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Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
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Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Spoletta wrote:
Hardly, i think that this is the same situation of the SM codex. They have the <Chapter> keyword and the adeptus astartes keyword. Theyr stratagems and relics RAW would apply also to Blood Angels since they share the Adeptus Astartes keyword, but they don't since in the codex it specifies that only the Adeptus Astartes from that book can benefit from it.
We could have an identical situation for tyranid keyword.


Ah, I was unaware of that exception. Ignore me then, that’s enough precedent to convince me.

It would be nice to have cult units following lictor pheromone trails as an ambush failsafe though
   
Made in us
Norn Queen






C4790M wrote:
Spoletta wrote:
Hardly, i think that this is the same situation of the SM codex. They have the <Chapter> keyword and the adeptus astartes keyword. Theyr stratagems and relics RAW would apply also to Blood Angels since they share the Adeptus Astartes keyword, but they don't since in the codex it specifies that only the Adeptus Astartes from that book can benefit from it.
We could have an identical situation for tyranid keyword.


Ah, I was unaware of that exception. Ignore me then, that’s enough precedent to convince me.

It would be nice to have cult units following lictor pheromone trails as an ambush failsafe though


Its the reason forgeworld forces like DKOK Elysians, red scorpions etc etc... don't get to use doctrines/chapter tactics. They are not armies that are a part of that codex so nothing from that codex applies to them.

On the pus side, when FW starts releasing 8th ed Imperial Armor books we may gain a Anphelion Hive Fleet with a new adaptation and some new relics, stratagems, and such instead of just the rules for the FW models.


These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
 
   
Made in nl
Longtime Dakkanaut





shogun wrote:
.....
HQ: Neurothrope (babysitting biovores)
.......


Dynas wrote: @ shogun, you have no synapse for your biovores.


ehhh yes I do..


I don't understand why tyranid players are so hyped up about the whole 'reroll charge' bonus (behemoth). Getting 3 tyranid units in close combat with the 'bubble wrap' conscripts instead of only one unit, doesn't make a difference. Bubble wrap dies or falls back and tyranids get shot in the face just like before.

   
Made in fr
Dakka Veteran






shogun wrote:
shogun wrote:
.....
HQ: Neurothrope (babysitting biovores)
.......


Dynas wrote: @ shogun, you have no synapse for your biovores.


ehhh yes I do..


I don't understand why tyranid players are so hyped up about the whole 'reroll charge' bonus (behemoth). Getting 3 tyranid units in close combat with the 'bubble wrap' conscripts instead of only one unit, doesn't make a difference. Bubble wrap dies or falls back and tyranids get shot in the face just like before.



You are right. What is better, however, that conscripts got nerfed and Dakka-fexes and Dakka-Tyrants have 24 shots BS3+ now. This is all very good against bubble-wrap.
   
Made in us
Tunneling Trygon





NJ

 Niiai wrote:
I like the colours schemes.


Is enchanted sences always the include if I wanne go shooting fexes?

What are people opinions on the carpaces? The one that shoots, or the one that makes it harder to shoot.

Is the way to do carnifexes dakka with venom cannon, enchanted sences and hard to hit?


Yes you can and always should do both. You can be shooty and be harder to hit. The only reason you would not take the -1 to hit is if you know for sure you'll have a Malanthrope babysitting them, but tbh I'd just rather they be able to be more mobile and autonomous for 10 points a fex. Furthermore, you can be jormungdr and be "in cover" always. That 2+ save fex is literally what we always wanted.


I'm still looking for a fex assault threat...but I just don't see it at str 6 with those talons. I think I'll just keep old one eye since he is un-targetable. Maybe a stone crusher would do the work. I think I take maybe 1 screamer killer fex with metabolic movement so that I can charge turn 2 for sure.

those dakka fexes are pretty hot right now. The ONLY thing stopping me from auto including 3 or more is that they're quite probably going to be out of range turn 1 if it's not Dawn of War deployment. But if you are able to fire at full efficiency on turn 1 somehow, they're the best shooting bargain in the entire codex (vs t3 and t4 anyhow). And tbh, with the volume of fire they put out, it's one of our best bets for walloping some of the bigger things. Yeah, they wound on 5's, but if you get some decent rolls...they fail 4 or 5 saves....suddenly BAM you double that damage and that's a big deal!

But for ultra competitive, I think I have to go with dakka flyrants for alpha strike mitigation. Having psychic powers helps too. And being able to always get within 12" of what you're likely shooting at (chaff units) is a big deal for some of the predominant armies with -1 to hit outside of 12"
   
Made in us
Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot






Texas

shogun wrote:
shogun wrote:
.....
HQ: Neurothrope (babysitting biovores)
.......


Dynas wrote: @ shogun, you have no synapse for your biovores.


ehhh yes I do..



But the Neurothrope is a different hive fleet, I didn't think synapse was universal. I think the synapse only provides to like minded hive fleets, maybe I am wrong. But, not having synapse for the Biovores isn't a bad thing, you get -2 to hit if you move and can spam spore mines.

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Made in nl
Longtime Dakkanaut





Astmeister wrote:
shogun wrote:
shogun wrote:
.....
HQ: Neurothrope (babysitting biovores)
.......


Dynas wrote: @ shogun, you have no synapse for your biovores.


ehhh yes I do..


I don't understand why tyranid players are so hyped up about the whole 'reroll charge' bonus (behemoth). Getting 3 tyranid units in close combat with the 'bubble wrap' conscripts instead of only one unit, doesn't make a difference. Bubble wrap dies or falls back and tyranids get shot in the face just like before.



You are right. What is better, however, that conscripts got nerfed and Dakka-fexes and Dakka-Tyrants have 24 shots BS3+ now. This is all very good against bubble-wrap.


Yea but that got nothing to do with the reroll charge bonus. in what shape or form, bubble wrap will always block the charge.

luke1705 wrote:

those dakka fexes are pretty hot right now. The ONLY thing stopping me from auto including 3 or more is that they're quite probably going to be out of range turn 1 if it's not Dawn of War deployment. But if you are able to fire at full efficiency on turn 1 somehow, they're the best shooting bargain in the entire codex (vs t3 and t4 anyhow). And tbh, with the volume of fire they put out, it's one of our best bets for walloping some of the bigger things. Yeah, they wound on 5's, but if you get some decent rolls...they fail 4 or 5 saves....suddenly BAM you double that damage and that's a big deal!

But for ultra competitive, I think I have to go with dakka flyrants for alpha strike mitigation. Having psychic powers helps too. And being able to always get within 12" of what you're likely shooting at (chaff units) is a big deal for some of the predominant armies with -1 to hit outside of 12"


I think you're right. In a competitive environment the carnifexes are not going to make a big difference. They're to slow for that and not being able to shoot first turn is a big price to pay. Deep strike dakka tyrant with 4+ inv and smite/psychic scream does a better job in my opinion.
   
Made in us
Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot






Texas

Thoughts on taking this Brigade just for CP spam. Comes out 753 points, leaves you with 1250 ish for whatever you want. Just trying to make the cheapest list possible. Getting 9+3+X CP. Massive -1 for malanthrope, hold rippers underground to tunnel objectives. Spore mines for DS denial, Biovores are always solid choice. Lictor to DS/Disrupt enemy backline. Thoughts on this? What would we fill out with the remaining 1250?

HQ
Malanthrope -90
Malanthrope -90
Malanthrope -90

Troops
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33

Fast Attack
Spore Mine x3 -30
Spore Mine x3 -30
Spore Mine x3 -30

Elites
Lictor-41
Lictor-41
Lictor-41

Heavy Support
Biovore -24
Biovore -24
Biovore -24




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Made in fr
Dakka Veteran






Dynas wrote:
Thoughts on taking this Brigade just for CP spam. Comes out 753 points, leaves you with 1250 ish for whatever you want. Just trying to make the cheapest list possible. Getting 9+3+X CP. Massive -1 for malanthrope, hold rippers underground to tunnel objectives. Spore mines for DS denial, Biovores are always solid choice. Lictor to DS/Disrupt enemy backline. Thoughts on this? What would we fill out with the remaining 1250?

HQ
Malanthrope -90
Malanthrope -90
Malanthrope -90

Troops
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33
Ripper Swarm x3 - 33

Fast Attack
Spore Mine x3 -30
Spore Mine x3 -30
Spore Mine x3 -30

Elites
Lictor-41
Lictor-41
Lictor-41

Heavy Support
Biovore -24
Biovore -24
Biovore -24





The Neurothropes seem to be even cheaper with 70 points each as an HQ. And besides they can cast spells, so I would also switch either all Malanthropes or some for Neuros.
   
Made in us
Tunneling Trygon





NJ

What I like best about Tyranids is that we can reserve almost anything we like, and that we have a lot of solid choices in every slot, so you don’t have to take things just because they’re cheap.

Grab some exocrines in the heavy slot, or a dakkafex or three. I’m not super sold on biovores, but I’ll certainly give them a shot to see how those mortal wounds stack up. Could really make or break a game against a primarch.

Lictors as elites I think are mandatory now, but I’ll probably run a Hive Guard unit to double fire (just not in my main Brigade). Does the deathleaper count as a “lictor” for the lictor Strat? might be worth running if so.

Flyrants are amazing HQ choices again with the ability to deep strike and with fly meaning they always fire at full effect, plus malanthropes and Broodlords are excellent too. The HQ section is actually pretty bloated.

Gargoyles are a beautiful deep striking unit. No, they won’t “tarpit” things, but if those things can’t fall back and shoot, that’s a real issue. And if you get lucky, maybe you can wrap around and lock yourself in combat. It’s a real nuisance unit for only 60 points.

Rippers are the penultimate objective grabbers. Hormagants are awesome. Nothing more needs to be said about Genestealers, and now they got even more adaptable. Even the devilgant with just a ton of shooting is much better since you can fire them twice.

The more I look at this, the more I think that Tyranids absolutely have a solid place in the competitive scene
   
Made in us
Omnipotent Necron Overlord






 luke1705 wrote:
What I like best about Tyranids is that we can reserve almost anything we like, and that we have a lot of solid choices in every slot, so you don’t have to take things just because they’re cheap.

Grab some exocrines in the heavy slot, or a dakkafex or three. I’m not super sold on biovores, but I’ll certainly give them a shot to see how those mortal wounds stack up. Could really make or break a game against a primarch.

Lictors as elites I think are mandatory now, but I’ll probably run a Hive Guard unit to double fire (just not in my main Brigade). Does the deathleaper count as a “lictor” for the lictor Strat? might be worth running if so.

Flyrants are amazing HQ choices again with the ability to deep strike and with fly meaning they always fire at full effect, plus malanthropes and Broodlords are excellent too. The HQ section is actually pretty bloated.

Gargoyles are a beautiful deep striking unit. No, they won’t “tarpit” things, but if those things can’t fall back and shoot, that’s a real issue. And if you get lucky, maybe you can wrap around and lock yourself in combat. It’s a real nuisance unit for only 60 points.

Rippers are the penultimate objective grabbers. Hormagants are awesome. Nothing more needs to be said about Genestealers, and now they got even more adaptable. Even the devilgant with just a ton of shooting is much better since you can fire them twice.

The more I look at this, the more I think that Tyranids absolutely have a solid place in the competitive scene

Totally. I think they have some really good internal balance too so that means we will have a variety of units showing up in competitive.

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Am I crazy or is Implant Attack REALLY awesome? If you wound a model but fail to slay it, you roll a die and on a 2+ that model suffers a MW. Who needs AP when you can just MW any non-vehicles that makes a save, Armor or otherwise??
   
Made in us
Tunneling Trygon





NJ

Let's be real though. Tactically-speaking, all that really matters is that my Zoats will rise again. I mean, my hive guard.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/03 14:19:23


 
   
Made in us
Tunneling Trygon






Rivener wrote:
Am I crazy or is Implant Attack REALLY awesome? If you wound a model but fail to slay it, you roll a die and on a 2+ that model suffers a MW. Who needs AP when you can just MW any non-vehicles that makes a save, Armor or otherwise??


Well, you don't successfully wound them unless they fail a save. But even then, it is only one mortal wound. So if a unit does 3 wounds to magnus in CC, you will do one more on a 2+. Unless you attack multiple multi-wound units you will never deal more than a single wound.


 
   
Made in no
Liche Priest Hierophant





Bergen

Zoats with shoot one more time stratagem will be good. Bith impaler and shock cannon.

So will 30 devilgaunts.

Perhaps even a group of warriors? Or some dakka raveners from reserves.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/03 14:21:37


   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Dynas wrote:
shogun wrote:
shogun wrote:
.....
HQ: Neurothrope (babysitting biovores)
.......


Dynas wrote: @ shogun, you have no synapse for your biovores.


ehhh yes I do..



But the Neurothrope is a different hive fleet, I didn't think synapse was universal. I think the synapse only provides to like minded hive fleets, maybe I am wrong. But, not having synapse for the Biovores isn't a bad thing, you get -2 to hit if you move and can spam spore mines.


Correct. Synapse doesent work on all nids, just that fleet. So no, he's not a babysitter
   
Made in us
Omnipotent Necron Overlord






How disgusting is kronos going to be with their warlord trait plus strategem. So if they fail any test within 18 inches (it's always on) psyker takes d3 mortal wounds. They are already -1 to cast for shadow in the warp and you can always use the stratagem for them to only use 1 dice! I mean - you are ether going to get a lot of free mortal wounds or they will just decide not to cast powers until your warlord is dead.

Both of these are great news for the your army that game.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/03 14:32:32


If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




 jifel wrote:
Rivener wrote:
Am I crazy or is Implant Attack REALLY awesome? If you wound a model but fail to slay it, you roll a die and on a 2+ that model suffers a MW. Who needs AP when you can just MW any non-vehicles that makes a save, Armor or otherwise??


Well, you don't successfully wound them unless they fail a save. But even then, it is only one mortal wound. So if a unit does 3 wounds to magnus in CC, you will do one more on a 2+. Unless you attack multiple multi-wound units you will never deal more than a single wound.


This could probably use a FAQ, because I just reread the rule book and it says you determine wounds and then determine saves. Which seems to indicate I could land five wounds on five marines, but they then save all five of them. The fight is now over, so I use Implant Attack and make a roll for each of the models wounded, but not slain. That’s all of them. So I roll five dice and inflict 5 MWs, killing off the marines entirely. Am I misreading the strategem?
   
Made in us
Rampaging Carnifex





Fredericksburg, Virginia

Can the jorm strat be used for multiple units? For example, spend 3 CP and bring in 3 units of genestealers from raveners holes? And give those raveners 24 inch deathspitters.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/03 14:38:22


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Made in us
Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot






Texas

 jifel wrote:
Rivener wrote:
Am I crazy or is Implant Attack REALLY awesome? If you wound a model but fail to slay it, you roll a die and on a 2+ that model suffers a MW. Who needs AP when you can just MW any non-vehicles that makes a save, Armor or otherwise??


Well, you don't successfully wound them unless they fail a save. But even then, it is only one mortal wound. So if a unit does 3 wounds to magnus in CC, you will do one more on a 2+. Unless you attack multiple multi-wound units you will never deal more than a single wound.


This. I looks good on paper, but the way multiwound model wound allocation works, your likely never to get more than 1 extra mortal wound unless you get some wierd multi unit With multiple wounds lock into combat. Perhaps if flanking genestealers were able to lock in a IG Tank gun line or a group of razorbacks, its possible but unlikely.

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Made in fr
Dakka Veteran






 Xenomancers wrote:
How disgusting is kronos going to be with their warlord trait plus strategem. So if they fail any test within 18 inches (it's always on) psyker takes d3 mortal wounds. They are already -1 to cast for shadow in the warp and you can always use the stratagem for them to only use 1 dice! I mean - you are ether going to get a lot of free mortal wounds or they will just decide not to cast powers until your warlord is dead.

Both of these are great news for the your army that game.


Unfortunately it does not really help against some super psykers like Magnus, since he gets a +2 or +3 to cast anyway.
But I think that is will be really nasty against cheap smite spam lists.
   
Made in us
Tough Tyrant Guard






@rivener is mostly correct. You allocate wounds BEFORE you roll saves,but people typically speed roll all their saves at once. This is technically incorrect, as you have no permission to speed roll saves, you must allocate, and save, them one at a time.

The problem is, if you allocate the wounds one at a time, and roll on the same model until it dies, you will never allocate to a model that doesn't die except the model that takes the last wound.

So, unless you multi-charge, you will only ever deal a single MW to any unit you wound with this.

GOOD NEWS, you don't need an unsaved wound for it to work, so, that's a little bit better.

Relevant rule;

If an attack
successfully wounds the target,
the player commanding the
target unit allocates the wound to
any model in the unit (the chosen
model does not have to be within
range or visible to the attacking
unit). If a model in the target
unit has already lost any wounds,
the damage must be allocated to
that model.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/03 15:11:40


 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/11/03/codex-tyranids-preview-units-nov-3gw-homepage-post-2/

   
Made in us
Rampaging Carnifex





Fredericksburg, Virginia

 Astmeister wrote:
 Xenomancers wrote:
How disgusting is kronos going to be with their warlord trait plus strategem. So if they fail any test within 18 inches (it's always on) psyker takes d3 mortal wounds. They are already -1 to cast for shadow in the warp and you can always use the stratagem for them to only use 1 dice! I mean - you are ether going to get a lot of free mortal wounds or they will just decide not to cast powers until your warlord is dead.

Both of these are great news for the your army that game.


Unfortunately it does not really help against some super psykers like Magnus, since he gets a +2 or +3 to cast anyway.
But I think that is will be really nasty against cheap smite spam lists.


It still helps, how expensive is that warp time ability that allows him to move again? Even with +2, on 1 d6 he may not get ut. And if he does, you still have a decent chance at denying. If I can keep him from double moving or gaining +1 invul then that will be a big help.

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Made in us
Omnipotent Necron Overlord






Magnus is a super beast. He won't be completely shutdown by kronus but an army of warlocks or primaris pskyers will be. Vs normal HQ psykers they will basically have to not cast a power or accept a d3 mortal wound for the 1 dice attempt at something with -1 to cast (this will require a 6 for even the cheapest spells) Plus you will be able to deny a magnus super power a lot easier for 2 command points.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/11/03 15:28:43


If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in us
Tough Tyrant Guard






Warptime is only 6, so he has a 50% (or 33% if in SITW) chance still, however we have a much better chance of denying, seeing as he's capped at on 1d6.
   
Made in fr
Dakka Veteran






 Zimko wrote:
 Astmeister wrote:
 Xenomancers wrote:
How disgusting is kronos going to be with their warlord trait plus strategem. So if they fail any test within 18 inches (it's always on) psyker takes d3 mortal wounds. They are already -1 to cast for shadow in the warp and you can always use the stratagem for them to only use 1 dice! I mean - you are ether going to get a lot of free mortal wounds or they will just decide not to cast powers until your warlord is dead.

Both of these are great news for the your army that game.


Unfortunately it does not really help against some super psykers like Magnus, since he gets a +2 or +3 to cast anyway.
But I think that is will be really nasty against cheap smite spam lists.


It still helps, how expensive is that warp time ability that allows him to move again? Even with +2, on 1 d6 he may not get ut. And if he does, you still have a decent chance at denying. If I can keep him from double moving or gaining +1 invul then that will be a big help.


Okay you are right about that. Quite frankly there is no better psyker defense than Kronos Hive Fleet with the special WL trait.
   
Made in us
Norn Queen






 Zimko wrote:
Can the jorm strat be used for multiple units? For example, spend 3 CP and bring in 3 units of genestealers from raveners holes? And give those raveners 24 inch deathspitters.


\Yes. Its before the game starts so can be used multiple times.


These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
 
   
Made in us
Rampaging Carnifex





Fredericksburg, Virginia

 Lance845 wrote:
 Zimko wrote:
Can the jorm strat be used for multiple units? For example, spend 3 CP and bring in 3 units of genestealers from raveners holes? And give those raveners 24 inch deathspitters.


\Yes. Its before the game starts so can be used multiple times.


Excellent, and the raveners don't have to be the same fleet. So right now I'm thinking of taking raveners in a behemoth detachment with adrenal gland gaunts or stealers in a jorm detachment and 3 neuros in a Kronos supreme command detachment.

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Dakka Veteran






That is all valid, but you have to watch out for your Synapse coverage!
   
 
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