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Are those pinheads actually getting released to the wild? Ouch.

The rest of their bodies look so nice! It's sad that these miniscule heads managed to sneak past QC at some point.

I was tempted to make some hooded Diablo style angels as it was.

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:

I was tempted to make some hooded Diablo style angels as it was.

Would the spare hooded-yet-unhelmeted heads from the DA upgrade sprues work?

Is it a good sign when you have to start buying GW products to FIX your cheap alternative model manufacturer models?

Mantic can't ride the "we took your money via KS suckers" business model if they continue to put out crap sculpts like they are doing. They are barley batting .500 with quality sculpts.

Scibor sells helmeted 'knight' heads with open face plates that look pretty good.

I was definitely disappointed that I didn't get in on this when the initial greens came out, I've definitely recovered from that now. Those paladins on Remy's blog aren't looking so hot either.

nkelsch wrote:
Is it a good sign when you have to start buying GW products to FIX your cheap alternative model manufacturer models?

I'm kinda in agreement here. What's the point of Mantic putting out minis on the cheap if, in order to look presentable, nearly every kit you have to buy replacement parts from other manufacturers to replace the "bad" parts from the Mantic kits.

After that considerable expense (not to mention all the extra time spent) you might as well buy the expensive kits in the first place.

Huh, I didn't think the heads they come with look that bad. Though, I'd rather have helmets for them. They don't come with any, do they? I bet they'd look pretty cool with Maxmini's not-Custodes helmets.

I actually rather like the Paladins, too. They're one of the few new KOW minis I'm looking forward to buying.

Schmapdi wrote:

nkelsch wrote:
Is it a good sign when you have to start buying GW products to FIX your cheap alternative model manufacturer models?

I'm kinda in agreement here. What's the point of Mantic putting out minis on the cheap if, in order to look presentable, nearly every kit you have to buy replacement parts from other manufacturers to replace the "bad" parts from the Mantic kits.

After that considerable expense (not to mention all the extra time spent) you might as well buy the expensive kits in the first place.

To be fair, the only fix I've had to make is the angel head. Everything else I've left as it is, because I like them. I even like the trolls with her tiny legs. It's just a different aesthetic, and while not everybody enjoys it, plenty of us do. Again only the angel had needed fixing in my eyes. And I will still Use the heads, just for different models where they fit to scale. They won't go to waste. In the car, so I had to text talk in order to send that. If there are mistakes I will correct it later.

My friend got his KS goodies and I got to see 'em last night (I'm still waiting on my two pledges).

I gotta admit... everything looks really good. Much better in person. The Abyssal Golems are absolutely badass, as are the Immortal Guard. The fleabag riders look amazing, even the werewolves and mummies look better. I am very disappointed in the dwarf brock riders - there's only a single dwarf body (with lots of heads and arms... but still. one body?). Ogres are amazing. Still not a fan of the trolls but in person they are definitely better than I thought. The palace guard are better than the original metals, as they have extra weapon options.

Basically, every model you've seen preview pics of... think about it in your mind, and then reduce the size in your brain by half. That's how big they are.

The Angel heads are very tiny; my brother had the idea to use leftover plastic greek plumed helmeted heads from greek hoplite plastic kits. Since the angels are true-scale, using ANY 28mm figure head will look right on it.

The Angel head's aren't that small. Whilst I like the vast majority of the sculpts Mantic have done from this KS I can't quite tell if most of these OMFG THOSE HEADS ARE B####Y TINY posts are series or just trolling.

^ Agreed, I don't see any problem with them at all.

Also, new pic of the ogre command group, we haven't seen the standard bearer or champion before. Lovely models, IMO... I like them more than the GW ogres.

This is what happens when a Mantic army gets 100% Remy Tremblay sculpts. If only he'd been able to do all of the Basileans as well. ;_;



As for replacing parts like the ogre arms, it isn't so much about "fixing" a bad sculpt (as you can plainly see, they're fine as they are), but rather as a means of kitbashing to get more variety into the models.

Using the GW orc arms to create "savage" ogres to cover the Ogre Berserker entry in the KoW Ogre army list is definitely a good example of the kind of thing that KoW players have been doing for ages.

It's more a case of people who buy Mantic being more willing to use any mini or bit from any company they want to get the result they want, whereas a lot of GW-only players will stress out over "not tourney legal", so buying third-party isn't as common.

I've seen a forgefather army with space wolf bits, toy sci-fi flyers, parts from all sorts of different places, and some rogue trader exo squats thrown in for good measure. Looked brilliant.

 judgedoug wrote:
My friend got his KS goodies and I got to see 'em last night (I'm still waiting on my two pledges).

I gotta admit... everything looks really good. Much better in person. The Abyssal Golems are absolutely badass, as are the Immortal Guard. The fleabag riders look amazing, even the werewolves and mummies look better. I am very disappointed in the dwarf brock riders - there's only a single dwarf body (with lots of heads and arms... but still. one body?). Ogres are amazing. Still not a fan of the trolls but in person they are definitely better than I thought. The palace guard are better than the original metals, as they have extra weapon options.

Hmm, you're talking about models that weren't in my package - any definitive list anywhere of what should have been in the "$225 pledge June 2013" pack?

 Slinky wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:
My friend got his KS goodies and I got to see 'em last night (I'm still waiting on my two pledges).

I gotta admit... everything looks really good. Much better in person. The Abyssal Golems are absolutely badass, as are the Immortal Guard. The fleabag riders look amazing, even the werewolves and mummies look better. I am very disappointed in the dwarf brock riders - there's only a single dwarf body (with lots of heads and arms... but still. one body?). Ogres are amazing. Still not a fan of the trolls but in person they are definitely better than I thought. The palace guard are better than the original metals, as they have extra weapon options.

Hmm, you're talking about models that weren't in my package - any definitive list anywhere of what should have been in the "$225 pledge June 2013" pack?

Ogre Hero
Vampiress
Skeleton Dog Handler
Skeleton Standard Bearer mounted
3 Ogres (you picked either melee or shooter in your survey)
3 Werewolves
5 Mummies
5 Palace Guard
3 Abyssal Golems
1 Chariot w 3 plastic crew
1 Mincer
10 Fleabag riders (doubled from 5 for free due to delay)
10 Brock riders (doubled from 5 for free due to delay)
3 Angel paladin elohi dudes
3 Trolls
PAID Immortal Guard
PAID Gargoyles

Delayed til August 2013:
the rest of the free heroes
FREE 5 Immortal Guard
FREE 5 gargoyles
all the other Basileans
5 Elf Cavalry
5 Twilight Kin Cavalry

Excellent, thanks very much!

I see what has happened, I have 20 fleabags instead of 10 fleabags and 10 brock riders.

Since the fleabags are useful to my friend who plays Orcs, I am not bothered.

Vampiress isn't actually one of those included. I think the old thread for this had a full list. But here's what I've written down myself as a reminder list -

Pledge level/reward
$35+ - Upgraded Mantic Splatdice
$50+ - Electronic copy of novel
$100+
- 1 x Undead skeletal dog handler
- 1 x Ogre hero
- 1 x Basilean Human Paladin
- 1 x Basilean Men at Arms
- 1 x Basilean Angel Paladin
- 1 x Basilean Battle Sister
- 1 x Elf Palace Guard
- 1 x Dwarf Brock Rider
- 1 x Gargoyle
- 1 x Mummy
- 1 x Troll
- 1 x Orc chariot/Fight wagon

$175+
- 5 x Basilean Mounted Knights
- 3 x Abyssal Golems
- 5 x Basilean Human Paladins
- 3 x Basilean Angels
- 5 x Basilean Battle Sisters
- 5 x Basilean Men-at-Arms
- 5 x Elf Cavalry or Twilight Knights
- 5 x Immortal Guard
- 10 x Fleabag Riders
- 10 x Brock Riders
- 3 x Trolls
- 5 x Palace Guard
- 5 x Mummies
- 5 x Gargoyles
- 1 x Limited edition Undead Standard Bearer

$225 (in addition to the $175+ level, excepting elf knights/twilight knights)
- 5 x Basilean Cat Cavalry
- 1 x Goblin Mincer
- 3 x Werewolves
- 3 x Ogres of your choice
- 5 x Elf Cavalry AND Twilight Knights
- 1 x All of the following heroes
- J'zik Gearlund, Dwarf Healer
- El'Rik Nisleen, Elf Mage Hero
- Atlak Nakh, Twilight Kin Hero
- Mikayel, Lord of Nightmares
- Basilean Angel Hero Julius
- Basilean Angel Hero Samacris
- Basilean Lord on Lion
- Druid Hero
- Air Elemental Hero

If anyone has any others to add, let us all know.

 scarletsquig wrote:

This is what happens when a Mantic army gets 100% Remy Tremblay sculpts. If only he'd been able to do all of the Basileans as well. ;_;

I reckon they ought to chain the guy down and fire all their other sculptors. I don't mean to be nasty, but those basilean sisters are a bit tragic... as are a lot of mantic's other sculpts :S *cough* trolls.

 Skarwael wrote:

 scarletsquig wrote:

This is what happens when a Mantic army gets 100% Remy Tremblay sculpts. If only he'd been able to do all of the Basileans as well. ;_;

I reckon they ought to chain the guy down and fire all their other sculptors. I don't mean to be nasty, but those basilean sisters are a bit tragic... as are a lot of mantic's other sculpts :S *cough* trolls.

I agree that the aesthetic decisions on the trolls were...odd. However, they are not technically bad sculpts. I feel like we need to start making a distinction about that as a group. The Trolls are bad designs, not bad sculpts.

Some of the others are indeed bad sculpts however, and that is one reason that the distinction needs to be made. Also, if we keep consistent with the distinction, maybe Mantic will have better information/feedback.

~Eric

I really like the trolls though I can see why some might not, so they are a question of style rather than quality (he's also done a troll for PP)

(By Gregory Clavilier for those who are interested http://greg-sculpteur.blogspot.co.uk/)

but I agree the arms on the sisters are just not well done and a bit of art direction would not have gone amiss here

 Taarnak wrote:

 Skarwael wrote:

 scarletsquig wrote:

This is what happens when a Mantic army gets 100% Remy Tremblay sculpts. If only he'd been able to do all of the Basileans as well. ;_;

I reckon they ought to chain the guy down and fire all their other sculptors. I don't mean to be nasty, but those basilean sisters are a bit tragic... as are a lot of mantic's other sculpts :S *cough* trolls.

I agree that the aesthetic decisions on the trolls were...odd. However, they are not technically bad sculpts. I feel like we need to start making a distinction about that as a group. The Trolls are bad designs, not bad sculpts.

Yeah, sorry, I haven't been following this thread from the beginning or the kickstarter so I didn't see the concept art for them till now. It was indeed bad. I still feel that the sculptor could've made them look better by making them a bit less cartoony looking, but meh...

 Skarwael wrote:

 scarletsquig wrote:

This is what happens when a Mantic army gets 100% Remy Tremblay sculpts. If only he'd been able to do all of the Basileans as well. ;_;

I reckon they ought to chain the guy down and fire all their other sculptors. I don't mean to be nasty, but those basilean sisters are a bit tragic... as are a lot of mantic's other sculpts :S *cough* trolls.

I disagree with this completely. I think the trolls look great, and have no problem with the tiny legs. It's the style Mantic chose to go with, and some fantasy books do actually show trolls having tiny legs. They run around with their arms like gorillas. They chose not to go the tried-and-true fantasy look, they went with their own thing. It's not that bad, it's just different. I realize it's not the design for everybody, but I like it.

Ironically, my phone decided to type "their own way" as "the wrong way". Make of that what you will. LOL

 Fenriswulf wrote:
Vampiress isn't actually one of those included.

There was definitely a Vampiress in my friend's $225 pledge package I looked at yesterday.

He likely got it through one of the army deals or similar, as it's not an auto-include in the $225 level for the free stuff. I was going to get it, but after seeing the sculpt, I am glad I didn't.

 judgedoug wrote:


Basically, every model you've seen preview pics of... think about it in your mind, and then reduce the size in your brain by half. That's how big they are.

That's what happens to me every time I buy anything from a new company/product line. For example I just picked up my first Warmachine mini, a light warjack, and was surprised by how tiny it was. I've been in the hobby for years - and I'm still constantly amazed by small everything is.

 Fenriswulf wrote:
He likely got it through one of the army deals or similar, as it's not an auto-include in the $225 level for the free stuff. I was going to get it, but after seeing the sculpt, I am glad I didn't.

It is an auto-include for pledges of $100+ listed in the pledge levels

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1744629938/kings-of-war

I'm not sure how this worked out, but here is what I pledged and got. I pledged at Standard Barer or $75.00. I upped my pledge for single armies to the $225.00 level to get all the free units. I did not get the electronic early release of the rule book, I assume because I did not pledge $100.00. However I just got what is described on the packing list as "$225 freebie bundle" and it had the Vampire from the front cover. Make what you will of it.

 scarletsquig wrote:
Also, new pic of the ogre command group, we haven't seen the standard bearer or champion before. Lovely models, IMO... I like them more than the GW ogres.

This is what happens when a Mantic army gets 100% Remy Tremblay sculpts. If only he'd been able to do all of the Basileans as well. ;_;

Well, dang. I like those ogres more and more with every sculpt I see of them. A well executed range!

I'll likely be in the market to buy some more golems, by the way, if anyone wants to part with theirs from their order (preferably a larger group of them than 3 due to shipping, but I'm open to just 3 as well)

RITides, the ogres are fantastic. I kinda wish I got command parts, but I can always do it later. And I apologize that I only had 3 golems to give you.

Speaking of sending stuff...anybody need the goblin mincer thingie from the $175 pledge reward group? I don't need mine and would be willing to part with it-perhaps somebody has a group of trolls they don't want? I'll also be willing to toss my Infernal Guard when they come in too. RITides, would you be willing to start a Mantic KS trade thread in your dungeon? I mean, uh, area of influence here. You're less likely to lock your own thread than if one of us started a mass thread on it.

Heh . Well, that deserves some discussion... I feel that a Mantic-specific mass thread for trading might do better in the Mantic subforum. Let me ask the other swapmods and get back to you...

I got my box last night! I haven't had time to go over everything in detail, but I'm pretty happy at first glance. One thing stands out though: a hand-written note saying that metal parts will come in the next shipment, with an apology for the delay. That, I thought, was a nice personal touch, and is one of the reasons that I will continue giving money to Mantic.

 scarletsquig wrote:
^ Agreed, I don't see any problem with them at all.

Also, new pic of the ogre command group, we haven't seen the standard bearer or champion before. Lovely models, IMO... I like them more than the GW ogres.

This is what happens when a Mantic army gets 100% Remy Tremblay sculpts. If only he'd been able to do all of the Basileans as well. ;_;



As for replacing parts like the ogre arms, it isn't so much about "fixing" a bad sculpt (as you can plainly see, they're fine as they are), but rather as a means of kitbashing to get more variety into the models.

Using the GW orc arms to create "savage" ogres to cover the Ogre Berserker entry in the KoW Ogre army list is definitely a good example of the kind of thing that KoW players have been doing for ages.

It's more a case of people who buy Mantic being more willing to use any mini or bit from any company they want to get the result they want, whereas a lot of GW-only players will stress out over "not tourney legal", so buying third-party isn't as common.

I've seen a forgefather army with space wolf bits, toy sci-fi flyers, parts from all sorts of different places, and some rogue trader exo squats thrown in for good measure. Looked brilliant.

I gotta say, the Ogres almost make up for the Basileans. They really should have Remy Tremblay placed as head of their sculpting team. Whoever is doing that job now needs to be sacked...

~Tim?

 scarletsquig wrote:
This is what happens when a Mantic army gets 100% Remy Tremblay sculpts. If only he'd been able to do all of the Basileans as well. ;_;

Yes. Tiny legged ogres that are pee dancing. They got it 100% right if that's what they were going for.