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I don't think the current issues have anything to do with in universe storylines.
I think the last Bob (chapek?) Was both pushing for Marvel Studios to develop a buch of tv series and produce at rates that are frankly unsustainable. Things spiraled quickly. If anything, the pandemic helped by sllwing things down even as it created logistic and technical issues with production. The farther into phase 4 and now i to phase 5 we get the more things were being produced concurrently with less ability for oversight and quality control.
Phase 4 has more hours of content then phase 1-3 combined and released in less time than any other phase. That gaks unsustainable.
This is the result of that. And we probably have another 3-5 projects before this "slow things back down" brings a real return to form.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
So binging this second half, just to get it over with. (Also, the sound balance is utter crap)
And no, binging doesn't help.
Episode 4:
Don't care about the relationship. I'm sure its very poignant and meaningful and the art on the walls is very symbolic of blending and coming together and whatever. I've got no capacity to believe that Fury could manage to trust a subordinate or alien or frankly even another human being enough to have a relationship.
Talos seems like an utter moron. Complete lack of anything resembling a plan, so no surprise the insurgents walked away
The attack was... incredibly stupid. People don't just... wander around... in the middle of a pitched firefight, and that farcical level of security was just insulting to the viewer.
-----
Episode 5:
Oh. Ok... then. Moustache twirling villainy ahoy.
Even the pretense of nuance just dropped out of the bottom of the show in the first five minutes.
What the actual feth?
Petty pedantry: burial and cremation are not interchangeable words.
Another terribly ineffective hit squad....yawn. Why are they even bothering? Also, why is anyone wearing armor that can't even stand up to low caliber pistols?
No Avengers because
Spoiler:
its... personal.
. Cool. That doesn't make anyone seem like a moron at all. I get the actual reason is actors and expense and all. But this is just coming across (along with everything else) as Fury being incompetent and not knowing how to communicate with (or, as 'the' spy) manipulate people. He's just another fool.
-----
Episode 6:
No one hears gunshots in this show. Not surprised, because that would mean actual consequences for shenanigans, but its still baffling.
Rhodey... is still a Colonel, right? (presumably reinstated after various... things) Because he really blatantly doesn't act like one. He acts like a 1st LT trying to bully his NCOs and for no apparent reason they're tolerating it.
The emotional confrontation is very sad. Not because it has any weight at all, but because I'm pretty sure these were good actors at some point, and I don't know what they're doing in this absurd farce of a scene (yes, it is very obvious)
And so it ends, the way the MCU always does. With CGI baby arms as 'ultimate power.'
Several epilogues later, the wild tone-shifts are making me nauseous.
I'm still vaguely convinced that Olivia Colman was filming an actually decent show in the next lot over, but just kept wandering on set and they couldn't shoo her off.
Overall I'd give it somewhere between 0.9 and 1.2 Eternals. Maybe the various strikes will remind Disney that they should actually make good shows and films.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/07/28 02:15:39
That relationship stuff was just uncomfortable. They had real second-marriage-couple-you-block-on-Facebook energy.
And I’m sorry, I know this is a jerkass thing to ask, but am I the only one who snickered whenever Priscilla asked him “do you love me…or this face?”? I get that the writers were probably already escorted off the lot before the show was cast, and I’m sure the actress is a wonderful human being despite her decades of beach-smoking, but the combination were Jordan Peele horror movie brutal. Her green face looked 30 years younger and two Vietnam Wars less grizzled. Did no editor think to take the director aside and whisper, “I can ADR in something less cruel. Won’t affect the budget at all.”? It’s like the opposite of the “disfigured” girl from Ready Player One, and just as distracting.
Ok, that was a stupid rant I held in too long and now I’m done venting into the void.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/07/28 06:01:05
Lance845 wrote: I think the last Bob (chapek?) Was both pushing for Marvel Studios to develop a buch of tv series and produce at rates that are frankly unsustainable. Things spiraled quickly. If anything, the pandemic helped by sllwing things down even as it created logistic and technical issues with production. The farther into phase 4 and now i to phase 5 we get the more things were being produced concurrently with less ability for oversight and quality control.
You're quite right in that a lot of the failings of the MCU at the moment are down to Bob Chapek's quantity over quality methodology, wanting more and more content for D+, and also the fact that he put his right-hand man (Kareem Daniel) over Feige.
But you cannot blame them for some of the truly terrible bits of nonsense that have come out of Marvel since End Game. A lot of it comes down to hiring terrible writers. Yes, having spin-offs of spin-offs that no one asked for (Echo and Agatha Harkness spring to mind) isn't helping, but Secret Invasion was't terrible because of Bob Chapek.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/07/28 06:32:47
But you cannot blame them for some of the truly terrible bits of nonsense that have come out of Marvel since End Game. A lot of it comes down to hiring terrible writers. Yes, having spin-offs of spin-offs that no one asked for (Echo and Agatha Harkness spring to mind) isn't helping, but Secret Invasion was't terrible because of Bob Chapek.
The performance of the actress (and the character), I think, could carry a Harkness TV show. Strangely, a show about Echo, a relatively mundane lieutenant in a criminal organization, responsible for carrying out and overseeing a fair few murders I find completely unappealing, despite (if such things were real) Harkness being just as much a vile character, if not more so. I guess Agatha is a villain whereas Echo is just a 'senior mook' who should be doing 25+ in prison.
AduroT wrote: Bit odd that one can get a bullet to the heart or half their face blown off and be fine, but a hole thru the gut is instantly fatal.
Um, because they're aliens? Apparently Skrulls are highly vulnerable to gut shots....
Humans - you can shoot them pretty much anywhere
Superman - Kryptonite
Zombies - headshots
Vampires - a stake through the heart
Werewolves - vulnerable to silver
MCU Skrulls - gut shots. Sure, why not?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
AduroT wrote: Yes, NATO exists in the MCU, one of the Skrulls had replaced (one of?) it’s leader(s?).
Yes, the Celestial was briefly mentioned in She Hulk in a passing news headline, along with a Wolverine reference in another.
I'm still convinced that Eternals & She-Hulk are really just their own self-contained bits of the Multiverse.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/07/28 09:13:19
I'm still convinced that Eternals & She-Hulk are really just their own self-contained bits of the Multiverse.
Deffo for She-Hulk. I think that the Eternals has been shunted off into space and so will be interacting more with the Gunn-inspired wackiness of that setting. Or just forgotten about.
Lance845 wrote: I think the last Bob (chapek?) Was both pushing for Marvel Studios to develop a buch of tv series and produce at rates that are frankly unsustainable. Things spiraled quickly. If anything, the pandemic helped by sllwing things down even as it created logistic and technical issues with production. The farther into phase 4 and now i to phase 5 we get the more things were being produced concurrently with less ability for oversight and quality control.
You're quite right in that a lot of the failings of the MCU at the moment are down to Bob Chapek's quantity over quality methodology, wanting more and more content for D+, and also the fact that he put his right-hand man (Kareem Daniel) over Feige.
But you cannot blame them for some of the truly terrible bits of nonsense that have come out of Marvel since End Game. A lot of it comes down to hiring terrible writers. Yes, having spin-offs of spin-offs that no one asked for (Echo and Agatha Harkness spring to mind) isn't helping, but Secret Invasion was't terrible because of Bob Chapek.
What I am saying is that Secret Invasion would have had a level of oversight and time to be developed that it did not receive because of the mandates handed down by Chapek. When you are in meetings about the scripts/stories for 1) Secret Invasion 2) the Marvels 3) Armor Wars) 4) Iron Heart 5) Loki 2 6) House of Harkness 7) Quantumania 8) etc etc... all at the same time, how can you possibly give any 1 project the attention it needs.
Look at phase 3. Phase 3 had 2-3 projects release a year over 3 years. Considering a 2-3 year general development time that meant scripts for Infinity war were being drafted when Civil War came out.
By comparison phase 4. 18 projects over 2 years. 9 of which were SHOWs not movies so the script writing shooting and directing were drastically larger endeavors. This isn't just hiring bad writers. It's stretching your pool of writers so damn thin. Having the producers who are supposed to be watching this stuff and keep it on track needing to juggle 9 productions to launch in a year instead of 3.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
This idea that TV shows, by nature of becoming heavily continuity based are interchangeable with movies is the heart of the problem. So many of the D+ shows feel like film pitches that someone decided could be stuffed with filler and turned into a show. Instead you get an overly long film with terrible pacing where both the budget and content are stretched too thin.
Book of Boba is the obvious offender here, but there's a huge difference between something like WandaVision, which used its episodic structure to great effect and the majority of these shows that are really just film scripts with every minute of deleted footage left in.
Capt Marvel cost at least $152 million for 124 minutes of content. Secret Invasion gives us 2.5 films coming in at 296 minutes for just $60 million more. It's the same effect you get turning the Hobbit into 3 films. Hours of filler instead of any concentration of quality.
LunarSol wrote: This idea that TV shows, by nature of becoming heavily continuity based are interchangeable with movies is the heart of the problem. So many of the D+ shows feel like film pitches that someone decided could be stuffed with filler and turned into a show. Instead you get an overly long film with terrible pacing where both the budget and content are stretched too thin.
Book of Boba is the obvious offender here, but there's a huge difference between something like WandaVision, which used its episodic structure to great effect and the majority of these shows that are really just film scripts with every minute of deleted footage left in.
Capt Marvel cost at least $152 million for 124 minutes of content. Secret Invasion gives us 2.5 films coming in at 296 minutes for just $60 million more. It's the same effect you get turning the Hobbit into 3 films. Hours of filler instead of any concentration of quality.
I agree. And I think the Early D+ Marvel shows really highlight what happens when they went in planning for it and had the attention span to focus on it. Wanda Vision, Loki, Falcon/Winter Soldier. The narratives really worked in the longer format. I feel like Ms Marvel was about the time when things started a downward trend. Just too much or too little in the wrong format.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
Ms Marvel is really noticeable as it feels like the first batch of episodes and the final couple were a single movie script that was based more on the Superhuman Registration Act style storyline. The Clan Destine stuff and Karachi almost feel like a second season that they tried to weave in with very awkward results.
From a production standpoint though it's VERY clear that the early episodes and later ones were filmed together. The lighting and set design and character dynamics and really everything are cohesive in a way that really stands out when they snap back to it.
Watched the final episode last night. It was such garbage.
My 12 year old daughter even complained, "Wait, wouldn't the people they kept there be dead from the radiation?" And, "Why isn't he healing like before."
She caught the Marvel bug about 2 years ago, so she's the only reason I watch most of the new stuff. If she's complaining, then you know it's bad.
I don't understand how the writers can be striking in fear of AI, when they can't even write intelligent and coherent material.
Another long-time gripe of mine is when people suddenly gain super powers and immediately know how to use them effectively. Add in to that my gripe when writers make DNA do stuff that makes no sense. Captain Marvel was powered up from an infinity gem... how does that translate to DNA?
Maybe they'll use the Multiverse and Secret War stuff to completely wipe out the current continuity... It's just so terrible now.
I don't understand how the writers can be striking in fear of AI, when they can't even write intelligent and coherent material.
I'm going to guess that it has something to do with them not getting paid if the chatbot does the work....
bbb wrote: Another long-time gripe of mine is when people suddenly gain super powers and immediately know how to use them effectively. Add in to that my gripe when writers make DNA do stuff that makes no sense. Captain Marvel was powered up from an infinity gem... how does that translate to DNA?
1) Nobody wants to sit through watching a training montage. And, most importantly the powers-that-be don't want to spend the $ showing you that.
bbb wrote: Another long-time gripe of mine is when people suddenly gain super powers and immediately know how to use them effectively.
Would’ve been such a more interesting fight if they were both wrestling with channeling their new powers in additionto combatting each other.
bbb wrote: Add in to that my gripe when writers make DNA do stuff that makes no sense. Captain Marvel was powered up from an infinity gem... how does that translate to DNA?
I liked* how they added Ebony Maws rings.
bbb wrote: Maybe they'll use the Multiverse and Secret War stuff to completely wipe out the current continuity... It's just so terrible now.
I think they need to put “continuity” on the back burner. Just make some some solid one-off superhero flicks for a bit.
*somehow rolled my eyes/groaned/laughed/sighed at the same time when that happened.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/07/31 02:30:12
"Sometimes the only victory possible is to keep your opponent from winning." - The Emperor, from The Outcast Dead.
"Tell your gods we are coming for them, and that their realms will burn as ours did." -Thostos Bladestorm
That was probably the most disappointing of the Marvel TV shows so far for me. It never felt like there was an intelligent, or even coherent, plot and all the actors other than Olivia Coleman and Ben Mendelsohn seemed like they would rather be doing anything other than be in this show. I never got the feeling there was any invasion going on either - secret or otherwise. It all felt like some random angry dude leading a small terrorist cell had somehow become a global threat because...characters kept telling is he was.
I think these shows work better when they're more personal to the characters and not trying to produce world-ending stakes all the time. Apart from avoiding the obvious "why not call in the Avengers" problems, it also means the writers might have to actually care about the characters involved.
Slipspace wrote: That was probably the most disappointing of the Marvel TV shows so far for me. It never felt like there was an intelligent, or even coherent, plot and all the actors other than Olivia Coleman and Ben Mendelsohn seemed like they would rather be doing anything other than be in this show. I never got the feeling there was any invasion going on either - secret or otherwise. It all felt like some random angry dude leading a small terrorist cell had somehow become a global threat because...characters kept telling is he was.
I think these shows work better when they're more personal to the characters and not trying to produce world-ending stakes all the time. Apart from avoiding the obvious "why not call in the Avengers" problems, it also means the writers might have to actually care about the characters involved.
The sad thing is, this was an attempt at personal stakes. The nuclear war they couldn't close the deal on was irrelevant. Fury's relationships with his second-in-command, his friend, his wife and his abandoned protege were supposedly the center-stage material.
The problem was, they never established any of that, so they were floundering trying to get the audience to take it seriously while introducing it and taking it away all at the same time. All under the guise of a completely different show focused on Jack Ryan-esque terrorist baiting.
That it ended in
Spoiler:
CGI comedy mode should come as a surprise to no one.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/07/31 12:40:58
Another long-time gripe of mine is when people suddenly gain super powers and immediately know how to use them effectively. Add in to that my gripe when writers make DNA do stuff that makes no sense. Captain Marvel was powered up from an infinity gem... how does that translate to DNA?
They've mentioned it in the trailers for The Marvels, but Carol's powers are based on energy absorption. In theory she's as strong as she is because she absorbed so much power from a gem, where the Super Skrulls would have mostly been about the what they absorbed from the machine and surrounding radiation.
I'm more curious why Drax's tattoos are written into his DNA...
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
Another long-time gripe of mine is when people suddenly gain super powers and immediately know how to use them effectively. Add in to that my gripe when writers make DNA do stuff that makes no sense. Captain Marvel was powered up from an infinity gem... how does that translate to DNA?
They've mentioned it in the trailers for The Marvels, but Carol's powers are based on energy absorption. In theory she's as strong as she is because she absorbed so much power from a gem, where the Super Skrulls would have mostly been about the what they absorbed from the machine and surrounding radiation.
I'm more curious why Drax's tattoos are written into his DNA...
Skin markings rather than tattoos I guess.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Nothing about the absorbed powers makes any sense whatsoever. I think everyone - including those at Marvel - should just forget that Secret Invasion ever happened. The MCU will be better off as a result.
Meanwhile, Loki 2. Loki is the only D+ MCU show I've genuinely liked, so here's hoping they don't feth up season 2.
Im actually a big MCU simp and defender. I liked she-hulk, been liking the recnt movies, thought eternals was great and underrated.
Secret Invasion actually made me frustrated. It felt so small-stakes because of the interactions. The Skrulls Shape-shifting wasnt used to its fullest. The idea of skrulls spending so long undercover they come to think they are them. No real paranoia about who is who because they decided to focus on the actors playing the skrulls and not the skrulls themselves. Like when shot, Gravik reverted to his human for, not skrull form.
Shapeshifter stories don't work when you know who everyone is. From an actor point of view, I'm sure the cast liked getting billed for a set role.
But from a narrative point of view, its undermining. Gravik, Giyah and Talos in particular are functionally human for most of the show. It honestly doesn't matter that they're shapeshifting aliens, and that's a shame.
Visual effects (VFX) crews at Marvel Studios have voted to unionize, IATSE announced on Monday.
A press release notes that “A supermajority of Marvel’s more than 50-worker crew had signed authorization cards indicating they wished to be represented by the International Alliance of Theatrical Stage Employees (IATSE).”
The unionization effort marks the first time VFX professionals have banded together in such a fashion, as this segment of the industry has largely remained non-union. IATSE represents more than 168,000 technicians, artisans and craftspersons working in movies and TV, but while “positions like production designers/art directors, camera operators, sound, editors, hair and makeup artists, costumes/wardrobe, script supervisors, grips, lighting, props and paint, among others, have historically been represented by IATSE,” the release explains, “workers in VFX classifications historically have not.”
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
Now Studios should have to enter production with a more solid plan and include in that plan time tables for VFX. No more last minute changes unless you are willing to change release dates.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
5000pts 
6000pts 
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