I take the "buy it all then sell/trade unwanted bits later" approach to these things.
The discount is usually steep enough for it to work out, and the delivery tends to be pre-retail for a lot of parts, so ebaying it can go well, too.
So far I'm fairly happy with the contents, Rampage is filling out nicely.
Apparently the current batch of Frenzy is the last batch, too so if you have any potential interest in it, might be best to park on it on with a second KS account.
scarletsquig wrote: Apparently the current batch of Frenzy is the last batch, too so if you have any potential interest in it, might be best to park on it on with a second KS account.
So... Mantic still hasn't realised that speculative pledges are bad? Front-loading pledges like this is bad, because they will all collapse later in the campaign, after you've screwed yourself with arbitrarily bloated stretch goal thresholds and rob the campaign of its momentum. Front-loading pledges with added value is good because these pledges are far more likely to actually stick.
The way I look at is this: I'll probably spend more money at retail getting this stuff, and I'll have less to show for it. So, might as well Kickstart it now and get a bunch of stuff later. Plus the extra 'freebies' I wind up giving to my buddies - when I got all my Dreadball stuff I wound up giving two teams to my friends so they would start playing and I gave all the "2 extra players" packs to all my friends that all played those teams, etc. So I wound up spending less money than I would have at retail even after getting two of my friends into the game (via free teams) and buffing another handful of friends teams with the extra models and whatnot.
Reevaluating my finances, no money to spare for this, will leave in the 1 or 10 dollar pledge to get digital rulebooks or whatever, if the survey runs long enough I may add later, but I don't feel like paying interest on a credit card to pre-order something, seems economically counter-productive
Still in the wings, hoping for a successful campaign (and then maybe a break until next year, or possibly just one other minor KS or something).
I think my main concern with going in big on this one is the chance that Mantic might do a Deadzone related KS later this year. If I keep my pledge small, I have some room to maneuver, but if I put in for a large pledge I'll effectively lock myself out of participating in a Deadzone expansion KS.
I realize it's unrealistic to expect an answer, but I emailed them to ask about the chances of a Deadzone KS in 2014. I couldn't see them doing Deadzone 2.0, but I could very much imagine a "mini-campaign" to launch four new forces and a smattering of new terrain or something.
Vermonter wrote: I think my main concern with going in big on this one is the chance that Mantic might do a Deadzone related KS later this year. If I keep my pledge small, I have some room to maneuver, but if I put in for a large pledge I'll effectively lock myself out of participating in a Deadzone expansion KS.
I realize it's unrealistic to expect an answer, but I emailed them to ask about the chances of a Deadzone KS in 2014. I couldn't see them doing Deadzone 2.0, but I could very much imagine a "mini-campaign" to launch four new forces and a smattering of new terrain or something.
Yeah... there's gonna be a Warpath LS, and its going to be awesome, and likely have DZ hooks... I can't get a straight answer from anyone officially, but no one poops in my cornflakes when I get loud and excited about hard-plastic, Mantic-priced, vehicles, either. ;-)
AlexHolker wrote: I wish that people who write stupid rules wouldn't make even stupider arguments to defend them. According to Jake Thornton, this is a sport where a Striker is literally allowed to kick a man to death as he lays on the ground, but isn't allowed to shove someone who is on his feet. There is no referee, the throw-in can kill people and the pitch is strewn with explosives but if you're any good at handling the ball it is literally unthinkable that you would shove someone back.
Hmmm, I thought having stat increases on the advance tables was pretty dissociative (in context of DB), but that might just knock it off top spot.
The rebellion continues. Jake Thornton deleted all discussion of the rule and posted a new article excusing it, and then the Mantic mods gave a couple of threadgakkers what they wanted by locking the discussion there and told everyone to only discuss it on Jake's site.
The site that just deleted all discussion on that topic.
What's this nonsense about a Deadzone related kickstarter you mention Vermonter? Just wishful thinking?
Don't toy with my Deadzone radar like that!
I'm finding myself in a similar situation to many of you. It looks like a fun game, but if I go all in now, that's one less game I can get a large chunk of later down the road.
I'm finding a sports game to be a very hard sell to anyone in my family. Barzam won't bite, kids aren't interested, wife laughed and walked away...we have a younger cousin who will play just about anything, but he lives far away and has no transportation of his own.
Deadzone cross compatibility would give me a reason to go in heavy. I wonder if they're saving those big gun type announcements for when Recon, Super Dungeon Explore, or Dwarven Forge all drop (if they all drop soon that is).
highlord tamburlaine wrote: What's this nonsense about a Deadzone related kickstarter you mention Vermonter? Just wishful thinking?
Don't toy with my Deadzone radar like that!
Nothing official, just a paranoid delusion. If Mantic would come out and say, "we're definitely not doing any Deadzone expansions later this year," I'd feel more confident about going in big on this one. It's not realistic to expect that, of course, but in the absence of that certainty, I may have to keep this one small. Don't plan on ditching Rampage, though - too many tasty Warpath universe things coming out of this. Even sponsors used as bystanders or objectives could add a lot of flavor to my Deadzone games.
Ouch! I can imagine that one. "It'll be really great, honey! I'll pit my team of shark men against your team of space elf supermodels in a dark and gritty urban future. They have these awesome MVPs too, including a guy who's so crazy he wears a necklace made from his dead wife's hair! Yeah, he went nuts and killed her, and now he kills other people in illegal backstreet matches and the fans love it! Isn't that just crazy? Wait, where are you going?"
highlord tamburlaine wrote: Deadzone cross compatibility would give me a reason to go in heavy. I wonder if they're saving those big gun type announcements for when Recon, Super Dungeon Explore, or Dwarven Forge all drop (if they all drop soon that is).
I think they'd rather not bother with Deadzone cross compatibility; one of them responded to me in the comments somewhere that they wouldn't be doing it. I think the longer the KS drags, the more likely they'll be to rethink that decision. At the moment I'd read a major reversal on Deadzone compatibility as a sign of desperation.
I thought this would do worse than Deadzone and better than Mars Attacks, but while both are being borne out, it's falling lower within that spectrum than I expected. Right now I'm not seeing how this KS will break a million, particularly since Mantic just did a pretty significant piece of damage control with the 2 free Rampage teams, and they have a popular MVP design as the current stretch goal, and nothing much has changed. If pledge levels stay about the same until the end, even if Mantic makes as much on their final day as they did on their first, they will fall well short of a million.
Not that they need to make a million, of course. Mars Attacks was a great deal at about half that. But it probably would mean that early talk of a possible 16 new teams instead of twelve would become pie in the sky.
AlexHolker wrote: I wish that people who write stupid rules wouldn't make even stupider arguments to defend them. According to Jake Thornton, this is a sport where a Striker is literally allowed to kick a man to death as he lays on the ground, but isn't allowed to shove someone who is on his feet. There is no referee, the throw-in can kill people and the pitch is strewn with explosives but if you're any good at handling the ball it is literally unthinkable that you would shove someone back.
Hmmm, I thought having stat increases on the advance tables was pretty dissociative (in context of DB), but that might just knock it off top spot.
The rebellion continues. Jake Thornton deleted all discussion of the rule and posted a new article excusing it, and then the Mantic mods gave a couple of threadgakkers what they wanted by locking the discussion there and told everyone to only discuss it on Jake's site.
The site that just deleted all discussion on that topic.
Yeah I read it.....score a victory for circular reasoning, ad hominem and false analogies.
Speaking of Deadzone and Dreadball compatibility, I was thinking it could be an awesome 4 player game to have a Dreadball game running inside a Deadzone battle. Have defence of the game the mission of the enforcers, and the plague, marauders, whatever, attacking and getting points for killing players.
Doubt there would be much crossover between the 2 sub games, but it could be great fun imo. Could be a mission in a campaign with big rewards depending on who wins. Rebel attackers winning would get their message across, enforcers winning would get a huge image improvement etc.
Yonan wrote: I may be missing sarcasm (wrong smiley in that case!!) but a bookmarked pdf - or depending on game, bunch of pdfs - is so much quicker than hard copy even on my antiquated first gen ipad.
Sorry for off topic, but I disagree entirely. I can flip to any particular page before you even hit the Bookmarks tab every time. If we're not sure exactly what page we need, I can flip through a dozen pages way faster than any device will turn them. Let's not even talk about loading multiple pdfs, that's hilarious.
The only instance where digitized reference material beats paper is in the case of such disastrous layouts (Spartan Games books, for example) that you need a Search function to ever find anything.
lord_blackfang wrote: Sorry for off topic, but I disagree entirely. I can flip to any particular page before you even hit the Bookmarks tab every time. If we're not sure exactly what page we need, I can flip through a dozen pages way faster than any device will turn them. Let's not even talk about loading multiple pdfs, that's hilarious.
The only instance where digitized reference material beats paper is in the case of such disastrous layouts (Spartan Games books, for example) that you need a Search function to ever find anything.
Given Mantic is releasing rules digitally, I think I can slightly continue this conversation without it being *too* off topic.
A single click will take you exactly to the section or page you need. 2 clicks will take you to the exact page you need in one of the other 5 books you have open. Not roughly to the area, exactly to the page since it's bookmarked. Properly bookmarked pdfs are an awesome tool. I'd like to see you get exactly to the spot you need with your hard copy (click it!) faster than I can with this codex, this supplement, and this BRB open in tabs on my tablet, or even better a laptop. If you prefer the feel of hard copy sure, that's subjective and perfectly understandable. But digital is objectively faster to access when setup correctly as with the pdfs I linked. Not to mention, I have your codex on it too and can have it open before the game begins to quickly check to make sure if your HQ really has a rerollable 2++, and the FAQ to clarify that no, your stealth suit can't just be a blank base etc ; p Once I bookmarked my (totally legitimately bought books, which I scanned myself to be in compliance with Australian law) pdfs, accessing information became so much faster for me, both on PC and when playing games.
When your pdfs aren't bookmarked I'd say it's maybe a wash, or probably even faster with physical books as you can "see" multiple pages as your're flipping through, in non-bookmarked pdfs you're relying on page number alone. It enrages me that the Mantic Deadzone digital rulebook isn't bookmarked, and is locked down so I can't add them in myself. That reminds me, I need to message them about that again. *grumbles incoherrently*
MVP stretch goals don't appeal to me or the rule books in paper.
you cant use mvps in one offs or tournaments and they would be making a rule book anyway? I don't own a tablet and when I'm playing a board game i don't want to have to use a laptop.
Yonan wrote: Speaking of Deadzone and Dreadball compatibility, I was thinking it could be an awesome 4 player game to have a Dreadball game running inside a Deadzone battle. Have defence of the game the mission of the enforcers, and the plague, marauders, whatever, attacking and getting points for killing players.
Doubt there would be much crossover between the 2 sub games, but it could be great fun imo. Could be a mission in a campaign with big rewards depending on who wins. Rebel attackers winning would get their message across, enforcers winning would get a huge image improvement etc.
Kind of similar to something I read on another forum - someone building a true to scale Emperor Titan was planning to play Apoc with it, and simultaneously run a game of Kill Team within the cathedral on top, and what happened in the kill team battle impacted the Titan's fighting abiity, while regular spacemans on the apoc ground could shoot at kill team spacemans from the ground if they got a shot.
Looks like it's going to be the 5th or 6th before they unlock their fifth team. $154,000 are tied up in 420 Frenzy pledges right now, and Mantic's in danger of losing them all if they don't start doing things smarter.
AlexHolker wrote: I wish that people who write stupid rules wouldn't make even stupider arguments to defend them. According to Jake Thornton, this is a sport where a Striker is literally allowed to kick a man to death as he lays on the ground, but isn't allowed to shove someone who is on his feet. There is no referee, the throw-in can kill people and the pitch is strewn with explosives but if you're any good at handling the ball it is literally unthinkable that you would shove someone back.
Hmmm, I thought having stat increases on the advance tables was pretty dissociative (in context of DB), but that might just knock it off top spot.
The rebellion continues. Jake Thornton deleted all discussion of the rule and posted a new article excusing it, and then the Mantic mods gave a couple of threadgakkers what they wanted by locking the discussion there and told everyone to only discuss it on Jake's site.
The site that just deleted all discussion on that topic.
That's not very encouraging all.
In fact, it is poor form - what was the reasoning given for the delete and re-boot?
AlexHolker wrote: Looks like it's going to be the 5th or 6th before they unlock their fifth team. $154,000 are tied up in 420 Frenzy pledges right now, and Mantic's in danger of losing them all if they don't start doing things smarter.
This project is going to hit a back slide at some point it's inevitable the way Mantic have set it up with the speculative Frenzy pledge and they clearly haven't learnt from Mars Attacks. I've backed at EB rampage on my main account $160 currently gets me all 4 season 4 teams (8 man Teams will do just fine for now) and The Brokkr team I really want (if/when it unlocks) plus $10 for Weiss. Add to that a free Season 6 team if it gets that far and I might put another $30 for 2 other 8 man teams so that's 8 teams. The Crystallans and potential Hobgoblin teams don't really interest me so I can pass on them. I do want a few extra scenery sprues which I have to pay for either way so I think $200 up to $250 and I'm good to go on this.
I also have an EB Frenzy parked on my second account just in case it becomes insane value. That's $360 that isn't real money for this project even if I do opt for it right at the end the other account losses $200. Is it right that it's set up like that not really but that's how Mantic have choosen to do and I have no problem "playing the game" for my own benefit.
They should make that obvious fa backers somewhere. Gonna a skip it in either case, dropped ma back To my pledge with little overage and this down to a dollar. Hopefully the backslide is mild, better its s shorter campaign.
Alpharius wrote: In fact, it is poor form - what was the reasoning given for the delete and re-boot?
The stated reasoning is "To try and keep things sane(ish) I will delete comments once they’ve been incorporated into the digital rules, discussed in an article, or added to any FAQ below."
Funny thing is the people complaining backed both and could still have edited their MA pledge manager to save the $5 instead of everyone having to pay $5 more now. Anyway it pushes the $20 cost from the MA survey down to the DBX survey so it saves me spending some money this month.
and to be a bit more constructive in my posts
Update #21
Mar 2 2014
Let's Talk Material!
19 comments
4 likes
We are over a third of the way there to locking in Brute Force – dare we imagine a third stretch goal broken in three days?
Today we’re going to talk plastics – well, Ronnie and James are going to talk plastics:
As you know, we’re using a different kind of plastic for DreadBall Xtreme, and the miniatures – with the exceptions of the Kovossian Mutants Plague and Mechanites team – are all coming preassembled to truly get you gaming straight away.
Over on the Mars Attacks Kickstarter we've just previewed a painted production Martian, which we’ve included below just so you can see how fantastic the detail on the Xtreme figures is going to be. Every line is crisp, and the detail on the face is incredible:
Pretty cool huh? Let us know what you think in the comments!
Oo, and whilst we’re on a Mars Attacsk theme, some of you have asked if the Martian DreadBall team will have rules to use in Xtreme. The answer is of course yes!
Xtreme Quirkworthy
Games Designer Jake Thornton has been busy beavering away on a number of articles covering topics that frequently came up after the Beta rules were released. You can give them a read here:
- What’s the difference between DreadBall and DreadBall Xtreme?
- Why Strikers can’t slam
- Why 4 actions not 5
We want to know your thoughts and opinions – let us know what you think in the comments. Tried the beta? Why not tell us about your games as well!
Oh, and Jake has done an interview with Starburst which you can read here!
Alpharius wrote: In fact, it is poor form - what was the reasoning given for the delete and re-boot?
The stated reasoning is "To try and keep things sane(ish) I will delete comments once they’ve been incorporated into the digital rules, discussed in an article, or added to any FAQ below."
Reading the comments on that post and Jake's replies to them (replying to issues with the matter) really doesn't give one a great deal of confidence. One thing I noticed was someone (Rob Clarke) offhanded said "My group Hasplays[sic] upwards of 20 games a month for the last 6 months and I don’t think it has ever happened." That is, a fairly general, vague statement about not recalling something happening in their personal recollection.
Jake apparently takes that offhand remark and repeats it like a clinical study was done, as it morphs into "120+ games and never used? Surely that is a darling that needs murdering."
If you don't want to change something, don't change it. Don't grab an offhand comment like that and put the UL seal on it.
As for the main issues, I snagged an EB and am pondering dropping it. It occurs (somewhat cynically) that the dark Astarian team is the most visually interesting one we are likely to see (personal opinion, of course), which may just be why they put it forth so very prominently in their ads...
Interesting - the Asterian team is the one I'm least happy to be saddled with.
Mantic have just done a "Rampage offensive," and as far as keeping me in the game goes, it worked. I think it's pretty clear that they'll need to do a "Frenzy offensive" soon if they want to prevent a mid-campaign backslide. Things just aren't progressing quickly enough to keep Frenzy backers from getting nervous. True, it could all turn around in the end and be an incredible deal, but that's not really the way human psychology works, which is why Frenzy style pledges are treacherous beasts.
As with Mars Attacks, it feels to me like Mantic started with a bang and got over-confident. If our first day was that good, we'd better play this safe and really stretch this out so we don't end up beholden to making 40 teams! So they make the stretch goals from team to team wide apart, and then they pad that out with extra ones on top (new sculpts stretch goals, for example) that should have been included in the first place. Then after the early birds are gone progress slows to a crawl and those wide apart stretch goals look less and less attainable. Then people start abandoning ship, and they have to recalibrate.
Seems like it would be much easier to bring stretch goal levels down to a more modest rate in the first place. Not every KS is going to be as popular as Deadzone or Warpath; some products have a smaller niche. It might have looked like Deadzone Xtreme's niche would be even larger than Deadzone's based on the first day or so, but since then it has been shown to be otherwise.
DaveC wrote: EDIT: Never mind Mantic made an error on the image in the email about the MA Dreadball team.
Was the mistake the price?
Yep they put $15 on it like all the DBX teams whether by mistake or they just plain forgot what they charged before but a few people complained about it being cheaper so now it's $20.
The $15 DBX teams are what the DB teams should cost. I suspect the MA $20 team was mantic pulling a number out of their ass during the KS and they have since realized that can release an 8 figure team (three sculpts) for less.
But since they called it $20 during the MAKS now they're going back to that rather than admit it was too high.
Vermonter wrote: Not every KS is going to be as popular as Deadzone or Warpath; some products have a smaller niche. It might have looked like Deadzone Xtreme's niche would be even larger than Deadzone's based on the first day or so, but since then it has been shown to be otherwise.
It would have been so easy to double the size of that niche. All they needed to do was include extra arms with weapons and not pre-assemble them. People could then build unarmed gangers for Dreadball Xtreme, or armed gangers for Necromunda.
A bit of an odd question: have there been any photos of the Asterians from behind? While it should go without saying that Mantic wouldn't forget that people have glutes, none of the pictures I've seen actually show any indication that they haven't.
Not for the $15 mini team price, or do you expect them to throw extra prones in at that price point? 15 seems as generous as they've gone with those prices (other than bogo, which they've said they won't be doing afaik).
The teams graphics might not list prones but the Prone update #5 says they are included with just the teams as well the boxed game
If we hit this stretch goal, we will produce the Convict and Asterian Prone Figures and add 2 to every Convict and Asterian Team, including those in the Boxed Game in pledges of Fury ($75) and up!
This means that whether you’re pledging for just a team, or a pledge that includes the Boxed Game, you’ll get these wonderfully characterful pieces!
That said only the original 2 teams have prones so far.
I thought I read there were not going to be boosters for the DBX teams. If that is the case (but at my age my memory is going so it may not be) then I would expect the prone figures to be included in with the main team. The alternate poses should be in for sure.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
DaveC wrote: The teams graphics might not list prones but the Prone update #5 says they are included with just the teams as well the boxed game
If we hit this stretch goal, we will produce the Convict and Asterian Prone Figures and add 2 to every Convict and Asterian Team, including those in the Boxed Game in pledges of Fury ($75) and up!
This means that whether you’re pledging for just a team, or a pledge that includes the Boxed Game, you’ll get these wonderfully characterful pieces!
That said only the original 2 teams have prones so far.
So far. But you know darn well Mantic has them planned for all the teams.
Yep prones and keepers - well for teams that have guards at least they really do have a lot to fit in as well as another 7 teams! (well actually 8 as Brokkrs are still locked)
CptJake wrote: The $15 DBX teams are what the DB teams should cost. I suspect the MA $20 team was mantic pulling a number out of their ass during the KS and they have since realized that can release an 8 figure team (three sculpts) for less.
But since they called it $20 during the MAKS now they're going back to that rather than admit it was too high.
That's my feeling on it. For $15, I would have bought them, as well as the robots, plague and free agents. For $20, I didn't even consider it. Maybe I'll even get lucky and get them cheaper from Miniature Market next Black Friday.
I'm sure Mantic would prefer to sell a bunch of teams for less profit, with the chance for add on sales down the road, than sell a few to the die-hards for more profit.
It's kind of a shame that Mantic gave them uniforms designed to show gratuitous skin and then chickened out of making the skin titillating, offending people who don't go for T-and-A while boring the people who do. There's a joke in there somewhere about Mantic half-assing it, but all I really need to say is almost.
I hate you so much right now, Bob. One, you got that song stuck in my head. Two, now I really want a Kingdom Death-based DreadBall team. Heck the worst violence violence of the pitch would be "Tuesday" in that world...
On other matters, the Early Bird thing is going to hurt Mantic in the long run here. They really need to find another way to encourage people to back early because multiple EB levels just makes people camp out on various levels using multiple accounts. As DaveC said, this will inevitably lead to a backslide at some point. They probably should have just priced Frenzy using the Rampage EB pricing and left it alone, similar to how Suppression Team in DeadZone was basically the EB Strike Team price per box. I know there's a keen interest in getting early pledges, but I just don't think EBs is really working out.
That said, I'll be sitting on my EB Frenzy until at least the 25th of March. I love the idea of the pledge because it's exactly what I would have ended up doing anyway (i.e. - buy everything), I just don't think the limited/time-sensitive aspects of it are going to work out that well.
That's my feeling on it. For $15, I would have bought them, as well as the robots, plague and free agents. For $20, I didn't even consider it. Maybe I'll even get lucky and get them cheaper from Miniature Market next Black Friday.
I'm sure Mantic would prefer to sell a bunch of teams for less profit, with the chance for add on sales down the road, than sell a few to the die-hards for more profit.
I am sure Mantic would be with you. Unfortunately, the "fans" disagreed and demanded a higher price.
And Mantic has seen enough Kickstarter that they'd rather sell a few miniatures less than risk turning the fickle mood of their Kickstarter-backers against them, as has happend to some other Kickstarters.
scarletsquig wrote: It isn't the first time that people have complained about Mantic lowering the price of something, I've seen it happen a lot.
I think it is a part of the "Kickstarter-exclusive" thing.
People expect the prices they "pay" on Kickstarter (in this case Mars Attacks) to be the lowest ever, just like the (used to) expect Kickstarter-exclusive miniatures to be never on sale elsewhere (hence most pro-Kickstarters now put in carefully worded phrases about being "allowed" to use even Kickstarter-exclusives on events, etc.., as if they'd needed the Backer's permission).
The implicit Kickstarter-deal is broken, if somebody somewhere gets a "better deal" than you on Kickstarter, or an exclusive mini that you thought was not for them to have.
scarletsquig wrote: It isn't the first time that people have complained about Mantic lowering the price of something, I've seen it happen a lot.
To be fair, this is a feth up on Mantic's part. I could care less about them lowering a price, that is a GOOD thing. But today, the MA pledges are still open with the Martian team at $20. To offer them during another KS at the same time for $5 less was stupid and a kick to the groin to anyone who already did their MA pledge manager. Selling something at two different prices at the same time isn't a good move, especially if the higher price is the folks who funded the damned product development.
The implicit Kickstarter-deal is broken, if somebody somewhere gets a "better deal" than you on Kickstarter, or an exclusive mini that you thought was not for them to have.
In Bones 1, they had 2 elementals (which were 30$+ in metal) for 15$ for rock/tree elementals.
When bones hit retail, each elemental was like 5.95$ and easily obtainable for a further discount.
People flipped their gak like I have never seen over the KS price being higher than 'elsewhere'.
Do we still think that the original Dreadball game board will be done on the mousemat material at some point? That's really the only thing I want to add on to my pledge.
I posted a little rant earlier about Mantic setting stretch goals too far apart. Fortunately, none of you handed my butt to me and I was able to figure out the following on my own:
Stretch goals for MVPs, formerly $15,000, are now $10,000.
Stretch goals for teams, formerly $25,000, are now $20,000.
Maybe this is common knowledge - I'm far from the most observant poster here - but I didn't see it remarked upon. Anyhow, good sign that Mantic are adjusting their strategy.
Riquende wrote: Either that or they're holding back the announcement for the 'slump' to gain a bit of fresh momentum.
They're in the slump. At the rate they're going they're only going to have six teams unlocked by the time they hit the last stretch, and if that happens, it's game over.
Fair enough. I pledged on day one and I don't follow the day-to-day progress of such projects, just check back on the last weekend to adjust the pledge.
I just know that I'm getting projects updates every day or so so I figured progress was still being made.
Here's the daily data. At $50k per team, ~$7k per day only gives one team per week. This would be survivable, if Mantic hadn't been pre-selling their pre-orders with things like Early Birds and limited availability Frenzy slots. It's kind of like a miniature version of the GFC, with derivatives of derivatives forming an increasingly fragile foundation for the stability of your plans.
Mars Attacks had a ton of $5k stretch goals on the last day giving out free stuff, in fact most of the freebies at the $150 level were added in the last 3 days.
It would be kinda nice if the next lot of stretches up to $500k focused on getting 3 new teams + a few other bits sorted, those Frenzy pledges really do need filling up with minis.
I think Mantic can fund another 4 teams on the last day, but ideally they'll want to go into it with 8 already sorted.
Interesting to note that this KS has an upper cap on the number of backers, there are 3000 Rampage levels in total, and 700 Frenzy levels. Might be possible that they wanted to keep the print run down to 5000 copies.
They only added that Rampage limit in the last few days - although I recall that they added a similar limit for the first Dreadball when it proved to be incredibly popular, adding in later-shipping waves when the first one filled. Of course, that Kickstarter didn't have multiple EBs/limited-slot levels to camp!
Regarding what to focus on: it's an interesting one. Teams are by far the easiest way to pump up the value of Frenzy - another 16-20 models being added each time. MVPs/Free Agents are cheap enough to produce to add to the lower levels for free, but too many of those and Frenzy ceases to look attractive. Stuff outside either category (tokens, additional scenery, original Dreadball board in mousemat form etc.) will add value to Frenzy, but won't lead to nearly as much money added-on to the lower levels.
And of course, Kickstarter aside, it's important to consider what to prioritise for retail! The more teams you have, the more attractive the game as a whole becomes, but people might only buy 1-2 teams each and the profit margin is lower on these boxes vs. individual blisters. MVPs and fancy accessories are where I imagine there's a ton of profit to be made (almost any team can use them, they retail for proportionately more) but I think the game looks a bit 'diluted' if there's too many of them vs. the number of teams.
The bonus to Rampage has the added (unintended) effect of making Frenzy look a bit worse in comparison.
If we do get to 12 teams, you'll now be able to go Rampage + 6 six teams to get all the teams for $240 pledged.
Okay, not 16 mini teams, but you might not need them, or might choose to not get some teams and double up on your favourite ones instead, there's some flexibility there rather than a mass-spend to get everything in the entire range.
The $200-$250 level really is where most backers end up at, the $150 level + a few add-ons they like.
I'm surprised Mantic didn't experiment with a $225 or $250 level, it would have been much easier to fill up than Frenzy.
Frenzy is seeming more and more like Rampage + fixed add-on bundle with small discount stacked on top, rather than "Triple Rampage". I'm fairly certain they'll fill up their 700 slots, but I can't see anyone who is carefully doing the math on this rather than "click and forget" wanting to stay on there.
I'll most likely stay in, but only because the £ is nice and high against the dollar currently, £82 for my EB Rampage is not bad at all and doesn't make a murderous dent in the bank account. Then when it arrives I can sell off bits and pieces of it until I've reduced the total wallet hit down to £50 or so. Not bad for a game.
And of course, I got into Mars Attacks for a paltry £10 investment for a ton of stuff (spent the bulk of the credit on battlezones which I was going to add on the DZ survey/ buy retail anyway), then added the $50 expansion and a couple of KS exclusives to hit $200 and qualify for the free hardback).
There is a lot to be said for the value of these things as long as you play them smartly, see where the 60-70% discounts are happening and focus on them, then sell off unwanted parts on arrival to recoup some of the spend.
I'll stay in at EB Rampage for 6+ teams (don't mind "mini-teams"), MVPs, and Giants, all of which I can work into Deadzone or Warpath in one way or another. True, I don't care overmuch for the bundled Asterians, but I didn't care for the bundled Marauders or 3rd Gen Plague or Mars Attacks survivor faction either, and those all ended up being good deals anyway. And hey, this game may actually end up being good, too! This campaign has no credit system, so it's not going to turn into another Mars Attacks opportunity to back one game while spending your pledge money on another, but there's enough here to like that I that I'm not too bothered by that.
What I'd really like to see is a free Dreadball Xtreme hardback compendium given out to backers pledging at least $200, as they did for Mars Attacks, in which case I'd raise my pledge accordingly.
I never wanted to go in for Frenzy and don't see it happening, but I hope Mantic go on a Frenzy blitz soon for the good of the campaign. I agree with Alex - they'll need to deliver on at least 12 teams if they want to avoid a meltdown on the last day.
I, too, see no reason for frenzy. It seems like a waste, at the moment. I went in for an EB rampage, knowing I can pull the pledge if I need/want later, and I'm not sure yet if I am even staying in at this point. I guess we'll see, I just don't think the value is there for me yet.
Well on the plus side, they've confirmed that the Sphyr will be getting a giant for their team, and we've got some add ons coming in the very near future.
You gotta work a bit harder to make me want to spend my money Mantic! Snap to it!
I'd say all they need to do is make these actual things instead of keeping us in the dark and just saying we'll get there.
If they don't get the value up and hit more teams BEFORE the last day, the backslide before hand will kill any momentum they hope to have for a finishing rush.
Time for everyone sitting on both Early Birds to start dropping out, maybe the backslide will make Mantic panic enough to start just throwing freebies at people. It's worked every time so far!
So it looks like Season 5s teams are Brokkrs, Crystallans. Rebs and Syphrs if I interpret Mantics post correctly - Ronnie did previously mention Rebs at $500k but I can't see them stringing out Season 5 for another $125k the way it's currently going,
That prison dz terrain set up in the latest update is pretty interesting. Curious as to how many sprues/bzs are in it, the aw components are liable to drive up the price/ lower the quantity of stuff included for the price... but they do good work and the whole point of it is to be an aesthetic upgrade.
Wonder if people jump on it. Certainly not frenzy backers, uneless they drop down or something.
This will require assembly – a degree of modeling skill is most certainly required – and comes complete with a set of resin antennociti accessories, a 2’x2’ single piece MDF pitch, acrylic doors, as well as a loads of scenery sprues (roughly 3 Battlezones - 12 sprues plus connectors and accessory sprues - worth for the Deadzone connoisseurs out there!) so that you can build something similar!
3 Bzs for 175 huh? And the MDF pitch, and the AW stuff. Wonder if the BZs are in that set as KS prices or their $40 retail. Trying to discern how much weight the AW bits are pulling. I'm sure the value is there, just dissecting it.
Not seeing it myself at KS prices 3 BZ = $75 MDF pitch = $25 and probably $25 worth of AW stuff, Acrylic doors $? depends on the Acrylic and Courier shipping $15. Think that's about $150 worth. At 4 BZ it might be on the money.
There's a lot of profit in that set for them given it's all pretty much made already and they are paying for raw materials only for the BZ. But they can't price it cheaper than previous KS prices or there will be complaints
The dice aren't exactly what Fenzy backers are looking for value wise either.
Automatically Appended Next Post: They might do the Acrylic doors as a separte add on for those who already have the BZs.
Acrylic doors may look nice, but I suspect they don't add to the game and in fact may make figure placement more of a hassle, and mess with LOS determination.
Well yeah I dunno if they're really meant to be particularly useful. I believe in the picture they're blocking prison cells, so those guys probably don't get to come out while the game is on (if the cells are even occupied to begin with, their contents may be all out on the field). What they will do, is look nice. A sweet option for replacing/swapping with the doors that already come on core worlds sprues.
Could have a different in-game use for games like deadzone, or other games that you're using your DZ scenery with too, normal door can be picked, force field has to be shorted or hacked, force field door permits bodies but not bullets, normal door has to be opened first etc.
I don't disagree that they'd be fiddly and potentially more trouble than they're worth, but personally, I would quite like to have some for various purposes. And scratch making them myself, I'm bad at cutting nice shapes out, even with stencils and sharp blades, forget it.
Oh lordy windows too, I would definitely have to dig up some cash for the survey then, things like that push me even further away from spending anything on the actual DBX stuff though
:Mildly Irritated Face: Looks like they have time to ask me why I lowered my DBX pledge, and respond after I got back to them, but not time to reply to a query about my DZ invoice and if they needed me to fill out another missing parts form. =/
:Mildly Irritated Face: Looks like they have time to ask me why I lowered my DBX pledge, and respond after I got back to them, but not time to reply to a query about my DZ invoice and if they needed me to fill out another missing parts form. =/
So now to get a valid customer service response from Mantic: Pledge their newest KS to the tune of 500$, then a few days alter pull that pledge and then they will look into your issues! Brilliant!
GrimDork wrote: Oh lordy windows too, I would definitely have to dig up some cash for the survey then, things like that push me even further away from spending anything on the actual DBX stuff though
:Mildly Irritated Face: Looks like they have time to ask me why I lowered my DBX pledge, and respond after I got back to them, but not time to reply to a query about my DZ invoice and if they needed me to fill out another missing parts form. =/
Wow. They contacted you personally to ask why you lowered your pledge? I hope you added the DZ issues in your reply to help them connect the dots. (even if they weren't 100% related).
The first message could easily have been automated, and I assume it was. The second wasn't particularly specific, but less likely to be automated.
My MA survey did finally return a summary, so there's something I don't have to worry about (having filled it out right, not having it fulfilled, will be quickdrawing the phone/email/ks messages if I don't have shipping information that changes like it's supposed to when everyone else is getting theirs )
@Azazelx, I didn't in the first reply, but I did after you made it sound like such a good idea Probably won't open it now they've got their answer though.
So yesterday's update went down like a lead ballon -4 backers today -$727 and lost 8 Frenzy pledges hopefully they can rally later today needs an update to reassure Frenzy backers or the backslide will have begun.
DaveC wrote: So yesterday's update went down like a lead ballon -4 backers today -$727 and lost 8 Frenzy pledges hopefully they can rally later today needs an update to reassure Frenzy backers or the backslide will have begun.
Not reassure, reward. It should not be taking this long to unlock teams, so they should just go "You know what? Space shark men are in! Please don't leave me."
AlexHolker wrote: Not reassure, reward. It should not be taking this long to unlock teams
I was wondering about this. Mantic said "Frenzy" was modeled after "Minecart" from that Cthulhu meets Westerns game. But what was "Minecart" actually like? Why did it succeed? Did the stretch goals come a lot faster? Why did people perceive "Minecart" as a bonanza in a way that they obviously aren't doing for "Frenzy"? I'm talking specifically about the mid-game pricing / rewards / customer perceptions that made "Minecart" a bonanza by the end of the campaign, not the actual deal it became by the end of the KS campaign. Curious what anyone better informed about that campaign than I am thinks. Did it have lots of $5,000 stretch goals or something? If it's a simple case of "Stretch goals still cost a lot more for Frenzy than they did for Minecart," then Mantic didn't quite do their homework as thoroughly as they should have.
If I recall correctly (and I may not) Minecart initially included a lot of add ons that were listed up front, and as more were listed/unlocked it just became better.
For Frenzy we are supposed to assume as of yet unknown goals will be met, and that these goals will increase the value of the pledge to the point the money pledged seems reasonable or even a good value.
Right now, it is not there though I am promised it will be. At the same time, I can see that Rampage gets me what I am really after at this point especially concerning the goals already announced and achieved.
Shadows of Brimstone (the minecart creator) had really close stretch goals for a long time, and things were constantly being added to the mine cart up until the very last day.
Mantic's not giving enough reason to stay up at that price range still. With the minecart, it was there from day one. There was no possibility of it being a good deal. It was from the very first moment the KS went live.
The later, more expensive levels fought a bit of a battle, but again, they were completely offset by the amount of stuff you got, plus an extra 75 credit to spend in the pledge manager as well.
I am still surprised that they have not gone the Deadzone crossover route to generate some extra backers and cash. One thing that comes to mind is the possible scale difference, my recollections of the few Dreadball minis I have seen is that they are quite small.
It also seems a weird time for the total to be going backwards. I think this was timed so that most people got paid during the mid-point of the campaign to provide it with a cash boost during the traditional slowing point of your average KS but that extra income has not come in.
Well, Mantic could have done $100k to fund, then another $250k for 10 teams if they really wanted to have Frenzy fully decked out at the $350k mark, and then from there have a solid base to do all the MVPS, alt sculpts, prones, sponsors etc. for the rest of the campaign.
The error was getting a little too excited on day 1.
At the moment, it looks like it'll roughly match the original DB KS in terms of final total. It'll limp its way to $500k over the next 9 days, then another $250k in the last few days.
scarletsquig wrote: Well, Mantic could have done $100k to fund, then another $250k for 10 teams if they really wanted to have Frenzy fully decked out at the $350k mark, and then from there have a solid base to do all the MVPS, alt sculpts, prones, sponsors etc. for the rest of the campaign.
The error was getting a little too excited on day 1.
At the moment, it looks like it'll roughly match the original DB KS in terms of final total. It'll limp its way to $500k over the next 9 days, then another $250k in the last few days.
That's a pretty good estimate, but I'm still cautious about it as I just think they're going to have to add a bunch of artificial goals that don't have to be stretched to get people backing Frenzy. Right now I believe it still doesn't even break even as far as what you're paying in, still.
If they don't get more teams and value going into the last day then they will be dependent on their limited supply of rampages and ad-ons to get a high last day total and in that case I just don't see that being enough to make Frenzy the same value as Rampage.
I'll stick with it. I mean I have until the last day to decide, but I honestly think Rampage is where a lot of people from Frenzy will end up in the end.
Have Mantic mentioned why they included convicts and asterians in the starter?
I have to be honest I'm likely to drop out at this point, I have zero interest in any of the teams and it feels ridiculous to be pledging in the hope they might reach the goal and release a team I like.
^ Not quite sure, but they're actually my least favourite out of all the teams so far.
I love the look of all the season 5 teams, really tough decision to pick the freebie there.
New update has worked nicely, +$3k in the space of a few minutes. If they can clear out all the Frenzies by Sunday then they'll have at least another $100k of funding sorted.
I think I may be the only person who likes the Convict team.
This update is pretty huge and very much needed. It was getting hard to watch the pledge amount bounce up and down. I doubt this was what they originally wanted to do, but at least they continue to show they are willing to adapt during these things.
lord_blackfang wrote: Time for everyone sitting on both Early Birds to start dropping out, maybe the backslide will make Mantic panic enough to start just throwing freebies at people. It's worked every time so far!
Aaand done.
Suddenly unlocking 3 teams for "free" shows just how bogus the whole stretch goal mechanic is.
Mantic dude said in the vid they were unlicensed or unincorporated or whatnot; they don't get to play in the official leagues.
Don't bite me please, I was just jumping on what sounded rather disappointing. And OTOH, there's DB original rules for the fething martians; I'd be somewhat miffed if that was okay and non-canon rules for these guys wasn't.
Perhaps it allows them to do something rules-wise that wouldn't work in 'regular' DB, and would be so different they'd rather not have two identical-looking teams playing completely differently because of a different version of the same ruleset?
Ehh, whatever. I'm sort of considering Azazeling this one anyway - venting my opinion on cheesecake minis is the sort of thing that tends to get one banned and the convics aren't all that evocative either - like the bots though, and the plague (variety for DZ models, yay! not as if I'll ever play DB with them but that's not really a problem) are horrible in a good way.
Shame they keep sticking you with teams you couldn't give a rat's ass about, really. There's plenty of lovely stuff but a lot of it isn't in rampage - but rampage does have scenery, book, board, tiles, the kind of stuff that adds up just a bit too much as add-ons.
Wow. They are really committed to get that one going again ... good stuff.
Still hate that cheap-ass Deadzone-mouse-mat material.
I'd kill for the Xtreme and that new DBO pitch on a nice, quality Axis-&-Allies-style boardgame board.
I really don't get why they are courting the boardgame crowd with the new miniature-policy, and than chase them away again with those horrible rubber-mats.
You're genuinely the only person I've seen that dislikes the rubber mats. Most reactions I've seen, even from boardgamers is 'wow, that's really awesome.'
Bolognesus, every team in Dreadball Xtreme will be available in a future Dreadball Season book. Just because the actual teams are unlicensed, doesn't mean that the in-universe Dreadball Governing Body won't find a way to bring in a team that looks the same into the big stadiums.
scarletsquig wrote: ^ Not quite sure, but they're actually my least favourite out of all the teams so far.
I love the look of all the season 5 teams, really tough decision to pick the freebie there.
New update has worked nicely, +$3k in the space of a few minutes. If they can clear out all the Frenzies by Sunday then they'll have at least another $100k of funding sorted.
Though because of all the speculative Frenzies, there's still going to be a huge last-minute drop. We just saw the tip of the iceberg. Really, and now with daily team unlocks, it goes back to all that "fake stretch goals" stuff I used to talk about, just as the prone players and alt sculpts also do.
Compel wrote: You're genuinely the only person I've seen that dislikes the rubber mats. Most reactions I've seen, even from boardgamers is 'wow, that's really awesome.'
Bolognesus, every team in Dreadball Xtreme will be available in a future Dreadball Season book. Just because the actual teams are unlicensed, doesn't mean that the in-universe Dreadball Governing Body won't find a way to bring in a team that looks the same into the big stadiums.
Certainly happy with the rubber mats, here.
Anyway, thanks. So that was a purely fluff-related statement and DGB will bring in lookalike teams or somesuch thing? That's fine, then. Probably no more than prudent, with the plague dudes
Compel wrote: You're genuinely the only person I've seen that dislikes the rubber mats. Most reactions I've seen, even from boardgamers is 'wow, that's really awesome.'
Possibly
Sucks I guess. At least, MERCS Recon with Myth-style board-game tiles will be hard to resist though.
To each his own, that's true. What's your problem with them, though? The stuff is nigh indestructible (certainly compared to even good boardgame cardboard...) and easy enough to store/take along - especially for multiple games (as in, DBO, DBX, DZ - all in one handy tube).
Rubber mats are awesome, played Deadzone on them last night, no slipping around at all even on a smooth table, really thin and light, you can loosely fold them up with no creasing. The upper surface is nicely printed and matt with some grip to it, not like those horrible shiny PVC mats you see sometimes.
The new dreadball one with places for your cards, counters and other stuff looks awesome.
No heft and depth. No "new boardgame" smell. And the "no-slipping" never seems to work for me in Deadzone either, so my club largely moved the Deadzone stuff to Dust Tactics boards.
Either way, I don't think it's the best idea to try pushing "Frenzy" as the main-pledge. There is a certain crowd that likes to splurge like that, but for the "unwashed masses", a 150 USD pledge is already a high bar for a Kickstarter-game pledge. "Workhorse" pledges at around US$ 100,- are still frequently around. The first DB-Kickstarter certainly ran mainly off the Striker Pledge, with well over 2000 of those pledged.
Trying to push the "average backer" to a 300+ USD pledge is not gonna work, I think, no matter how many free minis you throw in.
lord_blackfang wrote: Time for everyone sitting on both Early Birds to start dropping out, maybe the backslide will make Mantic panic enough to start just throwing freebies at people. It's worked every time so far!
Aaand done.
Suddenly unlocking 3 teams for "free" shows just how bogus the whole stretch goal mechanic is.
Just read through the new update and I was a bit upset at how they're just tossing stuff out. It's great that they're finally filling out the pledges and options but it makes it aggravatingly apparent that they could have done so much sooner especially with how coy they were being about adding teams, and the filler app and story goals.
As for the teams themselves, it seems I'm one of the few that like the two starters (Convicts and Asterian) but overall everything on offer so far, including the stuff revealed today, lacks the charm of the original Dreadball KS offerings. Maybe I just think Space Marine and Ork teams are cooler than mutants.
I'm having a very difficult time keeping myself at Frenzy. At this point the only way I think I can wing it is if there ends up being some Deadzone cross compatibility, which I know they've shot down, but considering how they're now just going to dump free teams on us makes me unsure if they really don't plan on any crossover or if it's still just smoke and mirrors.
At least with a Rampage pledge I'd still be getting a good chunk of stuff and could pick up an extra team or two if I felt the urge.
Keeping or dumping my frenzy is going to depend on wether I like the majority of the teams enough to want 16 figure versions of each. A crap ton of figs if I only like half does me no good, and though I see the utility for a 16 figure team for your primary team, I suspect a basic 8 player team will work for me for the vast majority of them.
We'll see. I am glad they finally decided to add stuff to Frenzy.
I'm confused why people keep talking about cross compatibility with Deadzone. A proper Warpath KS sure, but a sports game? They aren't equipped to fight a plague incursion and many of these figures running around in Deadzone would just seem out of place.
I agree that Frenzy isn't for everyone, but it seems a crafty e-Bayer will get most of his money back while retaining the other half of the models he wants if they just wait for a month or two after the initial dumping that goes on.
Zweischneid wrote: Wow. They are really committed to get that one going again ... good stuff.
Still hate that cheap-ass Deadzone-mouse-mat material.
I'd kill for the Xtreme and that new DBO pitch on a nice, quality Axis-&-Allies-style boardgame board.
I really don't get why they are courting the boardgame crowd with the new miniature-policy, and than chase them away again with those horrible rubber-mats.
I would like both, but too many are overly sold on the mouse mats and all Mantic seems to hear is praise.
Earth Dragon wrote: I'm confused why people keep talking about cross compatibility with Deadzone.
Because everyone but Mantic knows that people loved Necromunda.
But this a sports game. They don't have guns. They aren't being designed to be balanced in a skirmish game. It makes little sense to give them rules when you'd need a completely different line of models, which would take different funding, which they might as well do a different KS for at that point.
Earth Dragon wrote: I'm confused why people keep talking about cross compatibility with Deadzone.
Because everyone but Mantic knows that people loved Necromunda.
But this a sports game. They don't have guns. They aren't being designed to be balanced in a skirmish game. It makes little sense to give them rules when you'd need a completely different line of models, which would take different funding, which they might as well do a different KS for at that point.
True. But it sorta worked with Mars Attacks, where they "kickstarted" (need new verbs there) the MA-Kickstarter in a lull by adding Deadzone options. So I guess it stuck as "miracle cure" in the minds of Mantic's faithful Kickstarter-backers.
Ultimately, DB Xtreme is in many ways already an application of Deadzone ideas to Dreadball... look at the "gritty" side of things, add crates and terrain, add plague mutants, etc.. .
It's not hard to see where it's coming from, though I also find it a bit annoying.
And ... as stupid as it sound ... people simply seem to enjoy "shopping" through Kickstarter, even for stuff already released.
I remember there was one question by somebody if Mantic could add the digital DreadBall compendium to the add-ons, only to have Mantic respond that anybody could buy the digital book at anytime from Mantic's digital page already. There truly is no point for that on Kickstarter, and still people would rather "kickstart" it than buy it "by itself" in an online-shop.
Micky wrote: Obviously its the same giant crowd of people who wanted to use blood bowl players in their mordheim campaigns.
Which is equally out of place. The entire ambiance of the game is cheapened when there are more "sports team factions" then legitimate Mordhiem war bands with models that look like should be there.
Wanting a "gang styled" skirmish game I'm down with, but this is not the right venue (meaning a Dreadball KS) to pursue those goals.
Well we are going to unlock one new Season 5 team a day - starting tonight!
However, a word of warning (and to thank those pledging early) - the Limited Edition 1 Frenzy will close at midnight (GMT) Sunday 9th March ... exclusive rubber-backed Deluxe Dreadball Pitch - (could it REALLY be added free to Frenzy - surely not!) - and a highly detailed brass etching sheet, allowing you to add fine detail to your figures before (or indeed after) painting,
That should stall any Frenzy pledge drops I imagine haha. "The Unincorporated" rebs team, hello.
Looks like this campaign is ending up quite a bit smaller than they anticipated. Not that surprised, given the quality issues they have had with their last 3 KS, and the lack of cross compatibility with other systems (Deadzone and Mars Attacks both had awesome scenery that people bought in huge quantities as it could be used in many different games).
Micky wrote: Obviously its the same giant crowd of people who wanted to use blood bowl players in their mordheim campaigns.
Mantic have said quite often that this was supposed to be a 'relatively small' kickstarter where they were looking at raising in between Mars Attacks and the original Dreadball levels.
So, I don't think there's a great deal to be missing from that plan. But yeah, I imagine the Frenzy pledges have skewed the levels loads.
If I remember right, the big kickstarter of the year looks to be the Kings of War one, which is where I imagine they'll be hoping to raise Deadzone levels of cash and, I imagine, hoping for more.
I thought KoW was supposed to be a 'mini kickstarter' too primarily trying to get the Abyssal and Nature armies some hard plastic? I thought I also heard SS say something about that one not happening this year now (or warpath).
GrimDork wrote: I thought KoW was supposed to be a 'mini kickstarter' too primarily trying to get the Abyssal and Nature armies some hard plastic? I thought I also heard SS say something about that one not happening this year now (or warpath).
- KoW not until right at the end of this year if it happens this year, it might not, plans for it are vague. (confirmed)
- Warpath, 2015, no-one knows when, will be 100% hard plastic. (confirmed)
- Possible "new IP" KS sometime this year? (wild speculation)
Don't expect any new KS for a very long time, might be another 2 years before the warpath minis arrive in the mail.
No clue what's going on with DKH 4, no idea if it is being brought forward or shunted to 2016 or what.
All I know is DBX is the last Mantic KS for quite a long time (possibly at least 6 months). Mantic's release schedule is jam-packed currently, they're just about to release the last KoWKS items to retail, then they've got a ton more deadzone releases, then Mars Attacks for a few months, then with DBX they've got their release schedule filled quite a bit into 2015.
I haven't really taken a look at this one's progress until recently, and I was a bit shocked at how it is going:
Shocked, that is, until I looked into the other recent Mantic campaigns - looks like, aside from the massive spike at the start, it is business as usual!
I wonder if this one really will finish at just about where the first Dreadball ended?
It'll gradually get to $500k before the last few days then at least another $250k in last few days. A 2500-3000 backer, $750k estimate seems likely.
Don't think a season 7 is likely, but a full three seasons definitely looks like it'll happen now that the season 5 unlocks are getting leapfrogged (which has got the total moving quite nicely again).
scarletsquig wrote: It'll gradually get to $500k before the last few days then at least another $250k in last few days. A 2500-3000 backer, $750k estimate seems likely.
Don't think a season 7 is likely, but a full three seasons definitely looks like it'll happen now that the season 5 unlocks are getting leapfrogged (which has got the total moving quite nicely again).
You really think they are going to almost double where they are now, considering the front load effect of the EB and short time duration Frenzy pledges?
Just look at Deadzones last three days. There is a huge tendency of many potential backers to set a reminder for the last few days and then make a decision then. It's becoming exaggerated with the fact that many have already made their opinion on Mantic.
The board game crowd is who the "campaigning" needs to be directed towards on this one since the figures will come as whole pieces and there will be less of a need to paint/individualize figures with player advancement in the xtreme campaign (which instead focuses on sponsor advancement).
Automatically Appended Next Post: Double checking the numbers:
Getting a rampage and then doing add-ons is going to match Frenzy at the end of Season 5 more or less (a few unknowns but best and worst case is 20 or so bucks over and under).
IF Season 6 follows the same patterns, that is where you are going to make out, which is why they are locking it when they are, pushing people to do add-ons and late holdout completionists are gonna get the short end of the stick.
My thoughts are for any fence sitters, best to lock it in at frenzy now and if you think you don't want it all downgrade later. You may end up pledging as much but getting less if you really like what you see in Season 6. If they don't throw in "everything" in Season 6 like they are Seasons 4 & 5, you can move to rampage with nothing lost.
It's a new sculpt and I'd say it will be smaller than the Warpath ones a bit like the Big Mech and Striders, I don't see the new Dreadball Giants being to far out of scale with the existing ones.
I pledged for a buck, just in case there's anything down the road that turns out to be something I'd like. I'm now refereing to this as an "Azazelx 2.0 Manoeuvre".
Alpharius wrote: I pledged for a buck, just in case there's anything down the road that turns out to be something I'd like. I'm now refereing to this as an "Azazelx 2.0 Manoeuvre".
Well played and wise, to boot... at least in the case of Mantic, I think. They give such great pledge manager access, but are so hit and miss with sculpts, why risk more upfront? Get in with $1 and wait and see.
Of course, you have to have willpower for that... too easy to up it after pledging a buck. I'm not touching this one personally... waiting to see what the few Mars Attacks items I pledged for for a friend work out.
scarletsquig wrote: It'll gradually get to $500k before the last few days then at least another $250k in last few days. A 2500-3000 backer, $750k estimate seems likely.
Don't think a season 7 is likely, but a full three seasons definitely looks like it'll happen now that the season 5 unlocks are getting leapfrogged (which has got the total moving quite nicely again).
Still a lot of doubled-up speculative pledges that people are camping on (like your own). I don't think all those people are going to want a Frenzy and a Rampage....
My thoughts are for any fence sitters, best to lock it in at frenzy now and if you think you don't want it all downgrade later. You may end up pledging as much but getting less if you really like what you see in Season 6. If they don't throw in "everything" in Season 6 like they are Seasons 4 & 5, you can move to rampage with nothing lost.
I pretty much got everything first time around. I've done nothing with any of it. I don't see the need for absolute completionism for a game like this, TBH.
I pretty much got everything first time around. I've done nothing with any of it. I don't see the need for absolute completionism for a game like this, TBH.
Because it exists so it must be owned! I...um...may have an addiction problem when little plastic gaming figures are concerned. Since my hobby storage area is rapidly resembling a very nerdy episode of Hoarders (link for those unfamiliar) I might not be the person to take advice from on this topic.
Quasi-joking aside, it's slightly more relevant for Xtreme than it was with the original with the mix-n-match rules for team building. You can build a maxed out "pure" team of 14 players then use the extras to build a hybrid team or 2 (or 3 if you don't max them out). Mainly for painting convenience.
Sadly, I've only gotten one game of DreadBall in though it was enjoyable despite losing. Coming down to the last second throw, and then the guy drops the ball despite having 3 dice to catch. Good fun, and I like the look of the teams shown thus far. The Brokkrs are my least favorite of the batch, and I'd still rate them as "okay" so I'm looking forward to what gets added.
I'm a little surprised to see the Brokkrs getting so little love here. There are even some FF aficionados here that I've seen expressing disinterest in them.
Vermonter wrote: I'm a little surprised to see the Brokkrs getting so little love here. There are even some FF aficionados here that I've seen expressing disinterest in them.
Unless I missed something, there isn't much to comment on. The one drawing I've seen doesn't give me enough of an idea as to what the team is going to look like or do, let alone differentiate it from the current dwarf team.
In fact, the lack of real detail on what the announced teams are really like makes me wonder at the love shown to some of them in the KS comments section.
Unless I missed something, there isn't much to comment on. The one drawing I've seen doesn't give me enough of an idea as to what the team is going to look like or do, let alone differentiate it from the current dwarf team.
The Brokkrs were one of the first teams ever shown for Dreadball Xtreme, back at the Mantic Open Day.
Admittedly, my photos are rather rubbish compared to other peoples.
At least they have models to make a judgement on. I really like the Forgefathers Dreadball team and I'll be mixing some Brokkrs with them but I don't see them being overly different to the FF.
If I stay at Rampage I'd actually spend $25 on a full 16 man Brokkr team and I'll take the Spyhr as my Free team and buy 8 Rebs - the Rebs can be bulked up to 16 using other figures like the Grogan, Yndij and Spyhr and the Spyhr I like but only enough to get 8. Not interested in the Crystallans.
or I could stick with Frenzy and get em all one of these pledges has to go at some point!
I really like the Crystallans and can see myself picking up a full team.
I was wondering if mantic would be doing any bundle deals, such as buy two teams get one free. Doubt they would tho, it would probably work out better value than frenzy.
weirdly I feel less involved in this ks, I've only put in $1, all I can afford atm and I'm kinda happy to sit back and wait till the end rather than jump in the comments or check everyday for updates. On the deadzone ks I was there each day seeing what was been added to my strike pledge.
See I could live without the dwarfs, but I would like both the rebs and the crystallans (interesting before, clear plastic makes it even harder to resist). Sphyr are a maybe item if I can dig up more funds or don't have more than one team I want from the next season. If I end up backing. I gave up my EB1 Rampage but now I'm starting to come around again :p
@ed I'm kind of in the same spot, don't really have a lot of money to throw at it, but there's so much potential for DZ crossover stuff that I almost feel obligated to pick something up I was considering getting some Infinity minis from birthday funds but I would probably hit 10x as many dudes for a bit more cost here and I'd get a game system and stuff to play it with too. But I only check the comments or updates about once a day, only passingly interested, may still drop altogether.
I pretty much got everything first time around. I've done nothing with any of it. I don't see the need for absolute completionism for a game like this, TBH.
Because it exists so it must be owned! I...um...may have an addiction problem when little plastic gaming figures are concerned. Since my hobby storage area is rapidly resembling a very nerdy episode of Hoarders (link for those unfamiliar) I might not be the person to take advice from on this topic.
Quasi-joking aside, it's slightly more relevant for Xtreme than it was with the original with the mix-n-match rules for team building. You can build a maxed out "pure" team of 14 players then use the extras to build a hybrid team or 2 (or 3 if you don't max them out). Mainly for painting convenience.
Sadly, I've only gotten one game of DreadBall in though it was enjoyable despite losing. Coming down to the last second throw, and then the guy drops the ball despite having 3 dice to catch. Good fun, and I like the look of the teams shown thus far. The Brokkrs are my least favorite of the batch, and I'd still rate them as "okay" so I'm looking forward to what gets added.
I've got a touch of the completionist bug myself, but the fact that I found many of the models to be disappointing, both in sculpts and material - and because I haven't played, despite dropping hundreds last time makes it easy for me to not drop another $400 on it again. At least with 40k,WFB, KoW, random fantasy and sci-fi models I get the suckers painted. More tiny crappy Mantic bloodbowl men for a large amount of cash delivered for Christmas isn't actually very appealing anymore with so much stuff I want to buy now.
One thing I do find interesting is that several people (when doing the "value counts") seem to be just counting the boardgame plastic models with the same kind of "value" as though they were restic/HIPS/metal when boardgame plastic has traditionally been the low-cost, pack'em-in material that gets you an absolute pile of models without making that much of a fuss about it all. Look at Descent, Ravenloft, LNoE, etc. Now these are starting to be considered the same as other miniatures and priced accordingly. And this isn't the first or only KS to decide this...
Vermonter wrote: I'm a little surprised to see the Brokkrs getting so little love here. There are even some FF aficionados here that I've seen expressing disinterest in them.
Unless I missed something, there isn't much to comment on. The one drawing I've seen doesn't give me enough of an idea as to what the team is going to look like or do, let alone differentiate it from the current dwarf team.
In fact, the lack of real detail on what the announced teams are really like makes me wonder at the love shown to some of them in the KS comments section.
Didn't they show off a sculpted Brokkr Team at some open day or something? Why the hell are they instead showing line artwork for them?
The Brokkrs were one of the first teams ever shown for Dreadball Xtreme, back at the Mantic Open Day.
Admittedly, my photos are rather rubbish compared to other peoples.
DaveC wrote: Ah Compel got the picture up here's another
At least they have models to make a judgement on. I really like the Forgefathers Dreadball team and I'll be mixing some Brokkrs with them but I don't see them being overly different to the FF.
If I stay at Rampage I'd actually spend $25 on a full 16 man Brokkr team and I'll take the Spyhr as my Free team and buy 8 Rebs - the Rebs can be bulked up to 16 using other figures like the Grogan, Yndij and Spyhr and the Spyhr I like but only enough to get 8. Not interested in the Crystallans.
or I could stick with Frenzy and get em all one of these pledges has to go at some point!
[user]
I think Brokkrs will blend with Forge Fathers like Void blend with Trontek. Maybe not in xtreme proper (since it sounds like you blend in teams through the sponsor) but I don't see that being a problem in DBO
^Maybe the whole of dakka is slightly reeling from KS burnout? Plus, aren't all of our UK friends asleep, that could have something to do with it. Maybe even a nice classic case of bystander apathy
Sounds like it's a campaign/league expansion that's an extension of the galactic tour series. So crazy murder planets to make your future/space murderball game have an even higher (and crowd pleasing) mortality rate. The drake thing is perhaps an MVP, big, but not necessarily a giant from the way it's worded.
Ahem..
Played as a linked campaign, teams will visit a series of unique locations on a Galaxy Map (included in the Boxed Set!) before engaging the opposition in the Galaxy's Greatest Sport.
There are more areas to explore besides these and we will also produce a set of MVPs for some of the locations. To whet your appetite, here’s the first:
Blitz the Great Drake!
Also sounds like another frenzy booster potentially, and an add-on for anyone below that level.
Each location introduces new rules and abilities – Magmarax for example is a lava planet where teams can be expected to play around volcanic eruptions and intense heat, whilst Andromeda is a planet shrouded in night time, where one can never really be sure of what’s hiding in the dark…
I like my idea better - a gametype with a neutral giant - a mechanical tyrannosaurus - with a strike plate in its mouth. The ones Mantic is using as a selling point sound too boringly random to me, and Andromeda is just stupid for a spectator sport.
Mechanical dinosaurs always get a free pass in my book.
Odd thing is, I don't remember even seeing the update about the Sphyr and that new MVP in my email. Odd.
If he's available expansion only that's a shame for me then, as I'm probably not going to go in for that- I still don't even know if I can talk any family into playing!
Got in for $1 pledge, after some quick calculations it seems that buying Dreadball stuff through the DBX kickstarter is cheap even with $10 shipping to Sweden, especially if you buy multiple items. Feels a bit odd though.
The Fyrit looks to me a like mutant flying squirrel.
And yeah, I'd love to get a mechanical dinosaur into this thing. I'm from the Saturday morning creature double feature generation. Many happy memories of Mechagodzilla and King Caesar.
Vermonter wrote: And yeah, I'd love to get a mechanical dinosaur into this thing.
Feel free to mention it in the comments. Hell, it wouldn't be hard to make the mouth-mounted strike plate look like a mouth-mounted plasma cannon, if you do want to go for the Godzilla theme.
Here we go, knocked over the cash and backer stretches in one go.
Next up, a cheerleader with turn counter for the backer stretch. For cash stretch, Sephalin Sphyr MVP and... a Kraww rebs MVP
Edit: They really need to update the front page graphics if they want people new to the page to drop money on Frenzy, because it's missing a lot of the value added in the last few days
And the Mierce KS topic has "why does a snake have boobies?" going on....
....I think the answer is "the human race is obsessed with boobies", no?
Because people were asking for a female Teraton, not realizing there was already a female model, it just didn't have "mammary glands" as it wasn't a mammal.
Update #28 Mar 7 2014
I CHALLENGE YOU!
2 comments Like 6 likes
It’s Day 4 of the Frenzy Frenzy and as we approach the penultimate weekend, it’s always a good time to reflect.
In the last 7 days we’ve added a free 8 Player team of Mechanites, a free 8 player team of Plague Mutants and a free Season 5 team of your choice into Rampage.
Then we unlocked a Season 5 team a day, meaning that Frenzy got 16 Brokkr Players, 16 Sphyr, 16 Rebs and 16 translucent blue plastic Crystallans at no extra cost.
All-in-all that saw the totals rising, meaning we locked in some seriously cool MVPs – free in Rampage and up – as well as the Iron Ancestor Giant.
But we don’t want to stop there – it’s time to get your Frenzy on!
UNLOCKED – Galactic Tour Series: DreadBall Challenge Cup
Designed for both Original DreadBall and DreadBall Xtreme, the DreadBall Challenge Cup is a whole new way of playing leagues in DreadBall!
For the first time, you’ll be able to travel the stars and play games of DreadBall as part of a linked campaign. Teams will visit a series of unique locations across this region of space before engaging the opposition in the Galaxy's Greatest Sport – win and you claim the territory.
Corporation-Designated Hazard System - work in progress
The beauty of this set is that each location introduces new rules and abilities – Magmarax for example is a lava planet where teams can be expected to play around volcanic eruptions and intense heat, whilst Andromeda is a planet shrouded in night time, where one can never really be sure of what’s hiding in the dark…
In a similar fashion to the Azure Forest pack, this set takes DreadBall in all kinds of fun directions – whether it’s automated robot attacks in the Llo desert to radiation pulses that boost your players abilities on Visvera (or cripple them!)
As well as a Rulebook, a printed Hazard System Map, cards, and counters, the set also comes with four incredible MVPs (which are also available individually if you want them) – arguably the most exciting yet.
Let’s meet them…
Blitz, The Great Drake!
A brutal, tyrannical soldier of the underground circuit, Blitz is well-known both for his larger-than-life presence in the arena and for his mercurial rage. He was the first of the Fyrit to take part in DreadBall, selling his talents to the highest bidder in exchange for huge quantities of his home world’s golden currency.
Eko’o
Although the Reiker Corporation took great pains to only monitor Andromeda from afar, other corporations were not so patient. When a Spiczak survey craft entered the lower atmosphere it was attacked by a flight of Yarasa hunters. They were fought off by security troopers, and one of them – Eko’o – was taken as a prize.
Hexan, The Witch of Visvera
Visvera is a planet orbiting a dying star, blasted by radiation. The effects of the radiation is yet unknown by scientists, though reports from the planet suggest mutations, instant death – as well as the appearance of seemingly super-charged individuals – are rife. What effects do you think the radiation should offer? Let us know in the comments.
Alo-Khan
Alo-Khan can be found in New Haven where, stationed in the great desert of Llo, is the largest robot graveyard in the galaxy. The massive, rusted forms of bulk haulers line up against containers full of broken mechs and irreparable weapons systems, all baking under the heat of the twin suns. Xotek Industries, primary license-holders and founders of New Haven, makes serious credits here. Their primary business is in repurposing wrecked units, either salvaging their parts and melting down the rest or refitting them for new purposes. The more paranoid elements of the subnet are convinced that Xotek is building an army of weapons-enabled, cybernetic supersoldiers deep underground, but it’s much more likely that they’ve just found a very profitable niche. The organisers of the Challenge Cup care little for rumours, and are only interested in the brutal conditions and the possibility that some of the rusting hulks might react mid-game…
Sound cool? Well, the DreadBall Challenge Cup is now available to add-on to your pledge. That’s right, there’s no stretch goal.
Not only that – it is included at no extra cost in Frenzy!
Frenzy now has now broken $375 at Kickstarter prices (over $700 at retail!!!), and we’ve still got all of next week to go – and plenty of free stuff to throw in!!
However – Frenzy will not be around much longer.
You’ve got until midnight (GMT) Sunday 9th March to get yours before the Limited Edition 1 Frenzy is closed.
After this weekend, there will be no more of the Limited Edition 1 Frenzy set – whether we sell out or not, they will be all gone!
Thanks for reading - and please don't miss out on a Frenzy pledge.
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Michael, Rudolph Jindracek, and 4 more people like this update.
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Its definitely good for someone who's got the interest and bank to back it up. The campaign is neat and I'm glad it exists, but I won't likely get to play often enough to need it personally. As nice as frenzy will be, rampage looks to be really solid on its own.
If I step back and ask... what do I need to play dbx? The answer is the base game and potentially one other team if the original two don't strike my fancy. Other players can use the other team or one of their own. Rampage gets me way more than that, even if I cannibalize a lot of it for deadzone.
I just can't justify the cost and amount of additional minis, but it is a nice package for those who can. Maybe if I didn't have MA backed too.
Yeah........I think Mantic needs to take a KS break. Two Surveys intersecting with a new KS project?!? Even their faithful are taxed.
And with the release of 3 Season 5 teams WITHOUT stretches needed, they are showing that KS is unneeded in the first place and they really aren't gaining much if anything from doing a KS versus going straight to retail.
Well I think they need the money to dump into the fund to fuel all of the processes, but the money from the campaign isn't the only money they have to work with for this project. They probably wanted to release 16 more teams and they'll take all of the KS/preorder money they can get, but not getting enough won't stop them. That's my guess.
Urgh... I need someone to double check my maths. I'm having a very bad feeling about this.
Early Bird Rampage: $140
Acrylic Counters: $15
Challenge Cup Pack: $25
Dreadball Season 4 Book: $10
Potential Dreadball Season 5 + 6 Books: $20
Weiss: $10
Assuming 1 additional team free per season and 2 additional seasons: That's me requiring a further 5 teams of 8 players: $75
And.... that's me at $295. Which, therefore, is less than $100 below frenzy, with the potential for more stuff I actually need to play the 'complete' game coming.
Anyone seeing any flaws in this horrible, horrible line of logic. Please, please say yes... And explain.
Might not be a bad thing to slow down a little with Dreadball, out of all of Mantic's games it has definitely had the most releases.. when Xtreme ships it'll have had 25 teams and all sorts of other minis, accessories etc, sorted for it.
After Xtreme there will be more stuff out for Dreadball than GW ever released for bloodbowl. It has been extremely well supported.
Compel wrote: Urgh... I need someone to double check my maths. I'm having a very bad feeling about this.
Early Bird Rampage: $140
Acrylic Counters: $15
Challenge Cup Pack: $25
Dreadball Season 4 Book: $10
Potential Dreadball Season 5 + 6 Books: $20
Weiss: $10
Assuming 1 additional team free per season and 2 additional seasons: That's me requiring a further 5 teams of 8 players: $75
And.... that's me at $295. Which, therefore, is less than $100 below frenzy, with the potential for more stuff I actually need to play the 'complete' game coming.
Anyone seeing any flaws in this horrible, horrible line of logic. Please, please say yes... And explain.
Definitely get Frenzy, from the looks of that list, it makes sense. Frenzy is only $80 more than what your current planned spend is, and some stuff like the ODB rubber mat will come in handy... you'll be able to make back $80 by ebaying any bits you don't want easily.
There will also be MVPs coming that Frenzy gets, but Rampage doesn't.If you want Weiss, it's likely you'll want those as well?
Yeah, I think this will be my last Mantic KS until 2015 at the earliest. I have an absolute gakload of stuff coming from DFG and KD:M already in the next couple of months, and there is no way on god's green earth that will be sorted before Xtreme arrives. Even this one only snuck in because I love DreadBall in particular.
That said, I'll be holding onto my EB Frenzy, and I'm quite pleased with where that sits now.
Earth Dragon wrote: Visvera is a planet orbiting a dying star, blasted by radiation. The effects of the radiation is yet unknown by scientists, though reports from the planet suggest mutations, instant death – as well as the appearance of seemingly super-charged individuals – are rife. What effects do you think the radiation should offer? Let us know in the comments.
Loving all these new races of aliens that are popping up. I might have to spring for the galaxy ball set just for all those MVPs. Seems like we're seeing a LOT more variety of alien races- something that has infuriated me with 40k for many, many, MANY years.
I hope they utilize all these new varieties at least with the Rebs in the future. Too many interesting looking creatures popping up that look like they'd be fun to arm up and go to war with!
At the very least, the more static figures should make great DZ civvies or sneak their way into some Star Wars tabletop games.
I'm sure they'd be playing Dreadball out in Mos Eisley if the Empire would stop trying to squelch the game. At least we'll be having enough various races to populate a cantina!
^ I also like that, while a lot of the aliens are vaguely humanoid, there are a lot of aliens that aren't even close to human shape. They all manage to play dreadball... but there's a bit of tentacles, wings, quad, arms/legs mountings reversed, and various sizing differences that you don't see in a lot of TV and some other mediums.
Obviously we know why they don't want to have horse-people or five armed anti-grav raised chimp-dudes in star trek... would be nightmarish on the budget and hard to pull off in any case. But boy does it make me happy to see it here
I agree, it is nice to see non-human looking aliens. I hope some more of those make it into the Warpath KS. I hope the Rebs have a Navy SEAL type unit made out of those unicorn-frog guys. That would be awesome.
Earth Dragon wrote: Yeah........I think Mantic needs to take a KS break. Two Surveys intersecting with a new KS project?!? Even their faithful are taxed.
it comes down to 2 things:
1. Does running multiple KS so quickly slow down or reduce the quality; and
2. Do their "fans" have the cash to afford this many.
I don't think 1 has much if any impact. The whole process has different teams who work at different times. Production can't work until design is done. When design is done, it's a huge waste to have them doing nothing until production is done, ergo the need to find something new. Whatever that new thing is, kickstarter is the way Mantic chooses to (at least partially) fund it. I stand by funding coming from us being better than funding coming from a third party as the "interest" comes to us rather than the third party.
Regarding 2. Is it so much that they can't afford them in quick succession, or just that getting *everything* is largely pointless for most people? Imagine GW did a kickstarter. They had an initiate level for $4,000 where you could get 2,000 points split between 5 armies, and a "warp touched" $15,000 pledge where you get 8,000 points divided among 10 armies. (yes my math checks out by GW logic). GW players don't need 10 armies, and arguably don't need 5. It's similar with Dreadball for a lot of people. Why do you need 2, 5, 16 teams? I mean, *I* need them. But most people don't ; p But there's not much else Mantic can do to bring more cash to the KS I don't think, given the limited scope of the game. There are boards, rules, models and a small number of accessories. Feth... I'm going to end up buying the DBX shirt... I love my Deadzone shirt....
Contemplating at least 1 extra Crystallen team for Deadzone. That feth gon' be swooooooit!
Yonan wrote: But there's not much else Mantic can do to bring more cash to the KS I don't think, given the limited scope of the game.
Only because Mantic lacks vision. As I've said before, it would have been trivially easy to expand the scope of the miniatures, doubling the market just by adding one extra arm per sculpt.
AlexHolker wrote: Only because Mantic lacks vision. As I've said before, it would have been trivially easy to expand the scope of the miniatures, doubling the market just by adding one extra arm per sculpt.
Why are you even still here? You're not a backer, and all you've done is post how much you hate it and why they're a terrible company every time they announce a stretch goal.
Hoping they reach the giant sharkman before the Frenzy weekend push ends, so they can launch into a fresh set of goals for the final week
NTRabbit wrote: Why are you even still here? You're not a backer, and all you've done is post how much you hate it and why they're a terrible company every time they announce a stretch goal.
Of course I'm not a backer, they haven't enabled Paypal pledges yet. I criticise them because it's immensely damaging to their potential to just pretend that their mistakes are unavoidable Acts of God and not things that they should try to do better, and because I am still waiting for them to provide two very important pieces of information that will tell me whether it's worth paying a quarter as much again for shipping, eight months in advance, to buy their product.
Thanks, Scarletsquig, I didn't know that. I'll still be waiting to see what the Season Six teams are in the hopes that there will be another must-have like the Asterians, but it's good to know how to do things if there is.
Honest question, why the insistence on Paypal? I'm very careful who I give my cc details to, but KS charges go through Amazon. Doesn't get more legit than that.
lord_blackfang wrote: Honest question, why the insistence on Paypal? I'm very careful who I give my cc details to, but KS charges go through Amazon. Doesn't get more legit than that.
Because I don't have a credit card, and Kickstarter is the only site I've encountered that expects me to have one.
Those are some nice lookin' minis Orlando, thanks for the pic! Lots of character, nice assortment of hard and soft lines... that hopefully come through in production models. That Orx MVP looks really good. Face has much more attitude than the similar GW40k Orks imo.
Does anyone know of a good clear acrylic dreadball scoop type thing you can attach to models arms? My Greenstuffing ability falls far short, also I'd really like transparent ones for an energy field effect, but would also like some physical ones for less high tech teams.
I go back and forth on this kickstarter. The universe they are putting together looks fascinating. I find myself wanting to know more about the races, and the rebellion. I would back a Dreadball/Warpath RPG in a second. Dreadball looks like a much more detailed rules set than Warpath or KoW. I am intrigued.
But...
There are just enough things about Mantic that I don't like that have kept me on the fence with their projects. The Warpath figures I have (corporation) are uninspiring and a pain to assemble. It is blatant that they are using Kickstarter for pre-orders, and don't NEED all the pledge money to make DBX a reality. Their actions to artificially prop up enthusiasm during this Kickstarter dishearten me.
It also doesn't help that I don't know anyone currently playing the game in my area.
They really should have just gotten Slyvain to sculpt the Deadzone Marauders from the start rather than having some other sculptor do them, and then leaving it to him to fix/ resculpt them.
Yonan wrote: But there's not much else Mantic can do to bring more cash to the KS I don't think, given the limited scope of the game.
Only because Mantic lacks vision. As I've said before, it would have been trivially easy to expand the scope of the miniatures, doubling the market just by adding one extra arm per sculpt.
Doubling the number of markets, but the board game market is way bigger than the miniature gaming market. And if they did alternate arms, then they wouldn't be pre-glued, and would less effectively serve the board gaming market that wants things ready to go out of the box.
It'd certainly be worth considering for Mantic to sell conversion hands at some point though.
2081 backers, frenzy is looking good, time to drop the $140 spare pledge... and probably increase my $350 by that much in addons like shirts and Deadzone Crystallens : /
You so crazy! I did re-up to 140 after someone dropped their EB1 rampage. Unless I see something that I know I must have, I'll probably need to wait to add anything else for the survey. I know I'll *probably* want some more teams but I need to space the hit out further into this or next month than the KS close date.
This train has no breaks, the pacing is so much better than they got stuck with for Mars Attacks.
@yonan, ooooh you'd have to put the mat/pitch tiles/ whatever over the BS floor, but one could totally make a battle systems interior for the playing of DBX. Perhaps the inside of a prison/prison ship, or just the inside of a ship. Snap.
I ended up adding a T-Shirt and 20 dollars to my frenzy pledge. (Yes, I am fully aware of my 'rage' pledge level talk at the start of the campaign).
I figure the extra $20 will either be to pick up the 2 other dreadball giants I missed from the first kickstarter, or alternatively for the mars attacks team. - I imagine they're not going to be having actual printed rules though.
I think the scenery add-on for $5 is a great deal - a fair few generic crates and boxes to either make a more dense game of Dreadball, or for skirmish games, and it'll give you enough additional strike posts to fully equip an original Dreadball pitch!
Yeah, I went nuts on the 5 dollar dead zone accessory sprues. They didn't manage to send most of them but... yeah good deal. Almost regret not packing in more mars attacks urban accessories sprues.
Yonan wrote: 2081 backers, frenzy is looking good, time to drop the $140 spare pledge... and probably increase my $350 by that much in addons like shirts and Deadzone Crystallens : /
Are shirts and the like really such a big draw in campaigns like this? I don't think I've ever pledged for that type of item in miniatures kickstarters...
They were a good deal alright I ended up with 13 DZ accessory sprues although I've only got 2 so far, I'll have 8 MA ones bought mostly sight unseen as for $5 still worth it and I hope the chain link fence makes it on to the sprue as I should have 4 feet of it then. I'll probably pick up another 4 DBX crate sets in the survey and they did mention doing a second set if it gets far enough but i'm not sure that will happen.
Yonan wrote: 2081 backers, frenzy is looking good, time to drop the $140 spare pledge... and probably increase my $350 by that much in addons like shirts and Deadzone Crystallens : /
Are shirts and the like really such a big draw in campaigns like this? I don't think I've ever pledged for that type of item in miniatures kickstarters...
I've only recently started picking up a couple "nerdy" shirts. There are times where they're suitable to wear as Compel mentions. Or just whenever if that floats your boat, but I tend to save them for "relevant" occasions. Having a LAN? PC Polaris Blood Bowl tournament MVP "Lil Skittles" makes it rainbow!
Well that's just awesome I retract my semi-negative statement!
However, I guess I meant I don't really see kickstarters as the way I'd buy my nerd swag like T-shirts... since they'll be delayed along with whatever else I'm pledging for (or if not delayed, at least have a long lead time) even though they're really fast to make and obtain via any other avenue.
Related note, the entire Polaris Blood Bowl tournament is available on their (Totalbiscuit, Crendor, Jesse Cox, Dodger etc) youtube channels, and they're running another tournament atm with 45 second turns which I'm enjoying too as it's much faster games. If Dreadball is your thing, PC based Blood Bowl might be too. I have the vids up on second monitor while I do other stuff. And damn straight lil' skittles is adorable, he's the skink that could!
I shouldn't say this, but this and this are nerd/geek/internet culture shirts I've been considering.... and now I've lost what little credibility I had.
The Excavator needs new arms. The cartoony drill could be much improved by replacing it with either one of those contra-rotating rock drills or one of the narrower ones used for boring holes for explosives, and the other arm needs to be more capable of actually picking things up and holding them.
Schnorkel works well for what it is, but what it is is unexciting.
Corporation cruise liners must be packing some serious heat if they take out the entire star system when they explode.
Not sure how well that bit of background is going to sit with future space battles unless they're fought at extreme distances well, well away from any star.
Also, it'd make things terribly easy for the Rebs, sneak one suicide bomber on a cruise ship headed to Earth, pull the trigger and boom, no more council of seven.
scarletsquig wrote: Corporation cruise liners must be packing some serious heat if they take out the entire star system when they explode.
Not sure how well that bit of background is going to sit with future space battles unless they're fought at extreme distances well, well away from any star.
Also, it'd make things terribly easy for the Rebs, sneak one suicide bomber on a cruise ship headed to Earth, pull the trigger and boom, no more council of seven.
Rather than say "Do better", I'm going to say how they should do better:
The flavour text as written has been designed specifically to make it irrelevant to the universe as a whole, since the Elastopods do not matter except as backstory for this one individual. This removes whatever slim incentive there is to add the worst elements.
With this in mind, make Schnorkel's race control a single planet, and not a number of planets. If you're going to wipe out everyone but one individual, making them implausibly widespread beforehand is counterproductive. For that matter, the entire race need not be wiped out - Schnorkel's motivation is no less important if merely 90% of the population was killed and not 99.9999%.
Two, stop pulling this "The Corporation is equal parts stupid and evil" nonsense. Have Schnorkel's people be the victim of collateral damage from a space battle in that system and not the victims of an implausibly destructive malfunction on a civilian ship. This explains why Schnorkel was discovered and didn't merely starve to death in the depths of space - because there was something worth fighting over in the system, a place where Schnorkel could have ended up, and also provides a plausible mechanism for how Schnorkel could actually discover the Blue Flag Company was responsible.
scarletsquig wrote: Corporation cruise liners must be packing some serious heat if they take out the entire star system when they explode.
Not sure how well that bit of background is going to sit with future space battles unless they're fought at extreme distances well, well away from any star.
Also, it'd make things terribly easy for the Rebs, sneak one suicide bomber on a cruise ship headed to Earth, pull the trigger and boom, no more council of seven.
Rather than say "Do better", I'm going to say how they should do better:
The flavour text as written has been designed specifically to make it irrelevant to the universe as a whole, since the Elastopods do not matter except as backstory for this one individual. This removes whatever slim incentive there is to add the worst elements.
With this in mind, make Schnorkel's race control a single planet, and not a number of planets. If you're going to wipe out everyone but one individual, making them implausibly widespread beforehand is counterproductive. For that matter, the entire race need not be wiped out - Schnorkel's motivation is no less important if merely 90% of the population was killed and not 99.9999%.
Two, stop pulling this "The Corporation is equal parts stupid and evil" nonsense. Have Schnorkel's people be the victim of collateral damage from a space battle in that system and not the victims of an implausibly destructive malfunction on a civilian ship. This explains why Schnorkel was discovered and didn't merely starve to death in the depths of space - because there was something worth fighting over in the system, a place where Schnorkel could have ended up, and also provides a plausible mechanism for how Schnorkel could actually discover the Blue Flag Company was responsible.
Agreed, with the last part in particular. When they posted this for the Sphyr, it's amusing. When it becomes pattern, it's obnoxious. It's particularly obnoxious when somehow all these other races with space empires seem to be avoiding all the same mistakes. Do people really hate the human race that much these days that we have be written in as "incompetent bad guys". If the free market is controlling humanity, there'd be plenty of Corporations who make excessive attempts to be peacekeepers, who try to be unscrupulously honest, and who try to be Eco friendly. Why would they operate this way? Because just like people buy things that say "recycled", "organic", and "sends proceeds to breast cancer" in this day and age, corporations would use these same principles to build their empires in what Mantic has put together.
If you are going to make a Capitalist Star Empire, at least do it right
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh and less then 25 frenzy packages left
Earth Dragon wrote: If the free market is controlling humanity, there'd be plenty of Corporations who make excessive attempts to be peacekeepers, who try to be unscrupulously honest, and who try to be Eco friendly. Why would they operate this way? Because just like people buy things that say "recycled", "organic", and "sends proceeds to breast cancer" in this day and age, corporations would use these same principles to build their empires in what Mantic has put together.
Maybe a few such corps exist, but you don't hear about them because they're not major players, just like in the real world.
Earth Dragon wrote: If the free market is controlling humanity, there'd be plenty of Corporations who make excessive attempts to be peacekeepers, who try to be unscrupulously honest, and who try to be Eco friendly. Why would they operate this way? Because just like people buy things that say "recycled", "organic", and "sends proceeds to breast cancer" in this day and age, corporations would use these same principles to build their empires in what Mantic has put together.
Maybe a few such corps exist, but you don't hear about them because they're not major players, just like in the real world.
They would be in Mantic's world, because the previous major players all choked on their puppy sandwiches. Realpolitik evil is a fine concept for a faction, but that only works if they're not complete and utter morons. Mantic keeps writing them as complete and utter morons, and cannot comprehend that this doesn't fething work.
Earth Dragon wrote: If the free market is controlling humanity, there'd be plenty of Corporations who make excessive attempts to be peacekeepers, who try to be unscrupulously honest, and who try to be Eco friendly. Why would they operate this way? Because just like people buy things that say "recycled", "organic", and "sends proceeds to breast cancer" in this day and age, corporations would use these same principles to build their empires in what Mantic has put together.
Maybe a few such corps exist, but you don't hear about them because they're not major players, just like in the real world.
They would be in Mantic's world, because the previous major players all choked on their puppy sandwiches. Realpolitik evil is a fine concept for a faction, but that only works if they're not complete and utter morons. Mantic keeps writing them as complete and utter morons, and cannot comprehend that this doesn't fething work.
Throughout history, most of the big failings of corporations have been easily preventable, but they opted not to do so because it would be too expensive, out of just good old arrogance or because they had set themselves up to profit from the failing.
The Corporations of Mantic's world don't wake up and say "how many puppies can we choke today?" they simply care about what will make them the most money. If a million puppies have to be choked to do so, fine, as long as they're puppies over there I don't care. Puppy murder doesn't factor into the plan unless more space bucks can be made doing that then by not doing that.
It's about hyperbolic greed, and when all you care about is chasing the bottom line you will do a lot of stupid things as a result because you don't take in the whole picture. You don't have to look particularly far to see that in action in the world. Games Workshop dominates the miniatures market, yet pulls such bone-headed policies out that it boggles the mind. It will then use the fall-out of their bone-headed policies to justify further bone-headedness and...well, we all know where that leads.
Earth Dragon wrote: If the free market is controlling humanity, there'd be plenty of Corporations who make excessive attempts to be peacekeepers, who try to be unscrupulously honest, and who try to be Eco friendly. Why would they operate this way? Because just like people buy things that say "recycled", "organic", and "sends proceeds to breast cancer" in this day and age, corporations would use these same principles to build their empires in what Mantic has put together.
Maybe a few such corps exist, but you don't hear about them because they're not major players, just like in the real world.
I could buy that they aren't a member of the counsel of 7, but a 2nd rate player could easily be built on sound concepts.
Not all musicians are stoner junkies. Not all politicians are corrupt soulless husks. Not all athletes care about getting paid more then they care about playing well.
Earth Dragon wrote: I could buy that they aren't a member of the counsel of 7, but a 2nd rate player could easily be built on sound concepts.
And then they get at the very least pushed aside and trivialized by a powerful, less/unethical corp, or more likely just absorbed or destroyed. It happens here in our relatively decent democracies. Corps will be bought out, they'll be undercut out of markets, they'll be lawyered to bankrupcy or patent screwed... imagine how bad it would be when the corporations have their own *armies*.
Also, not a fan of the sphyr thing, unless it's quickly expanded upon that it's a cover story for an intentional corporation operation.
Earth Dragon wrote: If the free market is controlling humanity, there'd be plenty of Corporations who make excessive attempts to be peacekeepers, who try to be unscrupulously honest, and who try to be Eco friendly. Why would they operate this way? Because just like people buy things that say "recycled", "organic", and "sends proceeds to breast cancer" in this day and age, corporations would use these same principles to build their empires in what Mantic has put together.
Maybe a few such corps exist, but you don't hear about them because they're not major players, just like in the real world.
They would be in Mantic's world, because the previous major players all choked on their puppy sandwiches. Realpolitik evil is a fine concept for a faction, but that only works if they're not complete and utter morons. Mantic keeps writing them as complete and utter morons, and cannot comprehend that this doesn't fething work.
Throughout history, most of the big failings of corporations have been easily preventable, but they opted not to do so because it would be too expensive, out of just good old arrogance or because they had set themselves up to profit from the failing.
The Corporations of Mantic's world don't wake up and say "how many puppies can we choke today?" they simply care about what will make them the most money. If a million puppies have to be choked to do so, fine, as long as they're puppies over there I don't care. Puppy murder doesn't factor into the plan unless more space bucks can be made doing that then by not doing that.
It's about hyperbolic greed, and when all you care about is chasing the bottom line you will do a lot of stupid things as a result because you don't take in the whole picture. You don't have to look particularly far to see that in action in the world. Games Workshop dominates the miniatures market, yet pulls such bone-headed policies out that it boggles the mind. It will then use the fall-out of their bone-headed policies to justify further bone-headedness and...well, we all know where that leads.
But, as Alex is stating, another company with revised policies from how GW is operating and start to snag some of the business from disenfranchised customers. This is not a complex economic concept. It's rather rudimentary.
Earth Dragon wrote: I could buy that they aren't a member of the counsel of 7, but a 2nd rate player could easily be built on sound concepts.
And then they get at the very least pushed aside and trivialized by a powerful, less/unethical corp, or more likely just absorbed or destroyed. It happens here in our relatively decent democracies. Corps will be bought out, they'll be undercut out of markets, they'll be lawyered to bankrupcy or patent screwed... imagine how bad it would be when the corporations have their own *armies*.
Also, not a fan of the sphyr thing, unless it's quickly expanded upon that it's a cover story for an intentional corporation operation.
Even more reason for corporation that has a little more ethical backing to arise and draw in employees. Some of you are acting like the same things drive all human beings.
Earth Dragon wrote: Even more reason for corporation that has a little more ethical backing to arise and draw in employees. Some of you are acting like the same things drive all human beings.
You don't seem to understand that an unscrupulous corporation will always be able to out-compete a more ethical one in any number of ways. Try to find a fair-trade retail chain in the real world and see how it compares to Walmart. It's not going to be 2nd tier. Not even 3rd or 4th or 5thy or 6th tier.
And in the Mantic future, media is even more controlled than presently and customers will be even less aware of the ethical issues, and so even less inclined to support more expensive products. There is absolutely no way for that kind of business to grow beyond a corner store on some lame-ass planet, if that. And only because it's too small for the big boys to bother destroying.
lord_blackfang wrote: You don't seem to understand that an unscrupulous corporation will always be able to out-compete a more ethical one in any number of ways.
Only if you're smart and unethical. According to this latest flavour text, Mantic's corporations literally use doomsday weapons in their own systems for entertainment. You cannot out-compete a more ethical competitor if your idea of realpolitik is to stick a shotgun in your own mouth and pull the trigger.
Earth Dragon wrote: Even more reason for corporation that has a little more ethical backing to arise and draw in employees. Some of you are acting like the same things drive all human beings.
It doesn't need to drive all, just most. You can see it now in the West. The US, UK and Aus all have large problems with their governments - but they get re-elected because the majority of people just don't care. Most people simply don't care what's happening to other people, so long as they live their own little comfortable lives. In Mantics corporate future, if you have a job in a "core" world, you'll live a very comfortable life, with Dreaball hyped to the EXTREEEEME in the media, keeping the populace distracted. As Blackfang says, the media is even more controlled. People not only don't care - they don't even know.
A 40k comparison - people wouldn't even know the Sphyr world was destroyed if the Imperium didn't want them to know. If it could be lauded as a victory over Xenos, it would be spread far and wide. If it accidentally destroyed a loyal hive planet... no one would know about it, it would just have been "cut off by a warp storm". When the governing bodies have such supreme power, it's virtually impossible to fight it. The Rebs are trying in the Manticverse, but they've already been crushed once and the core worlds probably don't even know about them, or they're sold as "Osama and the Taliban" more likely.
It's a goofball sci-fi universe running off popular sci-fi clichees, including the "evil/greedy/unscrupulous megacorp" from Weyland-Yutani to various Cyberpunk to Umbrella Corporation.
I don't think Mantic is trying to draw a "realistic" far-future economics scenario, not any more than GW is suggesting that weaponised chainsaws will be a staple of intergalactic future warfare.
Even Mantic admitted it was more an oddity that their two "Humans wipe out their species/home world" were released right beside each other.
If profit is the bottomline, finding every market niche there is to find would reign. it would just be more entertaining lore (and realistic) to attack all sides and not just look at the negativities that could be caused. It's less black and white then "big business can only be evil and incompetent".
I got an answer for anyone wondering about metal minis in this kickstarter happening at the last minute:
@ SS - lol at the way the question is framed. All of the teams, giants and Mvps are pre-assembled plastic (except for the Robots and Plague with are plastic but not assembled). We're not doing booster you'll notice
It was also not an accountants decision. It relieved a whole load of tooling pressure as well and meant you guys got stuff on time (and the opinion was the casting was a lot better too).
@ SS - it was both. The volumes that we did through the KS weren't enough, which was validated through Trade. The plastic S1+2 booster releases wouldn't have warranted them being in plastic, hence the change for Xtreme. You will get more variety in your initial starter team, and they come with prones.
And they did it before with the Judwan, which were basically "James Cameron Na'vi that didn't fight back"
The "problem" with Xtreme is their underground-theme, yet most of the recent teams are all still varieties of fancy aliens, which probably would've made more sense in a general DreadBall theme, but now need to have some "this is why they are illegal" argument build into it.
Before this Kickstarter started, I rather expected it to be less focussed on varieties of exotic aliens than DBO was, with more (parody of) criminal elements... Convicts, not-Italian-Mafia, not-Chinese-Triads, not-Yakuza, etc.,, but they oddly stuck with the "exotic-aliens" angle for some reason or another, trying to "make it work" for the "illegal"-theme in one way or another.
Zweischneid wrote: And they did it before with the Judwan, which were basically "James Cameron Na'vi that didn't fight back"
The "problem" with Xtreme is their underground-theme, yet most of the recent teams are all still varieties of fancy aliens, which probably would've made more sense in a general DreadBall theme, but now need to have some "this is why they are illegal" argument build into it.
Before this Kickstarter started, I rather expected it to be less focussed on varieties of exotic aliens than DBO was, with more (parody of) criminal elements... Convicts, not-Italian-Mafia, not-Chinese-Triads, not-Yakuza, etc.,, but they oddly stuck with the "exotic-aliens" angle for some reason or another, trying to "make it work" for the "illegal"-theme in one way or another.
Valid point yet different category. This was a bit more intentional then "Dag nabbit!! Who let Gomer punch in the coordinates again" sort of scenarios. To reiterate, Mantic did mention it was more rare then it was being made out to be with virtually back to back "mistakes" causing travesty amongst races.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
RiTides wrote: SS- Lol at "and the opinion was the casting was a lot better, too". Why bother talking to them, that's a bald-faced lie and they know it =(
I'd rather they just said "We fethed up last time (again). It won't happen again (for reals this time)".
Grrrrr...
So if they thought the casting wasn't the greatest and the new formula was going to caste better, how is this in any way a lie?
Valid point yet different category. This was a bit more intentional and "Dag nabbit!! Who let Gomer punch in the coordinates again" sort of scenarios. To reiterate, Mantic did mention it was more rare then it was being made out to be with virtually back to back "mistakes" causing travesty amongst races.
Possibly.
Still, the bridge Mantic needs to cross is why they are illegal in the GCPS, cause it's Xxxxxtreeeemme!
Mantic Designer One: Let's make Rock-aliens for DreadBall.
Mantic Designer Two: Let's make Fish-aliens for DreadBall.
Mantic's Kickstarter Guru: Sounds cool, but we're done with DreadBall, we are doin' Xxxxxtreeeeme. We need a reason why the GCPS hates those guys and doesn't want the public to see them.
Mantic Designers: How about the GCPS fethed up and wants the universe to "forget about them".
Mantic's Kickstarter Guru: Good enough, go with it.
The alternative of .. say ... Fish-aliens' planet got wiped out by accident (or purpose) by ... dunno ... Asterians or the Plague or Veer-Myn doesn't work, cause it provides no reason for them to be "illegal" in the GCPS and forced into the underground of DreadBall Xtreme.
I have all teams but only 1 booster - my beautiful Z'zor. I couldn't justify the boosters for the other teams when it really didn't seem so essential to get them. I think this is a better way to do it. More poses from the start, since the limited poses initially was ... undesirable.
Any thoughts on how doable it will be to customize a team of Crystallen for Deadzone?
Another question - do teams come with clear bases, blue bases, red bases, random bases... ?
TBH I'd probably prefer they quickly retconned the accidental blow up, or at least retconned it to include that it was announced as accidental (or some other reaosn) when the real reason was that they were looking for something. Incompetence is often an excuse in corporations though - someone gets fired with a golden parachute, then business goes on as usual.
Zweischneid wrote: The "problem" with Xtreme is their underground-theme, yet most of the recent teams are all still varieties of fancy aliens, which probably would've made more sense in a general DreadBall theme, but now need to have some "this is why they are illegal" argument build into it.
Before this Kickstarter started, I rather expected it to be less focussed on varieties of exotic aliens than DBO was, with more (parody of) criminal elements... Convicts, not-Italian-Mafia, not-Chinese-Triads, not-Yakuza, etc.,, but they oddly stuck with the "exotic-aliens" angle for some reason or another, trying to "make it work" for the "illegal"-theme in one way or another.
Make one of the Season Six teams a bunch of deserters with military grade cybernetics.
I actually thought the restic casts were better than the metal ones which look rushed obviously to make the shipping deadline.
I have yet to clean or paint any of the metal minis prefering to stick with the restic which is saying something given the extra cleaning work involved in cleaning restic.
Anyway hopefully that was a one off and won't happen again.
Considering all of this fluff is so far just quotes in Kickstarter updates, I'm fairly certain that if enough people point out some of the sillier inconsistencies they'll go back and rewrite them before the work hits print in the rules.
lord_blackfang wrote: Yeah all these aliens fighting in back alleys of human worlds is confusing to me, too.
From what I gather, it's more the complete list of who "might" be found. We already have Orx, Teratons, Judwan, and Humans themselves as models who would be the more likely line-ups at underground fights in the middle of Corp territory. Many of these aliens would be showing up on the fringes, or even at non-corp worlds.
There is a lot of story telling potential here. It'd be fun to have rings where humans weren't even allowed, or Orx or Forge Fathers or whoever because the planet you're playing refuses their admittance.
lord_blackfang wrote: Yeah all these aliens fighting in back alleys of human worlds is confusing to me, too.
From what I gather, it's more the complete list of who "might" be found. We already have Orx, Teratons, Judwan, and Humans themselves as models who would be the more likely line-ups at underground fights in the middle of Corp territory. Many of these aliens would be showing up on the fringes, or even at non-corp worlds.
There is a lot of story telling potential here. It'd be fun to have rings where humans weren't even allowed, or Orx or Forge Fathers or whoever because the planet you're playing refuses their admittance.
Possibly. But none of those teams visually shout "this is gritty illegal-stuff" in the way Convicts and Plague and the odd Vampire-Sponsor do.
You can put anything in there from DBO (and stuff like Veer-Myn are arguably a better fit than some DBX stuff), but the distinct illegal-underground-theme is light on many of the add-on themes (MvPs are better, but there still isn't a useful and robust MvP rules-set in DBO, and I don't expect one here either. Those are largely "for painting").
NTRabbit wrote: Considering all of this fluff is so far just quotes in Kickstarter updates, I'm fairly certain that if enough people point out some of the sillier inconsistencies they'll go back and rewrite them before the work hits print in the rules.
Yeah exactly, I'm hopig it all gets nicely refined like this. Prefereably for a deluxe hardcover rbook containing all season rules plus bonus fluff and stuff like the deadzone book >:-)
I (and probably many others) pledged Frenzy to keep our options open until the end.
I expect that there'll be some backsliding as people drop their frenzies on last few days for rampage + options.
They'll leave the 700 available if someone drops it someone else can pick it up they won't add anymore but I doubt they will monitor every drop out and reduce the level accordingly.
Should be easy enough to pick up Frenzy pledge levels on the last day as people have to decide what level they want.
Sure, people may drop their frenzy pledges, but now we're down to the last week. In a few days we'll be headed for the end-rush. Mars attacks still had another week left at this point I think. Backsliding should get overrun by the 48 hour reminder imo.
For what its worth, to those worrying about the KS fluff for these races, I wouldn't worry. The editor on the project (and most of Mantic's going forward) is an incredibly passionate and focused guy who, having worked for other companies with deep lore pools to negotiate, knows how to make a cohesive universe.
Its in good hands, as he's already stopped me from mucking up too much. ;-)
Still slipped Space Gypsies into canon though.... hehehe..
On the comment someone made about how they expected Xtreme to be playing mainly on underground criminal gang tropes and whatnot... yes, i agree that this would be good. We at least need some 80s-style punk gangs all dressed in neon polyester and with mirror sunglasses.
One tidbit Hewitt dropped on the BoW Crystallins video was interesting tho - in the co-prosperity sphere, you need a license to be an alien. So by definition almost all alien races are illegal.
Is it just me, or does Mantic pick less then optimal times to have loan Stretch Goals? Only a season 5 book in site? Come on Mantic. You gotta give people something to really look forward to. Printed media is traditionally at the low end of which stretches make people excited for the project.
Not gonna hold my breath that this thing moves forward quickly tonight.
I agree with that. But when they showed the Short Stories, they had other stretches showing beyond it. I think it's not the smartest play to have it sitting by itself when Mantic could have showed the 1st Season 6 team, keeper models, more sponsors, or any number of other things as a goal beyond the book.
Letting frenzy pledges now they are getting ***** is gonna help retain them. I feel they are gonna lose a few due to uncertainty at least from the western states and Oceanic countries during this evening.
Joyboozer wrote: It's an expensive option, I agree as a stretch goal it sucks, but it does require funding.
Wait, 20 grand and it's only free for frenzy! Is that just for print or are they including design? I'm guessing under 20 sheets( 100 pages 4 up, average collator limit ), that's very expensive for a print run of that size.
Yeah, and I was giving Mantic credit earlier in the campaign for seemingly more upfront and realistic stretch goals........
Digital free for all. Print only provided for Frenzy
Automatically Appended Next Post: And yes.....the campaign is starting to move backwards. Would have been mitigated if they just showed a little something more. You'd think Mantic would be super pro at KS projects at this point 85% vet moves sprinkled with 15% rookie mistakes.
Are people expecting any surprise fireworks at the end? Or do we think we have it all figured by now?
We know there'll be 4 more teams for Season 6, another giant (the Marauder Hulk), probably a couple more MVPs, and if the campaign runs as normal, probably a limited hardback. Is that about it?
Yeah, the more races they establish into the Warpath universe, the better. It seems that generally less people who play Mantic's games are sticklers for using zomg official models for everything, and now that the sphyr are a thing that you can get a reasonable number of models for at a time... could easily convert them into your own fighting force, and just use the closest Warpath or Deadzone list as you can find. For warpath, allies make it even easier, though the odd merc might help in deadzone.
Who knows if WP 3.0 has allies in the future, but I'm pretty sure both previous versions of it did.
If I get a sphyr team, maybe I'll use them under marauder stats, commandos seem a fair fit. Maybe.
I can't get a straight answer from anyone officially, but no one poops in my cornflakes when I get loud and excited about hard-plastic, Mantic-priced, vehicles, either. ;-)
Heck the worst violence violence of the pitch would be "Tuesday" in that world...
Good fun, and I like the look of the teams shown thus far. The Brokkrs are my least favorite of the batch, and I'd still rate them as "okay" so I'm looking forward to what gets added.
