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Ahtman said it a little better, and had an action clip. But same-same.

Also, that stunt double looks like Chuck Connors.

 kronk wrote:
Dang she's cute. I'll over look the mom-shorts!

It was the '80s. Those were hot back then.


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chaos0xomega wrote:
..., and I find the second film to actually be an insult to The Wrath of Khan..

Strokes and folks, I guess. I enjoyed the second movie, and found the parralels to the Wrath of Khan amusing. Laughed like hell at the whole 'if you were here, you would have done the same' bit.

I loved Into Darkness too. Oh well, can't please everyone.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
I loved Into Darkness too. Oh well, can't please everyone.

I find it one of those movies I enjoy when I watch it, but if I think about it afterward it gets on my nerves. On Bluray 3D it looks amazing.

 Ahtman wrote:

 timetowaste85 wrote:
I loved Into Darkness too. Oh well, can't please everyone.

I find it one of those movies I enjoy when I watch it, but if I think about it afterward it gets on my nerves. On Bluray 3D it looks amazing.

Prometheus syndrome.

No..Prometheus got on my nerves while I was watching it

I'm also a fan of Into Darkness. But I also think that outside of Nemoy and Sulu the entire new cast is head and shoulders above the old cast. And even new Spock and new Sulu are on par with their predecessors.

Looking forward to seeing what he does with Star Wars. Especially since he's a fan.

 Medium of Death wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:

 timetowaste85 wrote:
I loved Into Darkness too. Oh well, can't please everyone.

I find it one of those movies I enjoy when I watch it, but if I think about it afterward it gets on my nerves. On Bluray 3D it looks amazing.

Prometheus syndrome.

It's Avatar Syndrome, because that has to be the poster child for that. The whole time I was watching it in IMAX 3d I was all "Whoa this is amazing!" I'd bet 99+% of people get so caught up in the visuals and everything that it is basically impossible to criticize whilst in the theater.

Then I got home and was talking about it with my buddy and we realized just how pandering, manipulative and two dimensional it was. Still looks amazing, though.

I have never seen an episode of Star Trek. I have never watched any of the movies, barring the Abrams ones. So I have no real frame of reference as to their faithfulness to anything.

I found the Abrams movies to be a little like a stripper: fun to watch, but vapid to the core. I also frequently found myself wondering how these kids from a CW show found themselves in charge of a military (?) ship.

 Seaward wrote:
I also frequently found myself wondering how these kids from a CW show found themselves in charge of a military (?) ship.

Starfleet isn't a military force, it's an exploratory science force. And the Enterprise is a science vessel with guns, not a warship.


Having said that, the cadets winding up in charge of the Federation's new flagship was a little contrived. Still fun, though... I didn't go into a Star Trek film expecting anything too deep.

 Bromsy wrote:

 Medium of Death wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:

 timetowaste85 wrote:
I loved Into Darkness too. Oh well, can't please everyone.

I find it one of those movies I enjoy when I watch it, but if I think about it afterward it gets on my nerves. On Bluray 3D it looks amazing.

Prometheus syndrome.

It's Avatar Syndrome, because that has to be the poster child for that. The whole time I was watching it in IMAX 3d I was all "Whoa this is amazing!" I'd bet 99+% of people get so caught up in the visuals and everything that it is basically impossible to criticize whilst in the theater.

Then I got home and was talking about it with my buddy and we realized just how pandering, manipulative and two dimensional it was. Still looks amazing, though.

I fell asleep during Avatar. It bored me to tears.

Original ST was an exploration vessel. However its forgotten the Enterprise was classed as a battle cruiser (at least by the klingons ). Everything about the movie Enterprise and other Fed ships screams heavy cruiser.

I just hope the older characters don't get too much screen time.

I can see Luke being the only one that would need it, seeing as he'll probably be serving as a Yoda equivalent.

 Ahtman wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
Never even heard of it.

Space Seed is the first meeting between Khan and the Enterprise, Wrath of Khan is the about the second meeting years later. Into Darkness was about the first meeting of Khan and the Enterprise. In Space Seed Khan tries to take over the Enterprise and kill most of the crew, in the second he is just out for revenge. As you can see here the stunt doubles also fought for the first time:

AH! Okay, now I know what you mean, I thought Space Seed was a separate show entirely lol. Okay that makes sense, I forgot this episode even existed...

True fact, Kirk (or his stuntmen) have never lost a fight one on one, with anyone or anything, including Vger.

 kronk wrote:
Max Von Sydow!

I loved him in Needful Things! Perfect Devil!

I dunno about perfect, but he certainly made a great one

chaos0xomega wrote:
I think you and I have different viewpoints on his Star Trek films then. They were great action films, I appreciate that he kept the original canon intact with his time paradox nonsense (which is something that I actually absolutely hate in general, same reason I dont watch Dr. Who) but they were terrible, terrible Star Trek films, and I find the second film to actually be an insult to The Wrath of Khan.

Here are my thoughts.

- I'm primarily an original series fan (DS9 had its moments). So I don't mind a more action-focused shoot-em-up. Certainly every OS episode wasn't that, but you saw the western influences everywhere in that series. In a lot of ways I think Abrams recaptured some of those roots. I don't want a ST OS reboot to have a TNG feel, if that makes sense.

- I don't think Into Darkness was a great movie by any stretch. But how many good ST films have there been? I figure II, III, IV, and First Contact are the leaders. IMO, Abrams' first effort is right in that mix. And is ID worse than I, V, VI, Generations, Insurrection or Nemesis? I know you're arguing something different -- that it wasn't a good TREK film -- but I wanted to share that thought anyway.

- I think the reactor scene showed a lack of respect for the older material. It was a dumb stunt. Otherwise, I think he kept a lot of elements intact even in the context of a significant reboot. Sure, he blew up Vulcan, but I put that more in the category of a story change than an awkward "wink, wink" stunt like the reactor. Abrams' penance should be to watch Tim Burton's Planet of the Apes film for 24 straight hours. After that, I'm willing to give him absolution.

- SW fanboy that he is, I think he'll easily avoid any reactor-scene equivalents or majorly sour notes. Besides, Kasdan's on board and Lucas isn't. Personally, I think SW is in excellent hands. You're obviously allowed to feel differently, but I still think you should be optimistic.



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 Medium of Death wrote:
I just hope the older characters don't get too much screen time.

I can see Luke being the only one that would need it, seeing as he'll probably be serving as a Yoda equivalent.

IIRC, the rumor was that in the original draft, Luke, Leia and Han were minor characters. In this new draft, they're more prominent, because Abrams wants to give those characters a proper curtain call before the focus shifts to the younger cast members in future installments.

Personally, I like the notion. We'll see about the execution.

IIRC, the rumor was that in the original draft, Luke, Leia and Han were minor characters. In this new draft, they're more prominent, because Abrams wants to give those characters a proper curtain call before the focus shifts to the younger cast members in future installments.

That works for me in a big way. As long as no one s with the fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy!

In a lot of ways I think Abrams recaptured some of those roots. I don't want a ST OS reboot to have a TNG feel, if that makes sense.

Something people are too busy mocking lens flare and contrived special effects sequences to really give the man due credit for.

I Like Captain Picard the best of the captains, but the movies were constantly throwing Patrick Stewart into the role of an action hero, and that just doesn't fly when you look as brittle as Patrick Stewart. Sisko doesn't do fist fights. He just stares you down till you surrender or he fires a full spread of torpedos because you're wasting his time. We don't talk about Janeway.

Abrams put the adventure back in Star Trek. People could at least give him some credit for that.

 LordofHats wrote:
Sisko doesn't do fist fights.

Q begs to differ.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 LordofHats wrote:
Sisko doesn't do fist fights.

Q begs to differ.

The Sisko has no fists. Just two quantum torpedos with fingers

 LordofHats wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

 LordofHats wrote:
Sisko doesn't do fist fights.

Q begs to differ.

The Sisko has no fists. Just two quantum torpedos with fingers

HAWT.

You've got me all scaroused.

 Frazzled wrote:

IIRC, the rumor was that in the original draft, Luke, Leia and Han were minor characters. In this new draft, they're more prominent, because Abrams wants to give those characters a proper curtain call before the focus shifts to the younger cast members in future installments.

That works for me in a big way. As long as no one s with the fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy!

You leave Alph's mom out of this!

I want Han Solo to go all grumpy old man on someone trying to steal the Falcon

 Grey Templar wrote:
I want Han Solo to go all grumpy old man on someone trying to steal the Falcon

Nah, they're gonna have a touchy-feely scene where he reluctantly gives it to his son to carry on his legacy and then they hug for the first time since he was a child. Leia looks on tearfully.

My observation on the Abrams Star Trek films is that the first one was reasonable if you can get around a couple of glaring plot holes (mostly to do with the sheer improbability of certain events as portrayed in the film and the absurdity of some of the technological changes the plot hinges on), and Into Darkness was (for the most part) a compilation of thirty-second clips of all ten pre-Abrams films with updated CGI arranged in a somewhat nonsensical manner with a meandering plot. My largest objection to Abrams' work is he seems completely and totally averse to actually creating new content in favour of taking older scripts, swapping a name or two, using shinier visuals, and calling it a "reboot"; I've got some confidence that if he actually goes and moves the story forward the new movies aren't going to be bad but if he takes the "let's do the original movies with new actors and destroy half the drama by offering quick and easy solutions to seriously challenging problems!" approach again I'm going to be fairly disappointed.

You forgot the fact that Star Trek NEVER should have been made into an action movie. Its space opera, and every fight has the elegance of a barroom brawl.

Am I to understand there will be no Lando?

 insaniak wrote:

 Seaward wrote:
I also frequently found myself wondering how these kids from a CW show found themselves in charge of a military (?) ship.

Starfleet isn't a military force, it's an exploratory science force. And the Enterprise is a science vessel with guns, not a warship.


Having said that, the cadets winding up in charge of the Federation's new flagship was a little contrived. Still fun, though... I didn't go into a Star Trek film expecting anything too deep.

Starfleet is a military force though. Their primary role is exploration and science, but they do double duty as Earth's primary space-based military/defense force. I would class them as a multi-role force with a focus on exploration and science, but isn't really true to say they're not a military force. If they're not a military force, then Earth has no military force, which certainly is not true.


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P.S. - Sisko is the best captain.

 Hordini wrote:
If they're not a military force, then Earth has no military force, which certainly is not true.

Earth has no military force. Roddenberry meant for that specifically to be true. He wrote the Federation to be a utopian society : post-scarcity with no need for a military. In the original, the fleet purely exists in an exploratory, scientific function.

More accurately it should be said(thanks to DS9 and later series), Earth/the Federation has no permanent military force. In events such as the Dominion War, the fleet is recalled to act as a military.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
I want Han Solo to go all grumpy old man on someone trying to steal the Falcon

Nah, they're gonna have a touchy-feely scene where he reluctantly gives it to his son to carry on his legacy and then they hug for the first time since he was a child. Leia looks on tearfully.

The prequel movies really could have used a wisecracking rogue character (among other things) to provide some balance to all the holy Jedi spouting stilted dialogue. Here's hoping Abrams gets that right. One of the new actors -- Oscar Isaac -- has that look about him, so we can cross our fingers that we get some classic Han in this one, plus a new guy to fill that role.

P.S. - Sisko is the best captain.

*Best negotiator: Picard.
*Best ship to ship and close combat specialist: Kirk
*Best Commander to stand toe to toe against evil space nazis (as long as you keep him focused and not wandering off on some god complex thing) - Sisko.
*Captain most likely to pull the ship over and ask for directions: Janeway.
*Voted best captain by Team Wienie? Porthos. Team Wienie really liked Porthos and his second in command Captain Archer.
*Best Captain to go barhopping with-Worf. You will be almost guaranteed to have at least one duel to the death, and a head butting contest. Just watch out when he starts talking about prune juice.