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 jmurph wrote:
Not sure why the Sisters would resent the Wolves repelling what turned out to be an unfounded invasion but be totally okay with the GKs slaughtering and wearing their blood because they thought the Sisters couldn't handle a mission, but whatever. The Inquisition doesn't seem to be up to thwarting Tzeentchian schemes and anymore seems to show a desire for slaughter up there with Khorne. No doubt Draigo will be along to sort this out any minute....

Not sure what you are talking about. And just in case, I feel like pointing out that the Inquisition and the Sisters are too completely different organizations, with completely different goals and all.

 13045273 wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Indeed, which is why the Wolves will win - since they have enough naval assets to destroy every fleet the Imperial Navy has in the whole Segmentum Obscurus at once, and still fend off a Ork Waagh...

You sound bitter that Sisters aren't this cool

Space Wolves were cool, once upon a time. Now? Now they've been written into Stupid. Wolfy McWolfwolf, Son of Wolf, from Wolftown, of the Wolfhampton Wolves.

They are also hypocritical, which is actually a really good flaw for them to have, except that no one (let alone Black Library) recognizes it for what it is. Russ purged the Thousand Sons for breaking the Edict of Nikea... never mind the fact that the Rune Priests of the Space Wolves are *also* psykers, and the only reason Russ didn't throw them out (per the Emperor's orders) is either because he's 1) Really, really fething stupid or 2) A big ol' furry hypocrite.

The claim is that the Rune Priests aren't actually psykers, instead "drawing upon the primal, natural forces of Fenris." Ehm... that's Sorcery. Straight-up, Warp-based arcane spell casting, with grimoires, blood, bones and ritual sacrifice.. That's actually worse than being a psyker, since psychic expression is a genetic condition, whereas sorcery requires the willing study of Black Magic and Warp-Craft.

So, either the Rune Priests are Psykers, and they've been living a lie for ten thousand years... or they're Sorcerers, which means they're Warp-dabblers and daemon-binders, and have been knowingly lying about it all this time, going so far as to attack the organizations of the Imperium charged with eradicating such Warp-spawned taint.

Taffy17 wrote:
Oh the irony!

You mean someone else gets the wrong idea about their orders and what's going on and decides to destroy the Space Wolves home world?

Something's wrong with the Exalt button, seems like it stopped after one.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Psienesis wrote:

 13045273 wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Indeed, which is why the Wolves will win - since they have enough naval assets to destroy every fleet the Imperial Navy has in the whole Segmentum Obscurus at once, and still fend off a Ork Waagh...

You sound bitter that Sisters aren't this cool

Space Wolves were cool, once upon a time. Now? Now they've been written into Stupid. Wolfy McWolfwolf, Son of Wolf, from Wolftown, of the Wolfhampton Wolves.

They are also hypocritical, which is actually a really good flaw for them to have, except that no one (let alone Black Library) recognizes it for what it is. Russ purged the Thousand Sons for breaking the Edict of Nikea... never mind the fact that the Rune Priests of the Space Wolves are *also* psykers, and the only reason Russ didn't throw them out (per the Emperor's orders) is either because he's 1) Really, really fething stupid or 2) A big ol' furry hypocrite.

The claim is that the Rune Priests aren't actually psykers, instead "drawing upon the primal, natural forces of Fenris." Ehm... that's Sorcery. Straight-up, Warp-based arcane spell casting, with grimoires, blood, bones and ritual sacrifice.. That's actually worse than being a psyker, since psychic expression is a genetic condition, whereas sorcery requires the willing study of Black Magic and Warp-Craft.

So, either the Rune Priests are Psykers, and they've been living a lie for ten thousand years... or they're Sorcerers, which means they're Warp-dabblers and daemon-binders, and have been knowingly lying about it all this time, going so far as to attack the organizations of the Imperium charged with eradicating such Warp-spawned taint.

What
Is wrong
With this exalt button?!

 Psienesis wrote:

 13045273 wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Indeed, which is why the Wolves will win - since they have enough naval assets to destroy every fleet the Imperial Navy has in the whole Segmentum Obscurus at once, and still fend off a Ork Waagh...

You sound bitter that Sisters aren't this cool

Space Wolves were cool, once upon a time. Now? Now they've been written into Stupid. Wolfy McWolfwolf, Son of Wolf, from Wolftown, of the Wolfhampton Wolves.

They are also hypocritical, which is actually a really good flaw for them to have, except that no one (let alone Black Library) recognizes it for what it is. Russ purged the Thousand Sons for breaking the Edict of Nikea... never mind the fact that the Rune Priests of the Space Wolves are *also* psykers, and the only reason Russ didn't throw them out (per the Emperor's orders) is either because he's 1) Really, really fething stupid or 2) A big ol' furry hypocrite.

The claim is that the Rune Priests aren't actually psykers, instead "drawing upon the primal, natural forces of Fenris." Ehm... that's Sorcery. Straight-up, Warp-based arcane spell casting, with grimoires, blood, bones and ritual sacrifice.. That's actually worse than being a psyker, since psychic expression is a genetic condition, whereas sorcery requires the willing study of Black Magic and Warp-Craft.

So, either the Rune Priests are Psykers, and they've been living a lie for ten thousand years... or they're Sorcerers, which means they're Warp-dabblers and daemon-binders, and have been knowingly lying about it all this time, going so far as to attack the organizations of the Imperium charged with eradicating such Warp-spawned taint.

Or, just maybe, they arn't psychers as defined by the Edict. I've thrown this challenge out every single time this idea comes up. Find me one. One single reference in any GW fluff piece of a Rune Priest falling to Chaos. Heck, find me one single instance of a Wolf Priest (in the fluff, not table top rules) of them even suffering a perils of the Warp like effect. There has been tons of fluff however showing that the SW talismans and their oral traditions of spell casting have actually strong protections against Chaos and other psychic powers. Makes me wonder how something can be so resistance to the warp and still be part of the warp.

The biggest support that I can come up with that Rune Preists are not psychers is that even after breaking the Edict, the Big E didn't raise a finger nor a single word of... No... no... This includes you too Russ. You little scamp. You get your guys in line too. If the all knowing and all powerful Emperor didn't have an issue with them keeping their rune priests on the battlefield in his time, I think that give a lot of weight to the idea that maybe there is something different about these guys.

 Jayden63 wrote:
Find me one. One single reference in any GW fluff piece of a Rune Priest falling to Chaos.

Challenge time? Find me one, one single reference of a stormtrooper/scion falling to Chaos. Or else stormtroopers are immune to Chaos. Find me one, one single reference to a whiteshield falling to Chaos. Else, the gunbabies are confirmed immune to Chaos.

 Jayden63 wrote:
Find me one. One single reference in any GW fluff piece of a Rune Priest falling to Chaos.

There might be one following Huron Blackheart - I'll dig out the book and check.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
Challenge time? Find me one, one single reference of a stormtrooper/scion falling to Chaos. Or else stormtroopers are immune to Chaos. Find me one, one single reference to a whiteshield falling to Chaos. Else, the gunbabies are confirmed immune to Chaos.

Cain's Last Stand? Stormtroopers & Sisters fall (kind of...)

beast_gts wrote:

 Jayden63 wrote:
Find me one. One single reference in any GW fluff piece of a Rune Priest falling to Chaos.

There might be one following Huron Blackheart - I'll dig out the book and check.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
Challenge time? Find me one, one single reference of a stormtrooper/scion falling to Chaos. Or else stormtroopers are immune to Chaos. Find me one, one single reference to a whiteshield falling to Chaos. Else, the gunbabies are confirmed immune to Chaos.

Cain's Last Stand? Stormtroopers & Sisters fall (kind of...)

Cains Last Stand
They did not actualy fall - I would contend psychic mind control is different - in that sepcific case were not able to make a conscious descion to fall or not fall.

There have been a number of Space Wolves who joined Blackheart by choice - in fact entire ships IIRC? Not sure if anyRune Priests amongst them

Re the Nikea edict - the Space Wolves and White Scars carried on pretty much as normal as they were "different"

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Jayden63 wrote:
Find me one. One single reference in any GW fluff piece of a Rune Priest falling to Chaos.

Challenge time? Find me one, one single reference of a stormtrooper/scion falling to Chaos. Or else stormtroopers are immune to Chaos.

Fething right they are...

New cannon accepeted and all that

beast_gts wrote:
Cain's Last Stand? Stormtroopers & Sisters fall (kind of...)

Beside what has already been mentioned, still lacking Whiteshields. Those are immune to Chaos. Also immune to the flu and immune to being dropped into grox dung.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Mmhm. A cardinal took six company-strengths of Sisters to Fenris to demand we be allowed to teach the poor, downtrodden locals of Fenris the light of the Emperor... and the Wolves had to call their whole chapter back to stop us landing any missionaries.

I'm curious, was this expanded on in a Black Library novel? The Codices only mention it as three Orders of Sisters. The Space Wolf Codex and Champions of Fenris merely mention that the war lasted three weeks before the Ecclesiarchy decided to withdraw, with no information on how many Wolves where defending Fenris. Unless I've missed something, the Sisters Codex doesn't include any more mentions on the size of the Space Wolf force.

So I don't know if anyone has seen the artwork yet, but this is how the Dark Angels roll... For context the ships alongside are cruisers and battleships... Behold The Rock!

 angelofvengeance wrote:
So I don't know if anyone has seen the artwork yet, but this is how the Dark Angels roll... For context the ships alongside are cruisers and battleships... Behold The Rock!

Did you see the last page of the 1st Damocles Campaign book - there were hundreds of capital ships in a massively over the top pic - bit like here - they did nothing in that story either - by and large its the Marines that matter.

Also the perspective is (as often the case in 40k artwork) somewhat odd. Lastly the Space Wolves alone, at least according to their Codex have more ships that even this pic shows...

Unless I miss my guess by the end of the second pack nothing will really have changed except:

Some stuff got blown up on Fenris (been there done that)
Some of the other planets that nothing happens on and don’t matter get blasted.
The Dark Angels sulk and preach a bit
The Wovles shout and rage a bit
The Grey Knights are stoic and look disapproving
Some Knights and Guard will look embarrassed to be there
The Wulfen stick around

The universe moves on as none of the above make any real difference

I refuse to believe that the Space Wolves, who have the equivalent of a Segmentum Battlefleet, have lost Void Superiority to a couple of SM Chapters, of all things. Unless, of course, the Space Wolf fleet was actively engaged in several hundred missions across he Galaxy like it always is, in which case the Space Wolves lost their home-planet because they were doing their jobs as SM... Getting attacked for being heretics when they're out purging heretics

Christ- this is why I should stay away from these parts of dakka...

 dusara217 wrote:
I refuse to believe that the Space Wolves, who have the equivalent of a Segmentum Battlefleet, have lost Void Superiority to a couple of SM Chapters, of all things. Unless, of course, the Space Wolf fleet was actively engaged in several hundred missions across he Galaxy like it always is, in which case the Space Wolves lost their home-planet because they were doing their jobs as SM... Getting attacked for being heretics when they're out purging heretics

They also have several Ramalies class starforts..........yeah really.

If the plot needs them to loose void superiroity despite thier incredably huge void resources - they will. (Or suddenly they never had them just five ships and the numbers in the last codex were wrong)

(i can never get the spellchecker to work on this computer)

 Mr Morden wrote:

 dusara217 wrote:
I refuse to believe that the Space Wolves, who have the equivalent of a Segmentum Battlefleet, have lost Void Superiority to a couple of SM Chapters, of all things. Unless, of course, the Space Wolf fleet was actively engaged in several hundred missions across he Galaxy like it always is, in which case the Space Wolves lost their home-planet because they were doing their jobs as SM... Getting attacked for being heretics when they're out purging heretics

They also have several Ramalies class starforts..........yeah really.

If the plot needs them to loose void superiroity despite thier incredably huge void resources - they will. (Or suddenly they never had them just five ships and the numbers in the last codex were wrong)

(i can never get the spellchecker to work on this computer)

Well, clearly, said starforts were out assisting the Plothole Crusades of the Plothole Star Cluster,

 dusara217 wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 dusara217 wrote:
I refuse to believe that the Space Wolves, who have the equivalent of a Segmentum Battlefleet, have lost Void Superiority to a couple of SM Chapters, of all things. Unless, of course, the Space Wolf fleet was actively engaged in several hundred missions across he Galaxy like it always is, in which case the Space Wolves lost their home-planet because they were doing their jobs as SM... Getting attacked for being heretics when they're out purging heretics

They also have several Ramalies class starforts..........yeah really.

If the plot needs them to loose void superiroity despite thier incredably huge void resources - they will. (Or suddenly they never had them just five ships and the numbers in the last codex were wrong)

(i can never get the spellchecker to work on this computer)

Well, clearly, said starforts were out assisting the Plothole Crusades of the Plothole Star Cluster,

Or they broke down - or the Rock one shots them - or stuff....................

oldzoggy wrote:If I am not mistaken these are exactly the space wolves that went on killing grey knights the last time they where in real space.

Can't blame them. The wolves and every survivor of Armageddon deserves to put a round in a GK's skull. They are traitors and cowards.

Vaktathi wrote:While on the one hand I would not mind seeing the SW's destroyed and removed from the background (given how atrocious they've become as a faction), it feels both lazy and anti-climactic to have this occur as a result of loyalist forces turning on them, if it's going to happen, the Thousand Sons *should* have that victory...that's really the only way to wrap up that story "correctly".

I'd rather save the SW's and watch the GK's get wiped from existence. as their background is ten times worse then the wolves has ever been. They are the lazy written, Super-Mary Sues of the 40K universe.

Psienesis wrote:Someone just virus bomb that iceball and be fething done with it.

Bomb Titan first. ^-^

Furyou Miko wrote:

 13045273 wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Indeed, which is why the Wolves will win - since they have enough naval assets to destroy every fleet the Imperial Navy has in the whole Segmentum Obscurus at once, and still fend off a Ork Waagh...

You sound bitter that Sisters aren't this cool

Pfft. Who mentioned Sisters? I'm indignant on behalf of the Imperial Navy here.

Sisters are way cooler than Space Wolves any day of the week, there's just no point comparing them.

Sisters and Wolves are both awesome, and since both got royally they should ally and purge the cowards, so real daemon slayers can step up.

angelofvengeance wrote:So I don't know if anyone has seen the artwork yet, but this is how the Dark Angels roll... For context the ships alongside are cruisers and battleships... Behold The Rock!

I thought the Rock was an actual you know...rock? Like a hollowed out planet sized asteroid fitted with engines and guns.

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Bomb Titan first. ^-^

But Titan is an empty planet, there is nothing to bomb there!

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
I thought the Rock was an actual you know...rock? Like a hollowed out planet sized asteroid fitted with engines and guns.

I think you are confusing things a bit. The rok is “a large hollowed out asteroid fitted with guns, engines, guns, targeting systems and some more guns” that is used by a green army. The Rock used to be “a large hollowed out asteroid fitted with guns, engines, guns, targeting systems and some more guns” that is used by a green army too, but then the Orks took a hint from GW and sent the Dark Angels a Cease and desist letter. I mean, if that was not blatant stealing, what is?

 KingmanHighborn wrote:


Can't blame them. The wolves and every survivor of Armageddon deserves to put a round in a GK's skull. They are traitors and cowards.

The survivors of Armageddon were liabilities. Any one of them be corrupted by Chaos knowingly or unknowingly. It's the big part of the Inquisition. They kill millions to save billions.

I'd rather save the SW's and watch the GK's get wiped from existence. as their background is ten times worse then the wolves has ever been. They are the lazy written, Super-Mary Sues of the 40K universe.

I'd disagree with this. The Grey Knight background makes Chaos seem weaker like they

I thought the Rock was an actual you know...rock? Like a hollowed out planet sized asteroid fitted with engines and guns.

A rock doesn't have to to spherical to be fair.

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:

 KingmanHighborn wrote:


Can't blame them. The wolves and every survivor of Armageddon deserves to put a round in a GK's skull. They are traitors and cowards.

The survivors of Armageddon were liabilities. Any one of them be corrupted by Chaos knowingly or unknowingly. It's the big part of the Inquisition. They kill millions to save billions.

I agree completely. The Inquisition is much like an Insurance company,"how many lives do we need to pay to keep from losing all of them?" The issue is, of course, that most people are looking at this from the perspective of a rich man, who doesn't see the point in paying that much money for insurance, when he can just pay it himself, until the day comes that he gets sued for several million dollars, and he goes bankrupt because of his lack of insurance.

 dusara217 wrote:
I refuse to believe that the Space Wolves, who have the equivalent of a Segmentum Battlefleet, have lost Void Superiority to a couple of SM Chapters, of all things. Unless, of course, the Space Wolf fleet was actively engaged in several hundred missions across he Galaxy like it always is, in which case the Space Wolves lost their home-planet because they were doing their jobs as SM... Getting attacked for being heretics when they're out purging heretics

No they don't. The Space Wolves Codex gave us a complete number of their ships. It is impressive, but it's not the size of a Segmentum Fleet, and it's horribly outclassed by the Rock (which is powerful enough to fight off an entire legion fleet).

 Wyzilla wrote:

 dusara217 wrote:
I refuse to believe that the Space Wolves, who have the equivalent of a Segmentum Battlefleet, have lost Void Superiority to a couple of SM Chapters, of all things. Unless, of course, the Space Wolf fleet was actively engaged in several hundred missions across he Galaxy like it always is, in which case the Space Wolves lost their home-planet because they were doing their jobs as SM... Getting attacked for being heretics when they're out purging heretics

No they don't. The Space Wolves Codex gave us a complete number of their ships. It is impressive, but it's not the size of a Segmentum Fleet, and it's horribly outclassed by the Rock (which is powerful enough to fight off an entire legion fleet).

The hyperbole appears to have been lost in translation... the SW fleet might as well have been a Segmentum Battlefleet, as far as SM fleets are concerned, due to the fact that it's several orders of magnitude larger than just about any other SM Fleet. As for the Rock, what evidence do you have that it could fight off a Legion Fleet, of all things, which includes fething Gloriana-class Void Craft. Now, if you, too, were using Hyperbole, what makes you think that the Rock could singlehandedly take on the Space Wolf fleet, which - wow, I just looked back at the 7e SW Codex, and it has half the amount of Star Forts, in this one, then it had in 5e :(. Also, the only example of the Rock's power was when it (and an entire fleet of DA ships) tipped the scales of a pitched battle between the IN and the Eldar, in which the Rock took down a Capital Ship and a half dozen escorts, which really isn't any more impressive than another ship of similar renown, such as an Ark Mechanicus or Ramilles Star-Fort.

Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Bomb Titan first. ^-^

But Titan is an empty planet, there is nothing to bomb there!

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
I thought the Rock was an actual you know...rock? Like a hollowed out planet sized asteroid fitted with engines and guns.

I think you are confusing things a bit. The rok is “a large hollowed out asteroid fitted with guns, engines, guns, targeting systems and some more guns” that is used by a green army. The Rock used to be “a large hollowed out asteroid fitted with guns, engines, guns, targeting systems and some more guns” that is used by a green army too, but then the Orks took a hint from GW and sent the Dark Angels a Cease and desist letter. I mean, if that was not blatant stealing, what is?

Titan is the Grey Knights homeworld/base

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:

 KingmanHighborn wrote:


Can't blame them. The wolves and every survivor of Armageddon deserves to put a round in a GK's skull. They are traitors and cowards.

The survivors of Armageddon were liabilities. Any one of them be corrupted by Chaos knowingly or unknowingly. It's the big part of the Inquisition. They kill millions to save billions.

I'd rather save the SW's and watch the GK's get wiped from existence. as their background is ten times worse then the wolves has ever been. They are the lazy written, Super-Mary Sues of the 40K universe.

I'd disagree with this. The Grey Knight background makes Chaos seem weaker like they

I thought the Rock was an actual you know...rock? Like a hollowed out planet sized asteroid fitted with engines and guns.

A rock doesn't have to to spherical to be fair.

See I disagree. And this to me is what makes them cowards. It was an 'unproved' liability. Their whole 'secrecy' angle is covered by the fact most the survivors would of just thought them to be odd Space Marines, and not even make a big whoop about it. The fact is those people fought tooth and nail against daemons, World Eaters, and a freaking daemon infused Primarch, and held out with the Wolves. The whole dang policy is borked and only ever served Chaos in 1. Getting rid of a whole population that gained experience in fighting them, 2. Caused the Wolves and Grey Knights to weaken themselves. And really how they managed to keep the word from getting out is one of the poorest pieces of lore out there. They not only hunted the survivors that fled down, but destroyed every world they may of contacted. And even then the Wolves were forced to give them up even when they had every advantage in the final moments of the conflict. They should of had whole systems learn of their existence and turn on them from this. But handwave it away cause despite it being 'one' chapter with no second foundings, they could actually dedicate the resources to be everywhere in masse at once.

 dusara217 wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 dusara217 wrote:
I refuse to believe that the Space Wolves, who have the equivalent of a Segmentum Battlefleet, have lost Void Superiority to a couple of SM Chapters, of all things. Unless, of course, the Space Wolf fleet was actively engaged in several hundred missions across he Galaxy like it always is, in which case the Space Wolves lost their home-planet because they were doing their jobs as SM... Getting attacked for being heretics when they're out purging heretics

No they don't. The Space Wolves Codex gave us a complete number of their ships. It is impressive, but it's not the size of a Segmentum Fleet, and it's horribly outclassed by the Rock (which is powerful enough to fight off an entire legion fleet).

The hyperbole appears to have been lost in translation... the SW fleet might as well have been a Segmentum Battlefleet, as far as SM fleets are concerned, due to the fact that it's several orders of magnitude larger than just about any other SM Fleet. As for the Rock, what evidence do you have that it could fight off a Legion Fleet, of all things, which includes fething Gloriana-class Void Craft. Now, if you, too, were using Hyperbole, what makes you think that the Rock could singlehandedly take on the Space Wolf fleet, which - wow, I just looked back at the 7e SW Codex, and it has half the amount of Star Forts, in this one, then it had in 5e :(. Also, the only example of the Rock's power was when it (and an entire fleet of DA ships) tipped the scales of a pitched battle between the IN and the Eldar, in which the Rock took down a Capital Ship and a half dozen escorts, which really isn't any more impressive than another ship of similar renown, such as an Ark Mechanicus or Ramilles Star-Fort.

The Rock curb stomped Typhus' fleet in the final book of the Legacy of Caliban series, including the Terminus Est itself. The Rock also only operates at a very minimal level of power. It was only during the assault on the Death Guard fleet that it fully powered up, and when fully powered up it's likely one of, if not the most powerful thing in the Imperium's arsenal save the Phalanx.

 dusara217 wrote:
Also, the only example of the Rock's power was when it (and an entire fleet of DA ships) tipped the scales of a pitched battle between the IN and the Eldar, in which the Rock took down a Capital Ship and a half dozen escorts, which really isn't any more impressive than another ship of similar renown, such as an Ark Mechanicus or Ramilles Star-Fort.

*groan* No, they did not call it the Battle of Midpoint. Couldn't they have come up with something slightly better?

Anyway, Wyzilla, the chapter's honor is in your hands! Repent! For tomorrow you die!

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Titan is the Grey Knights homeworld/base

I know, it was a joke about the amount of secrecy surrounding the Grey Knight. I don't think anyone in 40k that is not an Inquisitor or a Grey Knight (or, possibly, the Emperor) knows that Titan is the Grey Knight base.

Anyone who's flown past it knows there's something there though. You don't put defence satellites and Phobos in place to protect and supply an empty rock.

How many have flown past it? And are the defense satellite not super-stealthed magical archeotech version that you cannot see except if they are actually shooting at you?

 Jayden63 wrote:
t. I've thrown this challenge out every single time this idea comes up. Find me one. One single reference in any GW fluff piece of a Rune Priest falling to Chaos. .

Fatespinner, story in Honour of the space marines