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Against an army of Balrogs you would have lots of the second age Elf heroes, any of whom could have whupped Sauron with one hand tied behind their backs.

warpcrafter wrote:Against an army of Balrogs you would have lots of the second age Elf heroes, any of whom could have whupped Sauron with one hand tied behind their backs.

A 2nd age Sauron piece would be pretty awesome though.

Image Sauron the Deceiver if he could say, convince a unit of the opponents troops to join your side. Though Sauron was physically powerful it was his powers of deception that were his greatest strength. Probably a good thing he couldn't assume a true physical form.

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Plastic Models, £15 for 24 assorted models. So, I spend £30, and I have a force ready to rumble in SBG with the addition of a blister or two. So I reckon £60 is realistic price tag for a large enough force to enjoy the game.

£60, in wargaming terms, is not really a lot of money. But with WotR, I'd say an existing player with aforementioned £60 force need only spend around the same to have a decent sized WotR force.

So that you're figuring on 120 GBP which is $200 USD? That's a bit pricier than what I was hoping for, on top of the $50 rulebook.

I guess I'll hold off until the final rules come out and I can get a better idea of what I'd consider playing.
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jmurph wrote:GW *will* downgrade support at some point to refocus on WH40K/WHFB. It will still exist, much like LoTR is still in the line. But it will not get the same support as the other two lines. Thinking it will replace their Fantasy cash cow is highly optimistic (to put it lightly).

Given that LotR is understood to already outsell Fantasy, and is going to be out-releasing Fantasy for the foreseeable immediate future, I could easily see LotR becoming GW's second strong line. LotR has a lot more sales potential, so I don't know why you're so down on it, aside from wishful hate as a WFB player.

The Balrog is already pretty easy to deal with if you take Gandalf or any other magic user capable of casting immobilise or transfix.

I would love to play a game with multiple balrogs, dragons and marching hordes of orcs vs. gleaming ranks of elves and men and dwarves.

I'm looking forward to this game a lot!

JohnHwangDD wrote:I wonder what the typical starter army size and cost will be.

If the game plays well with $100 worth of minis, then that'll be cool, and I might go for it. If it needs $300 worth of minis, no thanks, I already have Fantasy.

A Starting Army should set you back about 150 dollars.

the box prices are 30 bucks for 6 Cav or 20-24 Infantry. (the only 20 that I know of is the Uruk-Hai box set) Each infantry box generally comes with 8 with sheilds and swords, 8 with spears and some have shields, and 8 with bows. For Cavalry they generally give you all of the options that is possible for them for all Models with the exception of Banners.

Also Movement trays are up on the site for 4.50 for 3.

JohnHwangDD wrote:
Given that LotR is understood to already outsell Fantasy, and is going to be out-releasing Fantasy for the foreseeable immediate future, I could easily see LotR becoming GW's second strong line. LotR has a lot more sales potential, so I don't know why you're so down on it, aside from wishful hate as a WFB player.

I know it did at one point. But I'm fairly sure that hasn't been the case for some time. It certainly turns a good profit though, one which will rise considerably with the release of WotR. I can't see it becoming GW second line long term. I think WFB will always have the edge in terms of sales.

Personally I think the 2 games are chalk and cheese in terms of style and play so I cant see ether replacing the other They both offer a very different experience to the gamer.

Da Boss wrote:The Balrog is already pretty easy to deal with if you take Gandalf or any other magic user capable of casting immobilise or transfix.

I would love to play a game with multiple balrogs, dragons and marching hordes of orcs vs. gleaming ranks of elves and men and dwarves.

I'm looking forward to this game a lot!

This is an actual game mechanic from WotR? Or is it something you could do in in the LOTR SBG?

Oh it's from LOTR. Sorry. I presume he'll easy enough to deal with with enough men from the mechanics they've shown so far though.

I can see Epic Shot being quite useful against Balrogs. D6 hits that don't need to roll should help in putting a dent in the burny nightmare.

I had a look at the book today in the shop. Looks like one of the best publications GW have put out in ages. I bought a bunch of the new trays and some Morannon Orcs on the spot out of excitement.

im buying it today after reading this for sure.

Thanks.

This thread is a couple weeks old, but I wanted to chime in for my positive reaction to this game.

We sat and read through the WotR book today and we had a blast reading the armie entries and the various rules nuances. Its a considerable tome, but I have to say that everything in one place and a price tag of $50 is a very good deal. No army books or various supplements in order to play an army.

I think GW did a good job with this, and as a result I am starting an Angmar army. Those army of the dead figs were too sweet to pass up as well as using my older plastics from FotR boxed set nearly a decade ago.

The army of the dead figs are a really good place to start, because they can be used by either the good or the evil allegiance (Gonder and Angmar respectively). They do not seem to be bad troops either. 2 boxes gives you 5 formations. With a bit of modelling skill you can forgo buying expensive metals by making your own banners from spearmen and such.

I will however say that I do not think this will be as cheap as has been stated earlier.

I am going the ultra-cheap route myself and the cost will still be almost $200 after buying the rules, using old plastics to stand in for angmar troops (which is fluffy if you read up on that segment of middle earth history) and a few new units to fill in for the rest.

Still all told, not bad. It can get pricey really quick though depending on what army you build but I do not know of any other mini game that doesnt, including skirmish games.

I'll pick up my book on Wednesday. Haven't worked on my Haradrim in a while.

I predict 6-12 months to getting a fighting force together for myself.

Hellfury wrote:I think GW did a good job with this, and as a result I am starting an Angmar army. Those army of the dead figs were too sweet to pass up as well as using my older plastics from FotR boxed set nearly a decade ago.

The army of the dead figs are a really good place to start, because they can be used by either the good or the evil allegiance (Gonder and Angmar respectively). They do not seem to be bad troops either. 2 boxes gives you 5 formations. With a bit of modelling skill you can forgo buying expensive metals by making your own banners from spearmen and such.

.

Sweet. I was wondering if this was possible. Time to get started.

take care

I was turned onto the game a few weeks back now there are just a few more things I need, the rulebook, and goblins (lots and lots of goblins)

It's a great game.

If you're that scared of the big burny Balrog, take Legolas. Crippling Shot followed by three companies (and an Epic Shot) worth of Shoot 3 Elves will wreak havoc.

ungulateman

Played a big game of about 2k per side last night, until 2am. Trampled Gandalf and a lot of Dol Amroth knights with a Mumakil. Tons of fun. Did another game today. We played with just 600 pts each, and only a couple of unit captains, and none of the characters. Hugely enjoyable, and very tactical game. Mechanics play out very differently from fantasy. Looking forward to a lot more games. We're taking a large display of Minas Tirith down to Baltimore games day, with a over a thousand models to play out Pelanor fields. Got to get some practice in.)

Hellfury wrote:We sat and read through the WotR book today and we had a blast reading the armie entries and the various rules nuances. Its a considerable tome, but I have to say that everything in one place and a price tag of $50 is a very good deal. No army books or various supplements in order to play an army.

You know, all of the above was true about 40k3, too, and look what sort of mess we're in now...

Hellfury wrote:I am going the ultra-cheap route myself and the cost will still be almost $200 after buying the rules,

So $250 all told? How many points, and how many dudes?

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Hellfury wrote:We sat and read through the WotR book today and we had a blast reading the armie entries and the various rules nuances. Its a considerable tome, but I have to say that everything in one place and a price tag of $50 is a very good deal. No army books or various supplements in order to play an army.

You know, all of the above was true about 40k3, too, and look what sort of mess we're in now...

True enough on that, but with one major difference.

40K v3 had very ultrabasic lists to get you by until codices were printed (as the 2nd ed codices would make no sense, obviously.)

This however is a completely different monster. These are the culminated rules from over a decade of, more or less, beta testing for the real LotR game. Even rules for models not yet released like the werewolves, etc.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Hellfury wrote:I am going the ultra-cheap route myself and the cost will still be almost $200 after buying the rules,

So $250 all told? How many points, and how many dudes?

Its a 2000 point Angmar list using very few allies. The list is rough from memory after working on it this after noon.
250-325 pts Witchking on fellbeast $50 (the points cost is uncertain because we were unable to ascertain if the witch king adds 75 pts to the fellrider combo as he does when he is onfoot/mounted)
125 pts The Dwimmerlaik $10 (one of the nine)
300? pts Gwenhyvar, terror of arnor $35
300 pts 40 ghostly legions (5 formation bases) $40
500? pts 48 Dead Marshes spirits (6 formations) $40 originally from the fellowship base game (since these spirits in the dead marshes are comprised of numerous races, and many races went to war against Angmar which lead to the ultimate defeat of the WitchKing, I am using plastics from the last alliance (elves/numenoreans) whose model style fits the period these conflicts took place in more closely than later styles found in elves or men)

This leaves about 500ish pts for other allies whom I am probably going to use the 24 goblins from fellowship boxed set (cost included above) and use 50 ish plastic mordor orcs given to me previously. This should come close to being 2000 points. The model count is high, but then again there is a fair amount of very cheap goblin units too. Atleast most of them will be easy to paint.

From the reading we did we came to the conclusion that this is not an optimal army list, but its a great theme and should look good which is more of what I am after to dip my toes back into the LotR colored water.

Well, this may finally give me the excuse to build my Tower of Ecthelion army I've always wanted. Nothing but silver and black, baby!

Hellfury wrote:40K v3 had very ultrabasic lists to get you by until codices were printed (as the 2nd ed codices would make no sense, obviously.) This however is a completely different monster. These are the culminated rules from over a decade of, more or less, beta testing for the real LotR game. Even rules for models not yet released like the werewolves, etc.

Oh, cool. I hadn't seen the army list information, so wasn't sure how much effort GW put into them. Sounds like a very promising start.

In the coming years, I predict a Good compendum, followed by an Evil compendium, followed by WotR2 with a greater emphasis on scenarios and campaigns.

Hellfury wrote:Its a 2000 point Angmar list using very few allies.

250-325 pts Witchking on fellbeast $50 (the points cost is uncertain because we were unable to ascertain if the witch king adds 75 pts to the fellrider combo as he does when he is onfoot/mounted)
125 pts The Dwimmerlaik $10 (one of the nine)
300? pts Gwenhyvar, terror of arnor $35
300 pts 40 ghostly legions (5 formation bases) $40
500? pts 48 Dead Marshes spirits (6 formations) $40

This leaves about 500ish pts for other allies

Sounds like a nice army, and should look good on the tabletop, even if it isn't "optimal".

One last follow-up question: Is 2000 pts the "recommended" or nominal / suggested game size?
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Polonius wrote:Well, this may finally give me the excuse to build my Tower of Ecthelion army I've always wanted. Nothing but silver and black, baby!

After this last season, you've got to be a *real* Raiders fan to be pushing "Silver and Black"... Not that they're actually as bad as their record, but still...

Personally, I'd want to field a Balrog and supporting stuff, but that'll probably wait until next year if WotR takes off in my group. I probably won't get around to WotR until 2011 or later...

Polonius wrote:Well, this may finally give me the excuse to build my Tower of Ecthelion army I've always wanted. Nothing but silver and black, baby!

After this last season, you've got to be a *real* Raiders fan to be pushing "Silver and Black"... Not that they're actually as bad as their record, but still...

Haha, even when I was in metro Day-twah, I didn't sign on board as a Lions fan. And after leaving the state and seeing their date with history, wow am I glad I stuck with my boys.

Now, Browns, that's been a tough roe to hoe for a long, long time. You have, and deserve, my sympathies.

Like Black Templars in 3E, I suspect that Gondor will do pretty well as a WotR faction, as they are "Good" and look comparatively easy to paint.

The more I read about this, the more interested I become. The part about cavalry charges especially interests me. One because I love cavlary and two as the Rohan and Gondor Knights charging in the movies always stuck with me. Hell, any cav charge in movies is pretty damn cool visually.

JohnHwangDD wrote:One last follow-up question: Is 2000 pts the "recommended" or nominal / suggested game size?

Yeah, 2k is the recommended suggestd army size and they even admit such.

The odd thing is though, they say that a 2k game will take most of an afternoon or the course of two days to play. (rough paraphrase)
Now, I just find that rather hard to beleive that 2K with these new rules equates to an 'apocalyptic' throwdown.
I havent played yet so I cannot say for sure, but perhaps GW might be exagerrating a tiny bit.

[edit]
Hmmm... now that I hink about it, didnt GW say the same thing about 2k pts in V3 40K as well? I seem to recall something equally exaggerated in V3 alluding to the enormous amount of time that should be alloted to 2K pt spread.

If my memory hasnt failed me then I think we can ignore GW suggested time allotment for this as well.

Thanks, Hellfury.

I'd have to dig, but I believe 40k3 suggested 1500 pts. Coming from their previous experience with 2E, I'm not surprised that they'd think that 2k of 40k3 points would take an eternity to finish.