Kilkrazy wrote: Unfortunately, I HAET Peter Capaldi with a mad passion, so I shall spend the rest of the thread banging on about getting rid of him.
HAETers gonna HAET.
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Corpsesarefun wrote: I've mentioned that twice, once today and once on the 25th of November, it's hardly a regular thing.
11/24 - The special really highlighted how much I despise Matt smith and adore David Tenant. 11/25 - Me and the two mates I watched the special with were hoping he'd die early. 11/25 - He's like a child... And I loathe children.
Twice on the 25th and once on the 24th. And that's only in the last 5 or so pages.
The Rani was a renegade Time Lady. She knew the Doctor and the Master when all three were young, and became an enemy of the former and an unwilling ally of the latter.
Automatically Appended Next Post: It won't be Rose.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Although, it appears it may not be anyone we have ever met before:
"The Doctor meets an old friend. Someone from his distant past. Someone who knows him very well, but whom we have never met. She's the Mother Superious of the Papal Mainframe."
To be honest, I am slightly annoyed that they passed over the opportunity to bring back someone from Ye Olden Days. Romana or the Rani would both tie into the 'quest for gallifrey' arc quite nicely and would give the Doctor an equal which is not something we've really seen in nuWho other than River.
It would have been a neat way to cap off the anniversary year bringing back an old name.
I'll be sad to see Smith go, to be honest, but I'm very much looking forward to Capaldi's run as the Doc. He'll be a great contrast to Smith and Tennant-style characters, which should change up the dynamic a bit (personally, I'm hoping he's halfway between Pertwee and McCoy, maybe with a bit of Tennant thrown in)
While Wiki gives another name I still think it is the Rani. The makeup and the "some one from his past" line just brings her to mind. If they just create a new character and then say they previously met it is kind of a cheat. Also in the trailer she mentions starting up the time war again which only someone completely nuts would want and that again screams the Rani.
Ah, I didn't know Romana was on Gallifrey. Oh well, they might bring her back when he finds it then. (which, with the Silence plot arc having taken 4 years, will occur in 2020 with the 15th Doctor).
@Stormdrake: Moffat has said that it is an unseen character It's quoted on either this or the last page. I agree, it is something of a cop-out after the reveal it was 'someone from his past'.
Yeah, the Romana thing came from the audio/books continuity though which is a bit dodgy on whether it is official. Although the night of the doctor added a lot of credence to it.
Would've been good to see more of Capaldi at the very least, the fact they've built up this regeneration so much had me expecting more.. that and there was no resolution of the situation on Trenzalore or with the Time Lords. Feels like they really were trying to pull off more than was possible in such a short amount of time, especially with short bits of narration progressing most of the plot and the Time Lords giving him another regeneration (maybe more?) not explained beyond Clara asking nicely. I know they needed the Doctor to answer the question so that they'd think it was safe yet they clearly knew he was dying and that it wasn't safe. The fact that Gallifrey was saved and the time war was ended in the 50th feels really hollow now that it's on the precipice of simply restarting once again (although I admit seeing the Time War 2.0 would be an interesting plot arch). Despite all that it wasn't bad, it had its moments, such as the old Doctor looking and sounding a lot like William Hartnell's incarnation. Not all throw backs were good mind you, Clara being sent back in the Tardis just reminded me of the end of the Bad Wolf plot arch.. and they did it twice in the same episode, yet for what purpose (other than letting Clara see the Doctor age) I'm really not sure.
Nevertheless.. "I've got new kidneys! I don't like the colour..."
I thought that was pretty good, cleared up a lot of stuff, and had a good plot to boot. SFX were great and the performance from the cast all round was good. Smith was absolutely brilliant, and even Coleman wasn't as bad as usual.
Plot spoilers ahead:
Spoiler:
I do like that it finally wrapped up the exploding TARDIS plot from series 5, that's been bugging me for a while.
Having the Silence (and the Silents) as good guys was a neat twist, especially as they cleared up the ones from the past episodes as a 'breakaway faction'. Not sure I like the idea that the Silents are genetically modified rather than actual aliens, but I can live with it.
I do hope this isn't the end of the Gallifrey plotline, and I doubt it will be. Interesting that they decided to grant him more regenerations, as he didn't exactly part with the High Council on good terms (End of Time). I wonder if that means Rassilon is no longer in command?
I felt the end was perhaps a little rushed, and could have done with running another 10-15 minutes. Smith as the older Doctors was exceptional.
Capaldi's entrance, although fleeting, was great. I can't see Clara lasting with him long, she seems so attached to 11, but that's a good thing, I'm not a fan of her.
I'll post more later, after I've thought about it a little more. Until then, Goodbye 11, roll on 12...
It's funny you say that, I thought it was too Christmassy in places. The worst specials in my opinion since 2005 have been the ones that really focused on Christmas (Christmas Carol, Doctor Widow and Wardrobe) while the best (Christmas Invasion, The Next Doctor, The End of Time) were the ones that used Christmas as a setting rather than a plot device. I agree the Christmas Special needs to be something... well, special, but it can be that without being overly festive. The regeneration itself was special enough for me.
Leaving the Regeneration would also mean it would have to come some point in the series, which really wouldnt work. I think the whole dynamic of the show will change with Capaldi at the helm, and that would be hard to pull off mid-series.
I agree, in my opinion they should've had an episode between the anniversary and christmas to cover the regenerations and then had this one as a christmas one to showcase capaldi.
Corpsesarefun wrote: I think it would've been better if they had made this a pure christmas episode and had a pure regeneration episode separately.
Something similar to what happened in the 8th Doctor's TV film where he regenerated right near the start, would have perhaps worked well in Capaldi's first episode.
Spoiler:
Also would have been nice if the Daleks had at any point regained their status as a truly fearsome enemy. In the past they always had to be defeated either in a particularly cunning or timey-wimey way, yet in all of Matt's series they've been progressively more useless sadly. Also, I don't think I saw more than 3 Daleks in any single scene.. prop department getting the short end of the budget it seems. I miss the malicious and outrageously xenophobic Daleks as opposed to the token 'this is serious so the Daleks must show up' card, only to be mocked senseless anyway.
It also felt like they were trying to outdo the grandeur and possibly even shock, depending on the person, of the past 3 regenerations (9, 10 and 10.2). Especially after the spectacle that was the 50th, I don't thing there was ever any chance of that.. in fact the 50th episode will always feel much more like Matt's finale rather than tonight's episode. Ah well, even though we didn't get to see Capaldi's supposedly energetic new take on the Doctor storming around in this episode, at least the next season isn't going to be split in two. That's a good sign in my book.
It was so... bad. If Moffat had sat on the toilet a little while longer and come up with something as good as the 50th, then that would've been alot better.
And the plot holes... it wasn't just a single one you could easily overlook, the entire plot just didn't make sense. Why did Clara do the 'send you into the Tardis in your own time' from Bad Wolf? Twice? Why is the town called Christmas? If this is an alien planet, how did Christianity spread there?
The one good thing is that Clara's gran was that gran from Benidorm.
I only watched the first series of Matt Smith but I didn't like him or the overall story arc so I stopped watching. Started watching today because a new doctor is a new start and I really like Capaldi as an actor. (Need to watch the 50th episode still though)
As for the episode tonight:
- I felt Capaldi didn't get enough screen time, but his quick entrance was a good start
- Kind of irked they used the Rose trick twice in the same episode as an excuse to age up Matt Smith
- I feel Daleks and Cybermen are quite overused at the moment as enemies and are quite often too easily defeated
- And at the start shouldn't Clara have been sent back in time by the weeping Angel when it grabbed her? (Massive plot hole imo)
- The episode started off with a really interesting premise and set up but Moffat couldn't get the pacing right I felt and it fizzled out towards the end
Preferred the 50th but yeah, I'm actually fine with a plot hole wrapup episode and, to be honest, I hope Jenna Coleman sticks around, not just for the obvious reason.
It might be good to see a character struggle to deal with a drastically different doctor.
Surely though this episode will mean an end to the endless and pointless is this 12 regenerations/is this the 11th or 12th Doctor/do regenerations count if he calls himself something else discussions that have plagued Dr Who threads since the start of the Internet!
The Doctor cleared it up quite neatly in one or two throw away lines.
Let the how many regenerations does he now have discussion commence.
Oh and I thought the episode was good and despite missing the first ten minutes it wasn't that hard to follow. More Capaldi Dr Who would have been better though.
One other little gem to leave you with: Regenerations can destroy Dalek spaceships, discuss.
I don't think there can be any debate on how many rengenerations he has now. He's given 'a whole new cycle' (ie 12 regens) and used 1. You don't need a degree in advanced maths to work out 12-1=11. So I imagine we'll reach the 100th anniversary before they need to address the issue again.
Several of the 'throwaway' lines wrapped stuff up without getting bogged down(what are the Silence/Silents? How many regens Why did the TARDIS blow up?) which is good going forwards, helps the shown move off with no hanging plots. We still have 'the woman in the shop' from Asylum and the Duck Pond Without Any Ducks from 'Eleventh Hour' (although maybe that's just a Crack in the Universe) but nothing major still hanging around.
I think the Regen that soloed a Dalek fleet was a) a result of the sudden release and absorption of 12 regens' worth of energy and b) because it's now a 'thing' that stuff blows up when regenerating. The fact that the Smith-Capaldi regen itself was so sudden adds credibility to the theory that the later the regeneration, the more violent it is. As the first of a cycle, it was pretty much instant (just like the older ones) while the more recent ones -10-11) end up taking out half the TARDIS.
- The Papal Mainframe being explained (Headless Monks and those soldiers from Matt Smith's first encounter with the Weeping Angels also covered, kind of).
- The Silence as a religious order being explained.
- Clara, I love Clara.
- Smith is my favorite Doctor so far and I enjoyed that he gave an interesting monologue at the end of his time, instead of complaining that he didn't want to go.
- Well placed humor.
- The Doctor as a protector willing to defend Christmas and Gallifrey for so long.
- The Weeping Angels as a minor villain, not as over the top as they've been in Smith's time.
- Capaldi's intro was interesting, except him asking how to fly the TARDIS.
Things that I didn't like:
Spoiler:
- Ditching Clara twice? Seriously, it was dumb in the first season, why do it again?
- Though the Silence sect that blew up the TARDIS was explained, we still don't know how they possibly got the TARDIS in the first place in order to blow it up.
- The Dalek stalk foreheads. They really are just annoying and kind of a deus ex machina, in my opinion.
- The Daleks seemed rather lame and more of a throw-in villain.
- Why is Capaldi asking how to fly the TARDIS?
Most of all: - Did anybody else think Capaldi didn't enunciate well? To me, Tennant and Smith spoke very clearly and Capaldi seemed more muffled.
Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote: Hey guys, would it be too much to ask y'all to tag your diddly-darn spoilers?
~Tim?
Or you could not read a thread about a discussion of a show right after a big special episode of the show aired but befor watching it yourself? I mean what did you Expect people to be posting?
- Why is Capaldi asking how to fly the TARDIS?
Most of all: - Did anybody else think Capaldi didn't enunciate well? To me, Tennant and Smith spoke very clearly and Capaldi seemed more muffled.
Traditionally, the doctor has been a bit messed up after regeneration. This one was a big one and he was more so. Heck, there was an entire episode for Davison where he was useless and his companions had to run things.
So far this has been about as sub par as I could have imagined...I cannot wait for this to end, just to seem my new doctor. Because it seems like that'll be the only good scene of the episode.
- The Papal Mainframe being explained (Headless Monks and those soldiers from Matt Smith's first encounter with the Weeping Angels also covered, kind of).
- The Silence as a religious order being explained.
- Clara, I love Clara.
- Smith is my favorite Doctor so far and I enjoyed that he gave an interesting monologue at the end of his time, instead of complaining that he didn't want to go.
- Well placed humor.
- The Doctor as a protector willing to defend Christmas and Gallifrey for so long.
- The Weeping Angels as a minor villain, not as over the top as they've been in Smith's time.
- Capaldi's intro was interesting, except him asking how to fly the TARDIS.
Things that I didn't like:
Spoiler:
- Ditching Clara twice? Seriously, it was dumb in the first season, why do it again?
- Though the Silence sect that blew up the TARDIS was explained, we still don't know how they possibly got the TARDIS in the first place in order to blow it up.
- The Dalek stalk foreheads. They really are just annoying and kind of a deus ex machina, in my opinion.
- The Daleks seemed rather lame and more of a throw-in villain.
- Why is Capaldi asking how to fly the TARDIS?
Most of all: - Did anybody else think Capaldi didn't enunciate well? To me, Tennant and Smith spoke very clearly and Capaldi seemed more muffled.
It's called "having an accent" - unlike David "North British" Tennant, Capaldi isn't going to kid-on he's English it seems.
Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote: Hey guys, would it be too much to ask y'all to tag your diddly-darn spoilers?
~Tim?
Or you could not read a thread about a discussion of a show right after a big special episode of the show aired but befor watching it yourself? I mean what did you Expect people to be posting?
Oh, I wasn't talking about myself. I was just under the impression that, if a thread doesn't have a spoilers warning in the title, it's expected of people to hide their spoilers. Just basic internet politeness. It's not that hard to do. Just press the "Spoiler" button.
Letdown. Day of the doctor was so good and this was kinda lame. I just don't see how Clara and the new doc will have any chemistry at all. With her whole arc being based upon the premise the doctor was her 'fake boyfriend' now will she introduce the doctor as 'her weird grandpa'?
I will still watch it... I am curious to see how it works... but not thrilled so far.
Vaktathi wrote: Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing more of Capaldi. I'm hoping he brings a bit of his Malcom Tucker to Doctor Who.
That stare that he gave Clara was hilarious.. both the wife and I were laughing our bums off at it... I was kinda waiting for a "Who the FETH are you!?... Wait... who the feth am I?!"
Like so many of the Moffat series finales and specials, the character interaction has been fantastic and any monologues or epic speeches have been well performed. I have loved Matt Smith as The Doctor. However Moffat just really sucks at explaining away plot threads or unanswered questions without resorting to deus ex machina. If anything is even explained at all. This one was much the same.
Vaktathi wrote: Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing more of Capaldi. I'm hoping he brings a bit of his Malcom Tucker to Doctor Who.
That stare that he gave Clara was hilarious.. both the wife and I were laughing our bums off at it... I was kinda waiting for a "Who the FETH are you!?... Wait... who the feth am I?!"
Yeah, the crazy stare is something I can see Mr Capaldi becoming very famous for very quickly.
If you want to see Malcom Tucker in Dr Who, then do a youtube search for 'Malcom Tucker+ Dr Who', there's a couple of amazing, if sweary, mashups on there that are hilariously funny.
Having watched the episode again, I liked it even more. Coleman's performance was way better than she usually was (ie she actually had character) and I think this may have been Smith's best performance, purely in terms of acting quality.
That said, I did spot one major plot hole: If they changed the future, and the Doctor never died at Trenzalore, then Simeon and Clara would never have been able to go into his timestream, and therefore the Doctor would never have met the other versions to go looking for her.
The only answer is that as she's a time traveller, she's not affected by changes in time or something handwavy like that.
That stare that he gave Clara was hilarious.. both the wife and I were laughing our bums off at it... I was kinda waiting for a "Who the FETH are you!?... Wait... who the feth am I?!"
Me too, was expecting some "fethity" wordplay here
Corpsesarefun wrote:I get the impression that Capaldi will replace all swearing with angry looks.
Indeed, especially with 'dem eyebrows. He looks like he good be a very good "dark" doctor.
Paradigm wrote: That said, I did spot one major plot hole: If they changed the future, and the Doctor never died at Trenzalore, then Simeon and Clara would never have been able to go into his timestream, and therefore the Doctor would never have met the other versions to go looking for her.
The only answer is that as she's a time traveller, she's not affected by changes in time or something handwavy like that.
Paradigm wrote: That said, I did spot one major plot hole: If they changed the future, and the Doctor never died at Trenzalore, then Simeon and Clara would never have been able to go into his timestream, and therefore the Doctor would never have met the other versions to go looking for her.
The only answer is that as she's a time traveller, she's not affected by changes in time or something handwavy like that.
Welcome to Doctor Who! It's all timey-wimey.
Timey-wimey has unfortunately become a byword and a cop-out for bad writing in recent years, so I'm hoping we see less of it going forward. Some of it has been clever, and the line was funny the first time round in Blink, but to quote the War Doctor 'Timey-WHAT!?'. It was fine as a joke, but it shouldn't become a crutch for overly convoluted and poorly-thought-out writing.
That said, I can more that live with that plot hole, in the grand scheme of things it doesn't really matter so long as we keep getting good adventures. To be honest, I'd like to see less of a focus on plot arcs in general (have them, but not so obviously, as in series 1-4) and just get back to good old adventuring in time and space.
That said, I can more that live with that plot hole, in the grand scheme of things it doesn't really matter so long as we keep getting good adventures. To be honest, I'd like to see less of a focus on plot arcs in general (have them, but not so obviously, as in series 1-4) and just get back to good old adventuring in time and space.
Indeed. Except for the plot arcs involving the Master, my favorite episodes have been the one-offs.
That said, I can more that live with that plot hole, in the grand scheme of things it doesn't really matter so long as we keep getting good adventures. To be honest, I'd like to see less of a focus on plot arcs in general (have them, but not so obviously, as in series 1-4) and just get back to good old adventuring in time and space.
Indeed. Except for the plot arcs involving the Master, my favorite episodes have been the one-offs.
Honestly, I think that many Whovians agree with this. However, market research has shown that folks who watch "normal" TV shows have started watching more shows where the entire series has a multi-season story arc that gets intermixed with a inter-seasonal arc as well (think Fringe, where all 5 seasons have this massive epic story, but each season concentrates on a smaller aspect of it)... The problem with that is, Dr Who really works best as a string of one off, or 2 part series episodes, much more so than a grandiose conspiracy type show.
Definitely a disappoint for me. It felt rather like a rushed montage of clips with a shred of a story tenuously holding it all together. I thought at least the regeneration scene would save it*, and it ALMOST did. That is, right until the split-second insta regeneration that completely deadened the emotion of the scene. Geeze, give a a little time to mourn with a proper regeneration scene. RIVER'S regeneration sequence was longer.
Also, is anyone else tired of the "save the universe" trope? It was okay for a while, and now it's just like "oh look, the universe is in danger. Wow. Much peril. So scary." The smaller-scale episodes with smaller stakes tend to work better for me - look at Vincent and the Doctor for a good example of that.
They did tie up a lotta loose ends. Here's to hoping they take advantage of that clean slate in series 8.
All in all, I give it 2 and a half stars. Matt Smith deserved so much more.
~Tim?
*like it did in The End of Time, which was otherwise an episode I've tried to erase from my memory.
Yeah, they have saved the universe too many times, especially when using a mysterious girl with a special power to save the universe.
I too would like to see more one- and two-off stories. I don't see why they can't weave them into an overall long story but it shouldn't be about saving the universe for a bit. Particularly if a mysterious girl is involved. Girls okay, but no more mysterious powers!
The Master stories weren't about saving the universe, and they still made a great long running story.
Also, no more mysterious girls for a season or two, please.
I have nightmares about RTD returning to the show. I'd frankly like to see a totally new writer, preferably someone who could take the show in a new direction unlike anything Moffat or RTD have done. I wonder how Gatiss would work as a head writer?
Both RTD and Moffat have done excellent work. It can't be easy to resuscitate an old show and pump out dozens of script concepts. There is a danger of getting spread too thinly. Not every script can be a humdinger.
Moffat and RTD, as has been mentioned above, produced some amazing work, and some real stinkers. Moffat's work pre being head writer was better than his more recent stuff, though (although Day of the Doctor proves he can still put out stunning scripts). I think RTD is done with Who now, and to come back to it after so long wouldn't do him or the show any good. I do think Moffat has been around as boss too long though, as it seems to be him that's driving the convoluted plot arcs and 'timey-wimey' nonsense.
Gatiss has the calibre to be head writer, he's written some good stuff (and is probably the best of the Sherlock writers as well). There are a lot of great writers for Who, but I don't think any of them could be consistent enough to be head writer. What I think would be the best idea (although it would never happen) would be to increase the work given to each writer to say, 2-3 episodes a series rather than 1 writer doing half the series.
Gaiman I'd like to see more of, he's great as a novelist, but while The Doctor's Wife was amazing, Nightmare in Silver lived up to the title in that it was a nightmare, almost single-handedly destroying the idea of the Cybermen (they're not Borg, Neil!). I really do need to see more of his work before I'd back him for head writer.
Toby Whithouse I'd like to see being given a chance to do more, his scripts for School Reunion, Vampires in Venice and Town Called Mercy were all among the best in their series.
There's a load of great talent in the show in all areas, it's just that Moffat is getting too carried away with what seem to be delusions of grandeur and taking on too much.
That would be my ciriticism of the writing over the last few years. There have been some brilliant one-off scripts, but the over-arching plot arcs have been in my opinion needlessly convoluted and complicated. A little timey-wimey is fine... actually expected, but the constant "who's on first", bouncing back and fourth, changing realities stuff is becoming cheap theatrical background noise as opposed to something monumental feeling. Too many things in the show seem to be turmped-up as significant, rather than tugging at your heart strings (which takes a lot more writing effort) & being naturally significant.
More than anything, I'd just like the "classic" bad guys to actually be scary and capable again. They manage to get a lot of convincing one-off bad guys in there, but they keep making the Daleks and Cybermen look like confused children/comic relief when they should be exceedingly dangerous.
Yeah, Dalek is among the best of nuWho full stop, it was a great episode that really captured the menace of the Daleks. In the same way, I think Rise of the Cybermen/Age of Steel did a great job of showing off the Cybermen. Nightmare in Silver just killed them, all that 'upgrade in progress' stuff was just nonsensical.
Unfortunately for many of the world's Who fans. The show recently inked a deal that saw them bring in George R R Martin as lead writer, and the show will now be shown on HBO instead of BBC
Ensis Ferrae wrote: Unfortunately for many of the world's Who fans. The show recently inked a deal that saw them bring in George R R Martin as lead writer, and the show will now be shown on HBO instead of BBC
If that happened we'd be seeing some VERY creative uses of the old Sonic.
He gets killed off in Ep 1 of the next season, and regenerates into an amorous dwarf with Heterochromia iridum. He shall henceforth be known as The Giant Doctor.
AegisGrimm wrote: I still would like to see the Doctor's daughter show up again.
Or better yet, grand daughter.
Both of those would be very interesting. I'm not sure they could do Susan any point soon as she was back on Gallifrey after she left the Doctor, so presumably was there in the Time War (although if they do bring Gallifrey back then it's doable). Bringing back Jenny (from the Progenitor) would be far easier, just pop forward to the future and run into her. I've read that Moffat said he'd like to bring her back at some point, so it's not a too distant possibility.
Jenny was easy on the eye, and being his daughter there could not be any romantic entanglements with him. And she can kick arse, which might spark some interesting "challenge resolution style" shenanigans.
Dr. Who trivia: The actress who plays her is the actual daughter of Peter Davison, and is married to David Tennant.
AegisGrimm wrote: I still would like to see the Doctor's daughter show up again.
Or better yet, grand daughter.
Both of those would be very interesting. I'm not sure they could do Susan any point soon as she was back on Gallifrey after she left the Doctor, so presumably was there in the Time War (although if they do bring Gallifrey back then it's doable). Bringing back Jenny (from the Progenitor) would be far easier, just pop forward to the future and run into her. I've read that Moffat said he'd like to bring her back at some point, so it's not a too distant possibility.
I could see that working. She got that one episode and then she was just sorta...forgotten. Weird, considering the ending of her episode.
Would definitely be a fun way to have a companion. Even if there is a problem with getting the original actress, there's always the regeneration angle.
AegisGrimm wrote: Would definitely be a fun way to have a companion. Even if there is a problem with getting the original actress, there's always the regeneration angle.
Would be even better if, even with multiple regenerations, the Doctor still recognized Susan, and Susan the Doc... the difficulties of such a situation could be solved with a simple line of dialogue... Just as 11 "Never forgets his own face", he may never forget his own kins faces, even if he's never seen them?
AegisGrimm wrote: Would definitely be a fun way to have a companion. Even if there is a problem with getting the original actress, there's always the regeneration angle.
If you're referring to Jenny, I don't think she can actually regenerate, as it was the terraforming device that brought her back to life, rather than a regeneration.
AegisGrimm wrote: I still would like to see the Doctor's daughter show up again.
Or better yet, grand daughter.
Both of those would be very interesting. I'm not sure they could do Susan any point soon as she was back on Gallifrey after she left the Doctor, so presumably was there in the Time War (although if they do bring Gallifrey back then it's doable). Bringing back Jenny (from the Progenitor) would be far easier, just pop forward to the future and run into her. I've read that Moffat said he'd like to bring her back at some point, so it's not a too distant possibility.
Actually, that's incorrect. Susan is on 22nd century earth. She stays there at the end of the Dalek Invasion of Earth.
The Doctor's Daughter thing would actually make sense for her to be Regenerating, as the explanation of the terriforming device makes it sound very much like the Loom.
It's something they can all do, but on a natural level they can only do it 12 times, it requires some kind of technology to grant another 'cycle'.
I think it comes from their exposure to the Time Vortex, like most other Time Lord abilities, as the others on Gallifrey (the Time Lords are a separate society, and not the majority of the population) give no indication of being able to regenerate.
Paradigm wrote: It's something they can all do, but on a natural level they can only do it 12 times, it requires some kind of technology to grant another 'cycle'.
I think it comes from their exposure to the Time Vortex, like most other Time Lord abilities, as the others on Gallifrey (the Time Lords are a separate society, and not the majority of the population) give no indication of being able to regenerate.
IIRC I think there was something about how all TLs can do it, but really only a few ultimately do so.
So all Time Lords are Gallifreyans and can regenerate, but not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords? Time Lords are some kind of Elite in Gallifreyan society?
I do t know, I have never heard the doctor refer to the people of Gallefrey as anything but the time lords. He has even refered to his race as time lords as I recall, as have other races. I think it being a title does make sense, but it has never played out that way.
Naturally it would appear that time lords are able to live hundreds of years in one life cycle. The doctor, however puts himself in harms way so often he has burned through his faster that time lords in general can do so. Also, it would appear that few spend 99% of their lives bounce through out time like the doctor does.
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: So all Time Lords are Gallifreyans and can regenerate, but not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords? Time Lords are some kind of Elite in Gallifreyan society?
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: So all Time Lords are Gallifreyans and can regenerate, but not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords? Time Lords are some kind of Elite in Gallifreyan society?
The Time Lords are the rulers of Gallifrey. They can all regenerate, mostly live in the domed cities like the Capital and Arcadia, and have an affinity with Time Travel technology.
The rest of the Gallifreyans are split between two classes. There are almost-barbarians that live in the wastelands outside the cities, who have little technology and simply farm and hunt, not often involving themselves in the affairs of the Time Lords. There are also some Gallifreyans who live alongside the Time Lords, but are not TL themselves. This includes the Chancellery Guard and probably other service providers within the cities.
If you're looking for some information on Gallifrey from the show itself, have a look for the Tom Baker episode arc 'The Invasion of Time'. It is set almost entirely on Gallifrey, and as far as I'm aware it was the first time the show ever really looked into Time Lord society. Not only is it a great episode (it features the Sontarons invading Gallifrey and the newest edition has had all the CGI remastered) but it will give a good insight into Time Lord culture.
It should be on amazon or Ebay fair cheap, and if you can't find it, then look for the 'bred for war' box set', it features all 4 sontaron stories from OldWho, including the absolutely amazing 'The Time Warrior' and the rather funny 'The Two Doctors'. Shouldn't cost you more than about £15.
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: So all Time Lords are Gallifreyans and can regenerate, but not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords? Time Lords are some kind of Elite in Gallifreyan society?
Yes.
It's never been clearly stated on screen though but that is what is described in the books etc and just makes sense. We do see Gallifreyans from outside the Capitol in Invasion of Time but there's nothing to suggest they can't regenerate, some might be Time Lords that have left their society. Oddly lots of Gallifreyans die but none ever regenerate on screen even those that surely should, which confuses the issue. Specifically coming to mind are Runcible and Goth in Deadly Assassin, the Castellan in Five Doctors, lots of chancellery guard, etc. It's a bit hard to argue which can and can't regenerate because none ever do even when they probably should
I was under the impression that the Chancellery Guard were not Time Lords, just Gallifreyans that served them in the capital.
When explaining how River got Time Lord powers, the Doctor mentions how TL got their abilities from exposure to the Time Vortex. If we assume that includes the ability to regenerate, then that explains why Time Lords can regenerate while others can't.
Paradigm wrote: I was under the impression that the Chancellery Guard were not Time Lords, just Gallifreyans that served them in the capital.
I would agree that makes the most sense, but most evidence for the Gallifrey having a distinctly two tier society comes from books/audios and they do occasionally mention the Guard as regenerating. It's not particularly consistent.
I've been rewatching a lot of old seasons and just hit on one of my favorite parts of Old Who: Turlough!
Nothing like having a companion who is out to get you.
We need more questionably useful companions. Between Tegan always getting herself in trouble, Adric dying and Turlough sabotaging everything, those were great times.
pretre wrote: I've been rewatching a lot of old seasons and just hit on one of my favorite parts of Old Who: Turlough!
Nothing like having a companion who is out to get you.
We need more questionably useful companions. Between Tegan always getting herself in trouble, Adric dying and Turlough sabotaging everything, those were great times.
I guess Mickey counts... *winces from remembering Mickey
pretre wrote: I've been rewatching a lot of old seasons and just hit on one of my favorite parts of Old Who: Turlough!
Nothing like having a companion who is out to get you.
We need more questionably useful companions. Between Tegan always getting herself in trouble, Adric dying and Turlough sabotaging everything, those were great times.
I guess Mickey counts... *winces from remembering Mickey
I could very well see the return of the Master as the Time Lords would view him as expendable. Sending him out to find the Doctor and see whats going on.
Gitsplitta wrote: I like the outfit. Very appropriate... with just a bit of John Pertwee to make it interesting.
I think that is still really late 11's outfit though. Could be filming a scene just after his regeneration and he hasnt had time to change outfits yet.
That's almost certainly Matt's costume, I doubt we'll see Peter's for a while.
The rumours are interesting, to say the least. Daleks? Yes. Vastra, Strax and Jenny? Cool. River coming back? Not sure, I kind of feel the character has run her course and now that we've seen the goodbye from both ends, it's time to let her go.
The Master? HELL YEAH! Should be awesome, whether it's John Simm or a new guy.
I agree with wanting to see more of UNIT, as Kate 'brigadier junior' Stewart and Osgood (sciencey one) are both good characters. The 70s UNIT days were some of my favourites, so a return to that style would be most welcome.
I certainly wouldn't find a Team Vastra spin off, it would be worth watching just for Strax's awesome lines. He is officially the funniest dwarf-potato-man-alien on TV.
But really? Turlough? Tegan? Adric? I must say, I found that era so annoying. Tegan just complained about everything, and Turlough was a bit rubbish.
I'll agree that Mickey and k9 are awesome, as was Rory.
Paradigm wrote: But really? Turlough? Tegan? Adric? I must say, I found that era so annoying. Tegan just complained about everything, and Turlough was a bit rubbish.
That was the great thing about them. I loved that run of Who. They were all so human. Having all the companions be brilliant at everything gets dull. Tegan whined and screwed up and got taken over by the Mara. Adric and Nyssa did sciency stuff but got in trouble a lot, Adric dying off and Nyssa causing all sorts of fun with the old goatee Master. Turlough was great! Nothing like having a mole in the part to spice things up. Flawed characters are a lot more interesting. The Doctor has always had his flaws but one of the problems with New Who is that his companions haven't had very many.
I appreciate a character needs flaws, but I just found them to be so grating and annoying. The Doctor claims to 'only take the best' and yet Tegan goes running around getting in trouble and just generally complaining.
Paradigm wrote: I appreciate a character needs flaws, but I just found them to be so grating and annoying. The Doctor claims to 'only take the best' and yet Tegan goes running around getting in trouble and just generally complaining.
When does he claim to only take the best? The companions are at their best when they are getting in trouble. Some of the best moments of Who are when he sacrifices himself to save Companions (Androzani, Parting, End of Time). Heck, Doctor Who starts with Susan drawing unwanted attention to the Doctor and getting him his second and third companion.
I believe it's in 'The Long Game' after he drops off the useless Adam, telling him 'I only take the best. I've got Rose'.
And I do agree that the sacrifice and dealing with their humanity is a huge part of the Doctor's character, but I just didn't find Tegan an engaging character at all. There have been far, far better companions.
Paradigm wrote: I believe it's in 'The Long Game' after he drops off the useless Adam, telling him 'I only take the best. I've got Rose'.
And I do agree that the sacrifice and dealing with their humanity is a huge part of the Doctor's character, but I just didn't find Tegan an engaging character at all. There have been far, far better companions.
I think that's mostly him just telling off Adam and is new Who so has certainly changed over time. Either way, opinions are opinions. I happened to like Tegan, you didn't no biggie.
Was this worth the wait? And yes, those are Doctor Martens.
Capaldi himself is quoted, in a BBC press release, as saying:
He’s woven the future from the cloth of the past. Simple, stark, and back to basics. No frills, no scarf, no messing, just 100 per cent Rebel Time Lord
Meanwhile, Moffat proffered:
New Doctor, new era, and of course new clothes. Monsters of the universe, the vacation is over – Capaldi is suited and booted and coming to get you!
I absolutely love the new costume, but Capaldi himself really weaves it all together. On anyone else it'd look pretty stupid, but his demeanour and face really allow the entire thing to scream "rebel" and "don't feth with me" without looking laughable and out of place.
Hmm, interesting. Seems to completely differ from the rather over-the-top nature of Smith's last few costumes. I think the simpler style may work nicely in that respect, giving him an element of class and gravitas.
I'm almost disappointed by the lack of a real identifying feature. As odd as the scarf/frills/bow tie/trainers(/Celery!?) were, they did add to the character. Still, the plainness may well end up defining in itself, and to be honest, I think it's clear he means business. Perhaps, going forward, the story's going to be a little less fairlytale and more down to Earth.
Still, enough costumes, I just can't wait to see him act. From what I've seen of him in The Musketeers (good program, by the way, for those not watching it), he seems almost a little flat, but that could just be the scripts. I'm still confident he can pull off a quite serious, dark and clever Doctor.
For anyone who hasn't seen it yet. I like it, it definitely suits him as a serious doctor.
I'm more interested in what they do for the master...
EDIT: Oh, and please let River Song disappear. I found her to be the most irritating, one-dimensional character I've ever seen, especially during Series 6. She had a lot of potential in Silence in the Library, but it went downhill rather quickly from there.
Apart from the mini-episode Last Night. The scene where the Doctor realises this is her last time with him before she dies was very well done.
He kinda looks like a pissed off Mr. Rogers. He's got the sweater (though in reality, I'd bet it's a vest, not sweater) on, but the jacket over top to show everyone he means business.
Looking at it more, it's like a more refined Pertwee. Same darkness but with the red lining, just like JP's cape/jacket. White shirt but no frilly bits.
For anyone who hasn't seen it yet. I like it, it definitely suits him as a serious doctor.
I'm more interested in what they do for the master...
EDIT: Oh, and please let River Song disappear. I found her to be the most irritating, one-dimensional character I've ever seen, especially during Series 6. She had a lot of potential in Silence in the Library, but it went downhill rather quickly from there.
Apart from the mini-episode Last Night. The scene where the Doctor realises this is her last time with him before she dies was very well done
I think that's probably a fake, to be honest. I doubt it's coincidence that he's in exactly the same pose in both the press release and that, and there's also no way we'd be seeing anything that concrete about a series not due for another 7 months minimum.
d-usa wrote: Well, apparently the episode is real and it sounds like they are actually going to work his appearance from "Fires of Pompeii" into the episode.
Sounds interesting.
the name of the episode is, but the poster is not:
The Doctor Battles the clockwork droids in Victorian England whilst also uncovering the truth behind 'Jack the Ripper'. Whilst Clara meets a very familiar face.
8.2 'Across the Stars'
On a scientific way station in the year 3056 Clara and the Doctor uncover a DNA experiment thats about to go very wrong.
8.3 (Unknown)
8.4 'TBA'
Said to revolve around the assassination of JFK
8.5 'The Cult of Ra'
An Egyptian set episode
8.6 (Unknown)
8.7 (Unknown)
8.8 (Unknown)
8.9 'TBA'
Said to be set on a forest world. Maybe the River song episode
8.10 'The Ghosts of Pompeii'
The Doctor and Clara travel to Pompeii to try and solve the mystery of his latest incarnation. The episode sees the return of the Pyrovile and fan favourite who appears in a cameo.
8.11 'TBA'
The Doctors quest to find Gallifrey is over.
8.12 'Master and Commander (rumoured)'
The return of the Master and consequently the Time lords. Its believed the Master is now the president and will be played by esteemed british actor Charles Dance.
To be honest, I wish they would just ignore him having already been in it. He's an actor, he plays different roles. Colin Baker appeared before being the Doc and no one cared, why would it matter now?
Some of those rumoured episode titles look rather fascinating, and
pretre wrote: Yeah, there's certainly a history of repeat actors.
That's why I'm hoping that it will at least be an interesting and meaningful interaction if they are choosing not to ignore it. It has the potential to be pretty interesting. Of course it also has the potential for becoming a giant stupid plot hole.
pretre wrote: Its believed the Master is now the president and will be played by esteemed british actor Charles Dance.]
Charles Dance as the Master?
Wow. Just... wow. That would be awesome. No disrespect to John Simm, who was great in Life On Mars, but they needed a new actor for the Master. Simm was not a very good Master. Eric Roberts, by any objective measurements a horrible Master, was better than Simm. Yes, he chewed scenery, too, but at least Roberts didn't play the role as an over the top pantomime dame, with none of the dark menace of Delgado. Or Ainley. Or the guy with the burnt skull makeup from Deadly Assassin...
Yeah, I saw Vincent Price as Doc #3 and thought "wtf?"... but the more I thought about it, the more sense it made.
Dick Van Dyke as Doc #2? No way. I mean, Pat Troughton already looked like Moe from the Three Stooges... why wouldn't you actually cast actual MOE FROM THE THREE STOOGES?
Christopher Walken as Doc #6 was inspired, though.
The BBC has today announced that Samuel Anderson is set to join the cast of Doctor Who as a recurring character in Series 8.
Not described as a companion, you’ll notice, Anderson will play Danny Pink, a teacher at Coal Hill School where companion Clara Oswald (Jenna Coleman) also teaches, and a location that has played a significant role in Doctor Who‘s 50 years.
Anderson – who has also appeared in The History Boys, Gavin & Stacey and Emmerdale - said:
'I was so excited to join Doctor Who I wanted to jump and click my heels, but I was scared I might not come down before filming started! It’s a quintessential part of British culture and I can’t believe I’m part of it. It’s an honour to be able to work alongside Peter Capaldi and Jenna Coleman and I can’t wait to show people how my character becomes involved with such a fantastic duo!'
Andrerson’s character Danny Pink has of course been created by showrunner Steven Moffat.
For the fourth time in Doctor Who history, Coal Hill School is coming to the aid of the TARDIS. In 1963 teachers Ian Chesterton and Barbara Wright accompanied the First Doctor. These days it’s the turn of Jenna Coleman as Clara Oswald. And very soon now, Sam Anderson as Danny Pink will be entering the world of the Doctor. But how and why? Answers are coming later this year in Peter Capaldi’s first series of Doctor Who!
This is an interesting turn of events you weren’t expecting, isn’t it? We don’t yet know if Danny will set foot in the TARDIS and join the Doctor and Clara on their travels – but let’s hope he gets the chance.
Could be good, could be abysmal. I shall withhold judgement until I see him in action. A 55 year old Doctor, 2 teachers from Coal Hill... We just need Susan back and it's 1963 again!
We’re only just now getting our first peek at Peter Capaldi’s take on Doctor Who, but if a new report is to be believed, he might just be a one-and-done Doctor.
Take it with a grain of salt, but The Mirror is reporting they’ve heard that Capaldi’s stint in the TARDIS has been predetermined to run through the upcoming eighth season, then come to an end. If true, it would make him the second Doctor of the new era (following Ninth Doctor Christopher Eccleston) to leave after one year.
The report goes on to state that Capaldi was chosen to serve as a transitionary Doctor who could help set the stage for a “radical” direction when it comes to the 13th Doctor. What that could mean is open to interpretation: A Doctor of a different ethnicity, gender or nationality, perhaps?
If Moffat and the BBC are planning something drastic soon, it makes some sense to provide a buffer between Matt Smith’s long-running Doctor and whatever comes next. Capaldi will also help shake things up with an older Doctor, to remind fans that the series has definitely worked without handsome young fellas as the star in the past.
There's also a chance this could signal Moffat’s potential swan song, as he’ll have been at the helm for a full five seasons by the end of Capaldi’s first run. Might this be a way to give Moffat one last year to wrap things up while setting up a new Doctor, show runner and potential change in direction? It's certainly possible.
Obviously, this is all just fun speculation at the moment, but you’d have to think Moffat is at least on the back side of his Who tenure at this point. It makes sense they’d want to give his potential successor a fresh slate, and it sounds like Capaldi could be the palate cleanser.
What do you think? Where would you like to see Doctor Who go next?
Auntie Beeb wrote:Keeley Hawes is to take on a villainous role in Doctor Who - as a banker.
The actress will guest star in an episode in Peter Capaldi's first series as the Time Lord.
"Anyone watching the amazing Line Of Duty will know that Keeley Hawes is having one hell of year," said Doctor Who boss Steven Moffat.
"And now it's about to get even better as she achieves the greatest villainy yet attempted on Doctor Who: she plays a banker."
Hawes, who previously starred in BBC dramas Ashes to Ashes and Spooks, plays Ms Delphox, who is described as "a powerful out of this world character with a dark secret".
The story, written by Steve Thompson, sees the twelfth Doctor and his companion, Clara Oswald (Jenna Coleman), meet Ms Delphox when they arrive "on a strange and puzzling planet".
The episode is directed by Douglas Mackinnon, whose previous work includes Line of Duty and Doctor Who.
Hawes said: "I am delighted to join Doctor Who and to be working with this incredible team. Ms Delphox is a great character and someone I've had a lot of fun playing."
