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Best juves I can think of are the outcast minis from Dark age miniatures.

Goliath forge born is the closest to original Juves in the new edition both model and rule. And the female one is a pain in the bum to find replacement arms and head.

They could just do 4-packs of Juves for each of the 6 Gangs in resin via FW. It's not like they have a wide variety of weapon options anyway.

That would be nice to give some variation. The models don't need to be smaller as such, or even particularly child-like. Just less elaborate or cheaper looking equipment, pistol armaments and various expressions of alarm would work nicely.

The Van Saar sprue has a handy androgynous bare head that looks reasonably startled that works nicely, but all the bodies have the full equipment/armour load. Just the leg armour and a t-shirt or something would be a fun statement. Or something like the amazing rogue doc with the tied-off jumpsuit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Hmm... I am now going to try and smoosh together some Escher and VS spares

 Flinty wrote:


The Van Saar sprue has a handy androgynous bare head that looks reasonably startled that works nicely, but all the bodies have the full equipment/armour load.

That is one of my champions . I prefer using helmets for juves and cheap gangers. Bare heads are for higher ranks.

 Blackie wrote:

 Flinty wrote:


The Van Saar sprue has a handy androgynous bare head that looks reasonably startled that works nicely, but all the bodies have the full equipment/armour load.

That is one of my champions . I prefer using helmets for juves and cheap gangers. Bare heads are for higher ranks.

Teehee, I go exactly the other way

My important bods get alllll the protection

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
For juves it's easy to see why they're not a priority.

First off they need special models. The sculptors did a fantastic job on the original models, they look young, not just like shorter adults. I remember noticing how one guy had trouble getting his fingers around the grip of his SMG.

This was easier in the days of metal models and blisters but now would need 6-8 additional plastic kits. A simpler answer would have been putting 1 juve in each of the original box sets but that ship has sailed.

And then there's the issue of child soldiers. Yes it's properly grimdark. Yes it is less grimdark than having your arm lopped off to install a chainsaw. But unlike cyber gladiators or zombie archers child soldiers are a real world problem and I think most of us prefer our grimdark a bit removed from reality.

If you want Juves/Prospects/cannon fodder/whatever the Outcasts might do the job for some gangs.

Spoiler:

It's easy to see a Goliath, Orlock, Delaque and Cawdor dude in there.

The other thing is that Juves just aren't an important fighter type in this ruleset.

People can make big declarations about Juves being "an essential building block of a gang" (without showing their work) but that's an appeal to nostalgia, not intellect.

Juves certainly felt essential in Necromunda: The Game From 30 Years ago; I know that every gang I ever used or played against back then featured one or more Juves, and when a Juve went down permanently it was a priority to replace them. But that was happening in a completely different game. Back then Juves offered an opportunity to create a specialist fighter with a unique skillset; now the wealth of equipment options and availability of champions makes that easier to do in other ways. They used to be a way to differentiate your gang from the next; now the gangs are more differentiated by default And they used to be a fighter you could hire cheap and quickly level up to be useful; now XP gain is so slow that that is an unrealistic path for any newly-hired fighter.

At the moment Juves are only "essential" from an emotional, aesthetic perspective... the perspective of someone who said "a true Necromunda gang must contain X, Y and Z" to themselves 20-30 years ago and isn't capable of updating their brain. Juves aren't necessary to create a fun or effective gang. In fact, the most useful Juves rn are a pretty toxic spam build of cheap Van Saar lasgunners.

It would be great for Juves to actually be relevant on the table again, but models shouldn't be a priority until the ruleset actually supports them (or every more important model release has been completed).

Is the math on Juves still so wonky? I remember in 2017 we worked out it would take something like 150 games to get a Juve up to Champion stats, and somehow they'd cost double in gang rating to what an identical Champion costs.

I'm just excited for the possibility that we'll get LARP rules for Necromunda now that GW HQ is flooded with sewage. It's perfect for playtesting!

They are playtesting necromunda now?

 privateer4hire wrote:
They are playtesting necromunda now?

It was just a crappy joke.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Thank God for Heresy Miniatures then, hey?

I have that set in my WIP queue at the moment. They're lovely models.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

The models and terrain? Can be easily ported to older editions. No bother at all. Indeed whilst aesthetics vary, with the vast majority of gang models being plastic, they’re easier and more straight forward to convert than ever before.

That's fine if you're only using the new models. It's less workable if you have old models. I have a scattering of the new models worked into a couple of my gangs as particularly large individuals (mostly in my Goliaths, where that works best) but more than that and the scale difference just starts to look too weird.

Don't get me wrong, I love the new model designs. I just wish they were the right size...

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Is the math on Juves still so wonky? I remember in 2017 we worked out it would take something like 150 games to get a Juve up to Champion stats, and somehow they'd cost double in gang rating to what an identical Champion costs.

Juves don't promote to champ, they promote to specialist.

 NAVARRO wrote:

 GaroRobe wrote:

 Mr_Rose wrote:
You know what would be fantastic; a Jokaero weaponsmith in the Underhive.

I'd love a kroot bounty hunter, even if it was just the model from blackstone fortress. If we can get a beastman bounty hunter, Kroot should be ok

If we are going there then what would get me nuts would be a "Necromunda bestiary" with loads of new creatures to hunt. And pure solo RPG campaign.

Solo / coop RPG campaign would be fantastic. That would very probably get me into the Necromunda line

Shame that the FFG games folded. I can totally see a great Necromunda RPG coming from them.

Chopstick wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Is the math on Juves still so wonky? I remember in 2017 we worked out it would take something like 150 games to get a Juve up to Champion stats, and somehow they'd cost double in gang rating to what an identical Champion costs.

Juves don't promote to champ, they promote to specialist.

But they can eventually promote to champion

The point wasn't the actual chance of this happening though, the issue is that if you take a juve with their stats and a champ, you see how undercosted champs and leaders are, or how overcosted juves are. The other issue is that advancements are bizarrely and unfairly costed, creating gang rating inflation - which is what blackfang was referring to - to get to a champ's stats, a juve becomes madly expensive.

That's because Necromunda is now about buying elite fighters up front, not developing those who survive over time. Need WS2+? BS2+? Killy weapons? Buy it and start using it from the first battle.

Judging by all the discussions online about starter gangs, people seem to love it.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Shame that the FFG games folded. I can totally see a great Necromunda RPG coming from them.

If but wishing could make it true...

Baxx wrote:
That's because Necromunda is now about buying elite fighters up front, not developing those who survive over time. Need WS2+? BS2+? Killy weapons? Buy it and start using it from the first battle.

Judging by all the discussions online about starter gangs, people seem to love it.

That is fair. I can indeed say that I see the appeal from my many games of Mordheim and Oldcromunda. I prefer seeing my warriors/heroes/gangers develop over time... but long campaigns are honestly just not something a lot of people can commit to.

Now that I am older, and have a family of my own, I am absolutely shocked that in the past I was able to play in so many long campaigns with large crowds. Mainly due to how hard it is getting people to show up reliably due to real life concerns, and those that fall behind in warband/gang development just have even more reason to drop out of the campaign.

So yeah, I can understand people enjoying being able to front load a lot of what used to be under "gang development" into their starting roster and watch them develop from there if they get the chance.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Shame that the FFG games folded. I can totally see a great Necromunda RPG coming from them.

Or a larger supplement for Dark Heresy but they'd likely have redone it as yet another separate but half compatible system given their history. Regardless, it would have been great to see in rpg form.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Shame that the FFG games folded. I can totally see a great Necromunda RPG coming from them.

Well, they didn't really fold... the license got pulled.

IIRC, there is a BitD hack that could be a good starting point.

 Albertorius wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Shame that the FFG games folded. I can totally see a great Necromunda RPG coming from them.

Well, they didn't really fold... the license got pulled.

IIRC, there is a BitD hack that could be a good starting point.

What's BitD?

 warboss wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Shame that the FFG games folded. I can totally see a great Necromunda RPG coming from them.

Well, they didn't really fold... the license got pulled.

IIRC, there is a BitD hack that could be a good starting point.

What's BitD?

Blades in the Dark.

 Albertorius wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Shame that the FFG games folded. I can totally see a great Necromunda RPG coming from them.

Well, they didn't really fold... the license got pulled.

IIRC, there is a BitD hack that could be a good starting point.

Does anyone have a link?

Thanks. Just from the description, the theme sounds about right. No idea obviously about the mechanics though.

 Crimson wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Shame that the FFG games folded. I can totally see a great Necromunda RPG coming from them.

Well, they didn't really fold... the license got pulled.

IIRC, there is a BitD hack that could be a good starting point.

Does anyone have a link?

This is the one I have, it's basically a Forged in the Dark set:

https://www.olddog.games/Blades-in-the-Underhive

https://www.dropbox.com/s/bl3hsy3c64oqm2m/blades_in_the_underhive_v001.pdf

I love Newcromunda, my only issue is how split up the rules still are. You should be able to play with the rulebook and your gang book. Instead you still need other books for the market/black market etc. Our local GW just started allowing printed rules "as long as you own the books at home". Immediately a Necromunda campaign was started up, 20 people signed up, 2 sets of terrain and dice were donated on loan for games and everyone bought a gang box from the GW. It's crazy that literally nobody within 50 miles of me played the game at all for the last 2 years and as soon as the rules became essentially free, 20 people started building and painting their gangs. GW needs to learn a lesson from this. The more rules you split the books into, the less people are going to bother playing the game at all.

No lesson to be learned, these are written by multiple staffs on paycheck, not one mastermind rule writer with a vision

Also more books = profit.

Not if they aren’t bought.

"We're #1, so why try harder?" - Games Workshop