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I am still waiting for the Orks (with deffkoptas) from the AoBR set to be released separately.

 AegisGrimm wrote:


Actually he's quite a bit older! Almost ten years further back in 1995 in the 2nd edition Ultramarines codex.

'Ancient' you might say...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Under the heading of 'learn something every day' Ancient (meaning standard bearer) is a corruption of Ensign (meaning flag).

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=ancient

Though I wonder if it could also have come from the origin of Ancient as antes, 'before' since the standard bearer marches in front of the army.

 privateer4hire wrote:
Didn't it take them 2 or more years to separate out the AoS and 7th edition 40k starters if I'm not too far off the mark.

I didn't think AoS got "separated" in the sense they made all new sprues and released them rather than separating out the ones in the actual starter set.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:
Didn't it take them 2 or more years to separate out the AoS and 7th edition 40k starters if I'm not too far off the mark.

I didn't think AoS got "separated" in the sense they made all new sprues and released them rather than separating out the ones in the actual starter set.

I feel like they've both separated things out(The "Easy Build" Liberators, Retributors, Bloodreavers, and Blood Warriors--the Liberators and Retributors have made it into the Warband and Start Collecting boxes for the Stormcast as well. Additionally, the two heroes who just went up for preorder on Saturday are split out from the main box) and then all new sprues in the form of the unit boxes and the new "Thunder & Blood" set where they took frames and did them in colored plastic.

Your opinion may vary.

So I got an order from GW today. It came with a free Primaris pin. It says copyright 2016.

 NivlacSupreme wrote:
So I got an order from GW today. It came with a free Primaris pin. It says copyright 2016.

Is that of great concern? I think it'd be far more interesting if it said copyright 2018 myself, but there you go…

 Mr_Rose wrote:

 NivlacSupreme wrote:
So I got an order from GW today. It came with a free Primaris pin. It says copyright 2016.

Is that of great concern? I think it'd be far more interesting if it said copyright 2018 myself, but there you go…

I just found it sort of interesting.

What's the pin look like?

 AduroT wrote:
What's the pin look like?

Probably like a marine pin....only bigger

 Theophony wrote:

 AduroT wrote:
What's the pin look like?

Probably like a marine pin....only bigger

Oh man, the innuedos....

shade1313 wrote:
For reference, "ancient" is also an archaic term for a flag or ensign, as well as the person who was the standard bearer for a commander. For example, Iago is referred to as Othello's ancient.

See also Ancient Pistol in Henry IV and V; he's not just an old gun...

 AduroT wrote:
What's the pin look like?

It's this picture superimposed on a background.

it does suggest the Primaris Marine was finished etc and they where prepping as early oas 2016 which is actually impressive when you consider that the first rumors and leaks only started to come out in march or so.

It's kind of a shame they made the Primus Marines new guys. It would have been easy just to say they're marines with new armor and guns, and maybe new drugs too.



I always liked to think of my marines as having centuries of experience. This guy is a lot less impressive if you figure he's only been around a week or two since he was hatched from his cloning tank or whatever.

Yeah, it does kind of undermine that famous speech by the Emperor about the Space Marines.

They shall be my finest warriors, these men who give of themselves to me. Like clay I shall mould them, and in the furnace of war forge them. They will be of iron will and steely muscle. In great armour shall I clad them and with the mightiest guns will they be armed. They will be untouched by plague or disease, no sickness will blight them. They will have tactics, strategies and machines so that no foe can best them in battle. They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines and they shall know no fear.
– on the Creation of the Space Marines.

Yeah, Finest warriors, except for the fact they got outdone by a Primarch and a techpriest.
I really hope they reveal at some point that the Primaris were originally based on a prototype created by the Emperor that was discovered by Roboute and Cawl.
Atm it feels like they are undermining the Emperor's Legacy by surpassing his Defenders of Humanity

Well in the army book that comes with Dark Imperium it says they were made from 'scraps of the Emepror's genetic research found by Guilliman and given to Cawl'

To be fair Space Marines are technology, and technology is always being improved upon.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Yeah, it does kind of undermine that famous speech by the Emperor about the Space Marines.

They shall be my finest warriors, these men who give of themselves to me. Like clay I shall mould them, and in the furnace of war forge them. They will be of iron will and steely muscle. In great armour shall I clad them and with the mightiest guns will they be armed. They will be untouched by plague or disease, no sickness will blight them. They will have tactics, strategies and machines so that no foe can best them in battle. They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines and they shall know no fear.
– on the Creation of the Space Marines.

Yeah, Finest warriors, except for the fact they got outdone by a Primarch and a techpriest.
I really hope they reveal at some point that the Primaris were originally based on a prototype created by the Emperor that was discovered by Roboute and Cawl.
Atm it feels like they are undermining the Emperor's Legacy by surpassing his Defenders of Humanity

My centuries of wisdom and totally not my eraser of truth (his name is dave, he used to be a porcupine) told me Rowboat just stole Corax's stuff. So that's my headcannon now.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Yeah, it does kind of undermine that famous speech by the Emperor about the Space Marines.

They shall be my finest warriors, these men who give of themselves to me. Like clay I shall mould them, and in the furnace of war forge them. They will be of iron will and steely muscle. In great armour shall I clad them and with the mightiest guns will they be armed. They will be untouched by plague or disease, no sickness will blight them. They will have tactics, strategies and machines so that no foe can best them in battle. They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines and they shall know no fear.
– on the Creation of the Space Marines.

Yeah, Finest warriors, except for the fact they got outdone by a Primarch and a techpriest.
I really hope they reveal at some point that the Primaris were originally based on a prototype created by the Emperor that was discovered by Roboute and Cawl.
Atm it feels like they are undermining the Emperor's Legacy by surpassing his Defenders of Humanity

Well they were already in 2nd, 3rd or 4th place after the Custodeus, Grey Knights and Death Watch (who are marines, but better marines) .

I'm reading HH: Master of Mankind now and it's interesting, the Emperor outright says he never loved the Primarchs or Marines and they are weapons with delusions of grandeur. Which goes against prior fluff but is an interesting twist. Of course he was telling that to a Custodeus so who knows, maybe he lied.

"You're totally my favs Goldy McGoldpants!"

 RyanAvx wrote:
Well in the army book that comes with Dark Imperium it says they were made from 'scraps of the Emepror's genetic research found by Guilliman and given to Cawl'

Well that's reasonable then, I guess. I suppose one can ascertain then that the Emperor was still finding out ways of improving the Space Marine project, just as the Space Marines were an improvement of the Thunder Warriors, but he got incapacitated before completing it.
If the Primaris Marines were, in fact, based on the Emperor's research, then it is possible that had the Heresy not happened we would have seen Primaris Marines 10,000 years earlier.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Yeah, it does kind of undermine that famous speech by the Emperor about the Space Marines.

They shall be my finest warriors, these men who give of themselves to me. Like clay I shall mould them, and in the furnace of war forge them. They will be of iron will and steely muscle. In great armour shall I clad them and with the mightiest guns will they be armed. They will be untouched by plague or disease, no sickness will blight them. They will have tactics, strategies and machines so that no foe can best them in battle. They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines and they shall know no fear.
– on the Creation of the Space Marines.

Yeah, Finest warriors, except for the fact they got outdone by a Primarch and a techpriest.
I really hope they reveal at some point that the Primaris were originally based on a prototype created by the Emperor that was discovered by Roboute and Cawl.
Atm it feels like they are undermining the Emperor's Legacy by surpassing his Defenders of Humanity

Well they were already in 2nd, 3rd or 4th place after the Custodeus, Grey Knights and Death Watch (who are marines, but better marines) .

I'm reading HH: Master of Mankind now and it's interesting, the Emperor outright says he never loved the Primarchs or Marines and they are weapons with delusions of grandeur. Which goes against prior fluff but is an interesting twist. Of course he was telling that to a Custodeus so who knows, maybe he lied.

"You're totally my favs Goldy McGoldpants!"

Grey Knights and Death Watch are just specially trained marines though, not a different creation, and Custodians were body guards, not warriors iirc.
The Thunder Warriors were closer in purpose and design to the marines.

I wonder if Primaris GK and Primaris Death Watch will be a thing.
I hope GK gets a more crusader looking helmet. Because Deus Emperor Vult.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:


I always liked to think of my marines as having centuries of experience. This guy is a lot less impressive if you figure he's only been around a week or two since he was hatched from his cloning tank or whatever.

8th supposedly timeskips a couple centuries, right, to explain why the primaris are so established?

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:


I always liked to think of my marines as having centuries of experience. This guy is a lot less impressive if you figure he's only been around a week or two since he was hatched from his cloning tank or whatever.

8th supposedly timeskips a couple centuries, right, to explain why the primaris are so established?

Cawl has been working on them since before Guilliman was placed in stasis after being wounded by fulgrim. The oldest Primaris remembers the scouring and primarch's being around, he even sneers at the idea of the primarch's being divinity as he remembers the imperial truth.

I highly suggest reading the dark imperium book, the way they look at the primaris is actually quite well done.

 AduroT wrote:
To be fair Space Marines are technology, and technology is always being improved upon.

We're talking about a setting that has had, right there at the front of every rulebook and novel, a blurb that includes the literal actual words:

To be a man in such times is to live in the cruellest and most bloody regime imaginable. These are the tales of those times. Forget the power of technology and science, for so much has forgotten, never to be re-learned. Forget the promise of progress and understanding, for in the grim darkness of the far future there is only war. There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods.

Technology in 40K isn't improved upon, because technology is considered a holy relic of the past and experimentation or innovation are heresies that get you lobotomised and turned into a monotask servitor scrubbing the same two-metre square of public toilet floor for the rest of your life. This is why Rowboat and the Primaris stick in the craw so badly for some of us - in any other scenario the Primaris would be treated as grotesque abominations to be hunted down and exterminated just like all the other genetically-deviant Space Marines that have shown up over the millennia, and Cawl would have been kept conscious as he was very slowly disassembled and discarded bit by bit into a vat of something agonisingly corrosive just for inventing a new type of bolt weapon without sanction, nevermind tinkering casually with what the vast majority of the Mechanicus consider to be one of the peak achievements of their actual god. But they can just cast all of that prior worldbuilding aside without having to think about it Because Primarch. And they'll keep doing it going forward - every time something inconvenient pops up it will simply be changed by fiat, Because Primarch.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 AduroT wrote:
To be fair Space Marines are technology, and technology is always being improved upon.

We're talking about a setting that has had, right there at the front of every rulebook and novel, a blurb that includes the literal actual words:

To be a man in such times is to live in the cruellest and most bloody regime imaginable. These are the tales of those times. Forget the power of technology and science, for so much has forgotten, never to be re-learned. Forget the promise of progress and understanding, for in the grim darkness of the far future there is only war. There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods.

Technology in 40K isn't improved upon, because technology is considered a holy relic of the past and experimentation or innovation are heresies that get you lobotomised and turned into a monotask servitor scrubbing the same two-metre square of public toilet floor for the rest of your life. This is why Rowboat and the Primaris stick in the craw so badly for some of us - in any other scenario the Primaris would be treated as grotesque abominations to be hunted down and exterminated just like all the other genetically-deviant Space Marines that have shown up over the millennia, and Cawl would have been kept conscious as he was very slowly disassembled and discarded bit by bit into a vat of something agonisingly corrosive just for inventing a new type of bolt weapon without sanction, nevermind tinkering casually with what the vast majority of the Mechanicus consider to be one of the peak achievements of their actual god. But they can just cast all of that prior worldbuilding aside without having to think about it Because Primarch. And they'll keep doing it going forward - every time something inconvenient pops up it will simply be changed by fiat, Because Primarch.

Unless you are Tau

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:


I always liked to think of my marines as having centuries of experience. This guy is a lot less impressive if you figure he's only been around a week or two since he was hatched from his cloning tank or whatever.

8th supposedly timeskips a couple centuries, right, to explain why the primaris are so established?

That, and the wibbly wobbly time shenanigans going on after the warp storms broke out and the astronomican was messed up. So some planets/universes had normal time, some had slower time and others had "What the crap is this speeeeeeed!" going on.

Explains how Guilliman popped up at Baal while it still was being invaded by the Nids Leviathan tendril (Which disapeared overnight with the help of... Khorne and sped up time on their moons.) with a full Crusade fleet and all the Primaris Marines.

That said, I need me more Primaris.

Khorne protecting the Blood Angels to corrupt them later would be interesting if the GW writers pull it off...

 Crazyterran wrote:
Khorne protecting the Blood Angels to corrupt them later would be interesting if the GW writers pull it off...

Wait, what> Next yoyr goona tell me Necrons & Blood Angels team up to battle a common foe. Not buying it.

 krazynadechukr wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:
Khorne protecting the Blood Angels to corrupt them later would be interesting if the GW writers pull it off...

Wait, what> Next yoyr goona tell me Necrons & Blood Angels team up to battle a common foe. Not buying it.

Well, they do enter into a state of murderous rage, to the point where they had to make a separate detachment for those who are most susceptible to it.
I wouldn't be surprised if Khorne has an interest in the the Blood Angels.
Makes more sense than the Necrons and BA teaming up anyway.

I too am disappointed by the execution of Primaris marines in the fluff. I much prefer KK's suggestion that Cawl's grand project was instead new gear & drugs to improve on pre-existing space marines. Though as I understand it old marines can be Primaris-ified, so it would be interesting to see characters undergo that transformation.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
I too am disappointed by the execution of Primaris marines in the fluff. I much prefer KK's suggestion that Cawl's grand project was instead new gear & drugs to improve on pre-existing space marines. Though as I understand it old marines can be Primaris-ified, so it would be interesting to see characters undergo that transformation.

...that last bit there is now in question, and it is looking like this is actually NOT the case!