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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Here's one for debate.

Batman and Robin.

As a follow-up to Batman/Batman Returns, they're pretty meh. Much too silly and bright.

But if you look at them more as a follow up to the Adam West Batman it takes on a whole new life as something of a tribute to that interpretation of the character.

Hudson Hawk suffered from a terrible, terrible ad campaign, leading to a very similar problem in expectations. Coming just after Die Hard as it did, the ads painted Hudson Hawk as a serious action film in the same style.... which it most definitely is not!

More than anything else, I'd call Hudson Hawk a live-action cartoon in the Looney Toons style. And watching it with that in mind, the movie is HILARIOUS!

CHAOS! PANIC! DISORDER!
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Made in us
Dakka Veteran





I will add yet another count for Dark City.

For one of my favorites that no one else ever gets - Mean Guns. It has one of the best 90's casts for not taking anything seriously and it still works out. I have managed to turn it into a Shadowrun game a few times.
   
Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

 Vulcan wrote:
Here's one for debate.

Batman and Robin.

As a follow-up to Batman/Batman Returns, they're pretty meh. Much too silly and bright.

But if you look at them more as a follow up to the Adam West Batman it takes on a whole new life as something of a tribute to that interpretation of the character.



I'd rate Batman and Robin over any Nolan's episode anytime! That movie was so terrible but to the point that it's actually hilarious, Batman should always be portrayed as a silly cartoon. Nolan's movies are too serious .

Among all the SW trash, my favorite episode is The Phantom Menace: mostly because of Liam Neeson's character and the duel between the two jedi and Darth Maul, IMHO still the best duel in the entire SW franchise. I also love the orky Kustom Force Field that Jar Jar's army brings to the final battle .

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/22 06:39:49



 
   
Made in jp
Crushing Black Templar Crusader Pilot





Ishikawa Prefecture, Japan

You fellas want a real unpopular hill to die on?

I'll give you unpopular.

The Phantom Menace.
I fething love the Phantom Menace. I love it more than all the other Star Warses, and at this point I don't care who knows.
Is this massively subjective?
Yes.
Is it also kind of a trash movie?
Even more yes.

But hear me out.
The Phantom Menace, even with all of the senate scenes, trade federation talk, podracing and the gungans, still clocks some of the most, and some of the BEST lightsaber action Lucas ever blessed us with.
At the very core of it, Lucas takes his space samurai epic, and sends them on a buddy cop detective mission.
McGregor and Neeson absolutely kill it. The chemistry there is fantastic. Neeson nails older, more professional spiritual warrior, while McGregor's scampish-yet-aspiringly-sincere performance is genuinely one of the best in the whole saga. He simply outclasses SO MANY actors who've been in Star Wars before or since, all the while trying to transplant Alec McGuiness' style into this younger universe. As a kid, I was totally enamored with the core story of the two Jedi finding themselves embroiled in this war, cutting a swathe through a horde of droids that they are only able to best because of their lightsabers and force powers. Lucas totally throws out the OT fighting styles, and invents a gorgeous combat choreography that fuelled many saber duels on the playground all throughout my elementary school years. Where Luke Skywalker feels like a rookie of a long-lost fighting style, the prequel universe felt like it was steeped in tradition, actively being taught.

All of this leads to the absolutely magnificent climax of the film. Duel of the Fates soars as Darth Maul, probably second only to vader in his raw sinister aura, finally ignites both saber blades for the first time. The whole final duel is a feast for the senses, and at probably 6 ish years old, I think it probably left my brains dribbling out of my nose watching it on the big screen.
So many of the designs are absolutely brilliant, too. The organic masonry, technology and machines of Ota-Gunga. The flamboyant painjobs and engine setups on the pod racers (yeah I said the p-word, feth you), the classical mediterranean opulence of Naboo, the austere grey blue of the senate, the skeletal, inhuman look of the battle droids, the jedi robes, the costuming of the Naboo court, those lil yellow naboo starfighters that look like sports cars stuck in a wind tunnel too long then dipped in chrome just a lil bit, LITERALLY EVERY COSTUME QUEEN AMIDALA WEARS DARTH MAUL a character so good they keep bringing him back from the dead because we only got a brief, intoxicating, perfect glimpse of him on the screen.
Spoiler:
He should have stayed dead. That mystery was delicious. Unanswered questions in sci-fi are some of the best ones.


I have this real warm, comfy feel whenever I see old promo stuff for Phantom. Something about those reds, blacks and pale golds just feels like it belongs in a place of innocence, at the very tail end of the 90s. I used to have this movie on DVD, and I'd play it on my PS2, lying on the big sofa in my living room whenever I was sick as a kid.

Does the movie have some kinda questionable plot points? Sure. Does it really drag it's heels and plod along at other points? Yeah. Are Jar-Jar, the Nemoydians and Watto a bit much? Yeah, probably (though silly alien with a frog tounge? When I was 6 I could think of fewer funnier things).
But as a sci-fi action movie? It kicks more ass than people are willing to admit, and gives a lot more than you would expect from a movie that is really for kids, at its heart. It's popcorn cinema at it's most outrageously, deliciously kitsch, trying vainly to be more high-brow than it is, and yet at the same time with clearly so much work put into the setting, for what at it's core is just the story of two cops shooting their way to the heart of a crime ring and I love it for all of that.

This is my hill.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/22 07:19:01


 
   
Made in gb
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






TPM does have some good bits, undermined by a poor choice of child actor, Jar Jar being insufferable, and….that’s about it for me.

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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






I think in 20-50 years Disney will start to remake the entire SW series. Hopefully they will have learned from Kennedy's awful mismanagement of the sequels and go in with a plan and not be afraid to change things. It will probably happen after Lucas is dead, and maybe even several more of the original cast.

George Lucas - 77
Harrison Ford - 79
Mark Hamill - 69
Anthony Daniels - 75

--------
Batman (1966) is the best Batman film
Lego Batman (2017) is the second best Batman film

All Batman films pale in comparison to Batman: The Animated Series

The Christopher Nolan Batman films are the worst because they fundamentally get the character of Bruce Wayne/Batman wrong on every level.
   
Made in us
Courageous Questing Knight





Texas

The only concept that 100% totally worked for me was the Nolan Bruce Wayne getting all his tech from Wayne Industries R&D. It is pretty ludicris to ever think, no matter how rich you are, that you can invent and manufature all of 'those wonderful toys.'

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Trustworthy Shas'vre





Leicester

Add me to the “I like The Phantom Menace” category; despite it’s flaws, I still think it is the best film in the prequel trilogy.

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 Zed wrote:
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Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






I'm a big fan of Death Race (the Jason Statham one). Most people say it's terrible, but I think it's great. Plus, they actually crash a lorry at 70mph and filmed it, just to see what happened.

Cutthroat Island - a brilliant swashbuckling pirate film, sadly let down in a couple of places (no recoil on the cannons, for example) but with a truly evil villain and a scene in which they actually blow up a full sized pirate ship. No CGI, they filled it with boom-juice and exploded it. Well worth a watch!

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Home Base: Waconia, MN (Minneapolis)

Unmentions I'd die on a hill for;

-John Carter (ok, one that's mentioned)

-Eurotrip: This movie is just one ridiculous running joke after another but in some ways encapsulates traveling with friends abroad in truly amazing ways. And Scotty will never truly "know".

-Ghost Ship: I don't care what people say. This was an absolutely amazing horror movie with a great cast.

-Alien Resurrection: feth you, this is the best aliens movie that isn't Aliens. I never enjoyed the alien slasher hunting individuals so that definitely influences. Give me a brawl against the actual aliens with people who don't have to make spears out of plastic forks to try and kill one.

-Conan (most recent one): This is just plain a good time. Buncha haters overrating Arnold and not appreciating the greatness of Momoa and Lang as a baller villain.

Movies I find way overrated;

-All Madmax films
-Both Bladerunners - Slow, not visually appealing. Bogged down by their own pretentiousness.
-Original Dune film

Seconds previously mentioned;

-Down Periscope is amazing
-Battle for LA just for the relatively novel at the time ground level alien invasion movie.
-Hudson Hawk because Hudson Hawk

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Fixture of Dakka





I don't think its considered bad, but I think Commando is probably the overall best film of its genre. I'm not entirely sure what that genre is, but Commando is the best of it.
   
Made in gb
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Alien Ressurection is definitely underrated.

It brought some cool new stuff to the table, answered “what would they try to do if they captured an Alien”, and didn’t fall back on this time….instead of a face, the Aliens have four arses…and a retractable leg….and a terrible fear of Stamps”, which is so often the downfall of sequels.

It also makes decent use of CGI to show swimming Aliens, without really using CGI elsewhere to the best of my knowledge. That gets a cap tip from me every time, because if you have the tech and budget to do prop effects, do them. Don’t just fall back on CGI, especially that relatively early in terms of CGI’s capabilities.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/22 14:11:26


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Pustulating Plague Priest






 some bloke wrote:
I'm a big fan of Death Race (the Jason Statham one). Most people say it's terrible, but I think it's great. Plus, they actually crash a lorry at 70mph and filmed it, just to see what happened.

Cutthroat Island - a brilliant swashbuckling pirate film, sadly let down in a couple of places (no recoil on the cannons, for example) but with a truly evil villain and a scene in which they actually blow up a full sized pirate ship. No CGI, they filled it with boom-juice and exploded it. Well worth a watch!


Ooh. I remember watching Death Race 2000 a couple years back. It was absolutely bonkers, and I could barely stop laughing throughout the film. Is the Statham one just as ridiculous, or is it toned down a bit?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/22 14:15:34


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Made in us
Battlefield Tourist




MN

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Well, if we’re going to get spicy…

Batman The Movie (Adam West) is better than any Batman movie except The Dark Knight and Lego Batman.



100% agree. Still watch it and enjoy a lot.

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Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






 SkavenLord wrote:
 some bloke wrote:
I'm a big fan of Death Race (the Jason Statham one). Most people say it's terrible, but I think it's great. Plus, they actually crash a lorry at 70mph and filmed it, just to see what happened.

Cutthroat Island - a brilliant swashbuckling pirate film, sadly let down in a couple of places (no recoil on the cannons, for example) but with a truly evil villain and a scene in which they actually blow up a full sized pirate ship. No CGI, they filled it with boom-juice and exploded it. Well worth a watch!


Ooh. I remember watching Death Race 2000 a couple years back. It was absolutely bonkers, and I could barely stop laughing throughout the film. Is the Statham one just as ridiculous, or is it toned down a bit?


The Statham one is different. Still campy, but not to the same degree. It also has at least one sequel with Him Out Of Bros, which is also pretty good fun,

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Pustulating Plague Priest






 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
 SkavenLord wrote:
 some bloke wrote:
I'm a big fan of Death Race (the Jason Statham one). Most people say it's terrible, but I think it's great. Plus, they actually crash a lorry at 70mph and filmed it, just to see what happened.

Cutthroat Island - a brilliant swashbuckling pirate film, sadly let down in a couple of places (no recoil on the cannons, for example) but with a truly evil villain and a scene in which they actually blow up a full sized pirate ship. No CGI, they filled it with boom-juice and exploded it. Well worth a watch!


Ooh. I remember watching Death Race 2000 a couple years back. It was absolutely bonkers, and I could barely stop laughing throughout the film. Is the Statham one just as ridiculous, or is it toned down a bit?


The Statham one is different. Still campy, but not to the same degree. It also has at least one sequel with Him Out Of Bros, which is also pretty good fun,


Well, it was the late 2000s. Some camp is probably still much more compared to the other movies of that time.

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Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

The only really janky part of Alien 4 is the way they put Ripley back into the story and the Aliens as well. The whole "cloned from a drop of mixed blood" with "genetic memories" was a huge huge huge stretch.

That said it gave us something we had indeed not seen before which was Aliens being fare more mobile and active. These ones didn't have to rush machine guns to choke them; or only hide in the vents. These were Aliens fighting, swimming and moving with a lot of speed.


As I recall CGI got used throughout the film in small and big bits - swimming was one scene, but there's also one near the start where the Alien leaps around an escape pod and then into it.

I see it as a film that aimed ot give fans a lot of things. Heck its even one of the few that touches on the sexualised/sensual side of the Aliens; as well as a different take on the horror (the experiments room).


I feel like its one big plot stretch and then everything else settles into place. A lot of the more recent ones its a lot of plot holes or odd behaviours "just cause".


Whta baffles me is that the action heavy Hollywood machine never did anything that the comics did with the storylines. Doing the War on Earth or the War on the Alien hive world and such would be great "no brains action" type films alongside "scary alien on the ship hunting us" horror ones.

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Made in gb
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






True, they do use CGI in more than just the swimming scenes - but at least they feel kind of justified. A way to show Aliens doing something you can’t really pull off any other way. Keeping the rest practical effects is still very welcome, as it adds impressive realism.

For example, the breakout scene, where they turn on the weakest in the cell. The subtlety of body movement would be very difficult even today to do purely CGI, let alone 24 years ago!

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Made in us
Courageous Space Marine Captain





SoCal

Someone said Eurotrip, and I have to agree it’s worth watching for three reasons: 1. it has The best Matt Damon cameo, 2. the running gag, 3. Robot Mime Fight.


 LunarSol wrote:
I don't think its considered bad, but I think Commando is probably the overall best film of its genre. I'm not entirely sure what that genre is, but Commando is the best of it.


It feels like they just took the schlockiest scene from Predator and extended it into a whole movie. I guess the genre would be “vanity action project”, like a Segal or Norris film, but maybe some of the creators of Commando were in on the joke. And the one liners all land.

   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
I don't think its considered bad, but I think Commando is probably the overall best film of its genre. I'm not entirely sure what that genre is, but Commando is the best of it.


It feels like they just took the schlockiest scene from Predator and extended it into a whole movie. I guess the genre would be “vanity action project”, like a Segal or Norris film, but maybe some of the creators of Commando were in on the joke. And the one liners all land.


It predates Predator by a couple of years. One of his earlier movies, hot on the heels of Terminator and Connan.
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

 Jadenim wrote:
Add me to the “I like The Phantom Menace” category; despite it’s flaws, I still think it is the best film in the prequel trilogy.
I'm with you there. Outside of the Jango stuff, AOTC only gets interesting once the characters get to the arena. And ROTS... well... that movie promises so much and delivers so little.

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"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Savage Minotaur




Baltimore, Maryland

 Hulksmash wrote:

-Ghost Ship: I don't care what people say. This was an absolutely amazing horror movie with a great cast.


-Conan (most recent one): This is just plain a good time. Buncha haters overrating Arnold and not appreciating the greatness of Momoa and Lang as a baller villain.



I can get behind these.

"Sometimes the only victory possible is to keep your opponent from winning." - The Emperor, from The Outcast Dead.
"Tell your gods we are coming for them, and that their realms will burn as ours did." -Thostos Bladestorm
 
   
Made in ca
Pustulating Plague Priest






 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Jadenim wrote:
Add me to the “I like The Phantom Menace” category; despite it’s flaws, I still think it is the best film in the prequel trilogy.
I'm with you there. Outside of the Jango stuff, AOTC only gets interesting once the characters get to the arena. And ROTS... well... that movie promises so much and delivers so little.


The entire pre-Empire setup has some interesting ideas, when the peripheral media surrounding the movies is used to supplement it. I won’t go into details for fear of derailing the conversation into politics, but it’s interesting to see how the mechanics of the republic seem to seem to have contributed to its downfall just as much as Palpatine had.

I like the movies on their own. With these kinds of ideas incorporated into the downfall of the republic though, I find them even more fascinating.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/09/23 17:54:20


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Made in ca
Hangin' with Gork & Mork






 Hulksmash wrote:
-Both Bladerunners - Slow, not visually appealing. Bogged down by their own pretentiousness.


Would you say they insist upon themselves?


Can we rename this thread to "Find Out Who You THought Was Cool But Actually Has Terrible Taste"?


MDG I thought you were cool.

H.B.M.C Why must you disappoint me?


Now if you'll excuse me I'm going to watch the greatest comedy ever: Balls of Fury.


Also: I saw Down Periscope in the theater when it came out. My brother and I might have been the only ones there. I've never been able to hear/see "Welcome Aboard" right ever since.

Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
 
   
Made in gb
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






I never said I was cool.

Nor has anyone else to the best of my knowledge


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Burnt Offerings 1976

A suitably creepy supernatural thriller starring Dear Old Oliver Reed and Karen Black.

It’s not necessarily original, but it is very cool, with some interesting concepts and effects.

Currently on Prime in the U.K. Definitely worth checking out, but one to watch rather than just have on in the background.

Crank 2 - High Voltage

I mean….it’s a Jason Statham movie. And being a Jason Statham movie, it’s silly willy fun fun fun!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/23 20:31:24


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your mind

Crank was great, Crank 2 also…

Reading the thread, I was reminded of how poorly Bladerunner was originally received. Personally, I disliked the second one, a lot. But the first one, I loved it and still do.

Yeah, that is a hard point, civil war magnitude misjudgment there, to malign the original Bladerunner film(S) (added S given different versions since released).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/26 07:07:58


   
Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Someone said Eurotrip, and I have to agree it’s worth watching for three reasons: 1. it has The best Matt Damon cameo, 2. the running gag, 3. Robot Mime Fight.



I love the original, Road Trip. Watched a hundred times. Unfortunately Eurotrip is full of prejudice and stereotypes against europeans, on a level that is hard to appreciate that kind of humor if you are european.

Commando is one of the best comedies in history, nothing made me laugh more than that movie, I adore it .

The Great Wall: it was poorly reviewed but I absolutely loved it and watched it several times, IMHO one of the best blockbusters of the last two decades.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/26 10:39:20



 
   
Made in us
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SoCal

I think Eurotrip makes more sense in the context of the time. It came out when shock humor was at its height. Comedians were telling jokes full of misogyny and bigotry where the actual “joke” was the things they were saying were so exaggerated no one could *really* believe them. (It was a simpler time when we just didn’t know.) Along those lines, the stereotypes in Eurotrip are exaggerated to the point where the joke is on Americans who believe these stereotypes. For example, the Italian guy on the train, or the bellhop who gets a nickel tip and declares “I buy my own hotel!” Are so over the top ridiculous that they feel like they’re making fun of American perceptions of foreigners than pandering to them, at least that was the impression I got at the time.

   
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Monarchy of TBD

Speaking of comedies of the times- I give you the greatest sports comedy ever made. Blades of Glory! It's got everything- Will Ferrell as an over the hill sleazy rockstar figure skater sex addict, Napoleon dynamite as his squeaky clean rival, and Amy Poehler and Will Arnett as their incestuous villians. It is whirlwind of pageantry, wit and idiocy.

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Made in ca
Hangin' with Gork & Mork






Eurotrip sort of came and went from the theaters but it must have struck a chord in some capacity as every few months I'll see a reference to it. Usually it is something about "Scotty doesn't know", or to the safe word.

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