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Oops, missed putting in a $1 pledge to see what we get. Oh well.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 kodos wrote:
2530 supporters and 395.990 GBP, which is more than the first WP Kickstarter but a 1000 less supporters

Which is some strange math since the buyin on Epic was much lower

So Warpath 28mm must have had a lot of 1$ just to see what happens backers.

think so, like people did the 1$ to get access to the rules/beta test the check if it was an alternative to 40k without buying more

while here it looks like most of those who join going to play the game as well and/or people doing higher pledges as a single person buys for a gaming group

 kodos wrote:

SU-152 wrote:
The proportion of players amongst collectors is so low that surprised me (no higher that 1 out of 50). I do not know if it is the same as in other games ...

no, because most other games, you buy in because they are games
GW you buy for "the hobby" and gaming is not a high priority there hence why they don't care about rules, good enough for the 1 out of 50 who plays once in a while and any complaining is unheard because the other 49 will say that rules don't matter at all

100% accurate IMO. I've noticed it with myself as of late - I haven't played a game of anything since 10th edition 40k dropped (No AoS or HH nor other games), and even prior to that I was tapering off on the frequency of my play. Likewise quite a few others I know... yet we all continue to throw money at our toy soldiers.

 Tabletop_Magpie wrote:
Just to jump on the GW rules/players conversation:

An AOS mate of mine told me recently that he doesn't care about better systems, it's just easier to get games of GW systems than it is anything else locally (because everyone plays them because you can get games easier...).

He won't even consider picking up anything non-GW, even if I lay it all out and run demos or whatever.

ANYWAY - backed at the last minute! Very low pledge, for now, and I'll see what I can afford when the PM rolls out ha haa

This has been my experience with the overwhelming majority of folks I know who play GW games. Irony is on the rare occasion I've managed to convince someone to try another game, they always inevitably end up essentially quitting GW entirely in preference of the other game in question (mostly warmavhine, but I've had some success with malifaux as well).

So, some success then! Well done and keep it up!

I'll keep grinding away. I can't see it being fun plugging away at AoS for 3 hours just to Math Hammer it at turn 4 and call it there. You could play two games of literally anything else in that time!

Fingers crossed this campaign will be delivered as smoothly as Dungeon Sage (translation issues aside of course).

 kodos wrote:

SU-152 wrote:
The proportion of players amongst collectors is so low that surprised me (no higher that 1 out of 50). I do not know if it is the same as in other games ...

no, because most other games, you buy in because they are games
GW you buy for "the hobby" and gaming is not a high priority there hence why they don't care about rules, good enough for the 1 out of 50 who plays once in a while and any complaining is unheard because the other 49 will say that rules don't matter at all

I don’t think this is true. I’ve bought into many games purely for the minis (and lore), such as Deadzone, Dreadball, Dropzone Commander, Kingdom Death, Ankh and Rising Sun, whatever games Wargames Atlantic is pretending to sell. Most of the people I know in the hobby are the same, especially when it comes to boutique miniature games like Kingdom Death.

The only Mantic games I made any serious attempt to play were Kings of War and Armada, and neither of those caught on.


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 kodos wrote:
easier to find players
but balance is off
must play with the right people that don't bring OP units
but it is not easy to find such players
processing error - it is easier to find players

anyway
2530 supporters and 395.990 GBP, which is more than the first WP Kickstarter but a 1000 less supporters

I will always choose hanging with friends I want to be around and maybe gaming over getting a game with some stranger I wouldn’t want to hang around with.

Did Zzor ever come up as even a passing joke during the campaign?

Well that is not a bad total. Went for three factions in the end and then will go from there - hopefully a nice big pile of minis next March. Now let the waiting game begin!

chaos0xomega wrote:Irony is on the rare occasion I've managed to convince someone to try another game, they always inevitably end up essentially quitting GW entirely in preference of the other game in question (mostly warmavhine, but I've had some success with malifaux as well).

my experience as well, once people who want to play (and not just collect and paint) play something else, they never go back to GW. They still buy their models but hardly play any of their games again

Tabletop_Magpie wrote:So, some success then! Well done and keep it up!

I'll keep grinding away. I can't see it being fun plugging away at AoS for 3 hours just to Math Hammer it at turn 4 and call it there. You could play two games of literally anything else in that time!

Fingers crossed this campaign will be delivered as smoothly as Dungeon Sage (translation issues aside of course).

think the translation should go better this time as they are now knowing where the issue is and avoid it and as Mantic is always aiming for the 2 hour gaming experience they are less exhausting and therefore more fun for me anyway

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

I will always choose hanging with friends I want to be around and maybe gaming over getting a game with some stranger I wouldn’t want to hang around with.

me too, hence why I cannot get behind that argument
for me that is just some theoretical point that does not matter in real life similar of needing to models coming with a certain amount of details when they never see a paint job good enough to make use of that

but then I buy games and I buy models and those 2 do not need to be related and I use the models I like with the games I like and GW games are not doing it for me in general


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 privateer4hire wrote:
Did Zzor ever come up as even a passing joke during the campaign?

they were mentioned a lot but not by Mantic

Probably because Z'zor are a star trek race and there's IP concerns, I would guess.

I'm skeptical that the ratio of collectors to gamers is quite as high as some are suggesting.

Additionally, I think there are alot of folks who take rules, community and likelihood of finding a game into account in their purchases even though they might only get in a couple games per year or less. Functionally they may be collectors, but they are buying as though they are gamers.

 Tabletop_Magpie wrote:
Just to jump on the GW rules/players conversation:
An AOS mate of mine told me recently that he doesn't care about better systems, it's just easier to get games of GW systems than it is anything else locally (because everyone plays them because you can get games easier...).

He won't even consider picking up anything non-GW, even if I lay it all out and run demos or whatever.

I completely understand this. It's sad, but if you don't have an amenable group and you enjoy gaming, GW is by far the safest choice. I wrote once that each overpriced box of GW miniatures comes packaged with a complete community of gamers. For alot of folks who don't have the inclination to be an organizer it's just not worth it to invest in other games that won't get played.

I'm very grateful I've got friends who will play KoW, Mech Attack, Alpha Strike, OPR, Space Weirdos etc...

Frankly I am way past the point where pick up games with randos at the store would be an acceptable lynchpin of my hobby.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Probably because Z'zor are a star trek race and there's IP concerns, I would guess.

Z'Zor are a Dreadball Team, so any IP concerns would have already be there with those
yet I am not aware of any canon Z'Zor race in Star Trek

chaos0xomega wrote:
Probably because Z'zor are a star trek race and there's IP concerns, I would guess.

They were not considered because it would be starting totally from scratch (they aren't in any other system) and eight armies to get done is more than enough work to do. Nothing beyond the nameless was ever planned for the KS.

there always need to be room for future expansions

Would be interesting to develop a faction from the other end, mass battles first, then firefight, then deadzone

I love that my first day post-surgery where I could be upright and focused a little on fun stuff instead of just healing, was in time to see this KS end so positively!

I really intended to go super wide on 3-4 factions, but the minute I tried to figure out what armies I might cut, I realized by end of the Pledge Manager, I will probably end up doing 5-6 factions, each with two Plastic Cores, two Reinforcement boxes, etc...

I truly cannot help myself, as this might legit be my Holy Grail engine. Its juuuuust the right level of crunch for this scale of battle to play quickly, with 95% of the DNA I wanted from the Epic lineage of 40k games (still missing accumulated pin-markers, but d8s will make for much healthier game math possibilities), and it cuts out insane bs rules that no sane designer would allow beyond a first draft.

I just wish this were out sooner thanks purely to my own impatience, but I've got a new crate of Deadzone to keep me actually gaming in the meanwhile.

I must say, I feel like one can't understate enough the value of accessible, easier, but non-shallow games. I came to this hobby as a gamer first, so just knowing I can actually play and enjoy a game is such a big deal. My wife and I went soooo hard on Imperialis, and by the time we got done building even a portion of the miserable, over-priced, fiddly models we had bought, we were already frustrated. Then we tried playing and realized it felt like a clunky chore, just as often as it felt fun and interesting. We're just too old to be getting that frustrated with clumsy design.

I'm hoping to see some of the Nameless before the Pledge Manager starts popping up.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Probably because Z'zor are a star trek race and there's IP concerns, I would guess.

There might be a joke I'm missing but that statement is wrong.
Also, we have the well-known trek-planet of Andor, yet there's a boardgame and a Star Wars series named the same...

Delighted to see this doing well - I didn't pledge, in the end (somewhat "over" the whole KS thing) but really happy to see so many factions worth of models getting funded, and if I see this in a local shop I'll definitely be tempted to pick it up.

Sgt. Cortez wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
Probably because Z'zor are a star trek race and there's IP concerns, I would guess.

There might be a joke I'm missing but that statement is wrong.
Also, we have the well-known trek-planet of Andor, yet there's a boardgame and a Star Wars series named the same...

Yeah you're right. I had googled Z'zor to see what yall were on about and seems somebody threw them up onto a fanon wiki for star trek rpg, which I took to be an official/canonical thing.

https://startrekrpg.fandom.com/wiki/Z%27Zor

Looking forward to this being available next year. Gives me time to save up for the retail version. Looks great.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Frankly I am way past the point where pick up games with randos at the store would be an acceptable lynchpin of my hobby.

I completely agree, but it's not just about dropping in at the FLGS. There are allot of areas in the country where your only option for a regular wargaming group might be a group focused on GW games.

I count myself lucky not be in that situation, but I think if I were and was having no luck starting an alternate group I'd probably join a 40k group. I've already got the minis and an appreciation for the setting and it would at least be a chance to game, hang with gamers and an excuse to build terrain.

In that situation, I’d rather not game at all.

I regularly play KoW, Deadzone & Firefight.

It's easier to post online in local clubs or store fb groups asking if anyone is interested rather than trying to get converts from people you already know, once you get 4-6 people playing a game at a public venue, things can go from there.

Oddly, the interest in KoW at my local club is entirely at the 10mm scale, so I went ahead and got some "Forest Dragon" prints to play with. (that's the sculptor name, but they do also have a forest dragon sculpt...).

Deadzone or KoW ambush for demo games, all the way.

Project 28mm Drakon light cruiser with deadzone demo board inside is 100% going to be a thing, it's an idea I've had for a while, an STL from Mantic just makes it so much easier.

scarletsquig wrote:
I regularly play KoW, Deadzone & Firefight.

It's easier to post online in local clubs or store fb groups asking if anyone is interested rather than trying to get converts from people you already know, once you get 4-6 people playing a game at a public venue, things can go from there.

Oddly, the interest in KoW at my local club is entirely at the 10mm scale, so I went ahead and got some "Forest Dragon" prints to play with. (that's the sculptor name, but they do also have a forest dragon sculpt...).

Deadzone or KoW ambush for demo games, all the way.

Project 28mm Drakon light cruiser with deadzone demo board inside is 100% going to be a thing, it's an idea I've had for a while, an STL from Mantic just makes it so much easier.

10mm KoW rocks and Forest Dragon range is top notch. Have fun!

I wish this Mantic project could deliver sooner, but ... they usually do a good job on their KS. excited and pondering if I even want to expand Imperialis. The only option
to buy what I need at moment is GW webstore, and I really do not want to pay MSRP prices.
Mantic's Epic will be a breath of fresh air to my monthly gaming budget.

Just seen the models at Hammerhead the infantry looked excellent but the vehicles were slightly lacking. Hoping to see far more.

I don't suppose you snapped off any pics llamahead?

That does bode well for some of the minis also being displayed at Salute next month, at least

Anyone else getting in on the playtesting? I've got the playtest rules warmed up and ready to go, and a pile of old Mechwarrior click bases for proxies!

I will end up getting the whole enchilada... Probably 8 plastic armies (two 4-army pledges), the big pack o terrain sprues, the STL file for my friends with printers... And maybe some cool dice if they make them (the loud, primary color options they've got up now seem a bit garish to me, so I'm hoping they choose nicer colors/styles)

I really felt like once this KS got going, Mantic was firing on all cylinders. The art styles for the proposed superheavies look really great, the game itself looks fun (have yet to playtest!), can't wait to get this baby in my grubby hands


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 Pacific wrote:
I don't suppose you snapped off any pics llamahead?

That does bode well for some of the minis also being displayed at Salute next month, at least

I think the vehicles were very prototype-y. A lot of feedback from the backers went in to helping make the vehicles cooler - a major theme was to ensure they're the right size, so they look suitably imposing on the battlefield. Right now they look quite anemic and sad, particularly the Enforcer tank. They showed some sketches of ideas on how to make their tank look more imposing and menacing, instead of some top-heavy kid's toy, and I think they were moving in the right direction. I just hope they make them big enough (I don't care if that means we get fewer vehicles per spru, I just want assurance that they'll look cool!)

 pancakeonions wrote:
Anyone else getting in on the playtesting? I've got the playtest rules warmed up and ready to go, and a pile of old Mechwarrior click bases for proxies!

I am considering it, though needing a FB account is a downisde (don't know if it is still possible to make fake ones)

 kodos wrote:

 pancakeonions wrote:
Anyone else getting in on the playtesting? I've got the playtest rules warmed up and ready to go, and a pile of old Mechwarrior click bases for proxies!

I am considering it, though needing a FB account is a downisde (don't know if it is still possible to make fake ones)

It's moot as they just emailed saying they were so inundated with replies that they have closed the playtest pool, for now.