yakface wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:Problem 1: Necron players already own a lot of Warriors.
Problem 2: The Necron Warrior box will not be recut as the return on investment would not be very high, so making the mould isn't worth it, so GW can't entice existing players with a new Warrior model.

Solution 1: Make Necron Warriors cheaper and weaker so you need more of them. Existing Necron players will need to buy more.
Solution 2: Make Scarabs even better than they are now. You can only get them in Warrior boxes, so existing Necron players will want to buy more.

Good to see GW once again starting (and ending) with how they can sell more models rather than making a better game...

Or perhaps they finally decided to make good on the basic concept of zombie undead robots in the way they always should have been?

Or perhaps their making them zombie undead robots instead of making them into full conversion military cyborgs, which is more how I envisioned them. Concepts vary, and the changes tend to go away from the ultra-high tech that I had in mind.

Perhaps sometimes needing more models can actually result in a better game?

Sometimes they do. In this case, I would have been just fine with no new models, but upgraded rules to really make the necron shine again. And maybe, just maybe, more models really are about selling more product? GW is a miniature company after all...


Or maybe even Necron players can use the existing they models they have and since they cost less points now, they'll have room in the army to field some of the (desperately needed) new variety of units?

Again, I'm not sure we need a new variety of units, so much as a plugging of holes in our rules and gear. Flayed ones with rending, Wraiths with power-weapons, stubborn, adjust some of the weapon stats, and a +1 on the vehicle damage chart would have gone a long way to fixing things so that we don't need a new variety of units. Some of us would have been happy with that, particularly if it meant that the army still had the same flavor to it that we enjoyed. Sorry if it doesn't match the way you envisioned them, or wanted to play them, but then, tastes differ.


But that requires players to buy more models and anything that does that is bad for the game by definition of course (and yes, that was sarcasm).

Sarcasm noted, but in this case the answer is quite possibly, yes. If it becomes required to buy more models to play the game, particularly different ones that are outside the theme or concept you like, at least if you'd like to play competitively, then yes, it is a bad thing. If I'm going from running Skynet to running the skeletons from Army of Darkness, there's a big change, it might not be something I like, and that's bad for the game if it drives players away. It would have been better to take the concept of an army of undead, and start a new codex.



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Uriels_Flame wrote:
I also don't understand sweeping robots. I've played Necrons for a long time, and was miffed about having to actually take leadership tests last go round.

The unit phases out when they realize they're getting their butt handed to them in CC? Robots of all creatures should be able to process when its time to get the heck out of dodge, and the fluff behind them being to teleport out of battle when needed gives them the excuse to disappear off a battlefield when they get swept.

Or maybe the robots, understanding that getting destroyed would just let them come back later anyhow as though brand new, would fight to the last on the possibility that they'd more severely weaken the foe for the next encounter, since the foe doesn't get to come back. If every foe you drop is one less of them, but each of you that drops gets back up no matter what, even if it takes a bit of time, it makes a bit more sense to stick around doing as much damage as possible to the bitter end.

Kanluwen wrote:

Praxiss wrote:So, technically, using a Tomb Stalker would have to be a house rule?

Arse.

No, because the Tomb Stalker's rules clearly state that it can be used as a Heavy Support in a Codex: Necron army.

It's like the 'Hazard' Suits. The rules are in Imperial Armour Apocalypse, but only because there's a formation to go alongside of it in there. The basic unit entry, however, explicitly states that it's a valid choice for a Codex: Tau Empire army.

Scarey Nerd wrote:

Praxiss wrote:So, technically, using a Tomb Stalker would have to be a house rule?

Arse.

I think so, but who's going to argue with the Tomb Stalker? It's not broken in strength by any stretch, unless you're playing against Dark Eldar, whom it absolutely destroys with ease.

Ascalam wrote:

Scarey Nerd wrote:

Praxiss wrote:So, technically, using a Tomb Stalker would have to be a house rule?

Arse.

I think so, but who's going to argue with the Tomb Stalker? It's not broken in strength by any stretch, unless you're playing against Dark Eldar, whom it absolutely destroys with ease.

It's immune to poison then

Last i heard it was a MC, and MC's bite the big one to poisoned weapon spam.

Not being snarky, just curious. I like the look of the model, but i don't want it going down in one turn to a single unit of Dark Eldar with splinter rifles.


*can't open the link at work- will check it out later *

Ascalam wrote:

Scarey Nerd wrote:

Praxiss wrote:So, technically, using a Tomb Stalker would have to be a house rule?

Arse.

I think so, but who's going to argue with the Tomb Stalker? It's not broken in strength by any stretch, unless you're playing against Dark Eldar, whom it absolutely destroys with ease.

It's immune to poison then

Last i heard it was a MC, and MC's bite the big one to poisoned weapon spam.

Not being snarky, just curious. I like the look of the model, but i don't want it going down in one turn to a single unit of Dark Eldar with splinter rifles.


*can't open the link at work- will check it out later *

Scarey Nerd wrote:Exactly S6 means it's instant killing Archons, T7 means in close combat they need S4 or better to even wound, so throwing it at kabalites etc destroys them with extreme ease. 2 Gauss Flayers, hit and run, deep strike, fleet, all in all it's awesome. And having 5 wounds never hurts for 195 points

FW beta rules wrote:
War Construct: The Tomb Stalker is a huge mass of shifting
pseudo-metal, with little vulnerability except to the
massive use of force. Sniper weapons, attacks with the
Poisoned ability and the like, only wound the Tomb Stalker
on a 6 (as opposed to a 4+, 2+ etc, as would normally be
the case).

Scarey Nerd wrote:I think so, but who's going to argue with the Tomb Stalker? It's not broken in strength by any stretch, unless you're playing against Dark Eldar, whom it absolutely destroys with ease.

Kanluwen wrote:No, because the Tomb Stalker's rules clearly state that it can be used as a Heavy Support in a Codex: Necron army.

It's like the 'Hazard' Suits. The rules are in Imperial Armour Apocalypse, but only because there's a formation to go alongside of it in there. The basic unit entry, however, explicitly states that it's a valid choice for a Codex: Tau Empire army.

Necros wrote:Too lazy to look through all the replies :( has there been any reliable talk of the tomb stalker being in the codex? Or is it just gonna be a FW only thing for Apocalypse? I know the rules say it counts as a heavy choice, but it would just be cooler to have it in the book

Praxiss wrote:

KingCracker wrote:The real problem is, what the hell CAN I buy right now that would be a good safe bet? Im getting my late bday present from the wife, and was wanting to buy some Necron stuff....but uh....now I dont know what the hell I should get

As states above, based on the rumours i woudl buy battleforces, boxes of warriors and/or monolilths. But i woudl keep them unbuilt so that, whenthe new stuff is released, you have loads of conversion fodder if you need it.

i think there was a link earlier to turn normal warriors into Flayed ones or Immortals using some plasticard and a positive attitude.

yakface wrote:




13) Necron Warriors have the same basic statline they had before except they now have a 4+ save. Now before you go crazy, also note that their points cost is 12 points, which is a 1/3 price drop (down from 18 points). That means you get 1/3 more Warrior models in the army for the same amount of points...it also makes losing an entire unit due to sweeping advance, not nearly as painful.

I know a lot of cynical people will hate this and accuse GW from simply making the change to sell more Warrior models, and you could be right. But personally I was always hoping they were going to make Necron Warriors not quite as tough and dump the points cost on them, so you could really take a ton of them...given in my mind they are supposed to be more like a shambling horde of undead robots than some sort of small elite force of super-warriors (but that could just be me).

So this change alone totally changes the army from out of the 'MEQ' umbrella and makes their base statline unique in the game (which is good, IMHO).


20) Scarabs sound great. They are cheap, have the new WBB rule, move like beasts and have an ability that erodes enemy armor when they get into combat with it. Any non-vehicle model they wound, but don't kill, has its armor save turned to a dash (i.e. nothing) for the rest of the game. If they hit a vehicle, on a 4+ the vehicle loses a point of armor value on ALL facings, and if any facing is reduced to zero, then the vehicle is destroyed (I'm not sure if this ability kicks in for each hit they get on the vehicle, or just once no matter how many hits they cause). There are some items in the army that also have a similar ability to erode armor, including one of the C'Tan powers.

So it sounds like Scarabs may play a major role in most Necron armies!

Kevin949 wrote:Don't forget that, according to Yak's info, nothing negates the new WBB either so PFist or not, they still get WBB.

Kevin949 wrote:Don't forget that, according to Yak's info, nothing negates the new WBB either so PFist or not, they still get WBB.

schadenfreude wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:Don't forget that, according to Yak's info, nothing negates the new WBB either so PFist or not, they still get WBB.

Yea, but they won't have a res orb in their unit, WBB is going to be 5+, and it still instant death's the swarm causing 3 wounds per hit which will cause the fearless swarm to loose 3 more wounds through combat resolution. Power fists will still be bad for swarms, but like I said even if the swarm looses the combat they will still end up vandalizing a lot of power armor which is very bad news considering the increase in firepower warriors and immortals are receiving.

Kurgash wrote:I think I'll find it hysterical when my scarabs charge a trygon and one lucky wound gets through and all of a sudden you have a naked trygon with the shaven look with pink skin ala looney toons.