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So you can take Grot Riggers on a Battlewagon?

Nope, infact the only Boss Nob who has access to anything beyond Melee weapon list is the Boyz Nob. he gets access to Ranged Weapon list.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Eldarain wrote:
So you can take Grot Riggers on a Battlewagon?

Yup, most vehicles have them listed as options in the unit entry, battlewagon says can make purchases from vehicle upgrade list, of which the riggers are part.

 jhnbrg wrote:


You get people to agree with that? seems a bit cheesy.

it's only cheesy if another army uses it against me but I don't see it any worse than those who play maledictions as stacking.

speaking of cheese and stacking, how are the waaagh banners worded?

They dont combine with the Lukky Stixx,

All models in a unit that includes a Waaagh! Banner add +1 to the Weapon Skill characteristic on their profile.

 TedNugent wrote:

 Multimoog wrote:
Footslogging 30 boy mobz with a KFF seems like a MUCH more sound option now

Why's that, because the KFF got nerfed to MODELS within 6 inches? How many individual boyz are you going to be able to fit within that KFF radius?

You also do realize that a 30 man squad has a leadership of 8, and if you fail that leadership test and roll a 1 that entire mob can run off the board on either a pinning or a morale check?

Do you also realize that shoota boyz now cost 7 points a model? That unit now costs 30 points more than it used to, and it is NOT fearless, and it does NOT get full coverage of the KFF. Only individual models within 6 inches do, and I'm not sure what percentage of a 30 man mob that would even be.

If you position the KFF Mek in the middle towards the front of the mob you can cover the front line of the mob which are the ones taking the wounds and as you take model loses let the advancing mob of boyz move past the mek so hes not stuck in the very front. Or you can just stick a painboy on the 30 boyz squad for that delicious FNP. Personally i think KFF are going to be better served in expensive units like gitz, nobz, burnas, tankbustas, bikers, etc while the typical foot slogging boyz would rather have the painboy. I expect to see biker KFF meks (with a few biker boyz for wound sponging) riding in between two battlewagons to be the new way to go. With a boss pole you can reroll that 1 so you basically need to get double 1s to run away.

For the kanz panic rule. Is it ignored if a gork/Morkanaught is near them ? Or does it have to be a deff dredd ?

I run lots of kans, dredds and I hope to in corporate a Morkanaught to look after them

Specifically a Dred, odd though

Grimgor Skullbusta wrote:

 Gitzbitah wrote:
That doesn't make any sense- I always thought Orks did the shark toof style, and grew many, many sets over their lifetime. They'd lose any metal teef when the next set grew in. That was one of the reasons they used teef for currency. Every Ork had some, and it was a reasonably valuable trophy.

5-6 Steel Teef. The Doc has removed the
patient’s teef and replaced them with
steel ones (some Docs get very rich, very
quickly). Though the warrior is now
immune to the ‘Gobsmacked’ serious
injury, he suffers -1 Leadership as his
steel choppers just aren’t properly Orky.

Presumably the ork would eventually grow a new set of teef, but not within the scope/timescale of a Gorkamorka mob career.

Thanks, that clears it up nicely! Although why I'm concerned about the dental habits of living space fungus, I'll never know.

I just got an idea to convert a runtherd deff dredd with a dredd size grot prod lol.

Looks like a Morkanaught, 6 kans and a deff dredd will be my heavy supports of choice =)

Thanks Melcavuk:

Unit size for Kommandos, Tankbustas, Nobz and MegaNobz?

Unit size for Grots? (10-30)?

Can Dreadnoughts still pay for extra DCCW for 15 pts up to four?

Do Painboys and Big Meks (HQs) have leadership 7 or leadership 8?

forgotten ghosts wrote:

 Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:
So from what i have read they have taken the old over powered units that were auto include and toned them down.
.
They took the lesser used units or underpowered ones and beefed them up.

Now the units are balanced to themselves. Which more of the book viable. Tournament players won't like this since now not one unit stands out as OP over the rest and no clear choice for the auto include death star unit.

And the death roller was op, to think other wise I feel is silly. D6 str 10 hits on spammed battle wagons. No Ned to roll to him just move through units.

Biker nobs, the KFF and the BW death roller spam needed the nerf bat. This is coming from an ork tourny player.

I saw the KFF nerf coming having effect the hole unit as long as one model was with in 6 was silly.

i agree with all of that. if this if the trend for the future of 40k i think it will be more fun than ever, every one was trashin 7th, i have enjoyed the new missions.

How OP exactly were Biker Nobs? A biker nob list hasnt been that competitve since six edition hit. They nerfed a lot of peoples favorite unit for no reason. Just because it was one of the strongest units in the codex is a gakky reason to nerf them.

 Gitzbitah wrote:

Grimgor Skullbusta wrote:

 Gitzbitah wrote:
That doesn't make any sense- I always thought Orks did the shark toof style, and grew many, many sets over their lifetime. They'd lose any metal teef when the next set grew in. That was one of the reasons they used teef for currency. Every Ork had some, and it was a reasonably valuable trophy.

5-6 Steel Teef. The Doc has removed the
patient’s teef and replaced them with
steel ones (some Docs get very rich, very
quickly). Though the warrior is now
immune to the ‘Gobsmacked’ serious
injury, he suffers -1 Leadership as his
steel choppers just aren’t properly Orky.

Presumably the ork would eventually grow a new set of teef, but not within the scope/timescale of a Gorkamorka mob career.

Thanks, that clears it up nicely! Although why I'm concerned about the dental habits of living space fungus, I'll never know.

Everyone should be concerned about the dental habits of living space fungus.

TableTopJosh wrote:

forgotten ghosts wrote:

 Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:
So from what i have read they have taken the old over powered units that were auto include and toned them down.
.
They took the lesser used units or underpowered ones and beefed them up.

Now the units are balanced to themselves. Which more of the book viable. Tournament players won't like this since now not one unit stands out as OP over the rest and no clear choice for the auto include death star unit.

And the death roller was op, to think other wise I feel is silly. D6 str 10 hits on spammed battle wagons. No Ned to roll to him just move through units.

Biker nobs, the KFF and the BW death roller spam needed the nerf bat. This is coming from an ork tourny player.

I saw the KFF nerf coming having effect the hole unit as long as one model was with in 6 was silly.

i agree with all of that. if this if the trend for the future of 40k i think it will be more fun than ever, every one was trashin 7th, i have enjoyed the new missions.

How OP exactly were Biker Nobs? A biker nob list hasnt been that competitve since six edition hit. They nerfed a lot of peoples favorite unit for no reason. Just because it was one of the strongest units in the codex is a gakky reason to nerf them.

It was obviously one of the strongest units, which is my point. Certain units stood out as stronger than the rest. Now until we actually get to play the dex, we can't say "x" unit is strong now, since they all seem viable.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Biker nobs were an elite T5, W2, 4+cover, 5++ and 5+ fnp death star unit able to be taken as a troop choice. The nerf was coming. Oh and they move 12" and have twin liked S5 guns.

Just wondering Mel if you noticed any new models in the codex we have yet to see?

I recall there where strong rumours of a new Warboss with Squig.

BooBoo wrote:Thanks Melcavuk:

Unit size for Kommandos, Tankbustas, Nobz and MegaNobz?

Unit size for Grots? (10-30)?

Can Dreadnoughts still pay for extra DCCW for 15 pts up to four?

5-15, 5-15, 3-10, 3-10

10-30

Yes

TedNugent wrote:Do Painboys and Big Meks (HQs) have leadership 7 or leadership 8?

Painboy 7, Bike Mek 8





Automatically Appended Next Post:

 steve1 wrote:
Just wondering Mel if you noticed any new models in the codex we have yet to see?

I recall there where strong rumours of a new Warboss with Squig.

Other than the mega nobz and teleporta Mek nope sorry, the warboss shown on his page is this guy:
http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Ork-Warboss-with-Attack-Squig

Hell the Deff kopta picture is the old metal model

 Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:

TableTopJosh wrote:

forgotten ghosts wrote:

 Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:
So from what i have read they have taken the old over powered units that were auto include and toned them down.
.
They took the lesser used units or underpowered ones and beefed them up.
Now the units are balanced to themselves. Which more of the book viable. Tournament players won't like this since now not one unit stands out as OP over the rest and no clear choice for the auto include death star unit.
And the death roller was op, to think other wise I feel is silly. D6 str 10 hits on spammed battle wagons. No Ned to roll to him just move through units.
Biker nobs, the KFF and the BW death roller spam needed the nerf bat. This is coming from an ork tourny player.
I saw the KFF nerf coming having effect the hole unit as long as one model was with in 6 was silly.

i agree with all of that. if this if the trend for the future of 40k i think it will be more fun than ever, every one was trashin 7th, i have enjoyed the new missions.

How OP exactly were Biker Nobs? A biker nob list hasnt been that competitve since six edition hit. They nerfed a lot of peoples favorite unit for no reason. Just because it was one of the strongest units in the codex is a gakky reason to nerf them.

It was obviously one of the strongest units, which is my point. Certain units stood out as stronger than the rest. Now until we actually get to play the dex, we can't say "x" unit is strong now, since they all seem viable.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Biker nobs were an elite T5, W2, 4+cover, 5++ and 5+ fnp death star unit able to be taken as a troop choice. The nerf was coming. Oh and they move 12" and have twin liked S5 guns.

We need to talk.

The deff rolla was one of two viable options we had for dealing with AV14, along with a PK equipped warboss. Both of these required you get them to their intended target. As to using them on targets other than, everyone got armor saves. Those with poor armor saves had weight of numbers vs the single d6.
It was in no way whatsoever 'broken', it also cost a lot of points.

The codex was what, 6 years old, older? In that time, many other codices have been done, the 'power' has crept up considerably. So when you take our best and make it worse and worst and bring it to the downgraded 'best', you end up with a lower mean capability on a codex that was already totally outgunned. You end up with an antiquated beige army that can't match the more recent codices it will be facing.

It required no nerfing, no downgrading, it was already showing its age more than a bit. Readjusting balance in a book a couple of years old is one thing, taking something this old and upping point costs and reducing capabilities was ridiculous. We should have seen boosts, inclusion and capability, instead we saw a very old book slightly adjusted, overfilled in slots and generally made less effective.

With the removal of the ability to make certain units troops we've lost options, not gained them. We didn't need our units 'balanced to themselves', we needed our army balanced to the rest of the armies.

So my call a long time ago of the book getting a points reshuffling, stuff deleted, characters deleted, and overall making the book incredibly vanilla to pave the way for "extra toppings" DLC of content that used to be in the codex was correct?

The trend continues.

Cyba Ork bodies are gone completely?

 TheKbob wrote:
So my call a long time ago of the book getting a points reshuffling, stuff deleted, characters deleted, and overall making the book incredibly vanilla to pave the way for "extra toppings" DLC of content that used to be in the codex was correct?

The trend continues.

Cyba Ork bodies are gone completely?

Available on characters, now a 6+ FNP not invul

 TheKbob wrote:


Cyba Ork bodies are gone completely?

For all serious purposes, yes, cybork is gone. It got downgraded to a 6+ FNP. God knows who is going to be using this gak.

We have no invuln saves in CC.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:

TableTopJosh wrote:

forgotten ghosts wrote:

 Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:
So from what i have read they have taken the old over powered units that were auto include and toned them down.
.
They took the lesser used units or underpowered ones and beefed them up.
Now the units are balanced to themselves. Which more of the book viable. Tournament players won't like this since now not one unit stands out as OP over the rest and no clear choice for the auto include death star unit.
And the death roller was op, to think other wise I feel is silly. D6 str 10 hits on spammed battle wagons. No Ned to roll to him just move through units.
Biker nobs, the KFF and the BW death roller spam needed the nerf bat. This is coming from an ork tourny player.
I saw the KFF nerf coming having effect the hole unit as long as one model was with in 6 was silly.

i agree with all of that. if this if the trend for the future of 40k i think it will be more fun than ever, every one was trashin 7th, i have enjoyed the new missions.

How OP exactly were Biker Nobs? A biker nob list hasnt been that competitve since six edition hit. They nerfed a lot of peoples favorite unit for no reason. Just because it was one of the strongest units in the codex is a gakky reason to nerf them.

It was obviously one of the strongest units, which is my point. Certain units stood out as stronger than the rest. Now until we actually get to play the dex, we can't say "x" unit is strong now, since they all seem viable.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Biker nobs were an elite T5, W2, 4+cover, 5++ and 5+ fnp death star unit able to be taken as a troop choice. The nerf was coming. Oh and they move 12" and have twin liked S5 guns.

We need to talk.

The deff rolla was one of two viable options we had for dealing with AV14, along with a PK equipped warboss. Both of these required you get them to their intended target. As to using them on targets other than, everyone got armor saves. Those with poor armor saves had weight of numbers vs the single d6.
It was in no way whatsoever 'broken', it also cost a lot of points.

The codex was what, 6 years old, older? In that time, many other codices have been done, the 'power' has crept up considerably. So when you take our best and make it worse and worst and bring it to the downgraded 'best', you end up with a lower mean capability on a codex that was already totally outgunned. You end up with an antiquated beige army that can't match the more recent codices it will be facing.

It required no nerfing, no downgrading, it was already showing its age more than a bit. Readjusting balance in a book a couple of years old is one thing, taking something this old and upping point costs and reducing capabilities was ridiculous. We should have seen boosts, inclusion and capability, instead we saw a very old book slightly adjusted, overfilled in slots and generally made less effective.

With the removal of the ability to make certain units troops we've lost options, not gained them. We didn't need our units 'balanced to themselves', we needed our army balanced to the rest of the armies.

Don't worry, GW has thought ahead about this problem! You will have access once again to nob troops and deff dread/kan troops as soon as they decide how much to charge you for the dataslate.

Is there any confirmation on what a Waagh! does? Im hearing run and assault in the same turn.

Melcavuk wrote:
Available on characters, now a 6+ FNP not invul

TedNugent wrote:

For all serious purposes, yes, cybork is gone. It got downgraded to a 6+ FNP. God knows who is going to be using this gak.

We have no invuln saves in CC.

7th edition is focused on controlling objectives.

I was planning to change my biker deathstar into an small & cheap unit of nobz bikers (with painboy for + survivability), that will turboboost here and there all over the board to collect VP each turn for me.
Now the new codex gives me +3 cover /4+ armour/5+ FNP ? Suits me very well.
Same for the stormboyz. 2D6 run ? they can reach an objective like nobody now.

The changes on bikers and even stormboys look like nerf, but maybe that because we still want to play them like we did in previous editions.

I am pretty sure we will discover plenty of new tactics with our new codex - so don't sell your army yet... ;p

 Melcavuk wrote:
My mistake, 10 points for riggers on Battlewagon, in my opinion worth it.

Oh hell yea. Grot riggers on anything that isnt a Buggy is damn worth it (be surprised if a buggy survived an attack anyway since its AV10 2hp)

Stormboyz are no faster than before. Before they were 12 + D6" in the movement, and could run normally. Now theyre 12" move and 2D6" run with the entire unit taking a Dangerous Terrain test in the process....which is a HUGE nerf as that will remove far more boyz than the old rules ever did.
I will probably still find a use for them, since i love the models and 12" powerklaw is nothing to sneeze at. Just gotta be weary howi move them.

Melcavuk you are a god!! Thank you so much for putting in the time to chat with us.

I have 2 questions.

1. Could you detail the formation in the book?

2. Are nobz and meganobz different unit entries?

These damn Meks and the new Painboys are monopose and they don't have a Kustom Forcefield on the sprue.

50 points base for a Killa Kan with big shoota. That seems like a large price hike when before it was 35 points base with +5 for a big shoota. Other than the vehicle moral tomfoolery did anything else about the kanz change?

The normal (small) mek ^ cant take the big meks wargear, so why would he have a kff

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:

TableTopJosh wrote:

forgotten ghosts wrote:

 Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:
So from what i have read they have taken the old over powered units that were auto include and toned them down.
.
They took the lesser used units or underpowered ones and beefed them up.
Now the units are balanced to themselves. Which more of the book viable. Tournament players won't like this since now not one unit stands out as OP over the rest and no clear choice for the auto include death star unit.
And the death roller was op, to think other wise I feel is silly. D6 str 10 hits on spammed battle wagons. No Ned to roll to him just move through units.
Biker nobs, the KFF and the BW death roller spam needed the nerf bat. This is coming from an ork tourny player.
I saw the KFF nerf coming having effect the hole unit as long as one model was with in 6 was silly.

i agree with all of that. if this if the trend for the future of 40k i think it will be more fun than ever, every one was trashin 7th, i have enjoyed the new missions.

How OP exactly were Biker Nobs? A biker nob list hasnt been that competitve since six edition hit. They nerfed a lot of peoples favorite unit for no reason. Just because it was one of the strongest units in the codex is a gakky reason to nerf them.

It was obviously one of the strongest units, which is my point. Certain units stood out as stronger than the rest. Now until we actually get to play the dex, we can't say "x" unit is strong now, since they all seem viable.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Biker nobs were an elite T5, W2, 4+cover, 5++ and 5+ fnp death star unit able to be taken as a troop choice. The nerf was coming. Oh and they move 12" and have twin liked S5 guns.

We need to talk.

The deff rolla was one of two viable options we had for dealing with AV14, along with a PK equipped warboss. Both of these required you get them to their intended target. As to using them on targets other than, everyone got armor saves. Those with poor armor saves had weight of numbers vs the single d6.
It was in no way whatsoever 'broken', it also cost a lot of points.

The codex was what, 6 years old, older? In that time, many other codices have been done, the 'power' has crept up considerably. So when you take our best and make it worse and worst and bring it to the downgraded 'best', you end up with a lower mean capability on a codex that was already totally outgunned. You end up with an antiquated beige army that can't match the more recent codices it will be facing.

It required no nerfing, no downgrading, it was already showing its age more than a bit. Readjusting balance in a book a couple of years old is one thing, taking something this old and upping point costs and reducing capabilities was ridiculous. We should have seen boosts, inclusion and capability, instead we saw a very old book slightly adjusted, overfilled in slots and generally made less effective.

With the removal of the ability to make certain units troops we've lost options, not gained them. We didn't need our units 'balanced to themselves', we needed our army balanced to the rest of the armies.

Armor 14 is not that common we don't need a lot of ways to deal with Iit, and at least not spamable ways. I thinks orks ran more armor 14 than any one else with BW spam.