Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Joey wrote:

G00fySmiley wrote:

Joey wrote:My chimeras.
If vehicles become more likely to blow up I will cry.

i doubt GW will nerf vehicles to much, those are the big money kits.

Not really, finecast are much more profitable.

did not know that....

well i also think with the rumour goign around abotu a flyer force org section we'll see a whole bunch of new models and units for armies and gw will want to sell those kits to. i know gw likes finecast, but i still think given how much they charge for vehicles and how few points they cost in codexes gw isn't doing to want that to stop. dedicated transports can cost over a dollar a point.

I would be worried about alterations to Deathwing terminators. Especially since I am just starting to plan out and order a new DW army.

G00fySmiley wrote:

Joey wrote:

G00fySmiley wrote:

Joey wrote:My chimeras.
If vehicles become more likely to blow up I will cry.

i doubt GW will nerf vehicles to much, those are the big money kits.

Not really, finecast are much more profitable.

did not know that....

well i also think with the rumour goign around abotu a flyer force org section we'll see a whole bunch of new models and units for armies and gw will want to sell those kits to. i know gw likes finecast, but i still think given how much they charge for vehicles and how few points they cost in codexes gw isn't doing to want that to stop. dedicated transports can cost over a dollar a point.

A flier force org section?
You mean Fast Attack?

I hope they leave my librarians alone, i have 3

Joey wrote:

G00fySmiley wrote:

Joey wrote:

G00fySmiley wrote:

Joey wrote:My chimeras.
If vehicles become more likely to blow up I will cry.

i doubt GW will nerf vehicles to much, those are the big money kits.

Not really, finecast are much more profitable.

did not know that....

well i also think with the rumour goign around abotu a flyer force org section we'll see a whole bunch of new models and units for armies and gw will want to sell those kits to. i know gw likes finecast, but i still think given how much they charge for vehicles and how few points they cost in codexes gw isn't doing to want that to stop. dedicated transports can cost over a dollar a point.

A flier force org section?
You mean Fast Attack?

it's a just speculation and rumor from supposed leaks

but supposedly bikes are getting a huge buff due to changes and your fast attacks will be jump troops and bikes while your things like jet bikes deff coptas and stormravens get their own spot on the force org. i take that with a huge grain of salt but it has been a pretty consistent rumor among other seemingly less likely options in different postings, but we shall see come whenever 6th is supposedly july but who knows. here's hoping they erratta everythign if that is the case

Brother SRM wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:Pariahs...oh wait.

You say that like they can't be made into Crypteks or Praetorians/whatever the scythe guys are.

Uh, those aren't pariahs. I'm not talking about the physical model. Plus, I was making a joke.

Ethereals, I mean those guys are just so awesome right now that if GW ever did anything to them I would cry for a week solid.


On a more serious note, I dont really value any unit over another in either of my armies. Surely if GW ruins one of my units it has to make another good right? right!?

GW doesn't scrap models anymore, they just beat them senseless with a nerf bat cough cough destroyers.

schadenfreude wrote:GW doesn't scrap models anymore, they just beat them senseless with a nerf bat cough cough destroyers.

They still scrap units, and by extension the models as well. See my previous comment on pariahs. Yes, you could use them as something else but they are not technically legal anymore nor do they exist.

Also, I disagree with your nerf comment on the destroyers. They're just as lackluster as they were in the previous codex.

Summoned Daemons. They've been part of Chaos Marines forever, something that really distinguishes them from loyalists.

Nitros14 wrote:Summoned Daemons. They've been part of Chaos Marines forever, something that really distinguishes them from loyalists.

They used to be more than just generic summoned daemons though; time will tell if Chaos players get something with a little more flavor.

Brother SRM wrote:

Nitros14 wrote:Summoned Daemons. They've been part of Chaos Marines forever, something that really distinguishes them from loyalists.

They used to be more than just generic summoned daemons though; time will tell if Chaos players get something with a little more flavor.

Yes, but I think this is the most generic they've ever been (if I remind my 2nd edition correctly).

Stormtroopers, hell even if the vets get moved to elite, that'll screw the Stormies pretty badly.

I have 50 shoota boyz, each individually kustomised to at least some degree, the thought that shootas might be nerfed and slugga boyz made the obvious choice in 6e keeps me up at night.

Thranriel wrote:Ethereals, I mean those guys are just so awesome right now that if GW ever did anything to them I would cry for a week solid.


On a more serious note, I dont really value any unit over another in either of my armies. Surely if GW ruins one of my units it has to make another good right? right!?

Right, GW would never render an entire army utterly useless! Except of corse us poor Daemon players who've been made redundant due to the release of the Herp-Derp Knights... Not to mention Tyranids got even more boned in process...
Yep, GW sure knows how to ruin a girl's day.


More on topic, I'm utterly terrified how the Deep Strike rules will be re-worked. As a Daemon player, any changes could potentially invalidate my army vs everyone else now too.

I'm afraid that I'll lose the wound allocation cheese for Nobz before I have a chance to try it out in an official game.
Also, we'll probably lose some of our more fluffy and strange options like Tankbusta squigs and SAG.

Bobthehero wrote:Stormtroopers, hell even if the vets get moved to elite, that'll screw the Stormies pretty badly.

Stormtroopers are already pretty bad. It would take concentrated effort to make them worse.

By having them in the same category as the vets, you'd be sure that noone would take them, except die hard fans

Joey wrote:

G00fySmiley wrote:

Joey wrote:My chimeras.
If vehicles become more likely to blow up I will cry.

i doubt GW will nerf vehicles to much, those are the big money kits.

Not really, finecast are much more profitable.

Also, horde Guard/Orks is much more expensive than Mech Guard/Orks in Trukks/Bikes.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Brother SRM wrote:

Bobthehero wrote:Stormtroopers, hell even if the vets get moved to elite, that'll screw the Stormies pretty badly.

Stormtroopers are already pretty bad. It would take concentrated effort to make them worse.

Yeah, if anything poor stormies need some kind of boost, they aren't bad, it is just that they are only effective as a suicide unit and 2 out of 3 of their special operations are never taken.

I am all for something to boost stormies (and by extention, DKoK Grenadiers )

Your probably not going to see the removal of vets or deathwing in the core rule set. Unless your codex is up for an update soon, your going to have your current org chart for many years to come. Guard players have a while until vets become elite choices again.

The core rule changes are more likey to cause problems to armies and invalidate units. For example
* If transports are changed to no longer be portable bunkers, IG vet armies will be nurfed
* If transports cause more damage when exploding, MSU razorback will be nurfed.
* If vehicles become easier to destroy, then vehicle spam will be nurfed.
* If infantry move faster then horde armies will be buffed
* If charge reaction rules are in place, shooting armies are buffed.

To make matters more complex, one of these rules is not to be pulled out and placed into 5th.
What happens if horde orks have a threat range of 24" on the assault during a WAAAAGH, but you can stand and shoot at them when they charge? Did they get a nurf or a buff?

Here are my predictions
* GW likes having tanks. I don't expect transports to be made useless
* I expect transports will become that. Transports for the foot soldiers to do the work. I doubt the bunker transport will stick around
* GW likes selling flyers. I expect them to get better rules. The high cost of necron flyers suggest to me that they will have better rule sets justifying the cost.
* GW is likely to try and merge warhammer fantasy and 40k (to my chagrin). This will be done to make the entry into fantasy easier, so they can generate more sales.
* GW wants to sell more models. I expect them to make tyranid's better to cause people to buy tyranid armies for example.

* GW is likely to try and merge warhammer fantasy and 40k (to my chagrin). This will be done to make the entry into fantasy easier, so they can generate more sales.

Can you elaborate a bit more on this?

Do you mean in terms of having model/scenery cross over kits what can be used under both systems? (ala Daemons, forests etc)

Ratius wrote:

* GW is likely to try and merge warhammer fantasy and 40k (to my chagrin). This will be done to make the entry into fantasy easier, so they can generate more sales.

Can you elaborate a bit more on this?

Do you mean in terms of having model/scenery cross over kits what can be used under both systems? (ala Daemons, forests etc)

from the rumours several rules changes will basically be fantasy rules (ICs challenging in CC, "Charge Responses" etc)

Ratius wrote:Can you elaborate a bit more on this?

Do you mean in terms of having model/scenery cross over kits what can be used under both systems? (ala Daemons, forests etc)

Think of it as a business. You want to generate as much revenue (sales) as possible.

Most people will buy one (or a few) armies and then stop with large purchases. At that point they are buying models every now and then to paint or play with - but the overall expenditure of funds is significantly diminished. After all, armies cost hundreds of dollars where that new model you want only costs 50.

How can you get someone to buy another army, which involves more money being spent? The answer is to get them into another game that you own. By making the rules for 40k and fantasy close, its easy for a 40k player to pick up the fantasy rules set and begin playing. If you already know 90% of the rules, then getting into that game and buying an army is less of a hurdle than starting a brand new game like warmachine.

Its part of the reason that D&D 3.5 did so well. Since you knew the 3.5 rules, you could pick up any roleplaying game that used the 3.5 rules engine (like World of Warcraft fantasy roleplay) and play the game with very few rules changes.

Now, I personally don't like this. I find the fantasy rules concluded and full of issues. I can understand why GW would want to bring the games closer. I just with they brought fantasy closer to 40k instead of the other way around :(


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:from the rumours several rules changes will basically be fantasy rules (ICs challenging in CC, "Charge Responses" etc)

I've also heard that psychic powers will be made more like 'lores' from fantasy, and they are adding mastery levels like in fantasy.

I just hope they don't go back to a move value for troops. One of their best ideas was to let all infantry move at the same speed, then give fleet/run to some of them.

Ah I see, I was looking at it from a modelling range perspective i.e. some truely bizarre version of Lizardmen in space or Chaos Marines in the old world.
/shudder

Monster Rain wrote:Anyone who had become accustomed to getting an extra attack in CC for a bolt pistol-powerfist combination in 4th Edition knows what I'm talking about.

The bolt pistol - powerfist wasn't invalidated, just less effective.

My powerfisted Aspiring Sorcerers on the other hand...

Brother SRM wrote:I think AP2 is a bit too harsh, but I'm all for S5 inside/S4 outside.

For elite armies like SM, the Rhino is currently just an extra layer of armor that you have to get through. There should be some sort of tradeoff for that extra level of protection.

I agree that AP2 is too tough, it should be AP 3.

Better yet, they could go to armor save modifiers like in WHFB. Then they could almost get rid of AP completely.

Ratius wrote:Ah I see, I was looking at it from a modelling range perspective i.e. some truely bizarre version of Lizardmen in space or Chaos Marines in the old world.
/shudder

Heh. You know one of my favorite things about the fantasy models is they fit so well with 40k ones.

One day earlier this year I wanted a Prince Yuriel for a tourney at my FLGS. There was no way I was going to order one and have it shipped before the touney, so I took some bits I had of high elves mages, dragon riders, human archmage, and high elf chriot to make my own Prince Yuriel.

I guess you could argue that this is also why I love plastics over finecast.

True, some models work great but not whole ranges imho.
Anyways, clarification noted.

AnomanderRake wrote:They're probably going to nerf Fire Dragons so we stop seeing every bloody list built around three Fire Dragon units...

Thank goodness. I never liked Fire Dragons much anyway. Let's have Rangers that can actually do something instead.

Agreed.

Just noticed, Craftworld Tar Valon? Really? Led by Farseer Siuan Sanche?

Hey, if sniper weapons are buffed as to the leaked codex rumors, you might see people taking them just because they would be better anyway. Then armies would consist if fire dragons AND rangers.