So they're about $5 cheaper than the previous dual-kit releases. I don't know if that indicates their lack of faith in the Wood Elf release or perhaps they feel they need to readjust their pricing, which would be good news.
Wildwood Rangers sounds like a Wild West gang of vagabonds and cut-throats.
Sisters of the Thorn are mounted on Stags and are similar to Doomfire Warlocks for they are sorceresses themselves. There you go.
Eternal Guard wield spears and shields.
Wildwood rangers are definitely the ones carrying the weapon that resembles a bardiche.
And there's going to be a big box containing 3 Treemen plus 36 Dryads.
Wolfen from La Taberna de Laurana wrote:- Sisters of the Thorn / Wild Riders: Plastic Box, dual kit, 5 miniatures. 29 euro. The Sisters are the Stag Riders, and the Wild Riders are Orion´s personal Guard, with long spears.
- Eternal Guard / Wildwood Rangers: Plastic box, dual infantry kit, 10 miniatures. 31 Euro. Has a Command Set: Champion, Musician and Standard Bearer
- Guardians of The Deepwood: Army Box, 3 Treemen and 36 Dryads. 190 euro. Treemen can be armed as Ancient and even one Durthu. Only until stocks last.
anonymous source on Faeit 212 wrote:from the next White Dwarf:
Wood Elves Eternal Guard/Wildwood Rangers $39
Wood Elves Sisters of the Thorn / Wild Riders: $44
Wood Elves Guardians of the Deepwood $230
The Sisters of the thorn come with a Blackbriar Javelin that is armour piercing with poisoned attacks with a range of 12". The unit also is considered to be a level 2 wizard with shield of thorns and curse of anraheir. With a 4+ ward save and always strikes first, these units are looking tough.
Wildwood Rangers also get always strikes first and immune to psychology, and come with a Great Weapon and light armour. Also a Guardians of Wildwood special rule for +1 attack.
avedominusnox wrote: Do we know what is the base the treeman is mounted? Is it the chariot one?
Definitely not a Chariot base, if that were a chariot base then the model would be huge, 8 or 9" tall. Looks like a new base size to me, maybe 75mm x 50 mm, judging by the Dryad which they've included on one of the pics.
Isn't 75mm x 50mm the old giant base?
Yeah possibly. I have a giant but I can't be bothered pulling it out of it's case right now, lol.
It's definitely not 100x50 like a chariot base, not unless they're lying about it only being 6" tall. You can see it's over 2 base widths tall, so if it's a 100x50mm base, that would make it over 8" tall. I'm thinking in the 70 to 80mm wide region.
Well in the pic with the dryad it seems to me appropriate for the 100x50. Can someone with a knowledge of that inform us, it is important for me to know. Thank you
Dryad is only on a 25mm base, so if the Dryad is to scale, there's no way the Treeman is on a 100mm wide base, as it's not 4 times wider than the Dryad's base.
If the Dryad is to scale, the Treeman is only 4.7" high to the top of it's head, and the branches sticking out of his head is about another 1.5".
Eagles,
Waywatchers,
Warhawk riders
Wardanceers
and Treekin left in metal / finecast right?
That's a bit sad. Eagles I don't really care because the LOTR Eagles look a million times better anyway. Waywatchers I don't really care because they look pretty good.
Warhawk riders and Treekin could really have used an update, especially the Treekin given the Dryad and Treeman now both have the same aesthetic, the Treekin are not only going to look ugly as all hell (like they always have) they are also going to look out of place.
What's interesting is that WE are not even getting a new BIG thing. Most of the other armies got a new "big" model (or oft two in one). I suspect being left alone for ages has its downsides in that only so much can be updated at once.
I do think that new treekin and warhawk riders would have been great to see.
Mr Morden wrote: On the nright side its not that much smaller than a Kinght and is what £35 versus £85.
I think it would make a geat Exodie Avatar
It's heaps smaller than a Knight. A Knight is a bit over 6" to the top of its hunch, this is only 4.7 to the top of its head, then the Knight is massively bulky. I'd feel comfortable in saying the Knight is probably at least twice the volume of the Treeman.
Depending on cost, sisters of the thorn should be a real pain to deal with depending on a couple of factors: movement distance and whether they have fast cavalry. This is assuming they still keep the cavalry bases on the wild riders. Shield or thorns isn't really that fantastic, it's just a generic set of hits which may be good if you can keep this unit alive in the flank or rear of an enemy unit. If they are S3/T3 as I would imagine, even with a 4+ ward, weight of attacks means they won't last long in combat. The gold of this unit should be the Curse of Anraheir. -1 to Hit is the kicker here, with the Dangerous Terrain tests being just an added bonus. The issue is that even as a level 2 wizard, the spell requires a 7+ or 8+ to cast regularly, depending if the Lore Attribute applies. That means 3 dice to get the spell off reliably.
Run this unit behind the rest of your force to provide them cover whilst you get them into range of your enemy, hexing them with that -1 to hit which should swing combat if favour of the WE. They also seems like a good way to deal with redirectors. However that said this will probably be an expensive unit to run.
the riders for both units are really cool imo, but stags riders is such a poor concept, that it's impossible to make them look good. Swapping the stags for some horses would fix them.
streetsamurai wrote: the riders for both units are really cool imo, but stags riders is such a poor concept, that it's impossible to make them look good.
They haven't done themselves any favours with the paint schemes. The white and blue just looks strange and the brown stags are painted terribly, whoever painted them needs to have their artistic license revoked, the shading and highlighting has been painted as though they're panel lines on a tank.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: They haven't done themselves any favours with the paint schemes. The white and blue just looks strange and the brown stags are painted terribly, whoever painted them needs to have their artistic license revoked, the shading and highlighting has been painted as though they're panel lines on a tank.
Agreed.
I actually think the Wild Riders (sisters less so) are a decent paint job away from awesome. It's difficult to say if the kit is poor, or the poantjob hideously clumsy, but there looks to be real potential here, much like the Treeman.
WIth 40k going down the crap-shoot with the release of a whole new rulebook, and me still enjoying GW model quality, I might have to move into this WE release with both hands open!
Wild Riders: look kinda cool, the stags need a far less dramatic/tattoo-filled paint scheme though. Helmets looks alright, but honestly I'd rather they be swapped out for the Wildwood Ranger heads (hooded).
The Eternal Guard looks fine, even if they are mostly a HE elite copy-paste with slightly higher skirts. The Wildwood Rangers on the other hand...their torsos look so very, very distorted. Their shoulders are obscenely wide and make their frame look ridiculous. The Wildwood Rangers are pretty much just lumberjacks, that's the only way I could think to explain their impossibly huge frame which is comparable to Marauders and even Chaos Warriors.
The Sisters of the Thorn...are pretty much unforgivable. They are blatant HE cavalry copy-paste down to the paint scheme they've used. They're maiden guard on stags, no joking here, this is a serious issue.
I love the models. Seriously tempted to start a Wood Elf army. Especially since my Dwarves are on hold until Avatars of War finishes their line so I can build it using them
streetsamurai wrote: the riders for both units are really cool imo, but stags riders is such a poor concept, that it's impossible to make them look good.
Why is this the case, in your mind?
Hard to say, probably that deer are such unthreatening animals, that it's hard to make them look badass
It's already been mentioned but I'm really impressed with the way in which the models (whilst look absolutely gorgeous!) also feature silhouettes that resemble both High and Dark Elf imagery. Very clever. Very cool!
Wood Elves are the nicest tabletop army GW put out now imo, really eye catching stuff.
Just need to find a way of fitting some of it into my HE army!
plastictrees wrote: Why wouldn't they have visual connections to High Elves, as they were High Elves back in the day?
Also, what browser are you guys using that make these paint jobs look gakky?
The quality of the paint scheme on the models is not in question. What is in question is the choice of colours and design in general. We have white with blue, teal and cyan mounts and riders, broken up only by small amounts of silver which blend into itself and there's a distinct choice that the best way to break up this confused mess of a colour scheme is with bone, light gold and fleeting amounts of brown. It's just a copy-paste of a HE scheme with just a few more green-tones in there. The way to make your army stand out is not to emulate another (armies should not be convergent). It isn't like WoC, DoC where the fluff ties both so closely together it's impossible to separate one from the other. The Sisters of Slaughter had the exact same issue with their preview colour scheme (silver/gold-grey/purple with no other colours to break up the scheme).
The Wild Riders are excusable (and in most ways favourable) because they take the time to give them a good variety of blending and contrasting colours (green to crimson) which brings out the rich woodland colours. I don't know what they were thinking when they were painting the Sisters of the Thorn. There is a distinct lack of both subtlety (blending with surroundings) and contrast (making anything specific on the models pop).
The only real reason I can see that they chose it is because they wanted to show off the models in different seasonal colour schemes. Wildwood Rangers in autumn hues, Sisters of the Thorn in winter tones, Wild Riders in summer colours and finally Eternal Guard in new spring greens.
Wow! I haven't played WHFB in probably 5+ years, and for the first time in a VERY long time I'm thinking about shelling out for GW's redicolous prices! This is pretty much exactly the direction i wanted Wood Elves to go, ramp up the magical feral aspect
I absolutely LOVE the stag riders! Especially the sisters, who have this fantastic ethereal magicy/wind blowey thing going on that ties in well with the Ariel artwork. Stags are a bit on the dynamic side, but I think the concept and execution is awesome, it's just the warpaint on the faces that makes it look a bit off. Male stag riders have this great savage/feral look to them that just works for me.
Rangers are a bit meh, but I'm REALLY digging the Eternal Guard! I liked the old ones, and these are even better!
The new Treeman is awesome, the new plastic kits are awesome, I always like the last set of plastics they released! Damn these are exciting figs!
I just wish they'd done the wardancers in plastic too, the current ones are just a bit too awkwardly posed.
plastictrees wrote: Why wouldn't they have visual connections to High Elves, as they were High Elves back in the day?
Also, what browser are you guys using that make these paint jobs look gakky?
The quality of the paint scheme on the models is not in question. What is in question is the choice of colours and design in general. We have white with blue, teal and cyan mounts and riders, broken up only by small amounts of silver which blend into itself and there's a distinct choice that the best way to break up this confused mess of a colour scheme is with bone, light gold and fleeting amounts of brown. It's just a copy-paste of a HE scheme with just a few more green-tones in there. The way to make your army stand out is not to emulate another (armies should not be convergent). It isn't like WoC, DoC where the fluff ties both so closely together it's impossible to separate one from the other. The Sisters of Slaughter had the exact same issue with their preview colour scheme (silver/gold-grey/purple with no other colours to break up the scheme).
The Wild Riders are excusable (and in most ways favourable) because they take the time to give them a good variety of blending and contrasting colours (green to crimson) which brings out the rich woodland colours. I don't know what they were thinking when they were painting the Sisters of the Thorn. There is a distinct lack of both subtlety (blending with surroundings) and contrast (making anything specific on the models pop).
The only real reason I can see that they chose it is because they wanted to show off the models in different seasonal colour schemes. Wildwood Rangers in autumn hues, Sisters of the Thorn in winter tones, Wild Riders in summer colours and finally Eternal Guard in new spring greens.
The Wild Rider stags are terribly painted. From a brushwork standpoint they aren't terrible, but they're just painted wrong for a furry animal, they have sharp edge highlights and sharp shadows, they make the models look like something you'd get in a child's play set. The completely lack any quality artistic direction and it makes the models look clumsy.
The rest of them I don't think are painted terrible, but the Sisters of Thorn scheme really isn't good for showing off the models.
Over all, I'm liking the new models... I just need to figure out what to do for Glade Guard because I really don't like the GW Glade Guard models. I still think the treeman doesn't look great though.
Is it the paint job that makes them look so angular or is it
the sculpt? The tissue on the legs and face look like a more
angular version of those Minotaur sculpts.
I love the new model range, the spear eternal guard are awesome! Wild riders are cool. I don't like the sisters.
Still I think I would like to see the book and rules before choosing. Does anybody know about the treeman base?
Sorry to ask again but it is of great importance to know.
Not that I'm actually planning on buying any, but I'm pleased the stags look more organic and rounded than the paint job made them appear for those that are.
they're definitely having an identity crisis. Too much of a High Elf aesthetic going on here - yes, I know they were High Elves once, but they have their own identity and culture now. With a different paintjob, all the infantry here could be High Elf units. Especially with the dramatic wind-in-the-hair sculpts.
The stags... not bad but not great. The horns aren't quite right, and from what I can see, they don't have cloven hooves... it's stuff like that that annoys me.
I desperately wanted to be really excited about the Wood Elf releases and I'm just not. I don't think it's GW being lazy, but they've certainly missed the mark in more than one place.
Tsilber wrote: so no new wardancer, waywatcher, riders of K or dragon/birds. I dont get it...
No new wardancers or waywatchers. But we have wild riders on 2nd week. Great release till now IMO.
Also the new treeman looks similar to dryad sculpts at last.
finnan wrote: The stags... not bad but not great. The horns aren't quite right, and from what I can see, they don't have cloven hooves... it's stuff like that that annoys me.
Scrub wrote: It's already been mentioned but I'm really impressed with the way in which the models (whilst look absolutely gorgeous!) also feature silhouettes that resemble both High and Dark Elf imagery. Very clever. Very cool!
No, not cool. The silhouettes of the High and Dark Elves are one of the worst things about them. We don't need more of those stupid helmets, especially for a faction that is always living around low-hanging branches.
Scrub wrote: It's already been mentioned but I'm really impressed with the way in which the models (whilst look absolutely gorgeous!) also feature silhouettes that resemble both High and Dark Elf imagery. Very clever. Very cool!
No, not cool. The silhouettes of the High and Dark Elves are one of the worst things about them. We don't need more of those stupid helmets, especially for a faction that is always living around low-hanging branches.
Yeah I've always hated the high helmets, cone heads, etc of the HE/DE/Eldar. I liked that WE didn't do such silly things.
I do like the new treeman; their slightly odd design, and more provocative poses make them good centerpieces (which they were bound to be, due to their size, anyway) and it does make them look very bizare and otherwordly, though the "Tree" aspect is maybe a bit lost.
As allready pointed out, the armours and helmets look very high/dark elfish.
The stags look kinda blocky (could be the paintjob though, don't have an eye for that kinda thing), and the way the antlers are attached is a tad weird.
The sister of the thorn look just plain silly; Way to much stuff crammed onto the modell.
On the whole the army just seems much to heavily armoured for a group of rangers and guerilla fighters. The old modells all had a very celtic barbarian sort of influence mixed with nordic fey legends. Some may say that this is a very generic design for wood elves, but it did set them apart nicely from the two other elve armies the game allready has, as well as the beastmen (the other "nature" army). The new theme is arguably closer to GW's distinct model style, but in my eyes it doesn't really fit with the wild force of nature theme that the wood elves had going in the old codex (who knows how much of that survives into this edition).
(On a side note: Is there something like uncanny valley for how static a modells pose is? Technically the new modells show a lot more movement, yet somehow they seem stiff to me, when compared against for example the glade guard.)
Nabbed from Warseer, who translated them from elsewhere:
Quote Originally Posted by Shadeseraph View Post
Translation:
Eternal Guard: S3, 1A, Stubborn
Arrows:
Witch's Curse: Poison.
Moonfire: +1 to wound against Order
Fast: 2 Shoots
Precise: No negatives to shooting
Razor: AP -3
Starfire: +1 to wound against Destruction
Special Rules:
Forest Stalker: Forest Striders, and, in forest: fight with an additional rank, shoot with an additional rank, and reroll 1s to wound on Close combat
Blessing of the Ancients: +1 Caster level in forests
Forest Spirit: Ward Save 6++ and ItP.
Place Forest: Citadel Forest, in your half of the table
Kurnous: Frenzy, Devastating Charge, Tattoos, Fast
Weaponry:
Asrai Bow, S3 AP.
Javelin, 12", AP and Poison.
Spears: basic spear (on foot and mounted), AP.
Sisters, WS 4++, javelins, same than warlocks, Shield of thorns and Curse. Poison.
Deers of ISha...1A S4. The kurnous ride Deers of kurnous...1A S4.
Rangers, GW, +1A vs fear and terror, S3. ItP
Shadowdancer is a hero, Shadow lore.
Hawks with Killing blow on charge, and AP both rider and mount.
Waywatchers: 2 shooting modes: First is rapid fire... Multiple shoots (2). Second is Accurate shooting. Ignore armor.
Only Aedas (the lord level mage) use High and Dark Magic.
Nobles and Trueborns have the rule arrow of Kuronus... If the enemy general is at 36" and in a straight line, before the game he receives a single S3 strike that ignores armor
Treeman S5, 5A. Upgrades such as strangle. Ancient only 3A, level 2 life.
Dancers, the already mentioned dances:
Quote Originally Posted by boli View Post
RE: wardancers
the last dances mentioned were:
* 3++
* Killing blow
* +1 A
* Removes Rank bonus from enemy.
for the same cost/profile.
which basically makes them 3 points more expensive than sisters of slaughter and not as good in any way (as you'll only have a choice of one of those dances at once and not 4++, removing rank bonuses from enemy as standard.)
- details are earlier in the thread I'm just repeating.
Lore rules, the already mentioned ones.
And some earler stuff, posted on a german forum by a poster called Paladin
He says that he has seen the book. Woodelves get both prowess rules as long they are inside of a wood... asf also.
Attribute of high magic gives one additional wound to the caster or unit he is in.
Attribute of dark magic is: place a counter for each successfull hex-spell on an enemy unit. Unit will eceive 1d3 additional hits per counter when hit by a subsequent damage-spell.
The magic item list (no idea what has changed on some of the items the German guy didn't post it)
Spirit sword
Daith's rapier
Bow of Loren
Helm of the hunt
Acorn of eternity ( old item from 5th edition. It makes a forest if I remember correctly)
Moonstone of hidden ways
Hail of doom arrow
Some wand (wand of wytch elm?)
Banner of midwinter (same unbreakable until EoT one time only ability also now grants mr3)
A new banner that gives vanguard and extra charge distance n first charge of the game ( I think someone already posted this on above)
Dryads and the new wildwood rangers are both the same point cost and are 1/2 slave cheaper than the current cost of a glade guard. Glade guard same cost. Basic tree man is old treeman - 2 trolls + 5 slaves in cost. Ancient is old ancient - troll in cost and still is s6. Basic treeman is s5
Strangle root is still in.
Wild wood rangers 5 5 4 3 3 1 5 1 9
a handfull of slaves
magical banner up to two handfull of slaves with spears.
DHW/GW light armour
magical arrows are ppm and in regions of dhw pointswise for other units.
Spells for maidens of thorn are anraheirs curse, shield of thornes
The eternal guard may very well see use as spearmen in my high elf army. Painted to fit in with the rest of my army I don't think anyone will notice their wood elves.
The stag riders look interesting, but who decided on the green paint scheme, makes them look horrid. The treeman kit suffers the same problem, I'm sure that with the right paint job one will fit in well with my LOTR ents, but the paint jobs in WD make it look like a bloody 6 year olds toy.
I might have to nab a box of Wildwood Rangers to build as Shadow Warriors.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Tamereth wrote: The eternal guard may very well see use as spearmen in my high elf army. Painted to fit in with the rest of my army I don't think anyone will notice their wood elves.
The stag riders look interesting, but who decided on the green paint scheme, makes them look horrid. The treeman kit suffers the same problem, I'm sure that with the right paint job one will fit in well with my LOTR ents, but the paint jobs in WD make it look like a bloody 6 year olds toy.
I would assume they're being painted unnatural colors because they're not actually living creatures, but rather are Forest Spirits.
Gorgeous stuff though, seriously. I had considered starting a Wood Elf force way back in the day but opted for Beastmen instead. I am starting to question that decision.
I like that the Eternal Guard have a slightly High Elven appearance. I might be wrong but aren't the Eternal Guard basically made up of lesser noble sons or something? Which means they would have retained more of the High Elven trappings than other aspects of the army.
Either way it's a stunning set of models. Fantasy has been super solid with it's last two releases with only the gyrocopter not being a particular favorite of mine.
I certainly think that GW, for all their rules failings, have set a good standard in the Fantasy model ranges. There is now a very pretty range of armies in the game. Makes me excited to see what happens with the Bretonnians.
It's ok, because in 8th the skirmish rules really suck and are overly clunky. Fewer skirmishers is better generally, otherwise you can't fit them on table due to current skirmish rules making skirmishers more unwieldy than horde infantry.
Daba wrote: Dryads used to be ranked units anyway.
Yeah, like 12 years ago
It's ok, because in 8th the skirmish rules really suck and are overly clunky. Fewer skirmishers is better generally, otherwise you can't fit them on table due to current skirmish rules making skirmishers more unwieldy than horde infantry.
I'd rather Dryads be more elite skirmishers. Making all the WE infantry in to blocks just takes away the unique feel the army had.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who had that thought!
This!!! I kind of like it.
The release looks pretty good. I don't particularly like the paint jobs they've shown the models painted with, but I think all the models themselves actually look quite good.
So WE aren't really the fast skirmisher-archer-fast cav army anymore, they're just like every other army with blocks of infantry? I hope not.
It's even worse when you consider that, due to lack of models, Dryads almost certainly won't be getting standards or musicians. They only dropped them 1 point also. It's a hefty nerf.
nels1031 wrote: Or, using the Eternal Guard as High Elf Spearmen and using them as the base of a HE army.
That's a good idea! They would work well.
Re: the Dryads posts above, people used to want Dryads to not be skirmishers. I know I was wishing for that when 8th first hit. Not really sure if things have changed now but they never could hold their own enough as a combat-only skirmishing unit for me.
nels1031 wrote: Or, using the Eternal Guard as High Elf Spearmen and using them as the base of a HE army.
That's a good idea! They would work well.
Re: the Dryads posts above, people used to want Dryads to not be skirmishers. I know I was wishing for that when 8th first hit. Not really sure if things have changed now but they never could hold their own enough as a combat-only skirmishing unit for me.
I have honestly not played my WE for a very long time, but I have always liked Dryads as skirmishers because it means you don't just use them to tank like every other infantry unit in the game, you have to use them as part of combined attacks and use the fact they typically inflict more wounds than they take to sway the combat res in your favour vs armies that have large static combat res.
Now, if they can't do that in 8th edition anymore, I'd rather see them gain special rules that let them remain viable as skirmishers than just turning them in to yet another ranked regiment.
Under the model description on GWs page the Dryad picture shows them skirmishing as well as saying "... the Dyrads skirmishing, fear-causing style of battle..." this is after they've updated the Wood Elf section as well, and Wardancers have a similar picture. The GW model descriptions usually are anything but, however it is something to think about perhaps...
Cirronimbus wrote: Under the model description on GWs page the Dryad picture shows them skirmishing as well as saying "... the Dyrads skirmishing, fear-causing style of battle..." this is after they've updated the Wood Elf section as well, and Wardancers have a similar picture. The GW model descriptions usually are anything but, however it is something to think about perhaps...
Hulksmash wrote: I like that the Eternal Guard have a slightly High Elven appearance. I might be wrong but aren't the Eternal Guard basically made up of lesser noble sons or something? Which means they would have retained more of the High Elven trappings than other aspects of the army.
Wood Elves see High Elves as traitors. So why shouldn't the elite copy High Elf armour to honor the beloved traitors
Yep, I think I am going to have to start playing fantasy. Although I do wish there was a larger update, but so far it seem pretty cool. But yea, some big eagle riders would have been neat, or even some updated plastic heros over the finecast.
Either way I am probably going to the stag riders as I think the models look amazing. The faces on the female stag riders are a little strange though, so I may have to put some different heads on there.
Flashman wrote: Hmm... do like this second week of releases. The deer riders remind of Princess Mononoke. I wonder if that's what they were going for...
I suspect that it was probably an influence - interesting to note that whilst several of us are getting a strong Ghibli Studio feeling from them the models themselves don't look like the deer from Mononoke (although the antler design does look like its inspired by eastern influences in anime).
This release is beautiful. Those new Wood Elf helmets look brutal, the "deers" look like they can anyone's ass and the ones with the Glaives, those are some badass looking elves.
I don't play Fantasy, now do I wish to spend money there and in 40k, but I'm considering at least buying the "codex"... I love their books and those illustrations are some of the best I have seen so far from GW.
GW WILL respond to a decline in sales. WHFB sales must be exceptionally low and/or they were not expecting the Wood Elf update to be a popular line.
The same thing would happen for 40k if people stopped buying the Citadel FineTools, the Space Marine Ultra Codex, etc. etc. etc.
Also, one can ascertain that the high prices on the Dwarfs brought about lower sales that GW is trying to deal with in pricing the WE (since they can't ever do discounts).
GW will certainly react to change in the market. Hopefully they can also see that they focus too much of their resources on advertising 40K to the detriment of their other lines. A big amount of Fantasy advertising - coupled with some stable prices - hopefully coupled with a rules set that allows for a smaller point match (500 points or less) should see fantasy gains some new ground.
They've got the sculpts that people like - they just have to convince them to get into the game.
I love the stag riders, I even like the winter theme of the sisters. That with the fact that I like both the glade guard/riders and the dyrads and the treemen, I could see me starting a wood elf army when I get more money and after seeing some battle reports. I would love to do a cavalry style army with horses and stags.
The Sisters just have too much going on. They look like they'll tangle themselves up with their antlers and their javelins and their staffs and their hair and their antlered helmets. They should have to take a dangerous terrain test every phase.
The Rangers look like they've got their Dad's ax. With their grip choked up on the ax head, it looks like they melted down an entire knight for each of those axes, and now they are too heavy to wield properly.
The eternal guard: "How do I hold all this gear? Also, why is my shield wicker?"
Say what you like about our evil overlords, they make mint minis.
Those treemen are absolutely beautiful, I might actually buy one just to paint, because I'm struggling to possibly conceive any way I can convert one for a Space Marine army?
Perhaps some sort of... leaf-based dreadnought that was abandoned in the jungles of catachan long ago?
I am honestly surprised we aren't seeing more pewter to finecast for the heroes and lords, or even more new plastic kits......but maybe they werent expecting good sales from it, though I kind of see wood elves as the Tau of fantasy when it comes to release......everyone has been sitting around waiting for them to get an update before deciding to play them or not.
It's more likely that with GW phasing out Finecast they can afford to keep several pewter lines going because there is little point paying for new moulds if you're going to phase them out so soon. Especially on a model like that likely won't generate vast sales to justify the cost.
WE are the unpopular in an already smaller selling unit for GW. Granted part of that unpopular is the lack of update which has just been resolved; but even so they are unlikely to suddenly jump to marine level sales.
See that's odd - GW army bundles (which have replaced the battle force/army forces) have generally been very attractive purchases for getting hold of a lot of core models. This WE one appears to be the total opposite. Sure it looks darn cool, but its also very situational and isn't really giving you a huge amount of the core of the army that you'll want.
Well it's 39% off once you get it from a retailer. That's pretty impressive savings.
Granted the dwarf one is way, way better since you can pull down a 2.5k army easy with two of the box sets for less than $300. And not to far off that for the Dark Elf one that is nowhere to be found anymore. Which is weird since I thought they were supposed to be standard releases now but maybe it's just currently out of stock.
I9 have doine a 180 on the stag riders. I actually like them. I still think they could have made up something cooler than stag riders (owl bears rider, or something like that would have been much better), but they are pretty good mini in theyr own right
Overread wrote: See that's odd - GW army bundles (which have replaced the battle force/army forces) have generally been very attractive purchases for getting hold of a lot of core models. This WE one appears to be the total opposite.
Overread wrote: See that's odd - GW army bundles (which have replaced the battle force/army forces) have generally been very attractive purchases for getting hold of a lot of core models. This WE one appears to be the total opposite.
Well, Dryads are core, right?
I think the point is more that Treemen are Lords/Rare choices as opposed to Core/Special/Heroes.
I may have to get a bitz order in once those Wild Riders have been out a while.. I am sensing huge potential for Dark Eldar conversions.. Those helmets would look great mefinks
Overread wrote: See that's odd - GW army bundles (which have replaced the battle force/army forces) have generally been very attractive purchases for getting hold of a lot of core models. This WE one appears to be the total opposite.
Well, Dryads are core, right?
I think the point is more that Treemen are Lords/Rare choices as opposed to Core/Special/Heroes.
Exactly - you'd only need one box really and then you're done; even then you'd be less likely to want to spend that much starting out. A box with core archers, riders, dryads - something neat and a lord would be far more versatile. Something you'd want to buy to start the army off and then heck maybe buy twice to bulk it out. Then you'd be in a position where "yes, not only do I want 3 treemen, but I've also actually got the points in core troops to put them on the table"
Maybe Durthu as general makes other treemen special or something, so you can do an entirely tree-spirit army from the book. I wouldn't be surprised to see a new 'elf only' bundle as well in week 3 perhaps..
pgmason wrote: Maybe Durthu as general makes other treemen special or something, so you can do an entirely tree-spirit army from the book.
Yeah maybe, otherwise the box doesn't make a lot of sense as you can't even have 3 Treeman until, what, 2200-2300pts? Even if Durthu shifts them to Special, you'll still be looking at around 1500pts before you can take 3.
I wouldn't be surprised to see a new 'elf only' bundle as well in week 3 perhaps..
You could do 2 lords/1 rare or 1 lord/2 rare to spread the points out and, depending on actual cost, probably fit 3 into an army at ~2,000 points.
I do agree it's strange to see a Wood Elf Army Box with no actual Elves though. I suspect you're looking at a new incarnation of the previous "Forest Spirits only" army though.
Also still kind of shocked that there are no new Tree Kin models. The major visual discrepancy between Treemen/Treemen Ancients/Durthu and Tree Kin is going to be a little eye gouging.
Well assuming the points cost don't change much, 2 Treemen are over 500pts, so even if you put 1 in Lords, you can't fit all 3 in to an army of less than about 2300pts.
If taking Durthu moves them to Special, I'm assuming Durthu will cost 300-400pts (current Treeman Ancient is 325), so that drops them to about 1500-1600pt minimum army to take all 3.
We'll just have to wait and see, it just seems like an odd move to make a boxed set you can't even use except in reasonably large games.
streamdragon wrote: You could do 2 lords/1 rare or 1 lord/2 rare to spread the points out and, depending on actual cost, probably fit 3 into an army at ~2,000 points.
Durthu is a Lord per WD, but from what is discussed in WD it seems like the Treeman Ancient is a Hero choice rather than a Lord choice...and it also kind of seems like Treemen might be a "unit" Rare choice, where you purchase them separately like Bolt Throwers.
I do agree it's strange to see a Wood Elf Army Box with no actual Elves though. I suspect you're looking at a new incarnation of the previous "Forest Spirits only" army though.
I think it might have something to do with the amount of plastic models they have available...including some kind of generic character choice.
Week 3 might have an Elf army box if there is a plastic Spellsinger model of some kind.
Also still kind of shocked that there are no new Tree Kin models. The major visual discrepancy between Treemen/Treemen Ancients/Durthu and Tree Kin is going to be a little eye gouging.
Man i love what they have done, but i think they really missed the boat on marketing. Lets face it this is one of the biggest Armies GW can re-release. Im shocked to not see plastic Orion or more characters, Tree kin, waywatchers, war dancers, warhawk riders, eagles...
Does this mean with finecast failing they are resorting back to puter? Or they have such an overstock of metal models, they want to sell them all first.
Either way I like the release, just figured GW wsho is always accused of being greedy could of made more models for this release. Dark Elves for 9 boxs/characters. Im counting 5 for wood elves...
AllSeeingSkink wrote: Well assuming the points cost don't change much, 2 Treemen are over 500pts, so even if you put 1 in Lords, you can't fit all 3 in to an army of less than about 2300pts.
If taking Durthu moves them to Special, I'm assuming Durthu will cost 300-400pts (current Treeman Ancient is 325), so that drops them to about 1500-1600pt minimum army to take all 3.
We'll just have to wait and see, it just seems like an odd move to make a boxed set you can't even use except in reasonably large games.
Durthu is 385 per WD.
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Tsilber wrote: Man i love what they have done, but i think they really missed the boat on marketing. Lets face it this is one of the biggest Armies GW can re-release. Im shocked to not see plastic Orion or more characters, Tree kin, waywatchers, war dancers, warhawk riders, eagles...
Does this mean with finecast failing they are resorting back to puter? Or they have such an overstock of metal models, they want to sell them all first.
Either way I like the release, just figured GW who is always accused of being greedy could of made more models for this release. Dark Elves for 9 boxs/characters. Im counting 5 for wood elves...
It means they have such an overstock of metal models.
In regards to Dark Elves v. Wood Elves:
Dark Elves had a lot of stuff that was still metal/Finecast...but they also had a few plastic kits that were really showing their age.
With Wood Elves, they actually did not have a huge amount of units to begin with and their plastic Core choices, while getting long in the tooth, are still gorgeous models.
There's still time for new releases, so please bear that in mind.
As it stands, I think we'll see a Forest Dragon kit(with multiple hero options like a Noble, a Spellsinger, or the Twins) and a plastic Spellsinger at least.
Maybe plastic Orion, but I doubt it because that model is again still gorgeous.
And the odds of making the money back for the plastic mold on a single special character for a low popularity army is pretty much zero. I wouldn't count on Orion.
I would count on a plastic spell seer but I'm not sure on the dragon. Dwarves had 3 weeks worth of model releases, I think DE did. So we're likely to see something else still.
Can't they just re-use the high-elf dragon. That would save them having to do a forest dragon (and far as I know most WE players were using the plastic kit anyway). Granted the riders could do with looking more WE like and less HE like. A shame that rider and dragon are on the same sprue (if memory serves me right) since that means a whole new mould if htey want to do a special WE one - otherwise they could have used the same dragon sprue and just done a WE character mount.
Kanluwen wrote: With Wood Elves, they actually did not have a huge amount of units to begin with and their plastic Core choices, while getting long in the tooth, are still gorgeous models.
I think the Dryads are reasonably good models, but the old plastic WE came out before GW had figured out how to do decent plastic cloaks. As such, the Glade Riders and especially Glade Guard look very "meh". The cloaks just don't flow well and look quite unnatural.
Overread wrote:Can't they just re-use the high-elf dragon. That would save them having to do a forest dragon (and far as I know most WE players were using the plastic kit anyway). Granted the riders could do with looking more WE like and less HE like. A shame that rider and dragon are on the same sprue (if memory serves me right) since that means a whole new mould if htey want to do a special WE one - otherwise they could have used the same dragon sprue and just done a WE character mount.
I doubt they would reuse the High Elf Dragon. They didn't do it for the Dark Elf Dragon, so why would they for the Wood Elf?
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Kanluwen wrote: With Wood Elves, they actually did not have a huge amount of units to begin with and their plastic Core choices, while getting long in the tooth, are still gorgeous models.
I think the Dryads are reasonably good models, but the old plastic WE came out before GW had figured out how to do decent plastic cloaks. As such, the Glade Riders and especially Glade Guard look very "meh". The cloaks just don't flow well and look quite unnatural.
True the cloaks are kinda bad...but it's only certain cloaks that look bad, IMO.
I'm only surprised they didn't do plastic Wardancers, that would have been a no brainer to me. I'm also a little surprised there is no plastic forest dragon, but not shocked that there isn't. The rest would have been nice, but I really I don't see a plastic Orion happening, or even necessary.
So wardancers aside, I'm quite pleased with the releases as well as with the (surprisingly) lower prices. To the point I'll probably buy some fantasy figures for the first time in 7 years, maybe even get enough to build an army with! Craziness!
I think the Orion model is pretty good still. I'm bidding on a DE dragon atm which I'll convert to a forest dragon if I win. Wardancers I was thinking converting witch elves? And for treekin I'm gonna convert river trolls into forest trolls. I love all the new models and I'm really excited for this book.
I use OK Yheti's as Treekin. In fact the majority of people in my gaming group simply call them "Yheti-Kin" To the point that when i called them Treekin once he was like "um, what are Treekin?" He actually thought they were called Yheti-kin. Paint them in a Sasquatch-gorilla way and they look great with the rest of the models.
malfred wrote: Is the entire book limited release or is this a limited release version of it?
Just the limited edition of the codex, like the other previous new codex's that GW has been releasing. The normal codex is still on sale and should be for ages
I just realized- GW is releasing the book in the first week this time. Does that mean they realized that people won't buy models until they've seen how many they're allowed to field together, etc? And that it puts a crimp in the impulse buy when they can't do that?
Either way, the book coming out first is a welcome bit of common sense
RiTides wrote: I just realized- GW is releasing the book in the first week this time. Does that mean they realized that people won't buy models until they've seen how many they're allowed to field together, etc? And that it puts a crimp in the impulse buy when they can't do that?
Either way, the book coming out first is a welcome bit of common sense
Mr Morden wrote: Is it just me or does the way that she is holding the bow just look wrong?
Yep, looks like the bow arm is twice as long as the other one. The illustrator probably sent a WIP file by accident, or thought it isn't that obvious, if it's printed as a small filler picture in the rulebook. Then they made it the cover. Oops
edit: actually it's probably a WIP version of the picture, as her leg-torso relatonship looks a bit weird too. Actually almost looks like she's a centaur and the other elf is sitting on her back facing rear But yeah, with digital illustration, you don't have to completely finish a pose at first, as you can easily move and resize stuff later. Many digital artists work by moving around the canvas and going back and forth between composition, posing and detail, so you can have this kind of perspective errors in WIP pieces.
I think she also has the arrow the wrong way round?
I really liked the image when I first saw it built now keep seeing odd things about it - unless she does have odd arms - there is some new fluff about the sisters...........
Tith Tatha was a Wood Elf born not like the rest; she was born with a rare mutation that caused one of her arms to have an exaggerated growth compared to the other. This gave her a lopsided appearance and was the source of much ridicule throughout her youth.
However she was also born with an indomitable character. Each insulting word was shrugged aside, each jab or kick was at first taken; later deflected and finally retaliated against. By the time she was a young adult she'd gained a fearsome reputation; despite her disfigurement she had managed to gain if not respect, at least the fear of those who might try to abuse her.
This character set her in good standing for when she came to join the army and help defend her people and the woods she'd grown up within (with many a grove the secret hiding place from those raining words and kicks in her far distant youth).
It also came to be that whilst one arm was different than the other, this difference led to her unique ability with a bow; able to fire faster and harder than many of her "correct" sisters within the army. Such a feat soon gained her great renown within the ranks.
edit - it doesn't feel natural but if you stand kind of like she is with the rest set of your shoulders you can hold one arm lower than the other even if the other is straight because its crossing your body at an angle and as such isn't reaching downward as far as the other arm.
Well, she tried to join Mantic's Basilean Sisterhood, but they turned her down since both arms have to be super long to join, so she turned to a promising modelling career with the wood elves.
Blessings of the Ancients: Any model with this special rule adds +1 to cast when in a forest
Ambush from the Worldroots: A Wood Elf army can place an additional forest (use a citadel wood) on the battlefield. This is done during deployment and must be placed wholly on your half of the battlefield. This is not mysterious terrain - declare it's type when you place it. If you cannot fit it, love other pieces of terrain by shortest necessary distance until it's possible to place. If a forest cannot be placed or the scenario means the Woof Elf army does not have a table half in which to deploy, this forest is not used.
Forest Spirit: Models with this special rule have the Forest Strider special rule and it's attacks (shooting and combat) are magical. In addition, if the model is not a mount, it has a 6+ ward and Immume to Psychology.
Forest Stalker: Models with this special rule have the Forest Strider special rule. In addition, if at least half it's models are within a forest:
- All models that have the Forest Stalker special rule fire in one more rank than normal (if the unit chooses to Volley Fire, this will mean that all the models in the front three ranks and half the models in forth and subsequent ranks are able to shoot)
- All models that have the Forest Stalker special rule can make supporting attacks with one extra rank than normal. This is cumulative with other special rules that allow models to fight in extra ranks.
- All models that have the Forest Stalker special rule (but not their mounts) re-roll all To Wound rolls of a 1 in combat.
Most Elven units also have, as expected, Always Strikes first.
So basically a mix of High and Dark Elf special rules if you're in a forest.
Magic: Spellsinger use one of the eight battle magic lores. Spellweavers use High Magic or Dark Magic or one of the eight other lores, but High Magic and Dark Magic have their own attributes:
High Magic attribute: Whenever a Wood Elf Wizard successfully casts a spell from this lore, and it is not dispelled, place a protection counter next to him once the spell has been resolved. Whenever the Wizard (or a model in the same unit as him) suffers an unsaved Wound and there are one or more protection counters next to him, remove a protection counter and treat the Wound as if it had been saved. (WOW!)
Dark Magic attribute: Whenever a Wood Elf Wizard successfully casts a spell from this lore, and the spell is not dispelled, place a vengeance counter next to each target once the spell has been resolved (do not place counters next to friendly units). Whenver a unit with vengeance counters suffers hits from a spell from the Lore of Dark Magic, remove those counters and increase the number of hits inflicted by D3 for each vengeance counter removed (roll separately for each counter).
The Armoury of Torgovann:
Asrai Longbow: 30" Range, Str 3, Armour Piercing, Volley Fire
Moonfire Shot: 30" Range, Str 3, Armour Piercing, Flaming Attacks, Volley Fire. Hits from Moonfire Shot have +1 on rolls to Wound against units with a majority model count from Forces of Order.
Starfire Shafts: 30" Range, Str 3, Armour Piercing, Flaming Attacks, Volley Fire. Hits from Moonfire Shot have +1 on rolls to Wound against units with a majority model count from Forces of Destruction.
Trueflight Arrows: 30" Range, Str 3, Armour Piercing, Volley Fire
Shooting attacks made with Trueflight Arrows do not suffer To Hit penalties.
New Units/Models:
Wildwood Rangers: Elven profile with WS5. Always Strikes First, Forest Stalker, Immune to Psychology and
Guardians of the Wildwood: If a model with this rule is in base contact with one model with Fear or Terror, it has +1 Attack.
Armed with Great Weapons & Light Armour.
Sisters of the Thorn: Elven profile with BS5. Always Strikes First, Forest Stalker, Fast Cavalry, Poisoned Attacks (Riders Only), 4+ Ward and:
Deepwood Coven: A unit of sisters is considered a Level 2 Wizard with the spells Shield of Thorns (Lore of Life) and Curse lf Anraheir (Lore of Beasts). This doesn't prevent other wizards knowing the same spells. Recievs +1 to cast for each rank of 5 after the first to a max of +3. Choose one sister for the caster or target for purposes of line of sight, range etc. Miscast results in d3 wounds with no saves of any kind allowed.
Lvl 1 Wizard that uses Beasts, Blessings of the Ancients, Flammable, Forest Spirit, Frenzy, Hatred, Large Target, Scaly Skin (3+), Stubborn, Terror;
Tree Whack: Make a Tree Whack attack in place of attacking. Must be declared before rolling to hit. Nominate enemy model in base contact. This model must pass an Initiative test or suffer D6 wounds with no armour saves allowed. May be used in a challenge.
A Lamentation of Despairs: 12" Range, Str 2, Killing Blow, Multiple Shots (2d6)
Araloth: M5, WS8, BS7, S4, T3, W3, I8, A5, Ld10
Always Strikes First, Forest Stalker, Stubborn;
Boldest of the Bold: Whilst Araloth is a lone character, he has Unbreakable (replaces Stubborn)
Favour of the Goddess: 4+ Ward Save
Skaryn the Eye Thief: Nominate a single enemy model within 18" of Araloth. This model takes a Str 4 hit. If wound is unsaved and the wound roll was a 6, model suffers -5 penalty to Weapon Skill and Initiative (to a minimum of 1) for the rest of the game. A model can only suffer this penalty once.
So I hope you guys enjoyed those special rules! We will some upcoming articles very soon about the existing units and the Armoury - my contact gave me EVERYTHING!
This one seems a potential tricky one for tournaments,
Ambush from the Worldroots: A Wood Elf army can place an additional forest (use a citadel wood) on the battlefield. This is done during deployment and must be placed wholly on your half of the battlefield. This is not mysterious terrain - declare it's type when you place it. If you cannot fit it, love other pieces of terrain by shortest necessary distance until it's possible to place. If a forest cannot be placed or the scenario means the Woof Elf army does not have a table half in which to deploy, this forest is not used
use it to move pre-placed terrain out of the way either to benefit you, or block off your opponant
The new cav units seem really, unbelievably fragile. They're like naked people riding naked horses. Which is a shame, because I really like the models.
I somewhat expected them to be a bit fragile, maybe as an harrassment unit, but its strange to see the wild-riders being fragile as well for something that looks like it wants to be getting right into the meat of the battle. Still might be that they make good warmachine, lone mage hunters and flanking support attackers.
Wild Riders are S5 2A on the charge with ASF. You use them to join a battle Eternal Guard are holding, or you use them when you know you can rip through a unit. I'm sorry, but for the points value, on the charge, the same points of a 240 treeman (5A) gets you the attacks of 3 treemen (9 Wild Riders, 2 ranks 14A) with ASF . Wild Riders are not MEANT to need defense, you have to play them as a glass cannon. They can be VERY deadly if you just don't get them locked up with a giant block.
The real question I want answered, is will Wood Elf characters get access to Heavy Armour and Barding, or will be forever stuck at 4+/4++ being the best we can get without armour of silvered steel?
Acorns of the Ages: One use only. At the start of the game after battlefield has been set up, but before deployment, place d3 citadel woods on the battlefield. Can be placed anywhere at least 1" away from another terrain feature and the edge of the battlefield. Once all forests have been placed, scatter each 2d6". If that lands within 1" or on top of other terrain, or within 1" of battlefield edge, reduce or increase scatter by smallest amount necessary to avoid obstruction. Once this has been done, delcare which type of Mysterious Forest you want these to be - all forests must be the same type.
Takes care of my max roll.
Man I am pumped for this release the rules are AWESOME.
Spirit Sword... lul
The Spirit Sword: Amour saves cannot be taken against Wounds caused by the Spirit Sword. Furthermore, immediately when an enemy character, champion or monster suffers one or more unsaved Wounds from the Spirit Sword, both he and the wielder must roll a 2d6 and add their respective Leadership values. If the wounded model's total is higher or the totals are the same, nothing else happens. If the wounded model's total is lower, it immediately suffers a Wound for each point by which it's total was exceeded, with no armour saves allowed.
The new cav units seem really, unbelievably fragile. They're like naked people riding naked horses. Which is a shame, because I really like the models.
That's because they are naked people riding horses.
I'm just excited to use the enchanted arrows. Why yes, I WILL take twice as many shots for only 4pts a model on all my glade guard thank you. And I will run some Glade Riders with Arcane Bodkins for 5pts a model and ambush out of nowhere shooting into heavily armored blocks.
ALSO
Drycha has the ability to "wake" Forest Spirits from a wood. (basically deep strike reserves) BUT Combine Drycha + Acorn enchantment (D3 Woods placed on the table) means you can drop a max of 4 woods on the table, 3 of which can be put in the enemy deployment zone, then on turn two you can awaken a treeman using Drycha RIGHT BEHIND THEIR LINES.
Do you understand how much fun it will be to have a treeman come out of nowhere and charge into the rear of an enemy? Not to mention, even if he doesn't the new 12" D6+1 S5 Strangle root attack can be just as fun to harrass with.
More for the rest of us. I'm unsure what the big deal about Wood Elves sharing HE Aesthetic is. One thing I absolutely love about the new book is how they really sell the idea that Wood Elves are the middle ground between High Elves and Dark Elves and even different realms within Athel Loren are closer to one or the other. Eternal Guard has always been less guerilla warfare and more tradition Elf-based combat so it doesn't bother me at all that they would also wear more traditional elf armor. Different areas of Athel Loren are differently fielded. If you lived in Fyr Derrec you're not going to field many Eternal guard because you're a bunch of crazy wardancing tricksters, if you live in Cavaroc you're going to be focusing on mounted units and staying away from Way Watchers, or Rangers that would rely more on wooded cover. However, there is an entire realm within Athel Loren that are Wood Elves who practice more like High Elves (Just as there is a Darker, grim, DE realm too) so It makes sense that they would field large units of more traditionally armored Eternal Guard.
I mean sure, it would be nice to sit the army down and feel starkingly different from HE and DE, but I for one like the way that they have made these three books feel cohesive, made it feel like three races of the same species. They will have similarities, but also differences.
SmurfInABlender wrote: More for the rest of us. I'm unsure what the big deal about Wood Elves sharing HE Aesthetic is. One thing I absolutely love about the new book is how they really sell the idea that Wood Elves are the middle ground between High Elves and Dark Elves and even different realms within Athel Loren are closer to one or the other. Eternal Guard has always been less guerilla warfare and more tradition Elf-based combat so it doesn't bother me at all that they would also wear more traditional elf armor. Different areas of Athel Loren are differently fielded. If you lived in Fyr Derrec you're not going to field many Eternal guard because you're a bunch of crazy wardancing tricksters, if you live in Cavaroc you're going to be focusing on mounted units and staying away from Way Watchers, or Rangers that would rely more on wooded cover. However, there is an entire realm within Athel Loren that are Wood Elves who practice more like High Elves (Just as there is a Darker, grim, DE realm too) so It makes sense that they would field large units of more traditionally armored Eternal Guard.
I mean sure, it would be nice to sit the army down and feel starkingly different from HE and DE, but I for one like the way that they have made these three books feel cohesive, made it feel like three races of the same species. They will have similarities, but also differences.
+1 I agree whole heartily with this post. Wood elves happened before the sundering which makes sense why they are a mix between the two. Similar but still much different
The only thing I really want to see GW push a little more with the WE is the beasties. They've already done this well with the new Treeman having familiars and with the stag riders - and with the character raptor bird. Now can we get some more beasties please GW (heck I'd love a "familiars" optional bits sprue with a selection of creatures to use as decoration).
Automatically Appended Next Post: New stuf on the GW page
I'm telling you, replace your ugly treekin with Yehtees. Join the Yehti-Kin parade! We are a beastly bunch!
Also I agree that the spites and stuff are fun. The Treeman box has like 6 optional spites which is cool, and great to use for other models, esspecially since "spites" are gone from the book except a couple key places (I think Durthu has a special rule that is something one of the old Spites used to be) SPITES EVERYWHERE!
I also like that Orion has hounds, but you can't field hounds anywhere else. Could definitely see more beasties, however with the new books push on the Elves vs. Beastmen thing, I think it creates an interesting dichotomy where the Trees side with the Elves and the Beasts of the forest side with the Beastmen. I don't know why they do, don't they know Beastmen are terrible? ;-)
They also appear to be doing a whole set of "How to Paint" ibooks - each model book sold separately instead of a single "how to paint" book.
I just want a "how to paint realms" book (Or a Heraldry book like the Empire and HE have....) The current book doesn't have anything to show what a Fyr Derric banner looks like, just a couple war dancers!
It's a shame if WE abandon the animal element - I would have thought that a prime area for them!
Also its interesting to see that the 3 treeman 2 dryad boxed set is actually a formal boxed set with its own box. A curious choice by GW to box that together but still not provide a core army option. I wonder if you can do a nearly all treeman legal army in the new codex
Overread wrote: It's a shame if WE abandon the animal element - I would have thought that a prime area for them!
Also its interesting to see that the 3 treeman 2 dryad boxed set is actually a formal boxed set with its own box. A curious choice by GW to box that together but still not provide a core army option. I wonder if you can do a nearly all treeman legal army in the new codex
Overread wrote: It's a shame if WE abandon the animal element - I would have thought that a prime area for them!
Also its interesting to see that the 3 treeman 2 dryad boxed set is actually a formal boxed set with its own box. A curious choice by GW to box that together but still not provide a core army option. I wonder if you can do a nearly all treeman legal army in the new codex
Dryads are Core.
Sorry poor wording on my part - mean core more like the old battle boxes and most of the current army deals we've seen would have a majority of core troop choices with variety.
Overread wrote: It's a shame if WE abandon the animal element - I would have thought that a prime area for them!
Also its interesting to see that the 3 treeman 2 dryad boxed set is actually a formal boxed set with its own box. A curious choice by GW to box that together but still not provide a core army option. I wonder if you can do a nearly all treeman legal army in the new codex
Dryads are Core.
Sorry poor wording on my part - mean core more like the old battle boxes and most of the current army deals we've seen would have a majority of core troop choices with variety.
I agree, its a peculiar pairing but have you seen the online bundle?!
Overread wrote: It's a shame if WE abandon the animal element - I would have thought that a prime area for them!
Also its interesting to see that the 3 treeman 2 dryad boxed set is actually a formal boxed set with its own box. A curious choice by GW to box that together but still not provide a core army option. I wonder if you can do a nearly all treeman legal army in the new codex
Dryads are Core.
Sorry poor wording on my part - mean core more like the old battle boxes and most of the current army deals we've seen would have a majority of core troop choices with variety.
I agree, its a peculiar pairing but have you seen the online bundle?!
Its just so pretty, so wonderful, so alluring. Sigh, Its like, do I want this, or do I want to stay married? So many hard decisions.
If it were not for my backlog I'd be really eager for that deal. Thing is I did hte maths - you save in £ about £8 which is about 2% of the price. On a £400 set that's a pretty poor saving; at least not enough of a saving on a deal to make me really go "Oh I really want that". Would have been nice if they could have made it at least a nice £12 or so then at least you can think you're getting one hero model for free - push it up to £20 and I think many more would be keen to order direct from GW for a big order.
RiTides wrote: Any word on dryad unit type? Are they ranked units now as rumored, or still skirmishing? Any new options for them?
Ranked, S3, 6+ ward, one point less.
The ONLY unit IMO that got the short end of the new book, I don't even mind giving up the S4 bows at half range, or the move-and-shoot of Gladeguard because the rest of the armies bows go up, all bows have Armor piercing and the Enchanted arrows are juicy.
Dryads are a rough burn, but the rest of the book makes up for it EASY.
EDIT: Only thing that Skirmishes now are Wardancers, Way Watchers and "Scouts" which have been moved from a Glade Guard upgrade into their own Special category.
Sigvatr wrote: Dryads got a big buff by not being Skirmishers, though - no more auto-Steadfast and auto-SCR disadvantage of 3.
True, really the truth is not necessarily that they got nerfed or buffed, but more the role of Dryads in the army changed fairly drastically. Which in a way it is good because it finally makes Wardancers relevant again.
Kroothawk wrote: Who else wants to see a mounted standard bearer with no saddle or reins charge through a dense forest
Those mounts don't even have stirrups! Those riders would be launched out of their saddles on the first leap! There's artistic license and there's not giving any thought to what one's doing. Or maybe the designers just don't care anymore. Can't blame them...
Kroothawk wrote: Who else wants to see a mounted standard bearer with no saddle or reins charge through a dense forest
Those mounts don't even have stirrups! Those riders would be launched out of their saddles on the first leap! There's artistic license and there's not giving any thought to what one's doing. Or maybe the designers just don't care anymore. Can't blame them...
Riding without a saddle is actually possible, and has been done quite a bit, and the mounts there do have a stirrup of a sort, its more like a step.
Kroothawk wrote: Who else wants to see a mounted standard bearer with no saddle or reins charge through a dense forest
Those mounts don't even have stirrups! Those riders would be launched out of their saddles on the first leap! There's artistic license and there's not giving any thought to what one's doing. Or maybe the designers just don't care anymore. Can't blame them...
Riding without a saddle is actually possible, and has been done quite a bit, and the mounts there do have a stirrup of a sort, its more like a step.
Not to mention, they are effectively "ghosts" or "spirits brought back to life" so REALLY they don't give an eff about physics.
Icculus wrote: Riding without a saddle is actually possible, and has been done quite a bit, and the mounts there do have a stirrup of a sort, its more like a step.
When riding a horse at a steady trot? Yes. When riding a stag hopping around at a gallop? I don't think so.
SmurfInABlender wrote: Not to mention, they are effectively "ghosts" or "spirits brought back to life" so REALLY they don't give an eff about physics.
Sisters of the Thorn aren't ghosts and yet they have to do with the same mounts.
WE have been surfing on the backs of eagles for ages now. Their new stag mounts are basically using the same mechanic, only using a metal long side stirrup instead of having their feet astride the beasts back.
So they are somewhat defying normal conventional riding mechanics because they are most certainly not using their thighs to hold onto the mount; but they are very much keeping with what WE can do in the fantasy world GW has made.
Edit - if we want to get really pedantic and compare to the real world most deer are not even well suited to riding; let alone riding with an armed rider. Their backs are not built like a horses and most can't take a single point of weight (rider) without back problems. They can pull a sledge because the weight distribution is spread out - same way that llama can carry heavy packs but also can't take a rider.
SmurfInABlender wrote: More for the rest of us. I'm unsure what the big deal about Wood Elves sharing HE Aesthetic is
Because if I wanted a HE aesthetic I would have collected HE. I liked that WE had a unique aesthetic, it's a large part of the reason I decided to collect them in the first place some 10 years ago. Luckily they haven't gone full cone-head yet, I frakking hate the cone heads, lol.
Icculus wrote: Riding without a saddle is actually possible, and has been done quite a bit, and the mounts there do have a stirrup of a sort, its more like a step.
When riding a horse at a steady trot? Yes. When riding a stag hopping around at a gallop? I don't think so.
Icculus wrote: Riding without a saddle is actually possible, and has been done quite a bit, and the mounts there do have a stirrup of a sort, its more like a step.
When riding a horse at a steady trot? Yes. When riding a stag hopping around at a gallop? I don't think so.
SmurfInABlender wrote: Not to mention, they are effectively "ghosts" or "spirits brought back to life" so REALLY they don't give an eff about physics.
Sisters of the Thorn aren't ghosts and yet they have to do with the same mounts.
ClockworkZion wrote:Magic Boots. There, problem solved.
malfred wrote:Yeah, there's artistic license and there's rule of cool.
Not cool when your big proud banner gets entangled in the forest you try to protect, magic boots or no It's like Valhallans wearing Waikiki shirts: It just doesn't fit the surrounding. Designers haven't thought about these folks living in a forest.
Designer's note from this week's WD basically says if Wood Elves can stand on Warhawks in mid-flight they can definitely stand on the backs of these Stags.
ClockworkZion wrote:Magic Boots. There, problem solved.
malfred wrote:Yeah, there's artistic license and there's rule of cool.
Not cool when your big proud banner gets entangled in the forest you try to protect, magic boots or no It's like Valhallans wearing Waikiki shirts: It just doesn't fit the surrounding. Designers haven't thought about these folks living in a forest.
Pfft you're clearly not thinking straight. These are Wood Elves, they can summon forests to battlefields and have massive walking trees come to wage war with them. Clearly asking the trees and branches to rise and fold aside as they charge through the forests with their weapons and banners is a trivial thing for them.
Actually I can see it now - you're a small squad walking through the woodland, then out of the blue the trees start to sway, like a mighty wind was blowing through them, but without the wind. The branches fold up and back and then through the new passageway come charging the stag riding elves - banners high and flicking before they lower and strike!
The Wild Riders-- I like them. Except that the antlers look bolted on rather than organically growing out of their heads like antlers. That makes them look strange. Other than that I like them. So I looked at the price. Hey, just a bit more than the Glade Riders. Not bad. And then I looked at the model count
Something tells me WFB players are going to need to buy quite a few boxes for a viable unit unless they just want a tiny one to ride around preventing marching, trying to flank or going after war engines and stuff. Assuming you still do that in WFB, I haven't played since 6th edition. I was planning on using the Wild Riders in skirmish gaming as I think they'd look great on 40mm warmachine style bases. Like this historical miniatures:
So, the artist who did the cover image decided that apparently, Wood Elves look "too faerie" and decided to make them bulkier and scarier to convey the idea that they're "better than humans".
How did he do this? By... drawing a constipated Leonidas from 300. Slowclap, someone is totally missing the point of Wood Elves...
After reading the fluff for the Rangers, the fact that they use their axes primarily on forest spirits makes sense once you learn that they basically exist to keep the Wildwood in check, which is where the most dangerous and malicious forest spirits are kept.
frozenwastes wrote: The Wild Riders-- I like them. Except that the antlers look bolted on rather than organically growing out of their heads like antlers. That makes them look strange. Other than that I like them. So I looked at the price. Hey, just a bit more than the Glade Riders. Not bad. And then I looked at the model count
Something tells me WFB players are going to need to buy quite a few boxes for a viable unit unless they just want a tiny one to ride around preventing marching, trying to flank or going after war engines and stuff. Assuming you still do that in WFB, I haven't played since 6th edition. I was planning on using the Wild Riders in skirmish gaming as I think they'd look great on 40mm warmachine style bases. Like this historical miniatures:
Spoiler:
We get it. GW has expensive minis. You don't need to keep reminding us. Beginning to think you work commission for those companies! And really, quality doesn't compare. Those continue to look like Ral Partha minis from like 20 years ago.
No, even Eternal Guard are just plain Core choices now, rather than Special-unless-you-have-a-noble. Sadly.
No more Wild Hunt armies, no more Drycha Spirit armies, and every army is an Eternal Guard army, because seriously, Archers are exactly the same as before except they got a minor close combat boost and can buy magic arrows at 3-5 points per model.
For those with the book, roughly how large is this army? Everything you'd need to play 2500 or 3k list with plenty of options? Barely enough to play a 2500 or 3k list if you upgraded everything and maxed out magic items? Is it just "A good start" and you still need another $200 to make it playable? I've been out of WHFB so long I don't know if that's way more than I'd need or just not enough for a viable army.
Furyou Miko wrote: No, even Eternal Guard are just plain Core choices now, rather than Special-unless-you-have-a-noble. Sadly.
No more Wild Hunt armies, no more Drycha Spirit armies, and every army is an Eternal Guard army, because seriously, Archers are exactly the same as before except they got a minor close combat boost and can buy magic arrows at 3-5 points per model.
What do the magic arrows do? I guess +1S or anything similar? 3-5 points per model is really expensive.
Sigvatr wrote: What do the magic arrows do? I guess +1S or anything similar? 3-5 points per model is really expensive.
Depending on which ones you buy they either have a -3 armour saving throw modifier, poisoned, flaming, +1 to wound roles versus units from Forces of Destruction armies and flaming, +1 to wound against units from Forces of Order armies and flaming, Multiple Shots (2), and no to-hit penalties.
Furyou Miko wrote: No, even Eternal Guard are just plain Core choices now, rather than Special-unless-you-have-a-noble. Sadly.
No more Wild Hunt armies, no more Drycha Spirit armies, and every army is an Eternal Guard army, because seriously, Archers are exactly the same as before except they got a minor close combat boost and can buy magic arrows at 3-5 points per model.
What do the magic arrows do? I guess +1S or anything similar? 3-5 points per model is really expensive.
-3 armour
Poison
Multiple shots 2
Tomb Kings Arrows
+1 to wound order, flaming
+1 to wound destruction, flaming
For those with the book, roughly how large is this army? Everything you'd need to play 2500 or 3k list with plenty of options? Barely enough to play a 2500 or 3k list if you upgraded everything and maxed out magic items? Is it just "A good start" and you still need another $200 to make it playable? I've been out of WHFB so long I don't know if that's way more than I'd need or just not enough for a viable army.
With no upgrades:
2775
If you build Durthu as a Treeman Ancient
2680
If you built Durthu as a Treeman:
2615
From the looks of things the multi-unit kits cost the same points per model.
Furyou Miko wrote: No, even Eternal Guard are just plain Core choices now, rather than Special-unless-you-have-a-noble. Sadly.
No more Wild Hunt armies, no more Drycha Spirit armies, and every army is an Eternal Guard army, because seriously, Archers are exactly the same as before except they got a minor close combat boost and can buy magic arrows at 3-5 points per model.
What do the magic arrows do? I guess +1S or anything similar? 3-5 points per model is really expensive.
-3 armour Poison Multiple shots 2 Tomb Kings Arrows +1 to wound order, flaming +1 to wound destruction, flaming
Thanks for posting!
Those are some really strong bonuses though. The -3 to armor is a godsend and counters the main weakness bows have. It certainly comes at a high price, but Elven armor-denying archers are nothing to joke about. Poison is worthless, of course, as you lack the sheer volume of fire to make it effective.
Furyou Miko wrote: No, even Eternal Guard are just plain Core choices now, rather than Special-unless-you-have-a-noble. Sadly.
No more Wild Hunt armies, no more Drycha Spirit armies, and every army is an Eternal Guard army, because seriously, Archers are exactly the same as before except they got a minor close combat boost and can buy magic arrows at 3-5 points per model.
What do the magic arrows do? I guess +1S or anything similar? 3-5 points per model is really expensive.
-3 armour
Poison
Multiple shots 2
Tomb Kings Arrows
+1 to wound order, flaming
+1 to wound destruction, flaming
Thanks for posting!
Those are some really strong bonuses though. The -3 to armor is a godsend and counters the main weakness bows have. It certainly comes at a high price, but Elven armor-denying archers are nothing to joke about. Poison is worthless, of course, as you lack the sheer volume of fire to make it effective.
-3 armour was the most expensive option iirc, I think that Tomb Kings and multi shots will be the most commonly taken ones if taken, it was quite amusing hitting my opponents CoK from 30" away through hard cover on a 3+.
It should be noted that the arrows are magical, so destroy ethereal counts and bounce off BotWD.
Lets face it, with Dryads becoming mysteriously 1 point cheaper and gaining Hatred, while Archers remained the same but got options to make them even more expensive, it's obvious what Games Workshop want us to be playing with Wood Elves.
We're not "the shooty army" any more. We're just another fragile melee army with some over-priced archers.
Well, it's not quite fair to say archers stayed the same. They got some nice... close combat buffs. What.
We get it. GW has expensive minis. You don't need to keep reminding us. Beginning to think you work commission for those companies! And really, quality doesn't compare. Those continue to look like Ral Partha minis from like 20 years ago.
Dude, that picture was just to show an example of how good cav can look on round bases. Like the LOTR horses that GW sold when that game was popular back in the day. I have no idea who makes the figures in the picture and yeah, I don't really like them either. The Wild Riders though, look pretty cool. I'm sure someone will eventually paint one up on a awesome round display base or as part of a diorama. I might get a single one from a ebay single figure bitz seller as I think they'd be pretty cool in individually based skirmish gaming.
How many wild riders are you planning on getting? Given the current state of WFB, how many will you need for a unit that actually matters on the table?
We get it. GW has expensive minis. You don't need to keep reminding us. Beginning to think you work commission for those companies! And really, quality doesn't compare. Those continue to look like Ral Partha minis from like 20 years ago.
Dude, that picture was just to show an example of how good cav can look on round bases. Like the LOTR horses that GW sold when that game was popular back in the day. I have no idea who makes the figures in the picture and yeah, I don't really like them either. The Wild Riders though, look pretty cool. I'm sure someone will eventually paint one up on a awesome round display base or as part of a diorama. I might get a single one from a ebay single figure bitz seller as I think they'd be pretty cool in individually based skirmish gaming.
How many wild riders are you planning on getting? Given the current state of WFB, how many will you need for a unit that actually matters on the table?
My apologies. Confused you with someone earlier who it seemed was also pimping historical minis as an alternative. Actual reading comprehension on my part shows that's now what you were doing.
I agree that buying large units of cavalry are expensive. I also have never really thought of 8th as a game for large units of cavalry though (Bretts excepted, of course). Small units to, like you said, march block and go after other weaker chaff seem to be their best role right now. Especially light cav, who can also try to put pressure on War Machines. I've never really cared too much what base a model was on, except in the cases of super ornate bases. Round, square, rectangle. All the same really when rocked and flocked, to me at least.
streamdragon wrote: I agree that buying large units of cavalry are expensive. I also have never really thought of 8th as a game for large units of cavalry though (Bretts excepted, of course). Small units to, like you said, march block and go after other weaker chaff seem to be their best role right now. Especially light cav, who can also try to put pressure on War Machines.
Hopefully the wild riders will work well enough in that role that buying a single box, painting them up and getting them on the table will be experience where what is bought actually feels like it matters to the game.
I've never really cared too much what base a model was on, except in the cases of super ornate bases. Round, square, rectangle. All the same really when rocked and flocked, to me at least.
I'm a round base guy. I played WFB during 5th and 6th edition and had fun with it, but never really liked the square bases. I've been grabbing single figure WFB figures off of eBay and it's amazing how good some of them look as individual models rather than in ranks. Though some look much, much better in formation.
I think the wild riders will look really good in fives on the table. With the leaping poses, they might get busy looking in multiple ranks.
From the looks of things the multi-unit kits cost the same points per model.
Thanks for that! I'm not sure i'd pick up that box set all at once, but it gives me a great place to start building toward and a good idea of what it'll take to get back into the game
Bases mini rant:
Spoiler:
I actually intensely dislike round bases for cavalry, bikes and jetbikes as well as prone figures, it's all that extra wasted space on the sides of the figures. I'm a big fan of the pill-shape bases such as the newer bike bases used in 40k, although I really with they had been 40mm wide (25mm isn't wide enough for space marine bikes). It's a footprint thing, and it's an anal-retentive OCD thing, i like bases just slightly larger than the model itself that are the same thickness and bevel and match the shape. Mixed bases, specifically squares mixed in with circles/ovals or GW bases mixed with warmachine rounded bevels just absolutely drives me bonkers, as does models with integral bases simply glued on top of a normal base so it looks like every figure is standing atop a mound that the modeler usually doesn't even try to disguise as being an integral base glued on top of a normal base. Or slotta bases that don't have the extra slot filled in. Or basing materials that aren't consistent throughout the army. Did I mention it's an OCD anal-retentive thing?
Although I like round and oval/pill bases better, for Warhammer Fantasy with everythign needing to rank up the square bases just make sense, otherwise you'd need War of the Ring style movement trays
malfred wrote: Is the entire book limited release or is this a limited release version of it?
Erm ... there is a standard and a limited edition of the armybook, the latter is sold out outside North America:
Seems the Codex MT desaster got a few people confused, thinking that Codices and armybooks in general might be a limited release. Well done GW!
What is going on with that Elf's arms? The one in the foreground has her right arm fully extended, drawing the string back towards herself, meanwhile her left arm is bending at the elbow. She's holding the bow directly in front of her, not to the left side.
The only way that could happen is if her left arm is quite considerably longer than her right...
malfred wrote: Is the entire book limited release or is this a limited release version of it?
Erm ... there is a standard and a limited edition of the armybook, the latter is sold out outside North America:
Seems the Codex MT desaster got a few people confused, thinking that Codices and armybooks in general might be a limited release. Well done GW!
What is going on with that Elf's arms? The one in the foreground has her right arm fully extended, drawing the string back towards herself, meanwhile her left arm is bending at the elbow. She's holding the bow directly in front of her, not to the left side.
The only way that could happen is if her left arm is quite considerably longer than her right...
I know I've harped on the WE release, but in all honesty now I have to say this is alongside Dwarfs as one of the least disappointing WHFB army releases in a long time. Treemen are not on extremely massive bases (only MC Cav bases at 50x75) and the $ cost in general is ~10% less and in some cases, much, much more ($47 for units of 10 vs. $70 for dwarfs/DE which is around 30%). The real shame is that they're still pushing $100 creatures and $25 characters and horrendously priced limited edition army books.
malfred wrote: Is the entire book limited release or is this a limited release version of it?
Erm ... there is a standard and a limited edition of the armybook, the latter is sold out outside North America:
Seems the Codex MT desaster got a few people confused, thinking that Codices and armybooks in general might be a limited release. Well done GW!
What is going on with that Elf's arms? The one in the foreground has her right arm fully extended, drawing the string back towards herself, meanwhile her left arm is bending at the elbow. She's holding the bow directly in front of her, not to the left side.
The only way that could happen is if her left arm is quite considerably longer than her right...
I just tried that pose myself- the picture is a bit misleading as to where the drawstring and the bow is.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ehsteve wrote: I know I've harped on the WE release, but in all honesty now I have to say this is alongside Dwarfs as one of the least disappointing WHFB army releases in a long time. Treemen are not on extremely massive bases (only MC Cav bases at 50x75) and the $ cost in general is ~10% less and in some cases, much, much more ($47 for units of 10 vs. $70 for dwarfs/DE which is around 30%). The real shame is that they're still pushing $100 creatures and $25 characters and horrendously priced limited edition army books.
I thought aside from the ridiculous core unit names- courtesy of Mat Ward- the Dark Elves were in fact a good release also.
Aye you can hold your arms in the same or similar pose as the elf because one arm is crossing her body, this its losing length; whilst the other is held down straight - thus it can reach lower.
Krellnus wrote: +1 to wound order, flaming
+1 to wound destruction, flaming
I have not played WFB for a long time, is there now some clear, official separation between forces of order and forces of destruction ? Where do the “neutral” armies like Orcs, Gobelins, Ogre, Tomb king go ? All destruction ? Also, where do Wood Elves themselves go ?
Krellnus wrote: +1 to wound order, flaming
+1 to wound destruction, flaming
I have not played WFB for a long time, is there now some clear, official separation between forces of order and forces of destruction ? Where do the “neutral” armies like Orcs, Gobelins, Ogre, Tomb king go ? All destruction ? Also, where do Wood Elves themselves go ?
Ogres and Tomb Kings were the only neutral armies. Orcs and Goblins are destruction (strangely )
Krellnus wrote: +1 to wound order, flaming
+1 to wound destruction, flaming
I have not played WFB for a long time, is there now some clear, official separation between forces of order and forces of destruction ? Where do the “neutral” armies like Orcs, Gobelins, Ogre, Tomb king go ? All destruction ? Also, where do Wood Elves themselves go ?
Yes in the core rulebook there is a breakdown of who is order and who is destruction. Orcs and goblins are destruction, Tomb Kings and Ogres are the only Neutral armies. Wood Elves are Order.
Ehsteve wrote: I know I've harped on the WE release, but in all honesty now I have to say this is alongside Dwarfs as one of the least disappointing WHFB army releases in a long time. Treemen are not on extremely massive bases (only MC Cav bases at 50x75) and the $ cost in general is ~10% less and in some cases, much, much more ($47 for units of 10 vs. $70 for dwarfs/DE which is around 30%). The real shame is that they're still pushing $100 creatures and $25 characters and horrendously priced limited edition army books.
I thought aside from the ridiculous core unit names- courtesy of Mat Ward- the Dark Elves were in fact a good release also.
DE was more or less a completely static release. They maintain absolute auto-includes and the foundations of the army are pretty much exactly the same, just with hydras swapped for warlocks now. I didn't really consider the new DE book as anything actually...new in that it added very little if anything at all (except for butchering the names and fluff). Dwarfs and WE on the other hand got a massive revamp which proved much less of a disappointment than expected.
I wouldn't be surprised if they moved Wood Elves to Neutral in the next book, following this thinking:
1) It makes the Elven armies separate out to fill all three slots. This suits the way that they are treating the Woodies in this release, as between the other two.
2) They seem to be going for the Woodies as totally selfish and focused on defending their own turf; that is much the same as the Tomb Kings, also in Neutral.
Charles Rampant wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if they moved Wood Elves to Neutral in the next book, following this thinking:
1) It makes the Elven armies separate out to fill all three slots. This suits the way that they are treating the Woodies in this release, as between the other two.r
2) They seem to be going for the Woodies as totally selfish and focused on defending their own turf; that is much the same as the Tomb Kings, also in Neutral.
By that going, I'd change the froggies to neutral too though. Despite them certainly being good in terms of fighting Chaos, they also do not give a flying fly about anything but themselves and prefer chilling in their natural grown hot tubs
Charles Rampant wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if they moved Wood Elves to Neutral in the next book, following this thinking:
1) It makes the Elven armies separate out to fill all three slots. This suits the way that they are treating the Woodies in this release, as between the other two.r
2) They seem to be going for the Woodies as totally selfish and focused on defending their own turf; that is much the same as the Tomb Kings, also in Neutral.
By that going, I'd change the froggies to neutral too though. Despite them certainly being good in terms of fighting Chaos, they also do not give a flying fly about anything but themselves and prefer chilling in their natural grown hot tubs
Whoah! Hold on there. The whole raison detre of the "froggies" (or Hypno Toads as I like to call them) is to restore order to the Old World, albeit by bashing a few heads together. If that doesn't constitute an army of order, I'm not sure what does
Charles Rampant wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if they moved Wood Elves to Neutral in the next book, following this thinking:
1) It makes the Elven armies separate out to fill all three slots. This suits the way that they are treating the Woodies in this release, as between the other two.r 2) They seem to be going for the Woodies as totally selfish and focused on defending their own turf; that is much the same as the Tomb Kings, also in Neutral.
By that going, I'd change the froggies to neutral too though. Despite them certainly being good in terms of fighting Chaos, they also do not give a flying fly about anything but themselves and prefer chilling in their natural grown hot tubs
Nah, Lizardmen are pure order, through and through. The reason why they were created by the Old Ones was to carry out their will and ensure that balance is maintained in the world. They despise Chaos, considering them to be a great threat to their goals. The problem though, is that there may be some...translation errors. As it turns out, translating millennium old tablets written in an alien language isn't so easy.
Might be getting a box of those at some point.
I hope not.
