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chaos0xomega wrote:I guess I'm the only one who still uses ccarnifexes to beat my opponents face in?

No, Kroothawk's assertion was a gross overgeneralization derived from applying his experiences to what he's read or those that play around him. By no means does that apply to players across the spectrum. 3 Carni's and a dual-bonesword Prime with Catalyst from a trailing Tervigon please and thank you.

puma713 wrote:That and, if I recall, the 'Nid battlefore never changed from the old codex to the new one.

It changed. They took the Carnifex out.

Gathering Storm wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:I guess I'm the only one who still uses ccarnifexes to beat my opponents face in?

No, I run 2 Trygons and a brood of 3 fexes. Idea being, does the opponent want to deal with the immediate, visible threat, OR stay defensive and deal with the tunneling horrors?

Good man! Finally someone else who realizes that its strength through diversity, not strength through spam.

Sidstyler wrote:...can you define "a very long time"?

Space Wolves second wave of stuff hasn't come out yet if that gives you any idea.

And, there's got to be a page somewhere on the forum specifically for whatever Tyranid list you guys want to play.

You realise there isn't going to be a Space Wolves second wave because they don't need it?

The only models that aren't supported are Thunderwolf Cavalry and Fen. Wolves.

This long time is infinity for the Space Wolves.

Another tidbit:
Jes Goodwin confirmed that there will be no Vect model in the forseeable future. You will have to use the old model and throne on the new Raider/Ravager or do some other conversion. Possible that other SCs will get no (new) miniature either in the next time.

Okay, I like that they're adding new units to every army, but this "we won't be making models for them ever" bs is starting to get annoying. I don't want to have to convert or kitbash half the gak in my army.

Kroothawk wrote:Another tidbit:
Jes Goodwin confirmed that there will be no Vect model in the forseeable future. You will have to use the old model and throne on the new Raider/Ravager or do some other conversion. Possible that other SCs will get no (new) miniature either in the next time.

I can see Vect being an easy conversion... but that doesn't make this right. I hope they make The Decapitator. The Mandrake Champion with his 4 arms has some absurdly massive coolness potential... Which would be very reassuring in a world where GW cares about coolness. If they did, they would have redone DE 8 years ago.

Who said they wouldn't be making models for them ever?

Vect already has a (gakky) model, and the units that are missing models usually get them 2nd/3rd wave.

Just Dave wrote:You realise there isn't going to be a Space Wolves second wave because they don't need it?

The only models that aren't supported are Thunderwolf Cavalry and Fen. Wolves.

This long time is infinity for the Space Wolves.

All of the smart ass answers that seem to be so prevalent on these forums are the best. Aside from the Thunderwolf Cavalry, Fenrisian Wolves, and Arjak Rockfist, the only Njal Stormcaller in power armor, or Bjorn The Fellhanded are out of production models.

Sidstyler wrote:Okay, I like that they're adding new units to every army, but this "we won't be making models for them ever" bs is starting to get annoying. I don't want to have to convert or kitbash half the gak in my army.

Yea this is getting dumb, probably reasoning that so many people would convert there own so they wouldn't have to buy the models, now you HAVE to convert. And I'm beginning to believe that they will only do 2nd waves when its slow and they need to make a quick buck.

chaos0xomega wrote:Who said they wouldn't be making models for them ever?

Nobody.
But 'not in the foreseeable future' is a GW way of saying 'probably never'. I'm sure more SCs than just Lelith will get a new model, but Vect was the biggest and baddest of the DE, and was present at the time of the fall. It's a little appalling that they have no plans to support him on the board. It's akin to Orks having to use that really old, small Ghazkull Thrakka model in the midst of their amazing new models.

Kroothawk wrote:Another tidbit:
Jes Goodwin confirmed that there will be no Vect model in the forseeable future. You will have to use the old model and throne on the new Raider/Ravager or do some other conversion. Possible that other SCs will get no (new) miniature either in the next time.

And this is where GW's collectors/bits service will come in, offering the old metal parts to the Vect kit so that people can conver... ahhha... ahahahahahah!

Ok, even I couldn't finish that sentence with a straight face.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Sidstyler wrote:Okay, I like that they're adding new units to every army, but this "we won't be making models for them ever" bs is starting to get annoying. I don't want to have to convert or kitbash half the gak in my army.

Welcome to 2nd Ed 40K.

I am so happy this thread hasn't wondered grossly off topic.......

Unless, of course, you subscribe to the notion that topics can develop and change over time.

Luthon1234 wrote:

Sidstyler wrote:Okay, I like that they're adding new units to every army, but this "we won't be making models for them ever" bs is starting to get annoying. I don't want to have to convert or kitbash half the gak in my army.

Yea this is getting dumb, probably reasoning that so many people would convert there own so they wouldn't have to buy the models, now you HAVE to convert. And I'm beginning to believe that they will only do 2nd waves when its slow and they need to make a quick buck.

It's like they said "Oh, models are too expensive? You don't like prices? Well feth you, half your codex can't even be fielded now unless you buy two kits to make each of those units! Go ahead, whine moar, I dare you."

I don't mind if some stuff doesn't have models right off the bat, but I just think it's really annoying that they aren't even going to be doing them at all. I know they haven't said that, but "not in the foreseeable future" might as well be "no".

Not true. I actually think what we're seeing is that GW had finally produced 90% of it's kits (or they could be easily converted 1-for-1 by other existing kits) and is now starting it back up. Basically it took them 2 full editions to make 90% of the stuff they put in codexes on the shelf. Well now most people will have those so they make a few extra kits with the release and leave room for future releases.

In a way it's actually smart. It gives them something to produce for an army so that they don't go 10 years with nothing. Coming out with 100% of stuff within the first 6 months of a codex leaves 4-6 years before you see anything new and that's for the popular xenos (Eldar, Tau, Nidz, Orks). I love it when people just scream without considering the actual reasoning. But it's people that buy GW, they're going to bitch.

Hulksmash wrote:Coming out with 100% of stuff within the first 6 months of a codex leaves 4-6 years before you see anything new and that's for the popular xenos (Eldar, Tau, Nidz, Orks).

Wave Releases are a perfectly sound idea to ensure that each army gets a release every year or so, rather than 4-6 years between getting anything new. The problem now isn't the length of time between releases, it's the fact that there are dozens of gaps in each line and we don't know if they will ever be filled. I doubt many Ork players would mind if they knew that a new Buggy and Deff Kopta kit was coming out 6 months from now or even 12 months from now. I think they mind more not knowing if there will ever be a Buggy kit.

Im still upset arhra not in the codex why the other eldar get there phonix lords why not the dark eldar

Plastic Warboss kit, Plastic Big Mek kit, Buggy and Deff Kopta kits. 4 big things for Orks from my perspective.

Sigmatron wrote:Plastic Warboss kit, Plastic Big Mek kit, Buggy and Deff Kopta kits. 4 big things for Orks from my perspective.

I wouldn't really expect the first two to ever come about. I think the era of plastic HQ's has pretty much died out.

Plastic SM Commander and plastic IG Command Squads beg to differ.

Also, Black Reach Warboss.

Plastic Special Characters? No, we'll never see those. Plastic generic HQs? I think it's not out of the question.

Plastic HQs for anything but the top-selling armies, however, eh. We probably won't see a plastic Farseer kit, but a plastic Warboss isn't out of the question.

SaintHazard wrote:Plastic SM Commander and plastic IG Command Squads beg to differ.

Also, Black Reach Warboss.

Plastic Special Characters? No, we'll never see those. Plastic generic HQs? I think it's not out of the question.

Plastic HQs for anything but the top-selling armies, however, eh. We probably won't see a plastic Farseer kit, but a plastic Warboss isn't out of the question.

Those two kits do not prove otherwise.. HBMC has a good point

Plastic SM commander is VERY different from a warboss on 2 points
1. hes a SM which sells a ton
2. He has tons of options. Ork warbosses always have a power klaw.. thats it. Wow great kit!

IG command squad is not what he meant, that is a *unit* that happens to be a HQ choice. Just like honor guard, command squads and many other units

They really arent even in the same league as a pointless plastic kit for two ork units which only have a single realistic option

I think we'll get plastic HQ kits provided those HQs have option you can model. I think a *new* SM commander kit is the most viable considering the current one is woefully obsolete

There is no Big Mek with KFF and power klaw, what about a burna? Also, no Mega-armored Warboss besides Ghaz.

im for one is so glade that the new archon is convertable with the wych sprues and tthe warrior sprues which means converting up any of the new specail characters would be easy im planning to buying 2 archon and convert them to be specail chaarcter and proberly buy a 3rd one to be a normal archon

Kirasu wrote:Plastic SM commander is VERY different from a warboss on 2 points
1. hes a SM which sells a ton

Orks are the #1 selling Xeno army, last time I checked.

Kirasu wrote:2. He has tons of options. Ork warbosses always have a power klaw.. thats it. Wow great kit!

Er, have you actually read the Ork codex? The Warboss has a ton of options, many of them viable. For starters, mega armor. Besides that, Orks are perfectly fine to take with a Big Choppa if you're going up against a T3-heavy army for that extra attack (since PKs don't benefit from an extra attack from the Slugga in CC). I've also seen Warbosses run with Kombi-Skorchas and TL Shootas, two distinct options. Once you break it down, Warbosses have just as many good builds as Captains, or close to it.

Kirasu wrote:IG command squad is not what he meant, that is a *unit* that happens to be a HQ choice. Just like honor guard, command squads and many other units

No, it's IG's primary HQ choice. How many competitive IG lists do you see led by a Primaris Psyker? Just because IG are squishy T3 humans doesn't make them somehow "not count" when factoring in the number of plastic HQ choices.

Kirasu wrote:They really arent even in the same league as a pointless plastic kit for two ork units which only have a single realistic option

Again, "single realistic option" is a gross oversimplification. There are plenty of ways to run Warbosses and Big Meks, and while your top-tier tournament lists may only include one or two viable Warboss builds, that doesn't mean there shouldn't be more options.

That said, do we currently have a way to build those one or two viable builds with plastic kits? Unless you buy a Black Reach Warboss, no, you don't.

SaintHazard wrote:Plastic SM Commander and plastic IG Command Squads beg to differ.

The former came out years and years ago. The latter is a squad, not a single character model.

SaintHazard wrote:Also, Black Reach Warboss.

Starter box model. Not at all analogous to the SM Commander or the host of Warhammer Character boxes (that seem to have completely dried up).

As I said - they don't seem to do them any more. Skaven didn't get any. Beastmen didn't. Hordes of Chaos or whatever they're called didn't. Dark Eldar aren't getting one. 'Nids didn't get a new Hive Tyrant. Chaos Daemons got a load of metal HQ choices (and technically don't have any Herald models outside of special characters, Forge World, and one atrocious metal Herald on Jugger). The last 40K one was the Chaos Terminator Lord IIRC. A Warboss kit is unlikely, but if they were to do one, I'd expect it to be a combined Warboss/Big Mek kit, where you can build either. And if the rumours pan out, we could see a Librarian/Chaplain kit. But otherwise, plastic HQ's are a dead concept until we see some new ones.

Lordkillyou wrote:Im still upset arhra not in the codex why the other eldar get there phonix lords why not the dark eldar

Because the ones in the Eldar codex are generations after generations of Phoenix Lords that have come and gone, passing on their mantle as the new Phoenix Lord inherets everything from the previous iteration.

We're not fielding the original Jain Zar or the original Asurmen (as in, the first of their kind).

Arhra is the original Father of Scorpions. The Fallen Phoenix. He would be like fielding a god. *shush up, Necrons*


Automatically Appended Next Post:

SaintHazard wrote:

Kirasu wrote:Plastic SM commander is VERY different from a warboss on 2 points
1. hes a SM which sells a ton

Orks are the #1 selling Xeno army, last time I checked.

Someone was reporting on the sales figures for GW not long ago (BrassScorpion?) and noted that Tau were the #1 selling Xeno army.

@HBMC

But those models you mentioned are already in the line. In all honesty there isn't anything in the Ork book without a model or a simple 1-to-1 conversion (Looted Wagons). Orks are lucky in that they might see upgrades in the future of their metals to plastics which is more than a lot of armies can say. I think GW's trend the last 10 years to create a model for everything in a book (which they've done an amazing job with) means that we can assume the models will come out eventually. But by not releasing them all together they get 2 things. People buying current models and converting them (sometimes poorly) which is an influx now. And then a release to keep army interest and another cash boost because most people don't convert super well and will buy the new kit. Win/Win for them actually.

puma713 wrote:Arhra is the original Father of Scorpions. The Fallen Phoenix. He would be like fielding a god.

From the 5th Ed Rulebook: "928.M41 - Arha and Karandras, opposed Phoenix Lords of the Striking Scorpions, duel for seventeen days amongst the shattered ruins of ancient Zandros."
He can't be THAT much better than the current Phoenix Lords... The question is WHO WON?!?!?!