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1) There is no world wide conspiracy. There are bigots that exist and the bigots do and say bigot things.
2) Did you not pay attention with Sandman and House of the dragon?
You have to be shoving your head into some pretty deep holes to not at least hear about this crap happening Every Single Time.
1. Of course that there is no world wide conspiracy. It is exactly what I am laughing at here.
2. Do you even bother to read what I wrote? To quote myself ''Both House of the Dragon and the Sandman faced a racistic backlash, and still there are much much more positive reviews than negative ones.'' Also even if I was not aware of that (is it mandatory to follow any social media gak show?), how does it changes that they are generally held as either good or very good shows, and TROP is not?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/09 13:38:14
The orcs looked amazing, also liked the way they designed the warg. He did have some neotenous features about him which was in stark contrast to the brutality and ferocity of the fight. It looked strange, but in a good way. Reminded me a bit of the Cave troll fight from the Fellowship, with the cave troll having had a similar cruel toddler thing going on. The attempted escape of the elves was done just right. They had a fighting chance, suffered several casualties and when it seemed that the Watchmaster would finally escape to safety, it is revealed that there was never any real chance of success in the first place. Devastating and satisfying. Well done.
Galadriel/Numenor remains a total bust for me. She is still an ice block of a character that fails to garner any sympathy. That lingering shot of her face when she rode the horse sent a shiver down my spine for its sheer awkwardness. Elendil, Isildur, Tar-Miriel and Ar-Pharazon all suffer from the same weird character displacement as Galadriel, Elrond and Gil-Galad. Wrong place in time, wrong characterization and wrong relations within the context of their people and other characters. Halbrand becoming bad boy Aragorn of the southlands is something I dread.
The hobbits were fine this time around. It was unexpected to me that they would just leave people behind who couldn't keep up, but that's a plausible rule dictated by the necessities of a wandering people that relies on remaining hidden. Again, somewhat of a stark contrast to their otherwise whimsical nature, but it worked for me. Still looking forward to who and what the stranger is, my bets and hopes are on Morinechtar/Romestamo for now.
1) There is no world wide conspiracy. There are bigots that exist and the bigots do and say bigot things.
2) Did you not pay attention with Sandman and House of the dragon?
You have to be shoving your head into some pretty deep holes to not at least hear about this crap happening Every Single Time.
1. Of course that there is no world wide conspiracy. It is exactly what I am laughing at here.
2. Do you even bother to read what I wrote? To quote myself ''Both House of the Dragon and the Sandman faced a racistic backlash, and still there are much much more positive reviews than negative ones.'' Also even if I was not aware of that (is it mandatory to follow any social media gak show?), how does it changes that they are generally held as either good or very good shows, and TROP is not?
1) Sandman came out all at once. It's done. People know exactly what they were getting.
2) House of the Dragon isn't regarded as anything yet. It's too early to tell. I think most people are tentative with a bit of optimism.
3) The Rings of Power has the bulk of it's complaints coming from "The Usual Suspects" while being very early in it's release and being on one of the least popular streaming services.
4) Lets say everything wraps and yeah, the rings of power is the least popular of the 3. Look at the criticisms. Are they criticisms about a non white cast? I think it's fair to remove those from the equation.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
1) Sandman came out all at once. It's done. People know exactly what they were getting.
2) House of the Dragon isn't regarded as anything yet. It's too early to tell. I think most people are tentative with a bit of optimism.
3) The Rings of Power has the bulk of it's complaints coming from "The Usual Suspects" while being very early in it's release and being on one of the least popular streaming services.
4) Lets say everything wraps and yeah, the rings of power is the least popular of the 3. Look at the criticisms. Are they criticisms about a non white cast? I think it's fair to remove those from the equation.
In a case of the Sandman, yes the season is finished, but my point for bringing it as an example was that there was also a racist backlash. But anyway let just use HOTD here. Both it and TROP have now 3 episodes, and still somehow one is generally praised when the other is not. Saying that all the critic is coming just from one source (be it racists/nazi/bigots, name them whatever) is simply untrue, and very offending to all those people out there who do not like the show (and I bet many of them are not white) . Same as saying that the show is exclusively criticised for their color cast. And yes, the racist comments should be removed. No one ever argued about it. The only problem, as always, is that practically any comment about the color cast is automatically classified as being racistic, especially when coming from a white person. My question here, why there need to be a real world diversity reflected in fictional races, was met with an immediate accusation of racism. Do you now understand how stupid it all is?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/09 14:31:10
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Well, Episode 3 has been a good improvement.
Numenor looks great and they've mostly avoided breaking more of the lore, so that is good. Only issue is that they're making Numenor out to be extremely isolationist, seemingly not having gone to Middle Earth for a long time. Numenor should be at the height of its colonization and power, Halbrand should have heard of them.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
1) Sandman came out all at once. It's done. People know exactly what they were getting.
2) House of the Dragon isn't regarded as anything yet. It's too early to tell. I think most people are tentative with a bit of optimism.
3) The Rings of Power has the bulk of it's complaints coming from "The Usual Suspects" while being very early in it's release and being on one of the least popular streaming services.
4) Lets say everything wraps and yeah, the rings of power is the least popular of the 3. Look at the criticisms. Are they criticisms about a non white cast? I think it's fair to remove those from the equation.
In a case of the Sandman, yes the season is finished, but my point for bringing it as an example was that there was also a racist backlash. But anyway let just use HOTD here. Both it and TROP have now 3 episodes, and still somehow one is generally praised when the other is not. Saying that all the critic is coming just from one source (be it racists/nazi/bigots, name them whatever) is simply untrue, and very offending to all those people out there who do not like the show (and I bet many of them are not white) . Same as saying that the show is exclusively criticised for their color cast. And yes, the racist comments should be removed. No one ever argued about it. The only problem, as always, is that practically any comment about the color cast is automatically classified as being racistic, especially when coming from a white person. My question here, why there need to be a real world diversity reflected in fictional races, was met with an immediate accusation of racism. Do you now understand how stupid it all is?
When someone pulls out one of the decades-old, classic standbys of racist rhetorical questions 'why does there need to be diversity?' why in the world would you expect people to not take it as racist?
People don't experience that as 'an honest question,' they see it as the 'I'm not racist, but... ' racism flag that its been since... the 1950s? 40s?
1) Sandman came out all at once. It's done. People know exactly what they were getting.
2) House of the Dragon isn't regarded as anything yet. It's too early to tell. I think most people are tentative with a bit of optimism.
3) The Rings of Power has the bulk of it's complaints coming from "The Usual Suspects" while being very early in it's release and being on one of the least popular streaming services.
4) Lets say everything wraps and yeah, the rings of power is the least popular of the 3. Look at the criticisms. Are they criticisms about a non white cast? I think it's fair to remove those from the equation.
In a case of the Sandman, yes the season is finished, but my point for bringing it as an example was that there was also a racist backlash. But anyway let just use HOTD here. Both it and TROP have now 3 episodes, and still somehow one is generally praised when the other is not. Saying that all the critic is coming just from one source (be it racists/nazi/bigots, name them whatever) is simply untrue, and very offending to all those people out there who do not like the show (and I bet many of them are not white) . Same as saying that the show is exclusively criticised for their color cast. And yes, the racist comments should be removed. No one ever argued about it. The only problem, as always, is that practically any comment about the color cast is automatically classified as being racistic, especially when coming from a white person. My question here, why there need to be a real world diversity reflected in fictional races, was met with an immediate accusation of racism. Do you now understand how stupid it all is?
When someone pulls out one of the decades-old, classic standbys of racist rhetorical questions 'why does there need to be diversity?' why in the world would you expect people to not take it as racist?
People don't experience that as 'an honest question,' they see it as the 'I'm not racist, but... ' racism flag that its been since... the 1950s? 40s?
To be precise, the question was, why there need to be exactly the same diversity in fictional races as is in our world. That is a huge difference. But I get what you mean. And I also know that people will hear only what they want to hear. And that is the problem with todays world, when you need to explain for several pages that you do not mean what they think you mean. Funny thing is that in most countries I would be called a leftist.
1) Sandman came out all at once. It's done. People know exactly what they were getting.
2) House of the Dragon isn't regarded as anything yet. It's too early to tell. I think most people are tentative with a bit of optimism.
3) The Rings of Power has the bulk of it's complaints coming from "The Usual Suspects" while being very early in it's release and being on one of the least popular streaming services.
4) Lets say everything wraps and yeah, the rings of power is the least popular of the 3. Look at the criticisms. Are they criticisms about a non white cast? I think it's fair to remove those from the equation.
In a case of the Sandman, yes the season is finished, but my point for bringing it as an example was that there was also a racist backlash. But anyway let just use HOTD here. Both it and TROP have now 3 episodes, and still somehow one is generally praised when the other is not. Saying that all the critic is coming just from one source (be it racists/nazi/bigots, name them whatever) is simply untrue, and very offending to all those people out there who do not like the show (and I bet many of them are not white) . Same as saying that the show is exclusively criticised for their color cast. And yes, the racist comments should be removed. No one ever argued about it.
There are 2 discussions to be had here.
1) Is that there are bigots who are review bombing and their critiques are coming from their own bs.
2 Is that the show has whatever things people don't like that are critcisms of the show itself. They don't like the pace. They think some of the opening gak was ham fisted. Whatever.
Just because people are talking about #1 doesn't mean the people saying #2 are being discussed in the same breath. When people call out the abusive bigots it's not calling someone who didn't like x scene a bigot. It's not talking about YOU.
(and I bet many of them are not white)
So fething what? There is only one thing this could imply. That a POC who is upset about racial casting cannot themselves be racist. Which is factually untrue. So why are you even bringing it up?
The only problem, as always, is that practically any comment about the color cast is automatically classified as being racistic, especially when coming from a white person
What criticism of the POC cast could you possibly have that isn't inherently at least systemically racist?
My question here, why there need to be a real world diversity reflected in fictional races, was met with an immediate accusation of racism. Do you now understand how stupid it all is?
Okay, so what if TRoP wasn't diverse. What if it was cast entirely with Indian actors. Is that a problem? Everyone, elves, humans, dwarves, orks, all of them, from central Asia. The issue isn't diversity. It's non white. Which, is discriminatory IRL. Which is racist. Probably not overtly racist. Not actively racist. Nobody is sitting at a desk twirling a mustache cackling white power (except the obvious ones who are). But these roles that do not require the cast to be white (or anything. Because the species are fictional) are being cast with diversity, and your question is "Why not just make them all white?" Do YOU not see how stupid that is?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/09 15:22:06
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
Numenor looks great and they've mostly avoided breaking more of the lore, so that is good. Only issue is that they're making Numenor out to be extremely isolationist, seemingly not having gone to Middle Earth for a long time. Numenor should be at the height of its colonization and power, Halbrand should have heard of them.
I don't think anyone can argue it does not look great! Of course if it had been Game of Thrones - Galadrials dress would have been much more see through
Looking forward to ep 4!
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
1) Is that there are bigots who are review bombing and their critiques are coming from their own bs.
2 Is that the show has whatever things people don't like that are critcisms of the show itself. They don't like the pace. They think some of the opening gak was ham fisted. Whatever.
Just because people are talking about #1 doesn't mean the people saying #2 are being discussed in the same breath. When people call out the abusive bigots it's not calling someone who didn't like x scene a bigot. It's not talking about YOU.
(and I bet many of them are not white)
So fething what? There is only one thing this could imply. That a POC who is upset about racial casting cannot themselves be racist. Which is factually untrue. So why are you even bringing it up?
The only problem, as always, is that practically any comment about the color cast is automatically classified as being racistic, especially when coming from a white person
What criticism of the POC cast could you possibly have that isn't inherently at least systemically racist?
My question here, why there need to be a real world diversity reflected in fictional races, was met with an immediate accusation of racism. Do you now understand how stupid it all is?
Okay, so what if TRoP wasn't diverse. What if it was cast entirely with Indian actors. Is that a problem? Everyone, elves, humans, dwarves, orks, all of them, from central Asia. The issue isn't diversity. It's non white. Which, is discriminatory IRL. Which is racist. Probably not overtly racist. Not actively racist. Nobody is sitting at a desk twirling a mustache cackling white power (except the obvious ones who are). But these role that do not require the cast to be white are being cast with diversity, and your question is "Why not just make them all white?" Do YOU not see how stupid that is?
You have some uncanny skill to either misinterpret or taking out of context or totally misunderstanding what I write. I am really tired of constantly explaining my point to you or others. Either you/they get it or not. I am past caring now. I will remove myself from this thread perpetually, and therefore will not interact here even if someone will try to continue the discussion. Thanks to all participants (yes, even to you who see me as a hidden racist).
1) Sandman came out all at once. It's done. People know exactly what they were getting.
2) House of the Dragon isn't regarded as anything yet. It's too early to tell. I think most people are tentative with a bit of optimism.
3) The Rings of Power has the bulk of it's complaints coming from "The Usual Suspects" while being very early in it's release and being on one of the least popular streaming services.
4) Lets say everything wraps and yeah, the rings of power is the least popular of the 3. Look at the criticisms. Are they criticisms about a non white cast? I think it's fair to remove those from the equation.
In a case of the Sandman, yes the season is finished, but my point for bringing it as an example was that there was also a racist backlash. But anyway let just use HOTD here. Both it and TROP have now 3 episodes, and still somehow one is generally praised when the other is not. Saying that all the critic is coming just from one source (be it racists/nazi/bigots, name them whatever) is simply untrue, and very offending to all those people out there who do not like the show (and I bet many of them are not white) . Same as saying that the show is exclusively criticised for their color cast. And yes, the racist comments should be removed. No one ever argued about it. The only problem, as always, is that practically any comment about the color cast is automatically classified as being racistic, especially when coming from a white person. My question here, why there need to be a real world diversity reflected in fictional races, was met with an immediate accusation of racism. Do you now understand how stupid it all is?
When someone pulls out one of the decades-old, classic standbys of racist rhetorical questions 'why does there need to be diversity?' why in the world would you expect people to not take it as racist?
People don't experience that as 'an honest question,' they see it as the 'I'm not racist, but... ' racism flag that its been since... the 1950s? 40s?
To be precise, the question was, why there need to be exactly the same diversity in fictional races as is in our world. That is a huge difference.
Maybe its a translation problem, but no, it isn't any kind of difference at all. Because the real effect is exactly the same- a coded question designed to exclude actors based solely on their appearance, not their talent.
Real-world effects on people trumps 'but fantasy...'
But I get what you mean. And I also know that people will hear only what they want to hear.
'I get what you mean, but its the fault of you people not listening' doesn't fly after you've doubled down on repeating the question after people have explained why it comes across as racist.
And that is the problem with todays world, when you need to explain for several pages that you do not mean what they think you mean. Funny thing is that in most countries I would be called a leftist.
Ah, no. Politics and racism sometimes align, but left leaning doesn't mean 'can't be racist.' Indeed, a lot of die hard Marxists were incredibly racist (and argued at length about why the USSR and China couldn't be Marxist utopias based on race)
And truthfully, being leftist doesn't say much. By American standards, center-right European politics is 'leftist.'
I am really tired of constantly explaining my point to you or others. Either you/they get it or not.
Nope, sorry. Zero points. If you are constantly explaining and multiple people don't get it, that's a problem with your explanation.
Some fair points you make there Voss and I agree with you.
Mrs. GG and I just finished watching episode 3 and loved it. A bit more graphic violence than we were expected but I am ok with that. I really like Galadriel more and more, especially when she makes mistakes. Her horse scene was awkwardly shot. Some shots in this show give off a bit of an “indulged art school student” vibe. And as much as I like how Clark can deliver lines at Galadriel, as much as she can show physical grace that could lend itself to martial arts, I am still not really seeing any sign of general level military expertise. And that is a real problem for me.
The Orcs were pretty good overall, certainly better than in Jackson's Hobbit. Maybe a bit less bones in the costuming. But I really liked the characterization and look of the slaves' “foreman”. I really liked the Warg. I think the actor playing Elendil is great. Isildur I am not so fond of but I suppose maybe I am not supposed to like him? I am not sure what to make of Halbarad but I definitely do not want him to become some sort of “bad boy Aragorn”.
Excellent set dressing and costuming across the board, except maybe the leather breastplates of the Numenorean sailors but the Royal Guard look good.
Arondil suffers a bit from “Legolas combat” but not as bad as I expected.
The show is nicely exceeding my admittedly low expectations and I am sorry to hear others are not enjoying as I am.
I’m still greatly enjoying this show. I of course know who Elendil and Isildur go on to become thanks to the movies, but the rest is, aha, an open book to me.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
BobtheInquisitor wrote: I also happened to read Tolkien’s LOTR as a story about white good men and even whiter elves, with a Semitic dwarf sidekick, fighting against the “unlovely Mongol type” orcs and brown had people.
You quite literally lost the plot
Bottom line is... its only bad if western media has white people only in things. All other nations and cultures can have the media casting 100% same race shows and its never a problem..
I mean, it’s not like the Chinese famously cast white American actors like Matt Damon into their fantasy movies to broaden the appeal.
Besides, this argument again hinges on confusing LOTR for some older culturally-specific mythology rather than a modern literary invention. Comparing it to Aladdin/Arabian Nights (which should actually be fairly diverse) , is disingenuous. Tolkien used older mythological terms as labels for his own creations; for example, his orcs were not sea monsters.
Grumpy Gnome wrote: Excellent set dressing and costuming across the board, except maybe the leather breastplates of the Numenorean sailors but the Royal Guard look good.
So it is leather!
I was having trouble with it last night and watched again this morning to try to confirm one way or the other, I'm not used to metal or leather being depicted that light tan colour and have been trying to puzzle out exactly what it was supposed to be - leaned towards leather due to it being less shiny than the polished metal breastplates of the guards on the land.
Good episode overall, we're still doing a lot of exposition for a show with only 8 episodes this season, but we've easily passed the 3-episode test. They managed to keep me interested in all three running narratives, the dwarves notably didn't steal the show like they did last episode, if only by virtue of not appearing - looks like they're going to have more focus next episode and I wonder if the plan going forward will generally involve them juggling three of their four parallel plot threads each episode?
Observations:
Spoiler:
-Numenor is as gorgeous as the previews have made it out to be - I don't know why but I was surprised the map of it we saw is the one Christopher Tolkien drew.
-We're once again seeing a younger, brasher, meaner Galadriel - Morfydd Clark does a great job of infusing a mix of pride and angry urgency into everything she does here and I'm here for it.
-I still feel to some extent she would work better as an original character.
-I get what they're going for with the riding scene, but it smashes through sentimental awe and lands squarely in corny territory. For all the talk of it it's incredibly brief.
-Speaking of original characters: I was dreading the 'hero character captured and enslaved' segments of this story the most, since they cover a lot of predictable beats, but Arondir continues to be a stand-out performance by Ismael Cordova that, and coupled with their willingness to be shockingly violent with the orcs and get on with an aggressive escape plan I think I ended up liking it better than the Numenor plotline.
-Meanwhile the Harfoot plot thread is my surprise favourite. Did not see that coming.
-Nori is confirmed to be short for Elanor - meaning the harfoots have encountered elves at some point (and not a dwarf named Nori travelling thorugh time, alas)
-A surprising show of depth from Sadoc, not only in refusing to de-caravan Nori or her family over what she did, but even when she told him all the weird stuff surrounding Meteor Man he took it at face value and thought about how it lined up with the legends, rather than just accuse her of lying like his character archetype would do. He also chewed her out for not reading the page herself right away if it was so important she had to steal it.
-I had my doubts that Meteor Man was Gandalf, but I'm warming to the idea more and more as it goes on. I swear I heard a little Sauron whisper from LotR when the page caught fire - I think this and the dead fireflies from last episode are because Sauron is already exhibiting some kind of control over the land.
Grumpy Gnome wrote: Excellent set dressing and costuming across the board, except maybe the leather breastplates of the Numenorean sailors but the Royal Guard look good.
So it is leather!
I was having trouble with it last night and watched again this morning to try to confirm one way or the other, I'm not used to metal or leather being depicted that light tan colour and have been trying to puzzle out exactly what it was supposed to be - leaned towards leather due to it being less shiny than the polished metal breastplates of the guards on the land.
Good episode overall, we're still doing a lot of exposition for a show with only 8 episodes this season, but we've easily passed the 3-episode test. They managed to keep me interested in all three running narratives, the dwarves notably didn't steal the show like they did last episode, if only by virtue of not appearing - looks like they're going to have more focus next episode and I wonder if the plan going forward will generally involve them juggling three of their four parallel plot threads each episode?
I am guessing it was leather. Or supposed to be leather. And I can not exactly say what it was that really bothered me except that it did not look thick enough or rigid enough to be the quality leather I have seen first hand from several prop makers in the UK. They looked like costume pieces rather than actual armor. So far in my opinion the weapon props have generally been better than the armor props. But then I may have an overly critical eye as I have a number of prop makers for mates. 😉
As for your observations, overall I quite agree. I think the only place you and I deviate Captain Joystick is that…
Spoiler:
I think prefer the Numenorean plotline over the prisoner plotline. I would have preferred a Human prisoner to have saved the Captain from the Warg with the thrown spear after Arondil was unable to delay the Warg longer. I like when characters make some mistakes or otherwise fail. Which is why I like the escape attempt failing. I did not expect that to happen.
Otherwise I am with you on all your other points. It is a pleasant experience to read someone feeling the same about the show as me and Mrs. GG.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2022/09/09 18:16:48
If by ''accurately adapting'' you mean manipulating then yes, he was. It is a proof of what I wrote earlier - one just need to ask the ''wrong'' question to be accused of being a racist.
It’s a call back to earlier in the thread. It’s also a comment on the accidental subtext of your posts that you seem to be unaware of.
Explain then both (to what it is a call back, and what hidden subtext I am unaware of) please.
I try and do the call back bit, it was very funny.
Earlier in the thread that really should die, there was extensive discussion about canon, what sources were used and adaptions made for drama, practicality and bias/agenda. How accurate to the texts, and which texts, is the series. Here we have a post "He was just accurately adapting your text." that refers back to that in a way many people find amusing. Self reference being one of the highlights for many fans of stuff like fantasy, the MCU, etc. Many peoples reactions here would have been similar, wry amusement that the reference was made to earlier discussion and misused (as per the earlier discussion about the adaption not being accurate) in a way that argued against your point echoing much of the the earlier assertion and argument about the text and the series.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Regarding the armor of the Numenorean sailors, while i doubt the showrunners are going to explain it as such, I think it kinda looks like and could be a kind of Brigandine. Steel armor covered in cloth/leather. Usually, Brigandine is segmented but there isn't any particular reason you couldn't have a large breastplate that was covered in leather.
That would be a practical thing for armor of people on ships too, since you want to keep that salt water off the steel. Coating it in treated leather/cloth could keep it from corroding. Pure leather armor is pretty rare historically since leather is quite expensive, so it was usually limited to straps, belts, etc... Metal or cloth armor is also much easier to repair than leather. But it could make sense as a Brigandine type armor specifically designed for seafarers.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/09 19:13:35
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Gert wrote: I'm really digging (hehe) the designs of the feral Orcs we're seeing.
Me too! They are generally familiar enough for anyone who knows orcs from PJ’s films but they definitely have their own distinctive look. The semi-translucent snake-skin (???) cloak protecting the one orc from the sun was a pretty awesome idea.
Oh wow and boy is it ever satisfying to see them get got, too! They are some truly vile baddies.
I liked every part of episode 3 but surely my favorite is the introduction of Numenor, which was amazing. They got it exactly right IMO; some kind of Mycenaean version of Rome. Elendil is an excellent character so far and Isildur shows a lot of promise. I continue to love Galadriel, she is my absolute favorite. It was nice to see her recognized (“THE Galadriel??”). Very, very interesting set up for Halbrand. Some are speculating he is actually Sauron. Some are comparing him to Aragorn. For my part, I wonder whether there is a certain ring (ahem, one out of nine) in his future …
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/09 22:13:20
Orcs, I think thanks to GW and WoW but also a bit of DnD too - have been in the "we're the bad comic relief" for a long while. Getting truly grim and nasty orcs is good!
The orc scene is E2 was essentially a horror movie. It was super effective. After that intro, I wondered how they would keep orcs so scary when it wasn’t a one-off movie monster but an army of ‘em, and the answer is that they are absolutely depraved.
I have not yet watched episode 3, so I might be wrong on this. Some of the armour looks like high tin alloyed bronze, which historically was used as an alternative to silver. The brighter polished surface was highly regarded, but more importantly it was more corrosion resistant. It was mainly decorative but in a fantasy setting, decorative armour is often more commonplace. It also has a better reflective surface and was much more common further East because that meant it didn't heat the wearer as much. Thanks to it's resonant quality it's also used in metal bowls and bells for music.
However, if I'm thinking of the same armour you're referring to, it is the cream armour from some of the other promo material? That the sailors are wearing. It's neither leather nor metal. It's in fact linen armour similar to the kind numerous military forces used in warmer climes. Surprisingly tough, can take an arrow and sword swing just as well as anything else. Much lighter, cheaper and above all, not going to overheat you.
Given the Byzantine aesthetic of the Numenoreans, this would be the likely material which is very cool as it's rare to see it in media.
Again though, I've yet to watch episode 3 so I'm just basing it on what you folks have said in the thread and what I'd seen in the promos!
Is it just me or are they packing the entirety of the second age into the series? Elendil and sons are the very tale end of the age. But if that’s the case, all the rings have been forged, the numenorians all all over Middle Earth, gates of moria shut. Etc.
Before this episode I would have placed the timeline circa 1000-1500 SA. But now it looks more like it’s at 3000- 3319 SA.
Granted, it’s been a few years since my last reading of the Silmarillion, so I’m a bit fuzzy on the details, but I’m having issues with the timeline.
I am, however, enjoying it. (Even if I need to kick my pedantic lore nerd self down occasionally)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/09 23:53:36
Well episode 3 has lost me entirely. First two epsiodes were dull and none of the characters have held me at all. In fact Galadriel has easily become the worst character in it, which is sad considering she's the focus. That's enough.
1) There is no world wide conspiracy. There are bigots that exist and the bigots do and say bigot things.
2) Did you not pay attention with Sandman and House of the dragon?
You have to be shoving your head into some pretty deep holes to not at least hear about this crap happening Every Single Time.
1. Of course that there is no world wide conspiracy. It is exactly what I am laughing at here.
2. Do you even bother to read what I wrote? To quote myself ''Both House of the Dragon and the Sandman faced a racistic backlash, and still there are much much more positive reviews than negative ones.'' Also even if I was not aware of that (is it mandatory to follow any social media gak show?), how does it changes that they are generally held as either good or very good shows, and TROP is not?
1) Sandman came out all at once. It's done. People know exactly what they were getting.
2) House of the Dragon isn't regarded as anything yet. It's too early to tell. I think most people are tentative with a bit of optimism.
3) The Rings of Power has the bulk of it's complaints coming from "The Usual Suspects" while being very early in it's release and being on one of the least popular streaming services.
4) Lets say everything wraps and yeah, the rings of power is the least popular of the 3. Look at the criticisms. Are they criticisms about a non white cast? I think it's fair to remove those from the equation.
Say what you will, but I just watched the first episode of HotD and it blows all 3 episodes of RoP out of the water by itself. It's storytelling done right with respect to source material and descriptions.
- Max
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: I’m still greatly enjoying this show. I of course know who Elendil and Isildur go on to become thanks to the movies, but the rest is, aha, an open book to me.
Except they are 1500 years too early.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/09/10 01:38:36
Conversely, this show has won me over. I went in expecting to like all the Weta designs (as I did from the previews) and not really liking the show. Thankfully, I like both a lot.
The fething Phil Tippet looking warg was awesome.
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Just finished watching ep3. Really enjoyed it save for a couple of issues. Galadriel seems too smart to openly antagonize the queen like that. She already felt the unfriendliness toward her, she's got no backup, no one back home even knows where she is, it's her against an entire island but still she chooses to be as idiotically brash as possible. I mean this is the same person who jumped off a ship in the middle of the sea so she could swim back to middle earth so maybe it's in character? I love the actress, but I feel like the writers are doing her absolutely no favors.
My other big problem with this episode was Halbrand. They are way too on the nose with the Aragorn parallel. A reluctant, self doubting hero, from a line of lost kings, to a land in need of a leader? It's too much. It felt ridiculous.
The Harfoots and Arondir were faultless. I loved the warg, so brutal and creepy looking. The bloodshot eyes were a very nice touch. Numenor looked absolutely gorgeous, definitely felt like I was peering into another world there. Looking forward to ep4!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/10 01:51:52
Nevelon wrote: Is it just me or are they packing the entirety of the second age into the series? Elendil and sons are the very tale end of the age. But if that’s the case, all the rings have been forged, the numenorians all all over Middle Earth, gates of moria shut. Etc.
Before this episode I would have placed the timeline circa 1000-1500 SA. But now it looks more like it’s at 3000- 3319 SA.
Granted, it’s been a few years since my last reading of the Silmarillion, so I’m a bit fuzzy on the details, but I’m having issues with the timeline.
I am, however, enjoying it. (Even if I need to kick my pedantic lore nerd self down occasionally)
It's not just you, they are.
Elendil and sons should be much later than this. They are really giving off a proto-atlantis/Rome vibe from numenor, which I like and agree with.
I also liked the statue of Earendil the Mariner, and the callback to him by the harfoot elder.
Two durins being alive, at the same time we're about to delve too greedily and too deep.
The dragon helm of turin was a nice Easter egg.
Disa having light mutton chops is a compromise on a fully bearded dwarf woman I can get behind.
creeping-deth87 wrote: Just finished watching ep3. Really enjoyed it save for a couple of issues. Galadriel seems too smart to openly antagonize the queen like that. She already felt the unfriendliness toward her, she's got no backup, no one back home even knows where she is, it's her against an entire island but still she chooses to be as idiotically brash as possible. I mean this is the same person who jumped off a ship in the middle of the sea so she could swim back to middle earth so maybe it's in character? I love the actress, but I feel like the writers are doing her absolutely no favors.
My other big problem with this episode was Halbrand. They are way too on the nose with the Aragorn parallel. A reluctant, self doubting hero, from a line of lost kings, to a land in need of a leader? It's too much. It felt ridiculous.
The Harfoots and Arondir were faultless. I loved the warg, so brutal and creepy looking. The bloodshot eyes were a very nice touch. Numenor looked absolutely gorgeous, definitely felt like I was peering into another world there. Looking forward to ep4!
To be fair, idiotically brash is like the key defining feature of the Noldor. These are the elves who thumbed their noses at the gods and left the undying lands in search of vengeance. There was even a crazy check, where a bunch of them realized how bad it was and turned back (not her). Another check when the guy who’s quest to get his shiny stones back they were on takes the boats and abandons most of those who stuck with him. Go home? Nope. March across the frozen lands of crushing ice and death. Yup.
Now Galadrial spent a big chunk of the 1st age chilling with the Sindaran elves, but she’s from the old, prideful, bit crazy part of Elfdom.
To be fair, idiotically brash is like the key defining feature of the Noldor. These are the elves who thumbed their noses at the gods and left the undying lands in search of vengeance. There was even a crazy check, where a bunch of them realized how bad it was and turned back (not her). Another check when the guy who’s quest to get his shiny stones back they were on takes the boats and abandons most of those who stuck with him. Go home? Nope. March across the frozen lands of crushing ice and death. Yup.
Now Galadrial spent a big chunk of the 1st age chilling with the Sindaran elves, but she’s from the old, prideful, bit crazy part of Elfdom.
Ehhhh, that was a part I wasn't so keen on. She may be prideful and a little brash, but she's not stupid. Or at least shouldn't be. She should have been more than capable of reading the room and knowing that she would need some diplomatic persuasion to get what she wanted. Sure maybe they SHOULD give her what she wants, but given that she is in no position to be demanding passage, and is in no position to take passage by force, it would have been better to take a tactful approach.
Which is another sign of poor skill on the part of the screenwriters, they are clearly very weak in terms of dialogue and how to properly write characters. They think an intelligent prideful characters would just go demanding everything, like they had happen. Instead, they should have written her to be asking for a favor, but struggling to swallow her pride and disdain for the lack of hospitality. Same end result, but the latter method feels more organic and makes the characters have more depth. Which really is the biggest issue here. They've plotted out a decent enough overall story in bullet point format, but they're not really qualified to flesh the dialogue out properly.
Just compare the dialogue between House of the Dragon and RoP. It's just another level in HotD and just highlights the amateurish skill of the writers in RoP. You'd think money could buy some decent writing, but Galadrial's lines in particular are cheesy B movie grade dialogue.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/09/10 03:20:44
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Nope, sorry. Zero points. If you are constantly explaining and multiple people don't get it, that's a problem with your explanation.
Ultramarines, 3rd Co. and friends, 16k+ 
4k 
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