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It's one thing forgetting things. It's another to ask, "OH CRAP I FORGOT TO CAST PRESCIEINCE!" "do you mind if i roll for it now?"

You shouldn't be allowed to roll it. Why? So YOU WILL NOT DO IT AGAIN.

In a fun game, it's good to let things slide. But letting it slide all the time, you get use to it and then not learn anything. So if you forget, you should be saying to yourself, you can't roll for it, so you will finally learn not to do it again.

Hell I forget all the time, and when I am corrected and my opponent says redo it, I say thank you for reminding me, but I will not redo it, since I want to remember this for next time when I get hammered.

Davor wrote:
It's one thing forgetting things. It's another to ask, "OH CRAP I FORGOT TO CAST PRESCIEINCE!" "do you mind if i roll for it now?"

You shouldn't be allowed to roll it. Why? So YOU WILL NOT DO IT AGAIN.

In a fun game, it's good to let things slide. But letting it slide all the time, you get use to it and then not learn anything. So if you forget, you should be saying to yourself, you can't roll for it, so you will finally learn not to do it again.

Hell I forget all the time, and when I am corrected and my opponent says redo it, I say thank you for reminding me, but I will not redo it, since I want to remember this for next time when I get hammered.

Totally! If i forget more than once or twice in a game i will just say screw and continue. But I wouldn't mind either way, it doesnt matter to me if someone cast their buff that effect the shooting phase before movement or whatever. I don't really think punishing someone for something as simple as that in a game is really worthwhile for anyone. I am all about having the best time possible. If someone rolls and the dice hits a model or whatever and lands badly i will ask them if they would like to reroll because it hit a guy. If your strategy for winning is dirty tricks or taking advantage of someone who just forgot to do something in its proper order you really need to sit down and reevaluate your life.

Technically I cheat everytime I pull out my Tyberos the Red Wake as I don't have the IA book. But, my friend does, I took note of them, and make sure my opponent is fine with them beforehand, and if not, I take Vulkan instead as they cost the same.

It here is a guy in the group at our FLGS that built a tervigon out of a carnifex.

TechMarine1 wrote:
It here is a guy in the group at our FLGS that built a tervigon out of a carnifex.

The Tervigon is a relatively new model..... if he had a conversion before hand ( which usually were Carnifex's ) I wouldn't hold that against him now.


There's a guy in our FLGS that has cooked dice. He never scatters and has 10 dice to roll for hits / wounds and 2 dice for LD tests. Sadly, with all those 6's and low LD rolls... he can still lose.

Davor wrote:It's one thing forgetting things. It's another to ask, "OH CRAP I FORGOT TO CAST PRESCIEINCE!" "do you mind if i roll for it now?"

You shouldn't be allowed to roll it. Why? So YOU WILL NOT DO IT AGAIN.

In a fun game, it's good to let things slide. But letting it slide all the time, you get use to it and then not learn anything. So if you forget, you should be saying to yourself, you can't roll for it, so you will finally learn not to do it again.

Hell I forget all the time, and when I am corrected and my opponent says redo it, I say thank you for reminding me, but I will not redo it, since I want to remember this for next time when I get hammered.

Agreed. Its one thing if its something to keep track of you normally dont but in a tournament setting or practice-tournament setting, youre suppose to know your list.
When i first started playing Tau you have no flippin idea how many times i forgot to thrust move lol. If i caught it before my opponent started moving i asked if i could do it real quick but now its my own damn fault since ive played them enough to know better. Actually lost a crisis bomb with a buffmander in it because i forgot to thrust move after deepstriking, i caught it but at this point i wasnt a new tau player so i just went "FETH MY LIFE!" as he flew a helldrake near it rofl

Davor wrote:
It's one thing forgetting things. It's another to ask, "OH CRAP I FORGOT TO CAST PRESCIEINCE!" "do you mind if i roll for it now?"

You shouldn't be allowed to roll it. Why? So YOU WILL NOT DO IT AGAIN.

In a fun game, it's good to let things slide. But letting it slide all the time, you get use to it and then not learn anything. So if you forget, you should be saying to yourself, you can't roll for it, so you will finally learn not to do it again.

Hell I forget all the time, and when I am corrected and my opponent says redo it, I say thank you for reminding me, but I will not redo it, since I want to remember this for next time when I get hammered.

Meh, I'm of the opinion that we're here to play a fun game, it sucks when your master plan is foiled because your commander forgot to order the psyker to do his thing. I mean, unless this is a tournament setting, I really don't care if you go ahead and roll that Prescience after you're supposed to, or if you take that jet pack movement after I've already started moving. As long as it's not something cheesy like measuring from your new position to cast a psychic power rather than your old position (giving you an extra 6" of range) then I'm happy to let you retroactively do stuff.

Davor wrote:
It's one thing forgetting things. It's another to ask, "OH CRAP I FORGOT TO CAST PRESCIEINCE!" "do you mind if i roll for it now?"

You shouldn't be allowed to roll it. Why? So YOU WILL NOT DO IT AGAIN.

Quite frankly, when I forget something like this I don't generally ask to try and do it. I figure that's the price I pay for not doing it right.

Most common cheating practice? Saying that a model is equipped with something that its not, to get a few extra shots.

I had a friend (one of only 3 of us in the area that played), who had a fully themed table of a fortress that one side was attacking. this included a trench system that was determined to be hindering terrain. long story short it was set on very long table edge (leading to the fortress) and a small (4ft) table edge to deploy. oh did i mention that the table was the exact length of his artillery range....never played there again.

I think I am doing the reverse of modeling for benefits. Most of models have bases bigger or highier than gw bases. Plenty of them stand on additonaly elevated ground on their bases.

Whiskered wrote:
I think I am doing the reverse of modeling for benefits. Most of models have bases bigger or highier than gw bases. Plenty of them stand on additonaly elevated ground on their bases.

Enjoying that LOS benefits?

Yeah a lot mate they are dying like nurgle carrion insects against flame-thrower.

But still I love them and I don't mind it.

I knew a guy who used the Big Gun Apocalypse dice and would only hold them 2-3 inches off the table. He would place them on his open palm and just tip his hand sideways. They would only "roll" to the next side so he could load whatever result he wanted.

One of our players tends to roll his dice with a dice cup lift it up tell everything has hit and immediately picks them up to do his next roll.
After telling him to stop he normally does but he tries to get away with it at the start of almost every game and especially if hes playing against new players in our club.

The consequences were that nobody wanted to play him anymore. He used to be there almost every week but since the last 3 or 4 times he came by he didnt find someone for a game he didnt show up for a while now. He's also that kind of player that likes to misinterpret his rules in his favour and if you ask to read the rule by yourself he gets angry. Sometimes he even makes up rules when playing with people that dont know his vibe.
I hope we never see him again.

Other than that i wouldnt accuse anyone in our gaming group of purposefully cheating. Its just pathetic anyway. If someone has to cheat to beat me - at least he knows for himself that his only chance was by cheating. I cant imagine thats a good feeling.

I had a guy at my LGS that mounted his marines on rocks so they could see over other squads. He also insisted on using a Soulgrinder vs a Defiller so that the cannon was able to fire over his Land raider. Plus much much more, he was eventually banned from every store in the area.
As for all the dice rolling issues I have always wanted GW to write in rules that you must roll out of a cup. It would stop all of those lets say Special rolling tricks.

 generalchaos34 wrote:
Im guilty of reverse cheating. When i see that my opponent is having a bad time or the dice is just against them and I am crushing them, I will roll my dice behind a building and claim to have missed or failed armor saves. For me it keeps the game competitive and it makes my friends feel a bit better, plus its good to avoid any rage quits when you have a very small pool of people who play locally.

I hate that.

Either we play a competitive game where someone has to loose and someone wins, or we play a fun game where I have no qualms to make bad decisions (Apocalypse is a good start for that) and just want to see (in my imagination) things blow up and experience ridiculous scenes.

When I loose, yes ... I get emotional sometimes too, but I have no grudge against the other player - normaly on my bad luck or over-/underpowered units. When I win combats or even the game because someone let me I would feel even more unhappy. I have no problem with loosing, I don't like it ... but I don't want to gain or win because someone helps me. Everything I achieve I want to have done myself!

/Edit: ad Topic:

I'm sure I've cheated a dozen times because I still do not friggin know/remember all the rules - most recently I experienced I only get ONE roll for Jokaeros, I simply overread that, so until now I was cheating there.

But I never ever do that on purpose - and I expect the same for people I play with.

Nefrugle wrote:

There's a guy in our FLGS that has cooked dice. He never scatters and has 10 dice to roll for hits / wounds and 2 dice for LD tests. Sadly, with all those 6's and low LD rolls... he can still lose.

Just roll his dice, too. How can he object without calling himself a cheater.

Adding the model's base to it's movement distances seems quite common in cheating.

 deviantduck wrote:

Nefrugle wrote:

There's a guy in our FLGS that has cooked dice. He never scatters and has 10 dice to roll for hits / wounds and 2 dice for LD tests. Sadly, with all those 6's and low LD rolls... he can still lose.

Just roll his dice, too. How can he object without calling himself a cheater.

Sorry, I have OCD, I can't let you touch my dice.

That said, take brand new unopened store dice to a game with him next time, ask him to use those. Although, being a perfectly proficient dice fraud (I don't do it on the table, but I also won't ever compete at 40k as a result) I know that someone who wants to cheat can, and with a touch of social engineering (less valuable units just happen to FAIL all their saves, for example) will do so. If you're sure someone is cheating, just don't bother to play them, same as the dreaded list-tailor (my most common encounter)

Also, embarrasingly, I misread my rules, and use kroot pulse rounds to kill a rhino from the front via HPs once, just after the eldar release. (I had not until then actually gotten tofire the kroot at anything, oddly) I allow happily for people making mistakes, I simply won't play with people who cheat unless dragged into it by the missus (she constantly gets me into games with the guy who heard me say "I'm bringing my guard" and went over to his armies (we were at his house) to get out all the models with flamers). Its just not fun, when I could be playing against someone else.

Nobody_Holme wrote:
That said, he's still more fun to play than the guy who brings your hard counter no matter what you play, because he won't even turn up unless told what you'll be bringing. Oh, and he'll leave instead of playing if you bait-and-switch in something that's a fair match, even, let alone his own counter.

We have a guy like this in our FoW group. He'll watch a game and pick who he wants to play and set up the game. Then he goes and builds his army to completely counter the army he watched being played. This is the primary reason most of us bring two armies to each session so that when this happens, he comes over with his tailored army all cocky and then gets really upset when you start putting away the minis on the table and pulling out the other army that is not even remotely the same as the first one. Oddly he hasn't figured out that we are doing it to him on purpose.

The old measure from front of base to back manuever is a classic, especially when moving a tank and trying to take an extra move equal to the length of the vehicle. Another is the always rolling dice behind some terrain piece so that you can't see what you actually rolled shtick. We usually keep the 40k box lid sitting nearby and do all rolling in that so everyone can see exactly what is going on. At crucial times if someone forgets and rolls an important roll on the table, the terrain piece in the way is picked up by the roller so everyone can see their roll.

Chuckling at the lengths people will go to get extra cover saves. Shaving/sanding bases down just sounds so tedious and ludicrous that I just can't imagine someone doing it. Modeling using kneeling legs makes some amount of sense since infantry should be conforming to cover, but extreme positioning of walkers specifically to get an advantage like having the walker literally crawling on its base are obnoxious too.

As for unit cheats as soon as someone says "I think it is..." we make them open the book and look it up directly. It helps that I primarily play with friends and almost never play with strangers anymore. That really limits the general limit of shenanigans that I have to deal with in games.


Skriker

People rolling for all psy powers at once, rather than one at a time.
Ignoring LOS for vehicle weapons.
Willfully forgetting what psy powers they can take.
Not going by FAQ updates, on purpose.
Rigged dice (yes I've seen them, mostly for seize rolls)

[juraigamer]People rolling for all psy powers at once, rather than one at a time.

The issue with rolling all at once is the decision to swap for the primaris.

If I need to roll 1 time, then decide if I want that power or swap, before I roll my second roll it makes a big difference.

VS

I roll say 3 dice, re-roll duplicates, then choose which if any to swap.

For instance I have 3 rolls on say divination.

Currently say I roll a 6 and don't want scriers gaze, so I swap for prescience, then I roll again, and get another 6, now I must keep that power because I already swapped, then I roll my 3rd roll and keep whatever that is as well say a 2. SO I get Prescience, Scriers gaze, and 4++ save

If I roll all 3 at once and roll the same 3 numbers 6,6,2. I re-roll the second 6, and say get a 3. Now I drop the 6 for prescience. I end up with Prescience, Misfortune, and 4++ save.

I see your point but apart from Divination none of the Primaris are really decent enough to make a difference. And if you're not taking Prescience why roll on Divination?

Anyway, I see your point but to me I wouldn't have a problem if it means I can play the game quicker.

 Rotary wrote:
I just wanted to get a list of things your friends do that cross that grey area when playing . Every group has that "one guy" who is trying to push the boundaries intentionally. I'll post my friend up to start, who plays necrons and tau. For instance, he shaves all of his bases down by about a small amount to try to get cover saves. He also cuts the small clear polls on his tau drones for the same purpose. What stuff have you guys seen, it can be rules or modeling.

None, and I find the term 'common cheating practices' bizarre, as I've only met a small handful of players in my 10yrs of wargames who actively cheat.

 Happyjew wrote:

 Omegus wrote:
All FW material is readily available online.

If so please provide a link to where I can get information on the Eldar Hornets as they appear in IA Apocaypse (August 2013 edition).

They're actually quite awesome now!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Happyjew wrote:
In my group if we are unsure whether or not a dice is cocked we gently place a second dice on top. If it stays, it's legal.

That's how we play it at my shop...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Not intentional cheating... but moving wonkey models too far (or too little) such as the Defiler.

It's not easy moving that spiny thingamajig. If there are issues, then I'd ask my opponent to move what he thinks as 6".

At our store, it's either on the flat part of the table that isn't terrain, or it's cocked. Even if flat in a piece of terrain, you reroll.

LOL, just saw this video by MWG. It might show some of the cheating habits people do:




Lucarikx

That video was pretty excellent.