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they say this on pre-paints in the comments (which I admit I wasn't aware of them planning to do but obviously I missed that press release)

Hi Jeroen
Yes, we are working with Paizo on a pre-painted line of miniatures for the broader market of players so there will be a growing line of pre-paints over time. These, however, are much slower to make, so as that range grows, we have an opportunity to get you a HUGE range of miniatures specific to Starfinder as soon as possible. This will go a long ways to enhance your player communities, and get your adventures going full steam until the pre-paints can catch up. (Also, these models are SOOOOO crisp and awesome - pre-paints are made from different materials, and dont look as nice if you want to put a little color on them. )


so it does sound a bit iffy for the prepaints showing any time soon if these will be quicker

Pre-paints are still scheduled for November and there haven't been any announcements otherwise - it will be a more limited selection though and probably not as nice as the resin models.

Interesting. I was going to get the prepaints but maybe I will see how far this one gets. I don't like the idea that ND is preemptively hedging their bets by forming a new company that coincidentally insulates them financially while still banking on their other name recognition. It smacks too much of having their cake and eating it too when they've apparently got issues with ongoing/prior campaigns judging from the comments.

 warboss wrote:
I don't like the idea that ND is preemptively hedging their bets by forming a new company that coincidentally insulates them financially while still banking on their other name recognition.

Ninja Division official company name is Ninja Division Publishing, LLC they didn't form a new company. That is at least what I found from a post from 2012 when they were hiring a Marketing Manager which lists the company as Ninja Division Publishing, LLC. They did, however, create a new Kickstarter account under Ninja Division Publishing instead of using Soda Pop KS account.

It's not the first time Soda Pop has created a new KS account they abandoned their original account after Tentacle Bento got suspended

https://www.kickstarter.com/profile/1189988320/created

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
Interesting that they're running this one under the Ninja Division Publishing banner as '1st created'

Had they run it under SPM, even more pitchforks would have come out.

Me, I had already requested a refund for Legends. If/when they give me my money, then I might look at things from a clean slate.

But given that they're currently behind on 4 projects, that's not so likely.

 Dark Severance wrote:

 warboss wrote:
I don't like the idea that ND is preemptively hedging their bets by forming a new company that coincidentally insulates them financially while still banking on their other name recognition.

Ninja Division official company name is Ninja Division Publishing, LLC they didn't form a new company. That is at least what I found from a post from 2012 when they were hiring a Marketing Manager which lists the company as Ninja Division Publishing, LLC. They did, however, create a new Kickstarter account under Ninja Division Publishing instead of using Soda Pop KS account.

Thanks for the clarification. Swap "kickstarter account" in for "company" in my previous post and it does make it less worriesome as there are some people not at both companies (albeit several big names like John at both) and legitmate reasons for doing so.

For all intents and purposes, SPM and ND are the same company. Notice that ND is using SPM's email for this campaign per the FAQ.
____

ETA - apparently, ND is now admitting that yes, they are SPM.

It is to bad kickstarter will not ban folks from swindling more people. I hate to use that term, but what else can we conclude at this point?

 Asmodai wrote:
Pre-paints are still scheduled for November and there haven't been any announcements otherwise - it will be a more limited selection though and probably not as nice as the resin models.

I assume the plastics will be much cheaper, even prepainted. Resin might be worth it for me if they have a large range of spaceships compared to the four(?) coming out in plastic.

The figures look very nice, and in resin the detail should really pop.

For GMs or game groups looking to get into Starfinder, this looks like a pretty good deal.

...and despite past performance, I suspect Paizo will keep them on the straight and narrow for this one. Paizo had a lot invested in Starfinder.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 Asmodai wrote:
Pre-paints are still scheduled for November and there haven't been any announcements otherwise - it will be a more limited selection though and probably not as nice as the resin models.

I assume the plastics will be much cheaper, even prepainted. Resin might be worth it for me if they have a large range of spaceships compared to the four(?) coming out in plastic.

Much cheaper? It looks like they'll be $8 a mini if this entry on paizo's site is still valid for the prepainted sets ($40 for 5 normal sized characters).

http://paizo.com/products/btpy9ub3/discuss?Starfinder-Miniatures-Iconic-Heroes-Set-2

The Starfinder KS has some awesome minis.

 warboss wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 Asmodai wrote:
Pre-paints are still scheduled for November and there haven't been any announcements otherwise - it will be a more limited selection though and probably not as nice as the resin models.

I assume the plastics will be much cheaper, even prepainted. Resin might be worth it for me if they have a large range of spaceships compared to the four(?) coming out in plastic.

Much cheaper? It looks like they'll be $8 a mini if this entry on paizo's site is still valid for the prepainted sets ($40 for 5 normal sized characters).

http://paizo.com/products/btpy9ub3/discuss?Starfinder-Miniatures-Iconic-Heroes-Set-2

Hmmmm. I was mixing up the Miniature Market price with the MSRP. Three spaceships for $27 is on the high side of acceptable, but 3 28mm heroes and a ship is a bit much to ask $30 for. So, unless the resins are even cheaper, I guess the whole range is a write-off...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok, I didn't realize this was live yet. I am definitely going to wait for retail.

Yeah, I was a bit surprised at the cost of the prepaints. Unless the paint jobs are better than the old SWM and DDM lines' rares I'm familiar with, it seems a bit steep for prepaints. I wasn't impressed with the pathfinder prepaints either but I dont know if ND was involved.

More delays

Ninja Division had planned to release the pre-painted Starfinder Miniatures in the fall of 2017. However, due to a rigorous approvals process and our commitment to release the highest quality product possible, we will be delaying the release of the following products until March of 2018:

NJD060101 Starfinder Miniatures: Iconic Heroes Set 1
NJD060102 Starfinder Miniatures: Iconic Heroes Set 2
NJD060201 Starfinder Miniatures: Pact Worlds Fleet Set 1
NJD060301 Starfinder Miniatures: Corpse Fleet Set 1

In other news regarding releases from Ninja Division Publishing, it was also announced today that the Way of The Fighter arcade-style fighting game will be delayed until the first quarter of 2018 in order to make sure that all Kickstarter backers of the project have their pledge rewards fulfilled prior to any trade release.

More like "we won't have the cash on hand until after the Holiday sales are completed"...

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
More like "we won't have the cash on hand until after the Holiday sales are completed"...

Except they could sell stuff at the holiday and then be able to cover manufacturing more.

We'll see. To me, it all looks like pre-bankruptcy actions.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
But given that they're currently behind on 4 projects, that's not so likely.

Good grief. I could never really trust Ninja Division's name (or SPM) on a KS project, and it doesn't look like I have any reason to.

Anyway, here's the BGG thread about SDE refunds : https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1853247/refunds-still-available-and-being-processed

Starting to feel more and more apprehensive about my SDE pledge.

Wondering if I should grab a refund while it's still being offered...

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
We'll see. To me, it all looks like pre-bankruptcy actions.

Yeesh. I sure hope not. A lot of people sank money into those recent Kickstarters. It'd be nice to be able to get my Relic Knights minis.

Glad I got a refund on Relic Knights a few months ago. ND/SPM are clearly out of their depth now, instead of focusing on the games they already have that they haven't the resources to finish they keep adding more presumably to pay for the earlier games - there's a name for that . It all seems to have started to go wrong with the split from CMON I think they thought they could emulate what CMON were doing and become publishing house with a load of games the problem is they haven't the know how or resource to do it.

I'm still in for SDE I'm not going to look for a refund there it's their flag ship game I think they'll do whatever they can to save that one if SDE fails it's game over for ND/SPM.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
More like "we won't have the cash on hand until after the Holiday sales are completed"...

Or the Pathfinder prepaints ended up looking like crap because the manufacturer cut corners to save themselves money.

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
Starting to feel more and more apprehensive about my SDE pledge.

Wondering if I should grab a refund while it's still being offered...

If I were you, I'd read the RRI, WotF, RK2 and Starfinder comments in addition to the SDE:L comments to get the "big pictures" of what SPM/ND is doing as a company. SPM seems to be falling short on everything, including their most recent promises.

Today, SPM said they were 4 weeks backlogged on admin (i.e. refunds). In reality, refunds have not been processed in over 3 weeks. However, in a week, "ND" will receive their Starfinder funds from KS. At that point, I expect to see the logjam break on refunds. If you want a refund, I'd submit on Monday, at the latest. Otherwise, that money will be spent on SDE Wave 1, and refunds will be "delayed" again.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 DaveC wrote:
Glad I got a refund on Relic Knights a few months ago. ND/SPM are clearly out of their depth now, instead of focusing on the games they already have that they haven't the resources to finish they keep adding more presumably to pay for the earlier games - there's a name for that . It all seems to have started to go wrong with the split from CMON I think they thought they could emulate what CMON were doing and become publishing house with a load of games the problem is they haven't the know how or resource to do it.

I'm still in for SDE I'm not going to look for a refund there it's their flag ship game I think they'll do whatever they can to save that one if SDE fails it's game over for ND/SPM.

SPM/ND can't juggle 4 games, and it's amazing that anyone thinks they can successfully deliver a 5th. CMoN has a core of guys who understand business, and can actually manage things. I think SPM will do their best and eventually deliver Wave 1, but if they run out of money, well, so much for Wave 2...

SPM/ND removed me as a Backer of the Legends KS in order to censor me in the comments, but in reading things, it's not gone well.

Refunds are running over 30 days to process, and it looks like others are getting antsy.

Starting the new year, and it's obvious to many backers that SPM/ND won't make their mid-April delivery estimate, given that they haven't even started production of Wave 1, much less gotten anything on the water.

If anyone is still backing Legends, I'd strongly advise to get your refund request in by Feb 7th, before SPM/ND arbitrarily cuts off refunds without any notice.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
More like "we won't have the cash on hand until after the Holiday sales are completed"...

I got my WOTF stuff except the minis, which is the main reason I brought in.

Time to thank my lucky star again that I disliked enough sculpts (like orcs and resculpted dragon babies) to not back Legends. I spend way too much on FK. I might hunt down the Von Drakk Manor stuff and stop thinking about SPM stuff. The Owlbear hatchlings and ghosts were so damn cute, though :(

Hmm. I got my RRI pledge yesterday, so that's one KS off the list for me. I still have Legends going.

I know, I should ask for a refund...but I'm still torn. On one side, it's not looking well and it's been so long I don't really expect much from the game...on the other, the main reason I pledged was the miniatures and I still want them.

I'm aware it will take time if I ask refund anyway.

To be honest, I don't really want SPM to fail. I like this company and what they're doing (mostly miniatures, I admit - never really played Ninja All Stars, but I love their design). I'll wait a bit more and see...and if it fails, well, too bad for me, I guess.

@Sarouan - it's not a question of whether you want SPM to fail, it's really a question of whether one recognizes that SPM is already failing as a company.

If you look at the facts, SPM has been failing to deliver on anything of what they've said for the past several months. By failing to show signs of available cash flow (e.g. processing refunds, tooling Wave 1+), SPM is actually showing every sign of a company that is about to go under. If one were to look at their balance sheet, and include outstanding KS activity, they're almost certainly bankrupt: i.e. SPM owes things to KS backers that they no longer have the financial resources to deliver. That's a lot of the reason SPM has rebranded as "ND" and is taking on every other bit of anything that makes a penny for them. They spent a *lot* of money getting into publishing and distribution, along with expanding their range from SDE into RRI, NAS, WotF, etc. That money obviously came from SDE's coffers, and it's not really paid off, hence the huge delays that we're seeing. And they don't want to admit it, hence the radio silence about anything hard or real.