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Except your stating it's not a terminator, so how can it select from that list?

I also didn't see the run through the checkout line 4 times either.

 JNAProductions wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:
I give my regular captain a bike-legal
I then give him terminator armor-by your logic, this is legal.
Is the end result legal?

This was ignored

Edit: so why doesn't tinge terminator captain have to do the same?

The Terminator Captain has permission to take Terminator Weapons. The model itself has that permission listed on its options.

col_impact wrote:

 Brother Ramses wrote:
You can lead a dead horse to water and beat it black and blue, but that won't stop it from rinse and repeating the same tactic on YMDC as it does in every thread when asked to provide proof of RAW when actually presenting yet another skewed RAI argument.

Feel free to point out how any of this is illegal.

Spoiler:

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model make legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

You cannot claim legality with a RAI stance. You have no permission to assume that the permissions set forth by being in terminator armor carry over to when the model no longer has terminator armor. You have no permission to assume that the sequence in choosing equipment somehow negates some rules while allowing others. Once again your entire line of reasoning is based upon RAI of your assumptions.

The Cataphracti entry is flawed. That is a given that everyone acknowledges. The player is left up to RAI their way into making it work, which based upon precedence of other armor only specified in fluff terms as being a certain type, has been ruled as effectively being that type.

But seriously, you saw your initial argument fall apart and chose to go with the age old timing/sequencing argument, which on YMDC has historically been laughed at and ridiculed as the last bastion of a losing stance, especially with wargear selections.

Ceann wrote:
Wonderful! Do you see any part of that which said they were rules? I didn't see the world rule in the entire thing.

The entire Army List Entry is a collection of rules.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Brother Ramses wrote:


You cannot claim legality with a RAI stance. You have no permission to assume that the permissions set forth by being in terminator armor carry over to when the model no longer has terminator armor. You have no permission to assume that the sequence in choosing equipment somehow negates some rules while allowing others. Once again your entire line of reasoning is based upon RAI of your assumptions.

I have made no assumptions.

Feel free to point out any assumptions or illegalities.

Ah it is? GREAT. So the part where is says see codex space marines is a rule on the same data sheet, making it just as important. And the wargear options tell us to use the rules in the appendix. The rules in the appendix tell us you must wear terminator armor to use those weapons. Therefore we must do so.

Ceann wrote:
The rules in the appendix tell us you must wear terminator armor to use those weapons.

That's not what the rule says. Quote the rule.

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:

 Brother Ramses wrote:
But you notice he has changed his argument since the beginning to account for his initial failure. It is now a sequencing argument to get around wearing Cataphracti armor, that isn't terminator armor, yet wielding terminator only weaponry.

col_impact has so far argued his case with:
1)ambulances
2)girlfriends pitbull (or some other dog breed, don't remember, don't care!)
3)"specific permission over general rule" which is not supported by anything
4)history
5)process, which is special case of history

All his arguments have been discredited, and often several times as he keeps on repeating his claims and disregarding other peoples opposing arguments, dodging questions and demanding other people produce rule quotes with page numbers while at the same time failing to produce rule quotes himself.

Looks like you are refusing to take up the challenge . ..

I have outlined a 100% legal process and you have yet to point out where it is illegal. Everything is copacetic according to the rules.

Spoiler:

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model make legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

Feel free to point out something illegal. If you cannot then you must accept it as legal.

Ghorgul wrote:
col_impact, you are the one dodging and ignoring other people.

Spoiler:

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:

col_impact wrote:


Incorrect.

The Terminator Captain model has permission to "take items from the Terminator Weapons" list.

Incorrect.
The Terminator Captain model in Cataprachtii has permission to "take items from the Terminator Weapons" list but he has no legal options within the Terminator Weapons list as all the options demand the model to be wearing Terminator Armour. Cataprachtii Terminator Armour is not Terminator Armour.

Nothing in rule "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" suggests he may override the rules governing Terminator Weapons, as has been argued earlier by several people several times.

Let me give you a clear example where a rule overrides another rule:
Raptor Talon [Formation], page 53 in Traitor Legions Codex Supplement.
Formation has Special Rule: Predatory Warriors
Direct quote: "Units in this Formation can charge on the same turn they arrive from Deep Strike Reserve, but always count as making a disordered charge when they do so."
There exists a basic rule, in BRB, stating that a unit cannot charge on the same turn it arrives from Deep Strike Reserve. (BRB, special rules, deep strike, pg. 162).
On page 13 in BRB, Basic versus Advanced:
"On rare occasions, a conflict will arise between a rule in this rulebook, and one printed in a codex. Where this occurs, the rule printed in the codex or Army List Entry always takes precedence."
Clearly the Codex rule Predatory Warriors contradicts the Special Rule for Deep Striking in BRB, therefore Predatory Warriors rule overrides contradicting [special] rule in BRB.
BRB does not state that rules inside codex override other rules inside the same codex or another codex.

Please produce us an excerpt which supports your argument of Terminator Captain permission to Terminator Weapons to override restrictions within the options in Terminator Weapons. BRB, faq or errata will be sufficient.

You missed the point. The Terminator Captain has a fully legal configuration.

To direct you back to the task at hand . . .

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model make legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

This is a perfectly legitimate RAW resolution. All rules were followed and no rule is broken.

If you feel otherwise point out the rule that I break. The burden is on you to post rules here.

Spoiler:

Ghorgul wrote:

col_impact wrote:


You missed the point. The Terminator Captain has a fully legal configuration.

To direct you back to the task at hand . . .

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model make legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

This is a perfectly legitimate RAW resolution. All rules were followed and no rule is broken.

If you feel otherwise point out the rule that I break. The burden is on you to post rules here.

The Roster you provide is convoluted, let me tidy it up to follow the:
BRB, pg. 117, The Force Roster:
"Write down the details of the models that make up your army... This written record is known as your army's force roster, and you must keep it to hand while you play the game."

Terminator Captain

Cataprachtii Terminator Armour

Chainfist/Power Fist (you switched it 2nd time midway with no mention, but lets not worry about that!)

Bike

1) Cataprachtii Terminator Armour is legal choice
2) Bike is legal choice because Cataprachtii Terminator Armour is not Terminator Armour by definition
3)Chainfist/power fist choice is Illegal. See the justification and rule entry below:

In Codex Space Marines, Space Marines Wargear List, Terminator Weapons

entry:
"A model wearing Terminator armour may replace his power weapon with one of the following: -Power fist X pts, -Chainfist X pts."
A model, as recorded in Force Roster I kindly provided for you, is not wearing a Terminator armour so therefore cannot replace his power weapon with Power fist or Chainfist. This is because Cataprachtii Terminator Armour is not Terminator armour by definition.

You failed to record your models Force Roster entry in clear manner and you failed to follow the rule set in Terminator Weapons [list] entry. Therefore you ended up with illegal choices for you models.

Spoiler:

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:
As all claims in support of Terminator Captain in Cataprachtii Terminator Armour being able to choose options within Terminator Weapons list have been discredited and arguments against the claims stand unchallenged, even outright ignored, we can conclude that:
[list]Terminator Captain in Cataprachtii Terminator Armour can have a bike or jump pack.

Terminator Captain in Cataprachtii Terminator Armour has access to Terminator Weapons, but cannot make any legal choices from the said list.

Quite dodging.

Point out the rules I break in the steps below.

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model may legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a chainfist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

Unless you can point out rules that I break, I am doing something perfectly legitimate and legal.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 doctortom wrote:
Prove that the same process can't be used with a vanilla Space Marine Captain to provide him with a bike and with terminator armor.

Why? The process I outline is thoroughly legal and end results in a 100% legal combination.

Meanwhile, you mention FAQs but fail to deliver as far as posting them.

You have to show a rule being broken here.

Please point out the rules I break in the steps below.

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model may legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a chainfist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

Your argument has been discredited, by rule quotes in very clear manner. You are ignoring arguments and dodging. You are acting in very disruptive manner. You do not provide rule quotes in support of your claims, yet you demand others to provide rule quotes. When they are provided you ignore them completely and continue repeating your discredited claims.

Ghorgul wrote:
Your argument has been invalidated, see above quote. You are still ignoring my arguments.

I have not ignored you. You haven't applied your argument to this outlined process. What exactly is illegal here? Please point it out.

What rules are you breaking.

Tenet 1. Provide your precedence
Tenet 2. Provide rule pages by number



Automatically Appended Next Post:
The process you have outlined to purchase wargear is not something you have explicitly permitted to do. Point out where you are allowed to do this.

Wow....12 pages on such a simple question. And such varying points of view.

I so glad i play 30k. This is never an issue.

RAW vs. RAI. ITs a game. Not a legal court case about human rights.

Common sence - screw RAW/RAI. Terminators are terminators. They are heavy armoured marines. They only go flying thru the air when thumped with a Falchion.

But hey if your opponent is desperate enough to want to play....good luck.

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:
Your argument has been invalidated, see above quote. You are still ignoring my arguments.

I have not ignored you. You haven't applied your argument to this outlined process. What exactly is illegal here? Please point it out.

Spoiler:

Point out the rules I break in the steps below.

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model may legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a chainfist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

You have failed to provide Force Roster as explained earlier. I will not discuss sequence unless you provide a rule which states that Force Roster needs to be provided in sequence.

Ceann wrote:Wargear has rules, the wargear options section does not have rules.

You must obey the wargear rules in codex spacemarines, you cannot refute this with a wargear option because it isn't a rule.

If the wargear options does/are not rules, then they have no impact on the game. Rules are how the game operates and functions, and part of the game is list building. Either they are rules on how to properly upgrade the unit, or they are not. If they are not the rules on how to upgrade a unit, they have no enforceable power which means you either can do nothing further with them or you can do like Col_Ignored and do whatever the sam-hill you please while upgrading them. Don't get so carried away trying to prove the person who cannot read an entire sentence wrong that you put yourself in error.

There is no definitive method on how unit upgrades are to be processed. All we know is you cannot go back on the list and select an upgrade in the list above a different upgrade if we go by the FAQ answer regarding Apothecaries. Which makes the concept behind someone's question on doing the same purchasing method with a regular Captain and Terminator Armour pertinent.

The Options for a Captain tell us that he can take Terminator Armour after he has access to purchasing Special Issue Wargear. The rules for purchasing Bikes in Special Issue Wargear state that a model wearing Terminator Armour cannot purchase a Bike or a Jump Pack (and then excludes both from being purchased at the same time). The only way this would be possible would be if we are looking at the final results, since if we go by top-down order, a Captain can purchase a Bike and then purchase his Terminator Armour. Purchasing Terminator Armour no longer clears the Captain of all Wargear, just his grenades, pistol, and sword.

This still doesn't change the fact that Col_Ignored likes to incorporate plenty of double standards in his assessments and then completely ignores that they happen. He nit-picks rules like he nit-picks the words in the sentences and willingly ignores everything else.

Ghorgul wrote:
You have failed to provide Force Roster as explained earlier. I will not discuss sequence unless you provide a rule which states that Force Roster needs to be provided in sequence.

The process produces an end result that is 100% legal. The Force Roster only cares that the end result is 100% legal, which it is. The Terminator Captain has permission to take items from the Terminator Weapons list. A Terminator Captain equipped with Cataphractii armour, chainfist, and bike is a legal combination.

col_impact wrote:

Ceann wrote:
Wonderful! Do you see any part of that which said they were rules? I didn't see the world rule in the entire thing.

The entire Army List Entry is a collection of rules.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Brother Ramses wrote:


You cannot claim legality with a RAI stance. You have no permission to assume that the permissions set forth by being in terminator armor carry over to when the model no longer has terminator armor. You have no permission to assume that the sequence in choosing equipment somehow negates some rules while allowing others. Once again your entire line of reasoning is based upon RAI of your assumptions.

I have made no assumptions.

Feel free to point out any assumptions or illegalities.

Spoiler:

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model may legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

Again, just because you say something is so does not make it.

You assume that you are allowed to sequence wargear purchase to circumvent not being allowed to purchase terminator weapons when not in terminator armor.

You assume that wargear/weapon purchase are akin to snap shots in time, whose rules and/or restrictions do not carry over or persist with future changes of wargear/weapons.

You also assume that permissions are persistent through wargear changes as well, which is also selective assumption in your part to fit your narrative.

Now I know you are going to probably comeback with "I make no assumptions" or "point to me where I am breaking a rule". But the truth of the matter is that the burden of proof is not on me to prove that you are making assumptions throughout your entire little summary. The burden of proof is in you to show me per the RAW that you are allowed to make those assumptions. I know that no RAW exists to support those assumptions. I do know that RAW exists in the form of a precedence with regard to armor not being specifically labeled as terminator armor, being effectively ruled as terminator armor.

Then how come a regular captain is different? At no point when making a terminator armored captain on a bike do you violate the rules.

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:
You have failed to provide Force Roster as explained earlier. I will not discuss sequence unless you provide a rule which states that Force Roster needs to be provided in sequence.

The process produces an end result that is 100% legal. The Force Roster only cares that the end result is 100% legal, which it is. The Terminator Captain has permission to take items from the Terminator Weapons list. A Terminator Captain equipped with Cataphractii armour, chainfist, and bike is a legal combination.

Incorrect, this has been proven to you several times and you have been unable to provide any further arguments that support your claim.

 Brother Ramses wrote:


Again, just because you say something is so does not make it.

You assume that you are allowed to sequence wargear purchase to circumvent not being allowed to purchase terminator weapons when not in terminator armor.

You assume that wargear/weapon purchase are akin to snap shots in time, whose rules and/or restrictions do not carry over or persist with future changes of wargear/weapons.

You also assume that permissions are persistent through wargear changes as well, which is also selective assumption in your part to fit your narrative.

Now I know you are going to probably comeback with "I make no assumptions" or "point to me where I am breaking a rule". But the truth of the matter is that the burden of proof is not on me to prove that you are making assumptions throughout your entire little summary. The burden of proof is in you to show me per the RAW that you are allowed to make those assumptions. I know that no RAW exists to support those assumptions. I do know that RAW exists in the form of a precedence with regard to armor not being specifically labeled as terminator armor, being effectively ruled as terminator armor.

I make no assumptions

These steps are made in a straightforward manner.

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model may legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)


Where exactly am I breaking a rule?

 Charistoph wrote:

Ceann wrote:Wargear has rules, the wargear options section does not have rules.

You must obey the wargear rules in codex spacemarines, you cannot refute this with a wargear option because it isn't a rule.

If the wargear options does/are not rules, then they have no impact on the game. Rules are how the game operates and functions, and part of the game is list building. Either they are rules on how to properly upgrade the unit, or they are not. If they are not the rules on how to upgrade a unit, they have no enforceable power which means you either can do nothing further with them or you can do like Col_Ignored and do whatever the sam-hill you please while upgrading them. Don't get so carried away trying to prove the person who cannot read an entire sentence wrong that you put yourself in error.

There is no definitive method on how unit upgrades are to be processed. All we know is you cannot go back on the list and select an upgrade in the list above a different upgrade if we go by the FAQ answer regarding Apothecaries. Which makes the concept behind someone's question on doing the same purchasing method with a regular Captain and Terminator Armour pertinent.

The Options for a Captain tell us that he can take Terminator Armour after he has access to purchasing Special Issue Wargear. The rules for purchasing Bikes in Special Issue Wargear state that a model wearing Terminator Armour cannot purchase a Bike or a Jump Pack (and then excludes both from being purchased at the same time). The only way this would be possible would be if we are looking at the final results, since if we go by top-down order, a Captain can purchase a Bike and then purchase his Terminator Armour. Purchasing Terminator Armour no longer clears the Captain of all Wargear, just his grenades, pistol, and sword.

This still doesn't change the fact that Col_Ignored likes to incorporate plenty of double standards in his assessments and then completely ignores that they happen. He nit-picks rules like he nit-picks the words in the sentences and willingly ignores everything else.

They are not rules. The movement phase has rules ,the shooting phase has rules. Special rules are rules. Wargear options are not rules, they permit you to purchase wargear, they do not have any game enforceable status. Notice all of the wargear options say MAY, which is not an absolute. Rules are absolutes. Now the wargear they permit you access too, the wargear does have rules the section explicitly days they do.

Ghorgul wrote:

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:
You have failed to provide Force Roster as explained earlier. I will not discuss sequence unless you provide a rule which states that Force Roster needs to be provided in sequence.

The process produces an end result that is 100% legal. The Force Roster only cares that the end result is 100% legal, which it is. The Terminator Captain has permission to take items from the Terminator Weapons list. A Terminator Captain equipped with Cataphractii armour, chainfist, and bike is a legal combination.

Incorrect, this has been proven to you several times and you have been unable to provide any further arguments that support your claim.

No proof has been presented by you that was not immediately refuted.

Again. I am looking for a simple pointing out by why as to what exactly is illegal in this process . . .

Your premise, that the data sheet words you consider to be rules, take precedence over wargear rules, which are actually rules.

col_impact wrote:

Spoiler:

 Brother Ramses wrote:


Again, just because you say something is so does not make it.

You assume that you are allowed to sequence wargear purchase to circumvent not being allowed to purchase terminator weapons when not in terminator armor.

You assume that wargear/weapon purchase are akin to snap shots in time, whose rules and/or restrictions do not carry over or persist with future changes of wargear/weapons.

You also assume that permissions are persistent through wargear changes as well, which is also selective assumption in your part to fit your narrative.

Now I know you are going to probably comeback with "I make no assumptions" or "point to me where I am breaking a rule". But the truth of the matter is that the burden of proof is not on me to prove that you are making assumptions throughout your entire little summary. The burden of proof is in you to show me per the RAW that you are allowed to make those assumptions. I know that no RAW exists to support those assumptions. I do know that RAW exists in the form of a precedence with regard to armor not being specifically labeled as terminator armor, being effectively ruled as terminator armor.

I make no assumptions

These steps are made in a straightforward manner.

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model may legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)


Where exactly am I breaking a rule?

As clearly shown earlier you end up with illegal Force Roster entry, but you keep ignoring other people here. I am convinced your conduct qualifies as spamming, you keep posting the same exact thing and then ignore all the counter arguments.

Ghorgul wrote:
[As clearly shown earlier you end up with illegal Force Roster entry, but you keep ignoring other people here. I am convinced your conduct qualifies as spamming, you keep posting the same exact thing and then ignore all the counter arguments.

How exactly do you end up with an illegal Force Roster entry? The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list.

col_impact wrote:


No proof has been presented by you that was not immediately refuted.

Incorrect. You have consistently failed to refute my arguments with rule quotes.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:
[As clearly shown earlier you end up with illegal Force Roster entry, but you keep ignoring other people here. I am convinced your conduct qualifies as spamming, you keep posting the same exact thing and then ignore all the counter arguments.

How exactly do you end up with an illegal Force Roster entry? The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list.

This has been explained many times earlier in great detail but you keep ignoring other people on this debate. The detailed explanations are on this same page, quoted by me, but you choose to ignore them and fail to produce relevant rule quote to support your claim.

Ghorgul wrote:

col_impact wrote:


No proof has been presented by you that was not immediately refuted.

Incorrect. You have consistently failed to refute my arguments with rule quotes.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:
[As clearly shown earlier you end up with illegal Force Roster entry, but you keep ignoring other people here. I am convinced your conduct qualifies as spamming, you keep posting the same exact thing and then ignore all the counter arguments.

How exactly do you end up with an illegal Force Roster entry? The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list.

This has been explained many times earlier in great detail but you keep ignoring other people on this debate. The detailed explanations are on this same page, quoted by me, but you choose to ignore them and fail to produce relevant rule quote to support your claim.

The end result (which is what the Force Roster cares about) is 100% legal. The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list. He has permission to be equipped with a chainfist.

col_impact wrote:
How exactly do you end up with an illegal Force Roster entry? The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list.

The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list. Are you claiming something? No one is disputing this rule in Army List Entry. Please produce a clear argument.

Ghorgul wrote:

col_impact wrote:
How exactly do you end up with an illegal Force Roster entry? The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list.

The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list. Are you claiming something? No one is disputing this rule in Army List Entry. Please produce a clear argument.

So you are in agreement that there is nothing illegal going on here?

col_impact wrote:
The end result (which is what the Force Roster cares about) is 100% legal. The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list. He has permission to be equipped with a chainfist.

True, but only when not choosing to have Cataprachtii Terminator Armour. With Cataprachtii Terminator Armour he cannot legally be equipped with chainfist. This has also been explained to you countless times before but you choose to ignore other peoples rule based justifications and keep on repeating your own claims.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

col_impact wrote:


So you are in agreement that there is nothing illegal going on here?

Spoiler:

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model may legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

I am not in agreement, as I have argued earlier on several occasions. You still keep ignoring my arguments and do not provide clear rule quotes to defend your claim.

Ghorgul wrote:

col_impact wrote:
The end result (which is what the Force Roster cares about) is 100% legal. The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list. He has permission to be equipped with a chainfist.

True, but only when not choosing to have Cataprachtii Terminator Armour. With Cataprachtii Terminator Armour he cannot legally be equipped with chainfist.

This process shows how he is legally equipped.



Do you see anything illegal?

Remember the permission to have Terminator Weapons is in the Options for the Terminator Captain. The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list.

col_impact wrote:

Ghorgul wrote:

col_impact wrote:
The end result (which is what the Force Roster cares about) is 100% legal. The Terminator Captain model "may take items from the Terminator Weapons" list. He has permission to be equipped with a chainfist.

True, but only when not choosing to have Cataprachtii Terminator Armour. With Cataprachtii Terminator Armour he cannot legally be equipped with chainfist.

This process shows how he is legally equipped.

Spoiler:

1) I equip my Terminator Captain model, replacing his power sword with a chainfist. (He is in terminator armour so he may replace and he does)

2) I swap the Terminator Captain's terminator armour for Cataphractii terminator armour. (He keeps his chainfist since the Captain model may legally take Terminator Weapon items)

3) The Terminator Captain purchases a bike. (He is not restricted from doing so since he is not in terminator armour)

4) I now have a Terminator Captain with a power fist and a bike in Cataphractii armour. (He has a completely legal configuration for Cataphractii armour)

Do you see anything illegal?

Remember the permission to have Terminator Weapons is in the Options for the Terminator Captain.

Earlier on this same page there is a post (2017/04/11 22:54:28) with a quote where I show this to lead into having illegal Force Roster. You are spamming.