry just got pwned moments.

**streamdragon**

True enough.

Hm... I wonder if I could turn that Sphinx into a Screaming Bell. Green stuff a little fur, throw a bell up on the howdah...

Yes... yes... filthy skeleton thingthings, your models will be minemine...

**jmurph**

The Thundersmash is at the 'sphinx's strength. Requires a roll to hit, though. Then place template and roll for wounds and saves.

**march10k**

Hmmm... So priests can ride warsphinxes, too? That actually makes them useful, perhaps, maybe. I'm certain that I want my kings on foot for MWBD, and at the same time, a warsphinx out of lord/hero points easily pushes a character out of the mix the same way the casket does...but it does seem like a good way to keep the heiro alive...I guess I'll have to wait and see the book. One thing's for sure, though, I'm definitely doing a necrosphinx with crook and flail, rather than those dopey katar looking blades.

And using winds of magic, I'm having a hard time coming up with a reason to take a HLP (MWBD>L3/4)...I'm thinking two survivor kings for lords, and three-four priests for heroes (two nehekerans and 1-2 lore of light)... unless TPs get to boost their units' WS as well...in which case I'd go the opposite way and spam 3-4 princes, and take two HLPs (to get 4/6 spells from each lore, assuming those taking the TK lore don't automatically know all spells?)

Dropping my SSC and the points drop for my skellies should give me the points for the necrosphinx, and the character changes will of course be internal to that point allowance...

The cool thing is, with no casket or catapult to protect, my tactical options go up dramatically!

**iproxtaco**

vonjankmon wrote:I think the thing with Thundercrush is what str is strikes at. It uses the Sphinx str 5, well just wow...

It's something like a str 2 hit, that seems a bit more inline with things. I could still do some damage but it really lowers the insane infantry just got pwned moments.

\

No its a strength 5 hit, on all models under the template. I guess it may be evened out depending on what roll you need to actually hit with the attack in the first place, before rolling for wounds and saves.

**Kroothawk**

Some insights by the first people having read the army book:

Notushabti over at Tomb King Forum wrote:From my reading of the TK army book this afternoon.We still cause fear, can't march, Arrows of the asp, and hold for charge reaction. Unbreakable/unstable special rules etc.

Magic: Must take our Nehekharan lore on heirophant and additional casters can choose either from the Lores of light or death.
We only use power dice from Winds of Magic now. I am assuming that we can miscast now as well.
Level 1 Liche 70 pts , Lvl 2 upgrade for 35pts
Level 3 high Liche priest 170 pts, Lvl 4 upgrade 35pts

Nehekharan lore:
The restless dead is the lore attribute. D3 + 1 wounds if augment spell is successfully caste on friendly Nehekharan undead target unit.
Khsar's incantation of the desert wind (signature spell). Caste on 8+. all unengaged friendly nehekharan undead units within 12" may make a single move as if in the remaining moves sub-phase (cannot charge). all non engaged friendlies can be instead targeted within 24" for a casting value of 16+. Any unit can only be effected by the desert wind once per turn.(undead construct units can only recover 1 wound per turn)

1. DJaf's Incantation of Cursed Blades. 7+. Augment, range 12". Until the start of your next magic phase close combat attacks gain killing blow or heroic killing blow special rule. If the unit already has killing blow or herioc killing blow special abilty, it will work on a 'To wound' roll of 5 or 6+ while this spell is in play. can increase range to 24" instead on a casting value of 10+
2. Neru's Incantation of Protection 9+. Augment range 12", until start of caster's next magic phase.
5+ ward save on a single friendly target unit. all friendly units within 12" can be targeted instead for 18+
3. Ptra's Incantation of righteous smiting 9+. Augment range 12" until start of caster's next magic phase. Target unit gains 1 attack (mounts, riders, models crewing chariots, monsters and war machines). If armed with a bow or great bow then get multiple shot (2) special rule. All friendly Nehekharan undead units can be targeted instead within 24" for 18+.
4. Usirian's Incantation of Vengeance, hex range 18" 10+. Until start of caster's next magic phase target unit has its movement reduced by D3 to min of 1 & all terrain is treated as dangerous terrain if unit moves. range can be extended to 36" for a casting value of 13+. Until start of next magic phase.
5. Usekhp's Incantation of Desiccation, 11+ hex range 24". target unit suffers -1 strength, -1 toughness (to min of 1) Until start of caster's next magic phase. Can instead choose to reduce by D3 (min of 1) for a casting value of 22+
6. Sakmet's Incantaion of the Skullstorm, Remains in play. magical vortex 15+. small template is placed on the board and a direction is nominated. artillery dice is rolled and the number is multiplied by wizard level = amount template is moved in stated direction. Every model passed over or under the template suffers a single strength 4 hit. misfire = place template over caster and scatter by wizards level in random direction. use large round template for a casting value 25+. on subsequent turns, vortex moves randomly equal to role of artillery dice. if misfire, vortex dissipates instantly.

Units:
There is an impressive mix of special characters.
eg: There is a lvl 5 wizard for 360pts, Arkhan the Black.

From memory skeletons are 4 pts with 30 points for full command
hand weapon and shield is free
spear is 1+ point per model, light armour is 1 pt per model.

Bowmen are 6 pts, 30 pts for full command, 1pt per model for light armour.

heavy horsemen are 12 pts with vanguard

skeleton horsemen 14pts (light cav) scout special rule.

Ushabti are 50 points each. Can add command units and giant bows str 6 30"

chariots are 55 points forming ranks 3 models wide.

a new model that gives undead constructs regeneration within 12"

a new model that acts as body guard to Tomb King except in a challenge, he steps in to take the hit on a 2+

skulls of the foe is now 30 points

Casket now 135 points has 3 wounds and doesn't have a priest as crew
Light of death works differently

It came from below:
Place the marker in remaining moves phase, Buried units are raised using scatter dice but cannot charge. miscast is the same.

Magic items: (from memory)
Destroyer of Eternities 80 pts
Blade of Ankhara 50 pts? every unsaved wound gains 1 wound.
enkhils kanopy 50 pts?
cloak of dunes 50 pts?:character has fly and any enemy unit flown over takes D? damage.

BotuL 50 pts power level 5.
Banner of the hidden sands is 90 points and any reserve troops (not yet deployed) up to 150 points can be deployed within 12" of bearer in remaining moves sub phase.

(...)
Light of death of is:(from memory) roll 3d6,combine total and compare to units highest leadership (not sure about generals inspiring presence). if the roll is higher than leadership the difference is the amount of wounds with no armor saves, distributed as shooting attacks. Then choose a unit within 6", on 4+ the light of death jumps to that unit roll 3d6 and so on. If the casket is destoyed any units with 12" takes (d6 str6 hits)?

I cannot remember if this is the mechanism for it going off or if it is only how damage is resolved.

We saw a giant with the unstoppable assault special rule for 170 pts. You could extras like another hand weapon and and Bow to take it to 215 points in total.

(...)
Also, please do not get too hung up on the wording of my posts. They are by no means an exact transcription.
(...)
I feel that they have done a good job breathing new life into our beloved TK.

Mannfred over at Warseer wrote:Umm here are some special rules for the new tomb kings:

Special Characters:
Arkhan the black - Lv5 wizard...i kid you not
Special Necrotect - gives boast to constructs on the board
Settra's Herald - a more buffed up version of the Tomb King herald
A Tomb prince/king that is actually made up of scrabs
Khalida is still in an she gives the unit she joins poison shooting, and also they can use her ballistic skill of 3 instead of the usual 2.

Tomb King - my will be done, gives the unit joined his ws of 6
Tomb Prince
Tomb Herald - Mix between an icon bearer and a champion
Necrotect - gives all constructs within 12 inches of them regeneration

Core Units:
Nothing different here.....skeles are 4pts each, and bows ones are 1 or 2 points more than them.
Chariots - d6 impact hits at str4 +1 str for each rank behind the first but they are no longer fast cav but still on 5+ armour
Light Cavalry get the fast cav special rule
Heavy/Regular Cav get the vanguard rule

Special:
Ushabti - new plastic ushabti with bows, 30inch str6 volley fire.
Tomb scorpion - same
Carrions - same
Necroknights - the tomb guard ridding giant serpents
Stalkers - have a special attack, for each one it's an 8inch shooting attack x artillery dice and at str 1 against enemy initiative, no armour saves. If you roll misfire you take d3 wounds back....because....it describes shiny bits of armour and swords reflecting their gaze and hence they turn themselves to stone...
Tomb Guard - can have halberds and bows i fink....bows do not have killing blow

Rare: - the good stuff

Casket of Souls - 3d6 leadership against a unit and then on a 4+ it can bounce to a unit beside it...
The sphinex with tomb guards on it's back, thunderstomp on 2d6.
The sphinex with blades, special str 10 heroic killing blow attack
Tomb Giant - the one we know of, can also take a bow, and it's a bolt thrower basically.
Special Tomb Giant - this on is a giant liche priest. It gives d3 extra casting to spells within 12 and has 3 spells of it's own, bound items.

Enjoy.

(...)
Umm Magic Items....lol it's pretty sad...it's like the Orcs and Gobo book so theres only like 8 pieces of wargear all up if fink

2 Weapons - Destroyer is in...and the other one is like for each wound cause you get a wound back? I fink it's like blooddrinker from Vamps.

1 Armour - ??
umm one enchanted item - is one use only gives d6 extra to incantations for the wizard for one turn.

Oh magic banners....

The reform banner is in.....clueless why
but the other on is like banner of hidden legion....150pts and the unit gets to like act like a tomb scorpion so it comes from below special rule but different wording...if you choose it to come up from within 12 of the banner you get to re-roll the scatter dice.

Ummm ushabati can get addition hand weapon or great weapon or great bow - sorry but the bow is like wtf so yea...

Umm skeles? The basic skele i believe has shield and hand weapon mentioned above. Oh and bow armed skeles are 2 extra points.

Chariots are....if the old ones were 50pts their now 5 points more.....

Belverker over at Warseer wrote:Skeletons have hand weapon and shield, can get spears and light armour at the usual cost

skeleton bowmen can get light armour

Chariots are more points

light and heavy cav are both less points

chariots are core without needing a tomb king

all have the same cost for their command groups

**Amaya**

Settra is gone?

**Kirasu**

So another big monster that can be auto killed by a cannon that will hit almost all the time due to engineer rules

Does gw not understand why monsters suck? Oh well it can sit next to my stegadons. HOwever, on the flip side they seem to have realized that undead needed to be 4 pts a model due to how unfair unstable is against them. Good job!

I like multiple shots that never need more than a 5+ to hit.. Poor highelves, youre even more awful with your bows now

**Minsc**

... Killing Blow Tomb Guard on 5+? WS6, S4 w/ 4+/5+ save or WS6 S5 5+ save unit with 5+ killing blow? That... ouch. I feel sorry for Cavalry now. I also feel sorry for my Boyz, as now I'm definitely getting the Boss stuck-in with the Tomb Guard, so it's only going to be Goblins that ever get anywhere near them.

5+ Ward Spell is mixed. And by that, I mean "mixed on degree of power". Decent spell, but not sure how close it comes to "crazy".

Single Righteous Smiting / Game is going to hurt TK shooting armies, a lot.

Vengeance looks a bit weak to me, but only because of Itchy Nuisance.

Desiccation also seems a bit weak to me, in this case when compared to BRB. Combining it with... whatever Lore's signature spell could be nasty, though, with many, many D3's of stats sapped.

Skullstorm looks good for slamming someone with lots of hits at once.

Well, there goes my hope for TK's with Arkhan. I just... am not looking forward to them like this.

Ushabti at 50pts / apiece is not surprising.

If Light of Death is shooting, can be nasty versus low-leadership armies. Can.

Thematically? Eh, thematically GW killed Tomb Kings for me (somehow!). Model-wise I still have a great interest to get them, and if I can I'll try to buy the old TK book when I next step in my GW, but as for actually playing the army? No thank you.

**Eldar Own**

I have to say that the new sphinx things are pretty damn awesome, they nearly made me want to start a tomb kings army. They're not a bad price either, considering it's GW we're on about here and it is a huge two-in-one kit.

Their rules do seem pretty awesome too, both seem to be able to cause a lot of damage, and one can even fly! That should teach those cannons a lesson or two!

**vonjankmon**

The rules just seem very "meh" to me. I know that the TK have only been seperate from VC for one army book but they really had a unique feel to them with their spells and army. This new book just really feels like they're just more of the same that's out there.

Losing the ability to charge via magic hurts them a lot too, since that's basically the only way the TK currently function.

**kirsanth**

First impression:

The rules seem somewhat suprising to me.

And not really in a good way.

I will not deploy my judgement though, I will hold it in reserve.

**Tantras**

I see a lot of interesting rules posted above, but I agree with Vonjankmon, not being able to charge with the movement spell is quite a blow.

**Platuan4th**

Hmmm... Does anyone know if the special Necrotect allows Ushabti(or some other Construct Unit) as Core?

**JimLofa**

streamdragon wrote:
iproxtaco wrote:Can exchange its attacks for a Thundercrush, place a small template on an adjacent unit and then roll 'a load of die' to wound. It's said is can kill 31 models a turn, if all its attacks wound. Apparently it can Thunderstomp in the same turn as the Thundercrush.

This sounds... ludicrous, honestly.

Of course they are going to bring out the coolest and most ridiculous aspects of the army. This is a business and they are trying to entice people to buy their product. When we get our hands on the book, we may actually see a balanced army... So much rides on core troops and army synergy for any army book. Most armies have one or two all star units. Look at the steam tank or the bloodthirster for example. Still, a general can not win with these units alone.

-Jim

**Thunderfrog**

I sure hope a lot of this is wrong, although I have a feeling it will not be.

1) Losing incantations took away the really unique thing about the army. And the new lore sucks for the most part. A lot of TK armies will need multiple units on the field to function but you can't spin your buffs everywhere like you could before. And seriously.. what other lore has so many 15+ casting requirements in it.

2) Nerfing Khalida. Lame.

3) Nerfing shooty-kings as a whole. Terrible!

4) Nerfing It came from below! bs! Why even take a scorpion for war machine hunting when now it pops up on your turn, then they just turn around and shoot/charge it on their turn. Completely freaking stupid.

5) Really? The Casket had to get hit too?

Final thoughts?

Unless a lot of this is wrong, this is definately Tyranid Cruddace and not Guard Cruddace. They got rid of almost all of my favorite things about the army. They should have just left them on the shelf until someone who actually understood the army would have a chance to write it. Now it's so much less strategy and more blocking up doods with a high WS and marching them into other doods with high WS's, except your doods have KB!

RARARAR.

I just spent 300$ on GK stuff, as it was 1 of my 4 armies. I have a feeling I wont be repeating that trend with TK's. Sheesh. Just thinking about it makes me pissed. Stupid GW. Stupid Cruddace. God dammit. One of my favorite armies now just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'll wait to see the book before I sell off my Kings, just in case, but this sucks and there's nothing I can do but wonder why they thought anything listed about (except the modeling work) was a good idea.

**JimLofa**

I'm liking the prospect of 50 point ushabti. It almost makes a horde a viable option. Str 6 bows, and the MI friendly eighth edition rules have put these guys near the top of my list for this new release.

-Jim

**Deus_Morte**

A lvl 5 wizard?? C'mon, running a TK army is gonna be like running eldar now, anyone who plays them will ALWAYS run Arkhan the Black. I wonder what kinda wargear he'll have.

I am kinda glad to see that special character come back though. He had a neat model back in the day

**vonjankmon**

Unfortunately now that I've sat and thought about it for a bit I think I'm in agreement with Thunderfrog. Was really looking forward to the TK coming out, was going to start fantasy back up, and then they give us this crap...

I think I'll just buy the army book and take a look but if even half of what we think now is true I think I'll just leave my TK on the shelf and get back into Hordes, I haven't played my Everblight in a couple of years now.

**Mantle**

iproxtaco wrote:

This sounds... ludicrous, honestly.

Of corse, doesent every set of rumours that get posted up on the internet sound ludicrouse, but then when the codex/army book comes out, a suprising amount of them are true, and on paper they look amazing, but in game they tend to not be as effective as first thaught, or to get them it costs a lot in points and a lot of people go back to spam listing again

**Hokkaido23**

Thunderfrog wrote:I sure hope a lot of this is wrong, although I have a feeling it will not be.

1) Losing incantations took away the really unique thing about the army. And the new lore sucks for the most part. A lot of TK armies will need multiple units on the field to function but you can't spin your buffs everywhere like you could before. And seriously.. what other lore has so many 15+ casting requirements in it.

2) Nerfing Khalida. Lame.

3) Nerfing shooty-kings as a whole. Terrible!

4) Nerfing It came from below! bs! Why even take a scorpion for war machine hunting when now it pops up on your turn, then they just turn around and shoot/charge it on their turn. Completely freaking stupid.

5) Really? The Casket had to get hit too?

Final thoughts?

Unless a lot of this is wrong, this is definately Tyranid Cruddace and not Guard Cruddace. They got rid of almost all of my favorite things about the army. They should have just left them on the shelf until someone who actually understood the army would have a chance to write it. Now it's so much less strategy and more blocking up doods with a high WS and marching them into other doods with high WS's, except your doods have KB!

RARARAR.

I just spent 300$ on GK stuff, as it was 1 of my 4 armies. I have a feeling I wont be repeating that trend with TK's. Sheesh. Just thinking about it makes me pissed. Stupid GW. Stupid Cruddace. God dammit. One of my favorite armies now just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'll wait to see the book before I sell off my Kings, just in case, but this sucks and there's nothing I can do but wonder why they thought anything listed about (except the modeling work) was a good idea.

If you are raging against GW just for the sake of doing so, then just say it. From your complaints, it sounds like you enjoy TK the way they are now so why not just play the current codex? If you hate an armybook that hasnt even been released yet, and hence you havent actually seen, why not just play what you like? Or is your problem that you didnt get an armybook that was super powered in your eyes? Dont say the man that wrote the rules doesnt understand the army; thats not whats upsetting you, considering you bemoan the Tyranid codex and laud the IG codex. Just say its balanced and you didnt want that, just say you feel entitled to a really powerful army rather than cursing GW for changing the things *you* liked.

As far as TK goes, I will wait to see the entire ruleset before passing judgment. It looks interesting, but different. Since Im not beholden to the current armybook, Im looking forward to dissecting the list and seeing what kinds of tricks I can pull out of it. Im not sold on the new trend of fitting large monsters into every army, but it does make me wonder what they'll come up with next.

**Tomb King**

Hokkaido23 wrote:
Thunderfrog wrote:I sure hope a lot of this is wrong, although I have a feeling it will not be.

1) Losing incantations took away the really unique thing about the army. And the new lore sucks for the most part. A lot of TK armies will need multiple units on the field to function but you can't spin your buffs everywhere like you could before. And seriously.. what other lore has so many 15+ casting requirements in it.

2) Nerfing Khalida. Lame.

3) Nerfing shooty-kings as a whole. Terrible!

4) Nerfing It came from below! bs! Why even take a scorpion for war machine hunting when now it pops up on your turn, then they just turn around and shoot/charge it on their turn. Completely freaking stupid.

5) Really? The Casket had to get hit too?

Final thoughts?

Unless a lot of this is wrong, this is definately Tyranid Cruddace and not Guard Cruddace. They got rid of almost all of my favorite things about the army. They should have just left them on the shelf until someone who actually understood the army would have a chance to write it. Now it's so much less strategy and more blocking up doods with a high WS and marching them into other doods with high WS's, except your doods have KB!

RARARAR.

I just spent 300$ on GK stuff, as it was 1 of my 4 armies. I have a feeling I wont be repeating that trend with TK's. Sheesh. Just thinking about it makes me pissed. Stupid GW. Stupid Cruddace. God dammit. One of my favorite armies now just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'll wait to see the book before I sell off my Kings, just in case, but this sucks and there's nothing I can do but wonder why they thought anything listed about (except the modeling work) was a good idea.

If you are raging against GW just for the sake of doing so, then just say it. From your complaints, it sounds like you enjoy TK the way they are now so why not just play the current codex? If you hate an armybook that hasnt even been released yet, and hence you havent actually seen, why not just play what you like? Or is your problem that you didnt get an armybook that was super powered in your eyes? Dont say the man that wrote the rules doesnt understand the army; thats not whats upsetting you, considering you bemoan the Tyranid codex and laud the IG codex. Just say its balanced and you didnt want that, just say you feel entitled to a really powerful army rather than cursing GW for changing the things *you* liked.

As far as TK goes, I will wait to see the entire ruleset before passing judgment. It looks interesting, but different. Since Im not beholden to the current armybook, Im looking forward to dissecting the list and seeing what kinds of tricks I can pull out of it. Im not sold on the new trend of fitting large monsters into every army, but it does make me wonder what they'll come up with next.

Its fresh and its new and has a few new units but its still not a top tier army by any means. They took away some of the best things tomb kings still had and then gave us a few good units to try an compensate. They took a real weak army book and bumped it up to just a weak army book. The fluff just went out the window. We ride snakes now and are ushabti have bows??? The hierophant magic is okay but significantly less then are current incantations. Catapults just went down in my book. Looks like we will have to spam the new and expensive units to be competitive. I feel like we are more like vampire counts now but lacking more on are ability to regenerate.

Tomb kings giving their ws... hmmm helm of commandment anyone?
Im surprised we didnt get something that can give us always strike first or a khemri coach that steals powerdice.

**Kurgash**

CRUDDACE STRIKES AGAIN!

**Amaya**

Has anyone even seen the codex yet?

And yet people are already freaking out.

**kastellan**

Absolutely ridiculous prices. I mean come on, $91 Australian for 3 cobras? What the hell is GW thinking? Seriously, I thought they were trying to get more people into the game, not scaring away those that have been in the hobby for a decade or more. Looks like I'll be sticking with Mantic Games, seems as they have got something right with their models. The prices.

**Thunderfrog**

Hokkaido23 wrote:
Thunderfrog wrote:I sure hope a lot of this is wrong, although I have a feeling it will not be.

1) Losing incantations took away the really unique thing about the army. And the new lore sucks for the most part. A lot of TK armies will need multiple units on the field to function but you can't spin your buffs everywhere like you could before. And seriously.. what other lore has so many 15+ casting requirements in it.

2) Nerfing Khalida. Lame.

3) Nerfing shooty-kings as a whole. Terrible!

4) Nerfing It came from below! bs! Why even take a scorpion for war machine hunting when now it pops up on your turn, then they just turn around and shoot/charge it on their turn. Completely freaking stupid.

5) Really? The Casket had to get hit too?

Final thoughts?

Unless a lot of this is wrong, this is definately Tyranid Cruddace and not Guard Cruddace. They got rid of almost all of my favorite things about the army. They should have just left them on the shelf until someone who actually understood the army would have a chance to write it. Now it's so much less strategy and more blocking up doods with a high WS and marching them into other doods with high WS's, except your doods have KB!

RARARAR.

I just spent 300$ on GK stuff, as it was 1 of my 4 armies. I have a feeling I wont be repeating that trend with TK's. Sheesh. Just thinking about it makes me pissed. Stupid GW. Stupid Cruddace. God dammit. One of my favorite armies now just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'll wait to see the book before I sell off my Kings, just in case, but this sucks and there's nothing I can do but wonder why they thought anything listed about (except the modeling work) was a good idea.

If you are raging against GW just for the sake of doing so, then just say it. From your complaints, it sounds like you enjoy TK the way they are now so why not just play the current codex? If you hate an armybook that hasnt even been released yet, and hence you havent actually seen, why not just play what you like? Or is your problem that you didnt get an armybook that was super powered in your eyes? Dont say the man that wrote the rules doesnt understand the army; thats not whats upsetting you, considering you bemoan the Tyranid codex and laud the IG codex. Just say its balanced and you didnt want that, just say you feel entitled to a really powerful army rather than cursing GW for changing the things *you* liked.

As far as TK goes, I will wait to see the entire ruleset before passing judgment. It looks interesting, but different. Since Im not beholden to the current armybook, Im looking forward to dissecting the list and seeing what kinds of tricks I can pull out of it. Im not sold on the new trend of fitting large monsters into every army, but it does make me wonder what they'll come up with next.

You're .. well.. something. I've been warned by the mods twice for the word I want to use.

If you are raging against GW just for the sake of doing so, then just say it. From your complaints, it sounds like you enjoy TK the way they are now so why not just play the current codex?

Because I play in an enviroment where most of our playing time comes via tournaments.. which wont take an old army book. I am NOT clamoring against GW in general. If I were, I wouldn't have mentioned a lot of TK specific stressers.. I would have just went on about GW sucking at everything they do.

Or is your problem that you didnt get an armybook that was super powered in your eyes? Dont say the man that wrote the rules doesnt understand the army; thats not whats upsetting you, considering you bemoan the Tyranid codex and laud the IG codex.

Wrong again. Point is, if I was crying about wanting an OP army book, I would NOT be wanting TK's to stay as they are. Nothing that's new has really been TK unique. Instead, they took a step backwards and are aiming the codex at being a VC knockoff, life the poster above mentioned. Sure, they used some name references from the Nagash the Sorceror books, but that's little more than lip service. Why would a Vampire SC pop up in a TK book? Lame. Giving us a carbon copy VC ability to transfer WS? Lame.

I don't give a rats ass about what's "competitive". I've won far more games with the current super weak TK codex than I had any right too. If the book just kept it's originality that'd be enough, but they couldn't even get the idea of an incantation in there.. and worse, they mechanically dismantle the current TK builds that were focused on the things that made the army unique. The reference to Nids and Guards wasn't to say I want a Guard equivilant level of dominance from the TK book. It was to say that Cruddace has made 1 book thats proved strong, and 1 that is a joke.

From the looks of things, you can add another book to the "Joke" column.

**Laughing God**

It really makes me sad to see that GW is dumming down the armory and magic sections of the new armie books for more simple players. It really robs me of the depth and detail I loved to put into my lords and heros and just give all the armies the cookie cutter feel I drifted away from 40k for.

Cant complain about too much else.

**Deus_Morte**

kastellan wrote:Absolutely ridiculous prices. I mean come on, $91 Australian for 3 cobras? What the hell is GW thinking? Seriously, I thought they were trying to get more people into the game, not scaring away those that have been in the hobby for a decade or more. Looks like I'll be sticking with Mantic Games, seems as they have got something right with their models. The prices.

1 word: EBAY

**LazzurusMan**

Hey, this might sound heretical, but does anyone know where i can get alternative skeletons for TK? I love the new models and rules, but i can't stand the old skeletons. Can anyone help???