Is there a chance the tactical squad sergeant can use that volkite pistol or is he doomed to weird a plasma pistol for lever? Also, it’s surprising that the chain sword is right handed. Usually melee weapons are in the left hand, though it could have been due to the mk6 sergeant already having a sculpted right handed weapon
The bikes look great, but yeah the riders are very static. On the plus side, it does lend the models to being easily converted (throw mk3 or mk4 torso or shoulder pads or helmet or whatever on there).
Pluses and minuses to be sure for both dynamic and static looking models.
lord_blackfang wrote: GW hasn't made a mini with a sense of motion in 15 years so that's a weird complaint.
Funny thing is, the new eldar windriders and shining spears achieved far more sense of motion and speed just by having the riders leaning forvard, compared to the older static sculpts that, yeah, looked alot like these skyhunters.
Apparently the sculpting team forgot this "design hack".
Another simple detail would be adding some flag or cloth trailing behind in the wind (also used in the eldar designs).
Mr_Rose wrote: Only real OGs know that the Necrons awoke because the Diggas on Angelus pledged all humans everywhere to their service while exploring deep inside the pyramids they lived within.
Lore was a lot more fun before wikis and ebay and
Spoiler:
(illegal downloads)
you'd know what you knew, or half remembered and what some guy in the gaming shop said, who may or may not have made it up. Man I remember some ass at the gaming shop claiming that the Ultra Marines were a second founding army who replaced the original ones who fell to Chaos, and lived on Dune with sandworms and had a half Elf psyker and stuff.
Very happy to see these, I think they look great and we are one step closer to a plastic Xiphon Interceptor. Assuming that we will see Javelins released later in the year as well.
Great. Been waiting for these. Love that they've gone for a more retroish plasma cannon look, although it does make the bike look a bit front heavy. Not real keen on the riders being MkVI, but that was inevitable I guess. Now I'm not sure whether i'm hoping they release a add-on pack of MkII/III/IV riders for them or not. I'd be nice to have a choice of rider armour, but I don't like the direction they've taken heresy with all the add-on packs for kits that should have been in the base kit to begin with.
Zooooooom.......M16, Deep Striking multi-meltas? Yes please! And Hit and Run with +3 to charge distance makes for an excellent "first charger" unit. Who needs Heavy Support slots?
lord_blackfang wrote: GW hasn't made a mini with a sense of motion in 15 years so that's a weird complaint.
Funny thing is, the new eldar windriders and shining spears achieved far more sense of motion and speed just by having the riders leaning forvard, compared to the older static sculpts that, yeah, looked alot like these skyhunters.
Apparently the sculpting team forgot this "design hack".
Another simple detail would be adding some flag or cloth trailing behind in the wind (also used in the eldar designs).
That's exactly what I was thinking of. A simple lean forward, maybe the feat tucked back a little.
Dislike the cloth idea simply because it got really confused and muddled on some of the newer Eldar kits, like Jain Zar, where too many elements (loin cloth, spear tassels, legs, hair) are moving in different directions.
Marine bikers have always had this stance. The sense of motion is conveyed by the massive great engine in front of the rider. If you want some floaty things flying behind him to enhance the idea that he's speeding along, then add them - it's a plastic kit, so modify it to suit your tastes. I plan to put Mk IV helmets on mine, just for variety, although the streamlined Mk IV actually makes more sense.
The one aspect of the kit that I dislike is the flying stand. I don't know what the thinking is behind this. Why is it angled forward, if it's meant to be 'invisible'? Why is it so spindly? They were going in a more sensible direction with the new Deffkoptas, which are attached to convenient bits of terrain.
Snord wrote: Marine bikers have always had this stance. The sense of motion is conveyed by the massive great engine in front of the rider.
A brick does not convey a sense of motion. A pose does.
It's just a different style bike. Eldar and Dark Eldar have the forwards leaning Kawasaki motorcycles, while Astartes lean back in these crusing style Harley Davidsons with big guns. For more dynamic charging bikes, the Scimitar is not it, you need the Bullock pattern.
Great to finally be getting something that's not a tank.
Definitely an interesting unit though, and iirc you can even put independent characters on these jetbikes (imagine that!) and take these up to squads of 10. That could be a scary, fast, beefy death star unit for White Scars or Emperor's Children.
I personally prefer the ground bikes, still hoping they get a plastic kit, but hey, this is big progress.
drbored wrote: Great to finally be getting something that's not a tank.
Definitely an interesting unit though, and iirc you can even put independent characters on these jetbikes (imagine that!) and take these up to squads of 10. That could be a scary, fast, beefy death star unit for White Scars or Emperor's Children.
I personally prefer the ground bikes, still hoping they get a plastic kit, but hey, this is big progress.
Keep in mind that jetbikes can't take special melee weapons. So while their baseline pistol + chainsword does allow them to bully weak units that don't want to be in CC (such as a heavy-support squad), they are absolutely not deathstar units.
But you can give them to a command squad - and by extension their praetor. That does make a menacing death star, but it's also obscenely expensive.
Snord wrote: Marine bikers have always had this stance. The sense of motion is conveyed by the massive great engine in front of the rider.
A brick does not convey a sense of motion. A pose does.
It's just a different style bike. Eldar and Dark Eldar have the forwards leaning Kawasaki motorcycles, while Astartes lean back in these crusing style Harley Davidsons with big guns. For more dynamic charging bikes, the Scimitar is not it, you need the Bullock pattern.
Eldar used to have a laid back style too.
But it just looks weird. Even Harleys, people don't ride them laid back with almost entirely straight legs unless they've done some significant (and probably highly uncomfortable to ride) mods to them.
And supposedly Space Marines are still supposed to be fighting from their bikes, but the straight legs, the foot position significantly forward of the hand position, the tilted back torso, it makes them look like they'd struggle to move let alone swing a sword or an axe.
I don't think they need to be cafe racer style poses like the Dark Eldar or new Eldar, but something like a stock Harley rider pose, and then with some alternate legs that let you pose them leaning over one way or the other to swing their sword, aim their pistol, thrust with their lance, etc.
Snord wrote: Marine bikers have always had this stance. The sense of motion is conveyed by the massive great engine in front of the rider.
A brick does not convey a sense of motion. A pose does.
It's just a different style bike. Eldar and Dark Eldar have the forwards leaning Kawasaki motorcycles, while Astartes lean back in these crusing style Harley Davidsons with big guns. For more dynamic charging bikes, the Scimitar is not it, you need the Bullock pattern.
Eldar used to have a laid back style too.
But it just looks weird. Even Harleys, people don't ride them laid back with almost entirely straight legs unless they've done some significant (and probably highly uncomfortable to ride) mods to them.
And supposedly Space Marines are still supposed to be fighting from their bikes, but the straight legs, the foot position significantly forward of the hand position, the tilted back torso, it makes them look like they'd struggle to move let alone swing a sword or an axe.
I don't think they need to be cafe racer style poses like the Dark Eldar or new Eldar, but something like a stock Harley rider pose, and then with some alternate legs that let you pose them leaning over one way or the other to swing their sword, aim their pistol, thrust with their lance, etc.
I find the rather static poses of the imperial jetbikes rather fitting. After all, they're not the sleek racers of the Eldar or the techno-sorcery of the Necrons, but 'flying bricks' that stay afloat due to pure force, ridden by a two hundred kilo chunk of muscle that wears a fridge as an armor. Their pose reminds me of paintings like 'Death Dealer', of lazily circling sharks that prepare to snap out in a single decisive blow, of the single dragoon in the distance that has spotted you and will call up his comrades. They're still menacing, but in a way that is different from the thrill-kill-high-speed eldar.
Snord wrote: Marine bikers have always had this stance. The sense of motion is conveyed by the massive great engine in front of the rider.
A brick does not convey a sense of motion. A pose does.
It's just a different style bike. Eldar and Dark Eldar have the forwards leaning Kawasaki motorcycles, while Astartes lean back in these crusing style Harley Davidsons with big guns. For more dynamic charging bikes, the Scimitar is not it, you need the Bullock pattern.
Eldar used to have a laid back style too.
But it just looks weird. Even Harleys, people don't ride them laid back with almost entirely straight legs unless they've done some significant (and probably highly uncomfortable to ride) mods to them.
And supposedly Space Marines are still supposed to be fighting from their bikes, but the straight legs, the foot position significantly forward of the hand position, the tilted back torso, it makes them look like they'd struggle to move let alone swing a sword or an axe.
I don't think they need to be cafe racer style poses like the Dark Eldar or new Eldar, but something like a stock Harley rider pose, and then with some alternate legs that let you pose them leaning over one way or the other to swing their sword, aim their pistol, thrust with their lance, etc.
I find the rather static poses of the imperial jetbikes rather fitting. After all, they're not the sleek racers of the Eldar or the techno-sorcery of the Necrons, but 'flying bricks' that stay afloat due to pure force, ridden by a two hundred kilo chunk of muscle that wears a fridge as an armor. Their pose reminds me of paintings like 'Death Dealer', of lazily circling sharks that prepare to snap out in a single decisive blow, of the single dragoon in the distance that has spotted you and will call up his comrades. They're still menacing, but in a way that is different from the thrill-kill-high-speed eldar.
To me, it's just too far into the realm of weirdness for me to like. There's lazy, then there's lying down on the job, they don't look like they'll be doing any "snapping" of decisive blows when all they can do is awkwardly flail their weapons off to their sides (and not the good flailing ).
Look at Harley riders, that sort of pose would be fine, they don't need to be perched atop the jet bikes like the eldar, they don't need to come across as agilely dancing in top of their bikes.
You mention Death Dealer, a quick google image search shows him hunched over and passive, but not laid back awkwardly like these dudes are.
But at least having the ability to swing their sword as opposed to just awkwardly holding it off to the side would go a long way for me. The dude with the gun is the worst, he looks like he's about to fire a flare gun into the air without looking where it's going
Of course each to their own, if you like them you like them, that's fine, personally I think they've skidded past "lazily menacing" to "too laid back to fight".
Snord wrote: Marine bikers have always had this stance. The sense of motion is conveyed by the massive great engine in front of the rider.
A brick does not convey a sense of motion. A pose does.
It's just a different style bike. Eldar and Dark Eldar have the forwards leaning Kawasaki motorcycles, while Astartes lean back in these crusing style Harley Davidsons with big guns. For more dynamic charging bikes, the Scimitar is not it, you need the Bullock pattern.
Eldar used to have a laid back style too.
But it just looks weird. Even Harleys, people don't ride them laid back with almost entirely straight legs unless they've done some significant (and probably highly uncomfortable to ride) mods to them.
And supposedly Space Marines are still supposed to be fighting from their bikes, but the straight legs, the foot position significantly forward of the hand position, the tilted back torso, it makes them look like they'd struggle to move let alone swing a sword or an axe.
I don't think they need to be cafe racer style poses like the Dark Eldar or new Eldar, but something like a stock Harley rider pose, and then with some alternate legs that let you pose them leaning over one way or the other to swing their sword, aim their pistol, thrust with their lance, etc.
I find the rather static poses of the imperial jetbikes rather fitting. After all, they're not the sleek racers of the Eldar or the techno-sorcery of the Necrons, but 'flying bricks' that stay afloat due to pure force, ridden by a two hundred kilo chunk of muscle that wears a fridge as an armor. Their pose reminds me of paintings like 'Death Dealer', of lazily circling sharks that prepare to snap out in a single decisive blow, of the single dragoon in the distance that has spotted you and will call up his comrades. They're still menacing, but in a way that is different from the thrill-kill-high-speed eldar.
To me, it's just too far into the realm of weirdness for me to like. There's lazy, then there's lying down on the job, they don't look like they'll be doing any "snapping" of decisive blows when all they can do is awkwardly flail their weapons off to their sides (and not the good flailing ).
Look at Harley riders, that sort of pose would be fine, they don't need to be perched atop the jet bikes like the eldar, they don't need to come across as agilely dancing in top of their bikes.
You mention Death Dealer, a quick google image search shows him hunched over and passive, but not laid back awkwardly like these dudes are.
But at least having the ability to swing their sword as opposed to just awkwardly holding it off to the side would go a long way for me. The dude with the gun is the worst, he looks like he's about to fire a flare gun into the air without looking where it's going
Of course each to their own, if you like them you like them, that's fine, personally I think they've skidded past "lazily menacing" to "too laid back to fight".
The melee weapon thing is true, but then that's more a critique of the basic premise than specific to this model Anything but polearms would of course be extremely unpractical or flat-out impossible to use from these bike, and i don't think that cool poses would give you enough suspension of disbelief to not notice that. Maybe it would look okay with long-hafted weapons, like chain-/power axes, mauls or hammers. I agree that the standard poses look a little too static and silly, it remains to be seen what can be done with a quick torso or arm swap.
The Scimitar pattern is the one that FW and now GW have made, but it doesn't seem appropriate for use as a melee bike. It's big, heavy, and has a heavy weapon mounted in the nose. It's a one man attack bike.
And luckily it's not a melee unit. Of course this general misconception that anything that moves faster than an infantryman is a melee unit is one of the core reasons people are so bad at evaluating units and factions.
lord_blackfang wrote: And luckily it's not a melee unit. Of course this general misconception that anything that moves faster than an infantryman is a melee unit is one of the core reasons people are so bad at evaluating units and factions.
TBH, it MAKES for a good melee unit if you give it the right support staff for basically all legions.
An HQ (either centurion or Praetor) and an apothecary with power weapons and other goodies may very well make for a nice little assault option.
Also m16 multi meltas are m16 multimeltas. As i see it, this unit is a bully unit that has target dependant equipment for shooting and or requries significant investment for melee.
Alternativly as you brought up, 2 legions can field melee jetbikers.
lord_blackfang wrote: And luckily it's not a melee unit. Of course this general misconception that anything that moves faster than an infantryman is a melee unit is one of the core reasons people are so bad at evaluating units and factions.
TBH, it MAKES for a good melee unit if you give it the right support staff for basically all legions.
An HQ (either centurion or Praetor) and an apothecary with power weapons and other goodies may very well make for a nice little assault option.
Also m16 multi meltas are m16 multimeltas. As i see it, this unit is a bully unit that has target dependant equipment for shooting and or requries significant investment for melee.
Alternativly as you brought up, 2 legions can field melee jetbikers.
Agamemnon2 wrote: Time to place bets on how much cheaper the plastic squad will be compared to the resin ones. I'm going conservative myself, no more than 20% less.
Well.
So far elites and troops came with double the MSU in a box, this is the first time we get an msu unit. Size wise 3 of them seem about to be a rhino?
I'd say it's probably the price range as a sicarian- terminator kit, with a chance of being cheaper.
Agamemnon2 wrote: Time to place bets on how much cheaper the plastic squad will be compared to the resin ones. I'm going conservative myself, no more than 20% less.
That seems way pessimistic to me. HH plastic in general has been priced marginally cheaper than 40k. 3 Custodes jetbikes currently cost exactly what a resin Scimitar cost. These are bit bigger so maybe a box of 2 for the same money, maybe 3 for a little more. So 50% off at least.
Tsagualsa wrote: I find the rather static poses of the imperial jetbikes rather fitting. After all, they're not the sleek racers of the Eldar or the techno-sorcery of the Necrons, but 'flying bricks' that stay afloat due to pure force, ridden by a two hundred kilo chunk of muscle that wears a fridge as an armor. Their pose reminds me of paintings like 'Death Dealer', of lazily circling sharks that prepare to snap out in a single decisive blow, of the single dragoon in the distance that has spotted you and will call up his comrades. They're still menacing, but in a way that is different from the thrill-kill-high-speed eldar.
I think this is really well put I would expect that the best a rider armed with a chainsword can usually do is a passing sweep at something somewhere below him. But let's remember that fighting in melee from a bike is ultimately very silly and noone does it in real life. Even putting guns on bikes didn't work very well. So arguing about whether one pose or another is realistic is rather pointless.
Agamemnon2 wrote: Time to place bets on how much cheaper the plastic squad will be compared to the resin ones. I'm going conservative myself, no more than 20% less.
That seems way pessimistic to me. HH plastic in general has been priced marginally cheaper than 40k. 3 Custodes jetbikes currently cost exactly what a resin Scimitar cost. These are bit bigger so maybe a box of 2 for the same money, maybe 3 for a little more. So 50% off at least.
£40-£45 is my guess.]
Of course, every Heresy kit so far (well, the plastic ones for absolute clarity) appeals to every Legion player, so one imagines the sales volumes are why we’re getting seemingly better prices than 40k.
Snord wrote: Marine bikers have always had this stance. The sense of motion is conveyed by the massive great engine in front of the rider.
A brick does not convey a sense of motion. A pose does.
It's just a different style bike. Eldar and Dark Eldar have the forwards leaning Kawasaki motorcycles, while Astartes lean back in these crusing style Harley Davidsons with big guns. For more dynamic charging bikes, the Scimitar is not it, you need the Bullock pattern.
Eldar used to have a laid back style too.
But it just looks weird. Even Harleys, people don't ride them laid back with almost entirely straight legs unless they've done some significant (and probably highly uncomfortable to ride) mods to them.
And supposedly Space Marines are still supposed to be fighting from their bikes, but the straight legs, the foot position significantly forward of the hand position, the tilted back torso, it makes them look like they'd struggle to move let alone swing a sword or an axe.
I don't think they need to be cafe racer style poses like the Dark Eldar or new Eldar, but something like a stock Harley rider pose, and then with some alternate legs that let you pose them leaning over one way or the other to swing their sword, aim their pistol, thrust with their lance, etc.
I find the rather static poses of the imperial jetbikes rather fitting. After all, they're not the sleek racers of the Eldar or the techno-sorcery of the Necrons, but 'flying bricks' that stay afloat due to pure force, ridden by a two hundred kilo chunk of muscle that wears a fridge as an armor. Their pose reminds me of paintings like 'Death Dealer', of lazily circling sharks that prepare to snap out in a single decisive blow, of the single dragoon in the distance that has spotted you and will call up his comrades. They're still menacing, but in a way that is different from the thrill-kill-high-speed eldar.
To me, it's just too far into the realm of weirdness for me to like. There's lazy, then there's lying down on the job, they don't look like they'll be doing any "snapping" of decisive blows when all they can do is awkwardly flail their weapons off to their sides (and not the good flailing ).
Look at Harley riders, that sort of pose would be fine, they don't need to be perched atop the jet bikes like the eldar, they don't need to come across as agilely dancing in top of their bikes.
You mention Death Dealer, a quick google image search shows him hunched over and passive, but not laid back awkwardly like these dudes are.
But at least having the ability to swing their sword as opposed to just awkwardly holding it off to the side would go a long way for me. The dude with the gun is the worst, he looks like he's about to fire a flare gun into the air without looking where it's going
Of course each to their own, if you like them you like them, that's fine, personally I think they've skidded past "lazily menacing" to "too laid back to fight".
The melee weapon thing is true, but then that's more a critique of the basic premise than specific to this model Anything but polearms would of course be extremely unpractical or flat-out impossible to use from these bike, and i don't think that cool poses would give you enough suspension of disbelief to not notice that. Maybe it would look okay with long-hafted weapons, like chain-/power axes, mauls or hammers. I agree that the standard poses look a little too static and silly, it remains to be seen what can be done with a quick torso or arm swap.
Yeah, I'd be curious to see what alternative poses might come out. To my eye, the problem is that there's no space for them to move in the saddle, which would prohibit any pose that looks like they could bring their melee weapons to bear. But, maybe I'm wrong. To me it's been a problem with how GW modelled biker models going back a long way when maybe casting limitations dictated the rider pose? They're reminisce of a bad chopper that stretches the rider out but isn't actually comfortable nor easy to ride.
Yeah, I'd be curious to see what alternative poses might come out. To my eye, the problem is that there's no space for them to move in the saddle, which would prohibit any pose that looks like they could bring their melee weapons to bear. But, maybe I'm wrong. To me it's been a problem with how GW modelled biker models going back a long way when maybe casting limitations dictated the rider pose? They're reminisce of a bad chopper that stretches the rider out but isn't actually comfortable nor easy to ride.
I think that general problem goes way, way back to the days when 'the way it's done' for cavalry models was to have standard horses in plastic that were common to a lot of kits, and model the riders and stuff like barding as add-on metal parts. That pretty much dictated the pose of the riders to make sure that they could fit the standard horse, and so it was. That's how GW did character models and stuff like light cavalry for a long time. That design approach translated to bikes, and lead to the bikes themselves being designed in a way that facilitated this.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: To my eye, the problem is that there's no space for them to move in the saddle, which would prohibit any pose that looks like they could bring their melee weapons to bear.
I think, much like with the current Outriders, simply moving the seat up and turning the 'pilot' into a 'rider' would fix the issue.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: To my eye, the problem is that there's no space for them to move in the saddle, which would prohibit any pose that looks like they could bring their melee weapons to bear.
I think, much like with the current Outriders, simply moving the seat up and turning the 'pilot' into a 'rider' would fix the issue.
Do you mean so that they're standing up like in a chariot or dog sled? That could work - space marines should not need a seat anyway, they could just lock out their leg armour.
Do you mean so that they're standing up like in a chariot or dog sled? That could work - space marines should not need a seat anyway, they could just lock out their leg armour.
Do you mean so that they're standing up like in a chariot or dog sled? That could work - space marines should not need a seat anyway, they could just lock out their leg armour.
Something like this
Add some more armour over the hole in front of the feet and you're good to go, not a bad look.
I'm looking forward to stealing some posing ideas for these models. Both to add some more dynamism to them, as well as to get rid of the clear base stand.
I like that there are chainswords in scabbards mounted on the bikes. I was thinking of trying to give one the primaris white scar chainsword from the upgrade kit, but a curved blade and a straight scabbard don't really gel well together
Do you mean so that they're standing up like in a chariot or dog sled? That could work - space marines should not need a seat anyway, they could just lock out their leg armour.
Something like this
Yeah, something like that, I think the peg shouldn't be tilted downwards though, still have it tilted slightly up or maybe just flat by also rotating the ankle.
But yeah, doing it this way would allow you to ever so slightly straighten the leg on one side only, which would shift the rider on the saddle and lean him over a bit, then give him a gun and it'll look like he's leaning out to shoot at someone, or give him a sword/axe/lance and it'll look like he's bracing ready to whack someone.
Racerguy180 wrote: I'd assume the forward controls would be altitude & rudder. How else would you control the z-axis?
Potentially fed from the Power Armour itself? Think it, and it’s done.
Yeah, i'd say they do the controlling via MIU/armour interface and have the manual controls only for emergency use and to have a convenient hardpoint to hold on to.
Agamemnon2 wrote: Time to place bets on how much cheaper the plastic squad will be compared to the resin ones. I'm going conservative myself, no more than 20% less.
That seems way pessimistic to me. HH plastic in general has been priced marginally cheaper than 40k. 3 Custodes jetbikes currently cost exactly what a resin Scimitar cost. These are bit bigger so maybe a box of 2 for the same money, maybe 3 for a little more. So 50% off at least.
Probably not two, since the minimum squad size is three.
Agamemnon2 wrote: Time to place bets on how much cheaper the plastic squad will be compared to the resin ones. I'm going conservative myself, no more than 20% less.
That seems way pessimistic to me. HH plastic in general has been priced marginally cheaper than 40k. 3 Custodes jetbikes currently cost exactly what a resin Scimitar cost. These are bit bigger so maybe a box of 2 for the same money, maybe 3 for a little more. So 50% off at least.
Probably not two, since the minimum squad size is three.
The 40k Custodes Jetbikes come 3 to a box and cost 50€, i guess that's about where these will land.
lord_blackfang wrote: And luckily it's not a melee unit. Of course this general misconception that anything that moves faster than an infantryman is a melee unit is one of the core reasons people are so bad at evaluating units and factions.
TBH, it MAKES for a good melee unit if you give it the right support staff for basically all legions.
An HQ (either centurion or Praetor) and an apothecary with power weapons and other goodies may very well make for a nice little assault option.
Also m16 multi meltas are m16 multimeltas. As i see it, this unit is a bully unit that has target dependant equipment for shooting and or requries significant investment for melee.
Alternativly as you brought up, 2 legions can field melee jetbikers.
How is the apothecary tending to the wounded when he is separated from the squad riding a jetbike?
lord_blackfang wrote: And luckily it's not a melee unit. Of course this general misconception that anything that moves faster than an infantryman is a melee unit is one of the core reasons people are so bad at evaluating units and factions.
TBH, it MAKES for a good melee unit if you give it the right support staff for basically all legions.
An HQ (either centurion or Praetor) and an apothecary with power weapons and other goodies may very well make for a nice little assault option.
Also m16 multi meltas are m16 multimeltas. As i see it, this unit is a bully unit that has target dependant equipment for shooting and or requries significant investment for melee.
Alternativly as you brought up, 2 legions can field melee jetbikers.
How is the apothecary tending to the wounded when he is separated from the squad riding a jetbike?
Really fast hands - in another life he would have made a mint as a close-up magician in vegas.
Emperors children "jetbike medics" are probably just the ones carrying the squads drugs stash on their bike.
My guess is what technically happens is the ones he "saves" are ones that get temporarily knocked off their bikes with minor wounds. Or his bike can gravlock onto another persons to keep bikes close and at same speed while he works.
Would be cool to see some jetbike style apoth backpack in style of fabius's chirugeon that can reach over to next bike though.
Mothman wrote: Emperors children "jetbike medics" are probably just the ones carrying the squads drugs stash on their bike.
My guess is what technically happens is the ones he "saves" are ones that get temporarily knocked off their bikes with minor wounds. Or his bike can gravlock onto another persons to keep bikes close and at same speed while he works.
Would be cool to see some jetbike style apoth backpack in style of fabius's chirugeon that can reach over to next bike though.
Nah, the apoth is there to harvest gene-seed only.
The FNP comes from there being someone around who'll harvest your gene-seed if he thinks you're hurt enough...
I'm all about that RT era flair, the Megaman one is my favourie tbh. If they had remade the knightly ones with horizontal slits, I'd be even happier, but I still got those from the old RG kit so they'll have to do
The more I look at these, the more I like them. The subtle tweaks to the design really do it for me.
3 boxes of these gets me two squads worth of RT heads, and the remaining 9 with raven symbols can be filed to look like the other 9 with some effort, those can be like spares or whatever.
I hope tomorrow's LVO reveals include some more plastic infantry to go with these headz
Kind of wish they carried over the flatter chin from the Imperial Space Marine.
I wonder if the reference to something nasty next week is to a Gal Vorbak like upgrade.
I get the lore they're going for, the 'prototype' or whatever, and also knocking on some nostalgia from Rogue Trader days...
But this isn't what I was hoping for, to be honest. I wanted something that evokes the feeling of the Raven Guard Contemptor Dread with the swirling patterns, or something that looks like it actually has some more stealth tech in it, other than being 'very smooth'. Or heck, raven-skulls would have been better.
Nope.
Oh well, that'll save me a lot of time and money at least.
Spend an extra £1+ per model on special heads to make them look exactly the same!
Joke's on you, I'm buying them to outfit Infiltrators, Incursors, and Reivers!
Well, I'm sure it's been long suspected by many of us, but here it is, conclusive proof Kan doesn't understand what jokes are.
Sure, or it's just a cheeky way of saying that for some Raven Guard players it's nice to have a slightly more affordable option to customize Phobos geared Raven Guard models or Primaris in general.
Because the current $27 a pop for 2 beakie helmets from the Raven Guard upgrade set isn't reasonable.
$80 for 20 models you're only taking the heads from is a bit much.
Assuming they stay at $23 like the other Mk VI helmet sets?
You're getting an additional helmet per set, compared to the current RG Mk VI set(which is 9 helmet heads and 1 bare head), and given the repeating nature of the heads it actually can be a feasible way to outfit whole squads in specific, distinguishable patterns.
Means my Phobos Company ends up being quite a bit cheaper in the long run for the beakies. So laugh all you want, but Mark X Beakies are happening curse you!
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GaroRobe wrote: The “something nasty” is probably that chaos assassin they teased in that video from a few weeks back
It may not be a chaos assassin but I’m guessing it will reveal that model
There's been a lot of chatter these past few weeks about a Horus Heresy Warhammer Quest, so maybe they'll go that route?
I quite like the RG heads. They’re simple and basic but that fits the legion. I mean I’m not sure they’re worth the £15 more than the plastics or whatever really but I don’t dislike the end result and that holds true for all of them really. The feather crest is cool, and the bare head is good too. They’re much better than I feared after some of the others and them saving them for last.
drbored wrote: I play Raven Guard and I'm a bit crushed.
I get the lore they're going for, the 'prototype' or whatever, and also knocking on some nostalgia from Rogue Trader days...
But this isn't what I was hoping for, to be honest. I wanted something that evokes the feeling of the Raven Guard Contemptor Dread with the swirling patterns, or something that looks like it actually has some more stealth tech in it, other than being 'very smooth'. Or heck, raven-skulls would have been better.
Nope.
Oh well, that'll save me a lot of time and money at least.
Just incase you missed them, the old raven guard mk6 head pack is still available incase that's more what you're looking for
I mean, on one hand, it looks cool, otoh, i'd have rather seen the Troop slot fully filled with the missing assault and jumppack infantry.
NVM weapons sprue for combi weapons and terminator weapons.
Definitely getting a Cerberus or two. Just a shame ruleswise the Lascannons are pretty much a compulsory upgrade. Otherwise a single Weapon Destroyed and you’ve paid a lot of points for a mobile brick, as none of the other weapons creep over into Main Weapon.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Definitely getting a Cerberus or two. Just a shame ruleswise the Lascannons are pretty much a compulsory upgrade. Otherwise a single Weapon Destroyed and you’ve paid a lot of points for a mobile brick, as none of the other weapons creep over into Main Weapon.
I guess you could also run a bunch of techmarines no? I feel like that would be pretty necessary at this stage.. also that reminds me that i maybee also should get myself a bunch of techmarines...
Pretty much. It's the exact same tank we already have, except with more pieces and gaps to fill because plastic can't handle undercuts. What a waste of a preview and a release slot.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Definitely getting a Cerberus or two. Just a shame ruleswise the Lascannons are pretty much a compulsory upgrade. Otherwise a single Weapon Destroyed and you’ve paid a lot of points for a mobile brick, as none of the other weapons creep over into Main Weapon.
I guess you could also run a bunch of techmarines no? I feel like that would be pretty necessary at this stage.. also that reminds me that i maybee also should get myself a bunch of techmarines...
I mean, you could I guess. But then the Techmarine will need a shielding squad of some kind. Or I can just cough up the pretty measly 10 points for the Lascannons. Same for the Typhon, as again you don’t want a single spunky Lascannon shot removing the reason you sunk points into the tank in the first place.
lord_blackfang wrote: I'm sure we'll get a teaser of some new infantry actually a Deredeo at AdeptiCon
honestly, i think deredos would be neat for a lot of people atleast more neat than yet another tank.
But at this stage i'd prefer GW throwing out the combiweapons/kraken bolter sprue kit and the terminator weapons kit and jumppacks / breacher shields spure before another vehicle.
I think it's sorta amazing anyone is surprised that GWs immediate releases for the heresy are the easiest things for them to tool up. This kit coming out isn't by any means necessarily at the expense of assault marines or despoilers either (another bit of weird logic floating around many forums).
I'd also say the complaints about the game being tank heavy are a bit unfair - given that the game has a significant number of options for tanks, and offers various lists designed around having a lot of tanks.
It's certainly unfortunate that GW didn't tool up an assault marine and despoiler kit (though honestly it really isn't hard to convert either) and it's annoying they haven't pushed anything out, but it also seems a bit foolish to complain that the game of massed tank and infantry battles does indeed feature a large number of heavy tanks.
blood reaper wrote: I think it's sorta amazing anyone is surprised that GWs immediate releases for the heresy are the easiest things for them to tool up. This kit coming out isn't by any means necessarily at the expense of assault marines or despoilers either (another bit of weird logic floating around many forums).
I'd also say the complaints about the game being tank heavy are a bit unfair - given that the game has a significant number of options for tanks, and offers various lists designed around having a lot of tanks.
It's certainly unfortunate that GW didn't tool up an assault marine and despoiler kit (though honestly it really isn't hard to convert either) and it's annoying they haven't pushed anything out, but it also seems a bit foolish to complain that the game of massed tank and infantry battles does indeed feature a large number of heavy tanks.
It also, arguably, sets it apart from 40K where traditionally Marines don’t really have Battle Tanks as such. I do mean traditionally, as the Primaris stuff has kind of changed it a bit.
Yes hordes of Power Armoured troops are also where it sets itself apart, but the tanks are just so pretty!
blood reaper wrote: I think it's sorta amazing anyone is surprised that GWs immediate releases for the heresy are the easiest things for them to tool up. This kit coming out isn't by any means necessarily at the expense of assault marines or despoilers either (another bit of weird logic floating around many forums).
I'd also say the complaints about the game being tank heavy are a bit unfair - given that the game has a significant number of options for tanks, and offers various lists designed around having a lot of tanks.
It's certainly unfortunate that GW didn't tool up an assault marine and despoiler kit (though honestly it really isn't hard to convert either) and it's annoying they haven't pushed anything out, but it also seems a bit foolish to complain that the game of massed tank and infantry battles does indeed feature a large number of heavy tanks.
It also, arguably, sets it apart from 40K where traditionally Marines don’t really have Battle Tanks as such. I do mean traditionally, as the Primaris stuff has kind of changed it a bit.
Yes hordes of Power Armoured troops are also where it sets itself apart, but the tanks are just so pretty!
I mean in both games marines do have Battle Tanks but it's the number of tanks where it's set apart - in the Horus Heresy there's a significant surplus of armour the legions are able to draw upon which modern chapters simply lack. Even the least mechanised legion could arguably draw upon a pretty huge armoured force - something which people are now treating as if it is some weird flaw.
I really can't say I'm upset Forge World tank models, which are infamously crap in quality, are getting replaced by high quality plastics and for a lower price as well.
blood reaper wrote: I think it's sorta amazing anyone is surprised that GWs immediate releases for the heresy are the easiest things for them to tool up. This kit coming out isn't by any means necessarily at the expense of assault marines or despoilers either (another bit of weird logic floating around many forums).
I'd also say the complaints about the game being tank heavy are a bit unfair - given that the game has a significant number of options for tanks, and offers various lists designed around having a lot of tanks.
It's certainly unfortunate that GW didn't tool up an assault marine and despoiler kit (though honestly it really isn't hard to convert either) and it's annoying they haven't pushed anything out, but it also seems a bit foolish to complain that the game of massed tank and infantry battles does indeed feature a large number of heavy tanks.
Its less about tanks than it is just skipping the basic infantry that multiple legions are built around.
Racerguy180 wrote: One would think that TROOPS would be low-hanging fruit.
Apparently, giving us every tank before filling out the COMPULSORY slot first was fruit laying on the ground.
Ummm, I kinda need despoilers & scrounging around in the collective bits box is getting more difficult.
It's simple. The Cerberus can be made with a token upgrade sprue for the Spartan they already have. Troops require making entire new kits and each of those kits may require unique sprues with little or no potential to reuse them on other kits.
Now, is it a good sign for the long-term health of the game that GW is making production decisions based on aggressive cost reduction rather than ensuring that the core units everyone needs to buy are prioritized over an obscure secondary unit that many people will have zero interest in? I'll let you draw your own conclusions about that.
Yet they gave us special & 3 heavy upgrades using the same basic bodies, but it took less effort(apparently) to do similar to tanks?
Maybe with the upcoming jetbikes there'll be a pistol/melee sprue for mkvi?
My point is, there are some armies that run troops geared toward their legion traits. With gaps in the availability not being addressed by fact of tanks, tanks & more tanks(I love tanks so its not that I don't want them).
I get drip feeding but, this is getting to be punitive at this point.
Racerguy180 wrote: Yet they gave us special & 3 heavy upgrades using the same basic bodies, but it took less effort(apparently) to do similar to tanks?
Maybe with the upcoming jetbikes there'll be a pistol/melee sprue for mkvi?
Swapping hands is easier than swapping arms. For my money, I'd say GW is going to do a dual Despoiler/Assault kit similar to how 40k Assault Marines have a sprue of normal backpacks alongside jump packs.
I get drip feeding but, this is getting to be punitive at this point.
Seventeen plastic kits with reboxes of older kits that made them cheaper to buy in bulk alongside rules for all but 2 HH1 armies in 6 months is punitive? Have you maybe considered that not following 40k in releasing a thousand new things within months of each other is maybe a good thing?
Yeah, they chose to prioritize tanks over filling out the things that everyone needs. Instead of Kratos+Spartan at launch they could have dropped the jetbikes & despoiler/assaults and I'd bet less people would be complaining, esp legions that use them in bulk. The fact we've only recently had the bikes previewed 8mo since release of game is telling.
Notice how I left out the dreads, rhinos, LR variants & preds, that's due to them being more useful to more legions, like the troops would.
Every WE/NL/WS/BA recent 30k player I know are basically waiting on assault/bikes to round out their AOD boxes.
The troops would get more players playing, sooner. Which would only give the game a stronger beachhead with NEW players, so we don't get attrition due to boredom
Racerguy180 wrote: Yet they gave us special & 3 heavy upgrades using the same basic bodies, but it took less effort(apparently) to do similar to tanks?
Maybe with the upcoming jetbikes there'll be a pistol/melee sprue for mkvi?
Swapping hands is easier than swapping arms. For my money, I'd say GW is going to do a dual Despoiler/Assault kit similar to how 40k Assault Marines have a sprue of normal backpacks alongside jump packs.
I get drip feeding but, this is getting to be punitive at this point.
Seventeen plastic kits with reboxes of older kits that made them cheaper to buy in bulk alongside rules for all but 2 HH1 armies in 6 months is punitive? Have you maybe considered that not following 40k in releasing a thousand new things within months of each other is maybe a good thing?
I get why people are upset and frustrated but there is 100% a disconnect from the reality of the production process. It's funny to see people say they're worried about The Old World being treated like HH. What, like getting a ton of kits and consistent support? Truly atrocious.
Racerguy180 wrote: Yeah, they chose to prioritize tanks over filling out the things that everyone needs. Instead of Kratos+Spartan at launch they could have dropped the jetbikes & despoiler/assaults and I'd bet less people would be complaining, esp legions that use them in bulk. The fact we've only recently had the bikes previewed 8mo since release of game is telling.
The Spartan is one of the most popular FW kits ever made and was one of the most requested plastic ports for years. It would have but utterly moronic for GW to not release a plastic Spartan at the release of HH2.
As for the Kratos, redoes of resin kits only get you so far and the Kratos was a new unit for people to play around with.
I don't see how in any possible way the release of Jetbikes in late Jan/early Feb is "telling" in any way. What does that even mean in this context?
Notice how I left out the dreads, rhinos, LR variants & preds, that's due to them being more useful to more legions, like the troops would.
A heavily armoured transport with a large transport capacity isn't useful to people using the Terminators they got in the AoD box? That's news to me. You seem to massively underestimate the popularity of the Spartan here my guy.
Every WE/NL/WS/BA recent 30k player I know are basically waiting on assault/bikes to round out their AOD boxes.
The WE/NL/BA players I know have never used Assault Marines so clearly, it's possible not to use them. Weird how people have different playstyles.
The troops would get more players playing, sooner. Which would only give the game a stronger beachhead with NEW players, so we don't get attrition due to boredom
You seem to think that if people don't get Assault or Breacher Marines, HH is going to become a dead game.
My guy, HH was absolutely fine before this and it will continue to be fine. GW isn't going to dump the most successful thing to come out of FW since the Death Korps of Krieg after less than a year just because some people are mad they can't get everything they want all at once.
The reality is that the next infantry kit (or three) are almost certainly done and just waiting for the right slot in the release schedule.
We have 40k 10th edition coming this summer which is likely to have thousands of new items being produced each week in time to ship out for the summer. If GW want to keep releasing stuff for other games during that busy production period do they pick:
a) The specialist tank kit that is likely to sell X boxes?
b) The common infantry kit that is likely to sell X * 4 or X * 5 boxes?
They may also want to make all the chapter-specific shoulder pads available before releasing any more infantry kits.
Gert wrote: The Spartan is one of the most popular FW kits ever made and was one of the most requested plastic ports for years. It would have but utterly moronic for GW to not release a plastic Spartan at the release of HH2.
I wouldn't be so sure about that. It was highly requested, but by people whose main concern was "how do I make my personal army cheaper" and not "how do I increase shareholder value". From a sales point of view the Spartan is actually a fairly questionable choice. Its popularity was largely the result of balance issues rather than inherent appeal to the model, and being a dominant unit for so long meant that a large percentage of the customer base already owned one. And since it's an expensive tank that requires an even more expensive terminator/primarch death star to function it's rare that a player will ever want to buy more than one. Contrast that with basic troops, which are always bought in multiples so the impact of a price drop is more significant and demand is more reliable, and the Spartan doesn't look like a great investment vs. a resin Spartan and plastic core units.
You seem to think that if people don't get Assault or Breacher Marines, HH is going to become a dead game.
My guy, HH was absolutely fine before this and it will continue to be fine. GW isn't going to dump the most successful thing to come out of FW since the Death Korps of Krieg after less than a year just because some people are mad they can't get everything they want all at once.
Of course GW isn't going to dump it immediately. But GW ending production isn't the only way for a game to die. Continued lack of access to high-demand kits means people are going to eventually get tired of waiting and move on. They'll be busy with other projects, the money they would have spent on 30k will be allocated elsewhere, and GW will be in the position of trying to rebuild hype and demand for a game that most people have already considered and rejected. Production may not end for quite a while longer but you end up with a game like Aeronautica Imperialis where the models are still mostly available to buy but ongoing support is nonexistent and the product line may never be finished. And there are already some red flags that 30k is heading that way in the slow pace of releases (other than mediocre shoulder pads) and GW's continued refusal to spend even a few minutes addressing the most egregious balance issues.
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xttz wrote: We have 40k 10th edition coming this summer which is likely to have thousands of new items being produced each week in time to ship out for the summer. If GW want to keep releasing stuff for other games during that busy production period do they pick:
a) The specialist tank kit that is likely to sell X boxes?
b) The common infantry kit that is likely to sell X * 4 or X * 5 boxes?
You know that's an argument againstGW's current release schedule, right? If you're arranging products to fit into the 40k release cycle you want those 4X and 5X infantry boxes out right now, and you save the Cerberus for when only the hardcore fans who will care about the Cerberus are paying attention to anything other than 10th edition. Showing the Cerberus now suggests that it's the current release because 30k is not a priority and it's the only thing available to preview right now.
I think the sad part about the rush of tanks is that... despite how many tanks we've gotten, there's still SO MANY MORE.
2 variants of Vindicator
3 more variants of Sicaran
Command Rhino
3 variants of Arquitor
3 variants of Sabre
Legion Glaive
Legion Fellblade
Legion Falchion
Legion Basilisk/Medusa
Termite Drill
Mastodon
Now, I think that the Mastodon, Glaive, Fellblade, Falchion, Arquitor, and Sabre are likely not on the list to be updated any time soon BUT YOU NEVER KNOW, I'm just listing them here. Even without those, considering the Vindicator will likely have both weapons in 1 but the others will be separated, it's likely that's 7 more tanks that could release before we see any Assault Marines.
The fact is also that the entirety of the Mk6 bolter squad, sergeant sprue included, takes up less sprue space than just predator turrets. So it's false that tank variants are easier/cheaper to tool.
But I'm used to stans bending over backwards to invent excuses for their favorite corporation, now mixed with a healthy dose of gleeful gatekeeping by HH grognards. I'ts okay bro, new players don't need troop choices bro, they can buy resin at 10 clams per model like what we did, the game will do just fine if old farts who already have armies can pretend to be buying all these plastic tanks they simultaneously say are useless in the new edition.
drbored wrote: I think the sad part about the rush of tanks is that... despite how many tanks we've gotten, there's still SO MANY MORE.
2 variants of Vindicator
3 more variants of Sicaran
Command Rhino
3 variants of Arquitor
3 variants of Sabre
Legion Glaive
Legion Fellblade
Legion Falchion
Legion Basilisk/Medusa
Termite Drill
Mastodon
Now, I think that the Mastodon, Glaive, Fellblade, Falchion, Arquitor, and Sabre are likely not on the list to be updated any time soon BUT YOU NEVER KNOW, I'm just listing them here. Even without those, considering the Vindicator will likely have both weapons in 1 but the others will be separated, it's likely that's 7 more tanks that could release before we see any Assault Marines.
Sounds reasonable. GW will surely publish soon a PDF how to properly play HH 2.0 though you will need double the table space as usual: Leave infantry on the shelves (they are squishy anyway) and use lots of tanks instead. VROOM! VROOM! VROOM!
lord_blackfang wrote: The fact is also that the entirety of the Mk6 bolter squad, sergeant sprue included, takes up less sprue space than just predator turrets. So it's false that tank variants are easier/cheaper to tool.
But I'm used to stans bending over backwards to invent excuses for their favorite corporation, now mixed with a healthy dose of gleeful gatekeeping by HH grognards. I'ts okay bro, new players don't need troop choices bro, they can buy resin at 10 clams per model like what we did, the game will do just fine if old farts who already have armies can pretend to be buying all these plastic tanks they simultaneously say are useless in the new edition.
Honestly even the FW resins are spoiling you all too much, back in my day we used to have to buy 20 boxes of 2002 CSM squad to get a tactical's squad worth of Mk5 chest pieces and we had to file off the chaos trims and we liked it fine that way.
A thought occurs. And it’s only a thought, not a claim, rumour or news.
Maybe the tank intensive release schedule is to allow newcomers to avoid being hideously outgunned by longer term players?
Entirely anecdotal, but the folks I know who’ve been playing Heresy since it first released (literally. We were in the mad dash at Games Day 201….3?) already have vast resin armies, and plenty of Spartans, Cerberus etc
So my thought here is if I was limited to just infantry, Dreadnoughts and Predators, I’d risk being somewhat outgunned?
Aecus Decimus wrote: I wouldn't be so sure about that. It was highly requested, but by people whose main concern was "how do I make my personal army cheaper" and not "how do I increase shareholder value". From a sales point of view the Spartan is actually a fairly questionable choice. Its popularity was largely the result of balance issues rather than inherent appeal to the model, and being a dominant unit for so long meant that a large percentage of the customer base already owned one. And since it's an expensive tank that requires an even more expensive terminator/primarch death star to function it's rare that a player will ever want to buy more than one. Contrast that with basic troops, which are always bought in multiples so the impact of a price drop is more significant and demand is more reliable, and the Spartan doesn't look like a great investment vs. a resin Spartan and plastic core units.
The Spartan got nerfed like four times in HH1 and was still a massively popular FW product. It went from being way undercosted to coming close to a quarter of a 2k list if you took certain upgrades. The biggest complaint was that the FW kit is an unwieldy brick of resin that also happens to have a lot of annoyingly fragile parts, specifically the sponsons and edges of the tracks. People rebuy models when they become better my guy and that is what GW did with the Spartan. It was an instant hype win when the Spartan got confirmed because it's insanely popular regardless of rules.
Of course GW isn't going to dump it immediately. But GW ending production isn't the only way for a game to die. Continued lack of access to high-demand kits means people are going to eventually get tired of waiting and move on. They'll be busy with other projects, the money they would have spent on 30k will be allocated elsewhere, and GW will be in the position of trying to rebuild hype and demand for a game that most people have already considered and rejected. Production may not end for quite a while longer but you end up with a game like Aeronautica Imperialis where the models are still mostly available to buy but ongoing support is nonexistent and the product line may never be finished. And there are already some red flags that 30k is heading that way in the slow pace of releases (other than mediocre shoulder pads) and GW's continued refusal to spend even a few minutes addressing the most egregious balance issues.
Balance issues aside, people like you are giving the game less than a year and saying it's going to be dead and then claim I'm the one who is incorrect in my assessment of the system.
As for availability, I'm on the UKGW website and the only things I can't order currently are the Scorpius, Contemptor (which was in stock last week because my mate got one), Fafnir Rann, 3 Legion dice sets and 4 Legion transfer sheets. And once again, if the current releases for HH in a six-month window are "slow" then I'm the King of France.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: A thought occurs. And it’s only a thought, not a claim, rumour or news.
Maybe the tank intensive release schedule is to allow newcomers to avoid being hideously outgunned by longer term players?
Entirely anecdotal, but the folks I know who’ve been playing Heresy since it first released (literally. We were in the mad dash at Games Day 201….3?) already have vast resin armies, and plenty of Spartans, Cerberus etc
So my thought here is if I was limited to just infantry, Dreadnoughts and Predators, I’d risk being somewhat outgunned?
Still want assault troops of course.
That is some grade-A, free range, 36 day matured, prime cope my dude.
I dont think GW intend to make Horus Heresy all plastic. They probably realise people will focus on buying legion uniqe infantry and HQ from FW. If they kept the tanks resin, most guys would simply not bother to get them. This way sales are way up for tanks, and people will still get those super elite CC units in resin.
Hard to get excited by a new tank that I already have. But that's entirely a "me" problem. If you want a Cerberus? Congratulations! It's now cheaper and in plastic!
Can I have my jetbikes now? And Cults and Militia and Daemons of the Ruinstorm rules? Maybe some more infantry options? Definitely not calling the plastic release of the Cerberus "bad", just not what I'm personally looking for right now.
Fayric wrote: I dont think GW intend to make Horus Heresy all plastic. They probably realise people will focus on buying legion uniqe infantry and HQ from FW. If they kept the tanks resin, most guys would simply not bother to get them. This way sales are way up for tanks, and people will still get those super elite CC units in resin.
Except people aren't talking about the Legion unique stuff, they're talking about the base Troops in the basic shared army list.
Fayric wrote: I dont think GW intend to make Horus Heresy all plastic. They probably realise people will focus on buying legion uniqe infantry and HQ from FW. If they kept the tanks resin, most guys would simply not bother to get them. This way sales are way up for tanks, and people will still get those super elite CC units in resin.
Except people aren't talking about the Legion unique stuff, they're talking about the base Troops in the basic shared army list.
A more solid foundation(troops) will yield a stronger game as a whole. But they'd rather load up top with tanks.
They could be saving Assault marines to be the stars of the next HH big box, when they get around to it. Say 30 assault marines, 10 Tartaros praetors, a Deredeo dread, a Proteus Land Raider, and a jump and Tartaros Praetor. Keep the price the same, but maybe a paperback rulebook to drop the cost. Leverage demand for the assault marines to push a few older kits in a big box that is still seen as good value, and get a second big wave of HH going. In the meantime, Tanks are single new sprues that help push a bunch of existing sprues in a new box, so extra profit margin, and the occasional more unique unit like Jetbikes to keep interest up.
Fayric wrote: I dont think GW intend to make Horus Heresy all plastic. They probably realise people will focus on buying legion uniqe infantry and HQ from FW. If they kept the tanks resin, most guys would simply not bother to get them. This way sales are way up for tanks, and people will still get those super elite CC units in resin.
Except people aren't talking about the Legion unique stuff, they're talking about the base Troops in the basic shared army list.
A more solid foundation(troops) will yield a stronger game as a whole. But they'd rather load up top with tanks.
Or maybe....switching more tooling/casting manpower from tanks/vehicles = more tooling/manpower available for Legion specific infantry units, with more "generic" infantry to follow? Just a guess, might be wrong. But at least we have a real WARgame, instead of the pathetic BOARDgame that 40k has devolved into. TLDR- we still have the better game. Just need to do more kitbashing/conversions, which always fun, IMHO.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: A thought occurs. And it’s only a thought, not a claim, rumour or news.
Maybe the tank intensive release schedule is to allow newcomers to avoid being hideously outgunned by longer term players?
Entirely anecdotal, but the folks I know who’ve been playing Heresy since it first released (literally. We were in the mad dash at Games Day 201….3?) already have vast resin armies, and plenty of Spartans, Cerberus etc
So my thought here is if I was limited to just infantry, Dreadnoughts and Predators, I’d risk being somewhat outgunned?
Still want assault troops of course.
The thought would be a good one, if vehicles outgunned anything or were difficult to destroy. Infantry with lascannons will make short work of any vehicle on the table, including spartans and the like. Contemptors will shred everything too, and with an assault cannon can ding lighter vehicles like rhinos and predators to death.
I played a game with 3 contemptors with assault cannons and fists, a leviathan with dual grav bombards, and a single squad of 10 lascannons (plus various troops and whatnot) and my opponent had a Kratos, a spartan, rhinos, predators, and sicarans. In the first round alone I had destroyed the Kratos, the Spartan, and stunned most of the other vehicles. By the second round, he had nothing left but a predator cowering in the back corner.
So, to suggest they're releasing plastic vehicles to help newbies not get dominated by resin vehicles also suggests that they aren't aware of how their own ruleset works. If anything, the initial release of heavy weapons and contemptors was to help old players get up to snuff and trade up their old resin vehicles
MajorWesJanson wrote: They could be saving Assault marines to be the stars of the next HH big box, when they get around to it. Say 30 assault marines, 10 Tartaros praetors, a Deredeo dread, a Proteus Land Raider, and a jump and Tartaros Praetor. Keep the price the same, but maybe a paperback rulebook to drop the cost. Leverage demand for the assault marines to push a few older kits in a big box that is still seen as good value, and get a second big wave of HH going. In the meantime, Tanks are single new sprues that help push a bunch of existing sprues in a new box, so extra profit margin, and the occasional more unique unit like Jetbikes to keep interest up.
Possible. I think there was talk about GW doing multiple large 30k boxes to introduce further units.
Do I think it's a good idea? Heck no. Takes too long for us to actually get the models we need to play games with the armies we want to play
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: A thought occurs. And it’s only a thought, not a claim, rumour or news.
Maybe the tank intensive release schedule is to allow newcomers to avoid being hideously outgunned by longer term players?
Entirely anecdotal, but the folks I know who’ve been playing Heresy since it first released (literally. We were in the mad dash at Games Day 201….3?) already have vast resin armies, and plenty of Spartans, Cerberus etc
So my thought here is if I was limited to just infantry, Dreadnoughts and Predators, I’d risk being somewhat outgunned?
Still want assault troops of course.
The thought would be a good one, if vehicles outgunned anything or were difficult to destroy. Infantry with lascannons will make short work of any vehicle on the table, including spartans and the like. Contemptors will shred everything too, and with an assault cannon can ding lighter vehicles like rhinos and predators to death.
I played a game with 3 contemptors with assault cannons and fists, a leviathan with dual grav bombards, and a single squad of 10 lascannons (plus various troops and whatnot) and my opponent had a Kratos, a spartan, rhinos, predators, and sicarans. In the first round alone I had destroyed the Kratos, the Spartan, and stunned most of the other vehicles. By the second round, he had nothing left but a predator cowering in the back corner.
So, to suggest they're releasing plastic vehicles to help newbies not get dominated by resin vehicles also suggests that they aren't aware of how their own ruleset works. If anything, the initial release of heavy weapons and contemptors was to help old players get up to snuff and trade up their old resin vehicles
Ehhh....do you have more "specifics" on this game? As I'm envisioning a Dawn of War/ Hammer and Anvil deployment with minimal terrain (read: Planet Bowling Ball) deployment, with maximum Imperial Fists WAAC chicanery (that's a lot of Assault Cannons) vs an unprepared and possibly inexperienced opponent). To be blunt: I think you rolled someone.
What exactly is it you believe I’m trying to “cope” with?
It is a fellow Brit calling you "dude" and going on about "cope". Best to just ignore them and move on.
I understand the frustration with the constant tank releases, but I think the amount of stuff (in both plastic and resin) released post the release box has been fantastic. Just it has been skewed to the elite/heavy and transport parts of the force organisation chart. But some fast attack are on the horizon and hopefully more variety of troops...then again we have 3 marks of Tactical armour in plastic already.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: A thought occurs. And it’s only a thought, not a claim, rumour or news.
Maybe the tank intensive release schedule is to allow newcomers to avoid being hideously outgunned by longer term players?
Entirely anecdotal, but the folks I know who’ve been playing Heresy since it first released (literally. We were in the mad dash at Games Day 201….3?) already have vast resin armies, and plenty of Spartans, Cerberus etc
So my thought here is if I was limited to just infantry, Dreadnoughts and Predators, I’d risk being somewhat outgunned?
Still want assault troops of course.
The thought would be a good one, if vehicles outgunned anything or were difficult to destroy. Infantry with lascannons will make short work of any vehicle on the table, including spartans and the like. Contemptors will shred everything too, and with an assault cannon can ding lighter vehicles like rhinos and predators to death.
I played a game with 3 contemptors with assault cannons and fists, a leviathan with dual grav bombards, and a single squad of 10 lascannons (plus various troops and whatnot) and my opponent had a Kratos, a spartan, rhinos, predators, and sicarans. In the first round alone I had destroyed the Kratos, the Spartan, and stunned most of the other vehicles. By the second round, he had nothing left but a predator cowering in the back corner.
So, to suggest they're releasing plastic vehicles to help newbies not get dominated by resin vehicles also suggests that they aren't aware of how their own ruleset works. If anything, the initial release of heavy weapons and contemptors was to help old players get up to snuff and trade up their old resin vehicles
Ehhh....do you have more "specifics" on this game? As I'm envisioning a Dawn of War/ Hammer and Anvil deployment with minimal terrain (read: Planet Bowling Ball) deployment, with maximum Imperial Fists WAAC chicanery (that's a lot of Assault Cannons) vs an unprepared and possibly inexperienced opponent). To be blunt: I think you rolled someone.
I was Sons of Horus and he was Iron Warriors with an allied detachment of World Eaters. We deployed in the diagonal deployments (forget the name for that one) with pretty close to the recommended amount of terrain, possibly a bit more. I remember there being a big piece that forced my sabers to give up the first turn of shooting as they drove around it to flank, and my Heavy Support Squad was on a hill. He had a rhino and a predator behind terrain making it impossible to shoot, and my leviathan had to walk around a piece to get an angle to shoot with the grav bombards.
Both of us deployed our forces fairly exposed other than that, I just happened to roll going first. Terrain sort of forced him, specifically to, because he had a ton of tanks and limited space.
Another game, my Iron Hands opponent outflanked some tanks (or artillery?) and was able to get a round of fire off before they were destroyed. My buddies that went up against tank armies at NOVA were also un-impressed with vehicles.
I dunno, I don't think it was an isolated instance of rolling. I think it's an inherent failure of the system to make vehicles appealing. Good riddance, though, infantry for life.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: A thought occurs. And it’s only a thought, not a claim, rumour or news.
Maybe the tank intensive release schedule is to allow newcomers to avoid being hideously outgunned by longer term players?
Entirely anecdotal, but the folks I know who’ve been playing Heresy since it first released (literally. We were in the mad dash at Games Day 201….3?) already have vast resin armies, and plenty of Spartans, Cerberus etc
So my thought here is if I was limited to just infantry, Dreadnoughts and Predators, I’d risk being somewhat outgunned?
Still want assault troops of course.
The thought would be a good one, if vehicles outgunned anything or were difficult to destroy. Infantry with lascannons will make short work of any vehicle on the table, including spartans and the like. Contemptors will shred everything too, and with an assault cannon can ding lighter vehicles like rhinos and predators to death.
I played a game with 3 contemptors with assault cannons and fists, a leviathan with dual grav bombards, and a single squad of 10 lascannons (plus various troops and whatnot) and my opponent had a Kratos, a spartan, rhinos, predators, and sicarans. In the first round alone I had destroyed the Kratos, the Spartan, and stunned most of the other vehicles. By the second round, he had nothing left but a predator cowering in the back corner.
So, to suggest they're releasing plastic vehicles to help newbies not get dominated by resin vehicles also suggests that they aren't aware of how their own ruleset works. If anything, the initial release of heavy weapons and contemptors was to help old players get up to snuff and trade up their old resin vehicles
Ehhh....do you have more "specifics" on this game? As I'm envisioning a Dawn of War/ Hammer and Anvil deployment with minimal terrain (read: Planet Bowling Ball) deployment, with maximum Imperial Fists WAAC chicanery (that's a lot of Assault Cannons) vs an unprepared and possibly inexperienced opponent). To be blunt: I think you rolled someone.
I was Sons of Horus and he was Iron Warriors with an allied detachment of World Eaters. We deployed in the diagonal deployments (forget the name for that one) with pretty close to the recommended amount of terrain, possibly a bit more. I remember there being a big piece that forced my sabers to give up the first turn of shooting as they drove around it to flank, and my Heavy Support Squad was on a hill. He had a rhino and a predator behind terrain making it impossible to shoot, and my leviathan had to walk around a piece to get an angle to shoot with the grav bombards.
Both of us deployed our forces fairly exposed other than that, I just happened to roll going first. Terrain sort of forced him, specifically to, because he had a ton of tanks and limited space.
Another game, my Iron Hands opponent outflanked some tanks (or artillery?) and was able to get a round of fire off before they were destroyed. My buddies that went up against tank armies at NOVA were also un-impressed with vehicles.
I dunno, I don't think it was an isolated instance of rolling. I think it's an inherent failure of the system to make vehicles appealing. Good riddance, though, infantry for life.
Then how the hell did you have 3 Contemptors with assault cannons, if you were Sons of Horus? I'm smelling something......
Yes, Kheres Assault Cannon. Is there... another kind? besides rotor cannons, which are not really assault cannons except sort of in appearance, I guess.
Ack. Ok. Fine. But please agree with me Gert, that "Kheres assault cannons" and "Assault Cannons" are two different things. And still, there must have been absolutely practically no terrain at all to get the described results.
Gert wrote: Blood Angels and Imperial Fists can take more 40k style versions instead of heavy flamers which means Dreads can take them in their fist.
Oh, interesting. Kheres had the same stats as I remember from 7th edition's Assault Cannon, so I assumed it was just a fancy name for the same gun. Or I misremembered 7th edition's stats.
And still, there must have been absolutely practically no terrain at all to get the described results.
I mean, there was enough to impact the game's deployment and movement? If there was more terrain, what, he would've deployed behind it, got 1 turn of shooting which would've done next to nothing to my dreadnoughts/lascannons in cover, and then died for being out in the open? I dunno man, I've had the same story repeat itself across enough games that I don't think it is the terrain's problem.
But, I'll try to convince my friend to play a few games with a 5" tall wall of line of sight blocking terrain across the middle, see if it makes him like vehicles any more.
That Leviathan had an effective range of 18". Those Contemptors? 24". That's a hell of a small board by 30k standards. Sounds kinda anemic. TBOH. Did you roll for it?
The thing is. Is not like Tanks are cheaper to do for GW than infantry kits so... why are they spamming us with vehicles and tanks? The jetbikes I get. Those are cool.
But why another slighly different variety of the same looking tank?
Galas wrote: The thing is. Is not like Tanks are cheaper to do for GW than infantry kits so... why are they spamming us with vehicles and tanks? The jetbikes I get. Those are cool.
But why another slighly different variety of the same looking tank?
Part of it is probably that they were very smart with the sprue layouts so the variants aren’t actually as expensive as they might first seem.
Another part is, I suspect, that the FW vehicle moulds are wearing out faster than the infantry ones, based on my experience with FW large kits vs infantry kits and the number of times I’ve found chunks of mould buried in undercuts.
The third part is, as with every modelling decision in GW, sculptor enthusiasm or the lack thereof. Seriously, if someone near Nottingham reading this thread really wants MkVI assault infantry with Heresy era equipment, go down to Bugmans, see if any of the sculptors are there, and persuade them that assault marines are the next best thing and a real opportunity for them to show off. Or something.
I will say that currently the majority of Forgeworld's offerings right now are still 30k tanks, since AoS is empty of models now.
I wouldn't be surprised if this is indeed a way for Forgeworld to clear out space for TOW, by getting GW to shift a lot of those big bulky kits to plastic so they can retire the resin.
Once that's done, Forgeworld will truly just be for specific characters and boutique models and the other boxed games, and not a whole heck of a lot else... other than the odd Manta or Titan sale.
Galas wrote: The thing is. Is not like Tanks are cheaper to do for GW than infantry kits so... why are they spamming us with vehicles and tanks? The jetbikes I get. Those are cool.
But why another slighly different variety of the same looking tank?
Galas wrote: The thing is. Is not like Tanks are cheaper to do for GW than infantry kits so... why are they spamming us with vehicles and tanks? The jetbikes I get. Those are cool.
But why another slighly different variety of the same looking tank?
Tanks probably are cheaper to do.
How much machining time it takes to make something is dependent on the cutters which you can use. Flat surfaces can use bigger end mills or slot mills with fewer passes. A cylinder of constant cross section can use a big ball cutter and do the cut in a few passes removing big chunks of material. A detailed cylinder of varying cross section (e.g. an arm or a leg) will require a smaller cutter and many passes only removing a small amount of material each time.
It maybe also takes longer to code infantry models, not sure, and probably longer to take the model from complete CAD to broken down into bits with gates and runners.
It wouldn't surprise me if a large tank sprue can be designed, broken down and machined faster than a small infantry sprue.
Not saying that's the reason GW haven't done infantry though.
Cost and stock management are likely to be factors, and it's probable that a lot of the vehicle kits were designed at the same time to check all the shared components worked together
Something else will be how new HH products fit into the production/release schedule around other games. Recently we've had large numbers of products made for Imperial Guard, World Eaters, and Slaves to Darkness. This summer we're looking at a massive Seraphon range update followed by 40k 10E, GW's biggest release since 2020.
Models like the Typhon tank are fairly specialist and likely to sell far fewer units than generic infantry that are key to several legions. It's easier to squeeze in a production batch of something like that alongside new IG / WE models, compared to a core infantry kit like assault marines that many HH players will want multiple boxes of.
If I had to bet I'd say the most likely time for a new HH infantry kit will be April/May, in between the peaks of 40k/AOS releases.
If I had to bet I'd say the most likely time for a new HH infantry kit will be April/May, in between the peaks of 40k/AOS releases.
There shouldn't be many unrevealed big releases from now until Seraphon/10th in May/June.
After World Eaters 40k is finished with all factions and is probably only getting single Character models for each AoO Books plus some boxsets. Dark Angels could be bigger with the Lion but we don't know for now how much they are getting so I would only expect the Lion, Azrael and the rumored Lions Guard for now
AoS will probably only get single hero models for the five Battletomes until Seraphon with maybe a vs-box for two of them.
Kill Team and Warcry should both only get 1 more set after the LVO ones until June so new new Kill Team cycle will also not have started before 10th
So there should be quite some space for HH in the coming months
Weither they actually use that space for HH or if there is still have something else we don't know about is another question
Cost and stock management are likely to be factors, and it's probable that a lot of the vehicle kits were designed at the same time to check all the shared components worked together
Something else will be how new HH products fit into the production/release schedule around other games. Recently we've had large numbers of products made for Imperial Guard, World Eaters, and Slaves to Darkness. This summer we're looking at a massive Seraphon range update followed by 40k 10E, GW's biggest release since 2020.
Models like the Typhon tank are fairly specialist and likely to sell far fewer units than generic infantry that are key to several legions. It's easier to squeeze in a production batch of something like that alongside new IG / WE models, compared to a core infantry kit like assault marines that many HH players will want multiple boxes of.
If I had to bet I'd say the most likely time for a new HH infantry kit will be April/May, in between the peaks of 40k/AOS releases.
I'm not saying there isn't reasonable logic in your post, but you've literally added "GW made tanks first because they sell less than infantry would" to the list of excuses and I think that's beautiful.
Ughhh of course hes resin. Interesting that it’s the backpack that has the librarian hood. Wonder how easy it’ll be to snag that and the helmet from a fw bit seller?
He can be used by either side, according to the article. And as Psykers go, the model is pretty agnostic in terms of its leanings.
I mean the staff does give it away a bit, doesn't it?
Kind of. I think it actually plays nicely into the general lack of understanding enforced upon the Legions. You know the Eight Pointed Star helps focus your powers - but not why, because why has been kept from you. And it’s not overly pronounced which I think helps it look practical over ritualistic. Not sure ritualistic is quite the right word, but hopefully you can get the gist of my waffle.
I think you could get away with him as a loyalist librarian but not replacing the staff top would be a bit of a reach.
He's nice, but to be honest I was hoping that they'd make generic command characters in plastic. And he works for some legions better than others, he's a bit dour for the cray cray that Emperors Children Esoterists probably were by the time there was much Mark VI armour floating around...
I don't usually like robed marines (whether on top of or under the armor), but the over all look of this one is pretty good.
Falls apart on detail though- the thickness of robes around the raised arm, the gun strapped to the outside of the robes, the floating-on-fabric shoulder pads.
The hodge-podge of traditions is fairly interesting. Runes and books and skulls and vials/canisters and whatever that slice of.. meat?(crystal?) is at the center of the staff. This guy is grabbing anything that might possibly work.
The hodge-podge of traditions is fairly interesting. Runes and books and skulls and vials/canisters and whatever that slice of.. meat?(crystal?) is at the center of the staff. This guy is grabbing anything that might possibly work.
We usually have Astartes Psykers, and Heretic Sorcerors - this dude is probably the first model of an Astartes Wizard.
It's an nice model...
there's just one issue, this being the traitor version and all that, yeah, well technically the big thing for the traitor version is summoning daemons. Daemons for which we require the rules.
Which we don't have so far, because the free PDF's for Ruinstorm nor militia and cults hasn't dropped yet.
So yay, it's a nice modell, shame that the explicit reason to field this dude isn't yet released
I like the overall look, but the execution of the model is a little sub par. The robe sleeve is completely solid -- the darkness is painted on.
In fact, it looks like there's almost no use of the benefits of the resin medium *at all*. I mean, at least if they're going to subject us to their sub-par version of the medium, can they please use the few advantages it has?
They continue to demonstrate why Forgeworld resin is disliked.
I really like it overall - bring on the beakie consuls - but disappointed it's not plastic as I'd hoped that generic consuls would swing in that direction.
In and of itself it's a nice model, although I do share Voss' misgivings about some of the details. While the thick fabric around the raised arm is unsightly, I think painting more of it as black negative space will help it look less like a huge chunk of resin and more like actual cloth. Hopefully the shoulder pads are unattached or at least easily removed as well.
Mocked this up. Not going to win any awards, but it gives an idea of how the robes could look if painted right.
Snrub wrote: In and of itself it's a nice model, although I do share Voss' misgivings about some of the details. While the thick fabric around the raised arm is unsightly, I think painting more of it as black negative space will help it look less like a huge chunk of resin and more like actual cloth. Hopefully the shoulder pads are unattached or at least easily removed as well.
Mocked this up. Not going to win any awards, but it gives an idea of how the robes could look if painted right.
I think less needs painting block black and more a transition to black to give the illusion of the depth of the sleeve. You could also Dremel or carve it out to make it look more realistic.
On second look, whats he doing with his hand? Looks like a triumphant teenager...
Carving out then sculpting will be the only way to fix that surely, can't be done with paint or they would have done it. It's quite a strange flaw imo I wonder how this happened, it's glaring and offputting, although I didn't notice it at first, I skim read a negative comment then had another look with a critical eye and it immediately jumps out when you know there's something awry without knowing the specifics. Maybe it's a training sculpt or something. Looks very good to me apart from the sleeve, a lot better than most of the one off minis that don't turn out great but which then subsequently get released (like as some sort of limited availability product, guaranteeing sales to the section of the audience who are always susceptible to that technique).
JWBS wrote: Carving out then sculpting will be the only way to fix that surely, can't be done with paint or they would have done it. It's quite a strange flaw imo I wonder how this happened, it's glaring and offputting, although I didn't notice it at first, I skim read a negative comment then had another look with a critical eye and it immediately jumps out when you know there's something awry without knowing the specifics.
I agree - I didn’t really notice it either at first, but now it seems very obvious. Yet this is something that resin models are specifically good at avoiding - you can normally achieve more depth with hollow spaces. I wonder if it was originally going to be plastic?
Quite like the model. It would make a good base for a Librarian. I wonder how hard it would be to move that psychic hood onto a jump pack. Though I must echo Not Online and drbored in wondering just when the rules for Daemons of the Ruinstorm will be released, since those will be needed to fulfill the model's intended use as an Esoterist.
Gadzilla666 wrote: Though I must echo Not Online and drbored in wondering just when the rules for Daemons of the Ruinstorm will be released, since those will be needed to fulfill the model's intended use as an Esoterist.
Give 'em time. There's like 16 more tanks they've got to convert to plastic first!
Gadzilla666 wrote: Though I must echo Not Online and drbored in wondering just when the rules for Daemons of the Ruinstorm will be released, since those will be needed to fulfill the model's intended use as an Esoterist.
Give 'em time. There's like 16 more tanks they've got to convert to plastic first!
Well, like 9, and the rest are sprue swaps or can be combined at best.
Unless you add Landspeeders and Fliers. Plastic Storm Eagle/Fire Raptor would do well.
No Assault or Breacher or otherweise Close Combat Infantry before Summer.
New Terminators of the Indomitus Pattern which can be used for 40k (option for Crux Terminatus on shoulder pads or without them). Seperate Sprue/Box for Close Combat Weapons
New Terminator Praetor with Indomitus Pattern Armour in Plastic, which comes with parts to show chaos influences and could maybe used as a Chaos Lord in 40k.
New "two Armies" Box Set in August with MkII Power Armour and a complete new close combat Dreadnought Pattern.
No Assault or Breacher or otherweise Close Combat Infantry before Summer.
New Terminators of the Indomitus Pattern which can be used for 40k (option for Crux Terminatus on shoulder pads or without them). Seperate Sprue/Box for Close Combat Weapons
New Terminator Praetor with Indomitus Pattern Armour in Plastic, which comes with parts to show chaos influences and could maybe used as a Chaos Lord in 40k. New "two Armies" Box Set in August with MkII Power Armour and a complete new close combat Dreadnought Pattern.
That sounds made-up. The bolded part especially - a chaos lord in 40k ought to be on the upper end of chaosification, while a dual loyalist-traitor kit with some chaosy parts is probably on the lowest possible end. A new Dreadnought pattern is somewhat like the free space in rumour bingo - it's one obvious avenue of expansion that they can take that has appeal for most legions, and currently only 2 of the 3 'classic' RT-era dreads have been updated, so it's a pretty safe guess. New army box in August also messes with the probable course of 40k 10th edition - the edition itself will probably release in June, so one can probably infer that the next couple of months will spotlight Space Marines of some sort and the other army in the starter box, which is supposed to be Tyranids. So we have something improbable, a safe guess and something even more improbable...
New Indomitus Termies for HH2.0? Seeing as Indomitus termies got legended in 2.0, I'm calling BS on that one. There has been rumours about new terminators for 40K though, which sounds much more believable.
tauist wrote: New Indomitus Termies for HH2.0? Seeing as Indomitus termies got legended in 2.0, I'm calling BS on that one. There has been rumours about new terminators for 40K though, which sounds much more believable.
Indomitus Terminators is the one thing HH positively does not need at all, weird rumour.
JWBS wrote: Carving out then sculpting will be the only way to fix that surely, can't be done with paint or they would have done it. It's quite a strange flaw imo I wonder how this happened, it's glaring and offputting, although I didn't notice it at first, I skim read a negative comment then had another look with a critical eye and it immediately jumps out when you know there's something awry without knowing the specifics. Maybe it's a training sculpt or something. Looks very good to me apart from the sleeve, a lot better than most of the one off minis that don't turn out great but which then subsequently get released (like as some sort of limited availability product, guaranteeing sales to the section of the audience who are always susceptible to that technique).
It looks to me as if the arm extending out was meant to have a capping bit for the sleeve.
MajorWesJanson wrote: Well, like 9, and the rest are sprue swaps or can be combined at best.
Unless you add Landspeeders and Fliers. Plastic Storm Eagle/Fire Raptor would do well.
Thanks for correcting an obvious exaggeration. It made it funnier.
I'm honestly hoping for the next announcements to be the Deimos Predator and the Xiphon. Whats even funnier is that you claim it is an exaggeration.
Deimos Vindicator
Vindicator Laser Destroyer
Sabre Strike Tank
Damocles Command Rhino
Sicaran Omega
Sicaran Arcus
Sicaran Punisher
Arquitor Bombard
Arquitor Grav Flux
Arquitor Spicula
Terrax Drill
Legion Basilisk
Legion Medusa
Fellblade
Falchion
Glaive
MajorWesJanson wrote: Well, like 9, and the rest are sprue swaps or can be combined at best.
Unless you add Landspeeders and Fliers. Plastic Storm Eagle/Fire Raptor would do well.
Thanks for correcting an obvious exaggeration. It made it funnier.
I'm honestly hoping for the next announcements to be the Deimos Predator and the Xiphon. Whats even funnier is that you claim it is an exaggeration.
Deimos Vindicator
Vindicator Laser Destroyer
Sabre Strike Tank
Damocles Command Rhino
Sicaran Omega
Sicaran Arcus
Sicaran Punisher
Arquitor Bombard
Arquitor Grav Flux
Arquitor Spicula
Terrax Drill
Legion Basilisk
Legion Medusa
Fellblade
Falchion
Glaive
Is 16 actually.
The Sicaran and Arquitor share a common hull and the sprues are already designed to accommodate the reverse drive positioning so we’re looking at a single half-sprue each for most of those.
The Damocles is literally just the big dish and a more elaborate top hatch so that’s also a single half sprue extra.
The Vindicator variants… the hull mods are more extensive but are common between the two so if they’re sensible that breaks down into a half sprue for the weapon mount and one each for the main gun.
The Sabre and Terrax would be full new kits though, as would the super-heavies so I don’t think they would be happening soon. Though it would be very cool if we got a squadron set of two Sabres in a box of three full sprues.
The Sicaran and Arquitor share a common hull and the sprues are already designed to accommodate the reverse drive positioning so we’re looking at a single half-sprue each for most of those.
The Damocles is literally just the big dish and a more elaborate top hatch so that’s also a single half sprue extra.
The Vindicator variants… the hull mods are more extensive but are common between the two so if they’re sensible that breaks down into a half sprue for the weapon mount and one each for the main gun.
The Sabre and Terrax would be full new kits though, as would the super-heavies so I don’t think they would be happening soon. Though it would be very cool if we got a squadron set of two Sabres in a box of three full sprues.
Vindicator and Las Destroyer ought to be a single kit. Only difference is the gun in the mount. Maybe a single full sprue if they add the dozer blade. Add some hatch stuff and the pintle bolter and they could leave out the normal accessory sprue.
Agreed on the Damocles- extra sprue on top of the rhino.
Sicaran variants would either need a reprint of the topside sprue with the replacement turret, or just a half sprue for the new turret as an add-on for the sicaran kit, giving you 2 full turrets and a price bump.
Arquitor is not the same hull as the Sicaran, but would probably be 2 sprues and share the track sprue from the sicaran. Maybe half sprues for the weapon options
Terrax would be like the Drop pod- 5 segments, so 2 duplicated sprues with 2 panels, and a second unique sprue with the fifth panel and the nose and weapon bits. New kit, but also shared with more than just Astartes- Mechanicus and 40K would get a lot of use out of it as well.
Fellblade and Glaive are just straight turret swaps on top of a superheavy body, could even share a kit like the Kratos options, while Falchion is a more complicated upper hull.
Sabre would be a new kit yes, and I expect Javelins and Land Speeders before it.
No Assault or Breacher or otherweise Close Combat Infantry before Summer.
New Terminators of the Indomitus Pattern which can be used for 40k (option for Crux Terminatus on shoulder pads or without them). Seperate Sprue/Box for Close Combat Weapons
New Terminator Praetor with Indomitus Pattern Armour in Plastic, which comes with parts to show chaos influences and could maybe used as a Chaos Lord in 40k.
New "two Armies" Box Set in August with MkII Power Armour and a complete new close combat Dreadnought Pattern.
A new Terminator kit that follows the prevailing HH2 design philosophy of base kit plus upgrade/alternate sprues would make sense. But I'm definitely filing this rumour under "I want to believe"
Gadzilla666 wrote: Though I must echo Not Online and drbored in wondering just when the rules for Daemons of the Ruinstorm will be released, since those will be needed to fulfill the model's intended use as an Esoterist.
Give 'em time. There's like 16 more tanks they've got to convert to plastic first!
I know that you're just joking, but Daemons of the Ruinstorm and Cults and Militia are rules. I don't see how the model release schedule affects those.
RazorEdge wrote:Found this on Faeit 212
No Assault or Breacher or otherweise Close Combat Infantry before Summer.
New Terminators of the Indomitus Pattern which can be used for 40k (option for Crux Terminatus on shoulder pads or without them). Seperate Sprue/Box for Close Combat Weapons
New Terminator Praetor with Indomitus Pattern Armour in Plastic, which comes with parts to show chaos influences and could maybe used as a Chaos Lord in 40k.
New "two Armies" Box Set in August with MkII Power Armour and a complete new close combat Dreadnought Pattern.
Yeah, a lot of salt. We've already seen the 40k Loyalist Scum vs Chaos box, and it uses the same old Deathwing Terminators that we've had since, 6th edition? (Help me out here DA players). And CSM already have upscaled Indomitus Pattern Terminators, and a perfectly fine Terminator Chaos Lord kit. I find this rumour kinda iffy.
Gadzilla666 wrote: Though I must echo Not Online and drbored in wondering just when the rules for Daemons of the Ruinstorm will be released, since those will be needed to fulfill the model's intended use as an Esoterist.
Give 'em time. There's like 16 more tanks they've got to convert to plastic first!
I know that you're just joking, but Daemons of the Ruinstorm and Cults and Militia are rules. I don't see how the model release schedule affects those.
The current Rumor/Copium floating around is that there's a "Liber Tratoris" book coming with Daemons, Traitor Assassins, and Militia. Similar Loyalty setups as Liber Imperium's Custodes, Sisters, Solar Aux (Loyal, Loyal Either)
Another part is, I suspect, that the FW vehicle moulds are wearing out faster than the infantry ones, based on my experience with FW large kits vs infantry kits and the number of times I’ve found chunks of mould buried in undercuts.
From everything other people have shared over the years, the big FW kits seem to have a pretty high casting failure rate, each unsellable casting uses up a significant volume of resin, and the moulds need remaking all the time. As such their profit margins on something like the old Spartan probably weren't up to the standard they wished.
Seems likely. We've basically hit the end of 40k releases
We still have a good chunk of Guard stuff(new plastic Commissar, Kasrkin, Cadian Castellan, Rough Riders, and Combat Patrol) to release, plus Kill Teams to get solo releases.
YES! Void war bases, finally. Been waiting for these.
And they're even better than I expected with loose bits for filling out the base. Best 40k release in at least a year.
It will make building out bases for my leviathan dreads much easier, and add some variety to the necromunda bases.
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Still not really sold on the jetbikes. Not sure why they copy-pasted over the third model they originally had in picture.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Hmm. Seems this chap is likely to be Thursday’s new model reveal. Whatever he is, he’s the last unconfirmed from the New Years Tease.
It'll be interesting to see some comparisons to the FW jet bikes. I really liked how they seemed huge in comparison to the riders, the new ones look less so since the Marines are larger and the bike seems slightly smaller.
I'm expecting the reason that assassin is last is that they'll pair it with at least SOME information on the Daemons of the Ruinstorm rules... or something.
Dryaktylus wrote: Did they had the plan to release only two per box or what's the reason they just painted two models?
There exist a third Model with a Chainsword.
If it's alternative pose to the pistol guy aka leader wouldn't make sense to show it there too. 2 squad leaders and 1 regular grunt?
Is there even alternative pose for regular guys or is it just one pose you get for regular grunts? Aka apart from bike's gun and paint job is there any way to separate grunt #1 and grunt #2?
Dryaktylus wrote: Did they had the plan to release only two per box or what's the reason they just painted two models?
There exist a third Model with a Chainsword.
If it's alternative pose to the pistol guy aka leader wouldn't make sense to show it there too. 2 squad leaders and 1 regular grunt?
Is there even alternative pose for regular guys or is it just one pose you get for regular grunts? Aka apart from bike's gun and paint job is there any way to separate grunt #1 and grunt #2?
All the models can take volkite and flame pistols, so that doesn't really mark him as a leader.
In that case particularly lazy photoshop job since the chainsword model has been seen so we know all the things needed to show 3 separate models ARE painted
Not even excuse that there might be only 2 actual bikes painted because combining separate photos to one photo is basic job and something GW commonly does anyway.
There is a third model painted, so the safest assumption is that the designer couldn't find where he'd saved the third asset and had to make deadline...
Or at least there's alternative arms painted After all GW is known to not even assemble models fully so they can swap parts. Why paint multiple models when you can paint one body and alternative arms?
But yeah for some reason or another they didn't bother to have 3 different models in the photo. No biggie. We know they are coming in squads of 3 for 50 euro's. Surprpsingly cheap. If I had use for them might get box or two.
tauist wrote: 37,50€ from the usual discounters, assuming they will be able to get their orders in.
I'm assuming the box will be a triplicate affair (1 single sprue x 3), HH 2.0 releases have been super stingy in the unique sprue count dept
Potentially, yeah. Which would be nice, as at least I can now hand swap a Volkite Serpenta.
Maybe even a Chainsword. Imagine that.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
ImAGeek wrote: It’s about what 1 cost in resin isn’t it?
Around that yeah. But I’m conscious of a sort of Forgeworld Pricing Stockholm Syndrome, where any switch from I Can’t Afford That to a lower price point feels potentially misleading.
Crap and over egged example? I’m selling a tin of peas for £100. Clearly far over priced. I could announce a 90% off sale, and there’ll be some folk who can’t see past the discount to the more objective value, which in this example remains a rip off.
Models of course are not peas, so the value has a greater degree of subjective opinion. But hopefully you get what on I’m about.
Another example really of HH pricing generally. Not cheap by any stretch but (relatively speaking....) surprisingly reasonable and a pleasant surprise to an extent.
JimmyWolf87 wrote: Another example really of HH pricing generally. Not cheap by any stretch but (relatively speaking....) surprisingly reasonable and a pleasant surprise to an extent.
As is said before, they offer largely identical units - in mass and general build - in plastic in form of the Custodes Jetbikes, it was clear that they would not deviate too much from their pricepoint.
However, this does mean that the original resin Legion Contemptor Dreadnoughts – which have Legion-specific shoulders, legs, and other details – are not long for this world. They’ll soon be marked as Last Chance to Buy, and after that will disappear for good, so if you want one before the upgrade set becomes available, you’ll need to order it soon.
Didn’t see that coming but I guess we should have; I think I remember someone speculating about this exact thing, more or less, when the plastic Contemptor was first introduced.
Maybe that means legion upgrades for leviathans will be forthcoming too? I know the kits are well set up to accommodate them.
Hmm. Slightly more persuaded to hold one of my three unbuilt Contemptors for now, so I can order the DA sarcophagus, and have that as my Fury of the Ancients HQ.
I’m not normally a fan of resin, let alone plastic/resin hybrids, but these shouldn’t be too tough to assemble.
So we had MKVI upgrades, now we are getting Contemptor upgrades, Leviathan for sure too after that and then they can still do Terminator upgrades so still quite a lot they can show for HH Thursdays
I'm a bit surprised they're moving on to these before spending a few months doing some more legion specific Praetors. Several legions are still missing them, and a couple could charitably do with replacing.
However, this does mean that the original resin Legion Contemptor Dreadnoughts – which have Legion-specific shoulders, legs, and other details – are not long for this world. They’ll soon be marked as Last Chance to Buy, and after that will disappear for good, so if you want one before the upgrade set becomes available, you’ll need to order it soon.
Given these ARE the current resin dread torso with minor changes you cant see to better fit the waist section and maybe backpack, im pretty disapointed. Buying a £42 resin contemptor was expensive but you got either something very unique or if you mixed it with a plastic version, you got 2 dread with unique torso / legs / shoulders. Now you have to buy a plastic dread, throw away the torso and pay presumably £20? for a fancy torso you wont want more than 1 of. Sure its good you can buy it separate, but i think it will work out more expensive per dread.
However, this does mean that the original resin Legion Contemptor Dreadnoughts – which have Legion-specific shoulders, legs, and other details – are not long for this world. They’ll soon be marked as Last Chance to Buy, and after that will disappear for good, so if you want one before the upgrade set becomes available, you’ll need to order it soon.
Given these ARE the current resin dread torso with minor changes you cant see to better fit the waist section and maybe backpack, im pretty disapointed. Buying a £42 resin contemptor was expensive but you got either something very unique or if you mixed it with a plastic version, you got 2 dread with unique torso / legs / shoulders. Now you have to buy a plastic dread, throw away the torso and pay presumably £20? for a fancy torso you wont want more than 1 of. Sure its good you can buy it separate, but i think it will work out more expensive per dread.
At some point they just need to reduce the number of items on offer and/or reach the point where continued sales no longer justify making new masters and production moulds, and the glut of dread-related products is just a very obvious place to start pruning.
stato wrote: Given these ARE the current resin dread torso with minor changes you cant see to better fit the waist section and maybe backpack, im pretty disapointed. Buying a £42 resin contemptor was expensive but you got either something very unique or if you mixed it with a plastic version, you got 2 dread with unique torso / legs / shoulders. Now you have to buy a plastic dread, throw away the torso and pay presumably £20? for a fancy torso you wont want more than 1 of. Sure its good you can buy it separate, but i think it will work out more expensive per dread.
Don't forget, the plastic dread includes the weapons, the resin ones didn't, so that adds a big chunk to the price of the resin ones, so this should work out cheaper. Does seem a shame that it loses a lot of the extra upgrade detail on the shoulders and legs though (though of course, to retain that would mean basically supplying nearly the entire resin dread, which defeats the point of these releases).
I've never been a fan of the Contemptor aesthetic, but that Iron Warriors sarcophagus is making me seriously consider getting one for use as a modern Hellbrute.
stato wrote: Given these ARE the current resin dread torso with minor changes you cant see to better fit the waist section and maybe backpack, im pretty disapointed. Buying a £42 resin contemptor was expensive but you got either something very unique or if you mixed it with a plastic version, you got 2 dread with unique torso / legs / shoulders. Now you have to buy a plastic dread, throw away the torso and pay presumably £20? for a fancy torso you wont want more than 1 of. Sure its good you can buy it separate, but i think it will work out more expensive per dread.
Don't forget, the plastic dread includes the weapons, the resin ones didn't, so that adds a big chunk to the price of the resin ones, so this should work out cheaper. Does seem a shame that it loses a lot of the extra upgrade detail on the shoulders and legs though (though of course, to retain that would mean basically supplying nearly the entire resin dread, which defeats the point of these releases).
The shoulder and leg armour plates are completely separate pieces on the plastic Contemptor. You could be replacing four relatively thin plates instead of four solid chunks.
Well, I already have 3 of the EC dreads (and another 5 of the new ones) so I will pass on this. However, this will eventually be a boon for my buddy and his WB forces...which for now consist of a starter box, Lorgar and a unit of Ashen Circle.
This move to (mostly) plastic was the trigger for him to jump fully into HH. I already told him that when we play all he needs to do is write out his list as "counts as"...I want him to enjoy the games.
Thinking about it, I may get a pair of the new EC ones...only 2 of the new Contemptors are currently built...
What are the odds they’ll rework the shoulder and leg plates as made to order upgrades?
I don’t know the limits of resin or the specifics of the plastic contemptor version, I guess it’s possible resin version of these plates will be too fiddly.
TreeStewges wrote: What are the odds they’ll rework the shoulder and leg plates as made to order upgrades?
I don’t know the limits of resin or the specifics of the plastic contemptor version, I guess it’s possible resin version of these plates will be too fiddly.
The new plastic kit is crazy modular. Here is mine after the sub-build, but before pose/assembly.
Spoiler:
Doing non-torso bits should be well within the technical limits of resin. Would it be financially viable is a whole different story.
I guess another option is for them to just occasionally bring these ‘full bodied’ versions back as made-to-order just like they do torsos and certain shoulder pads.
My main thing is, if these torsos are $23 USD like head and shoulder packs are, then buying the plastic ‘nought, $60 USD, plus the torso is $83 USD.
The ‘full’ ones are currently $65 USD and one of the Contemptor weapon frame packs is $27. Each pack has everything for arm mounting.
Thus the ‘full’ and one pack to make a valid ‘nought is therefore $92 USD. $9 more for a nicer looking ‘nought. Of course, if what you want is double of something or the combo requires both packs. Well doubles will have a similar price difference but the plastic and torso combo works much better if the desired weapon set is across both default frames.
The point of my rambling is that the savings isn’t all that high, for the most part, for a more pose-able ‘nought that doesn’t look as legionified.
Especially since they aren’t selling multiple kinds of torsos and heads like they do infantry so you’ll only want one in general anyway.
Combined with this years price hikes due to everything; it’s looking like they should just say frack it and sell it jumbo upgrade packs.
Torsos, heads, shoulder pads, weapon styles, unit upgrade kits, as well as plates and doors for dreadnoughts, rhino based and land raider based vehicles.
Actually, for rhinos and raiders just make large, decorative gubbinz that fit on flat surfaces so that the decorations work on both rhinos and raiders, both 30k and 40k.
I guess a guy can dream.
Automatically Appended Next Post: EDIT: Oh snap, I almost forgot, thanks for elaborating Nevelon! Those plates do look thick enough for resin to work.
I like that FW is doing upgrade bits for the Contemptors. I'm a little disappointed that it's only the chest piece and not the other pieces (legs, shoulders, etc) as well.
Oh, well. It gives the people who bought the resin ones something to crow about instead of feeling sad and wishing they would have waited.
All we needed was the shoulder/elbow joint.
Or for GW to actually supply the contemptor weapon upgrade sprue.
With this new system, you'll still have to pay for the resin upgrade and a whole contemptor, but if the resin contemptor torso is more than the 27 usd it takes for the weapon upgrade sprue, that'll be a straight downgrade.
em_en_oh_pee wrote: The slow march to Forge World's inevitable phasing out continues.
????
This is an old forgeworld product being replaced by a slightly different forgeworld product.
They are moving as much of each thing over to plastic as possible, it feels like. FW seems less and less relevant. These strike me as at best a middle-ground offering until 30k proves worthwhile to tool out unique plastic upgrades or not, so while yes they are FW, they aren't the whole kits anymore. Overall, I think 30k going to plastic was the death knell for FW.
em_en_oh_pee wrote: Overall, I think 30k going to plastic was the death knell for FW.
I think your prognostication is overly pessimistic. Forge World isn't losing any money here. The 30k range was pretty much finished a while ago, with model sales slowly declining. Switching to plastic is driving new 30k sales that simply aren't there any more for the resin stuff. Forge World also gets to double dip by providing upgrade bits for the new plastic models. I just hope that the 40k models begin switching over to plastic as well. I would LOVE to see a plastic Storm Eagle.
Personally, I think the sculptors are having more fun making characters for Blood Bowl and Necromunda.
em_en_oh_pee wrote: The slow march to Forge World's inevitable phasing out continues.
????
This is an old forgeworld product being replaced by a slightly different forgeworld product.
They are moving as much of each thing over to plastic as possible, it feels like. FW seems less and less relevant. These strike me as at best a middle-ground offering until 30k proves worthwhile to tool out unique plastic upgrades or not, so while yes they are FW, they aren't the whole kits anymore. Overall, I think 30k going to plastic was the death knell for FW.
The 'secret' is FW was never particularly relevant. It was small scale production of premium priced kits for a limited audience.
Of course they want a bigger audience for more sales in a medium that does economy of scale better.
em_en_oh_pee wrote: The slow march to Forge World's inevitable phasing out continues.
????
This is an old forgeworld product being replaced by a slightly different forgeworld product.
They are moving as much of each thing over to plastic as possible, it feels like. FW seems less and less relevant. These strike me as at best a middle-ground offering until 30k proves worthwhile to tool out unique plastic upgrades or not, so while yes they are FW, they aren't the whole kits anymore. Overall, I think 30k going to plastic was the death knell for FW.
I think you misunderstand what FW is and ignore that most of new released 30K products still are FW resin. But the way I see it every plastic set for a specialist game (including HH and lotr) is forgeworld as well, since they're designed by FW and their rules are written by the FW Team.
Additionally, FW is just a subdivision of GW, like Citadel. As long as GW is not going down, FW isn't either.
Gir Spirit Bane wrote: Whilst the IV legion dread is tempting, I just really want Ruinstorm rules so I can actually do some siege of terra themed joint armies!
Considering again, that the whole point of SPECIFICALLY THE TRAITOR ESOTERIST is summoning said ruinstorm daemons.
Yeah, preferentially GW would finally release the sheets for ruinstorm atleast before the esoterist, alas GW gonna GW:
tneva82 wrote: Gw's logic being got to have summoner before summoned units. Literally.
Which would be true, kinda, if it weren't for the fact that list building comes before psi phase
I mean it's not like they sell two products that literally are unusable in the system they were created for, one of which is a massive, expensive character model.
zedmeister wrote: Holy out of stock Batman. Bunch of the contemptors are now temporary out of stock. Didn’t take long…
Considering every Heresy group has been doom and gloom over losing the leg and shoulder details since the announcement, I'm not surprised at the panic buying.
zedmeister wrote: Oh interesting. A single body kit seperate to the jetbikes. Wonder if that allows them to make Outriders or different Marks for the riders.
That would definitely be the smart thing to do!
There's a good amount of future-proofing across the 30k kits, and it gives me hope for what's going to come, but until those things are actually confirmed, all we can do is speculate.
zedmeister wrote: Oh interesting. A single body kit seperate to the jetbikes. Wonder if that allows them to make Outriders or different Marks for the riders.
That would definitely be the smart thing to do!
There's a good amount of future-proofing across the 30k kits, and it gives me hope for what's going to come, but until those things are actually confirmed, all we can do is speculate.
Indeed. I reckon we'll see Javelins switch over. The rules already have them being able to take Volkites and Lascannons in place of the cyclones and the mounts are the universal sponsons used across all vehicles.
zedmeister wrote: Oh interesting. A single body kit seperate to the jetbikes. Wonder if that allows them to make Outriders or different Marks for the riders.
That would definitely be the smart thing to do!
There's a good amount of future-proofing across the 30k kits, and it gives me hope for what's going to come, but until those things are actually confirmed, all we can do is speculate.
Indeed. I reckon we'll see Javelins switch over. The rules already have them being able to take Volkites and Lascannons in place of the cyclones and the mounts are the universal sponsons used across all vehicles.
Javelins could include the sponson sprue and have the missile option on the body sprue as well.
zedmeister wrote: Oh interesting. A single body kit seperate to the jetbikes. Wonder if that allows them to make Outriders or different Marks for the riders.
That would definitely be the smart thing to do!
There's a good amount of future-proofing across the 30k kits, and it gives me hope for what's going to come, but until those things are actually confirmed, all we can do is speculate.
Indeed. I reckon we'll see Javelins switch over. The rules already have them being able to take Volkites and Lascannons in place of the cyclones and the mounts are the universal sponsons used across all vehicles.
Javelins could include the sponson sprue and have the missile option on the body sprue as well.
zedmeister wrote: Oh interesting. A single body kit seperate to the jetbikes. Wonder if that allows them to make Outriders or different Marks for the riders.
That would definitely be the smart thing to do!
There's a good amount of future-proofing across the 30k kits, and it gives me hope for what's going to come, but until those things are actually confirmed, all we can do is speculate.
Indeed. I reckon we'll see Javelins switch over. The rules already have them being able to take Volkites and Lascannons in place of the cyclones and the mounts are the universal sponsons used across all vehicles.
Javelins could include the sponson sprue and have the missile option on the body sprue as well.
zedmeister wrote: Oh interesting. A single body kit seperate to the jetbikes. Wonder if that allows them to make Outriders or different Marks for the riders.
It does seem like it should be possible but the sprue says Scimitar B on it while other multi-use sprues had generic terms like Sponsons or Land Raider on them
But what they could easily do in the future is different armour mks for the riders
zedmeister wrote: Oh interesting. A single body kit seperate to the jetbikes. Wonder if that allows them to make Outriders or different Marks for the riders.
It does seem like it should be possible but the sprue says Scimitar B on it while other multi-use sprues had generic terms like Sponsons or Land Raider on them
But what they could easily do in the future is different armour mks for the riders
A couple of the shared land Raider sprues are labeled as Spartan, so not impossible. Using the same rider sprue for bullock jetbikes or outriders would make sense.
zedmeister wrote: Oh interesting. A single body kit seperate to the jetbikes. Wonder if that allows them to make Outriders or different Marks for the riders.
It does seem like it should be possible but the sprue says Scimitar B on it while other multi-use sprues had generic terms like Sponsons or Land Raider on them
But what they could easily do in the future is different armour mks for the riders
A couple of the shared land Raider sprues are labeled as Spartan, so not impossible. Using the same rider sprue for bullock jetbikes or outriders would make sense.
At least on the Webstore every sprue that is shared between the Proteus and Spartan says Land Raider or is the Tank Assessories sprue but yea it would make sense if they did it I just wouldn't expect it anytime soon this way
em_en_oh_pee wrote: The slow march to Forge World's inevitable phasing out continues.
????
This is an old forgeworld product being replaced by a slightly different forgeworld product.
They are moving as much of each thing over to plastic as possible, it feels like. FW seems less and less relevant. These strike me as at best a middle-ground offering until 30k proves worthwhile to tool out unique plastic upgrades or not, so while yes they are FW, they aren't the whole kits anymore. Overall, I think 30k going to plastic was the death knell for FW.
I think you misunderstand what FW is and ignore that most of new released 30K products still are FW resin. But the way I see it every plastic set for a specialist game (including HH and lotr) is forgeworld as well, since they're designed by FW and their rules are written by the FW Team.
Additionally, FW is just a subdivision of GW, like Citadel. As long as GW is not going down, FW isn't either.
Yes. I think also to add to this if you look at how the plastic model kit market has worked since forever there is a space for both the plastic and resin releases and for them to complement each other. You have the mass-produced plastic kits that sell in the thousands, are cheaper to produce and collect. Then the bespoke resin releases which are much smaller in volume, only ever going to appeal to a smaller subset of collectors and are more expensive. I think there will continue to be lots.of FW releases that are worth their while as a resin release, but would not warrant a new plastic sprue or to be released in that sort of quantity.
hell did you have 3 Contemptors with assault cannons, if you were Sons of Horus? I'm smelling something......
