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Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

1hadhq wrote:@Sir Pseudonymous:
Comorragh isn't unassailable. ( Again Salamanders, rescuing a stolen relic from there ).
Plus cloning has some drawbacks too.

Vect opened the gate, and essentially showed them where to go. Three whole chapters attacked Commoragh through the gate Vect jammed open, lost every ship but the one they came to rescue, suffered heavy casualties, and then teleported away with the rescued ship.

Thats all well and nice, still I was referring to the last Sally book, where they entered commaragh without vect doing anything.
So 2 times gone there.

But the first one fits the DE fluff and is IMO one of the better ideas of GW lately.
The second one is BL fluff and uses the transports of the DE to enter. I doubt the unassailability of any gate.

@xXSir MontyXx:
No. Open the flood gates ( ie Emperor distracted with beeing reborn ) and the time you have to close it again is really short.

Klawz wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:I would say Imperium, and here is why:
-On a year account they lose around 100 planets, but colonize 1000 more. So there is 500-600 billion star in our galaxy, each with around 9 - 13 planets. That's a lot of planets to colonize...
-And you haven't get in account that other races are fighting themselves. And Imperium has been known to make alliances in several occasions with the Eldar and the Tau.
-It's only the matter of time before Imperium counter the threat of Necrons and Tyranids. They upgrade their existing technology daily, and I am sure that in crisis times they will use new means of technology.
-Now, in the end of 41'st millennium the Imperium is weak. But they are slowly getting their strength back as in last 100 years more worlds have been regain and few have been lost.
-And none is taking in account that the Emperor will return one day. He said that himself, and with him his Primarchs will return and then god help the enemies of Mankind.

But on the realistic side, none race wil get the advantage. Imperium may conquer 90% of the galaxy (70% is already owned) but they will never truly defeat anyone. There is just to much planets in the galaxy to have army everywhere. And I imagine that even if Imperium conquer Tau Empire, surviving Tau will fled somewhere else. And in the end our galaxy will crush into Androida and then we will have interesting set of views...

The Imperium has more or less stopped colonizing new worlds, only taking back ones that were captured by Chaos.

It's not true, there is still colonization going on... The prodd is in Kaurava, after the war IG colonized Kaurava II and turned it into an Hive world. And Imperium is always need more resources. And what a better way than to colonize new world and take the resources.

Orks being designed for war, and survivor race...high chances to them BUT!

if the Tyranid codex (cant remember wich one..) says that the Tyranids eat entire galaxies...

@ Mawhawk;
I voted Tyranid and all, but the Tyranid codex says the same thing most do. That the race in the codex will eventually prevail and come out on top. Codexes are definitely a fun read but when being compared to other races fluff-wise, the codex you have will always glorify the race its about.

I think dark eldar will be the last one standing for these reasons
1. Dark eldar produce faster than eldar, because the majority of them are born in tubes.
2. The webway protects them pretty damn well, and harmful sections of the webway are closed off.
3. A dark eldar can comeback from the dead by giving part of his soul to a haemonculi.

If the Tyrnids engulf the galaxy, dark eldar hide in Commagh and steal random 'nids and torture them.

The Nids would kill everything and orks would be drawn to the wars against the Nids where the Nids would absorb the orks before consuming the galaxy and buggering off while the necrons go back to sleep as all of their soulfood is gone.

corpsesarefun wrote:The Nids would kill everything and orks would be drawn to the wars against the Nids where the Nids would absorb the orks before consuming the galaxy and buggering off while the necrons go back to sleep as all of their soulfood is gone.

Sounds accurate to me

It is simple the eldar would be the winners in the end why because if you kill them then they have a new god that not only makes more of them he also is able to kill the eldars biggest rival Slaanesh. So the Ultimate victores are the eldar.


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Also the C-tan arnt that grate they could barly fight off Cypher a mear chaos marien

It's funny how many people say Tyranids, when the Tyranid codex itself basically just proclaims "and Hive Fleet X was annihilated at heavy cost to the opposing fleet [which comprised only the tiniest and most insignificant fragment of the respective race's military machine]." A single space marine chapter (the Imperium has one thousand of those, and they're outnumbered by Guard millions to one, remember) took out a Hive Fleet, suffering only moderate casualties. And then took out another one, with only minor reinforcements. A minor expeditionary force from the craftworlds hunted down one trapped behind some warpstorms and destroyed it. A ramshackle flotilla of conscripted freighters led by warships from a couple of Imperial worlds wiped out yet another. In all honesty, they make actual locusts look dangerous, in the grand scheme of things.

Orks are similar: they might cause some damage, but they live for the sake of fighting. When the warboss uniting them dies, they collapse in on themselves and destroy any accomplishment they'd made, and it would only take a single radical Inquisitor to enact the fungicide idea whatever Magos it was came up with...

And why none thinks that Imperium would dominate all?

Because the Imperium has A LOT of enimies and multiple fronts to fight on, and actually alot of people do...

The Imperium has a handful of weak enemies.

Chaos is split between beings trapped in another dimension, the occasionally petty heretic sect that gets torched by the Inquisition with barely a passing glance, and the Traitor Legions, whose numbers make the loyalists look vast, and the loyalists themselves are outnumbered by the Guard by many millions to one. By all accounts there may well be more Titans than there are space marines, and certainly more Titans than there are dreadnoughts or terminator suits, and there are even fewer landraiders than either of those. The Traitor Legions are also trapped in the Eye of Terror, behind the heaviest fortifications in the Imperium.

The Craftworld Eldar don't seek the destruction of the Imperium, and for the most part share the same enemies, the Exodites are barbarians in a self-inflicted stone age, and the Dark Eldar, despite being the only faction who could conceivably bring down the Imperium, have no desire to do so, as they're happy just sitting around Commoragh, occasionally taking a world here or there for slaves (and the destruction of the Imperium would mean fewer slaves, and fewer entertaining events to watch).

The Tyranid's own codex is little more than a long a string of "And Hive Fleet X was annihilated at heavy cost to the tiny, insignificant fleet that opposed it."

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:A single space marine chapter (the Imperium has one thousand of those, and they're outnumbered by Guard millions to one, remember) took out a Hive Fleet, suffering only moderate casualties. And then took out another one, with only minor reinforcements. A minor expeditionary force from the craftworlds hunted down one trapped behind some warpstorms and destroyed it. A ramshackle flotilla of conscripted freighters led by warships from a couple of Imperial worlds wiped out yet another.

So, yeah, Tyranids are straight out of the "credible threats" category, at least as long as there remains so much as a cardboard cutout with a lasgun standing in their way.

Orks are highly fragmented, and have nothing but numbers on their side. They can't be a credible threat to the Imperium either, especially considering it would only take a single radical inquisitor with some techpriests to implement the anti-ork fungicide solution, which would permanently eliminate them from Imperial space.

The Tau are insignificant. The "makes space marines look relevant" kind of insignificant. They might have fancy toys, but they're stuck in their little corner of the galaxy, and wouldn't be able to withstand a push from the Imperium. The only thing keeping them alive is the fact that they're too insignificant to bother sending more than a token force to deal with (a token force which still has them overmatched, mind you). Even they can deal with Tyranid splinter fleets.

The necrons are the only faction to pose a credible threat, and even they can be dealt with when their tomb worlds are cracked open by Imperial weapons. Considering how slow they are to wake, the Imperium has more than enough time to scour them from the galaxy before they become a real threat.

I think the Imperium will be the last one standing.
That is if the Emperor is reborn and the Primarchs return,then the Galaxy will be reclaimed and all will be peachy.

I believe the Imperium of Man shall emerge victorious, for a few reasons.

Ultimately, the Tyranids are the largest threat to the Imperium, as the powers of the Warp have been ignored for this poll.

1. While Necrons are deathless, their number is finite. While their numbers never diminish, they cannot grow. Tyranids, Humans, Orks, Tau all can over come this. True, they take casualties, but the new members produced will grow exponentially, untill they vastly outnumber the Necrons. Necrons and Tyranids I feel may be constantly at an impass, but I don't see this conflict significantly affecting the outcome of the war.

2. Orks, while indominitable, would only rally in limited groups. When their population reaches a point, civil war erupts, and this ultimately leaves them vulnerable. Only Waaagh's would prove a real threat, but I don't know why Orks would bother plundering a world taken over by Tyranids. Teef, perhaps, but little else.

3. Chaos Space Marines? I doubt they could be truly erradicated, as their traitorous hides always find a way of self preservation. They could fight for some time, but eventually retreat into the Eye of Terror would be the end result.

4. The Eldar, Tau, and Humans share common interests, and share common sense. When the Tyranid threat becomes more obvious, it is likely that these races would ally and combine their forces. This would significantly increase their chances of survival.

5. There is also Technology to consider. All three of these races pooling resources could result in truly awesome firepower, combined with psykers and teleportation capabilities, would grant maneuverability and flexibility that the Tyranids could not hope to match. Numbers are ultimately on their side, but without a means of keeping pace with this technology, that advantage will quickly dissapear.

6. After the Tyranid threat, I can't imagine the Imperium losing to the Eldar, or the Tau. Perhaps it would not even come to that, but if war did erupt between them, Humans would ultimately emerge victorious.

Benificent Emperor, you shall see your galaxy united once more!

All races have a decently fair chance of surviving. Might even go as far as saying that the 'nids don't count because they don't live in the galaxy. They are just going to eat and run. So that said I would have to say that the race that inhabits the universe that has the best chance of surviving is probably the imperium.

The reason why people dont think the IoM will win is because the god emperor is deing and when he goes that web way gate that goes to tera that no one human knows were it is is gona pop open letting out a title wave of dark eldy and chaos and thier gona do what the vikings did to the romans.


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Although they do have a very good chance of fighting off the other races

Chaos would definitely outlast the Imperium. Maybe not Chaos Marines, but the forces of Chaos would stay, because they aren't kill-able men, they are gods, daemons, and represent the dark side of every human. That will never be gone, for even when humans are killed, the Chaos gods will find others to taint, and destroy.

That said, I think Tyranids would kill everything, leave, and then the necrons would rule over the universe... while Chaos schemes and seeks knew people to corrupt.

What we must realize about chaos is that there could very well be beings in other universes that are corruptible. They might not even care about this universe as much as we think they do.

Yeah like the story is only focused in Milky Way Galaxy. What about other galaxies?

It can only be the Imperium of Man that succeeds.

The Emperor Protects.

Im torn between necron/tyranids due to the mystery behind their true numbers and strength


Dan

I'm saying Orks and Nids due to how Orks work (stronger as they get fightier, every one killed releases X number of spores etc.) and how Nids create more (each Ork killed = more biomass) but also Khornate Chaos.

The amount of bloodshed that leads up to this most epic fight is likely to be huge, and we all know that Khorne feeds off this stuff like a fat kid feeds off cake. It's therefore likely that Khorne will grow in power enough to probably destroy his siblings and devour their power (assuming that's how they roll) and then empower his followers thusly; and with Cadia probably consumed by then, the eye will be open for daemons to pour forth from.

That's how i'd see a potentially everlasting conflict, with each side only gaining strength from the other's presence (plus they're all melee oriented, so it'd be super-killy to boot).

D.Smith wrote:Im torn between necron/tyranids due to the mystery behind their true numbers and strength


Dan

We don't even know the true number and strength of the Human Imperium. And we know less about other races. In fact, the point is that we don't know enough about everyone to claim the winner in the end.

Brother Coa wrote:

D.Smith wrote:Im torn between necron/tyranids due to the mystery behind their true numbers and strength


Dan

We don't even know the true number and strength of the Human Imperium. And we know less about other races. In fact, the point is that we don't know enough about everyone to claim the winner in the end.

So true!

If we really think about it the only true winner could ever be chaos, because as of yet noone has figured out how to kill a god

(god emperor of man excluded cause as everyone with an Meq codex know horus ended that particular god quite nicely, its just a matter of time)

Tyranic Marta wrote:If we really think about it the only true winner could ever be chaos, because as of yet noone has figured out how to kill a god

(god emperor of man excluded cause as everyone with an Meq codex know horus ended that particular god quite nicely, its just a matter of time)

Oh really?...
What about Eldar? They have gods to, how to kill them?
And Orks have gods to, none say that Gork and Mork don't exist? Maybe they fight Chaos gods to?
What about Necrons and the C'tan, C'tan is a god to...
Maybe even Tyranids have some god to fight Chaos gods?

I would say that Chaos gods will be very busy even if universe came to an end. And EoM maybe dead in the flash, but he is quite powerful in soul. Maybe he will became as powerful as Chaos gods when he die, who knows?

Chaos feeds off the war and various other wrong-doings of intelligent life. Without this fuel... this energy the Chaos gods gain from their mortal followers. They would lose their primary hold on the material realm of existence.
How I put their control into perspective is this; imagine the universe as a huge piece of paper (or something else flat), then imagine a similar sized piece of paper right above it. The distance between the two fluctuating in various areas due to the random occurrences such as the eye of terror and various warp storms. Now, each intelligent creature that fall's to the worship of chaos makes a infinitesimally small dot on this plane that represents the universe. These conduits of mortals minds located in their actual planet/star-cluster ect. However it is not just a dot but a connection between the two planes, a conduit through which the gods can assert their will. This one dot however has very, very small influence on the material realm. This is why they spread their influence to others. This one small dot/conduit pools together as more followers in this area are obtained. The conduit getting ever wider with more influence. This allows massive amounts of the chaos gods whim to be delivered to our plain of existence. (this is where exterminatus comes in). The eye of terror is a perfect example of this, where the consciousness of Chaos has gotten so great it has broken through consciousness and into even the visible spectrum.

This is just how I view the 40k universe though.....

Fair enough, however, I believe that if all of the gods eventually duke it out at the end of time then khorne has to win, he can ignore psykic and magical manifestations so no eldar tricks and his is the ultimate god of battle, as the battle gets feicer he gets more powerful, the only reason tzeench can kick his but is because he knows the future is the weaver of the great game etc, you cant concievably trick or beat tzeenth by either conventional or other methods, this is the only reason khorne cant beat him, as for the other chaos gods, nurgle simply diseases khornes followers or sommat and slaanesh converts em / his minions can befuddle the deamons senses and kill them that way, anyhoo none of the other "gods" know the tricks of the 4 chaos gods and their ploys in the game the four chaos gods play they have come to understand each other to a degree that they are perfectly equal, and if they work together then they are unstoppable as they cover every concievable concept of warfare and can overwelm their enemies with superiour numbers knowlege and power

and as for khorne, well as the fighting escalates he would eventually become more powerful than the other three chaos gods and would annihilate them, ie all gods dead (including other factions) bar khorne and his minions would sweep across the galaxy and claim it for chaos because they grow more powerful as he does, ie indefinte power


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my logic is undefeatable

Tyranic Marta wrote:Fair enough, however, I believe that if all of the gods eventually duke it out at the end of time then khorne has to win, he can ignore psykic and magical manifestations so no eldar tricks and his is the ultimate god of battle, as the battle gets feicer he gets more powerful, the only reason tzeench can kick his but is because he knows the future is the weaver of the great game etc, you cant concievably trick or beat tzeenth by either conventional or other methods, this is the only reason khorne cant beat him, as for the other chaos gods, nurgle simply diseases khornes followers or sommat and slaanesh converts em / his minions can befuddle the deamons senses and kill them that way, anyhoo none of the other "gods" know the tricks of the 4 chaos gods and their ploys in the game the four chaos gods play they have come to understand each other to a degree that they are perfectly equal, and if they work together then they are unstoppable as they cover every concievable concept of warfare and can overwelm their enemies with superiour numbers knowlege and power

and as for khorne, well as the fighting escalates he would eventually become more powerful than the other three chaos gods and would annihilate them, ie all gods dead (including other factions) bar khorne and his minions would sweep across the galaxy and claim it for chaos because they grow more powerful as he does, ie indefinte power


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my logic is undefeatable

I will defeat it:
"Ah yes, CHAOS GODS!!!
The immortal beings allegedly waiting in Warp realm.
We have dismissed that claim."

Tyranids and Necrons.

that's for sure. The first for the moltitude and unstoppable hunger and the second for not being an interesting meal for the first one.