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Aduro wrote:Looks like that might be a servitor in the turret rather than a marine gunner?

I noticed that right away, too.

Good Help us the Storm Raven still looks bad.
But the Fursio looks AWESOME!

BrookM wrote:Nice Dreadnought sized Nemesis Force Weapon.

Just what I used, the FW Dread NFW.

I'm getting two of each- a dread for my BA libby dread, another for my GK dread, a stormpelican for my BA and another for my GK.

The army is for the Badab War

oh my god i am so excited 3 of each please that will do cheers
loving the three sarcophagus and the over sized force weapon
it all looks good, even the raven looks a lot bulkier than the original pic!!

Valkyrie wrote:Hmm, actually that first photo of the Stormraven has slightly altered my otherwise negative thoughts towards it

Agreed...might be kinda cool after all.

so im going to end up buying 2 of each kit....

me too...and I wanted to do DKoK, too...DAMN YOU GW!!!

The Stormraven still doesn't work for me. That is a better angle, but I am still incapable of accepting the proportions.

The Dread kit, blurry as the picture is (thanks, though!), looks like it is loaded with great looking options. All over that one. Now I'll get a Librarian Dread to go with a Chaplain Dread.

Hmm the new dread reminds me, when they update the dark angels would this mean theres a good chance of a mortis dread kit? Complete with twin linked autocannons for everyone else

Aweosme! Now that I have finally seen it from another angle (other than the leaked photo of the model at a obscure angle) --I love it! Cant wait to get a few into the BA army.

Anyone know what they are going to cost?

probably £26 and £35 respectively.

kenshin620 wrote:Hmm the new dread reminds me, when they update the dark angels would this mean theres a good chance of a mortis dread kit? Complete with twin linked autocannons for everyone else

I'd settle for Ravenwing that are actually, you know, Ravenwing. And not just Black Bikes. Not terribly impressed with the current Dark Angel book in the modern day.

Have you ever got the £12 DA upgrade kit? That isn't too shabby- 10 marines in it...
but now GW's replaced it so you only get 5...
still a good deal...

Mr Mystery wrote:

kenshin620 wrote:Hmm the new dread reminds me, when they update the dark angels would this mean theres a good chance of a mortis dread kit? Complete with twin linked autocannons for everyone else

I'd settle for Ravenwing that are actually, you know, Ravenwing. And not just Black Bikes. Not terribly impressed with the current Dark Angel book in the modern day.

I hate to break it to you...but that's really all the Ravenwing are, if you don't include them being "skillful bikers" and also "trained to work with the Scout Company to seek out the Fallen".

The second one is a player decision whether or not to follow, and the skillful biker bit...well, most races lost their equivalent to that, didn't they?

Kanluwen wrote:I hate to break it to you...but that's really all the Ravenwing are, if you don't include them being "skillful bikers" and also "trained to work with the Scout Company to seek out the Fallen". The second one is a player decision whether or not to follow, and the skillful biker bit...well, most races lost their equivalent to that, didn't they?

Telling people what they can and can't have again Kan.

I think most DA players would love to be able to play their Ravenwing and have some benefit for doing so and not have to bring the same special character to every game in order to do so.

It's not so much that.

In 2nd Edition (yeah I know, rose tint my world and all that!) Ravenwing were awesome hard for the enemy to hit (the faster you moved back then, the harder you were to hit. Ravenwing got an additional -1 on top!) and didn't suffer the same in return.

Plus their's were the only Landspeeders to have Heavy Bolter and Assault Cannon, an awesome combination which gave them a very different operational role to non-Ravenwing Speeders etc.

Where are the unique DA tanks? Where are the unique DA units? I know I'm sounding like a petulant brat but seriously, where are they?

Yeah, DA really deserve to have the Ares in the codex. It's an amazing tank. They need a lot of things, really

Mr Mystery wrote:It's not so much that.

It is. Kan is an extreme absolutist and is often quite belligerent in the black-and-white manner that he tells people what they can and cannot have in their games. That's why we call him WRONGBADFUN.

But yes, I do get what you're saying about 2nd Ed Ravewing (I to have the Angels of Death Codex and remember them quite well, with their 'Jink' rules, and so on). The current DA Codex is bland-city. It's why the verb 'Jervised' exists. It was the start of the dreaded Jervis-Era that claimed a number of armies (Chaos included) and relegated them to bland dullness for years to come (only the Orks make it out unscathed).

I'd just love to see Dark Angel players get their Ravenwing armies back, sans a mandatory Special Character, and with some rules that say "Hey! We're the most awesome super-bikers around!". Even something simple like "Jink - All Ravenwing units have a 6+ Invulnerable save to represent their skill in movement. If the unit already has an Invulnerable Save, increase it by +1. Additionally, all Ravenwing Bikers have the Skilled Rider USR.". And then make 'em 5 or so points more expensive (per bike) than a normal Marine Bike. Done. Takes up a page in the book. Really not difficult. You could do a similar thing for Deathwing as well.



But anyway, that's really not what this thread's about. So I'm going to leave it there and jump back on topic:

Plastic Furioso Dread - Awesomesauce.
Chibi-Hawk - Still goofy and dumb looking.

The Jink save was alright in 3rd Ed. 6+ seems a little pointless, but always better than nothing.

I just want to see uniquely DA stuff. Fearless Terminators just don't cut it for me I'm afraid. My brother and I have a couple of full companies of Dark Angels, and right now I'm just very 'meh' about them. Don't get me wrong, it's not that the book is unplayable, it's not. But it is distinctly uninspiring.

Usually, I find the whole 'lulz moar mareenz but grey/red/lulz' argument a tad false, as the charactered Chapters do work differently on the board. But in the case of Dark Angels, it's sadly entirely justified. Which is a real shame.

Wait - Dark Angels are getting a revised codex soon, and they'll get a Furioso and a Stormraven too?

Erm....I don't think so?

Alpha's just messin' with ya Mystery.

And also subtlety nudging us back OT.

Alpharius wrote:Wait - Dark Angels are getting a revised codex soon, and they'll get a Furioso and a Stormraven too?

No, I'm sorry I made an assumption based on plastic dreadnought releases

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Mr Mystery wrote:It's not so much that.

It is. Kan is an extreme absolutist and is often quite belligerent in the black-and-white manner that he tells people what they can and cannot have in their games. That's why we call him WRONGBADFUN.

I didn't say "can't have". So stop putting words in my mouth and start actually reading posts before trying to call me out with your standard crap.
I said that "If you don't include the skillful bikers bit and being trained to work with the Scout Company to seek out the Fallen, the Ravenwing are just Black Bikes". Which is 100% true.
But you'd know that if you read it, FAILSTOREADPOSTS.

But yes, I do get what you're saying about 2nd Ed Ravewing (I too have the Angels of Death Codex and remember them quite well, with their 'Jink' rules, and so on). The current DA Codex is bland-city. It's why the verb 'Jervised' exists. It was the start of the dreaded Jervis-Era that claimed a number of armies (Chaos included) and relegated them to bland dullness for years to come (only the Orks make it out unscathed).

You mean the "dreaded Jervis-era" that really impacted all of two Codices? Chaos and Dark Angels were the only ones who really had the "flavor" gutted from them in favor of simplification.

I'd just love to see Dark Angel players get their Ravenwing armies back, sans a mandatory Special Character

That's not happening, and you and I both know why. Powergamers ruin everything for everyone, especially when it comes to fluff for weirdly organized forces like the Ravenwing and Deathwing.

and with some rules that say "Hey! We're the most awesome super-bikers around!". Even something simple like "Jink - All Ravenwing units have a 6+ Invulnerable save to represent their skill in movement. If the unit already has an Invulnerable Save, increase it by +1. Additionally, all Ravenwing Bikers have the Skilled Rider USR.". And then make 'em 5 or so points more expensive (per bike) than a normal Marine Bike. Done. Takes up a page in the book. Really not difficult. You could do a similar thing for Deathwing as well.

Well, see the problem is the fluff has slightly evolved in regards to the Ravenwing. They've gone from just being "the forward advance" of a Dark Angels force, where they'd strike hard and strike fast paving the way for the main assault and setting up Deathwing Teleport Assaults, to being the "speartip" of the Dark Angels'(and the other Unforgiven Chapters) hunt for the Fallen. Ravenwing no longer just harass the enemy...they take them on, head first.
They take to the field with Chapter Veterans and the Scout Company's best Scouts to isolate, capture, and extract with the Fallen or someone who knows the location of a Fallen.

Basically: They're not "just the most awesome super-bikers around!" anymore. They're the Unforgiven's SpecOps.

The Deathwing have also taken an evolutionary step from just "They're superveterans always wearing Terminator armors!". They're now more akin to the Unforgiven's "Repentant Knights". They're the best and brightest of the Unforgiven Chapters bearing the weight of the world upon their shoulders, with the knowledge of as much of the full story of the Fall of Caliban as any Chapter Master save Azrael and determined to make the Fallen repent and clear the perceived blemish upon their honor.

In both cases...those are things that are slightly hard to represent outside of story narratives and campaign rules, wouldn't you agree?

Mr Mystery wrote:Where are the unique DA tanks? Where are the unique DA units?

The tanks bit is a bit annoying, yes. The Ares, Damocles, and more would all be flavorful...and more importantly fun for a Dark Angels force.

The unique Dark Angels unit bit, I can't actually really think of anything they have that's "signature" that isn't already in.
Maybe the "Ravenwing Scout" units? Pathfinders mounted in Land Speeder Storms that use the disarray stirred up by the main Ravenwing assault to grab a target?
But that goes back to the "slightly hard to represent outside of story narratives and campaign rules" bit.

I just want to see uniquely DA stuff. Fearless Terminators just don't cut it for me I'm afraid. My brother and I have a couple of full companies of Dark Angels, and right now I'm just very 'meh' about them. Don't get me wrong, it's not that the book is unplayable, it's not. But it is distinctly uninspiring.

Agreed. It's disgusting that it's easier, and more characterful, to represent a Deathwing force using the Space Wolf Codex.

Usually, I find the whole 'lulz moar mareenz but grey/red/lulz' argument a tad false, as the charactered Chapters do work differently on the board. But in the case of Dark Angels, it's sadly entirely justified. Which is a real shame.

Well, I think part of the problem is just that if you removed the "Unforgiven" aspect, they're just a slightly divergent Codex Chapter.

They need a bit more fleshing out in that regards and a radical rethink in how the Fallen could be implemented again.

Alpharius wrote:Wait - Dark Angels are getting a revised codex soon, and they'll get a Furioso and a Stormraven too?

I hope they get a revised Codex soon.
I don't think they'll get a Furioso though. Stormraven is likely, and thematically would work fantastic with the Ravenwing/Ironwing.

If they bring the Mortis Dreadnought in, I'll just about die of shock.

Stormraven still blows...

I see myslef replacing my dreadnoughts in the near future though... damn you GW... Damn you.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
BTW... Flesh Tearers... not blood angels. Bunch of pretty boys.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Alpha's just messin' with ya Mystery.

And also subtlety nudging us back OT.

All least ONE person got it!

But seriously guys, back OT, OK?

I wonder how long until the standard Dread kit is replaced and retired. I mean, it's a bit poop now, compared to the Ven and the Furioso.

Even when it was a pound cheaper, I still urged my customers to get the Ven, seeing as it was simply a far superior kit!