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 poppa G wrote:
We should just compare the hard stats and abilities. Honestly?
You're saying some librarian could spank an overlord, abaddon, and an avatar?
No way.

Sure, Coteaz loses in close combat to hideously expensive HQs designed for melee, but he is by far the best overall HQ in the game. This thread is titled best overall HQ, so when you take into account everything he brings to an army for only 100 points, there is no-one better than Coteaz.

 reddwarf54 wrote:

 poppa G wrote:
We should just compare the hard stats and abilities. Honestly?
You're saying some librarian could spank an overlord, abaddon, and an avatar?
No way.

Sure, Coteaz loses in close combat to hideously expensive HQs designed for melee, but he is by far the best overall HQ in the game. This thread is titled best overall HQ, so when you take into account everything he brings to an army for only 100 points, there is no-one better than Coteaz.

Shrug. I agree that he isn't an auto disqualifier because he can't beat a melee beatstick in combat...but IDK if he's the best overall (he's certainly on the short list though)

A 100 point Rune Priest brings you similar utility (less utility buffing, better offense with codex powers, best anti psycher in the game, better in combat)
A 300 point Fateweaver arguably brings you 3x the Force multiplication (8 psychic powers, two incredible reroll abilities, the ability to become invulnerable and troll your opponent)
A Dark Angels Librarian does much of what Coteuz does for even cheaper
The Baron is incredible for a similar cost.
There's more. Coteaz is great, but is not "by far" the best.

anonymou5 wrote:

 reddwarf54 wrote:

 poppa G wrote:
We should just compare the hard stats and abilities. Honestly?
You're saying some librarian could spank an overlord, abaddon, and an avatar?
No way.

Sure, Coteaz loses in close combat to hideously expensive HQs designed for melee, but he is by far the best overall HQ in the game. This thread is titled best overall HQ, so when you take into account everything he brings to an army for only 100 points, there is no-one better than Coteaz.

Shrug. I agree that he isn't an auto disqualifier because he can't beat a melee beatstick in combat...but IDK if he's the best overall (he's certainly on the short list though)

A 100 point Rune Priest brings you similar utility (less utility buffing, better offense with codex powers, best anti psycher in the game, better in combat)

Coteaz has a Daemon Hammer, an additional wound and 2+ armour without paying extra for it, how is the Rune Priest better in combat?

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

anonymou5 wrote:

 reddwarf54 wrote:

 poppa G wrote:
We should just compare the hard stats and abilities. Honestly?
You're saying some librarian could spank an overlord, abaddon, and an avatar?
No way.

Sure, Coteaz loses in close combat to hideously expensive HQs designed for melee, but he is by far the best overall HQ in the game. This thread is titled best overall HQ, so when you take into account everything he brings to an army for only 100 points, there is no-one better than Coteaz.

Shrug. I agree that he isn't an auto disqualifier because he can't beat a melee beatstick in combat...but IDK if he's the best overall (he's certainly on the short list though)

A 100 point Rune Priest brings you similar utility (less utility buffing, better offense with codex powers, best anti psycher in the game, better in combat)

Coteaz has a Daemon Hammer, an additional wound and 2+ armour without paying extra for it, how is the Rune Priest better in combat?

I honestly forget about the Artificer armor when I wrote that. I was just thinking T3 and a S6 hammer weren't really that impressive. Coteaz is better in combat (in most situations), but I think my point about him still stands.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

anonymou5 wrote:

 reddwarf54 wrote:

 poppa G wrote:
We should just compare the hard stats and abilities. Honestly?
You're saying some librarian could spank an overlord, abaddon, and an avatar?
No way.

Sure, Coteaz loses in close combat to hideously expensive HQs designed for melee, but he is by far the best overall HQ in the game. This thread is titled best overall HQ, so when you take into account everything he brings to an army for only 100 points, there is no-one better than Coteaz.

Shrug. I agree that he isn't an auto disqualifier because he can't beat a melee beatstick in combat...but IDK if he's the best overall (he's certainly on the short list though)

A 100 point Rune Priest brings you similar utility (less utility buffing, better offense with codex powers, best anti psycher in the game, better in combat)

Coteaz has a Daemon Hammer, an additional wound and 2+ armour without paying extra for it, how is the Rune Priest better in combat?

I gotta' say, for what you get, T4 with a 3+ and Instant Deathing while ignoring 3+ saves is pretty damn good for 100pts... Especially considering you can take like, 3 of them, and they have a hell of a lot of cool upgrades with the word 'wolf' in them xD

I'm an Eldar player and wanna support Eldrad but, since the nerf (slight), Coteaz (Cortez) wins it for me.

Cortez is ok as a beatstick but, the changes he can make to an Inquisitorial army would make him a bargain at 200 points.

For what he brings to the army, no one does as much as the 50-pt Ethereal.

 jy2 wrote:
For what he brings to the army, no one does as much as the 50-pt Ethereal.

Inquisior Corteaz begs to differ. He feels that for his points he could easily kill 2 Ethereals in combat, and provides better buffs

Im gonna say the necron royal court is the best its still an hq and very versatile

 BrotherOfBone wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
For what he brings to the army, no one does as much as the 50-pt Ethereal.

Inquisior Corteaz begs to differ. He feels that for his points he could easily kill 2 Ethereals in combat, and provides better buffs

abbadon could kill Corteaz and the 2 Ethereals in combat, but being good in combat is only part of what makes something the best HQ overall.

Im going to have to go with an ethereal(have you experienced the joy of the greater good today? No?(36 firewarriors jump out of transports within 15 inches) to bad!), a jetbike farseer(Twin linking, giving rerolls to wound, fleshbane haywire, mindwar, can drop these anywhere) , or a mark'O rain squad(6 markerlights mean my 3 firewarrior squads within 15 inches of you with an ethereal are more effecient)

Another vote for St celestine from me. At 115 pts she is an auto include in every single sob list. She can hunt anything with a high toughness, and destroys meq units in combat. But the most important things for her relate to her immortality.

As she can always come back there is no danger in sending her at anything in the game...anything. She can do damage to most things one way or another, and is just a pain when she holds up whole units. If she dies so what? She'll be back next turn. Also I don't know another character choice that has 14 wounds ( how many celestine got in my last battle).

Oh and she's got a heavy flamer for s**its and giggles!

Best HQ as stand alone?, or best HQ for what it brings to a given army?.

If its the second would have to agree Etheral is the best, I do like Fateweaver as well, recently tourny has re ignited my love for his one dice re roll. Love it when a opponent finally thinks he has killed my Daemon prince after tanking 50 odd wounds and him still have one wound left and sweeping a unit (my dice rolls in that game, unreal!).

I find the GUO is the best HQ for a warlord.
Its durable enough to make it a real PITA for your opponent to score 'Slay the Warlord'.
Its strong enough to sit in the middle of the board and say "Get off my lawn!" to any enemies that get close.

Another awesome HQ is Abbadon. Hes an IC and can beat the face of nearly every other IC in the game.

Another awesome HQ is a LoC. If you get the right power/gifts, it can destroy nearly anything.

 labmouse42 wrote:
I find the GUO is the best HQ for a warlord.
Its durable enough to make it a real PITA for your opponent to score 'Slay the Warlord'.
Its strong enough to sit in the middle of the board and say "Get off my lawn!" to any enemies that get close.

Another awesome HQ is Abbadon. Hes an IC and can beat the face of nearly every other IC in the game.

Another awesome HQ is a LoC. If you get the right power/gifts, it can destroy nearly anything.

I have to say yes, throw in a vote for the Greater Unclean One, it really is remarkable! It's just so hard to kill, it took shots from a land raider, a predator, two squads of chaos space marines with heavy bolters and a squad of cultists with autoguns ^_^

Don't forget, a GUO with its toe in difficult terrain has a 3+ cover save.

You can also get that same cover save from having models in front of the GUO.

Finally it can go to ground for a 2+ cover save when really needed.

Coteaz, his wargear alone makes him worth the 100 points...now add in abilities like shooting units that appear from reserves and disintegrating GKs largest weakness.

Point for point I don't think there's an argument.

 labmouse42 wrote:
Don't forget, a GUO with its toe in difficult terrain has a 3+ cover save.

You can also get that same cover save from having models in front of the GUO.

Finally it can go to ground for a 2+ cover save when really needed.

Slow and Purposeful means no going to ground

Now he might not be the best one on one, but i love what farsight can do, (and no, not a farsight bomb either.) when he comes in imma gonna say he and his 3 tl plamsa rifle buds here and tear you a new one with 8 fairly accurate, without markerlights by the way, s6 ap2 shots, then when you try and assault him, hes got the dawn blade, s5 ap2 hits at int, which is a 5, and has like 5 attacks with ws 5 as well.

anonymou5 wrote:
Slow and Purposeful means no going to ground

Really? Where did you read that? If in a rulebook, what page? If in a FAQ, which one?

Edit : I just double checked the main 40k FAQ and the rulebook and don't see anything in regards to this. That's fairly significant as it applies to plague bearers as well -- which is why I'm curious to know where you found that ruling.

 labmouse42 wrote:

anonymou5 wrote:
Slow and Purposeful means no going to ground

Really? Where did you read that? If in a rulebook, what page? If in a FAQ, which one?

Edit : I just double checked the main 40k FAQ and the rulebook and don't see anything in regards to this. That's fairly significant as it applies to plague bearers as well -- which is why I'm curious to know where you found that ruling.

I'm kind of glad you replied, I think I've been playing this wrong. I just checked myself and you're right, it does not say that. I may have to reconsider plaguebearers...

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Ghazghkull Thraka. WS6, T5, 4 wounds with Eternal warrior. He gets 7 str10 ap2 attacks on the charge, and can activate a 2+ invulnerable save at any moment in the game. His Waaagh makes the entire army fearless. He can destroy anyone in a challenge.

wheresmypulitzer wrote:
He can destroy anyone in a challenge.

Skarbrand.. Nuff said...

'Cept fer whereamypulitzer, yer all rootin' fer sum 'umie. Or a tree-huggin pansy (read Eldar). Everyone knows Green is da bestest as we get the koolest toys on our bosses. Dey may not be able to shoot as good as 'umies but they are great at krumpin!

Coteaz can radically change the character of an army by making a quirky retinue into standard troops. And there is so much you can do with it.

 BrotherOfBone wrote:

wheresmypulitzer wrote:
He can destroy anyone in a challenge.

Skarbrand.. Nuff said...

No, Ghazghkull probably wins that.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 BrotherOfBone wrote:

wheresmypulitzer wrote:
He can destroy anyone in a challenge.

Skarbrand.. Nuff said...

No, Ghazghkull probably wins that.

Really? I think Skarbrand would whup him.. Or even a Chaos Lord with the Murder Sword could probably have a good crack at Ghazkull :S

 BrotherOfBone wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 BrotherOfBone wrote:

wheresmypulitzer wrote:
He can destroy anyone in a challenge.

Skarbrand.. Nuff said...

No, Ghazghkull probably wins that.

Really? I think Skarbrand would whup him.. Or even a Chaos Lord with the Murder Sword could probably have a good crack at Ghazkull :S

Ghazghkull is one of the few ICs who can fight Abaddon and win semi-reliably. Abaddon wins, but just barely IIRC. At any rate, the Chaos Lord is going to die to ID and Skarbrand will bounce off Ghazzy's 2++.

There is a character that can beat Ghazghkull fairly easily, Hulked out Swarmlord on Warp Speed+Iron Arm, to add insult to injury he can have Catalyst or Endurance slapped on him too.

Hence why I said IC and not Character. Regardless, Ghazghkull would take a fair chunk out of Swarmy before going down.