Author |
Message |
 |
|
 |
Advert
|
Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
- No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
- Times and dates in your local timezone.
- Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
- Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
- Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now. |
|
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/02 20:19:16
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade
|
Has anyone here used the new Brazen Beasts rules in their army? I was thinking of putting a detachment of them alongside my Iron Warriors for some heavy-hitting berzerkers and spicy daemon engines. Their warlord trait sounds good but potentially risky to activate. Putting my disco lord and venomcrawler in there in a soulforged pack alonside the use of the blasphemous machines and daemonforge stratagems.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/03 00:50:52
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer
The dark hollows of Kentucky
|
Not Online!!! wrote: techsoldaten wrote:Just found out about the SM nerf. Read it and thought: this doesn't hurt any of the armies I've played against. If anything, it helps them against Chaos.
When I'm playing Daemon Primarchs, I would much rather have Devastator doctrine up than Tactical. Now they are forced to switch turn 2, that's a net benefit. Same with Chaos gunlines, most things that would benefit from Devastator are dead by turn 2.
Same with Intercessors tanking wounds for vehicles. We have a lot of D2+ weapons, it's actually worse for us to have more Intercessors on the board because anything over 2W wasted damage.
The Dreadnought Stratagem, yeah, that's a nerf, but did anyone expect unwoundable dreadnoughts to survive a FAQ? Or infiltrating Centurions? Have not faced either but those would have been tempting for anyone to do away with.
I guess, in a way it forces them to vomit more AP-1 bolt shells down at us. So yes in a way. Otoh, vehicle based lists do proft a tad from that. (if your vehicles survive that is)
What is for sure it certainly hits only IH and IF.
As for the RG shenanigans, yes but so long a dread can still do that i find the argumentation give questionable.
Super sneaky ninja 15 foot tall killer mech suits is just as logical as eliminators curving bullets. That said infiltrating said mech suits usually just gives my contemptor something to shred in turn one. I'm more annoyed that now rg will just switch from centurions to aggressors.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/03 09:52:04
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak
|
ArcaneHorror wrote:Has anyone here used the new Brazen Beasts rules in their army? I was thinking of putting a detachment of them alongside my Iron Warriors for some heavy-hitting berzerkers and spicy daemon engines. Their warlord trait sounds good but potentially risky to activate. Putting my disco lord and venomcrawler in there in a soulforged pack alonside the use of the blasphemous machines and daemonforge stratagems.
Brazen beasts are fun, until you realize they are all khorne and no sorcerer allowed. ( imo the renegades should've been mark free but that would've probably opened up alot of cheese, btw why don't we get custom warband / legion splinters?)
personally, brazen beast khorne berzerkers would be quite decent at tank hunting what with their AP-4 on 6's. The main issue will be delivery and screening, and whilest screening you can easily remove via fire from chaff you still need to get the berzerkers into melee, which the following all do better.
That said i'd also assume that you are indeed CP hungry so i'd imagine 15 CSM and 2 sorcerers with warptime and prescience in a RC detachment might actually work in your favour.
I'd then also field a brazen beast battalion with cultists and 2 Lord discordants (better three as someone that runs the srtictly more survivable al version you'd be better off with three allways sadly).
I'd still put the Khorne berzerkers into the RC detachment, simply for the even further increasable threat range (warptime + advance + charge makes for even more reach and potentially allows you to melee turn 1)
But approximately that would put you into the realm of:
320 pts for 2 Brazen beast lord discordants.
120 pts for cultists,
i'd assume 3 venomcrawlers for 345 pts
then i'd imagine that you'd want to field some IW shenanigans.
i still reccomend a sorcerer or 2 for warptimeing..
atleast another battalion worht in cultists ( cannonfodder might come in handy.)
The warlord trait is clearly superior for IW then for BB so don't bother with theirs.
Field commander might be worth it for the increased range.
|
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/04 22:10:17
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Pulsating Possessed Chaos Marine
|
Not Online!!! wrote: techsoldaten wrote:Just found out about the SM nerf. Read it and thought: this doesn't hurt any of the armies I've played against. If anything, it helps them against Chaos.
When I'm playing Daemon Primarchs, I would much rather have Devastator doctrine up than Tactical. Now they are forced to switch turn 2, that's a net benefit. Same with Chaos gunlines, most things that would benefit from Devastator are dead by turn 2.
Same with Intercessors tanking wounds for vehicles. We have a lot of D2+ weapons, it's actually worse for us to have more Intercessors on the board because anything over 2W wasted damage.
The Dreadnought Stratagem, yeah, that's a nerf, but did anyone expect unwoundable dreadnoughts to survive a FAQ? Or infiltrating Centurions? Have not faced either but those would have been tempting for anyone to do away with.
I guess, in a way it forces them to vomit more AP-1 bolt shells down at us. So yes in a way. Otoh, vehicle based lists do proft a tad from that. (if your vehicles survive that is)
What is for sure it certainly hits only IH and IF.
As for the RG shenanigans, yes but so long a dread can still do that i find the argumentation give questionable.
Definitely stings the IH that have been a plague on my local scene, plus even ultramarines and raven guard only get there super doctrine for 2 turns. Plus I've played against ravenguard assault centurions, the less of them the better!
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/04 22:19:24
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak
|
small_gods wrote:Not Online!!! wrote: techsoldaten wrote:Just found out about the SM nerf. Read it and thought: this doesn't hurt any of the armies I've played against. If anything, it helps them against Chaos.
When I'm playing Daemon Primarchs, I would much rather have Devastator doctrine up than Tactical. Now they are forced to switch turn 2, that's a net benefit. Same with Chaos gunlines, most things that would benefit from Devastator are dead by turn 2.
Same with Intercessors tanking wounds for vehicles. We have a lot of D2+ weapons, it's actually worse for us to have more Intercessors on the board because anything over 2W wasted damage.
The Dreadnought Stratagem, yeah, that's a nerf, but did anyone expect unwoundable dreadnoughts to survive a FAQ? Or infiltrating Centurions? Have not faced either but those would have been tempting for anyone to do away with.
I guess, in a way it forces them to vomit more AP-1 bolt shells down at us. So yes in a way. Otoh, vehicle based lists do proft a tad from that. (if your vehicles survive that is)
What is for sure it certainly hits only IH and IF.
As for the RG shenanigans, yes but so long a dread can still do that i find the argumentation give questionable.
Definitely stings the IH that have been a plague on my local scene, plus even ultramarines and raven guard only get there super doctrine for 2 turns. Plus I've played against ravenguard assault centurions, the less of them the better!
Tbh, i am more annoyed that gw even released them in this state.
It's 7th all over again.
|
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/04 22:42:39
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Torture Victim in the Bowels of the Rock
Fort Worth, Texas
|
Woops, didn't realize I was replying to such an old post. My bad!
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/04 23:45:26
1300pts of Dark Angels ready to repent. I mean, make their enemies repent. Yeah, that. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/04 23:21:06
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Crazed Spirit of the Defiler
|
Probably dumb question but if you roll the dreaded one with a daemon weapon, can you still use the weapon it replaces (like a power sword) or do you literally have to fight with your basic melee weapon ie S User, AP dash etc?
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/04 23:25:20
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Pulsating Possessed Chaos Marine
|
Not Online!!! wrote: small_gods wrote:Not Online!!! wrote: techsoldaten wrote:Just found out about the SM nerf. Read it and thought: this doesn't hurt any of the armies I've played against. If anything, it helps them against Chaos.
When I'm playing Daemon Primarchs, I would much rather have Devastator doctrine up than Tactical. Now they are forced to switch turn 2, that's a net benefit. Same with Chaos gunlines, most things that would benefit from Devastator are dead by turn 2.
Same with Intercessors tanking wounds for vehicles. We have a lot of D2+ weapons, it's actually worse for us to have more Intercessors on the board because anything over 2W wasted damage.
The Dreadnought Stratagem, yeah, that's a nerf, but did anyone expect unwoundable dreadnoughts to survive a FAQ? Or infiltrating Centurions? Have not faced either but those would have been tempting for anyone to do away with.
I guess, in a way it forces them to vomit more AP-1 bolt shells down at us. So yes in a way. Otoh, vehicle based lists do proft a tad from that. (if your vehicles survive that is)
What is for sure it certainly hits only IH and IF.
As for the RG shenanigans, yes but so long a dread can still do that i find the argumentation give questionable.
Definitely stings the IH that have been a plague on my local scene, plus even ultramarines and raven guard only get there super doctrine for 2 turns. Plus I've played against ravenguard assault centurions, the less of them the better!
Tbh, i am more annoyed that gw even released them in this state.
It's 7th all over again.
They were in a real state before the codex, maybe one of the worse preforming armies (except GK and Necrons) but they went from wanting to make them competitive to making them stronger than all other armies and really easy to play. It requires 0 skill to man a IH gunline or plane list but to best them you need to be really skilled and get decent rolls.
It's the problem when you have finances and rules intertwined. In an ideal world there's be an independent rules/balance agency.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/04 23:26:00
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/05 05:23:52
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer
|
Which baffles me as you'd think not having so many units/armies spending years in garbage tier would increase profits.
|
BlaxicanX wrote:A young business man named Tom Kirby, who was a pupil of mine until he turned greedy, helped the capitalists hunt down and destroy the wargamers. He betrayed and murdered Games Workshop.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/05 09:36:07
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak
|
Eldarain wrote:Which baffles me as you'd think not having so many units/armies spending years in garbage tier would increase profits.
Considering this and my personal experience, i'd have to agree. Especially newer players that don't have multiple armies, can't switch around to a better supported faction easily.
For me, i now have literally stopped buying anything for my Renegades, becuase there is nigh 0 point to do so.
Their uneven release practices also lead to a loss of maintinaing a custommer base, and a focus on allready successfull lines. In a way they create their own desinvestment cycles. Some factions atleast got the rules support to maintain a playerbase, (however the recent "improvements" to the Eldar line sure as hell is a sign of things to come) the sad part though is, that many factions theorethically are beloved but just didn't recive the love they were due imo, considering how GW was surprised at the"Demand" for SoB should show their failure at grasping what the hobby is about. Further the consolidation to few factions sure as hell isn't beneficial for the overall interest in the game long term, if i wanted to justfight Spikey marines vs Marines then id' have played 30k which has even a better ruleset for this...... as for the pricees One can only imagine what this means for future updates, like IG f.e.. Which is incidentally also why i am not eally looking forward to a potential GW dex with units for traitor guard. And i can't even imagine what aussies would think about it.
|
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/05 18:15:19
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade
|
Not Online!!! wrote: ArcaneHorror wrote:Has anyone here used the new Brazen Beasts rules in their army? I was thinking of putting a detachment of them alongside my Iron Warriors for some heavy-hitting berzerkers and spicy daemon engines. Their warlord trait sounds good but potentially risky to activate. Putting my disco lord and venomcrawler in there in a soulforged pack alonside the use of the blasphemous machines and daemonforge stratagems.
Brazen beasts are fun, until you realize they are all khorne and no sorcerer allowed. ( imo the renegades should've been mark free but that would've probably opened up alot of cheese, btw why don't we get custom warband / legion splinters?)
personally, brazen beast khorne berzerkers would be quite decent at tank hunting what with their AP-4 on 6's. The main issue will be delivery and screening, and whilest screening you can easily remove via fire from chaff you still need to get the berzerkers into melee, which the following all do better.
That said i'd also assume that you are indeed CP hungry so i'd imagine 15 CSM and 2 sorcerers with warptime and prescience in a RC detachment might actually work in your favour.
I'd then also field a brazen beast battalion with cultists and 2 Lord discordants (better three as someone that runs the srtictly more survivable al version you'd be better off with three allways sadly).
I'd still put the Khorne berzerkers into the RC detachment, simply for the even further increasable threat range (warptime + advance + charge makes for even more reach and potentially allows you to melee turn 1)
But approximately that would put you into the realm of:
320 pts for 2 Brazen beast lord discordants.
120 pts for cultists,
i'd assume 3 venomcrawlers for 345 pts
then i'd imagine that you'd want to field some IW shenanigans.
i still reccomend a sorcerer or 2 for warptimeing..
atleast another battalion worht in cultists ( cannonfodder might come in handy.)
The warlord trait is clearly superior for IW then for BB so don't bother with theirs.
Field commander might be worth it for the increased range.
I might try that. Again, daemonforge just looks too good to not at least try. Daemon Princes do well with the Iron Warriors traits and can be extremely durable due to the relics insidium or fleshmetal exoskeleton, combined with the warlord trait Iron Without and the mark of Nurgle, which gives them access to grandfather's blessings and miasma of pestilence. Obliterators are also good with them due to ignoring cover.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/09 22:02:58
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade
|
I know that CSM characters with a specific mark can only summon daemons with that mark. I was thinking of using an undivided MOP to summon Khorne daemons, and while I'm pretty sure that that specifically is legal, is it allowed for me to use a Nurgle-marked venomcrawler to boost that unit's summoning role and still get Khorne daemons?
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/10 04:28:15
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Heroic Senior Officer
|
So I'm sure others have noticed this, but I'm surprised no one seems to talk about the serious weakness with the Alpha Legion Conceal strat. Specifically, that it's vulnerable to "rhino sniping" and the like.
The strat reads, verbatim, underline for emphasis
Use this strategem at the start of the opponent's shooting phase. Select one ALPHA LEGION INFANTRY unit from your army. Until the end of the phase, enemy models can only target that unit if it is the closest visible target
Reason I bring it up is I've seen a lot of local players get confused, thinking you can hide a unit out of line of sight that is closer to prevent the concealed unit from being shot, or just in general assuming it follows the character rules as far as sniper abilities go. RAW, long as it's the closest thing you can see, it's a legal target. So for example, if I want to shoot the possessed bomb, all I need to do is finagle my shooting unit so a building blocks Los to the screen or something. Not so easy if you have cultists or something screened across the front. Pretty easy if all you have is a lord discordant with the -4 to hit or whatever.
Interesting quirk is that it also means artillery cannot target them for any reason if they can't see them, so that's fun. Just stuff to think about, primarily for new players since I'm sure a lot of the most competitive guys already noticed this.
|
'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader
"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/10 10:13:36
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak
|
ArcaneHorror wrote:I know that CSM characters with a specific mark can only summon daemons with that mark. I was thinking of using an undivided MOP to summon Khorne daemons, and while I'm pretty sure that that specifically is legal, is it allowed for me to use a Nurgle-marked venomcrawler to boost that unit's summoning role and still get Khorne daemons?
Nope, just needs to be off the same <Legion> according to it's rules. Not same mark. Also they are literally slave vessels used by warpsmiths and MoP's as oversized batteries itself beeing a chained daemon fo some good may influence some of it's behaviour but not the core point of the machine, aka beeing an oversized battery.
So yes you can. One thing i allways wondered though, is the effect cumulative, as in if i stand around 3 do i get + 3 to my role?
Automatically Appended Next Post: MrMoustaffa wrote:So I'm sure others have noticed this, but I'm surprised no one seems to talk about the serious weakness with the Alpha Legion Conceal strat. Specifically, that it's vulnerable to "rhino sniping" and the like.
The strat reads, verbatim, underline for emphasis
Use this strategem at the start of the opponent's shooting phase. Select one ALPHA LEGION INFANTRY unit from your army. Until the end of the phase, enemy models can only target that unit if it is the closest visible target
Reason I bring it up is I've seen a lot of local players get confused, thinking you can hide a unit out of line of sight that is closer to prevent the concealed unit from being shot, or just in general assuming it follows the character rules as far as sniper abilities go. RAW, long as it's the closest thing you can see, it's a legal target. So for example, if I want to shoot the possessed bomb, all I need to do is finagle my shooting unit so a building blocks Los to the screen or something. Not so easy if you have cultists or something screened across the front. Pretty easy if all you have is a lord discordant with the -4 to hit or whatever.
Interesting quirk is that it also means artillery cannot target them for any reason if they can't see them, so that's fun. Just stuff to think about, primarily for new players since I'm sure a lot of the most competitive guys already noticed this.
I guess it was to deny magic box interactions and therefore got preemptively curbed before the issue would arrise. As for the arty. there is only one type of it run atm and i don't mind it beeing hardcountered by the strat ( TFC ) because that thing is seriously underpriced for what it does, especially comparatively to any other arty type in the game, (regardless if GW or FW)
the second part is, we don'r really see a lot of Rhinos anymore and finangeling the unit to not see the "predesignated" target unit is therefore more reliant on terrain which is a lot more difficult to exploit that way i guess.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/10 10:17:30
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/10 17:03:35
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Nihilistic Necron Lord
|
Not Online!!! wrote:
So yes you can. One thing i allways wondered though, is the effect cumulative, as in if i stand around 3 do i get + 3 to my role?
And i wonder if you ever start reading the FAQs.
Q: Lots of aura abilities say they grant an ability to nearby
units that are within range of any such models. Are the bonuses
cumulative (i.e. if I am within range of two models with identical
aura abilities, is the bonus doubled)?
A: Unless stated otherwise, no. The bonus for such an
ability applies once if any (i.e. one or more) of these
models are within range.
This is from the first rulebook update, released more than 24 (!) month ago. FAQs are mandatory, just like the core rules.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/10 17:04:07
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/10 17:23:59
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Daemonic Dreadnought
|
MrMoustaffa wrote:So I'm sure others have noticed this, but I'm surprised no one seems to talk about the serious weakness with the Alpha Legion Conceal strat. Specifically, that it's vulnerable to "rhino sniping" and the like.
The strat reads, verbatim, underline for emphasis
Use this strategem at the start of the opponent's shooting phase. Select one ALPHA LEGION INFANTRY unit from your army. Until the end of the phase, enemy models can only target that unit if it is the closest visible target
Reason I bring it up is I've seen a lot of local players get confused, thinking you can hide a unit out of line of sight that is closer to prevent the concealed unit from being shot, or just in general assuming it follows the character rules as far as sniper abilities go. RAW, long as it's the closest thing you can see, it's a legal target. So for example, if I want to shoot the possessed bomb, all I need to do is finagle my shooting unit so a building blocks Los to the screen or something. Not so easy if you have cultists or something screened across the front. Pretty easy if all you have is a lord discordant with the -4 to hit or whatever.
Interesting quirk is that it also means artillery cannot target them for any reason if they can't see them, so that's fun. Just stuff to think about, primarily for new players since I'm sure a lot of the most competitive guys already noticed this.
Most players are aware of the closest visible thing. The most common counters I've seen are the -4 Discolord and infiltrated Nurglings.
Regardless of how you do it - the goal is to make the Possessed impossible to hit. I got screwed in a match vs Alpha Legion, had 3 Scorpius Whirlwinds and could not shoot them. They wrecked my gunline infantry before Abaddon and a DP killed half of them and the tanks finished off the rest.
The real problem with Possessed - one hyper-buffed unit per detachment that goes down as soon as they are out of range of the Sorcerer / MoP. It's not getting there that's the problem, it's sustaining the assault.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/10 17:39:25
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak
|
p5freak wrote:Not Online!!! wrote:
So yes you can. One thing i allways wondered though, is the effect cumulative, as in if i stand around 3 do i get + 3 to my role?
And i wonder if you ever start reading the FAQs.
Q: Lots of aura abilities say they grant an ability to nearby
units that are within range of any such models. Are the bonuses
cumulative (i.e. if I am within range of two models with identical
aura abilities, is the bonus doubled)?
A: Unless stated otherwise, no. The bonus for such an
ability applies once if any (i.e. one or more) of these
models are within range.
This is from the first rulebook update, released more than 24 (!) month ago. FAQs are mandatory, just like the core rules.
Similarly i wonder if you ever achieved basic manners.
|
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/10 18:02:00
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
[DCM]
Et In Arcadia Ego
|
Simmer down please folks. no need to needle each other.
|
The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king, |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/10 21:25:58
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Deranged Necron Destroyer
|
New Fabius being teased at GAMA. Hopefully we won't just get Chaos Primaris but some interesting new creations.
Thoughts on what role they could potentially fill? I think Fabius is an underrated HQ choice, he's great for buffing Cultist chaff. If he gets new rules, I'm hoping to expand on that theme. Less random buffs perhaps, or maybe the ability to uplift an entire squad to New Men.
I'd like to see some big scary melee beatsticks that represent his experimental subjects, but I wonder if Chaos already has a lot of competition for that slot. I'm thinking a faster version of mutliators, or a more durable version of Possessed/Warp Talons.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/11 05:41:02
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade
|
Not Online!!! wrote:Nope, just needs to be off the same <Legion> according to it's rules. Not same mark. Also they are literally slave vessels used by warpsmiths and MoP's as oversized batteries itself beeing a chained daemon fo some good may influence some of it's behaviour but not the core point of the machine, aka beeing an oversized battery.
Thanks, that's what I thought. I just wanted to make sure.
Today I played a game with my Iron Warriors and got trashed. This was mainly my fault since a) I forgot my first psychic phase (this was because I had been playing a strictly Khorne army a day or so before) and b) I didn't organize my army correctly on the field, meaning that I did not get as much use out of my buffs that I could have. Next time, I'm going to be more focused on organizing along the lines of Chaos marks. Also, I tend to be too shy about my command points, which is funny since I try to maximize as many command points as possible without hurting my army's compositions or putting together an army that I'm just not excited about. My opponent did get first turn and a lot of good rolls while I got some bad rolls (my disco lord was shredded before it could do anything), but the fault still mainly lies with my underwhelming planning and lackluster gameplay/ I did get the awesome moment of killing a dreadnought in melee with two plague marines, one armed with a plage knife and the other with just standard melee. It was down to its last legs, but it was still a cool moment to have amidst being shredded.
I was looking over the stats for Zhufor the Impaler today, and he seems like he's a pretty good unit who could benefit well from the WE buffs. However, I don't see any way to get a Skulltakers unit so that he can give out his own buffs. Would it be allowable to give the keyword to WE units? It strikes me as a waste to have these abilities and to not be able to use them at all.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/11 08:13:50
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak
|
Zhufor and arkos suffer from the Same issue.
And no too my knowledge not.
Also nothing in the faq.
|
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/11 13:56:18
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Regular Dakkanaut
|
ArcaneHorror wrote:
I was looking over the stats for Zhufor the Impaler today, and he seems like he's a pretty good unit who could benefit well from the WE buffs. However, I don't see any way to get a Skulltakers unit so that he can give out his own buffs. Would it be allowable to give the keyword to WE units? It strikes me as a waste to have these abilities and to not be able to use them at all.
I suspect the Forgeworld rules re-write will fix a lot of issues such as these.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/12 06:58:57
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Nihilistic Necron Lord
|
eternalxfl wrote: ArcaneHorror wrote:
I was looking over the stats for Zhufor the Impaler today, and he seems like he's a pretty good unit who could benefit well from the WE buffs. However, I don't see any way to get a Skulltakers unit so that he can give out his own buffs. Would it be allowable to give the keyword to WE units? It strikes me as a waste to have these abilities and to not be able to use them at all.
I suspect the Forgeworld rules re-write will fix a lot of issues such as these.
Prepare to be disappointed. Its the GW rules team doing the re-write.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/12 10:17:10
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak
|
p5freak wrote:eternalxfl wrote: ArcaneHorror wrote:
I was looking over the stats for Zhufor the Impaler today, and he seems like he's a pretty good unit who could benefit well from the WE buffs. However, I don't see any way to get a Skulltakers unit so that he can give out his own buffs. Would it be allowable to give the keyword to WE units? It strikes me as a waste to have these abilities and to not be able to use them at all.
I suspect the Forgeworld rules re-write will fix a lot of issues such as these.
Prepare to be disappointed. Its the GW rules team doing the re-write.
Sofar FW rules provided by the GW rulesteam (everything CA and FAQ, ) is indeed lackluster as all hell.
And considering the recent SM releases. You could get lucky and get IH tier nonsense, or unlucky like other factions.
|
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/12 14:49:14
Subject: Re:Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Huge Hierodule
|
p5freak wrote:eternalxfl wrote: ArcaneHorror wrote:
I was looking over the stats for Zhufor the Impaler today, and he seems like he's a pretty good unit who could benefit well from the WE buffs. However, I don't see any way to get a Skulltakers unit so that he can give out his own buffs. Would it be allowable to give the keyword to WE units? It strikes me as a waste to have these abilities and to not be able to use them at all.
I suspect the Forgeworld rules re-write will fix a lot of issues such as these.
Prepare to be disappointed. Its the GW rules team doing the re-write.
I mean, if this means the Legion characters are compatible with their Legion, I’m lowit
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/13 13:37:07
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers
|
So I am building my friend a Word Bearers army from scratch, because he is interested in playing, but can't afford the cost. Aside from Daemons, can anyone give me some tips on good must have models for a WB army? Also, where is a good source for cheap counts as cultist models?
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/13 15:25:17
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Decrepit Dakkanaut
|
Tell them to run the Word Bearers as World Eaters as the color schemes are close but one is infinitely more useable.
|
CaptainStabby wrote:If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote:BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote:Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote:ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/14 01:17:38
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers
|
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:Tell them to run the Word Bearers as World Eaters as the color schemes are close but one is infinitely more useable.
Thank you for contributing absolutely nothing and not actually answering the question: What models/units are good in Word Bearers, and should be included in the army?
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/14 03:42:36
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Commanding Lordling
|
FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:So I am building my friend a Word Bearers army from scratch, because he is interested in playing, but can't afford the cost. Aside from Daemons, can anyone give me some tips on good must have models for a WB army? Also, where is a good source for cheap counts as cultist models?
For cultists just look around for left over Dark Vengeance and poxwalkers from Dark Imperium. You can find groups of 20 for around $18-20. As for good units I would say the Start collecting box with the Demon Engine and Master of possession would be a good base. Word Bearers seem Demon centric. From there it's add an HQ and one cultist unit for the battalion and go from there depending on intended play style.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/03/14 03:42:53
Subject: Chaos Marines Tactica [8th Edition]
|
 |
Daemonic Dreadnought
|
FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:Slayer-Fan123 wrote:Tell them to run the Word Bearers as World Eaters as the color schemes are close but one is infinitely more useable.
Thank you for contributing absolutely nothing and not actually answering the question: What models/units are good in Word Bearers, and should be included in the army?
Please don't pick on my good friend slayer-fan123. He's someone to be understood, not interpreted literally.
As far as what to select for a Word Bearers army, there are many ways you could run one. I'm personally fond of infantry-only builds, for the fluff and for the potential for summoning.
These are the models I would consider:
- Dark Apostle, Master of Possession for HQs with Master of the Union on the Warlord for buffs to Daemons
- Jump Pack Sorcerer for Warptime
- Possessed x 20, run them as a bomb
- 2x Greater Possessed for buffs to Possessed
In a Nurgle Detachment, I would run the following:
- Herald
- Nurglings
- The Tree
And I'd leave about 500 summoning points.
This isn't alpha legion, you aren't going to use conceal to get up the battlefield. You are going to try to go second and use warptime + the tree for first turn charges. Use the Revered Hosts Stratagem to destroy Primaris with each successful hit.
After the first round, summon a ton of Daemons to expand the assault. The reason you will do it this way is for tactical flexibility, you can bring on any units you want and you have the WB stratagem for rerolls on the summoning.
This is about as nasty as I would get with pure Word Bearers right now. If you want to consider SlayerFan123's advice, also get a squad of Terminators and kit them out for close combat. Tell your friend he can run them as Red Butchers.
|
|
|
 |
 |
|