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Made in us
Damsel of the Lady




Tiberias wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Has GW ever produced rule changes for FW models? I mean other than nerfs? It seems like would anyone be shocked if GW just forgot that we were in the pipe, and left us alone with our Talons mistake?


Well, no but FW will bring out new and updated indexes in book form for all their units some time this year if I'm not mistaken and I really hope for some updated rules for our 3 forgeworld dreads. And the venetari while we're at it, because the models are bitchin, but their rules and cost are rather lackluster.


GW took over making FW rules. They made the current datasheet for the Custodes units.
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




Audustum wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Has GW ever produced rule changes for FW models? I mean other than nerfs? It seems like would anyone be shocked if GW just forgot that we were in the pipe, and left us alone with our Talons mistake?


Well, no but FW will bring out new and updated indexes in book form for all their units some time this year if I'm not mistaken and I really hope for some updated rules for our 3 forgeworld dreads. And the venetari while we're at it, because the models are bitchin, but their rules and cost are rather lackluster.


GW took over making FW rules. They made the current datasheet for the Custodes units.


Well then, here's even more hoping that they will update our three FW dreads.

While we're at, do you guys think that FW will expand their custodes line in the future even more or is that line done? I'd Personally like to see special hetaeron guard models.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




The Shield one needs a 3++ period.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight




I don’t know enough about the Heresy line (or Heresy fluff even) unfortunately, and that has been the source of all FW Custodes units. I do know that that are or at least were considered a somewhat OP army in that game, and if I had to speculate based on the other releases FW will probably keep churning out more specialist units for the legions. But who knows.

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment. 
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
The Shield one needs a 3++ period.


I'd love that, I'm not sure if it would be too strong though. T7 with a 2+, 3++ and 6+++ is extremely tanky.

I'd rather they give his sword two profiles: a piercing profile With S 2x, AP - 4 and flat 3 dmg
And a slashing profile with S user, AP - 3, D 1 and when the bearer fights every attack in his profile counts as 2

This would be fitting I think for a dread that has no real ranged ability and is entirely focused on melee.
Also I want a stratagem for the galatus for...I don't know... 1-2 CP where he can shoot his flamer into melee.

Wishful thinking maybe, but it would be awsome

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/05/13 18:42:07


 
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




It would be hotness if our contemptor was suddenly even close to worth it's points. Right now it's completely worthless. Unless you use it as a countas model for a Telemon.
   
Made in gb
Steadfast Grey Hunter






So something that popped into my head last night while I was falling asleep (strange I know). As Custodes were designed with soup in mind when 8th was released, wouldnt the easiest thing be to give them a "servants of the emprah" ability which means they could soup in Imperial allies with no negatives. At least that way there would be access to the Loyal 32 or some Admech to help balance out the glaring weaknesses in the Custodes lineup.

Zap Brannigan -
"In the game of chess you can never let your adversary see your pieces."
"If we hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes should fall like a house of cards. Checkmate."
"Rock breaks scissors. But paper covers rock, and scissors cut paper! Kiff: we have a conundrum...... Search them for paper... and bring me a rock." 
   
Made in gb
Witch Hunter in the Shadows





Tiberias wrote:
Well then, here's even more hoping that they will update our three FW dreads.
Presumably there is still a half finished Contemptor-Exemplar sitting around the forceworld office somewhere.
   
Made in us
Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight




 Garrlor wrote:
So something that popped into my head last night while I was falling asleep (strange I know). As Custodes were designed with soup in mind when 8th was released, wouldnt the easiest thing be to give them a "servants of the emprah" ability which means they could soup in Imperial allies with no negatives. At least that way there would be access to the Loyal 32 or some Admech to help balance out the glaring weaknesses in the Custodes lineup.

Right now, there ARE no negatives to souping. Neither AdMech, Astra Militarium, or Custodes themselves lose any benefits from having other faction’s detachments alongside them, and that is even after the PA AM update. In fact, the only armies that have to be 100% pure for special bonuses are Space Marine variants at this point. Also, IIRC the “Imperium can’t be a faction keyword” FAQ came out before the codex was released or extremely shortly thereafter, and Custodes enjoyed an extremely high monofaction win rate last summer (thanks FW!).
Point is, Custodes aren’t “designed with soup” any more or less than any other army. The reason their win-rates are down is the same every other army has also dropped: Iron Hands had a 70+% win rate in some cases with other Space Marine flavors dominating everyone except for a couple Tau and Eldar builds. We haven’t really seen the impact of the SM FAQ yet since Covid-19 happened about the same time it dropped.

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment. 
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




They absolutely were designed with soup in mind. When they were developed for 8th, soup was clearly the way GW wanted their armies to go. They had done nothing to stop the trend, and even actively encouraged it. The first several released press about the Custodes featured them with SM, AM, and Ad-mech allies. To say GW didn't create armies in the start of 8th with Soup in mind is just a flat out misreading of the well established history of 8th. Also, their soupiness has nothing to do with win/loss rates, but just an argument as to their creation in 8th.
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:They absolutely were designed with soup in mind. When they were developed for 8th, soup was clearly the way GW wanted their armies to go. They had done nothing to stop the trend, and even actively encouraged it. The first several released press about the Custodes featured them with SM, AM, and Ad-mech allies. To say GW didn't create armies in the start of 8th with Soup in mind is just a flat out misreading of the well established history of 8th. Also, their soupiness has nothing to do with win/loss rates, but just an argument as to their creation in 8th.


Garrlor wrote:So something that popped into my head last night while I was falling asleep (strange I know). As Custodes were designed with soup in mind when 8th was released, wouldnt the easiest thing be to give them a "servants of the emprah" ability which means they could soup in Imperial allies with no negatives. At least that way there would be access to the Loyal 32 or some Admech to help balance out the glaring weaknesses in the Custodes lineup.


I would just argue that factions should be designed to be able to stand on their own, at least I think that is the way they should be going with their faction development.
Now here is hoping that with our psychic awakening debut we will get some stuff to hold up better
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




Except for the ever undying rumor that 9th will just wipe the slate clean, in which case why bother?
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except for the ever undying rumor that 9th will just wipe the slate clean, in which case why bother?


Well the argument I made still stands, 9th Ed or not. If they release 9th edition this year, I'd want them to design the factions to be able to stand on their own without requiring soup.

And let's remember, 9th Ed coming this year or coming at all for that matter it still just a rumor. Maybe we'll know more on Saturday, though I am more in favor of a juicy necron preview.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except for the ever undying rumor that 9th will just wipe the slate clean, in which case why bother?


Why would they do a full rules reboot again that fast? There were decades between 2nd and 8th.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except for the ever undying rumor that 9th will just wipe the slate clean, in which case why bother?


I hope so.

For an edition that was supposed to be 'streamlined', there's so much bloat and power creep already.

I'd love to see an end to the constant re-roll spam that armies chuck out nowadays, and for strategems to stop being such a huge deciding factor in games.
   
Made in us
Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker





Somewhere over the rainbow, way up high

Good lord i hope there is A) an end to anything with "reroll all to hits" and "reroll all to wounds"

That, and most weapons should lose a point or two of AP

Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts

MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum. 
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




changemod wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except for the ever undying rumor that 9th will just wipe the slate clean, in which case why bother?


Why would they do a full rules reboot again that fast? There were decades between 2nd and 8th.


Can't tell if joking. The majority of editions have been between 3-5 years apart. Guess where 8th is? Also, almost every new Edition is heralded by the release of SoB about 6-10 months prior. Guess what dropped in late 2019.

They are trying to go to a "Living" rule set according to several insiders/influencers. But that being said, this is one undying field that needs to be divine smited back to the netherrealm of matt Ward's butt hole.

Marines are just barely less OP than they used to be, half the races/factions are flat garbage and don't even see competitive meta, and the majority of the top lists are heavy on the FW side, which means even from a financial stake, GW's investors, which are not the same as FW's investors, aren't making their money back. Oh, and the lore they are coming out with is utter trash. Godo level trash.

The Silent king is back, and oh wait, he created the Nid's, but only before he did that he created a planet sized death star and has been chasing them around the universe for the last 60k (?) years. And the rumors are, that Hive Fleets aren't trying to wipe out the galaxy, they are literally running from the Silent King. Because he knows something about how to end their existence.

I'm telling you, the sooner we end this horrific abomination of an edition we can get back to the good fluff, where Ad-Mech are traitors and heretics, and the only living primarch is also a anime fan race traitor.
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
changemod wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except for the ever undying rumor that 9th will just wipe the slate clean, in which case why bother?


Why would they do a full rules reboot again that fast? There were decades between 2nd and 8th.


Can't tell if joking. The majority of editions have been between 3-5 years apart. Guess where 8th is? Also, almost every new Edition is heralded by the release of SoB about 6-10 months prior. Guess what dropped in late 2019.

They are trying to go to a "Living" rule set according to several insiders/influencers. But that being said, this is one undying field that needs to be divine smited back to the netherrealm of matt Ward's butt hole.

Marines are just barely less OP than they used to be, half the races/factions are flat garbage and don't even see competitive meta, and the majority of the top lists are heavy on the FW side, which means even from a financial stake, GW's investors, which are not the same as FW's investors, aren't making their money back. Oh, and the lore they are coming out with is utter trash. Godo level trash.

The Silent king is back, and oh wait, he created the Nid's, but only before he did that he created a planet sized death star and has been chasing them around the universe for the last 60k (?) years. And the rumors are, that Hive Fleets aren't trying to wipe out the galaxy, they are literally running from the Silent King. Because he knows something about how to end their existence.

I'm telling you, the sooner we end this horrific abomination of an edition we can get back to the good fluff, where Ad-Mech are traitors and heretics, and the only living primarch is also a anime fan race traitor.


Please don't take this the wrong way, but in the posts and topics you seem passionate about, you tend towards hyperbole.
The recent lore is not goto level trash, there have been well written codices and books this edition, our own faction is a good example of that.
I don't know where you got the idea that the silent King created the tyranids, but that's nothing but a rumor at best.

Also many factions not seeing competitive meta might be true or has been true at some point, but you have to give it to gw that they at least tried to fix things more often this edition via FAQs and light faction updates like psychic awakening.
Though I'll grant you that the psychic awakening fluff has been very subpar at best.
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




Tiberias wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
changemod wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except for the ever undying rumor that 9th will just wipe the slate clean, in which case why bother?


Why would they do a full rules reboot again that fast? There were decades between 2nd and 8th.


Can't tell if joking. The majority of editions have been between 3-5 years apart. Guess where 8th is? Also, almost every new Edition is heralded by the release of SoB about 6-10 months prior. Guess what dropped in late 2019.

They are trying to go to a "Living" rule set according to several insiders/influencers. But that being said, this is one undying field that needs to be divine smited back to the netherrealm of matt Ward's butt hole.

Marines are just barely less OP than they used to be, half the races/factions are flat garbage and don't even see competitive meta, and the majority of the top lists are heavy on the FW side, which means even from a financial stake, GW's investors, which are not the same as FW's investors, aren't making their money back. Oh, and the lore they are coming out with is utter trash. Godo level trash.

The Silent king is back, and oh wait, he created the Nid's, but only before he did that he created a planet sized death star and has been chasing them around the universe for the last 60k (?) years. And the rumors are, that Hive Fleets aren't trying to wipe out the galaxy, they are literally running from the Silent King. Because he knows something about how to end their existence.

I'm telling you, the sooner we end this horrific abomination of an edition we can get back to the good fluff, where Ad-Mech are traitors and heretics, and the only living primarch is also a anime fan race traitor.


Please don't take this the wrong way, but in the posts and topics you seem passionate about, you tend towards hyperbole.
The recent lore is not goto level trash, there have been well written codices and books this edition, our own faction is a good example of that.
I don't know where you got the idea that the silent King created the tyranids, but that's nothing but a rumor at best.

Also many factions not seeing competitive meta might be true or has been true at some point, but you have to give it to gw that they at least tried to fix things more often this edition via FAQs and light faction updates like psychic awakening.
Though I'll grant you that the psychic awakening fluff has been very subpar at best.


No offense taken, it was very hyperbolic.

As for the Tyranids, in a recent White Dwarf lore bit (Cannon)

...there he bred horrors of infinite hunger. Finally pleased with their form, he showed the the shining light of the world and unleashed them upon it, where they moved from kingdom to kingdom, devouring everything." PRETTY SURE THAT's the nommy horde.

As for Goto Level trash, We have the lore writers behind DoW3, where a SM Captain in Terminator armor does literal foward flips. Granted this isn't lore per-se. However we have lore breaks aplenty. Leader of the Cogboys has been hoarding geneseed that even the Lords of Terra didn't know about, oh, and he has some of the original traitor legions geneseed on stock as well. So he basically is somehow as smart or smarter than the emperor, which is kinda heresy, and creates new SM legions. Somehow Rowboat violates his own father's edicts, and essentially conspires with heretics, xenos and using banned knowledge somehow is restored to life. Oh, and this whole time, Cadia, the symbol of Imperial Lawful/Good, has been using Necron Tech and working with Alderi witches.

I don't even want to get into the 40k for Kids lore.

   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
changemod wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Except for the ever undying rumor that 9th will just wipe the slate clean, in which case why bother?


Why would they do a full rules reboot again that fast? There were decades between 2nd and 8th.


Can't tell if joking. The majority of editions have been between 3-5 years apart. Guess where 8th is? Also, almost every new Edition is heralded by the release of SoB about 6-10 months prior. Guess what dropped in late 2019.


...No, I said full rules reboot. The only times that's happened are 2nd, 3rd and 8th. 3rd through 7th was one continuous evolving ruleset.

9th is completely unlikely to wipe the slate clean, it's far more likely to be a minor update like most editions are.
   
Made in gb
Twisting Tzeentch Horror






Hey uh feel like I'm breaching a very heated topic atm, but anyway

Got a telemon, because cool. Its one of the only large models I've ever painted that I'm actually happy with- I stuck about 100 purity seals all over it hehe.

What's the best way to use it in an army? Ive got both sets of the arachnus guns, and the fists, fully magnetised.

ps maybe bring the discussion back to custodes lol

 insaniak wrote:

You can choose to focus on the parts of a hobby that make you unhappy, or you can choose to focus on the parts that you enjoy.
 
   
Made in nz
Unshakeable Grey Knight Land Raider Pilot




 McMagnus Mindbullets wrote:
Hey uh feel like I'm breaching a very heated topic atm, but anyway

Got a telemon, because cool. Its one of the only large models I've ever painted that I'm actually happy with- I stuck about 100 purity seals all over it hehe.

What's the best way to use it in an army? Ive got both sets of the arachnus guns, and the fists, fully magnetised.

ps maybe bring the discussion back to custodes lol


Arachnus guns are great, best overall choice I think.

I take at least one of my Telemons in about 2/3rds of my games. Thinking back, I always do well and win handily when my opponent focusses on killing it/them. I'm still convinced that 14 wounds of T8 2+ 4++ 6+++ for under 300 points is a steal. The tricky part of course is getting the idea that it needs to die into your opponents head. I'll take either dual guns or a gun and a fist usually. Dual fists is a bit of a waste imo (unfortunate because they look great like this).

Set it up front and center with as flashy a paint scheme as you can muster, and use plenty of imaginative description when you place him, being sure to explain his offensive capability in as dramatic a way as possible, especially the damage 4 fist.
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




The fisto Roboto is a great distraction Carnifex. Theory wise, our Telemon is one of our best, if not the best unit. They are practically auto include now.
   
Made in us
Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker





Somewhere over the rainbow, way up high

I am getting increasingly nervous. As time marches on, we have yet to hear a single, solitary detail about anything in War of the Spider about the Custodes getting some help/some love.
If we get only lip service changes, the army is pretty much toast til 9th ed.

Regarding Telemons. I have several lists running 2. They were a bucket better before they got nerfed into the ground, but they are still rock solid. Sticking one of them next to a vexilla magnifica makes them absurdly hard to shift. I usually run one twin arachnus, and the other with an arachnus and a fist, sometimes out of deep strike, other times hoofing it behind bikes.

Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts

MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum. 
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




So, did Telemon's get exempted from the Codex stratagems? Can you still FGLTC 2 Telemons and give them re-roll ones? Or do they not get that as FW?

Also, I would LOVE to know who the "Ancient" Custodes are that are piloting the Naughts. Because when a Custodes gets too old, they go off and do that "travel the galaxy" self banishment thing. So if they get even OLDER, they become Dreadnaughts? How does a Custodes even make it to Dreadnaught phase?

They haven't been out battling anything like actually strong enough to pose much of a threat of Terra, so when does a Custodes suffer enough damage to get interred into a Dreadnaught? I assume it's more age than anything, hence why would they get interred if they get banished, etc?
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, did Telemon's get exempted from the Codex stratagems? Can you still FGLTC 2 Telemons and give them re-roll ones? Or do they not get that as FW?


Telemons have the Custodes and Dreadnought keywords, making them legal targets for FGLtC and Wisdom of the Ancients. There is no errata that changes this.
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, did Telemon's get exempted from the Codex stratagems? Can you still FGLTC 2 Telemons and give them re-roll ones? Or do they not get that as FW?

Also, I would LOVE to know who the "Ancient" Custodes are that are piloting the Naughts. Because when a Custodes gets too old, they go off and do that "travel the galaxy" self banishment thing. So if they get even OLDER, they become Dreadnaughts? How does a Custodes even make it to Dreadnaught phase?

They haven't been out battling anything like actually strong enough to pose much of a threat of Terra, so when does a Custodes suffer enough damage to get interred into a Dreadnaught? I assume it's more age than anything, hence why would they get interred if they get banished, etc?


Telemons are not exempt from codex stratagems as far as I know.

Custodes get interred into dreads when they are too greviously wounded. And as you well know they face and have faced a lot more threats than stuff on Terra in the last couple thousand years.
They become eyes of the emperor when they are physically fine generally, but become ever so slightly slower than before, therefore not meeting their high standards.
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





Tiberias wrote:
Well then, here's even more hoping that they will update our three FW dreads.


Eh you are hoping they update models from studio that has vested interest(money) in making sure gamers don't spam resin rather than plastic.

2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in gb
Steadfast Grey Hunter






I guess Frezzik deserves some credit for always going on about 9th edition....

Also FW are going to get new rules and books moving forward, will that help or hinder Custodes I wonder?

Zap Brannigan -
"In the game of chess you can never let your adversary see your pieces."
"If we hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes should fall like a house of cards. Checkmate."
"Rock breaks scissors. But paper covers rock, and scissors cut paper! Kiff: we have a conundrum...... Search them for paper... and bring me a rock." 
   
Made in de
Mighty Chosen Warrior of Chaos






Since custodes are on of the worst factions in 40k it can only get better ^^ and they specifically addressed custodes have problems generating CP.
   
 
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