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Having subtitles on was really great for that sequence.
"Exciting music plays"
trexmeyer wrote: Yes, but this episode is heavily inspired by The Last Samurai, Dances with Wolves, Lawrence of Arabia, and who knows what else.
Honestly, I think that's just the whole show. Its pretty groan-worthy. The 'present' looks a lot more interesting and it feels like another bait and switch. Come for the SW Underworld, get shown something else. In this case, 'Civilized Man Raising up the Savages'
It just needs his trainer turning out to be female and ending up his wife. Something, something tragic massacre and then he goes looking for his armor, all sad and stuff but having learned something about 'Respect'
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It was really, really hard not to see 'civilized man co-opts and destroys noble savages' way of life while offering them salvation from the great steel monster'
Meanwhile, I'm just thinking they could just... not camp on the hilltops along the train's route. Or line up to be shot. Just... 25 feet past the crest of the dune, and they'd be fine But as long as he keeps speaking English, slowly, loudly and deliberately, it will all be fine.
So... they get their wood from psychotropic lizard dreams? That's... something.
And they then discard almost all of it and replace all but a little with really crudely 'forged' metal that will fall apart within minutes of use. The weapon crafting was actually painful to watch- I've done more reliable work pinning miniatures, not just sticking flanges in a grove and hoping that goop placed on the outside of the join and heated will keep it in place.
---
So I assume the evil wookie gladiator will pop up again. His costuming and prosthetics were SOOO much better than anything else in the show thus far. Like a mastercraft surrounded by cheap and functional apprentice work. It'd be an absolute waste to just be a random appearance for no reason.
Its interesting how much better the concept art stills are compared to the actual show. The workshop in the end slide show was amazing. The actual lean-to and fireplace was not.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2022/01/05 18:25:51
Mixed feelings about the episode. Morrison is an awful actor and I really wish he was a part of Mando's clan so that we wouldn't have to see his cringey grimaces so much. That said, I enjoyed the second half of the episode more than the first. I can't shake the feeling that this is derivative of the Mandalorian despite knowing the opposite is the case.
Spoiler:
Seriously, that is one gak group of amateur assassins the Hutts keep.
Fett: We can torture you for weeks to months of unending intense pain the likes of which you can't imagine.
Assassin: I'll never talk!
Fett: Ok. Quick death in seconds being eaten by rancor it is instead.
Assassin: Nooooooo! I'll tell you everything!I
The assassin was almost as stupid as the tuskens who know the train is coming and its course yet don't hide themselves or their banthas behind one of the DOZENS of dunes surrounding them and instead let them get shot.
I did love the addition of a new wookie that wasn't a Chewie clone and I hope they do something meaningful with the character. Liking the look of both the gear and fur style/color of the new wookie.
The second half was better though for the most part. The train heist was enjoyable and I liked the creation of the Gaffi stick and the donning of his new outfit with his acceptance into the tribe. I also knew that he'd work in a Maori haka somewhere as the actor is as predictable as his acting his bad.
I laughed at the introduction of the infamous psychedelic snot gecko of Tattoine though. I suppose having the offworlder from a water world saving the desert tribe experiencing visions after ingesting the spice he just captured might be a bit too derivative of a certain other property though.
We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
BertBert wrote: I Props to the composer who adapted the cantina theme, it was recognisable but still a fresh take.
We can always use more fresh cantina goo songs.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Man, they go Hard on the white savior and noble savage tropes in this one. All we need is for Fett to marry the chiefs daughter.
Also, was that Black Krrsantan or just a generic Wookie we think? Like it’s gotta be Krrsantan.
White saviour seems an odd accusation considering Temuera Morrison isn’t white.
And still, the good human has to teach the savage aliens how it's done... seriously it really is the very same trope, all over again. The script is being followed quite straight, here. As said above, but adding Avatar to the mix too, in case the problem is the aliens.
Voss wrote: It just needs his trainer turning out to be female and ending up his wife. Something, something tragic massacre and then he goes looking for his armor, all sad and stuff but having learned something about 'Respect'
The trainer looks very female, yes, so...
Also, the wookie seems to be pretty clearly Black Krrsantan, a regular from the Doctor Aphra comic series.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/01/05 18:36:55
All you really need to know about Black Krrsantan is that’s he’s an unstoppable killing machine with few if any morals who will lay waste to everyone before him, so long as the paycheck clears.
AduroT wrote: All you really need to know about Black Krrsantan is that’s he’s an unstoppable killing machine with few if any morals who will lay waste to everyone before him, so long as the paycheck clears.
Climatic fight before final confrontation, check. Aka, Sub-boss.
AduroT wrote: All you really need to know about Black Krrsantan is that’s he’s an unstoppable killing machine with few if any morals who will lay waste to everyone before him, so long as the paycheck clears.
Climatic fight before final confrontation, check. Aka, Sub-boss.
I’m betting Fett offers to pay him more and he switches sides, given he works for the main characters in the comics.
AduroT wrote: All you really need to know about Black Krrsantan is that’s he’s an unstoppable killing machine with few if any morals who will lay waste to everyone before him, so long as the paycheck clears.
Climatic fight before final confrontation, check. Aka, Sub-boss.
I’m betting Fett offers to pay him more and he switches sides, given he works for the main characters in the comics.
Sure, that could work, too. Recruiting the gruff lieutenant is a workable trope for this show.
But I'm still betting on a Fennec betrayal and sad walking away music, like the old Incredible Hulk TV series.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/05 20:16:10
beast_gts wrote: The train driver was the best bit of that episode.
I dunno. I quite liked
"This is my gift to you. Hey, that's mine!"
The train was honestly overly complicated in execution (though simplistic in what it was trying to invoke).
The biggest problem is... its pointless. They're on Tattoine, the backside of the Outer Rim, with no governance or oversight, no laws from the Republic (or Empire at the time of the flashback), the big head crime lord is recently dead.
Why in any possible world is it useful to import in Spice from Kessel, run it in a train across the surface of Tattoine, then send it back up into space to be sold and distributed? Who are they smuggling the Spice past (seriously, what normal trade routes exist here)? Why take it off whatever ship landed with it? Why not land in the other spaceport? Why bring it to the furthest point from the 'bright center of the universe?'
I get that they want to remind the audience that only a civilized man can protect the savages from the evils of civilization, but this was a really wacky way to introduce fish-cowboys shooting natives and buffalo across the Old Space West.
No wonder Boba is so slow and ponderous on camera. He's hauling these moral anvils all over the place.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/06 02:40:41
I kind of figured the train was part of the spice runners' on-planet distribution network. I was wondering why the Tuskens didn't just, well, take better cover when the train went past though. Made zero sense to me. Still better than a lot of what was in the sequel trilogy though.
Somehow I missed the fact that the couple in Tosche Station were supposed to be Fixer and Camie; now that I know that I think it's a great little nod to the deleted scene from the original movie. The Black Krrsantan reference eluded me as well, but I'm not familiar at all with Star Wars comics outside of the Dark Empire ones (which I have in graphic novel form).
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Mr_Rose wrote: Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
trexmeyer wrote: The Hutt litter is painfully stupid. In a universe of robots, Wookies, Gamorreans, hover technology, etc, you decide to have at least 2 tons of Hutt lard carried by 16~ skinny guys on a litter that is warping under their weight? C'mon now.
It’s a very intentional symbol, both diegetically and for the audience.
Aash wrote: White saviour seems an odd accusation considering Temuera Morrison isn’t white.
Yeah, people who say that are missing the point that Boba is his own kind of indigenous person, albeit one who never got to live in his native land. Also, the Tuskens are not savages (noble or otherwise) except according to the most superficial analysis.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: There’s also a possibility he’s not a perfect Clone after all, which could tie into later plot lines as he seeks a permanent fix for organ degradation etc.
I think you are right about this and I suspect Boba may not survive this show.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/06 08:16:09
Loved the second episode apart from the hangover Assassin from last episode.
While I was wondering why they didn't hide better from the spice train I could forgive this because of the train heist and the fact there wre training scenes.
It seems like the theme of this show is that the different peoples of Tatooine can live together productively, without sacrificing who they are. Boba Fett’s goal is not merely to be a gang lord. He wants to build a better society. He’s not an anti-hero at all. He’s a straightforward hero. To me, that is a welcome surprise.
The Mos Espa scenes in this chapter were very well done, if sparse. The encounter with the mayor had some fascinating insights about whether power is anything more than brute coercion. Boba’s ethos, and why it has a chance of working in a violent world, is coming into better focus: he doesn’t insist on conflict and there are some who can deeply appreciate that. I loved the scene with the Hutts. It is now totally clear that for Boba, this is something he is willing to die for. Perhaps unlike what many were expecting, Boba is not a violently reactive “badass” but rather a restrained, mature person. The fact that the Twins are also patient and above being baited shows them as the real, and quite formidable threat.
Once again, the Tusken scenes stand out more than the present-day ones. At the end of Ch. 1, Boba was no longer a prisoner of the Sand People. In this chapter, we see him become their ally. In these experiences, we are shown how Boba begins to conceive of his life’s purpose as something greater than merely surviving from job to job, as Jango once said “making his way through the galaxy.” He sees the reckless indifference to life on the fringe and can imagine something better, something many other fringers (and apparently also some audience members) cannot imagine.
This show is not really in step with the current cynical mood of our culture. For me, it is a breath of fresh air.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/06 08:04:50
The train is dumb in a world with space ships that could land anywhere on the planet within minutes. Starwars has always been dumb in this way.
The Hutt litter is also dumb in that there is nowhere near enough people to carry that much weight. This is a new way in which Starwars is being dumb.
White Savior is the trope that does not require the savior in question to be white in the same way that the Magical Black Man doesn't need to be Black or a Man.
Once again, the Tusken scenes stand out more than the present-day ones. At the end of Ch. 1, Boba was no longer a prisoner of the Sand People. In this chapter, we see him become their ally. In these experiences, we are shown how Boba begins to conceive of his life’s purpose as something greater than merely surviving from job to job, as Jango once said “making his way through the galaxy.” He sees the reckless indifference to life on the fringe and can imagine something better, something many other fringers (and apparently also some audience members) cannot imagine.
Starwars is not a universe that changes. Every time they even slightly start to change something it resets to the status quo lightning fast. The Book of Boba Fett is not where we will see Mose Isley become something other than a wretched hive of scum and villany.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/06 09:52:50
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
White Savior is the trope that does not require the savior in question to be white in the same way that the Magical Black Man doesn't need to be Black or a Man.
That’s news to me. I’ve always understood that race and especially the saviour figure being white was the central factor in the white saviour trope and associated criticism.
As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.
As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.
I’m well aware of the stock character and the various uses it can be put to, but labelling it as a white savior trope when the character in question isn’t white is applying a racial element which simply doesn’t exist here.
By all means call it a colonial stereotyping or an outsider or what have you, but it’s disingenuous if not outright dangerous to call an actor of Māori extraction a “white saviour”, and when I see that behaviour I’m going to call it out.
As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.
I’m well aware of the stock character and the various uses it can be put to, but labelling it as a white savior trope when the character in question isn’t white is applying a racial element which simply doesn’t exist here.
By all means call it a colonial stereotyping or an outsider or what have you, but it’s disingenuous if not outright dangerous to call an actor of Māori extraction a “white saviour”, and when I see that behaviour I’m going to call it out.
So you understand that the trope refers not to race, but to circunstances, but you don't care. Alright then.
As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.
I’m well aware of the stock character and the various uses it can be put to, but labelling it as a white savior trope when the character in question isn’t white is applying a racial element which simply doesn’t exist here.
By all means call it a colonial stereotyping or an outsider or what have you, but it’s disingenuous if not outright dangerous to call an actor of Māori extraction a “white saviour”, and when I see that behaviour I’m going to call it out.
So you understand that the trope refers not to race, but to circunstances, but you don't care. Alright then.
You seem to be misunderstanding me. I’m saying that the term “white saviour” shouldn’t be applied to an actor or character that isn’t white. “White Saviour” is a specific example of an “enlightened outsider” or “superior colonialist” where the saviour/outsider/colonialist etc. is in fact white. In this instance it is incorrect because the the saviour in question isn’t white.
I find the use of the term “white saviour” to refer to an actor of Māori extraction offensive and little more than casual racism. As such I’m pointing out that the term isn’t applicable in this context.
As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.
I’m well aware of the stock character and the various uses it can be put to, but labelling it as a white savior trope when the character in question isn’t white is applying a racial element which simply doesn’t exist here.
By all means call it a colonial stereotyping or an outsider or what have you, but it’s disingenuous if not outright dangerous to call an actor of Māori extraction a “white saviour”, and when I see that behaviour I’m going to call it out.
So you understand that the trope refers not to race, but to circunstances, but you don't care. Alright then.
You seem to be misunderstanding me. I’m saying that the term “white saviour” shouldn’t be applied to an actor or character that isn’t white. “White Saviour” is a specific example of an “enlightened outsider” or “superior colonialist” where the saviour/outsider/colonialist etc. is in fact white. In this instance it is incorrect because the the saviour in question isn’t white.
I find the use of the term “white saviour” to refer to an actor of Māori extraction offensive and little more than casual racism. As such I’m pointing out that the term isn’t applicable in this context.
Ok, you're objecting to the term, them, just because of the "white", even though the actual trope is inespecific. Ok.
What name should we use, then? The trope will stay the same, but if you can't stand the name, well, let's change it.
“White Saviour” is a specific example of an “enlightened outsider” or “superior colonialist” where the saviour/outsider/colonialist etc. is in fact white. In this instance it is incorrect because the the saviour in question isn’t white.
For all intents and purposes, humans are the "white people" of The Star Wars universe.
The only way we can ever solve anything is to look in the mirror and find no enemy
Something confusing is happening when people bring up a criticism of racism but at the same time insist on brushing off the specific question of race. For those who say that Boba Fett is a white savior, what exactly are you getting at? When we say Kevin Costner played a white savior in Dances With Wolves, the point is to criticize the film for fictionalizing the historical plight of non-white people for the purpose of emotionally reassuring, in the face of ongoing racism, actual white people in the audience. Are people arguing that the point of Book of Boba Fett is to comfort white people about real racism? This is a non-rhetorical question. I realize some people might say yes. But so far ITT I am not seeing an argument that the show is racially problematic; only that it is boring/predictable. To be clear, the main problem with white savior stories is NOT that they’ve been done before.
Furthermore, if Dances With Wolves had starred Denzel Washington rather than Costner, it would be quite convoluted to try to make the same “white savior” criticism. Similarly, Temuera Morrison’s race is certainly relevant to the question of whether, or to what extent, Book of Boba Fett is a white savior narrative (if not solely determinative). To be clear, I understand that the white savior criticism is directed at the character of Boba Fett rather than the actor Morrison. For those making the criticism, “white” apparently means “people who use blasters and space ships.” Boba is “white” in this sense; so are all Mandalorians, along with non-humans such as Gamorreans, Trandoshans, Wookies, Hutts, etc. So we see that there is already a problem with this approach: we’ve left the realm of racial, or even cultural, distinction altogether, in favor of a strictly technological distinction. In this view, Tusken people would become “white” as soon as they started piloting spaceships. In reality, indigenous people do not become white when they start driving cars. Or do they? Again, is that the debate here?
There is also the issue that Book of Boba Fett is part of The Mandalorian, a show that does not easily blur racial and cultural distinctions in favor of a clear-cut materialist/technologist viewpoint. Mandalorians are not the same “race” as non-Mandalorians. In previous seasons, the question of who is Mandalorian and why is a central issue. Is it a matter of technology (e.g., Beskar armor), birthright, genetics, ethos? I think, if anything, that theme is continuing in these episodes. Boba is unique, quite literally, but maybe that is not important. His claim to being Mandalorian (called into question immediately by nationalist zealot Bo Katan last season) hinges on being raised by a Mandalorian father, who himself was a foundling raised by Mandalorians similar to Din Djarin. Being “adopted in” is of huge importance to this show, and it’s not very surprising to see it come up again in Book of Boba Fett, albeit reoriented in a new and interesting way, especially considering Temuera Morrison’s own racial/cultural background.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/06 15:28:26
~15000 Astra Militarum: 
~1200 | Adeptus Custodes: 
~1900 | Imperial Knights: 
~2000 | Sisters of Battle: 
~3500 | Leagues of Votann: 
~1200 | Tyranids: 
~2600 | Stormcast Eternals: 
