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Look at the Fate of the Forgestar box cover... now look at the Steel Warriors pictured above. The aren't the same!

Cosmic wrote:Look at the Fate of the Forgestar box cover... now look at the Steel Warriors pictured above. The aren't the same!

Artwork that doesn't look like the miniatures?! How dare someone do that...

Why do people find it entertaining to make fun of other company's miniature?

LunaHound wrote:Why do people find it entertaining to make fun of other company's miniature?

Its human nature to take refuge in humor, otherwise webcomics poking fun at video games would have never existed

Those figures are a real shame. I wanted to like Warpath (or the miniatures, even if I never play the game). Get some Orxs to mix in with my existing Orks. Get some Space Dwarves to use as a "counts-as" Squat army.

Unfortunately, the quality is not there. The sculpting and design quality, to be specific. And I don't mind a bit of Fantasy mixed in with my sci-fi (40k is Science-Fantasy, after all).


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lord marcus wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:

lord marcus wrote:They look reasonably sci-fi.

Giving a knight a gun and a bionic eye is not enough. They all still have their swords for Christ's sake! How lazy is that!

They arent swords, they are knives. in this instance the could be used in the context of combat/field knives. If you don't like it, get on facebook or phone mantic directly and tell them. They do listen guys.

They're clearly swords, which is actually okay in my book. Just don't do the whole denial-on-every-point thing. Call a spade a spade and it will help your crediibility. I'm not willing to make an international phone call to tell them I don't like their figures (what's the guy on the other end of the phone going to do/say? I don't expect him to apologise for company policy). I'm also one of those old people who don't like or do Facebook. If they care what I have to say they'll check the forums for an overall feel (of course, the noisier bastards, both negative and positive are on forums, but so too are those who contact them directly).

I'll "tell" them by simply not buying their product. Just as I have with Finecast (to draw a parallel). Vote with my wallet, etc.

It could be that mantic doesn't have 150000 dollars to spend on new molds, personally I don't mind reusing sprues. And how many poses are in a space marine squad, or a ork squad, or an IG squad. They could certaintly be better but many of the complaints could be levied against GW as well.

youbedead wrote:And how many poses are in a space marine squad, or a ork squad, or an IG squad. They could certaintly be better but many of the complaints could be levied against GW as well.

I find that separate torsos can go a long way.

kenshin620 wrote:As I feared, oh well theres more fish in the ocean as they say

Okay, I've given you flak for posting these before, but this one is pretty funny... mainly because this is exactly what I'm planning on doing! Only without that fancy-ass bionic eye thingy.

I have about 40 or so dwarf ironwatch knocking around that I wasn't planning on doing much with. They are going to be put on round bases and used as forgefathers.

Lets face it, that's no handgun, it's a lasgun!

youbedead wrote: They could certaintly be better but many of the complaints could be levied against GW as well.

Ok, super, what does that mean exactly? Another company might do something I don't like so I can't complain about this company doing something I don't like?
As soon as people realise that there are people that don't play 40k that might be looking for a sci-fi mass combat game this thread will become a lot less repetitive.

Are the heads "new" heads or do they just provide little goggle/bionic bits on the sprue to modify unchanged KoW heads?


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scarletsquig wrote:

I have about 40 or so dwarf ironwatch knocking around that I wasn't planning on doing much with. They are going to be put on round bases and used as forgefathers.

Lets face it, that's no handgun, it's a lasgun!

Bit of a tangent but I've been meaning to find this out for a while: Where do the handgun arms attach to the torso? At the "shoulder" or below the shoulder pad thing? Would they fit on a Cadian/Catachan torso?

plastictrees wrote:
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scarletsquig wrote:

I have about 40 or so dwarf ironwatch knocking around that I wasn't planning on doing much with. They are going to be put on round bases and used as forgefathers.

Lets face it, that's no handgun, it's a lasgun!

Bit of a tangent but I've been meaning to find this out for a while: Where do the handgun arms attach to the torso? At the "shoulder" or below the shoulder pad thing? Would they fit on a Cadian/Catachan torso?

Looks like a bit under the shoulderpads

Does anyone else think that the painting might be making the crossover parts more obvious? The way they're such a contrasting color looks like CGI in A New Hope- glaringly obvious. I suspect a more blended approach will be more effectively all the way scifi.

Though nothing can help the flat top helmets- I don't mind anything but those frying panheads.

Some of my KOW dwarfs have separate heads, and they all have separate weapons. Some of them also have integrated legs and back-torsos with separate front-torsos and heads, as shown in Kenshin's post above.

youbedead wrote:It could be that mantic doesn't have 150000 dollars to spend on new molds, personally I don't mind reusing sprues. And how many poses are in a space marine squad, or a ork squad, or an IG squad. They could certaintly be better but many of the complaints could be levied against GW as well.

I'm sure they're working to a tight budget, and doing their very best to put out good product while saving as much as possible. The question is pretty much on how many sales wil their cut corners cost them versus how much will they save. It's a gamble, and none of us here with positive or negative opinions of the figures can know the answer, just as Mantic can't. They've made their choices and now they're rolling the dice.

It cost them a sale or two of the boxed set from me, but each individual one of us here is just a drop in the bucket. It just depends how many of us en masse decide to buy it regardless, or decide not to buy it (if we were potential customers). Along with how many "wow that's cool" customers who would just come along would have bought it.

As for the GW comparisons, I'm pretty sure the AOBR marines are all unique sculpts while obviously the multipart plastic marines have as many poses as you want to give them, and even near-identical poses will differ markedly depending on the armour mark components you choose to use (chests, legs, heads, etc)

scarletsquig wrote:

kenshin620 wrote:As I feared, oh well theres more fish in the ocean as they say

Okay, I've given you flak for posting these before, but this one is pretty funny... mainly because this is exactly what I'm planning on doing! Only without that fancy-ass bionic eye thingy.

I have about 40 or so dwarf ironwatch knocking around that I wasn't planning on doing much with. They are going to be put on round bases and used as forgefathers.

Lets face it, that's no handgun, it's a lasgun!

It actually looks just like a lasgun! I thought the original pic was a photoshop at first.

scipio.au wrote:Those figures are a real shame. I wanted to like Warpath (or the miniatures, even if I never play the game). Get some Orxs to mix in with my existing Orks. Get some Space Dwarves to use as a "counts-as" Squat army.

Unfortunately, the quality is not there. The sculpting and design quality, to be specific. And I don't mind a bit of Fantasy mixed in with my sci-fi (40k is Science-Fantasy, after all).


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lord marcus wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:

lord marcus wrote:They look reasonably sci-fi.

Giving a knight a gun and a bionic eye is not enough. They all still have their swords for Christ's sake! How lazy is that!

They arent swords, they are knives. in this instance the could be used in the context of combat/field knives. If you don't like it, get on facebook or phone mantic directly and tell them. They do listen guys.

They're clearly swords, which is actually okay in my book. Just don't do the whole denial-on-every-point thing. Call a spade a spade and it will help your crediibility. I'm not willing to make an international phone call to tell them I don't like their figures (what's the guy on the other end of the phone going to do/say? I don't expect him to apologise for company policy). I'm also one of those old people who don't like or do Facebook. If they care what I have to say they'll check the forums for an overall feel (of course, the noisier bastards, both negative and positive are on forums, but so too are those who contact them directly).

I'll "tell" them by simply not buying their product. Just as I have with Finecast (to draw a parallel). Vote with my wallet, etc.

They are Knives. Have you ever seen the fantasy dwarf models in person? The detail we are reffering to is not a sword. its a knife.

you may think I'm denying every point just to be annoying and/or Fanboyish. Thats simply not the truth. I'm pointing out inconsistencies in the logic of other posters statements, based and verified from what I know by having actually bought the parallel fantasy models.

And you don't have to make an international call. They have a contact web-form which I mentioned in my previous post.

I think they look pretty good (and Dwarves in Space is a niche that should have as many models made for it as possible! ) Hopefully there will be more various sculpts coming out, otherwise it will be pretty difficult to get motivated to make and paint so many of these guys.

However, I want to wait for a little bit and see how the orxs turn out, specifically the rifle varient which will hopefully look a bit less fantasy-ish.

lord marcus wrote:
They are Knives. Have you ever seen the fantasy dwarf models in person? The detail we are reffering to is not a sword. its a knife.

you may think I'm denying every point just to be annoying and/or Fanboyish. Thats simply not the truth. I'm pointing out inconsistencies in the logic of other posters statements, based and verified from what I know by having actually bought the parallel fantasy models.

And you don't have to make an international call. They have a contact web-form which I mentioned in my previous post.

I own the KoW boxed set. Ergo, I own the fantasy dwarves that this sprue is based on. If I were at home and not at work on lunch, I'd go get one to add "and I have one in my hand right now", but I'm familiar enough with the models that I feel quite confident enough not to need to do that. Thanks. A bladed weapon the length of which is from your pelvis to your feet is a sword, not a knife or dagger. A shortsword at best. Ever heard of a gladius? Unless the Roman empire was created at the end of an army of knives, of course. If they were unsheathed and presented for battle by those same figures, I doubt you'd be defending this pointless point. As I said earlier, I have no issues with models in a game like this being issued with swords or shortswords. After all, I play 40k(!)

I actually can't be arsed with their contact webform at this point, but you have my permission to contact them on my behalf and present their shortcomings to them. I'm still posting here because (as a group) we're having a somewhat entertaining discussion.

*picks up ironwatch model and looks at it*

Looks like a knife to me, but oh well.

The chainmail on the legs is much more of a problem as far as the sci-fi conversion goes.

A Greatsword for a human is a Knife for a Giant.

Cyporiean wrote:A Greatsword for a human is a Knife for a Giant.

And a knife for a giant is a greatsword for a human.

It might be a "knife" for a human, but it is a Dwarf sword.

The dwarf's hand is almost as wide as the length of the "sword".

Even by dwarf standards, it's definitely a knife.

There are 2 different sizes of knife on the 2 legs anyway, one is knifey, the other is longer and could probably pass as a short sword.

Cyporiean wrote:A Greatsword for a human is a Knife for a Giant.

That's pretty much what I was getting at - thank you.

Cyporiean wrote:

Artwork that doesn't look like the miniatures?! How dare someone do that...

No, no... sorry, I didn't specify. The PICTURE on the box. The one that shows the actual Forge Father and Marauder miniatures.

As a reference, could people please:

- turn to page 115 of the Warhammer 40000 Rulebook (3rd edition)

- and read it, particuarly the box which read "[Feudal Worlds]",

- then tell me about the contradiction in many of the previous statements regarding to the Forge Father's "fantasy" appearance.

The Forge Fathers are Forge Fathers. They can be whatever Mantic wants them to be.

See, the thing is. I don't have a problem with the swords.

I don't have a problem with chainmail on some models (it's not the best choice for dwarves, but on Orks I'd say go for it).

I don't even have a major issue with Tabards or flat-top helms.

Just, you know, make the models good.

Someone just look up the rules for the gunners: Can they engage in close combat and are the stats the same as for fighting with a sword/hand weapon?

LunaHound wrote:Why do people find it entertaining to make fun of other company's miniature?

Some will argue that people are just jerks. And while that might be true in a larger sense, I don't think that's why people make fun of Mantic's miniatures. I can only speak for myself, really, but I like to use humor to counteract disappointment. I had really hoped that I'd like Mantic's squats. Seeing them now has left me incredibly disappointed, especially seeing that all Mantic did was recycle their lazy fantasy design with some lazily-designed scifi embellishments. So when I saw kenshin620's picture it turned my frown upside down.

scarletsquig wrote:
There are 2 different sizes of knife on the 2 legs anyway, one is knifey, the other is longer and could probably pass as a short sword.

Knifey-spooney?

scipio.au wrote:

lord marcus wrote:
They are Knives. Have you ever seen the fantasy dwarf models in person? The detail we are reffering to is not a sword. its a knife.

you may think I'm denying every point just to be annoying and/or Fanboyish. Thats simply not the truth. I'm pointing out inconsistencies in the logic of other posters statements, based and verified from what I know by having actually bought the parallel fantasy models.

And you don't have to make an international call. They have a contact web-form which I mentioned in my previous post.

I own the KoW boxed set. Ergo, I own the fantasy dwarves that this sprue is based on. If I were at home and not at work on lunch, I'd go get one to add "and I have one in my hand right now", but I'm familiar enough with the models that I feel quite confident enough not to need to do that. Thanks. A bladed weapon the length of which is from your pelvis to your feet is a sword, not a knife or dagger. A shortsword at best. Ever heard of a gladius? Unless the Roman empire was created at the end of an army of knives, of course. If they were unsheathed and presented for battle by those same figures, I doubt you'd be defending this pointless point. As I said earlier, I have no issues with models in a game like this being issued with swords or shortswords. After all, I play 40k(!)

I actually can't be arsed with their contact webform at this point, but you have my permission to contact them on my behalf and present their shortcomings to them. I'm still posting here because (as a group) we're having a somewhat entertaining discussion.

You forget these are dwarves. And the fact that you ackowledge that there is a way to contact them about shortcomings you percieve yet are lazy enough to write them out upon a web forum where no one really gives a damn instead of copy/pasting to a web-form is illogical and ludicrous.

lord marcus wrote:
You forget these are dwarves. And the fact that you ackowledge that there is a way to contact them about shortcomings you percieve yet are lazy enough to write them out upon a web forum where no one really gives a damn instead of copy/pasting to a web-form is illogical and ludicrous.

Why do you take it so personally? It is not like Mantic is going to pull the product and re-engineer the model now due to people's feedback. Maybe if they would have released images beforehand but it sounds like they clearly don't care if people dislike the models. You really think if people post these criticisms on this 'web forum where no one really gives a damn' on Mantic's feedback site we will get the ORX and Forefather models pulled and new ones with fresh sculpts and pure scifi model sculpts?


People post comments and opinions on EVERY MODEL released by every company and many are much worse than anything posted in this thread. If complaints about 'swords' and looking like lazy fantasy in space designs is the worst Mantic has to weather, they should count themselves lucky. I remember last week where people called a gunner model for another company babies sitting on a toilet.

Image removed. There's better ways to make your point. Kudos on the effort though.
reds8n

The Dwarf Wolf wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

The Dwarf Wolf wrote:

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CT GAMER wrote:

Baragash wrote:http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2011/10/exclusive-painted-warpath-forgefather.html



Much, much better colour scheme.

WOW CT, they look exactly the same guy... Mantic is probably stealing that ideia too, you know, gunslingers shooting with 2 guns are a very orginal ideia. Yeha, Mantic now is stealing IP from PP too. At least now they are not a "GW copy" anymore...

Maybe take a deep breathe?

It was a simple observation that both have the same tailor. Blue/brass/brown in the same locations, both with two guns, etc.

it was an observation that I found amusing. Nothign was implied, so maybe relax just a tad?

Toy Soldiers are s3rious buisn3ss111

Sorry CT, i was joking there too... i just forgot the " " in the end.

I understood your observation, and it was a joke with it. Reading it now i can see how "rant" it looked at the end. lol

Not intended

(edited some spelling issues)

No worries.

lord marcus wrote:
You forget these are dwarves. And the fact that you ackowledge that there is a way to contact them about shortcomings you percieve yet are lazy enough to write them out upon a web forum where no one really gives a damn instead of copy/pasting to a web-form is illogical and ludicrous.

No, I don't "forget these are dwarves". Though it's interesting that you feel that a blade that length is a knife and not a sword or shortsword in Mantic's case. Even scarletsquig has conceded that some of them look like swords. We might have to agree to disagree on that one.

You've actually hit on the reason I don't bother with their webform - I don't think they'll really give a damn. Their figures are (almost) out and done. Not one iota of my opinion will make a difference at this stage. As I said, discussing it (and other topics) here at least provides for some entertainment - that's why I post on Dakka or any forum, after all.

Should I ring up GW and complain about Finecast? Should I ring them and complain that they released Dreadfleet which I have no interest in and tel them I would have preferred WHQ? I think not. Sales (or lack therof) will provide them with enough information.

It may not make a damn slight of difference for this release. But there is always the possibility of a re-release featuring new sculpts. In addition, Ronnie stated in a blog post that there are new leg bits coming.

As i said before, The Mantic fanatics (while a group of fans interested in Mantic products) have a diverse range of opinions on the separate products Mantic creates and are not apologists who "carry water" or try to "sweep things under the rug".