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Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 07:39:00


Post by: Jancoran


Let us begin.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 07:53:06


Post by: mrwhoop


I suppose I'll start by saying I have been waiting a long time for plastic Sisters and am really psyched to see them on the field again. I love the Seraphim strat for 12" pistol goodness to wreck a screen or if you wait to clear an objective holder in an out of the way position.


I am curious if anyone else wanted to model the Anchorite upgrade for the Mortifiers but found the pt cost a bit much to upgrade only the armor save?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 08:13:25


Post by: Shivan Reaper


I think the anchorite pt cost is worth it, especially since the mortifiers lose 1 on their fnp roll. What I am trying to figure out is what real use crusaders have besides possibly eating a smite or similar power. Yes they have storm shields, but they aren't much of an offensive threat, and they can't forcibly redirect wounds to themselves from other units.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 09:03:05


Post by: BrianDavion


So what's everyone think of the Chapter tactics? what are the good? what are the situational? what are the "word bearer equivilants"?



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 09:15:43


Post by: Spoletta


I don't care. Bloody roses all the way.

I like the paint scheme, so i was determined to find a way to make them good, even if i knew that getting a melee doctrine in a shooting army was hardly going to work... i was so happy to be proven wrong!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 09:19:03


Post by: Dr. Mills


Shivan Reaper wrote:
I think the anchorite pt cost is worth it, especially since the mortifiers lose 1 on their fnp roll. What I am trying to figure out is what real use crusaders have besides possibly eating a smite or similar power. Yes they have storm shields, but they aren't much of an offensive threat, and they can't forcibly redirect wounds to themselves from other units.


I find them useful for tarpitting a low attack, high damage/strength models. 3++ can be super annoying when leviathan dread bounces off it!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 09:20:22


Post by: mrwhoop


BrianDavion wrote:
So what's everyone think of the Chapter tactics? what are the good? what are the situational? what are the "word bearer equivilants"?



I personally am going for Ebon Chalice as my meta can be Smite/MW heavy and everyone having a 5+++ NOPE is special. There is talk of the Valorous Heart being good with an Imagifier to ignore -2 AP into 0 AP. Sitting back on an objective and make Raven Guard or other marine -2 AP into 0 AP is quite nice. Then if you like some melee punch (which is not that nice in this shooty edition) the Bloody Rose add an attack. Load up on Mortifiers and Pen. engines for loads of attacks on the charge. **Oops, not Order so Pens and Morts don't benefit...

And since I can't recall the other 3 Orders I imagine they're situational to meh but please feel free to correct me on that sentiment.

*edited on goof for Bloody Rose Order


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 09:25:37


Post by: BrianDavion


I'm pondering the sacred rose (I got into 40k through DOW and soulstorm gave me my love of sisters) or argent shroud, both seem decent and I just am finishing my black legion so I'm not terriably lnclined to do another black army


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 09:28:12


Post by: Lammia


BrianDavion wrote:
So what's everyone think of the Chapter tactics? what are the good? what are the situational? what are the "word bearer equivilants"?

Valorous Heart is the most genericly useful trait. But they are all viable; depending on what you're planning on doing...


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 09:35:38


Post by: Spoletta


I think that if you don't get a seizure for playing mulitple orders together (i do), in all AS armies you will have an Ebon detachment.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 09:45:17


Post by: Lammia


Terrible Knowledge is the best order WL trait, but idk that it's the best pick.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 10:51:24


Post by: tneva82


Quick question. The launch box. How many points it is? Haven't checked wargear but looks like not even 400?

What did i start...


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 11:00:40


Post by: Lammia


Side question. Are we all now going to make our actual Warlord a 45 point Canoness with Beacon of Faith and Litanies of Faith who we hide behind our backfield units for the re-rolls?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
tneva82 wrote:
Quick question. The launch box. How many points it is? Haven't checked wargear but looks like not even 400?

What did i start...
403-ish. But you can run it with other Imperium stuff too. (And it'll need a Priest in Matched Play)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 13:57:11


Post by: Frowbakk


A quick & easy conversion reminder: Kroot Rifles.

Any Tau player should have extras in their bits box, and the end part makes a good Inferno Pistol for Seraphim/ The Martyred Lady Relic Inferno Pistol.

With the Canoness with the robotic leg I'm going to modify the Plasma Pistol on her hip and either file it down or bui8ld it up a little with greenstuff so it's a holstered pistol. That way it can be anything and still be WYSIWYG.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 14:35:08


Post by: Crimson


I'm reiterating some of my questions from another thread here:

So what are people's thoughts on equipping the Superiors in general? They can have a melee weapon addition to their bolter and pistol (and as bolters are free you always want one.) All of these can also be traded for better weapons. A Power Maul actually seems pretty damn solid with the Bloody Rose rules. This is nice, though also means there is no reason to ever take a power sword, which seems a bit of a shame.

Also, what's the current ruling on trading items you have gained via trading? You can do that right? Because the Superior can trade their bolter for a bolt pistol and bolt pistols can be traded for better pistols. So this would allow for example dual wielding plasma pistols... Not necessarily super effective, but would look cool.



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 15:05:06


Post by: Mythantor


Lammia wrote:
Side question. Are we all now going to make our actual Warlord a 45 point Canoness with Beacon of Faith and Litanies of Faith who we hide behind our backfield units for the re-rolls?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
tneva82 wrote:
Quick question. The launch box. How many points it is? Haven't checked wargear but looks like not even 400?

What did i start...
403-ish. But you can run it with other Imperium stuff too. (And it'll need a Priest in Matched Play)


Nah I'm going to run Celestine as my warlord then pay The 1CP to give my Ebon Heart Cannoness the Terrible knowledge command trait.



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 16:28:57


Post by: MacPhail


Initial plans... Valorous Heart backfield, Bloody Rose forward elements, maybe backing off of mechanized infantry a bit in favor of Seraphim, but I'll initially run a mainly Sororitas (as opposed to Ministorum) list as I have been. That should give me a chance to explore new Stratagems and Relics while I acquire and build some of the units my collection has been missing: Engines, Arcos, and Repentia.

Despite some dismay at the previews, I'm very excited for this Codex, the new model range, and the energy of all the assembled Sororitas fans on Dakka to help find our way forward. The Emperor Protects!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 16:35:26


Post by: Unit1126PLL


I am planning to not run Celestine. I have a 127-sister list (all foot) that gives 20 CP. I think I was originally planning to do Argent Shroud to sprint up the board (given the absence of tanks) and use my Canonesses and Preachers as counter-charge thingers (combined with a 4x Heavy Flamer ret squad and the wall of short-range firepower Sororitas have always been known for).

The list has 12 meltas/combi-meltas, like 6 Inferno Pistols (4 on Seraphim), and 8 Multi-Meltas on Retributors. I hope that is enough anti-tank, combined with the Argent Shroud trait to blast forwards into range ASAP.

I have considered Ebon Chalice, which makes me a good bit slower, but gives me even more CP and better Miracle Dice. The only reason I am worried about this though is the utility of Miracle Dice is a mystery to me. The quantity seems kinda low (and I'm not interested in taking the Triumph) so while the EC auto-6 ability is nice, you need a ton to do it, while the Sacred Rose can get a ton but doesn't quite guarantee that they're useful.

Argent Shroud seems the most Miracle-agnostic, meaning they become "cool-to-haves" instead of "if I get the wrong ones, my army breaks". But I'm willing to be convinced - and yes, I want to investigate all possibilities.

Lastly, it also seems like I could play Bloody Rose, which looks fantastic, but the 20-CP list doesn't have many dedicated combat units.

EDIT:
I am disappointed in the title! Why not put something cool, like "The loving warmth of the torch shall serve as their damnation!" or... idk.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 18:11:04


Post by: Sim-Life


"Deeds Not Words: Sororitas Tactica 2019".

Also I wish battlescribe would update so I can start trying out lists. Who's stupid idea was it to not have a full codex release now and only let a few people get one?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 18:32:39


Post by: Oberron


Flipping through my book I am very happy with the codex. The main draw for me is that your army can easily be tailored for multiple different things. And some seem very unique to SOB currently as well like the ability to ignore ap -1 and -2 nearly army wide. There are a lot of options to mix with each other so its all about going through and finding out what works best. We even have several options to change post deployment like sacred rites.

It is a lot to process.

Edit: Sad we lost jacobus

Edit2:

SO for some actual tactics for a battalion detachment the min cost is 218 for stock cannoness, Missionary and 3x5 BSS. Not a bad investment that lets you keep your sacred rites and order convictions


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 19:14:03


Post by: Tyel


 Sim-Life wrote:
"Deeds Not Words: Sororitas Tactica 2019".

Also I wish battlescribe would update so I can start trying out lists. Who's stupid idea was it to not have a full codex release now and only let a few people get one?


I'm trying to do the same - but really I think you need experience on the tabletop.

I'm finding it very hard for instance to quantify the Sacred Rites - and (ignoring soup for now) the value of one definite buff over two random ones.
It seems to me Sisters can easily get bags of CP - so definitely getting 2 is not an issue. But its trying to weight up the odds of getting 2 useful abilities - versus 2 marginal to useless ones.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 19:27:14


Post by: Oberron


Tyel wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:
"Deeds Not Words: Sororitas Tactica 2019".

Also I wish battlescribe would update so I can start trying out lists. Who's stupid idea was it to not have a full codex release now and only let a few people get one?


I'm trying to do the same - but really I think you need experience on the tabletop.

I'm finding it very hard for instance to quantify the Sacred Rites - and (ignoring soup for now) the value of one definite buff over two random ones.
It seems to me Sisters can easily get bags of CP - so definitely getting 2 is not an issue. But its trying to weight up the odds of getting 2 useful abilities - versus 2 marginal to useless ones.


I feel it very much depends on a mixture of personal style and what the opponent is bringing. Heavy melee sisters list? Hand of the emperor, The passion and spirit of the martyer are all good options. If they are heavy on psykers than Aegis of the emperor is a no brainer, Divine guidance for dakka spam. Spirit of the martyr can be good for massive blobs of sisters or mass MSU.

With battle rites stratagem (and if you are able to use the normal command point re-roll) You have a pretty high chance of getting at least 1 that you want and 2nd that will be useful.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 19:27:48


Post by: Sim-Life


Tyel wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:
"Deeds Not Words: Sororitas Tactica 2019".

Also I wish battlescribe would update so I can start trying out lists. Who's stupid idea was it to not have a full codex release now and only let a few people get one?


I'm trying to do the same - but really I think you need experience on the tabletop.

I'm finding it very hard for instance to quantify the Sacred Rites - and (ignoring soup for now) the value of one definite buff over two random ones.
It seems to me Sisters can easily get bags of CP - so definitely getting 2 is not an issue. But its trying to weight up the odds of getting 2 useful abilities - versus 2 marginal to useless ones.


I said over in a thread in general that I think the codex will be more than the sum of its parts and I feel like that basically describes it pretty well. I should hopefully be getting a game in with them later this week and I look forward to the good old headache from Warmachine of making sure everything is 0.1" of the right auras and the aura giver is in the right place.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 20:07:12


Post by: MacPhail


Tyel wrote:
I'm finding it very hard for instance to quantify the Sacred Rites - and (ignoring soup for now) the value of one definite buff over two random ones.
It seems to me Sisters can easily get bags of CP - so definitely getting 2 is not an issue. But its trying to weight up the odds of getting 2 useful abilities - versus 2 marginal to useless ones.

On my initial read, I was leaning toward taking Aegis when playing psyker-heavy armies (my most common opponents in that realm are Thousand Sons and Death Guard) and then just rolling for two the rest of the time. If I were to pick one I'd like to have in general, it would probably be dependent on my list... Divine Guidance for Bloody Rose Seraphim or Spirit of the Martyr if I can find a way to make melta Doms worthwhile. The others, especially Hand and Passion, feel dependent on both my list and my opponent's, and therefore hard to anticipate.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 21:02:31


Post by: tneva82


Okay so at home, assembled few miniatures(got myself two boxes...) and made first army list. Might have some errors(been a while since did by hand!) and 33 pts left to spend. Not intended as super duper competive list but hopefully not that weak either. All the valorous heart(? the one that makes AP -1 to 0)

Spoiler:
Battalion.

Canoness(bolt gun, power sword, rod of office)
missionary

3x5 battle sisters(2xstorm bolter, inferno pistol&chainsword, cherub)

repentia superior
8xrepentia

2ximagifier
6xarco flagelant
6xretributior w/4xmulti melta
3xexorcist w/at missiles

Battallion:

Canoness(bolt gun, power sword, rod of office)
missionary

3x5 battle sisters(2xstorm bolter, inferno pistol&chainsword, cherub)

5xseraphim w/2xtwin inferno pistol, plasma pistol, power sword
5xseraphim w/2xtwin hand flamer, plasma pistol, power sword

2xpeninent engines
6xretribution w/4 heavy bolters



Tad low on basic sisters maybe but want some toys as well. 13 CP, likely several goes pre-game. Extra miracle dice warlord trait and reroll miracle dice relic.

Now to wait for solo boxes. 2 sets(minus maybe 2nd cannoness) doesn't take you far.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 21:19:39


Post by: Waaaghpower


It seems like Ebon Chalice Retributors with Heavy Flamers (and a Combiflamer) are pretty great. For 1cp and using both Cherubs, you get 36 heavy flamer and 6 flamer hits automatically. Or, give the sergeant a Combimelta, take some meat shields, and benefit from +1 to wound and a fethton of autohitting attacks.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 22:08:11


Post by: Rogerio134134


I definitely want to have at least one Dominion squad with storm bolters move them forward with the vanguard move thing into cover, use the 1cp strat to turn storm bolters into ap 2 D2 weapons! Space marines will be absolutely mulched by dominion squads with the strat.

Can't wait to get a bit of time and actually paint! I've been doing test schemes but not got very far.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 22:28:19


Post by: Tyel


I think my current list building... problem, is that I think every list wants to have 3 Exorcists for the long range firepower, and you probably want them to be valorous heart - partly for the added protection, but also for the ignoring modifiers to hit stratagem. (Depending on whether Eldar Flyers and the like recede from tables).

But three exorcists and a bare bones canoness in a spearhead is a big chunk of points and I'm not sure if its skewing things too much.
Its probably more efficient to just put this into a batallion, as you are highly llikely to bring two if not opting for a full brigade.

Are exorcists this necessary? I'm not sure - but my gut says yes.
You can opt instead for a load of melta scattered throughout your army, but I'm not a huge fan of this. Mathematically it makes no sense - but I find when you roll lots of dice, you tend to approach the average. Whereas when you roll 1 melta at a time, you always seem to miss or fail to wound (enter miracle dice, but only one a turn). Or maybe it just feels worse. Conventional melta is also short ranged which can limit your options. DSing Seraphim for 8 melta shots that turn is nice, but I feel its not exactly the hardest thing to screen for. All in all, if you are going second, it also means something nasty has had two turns to shoot you before you did anything. Whereas, assuming they survive, the exorcists could respond immediately.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/11/30 22:45:53


Post by: Rogerio134134


I'll be taking 3 excorcists absolute guaranteed. They are a fantastic unit and are actually relatively durable with T8 3+ and 6++. Not only are they brilliant anti tank units but they can also put down a massive rate of fire against infantry as well with the conflagration rockets.

With that being the bedrock of the list Im not sure which direction to go with the rest of the list. I think Dominion squads with storm bolters and retributors are both great for big firepower and I'll be looking into them.

I think I'll throw a portion of the army forward to martyr itself for the God emperor in the form of multiple units of penitent engines and repentia. Add in a few battle sister squads in immolators with lots of flame weapons and I think the enemy will have a few questions to ask about target priority!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 02:30:23


Post by: MacPhail


I won't have my book til next week, but I'm pretty sure the Exorcist role is a list building decision with a pretty big points difference. Time will tell, but I'm hoping the anti tank option proves to be worth the points and I can keep them in their traditional role. Either way, there's no switching back and forth in game... or is there?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 03:21:30


Post by: Kapitan Montag


Tyel wrote:
DSing Seraphim for 8 melta shots that turn is nice, but I feel its not exactly the hardest thing to screen for. All in all, if you are going second, it also means something nasty has had two turns to shoot you before you did anything. Whereas, assuming they survive, the exorcists could respond immediately.


I don't think you can shoot 8 times because the strat to increase range only works for that phase (movement phase)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 03:27:48


Post by: dracpanzer


 Kapitan Montag wrote:
Tyel wrote:
DSing Seraphim for 8 melta shots that turn is nice, but I feel its not exactly the hardest thing to screen for. All in all, if you are going second, it also means something nasty has had two turns to shoot you before you did anything. Whereas, assuming they survive, the exorcists could respond immediately.


I don't think you can shoot 8 times because the strat to increase range only works for that phase (movement phase)


It doesn't, they are only in range because of the strategem outside of the shooting phase.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 03:45:38


Post by: MacPhail


 dracpanzer wrote:
 Kapitan Montag wrote:
Tyel wrote:
DSing Seraphim for 8 melta shots that turn is nice, but I feel its not exactly the hardest thing to screen for. All in all, if you are going second, it also means something nasty has had two turns to shoot you before you did anything. Whereas, assuming they survive, the exorcists could respond immediately.


I don't think you can shoot 8 times because the strat to increase range only works for that phase (movement phase)


It doesn't, they are only in range because of the strategem outside of the shooting phase.

This is my understanding as well, but I don't think it hurts us too badly. I'm planning to Vanguard at least one squad of stormbolter Dominions on foot and into cover, maybe more, with the goal of clearing screens for Turn 2 and 3 DSing Seraphim with infernos. Also, screens might be the best target anyway. I'm toying with the idea of a third unit of 10 with mixed loadout, deploying out of LoS if possible, jumping into range on Turn 1 or 2, meeting Celestine halfway up the board for the save bonus, and dropping Holy Trinity on top of Bloody Rose. +1 to Wound and -1 AP seem a potent combo against most infantry.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 03:47:34


Post by: tneva82


Rogerio134134 wrote:
I'll be taking 3 excorcists absolute guaranteed. They are a fantastic unit and are actually relatively durable with T8 3+ and 6++. Not only are they brilliant anti tank units but they can also put down a massive rate of fire against infantry as well with the conflagration rockets.


Missiles are distinlt weapons you buy at list building so no switlhing. And since part of same datasheet max 3 total :(


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 05:07:37


Post by: BrianDavion


Rogerio134134 wrote:
I'll be taking 3 excorcists absolute guaranteed. They are a fantastic unit and are actually relatively durable with T8 3+ and 6++. Not only are they brilliant anti tank units but they can also put down a massive rate of fire against infantry as well with the conflagration rockets.

With that being the bedrock of the list Im not sure which direction to go with the rest of the list. I think Dominion squads with storm bolters and retributors are both great for big firepower and I'll be looking into them.

I think I'll throw a portion of the army forward to martyr itself for the God emperor in the form of multiple units of penitent engines and repentia. Add in a few battle sister squads in immolators with lots of flame weapons and I think the enemy will have a few questions to ask about target priority!


sadly pentinent engines are the same slot as exorcists sadly so if you take 3 pentient engines would require you to take another detachment for.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 05:08:50


Post by: Kaffis


I'm thoroughly enjoying the codex so far. It's also rather baffling me, at the moment, but that's just because this is my return to 40k since bailing in early 6th edition. So I've got some homework to catch up on basic list structure, too.

Regardless, it seems readily apparent to me that, especially in the non-rigorous meta I'll be playing in among my friends, this codex gives me a lot of options to experiment with and try different approaches and strategies. And that's exciting!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 05:25:59


Post by: Lammia


BrianDavion wrote:
Rogerio134134 wrote:
I'll be taking 3 excorcists absolute guaranteed. They are a fantastic unit and are actually relatively durable with T8 3+ and 6++. Not only are they brilliant anti tank units but they can also put down a massive rate of fire against infantry as well with the conflagration rockets.

With that being the bedrock of the list Im not sure which direction to go with the rest of the list. I think Dominion squads with storm bolters and retributors are both great for big firepower and I'll be looking into them.

I think I'll throw a portion of the army forward to martyr itself for the God emperor in the form of multiple units of penitent engines and repentia. Add in a few battle sister squads in immolators with lots of flame weapons and I think the enemy will have a few questions to ask about target priority!


sadly pentinent engines are the same slot as exorcists sadly so if you take 3 pentient engines would require you to take another detachment for.
Not if you take a Missionary! But we'll have the detachments anyway.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 06:14:50


Post by: Shivan Reaper


Lammia wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
Rogerio134134 wrote:
I'll be taking 3 excorcists absolute guaranteed. They are a fantastic unit and are actually relatively durable with T8 3+ and 6++. Not only are they brilliant anti tank units but they can also put down a massive rate of fire against infantry as well with the conflagration rockets.

With that being the bedrock of the list Im not sure which direction to go with the rest of the list. I think Dominion squads with storm bolters and retributors are both great for big firepower and I'll be looking into them.

I think I'll throw a portion of the army forward to martyr itself for the God emperor in the form of multiple units of penitent engines and repentia. Add in a few battle sister squads in immolators with lots of flame weapons and I think the enemy will have a few questions to ask about target priority!


sadly pentinent engines are the same slot as exorcists sadly so if you take 3 pentient engines would require you to take another detachment for.
Not if you take a Missionary! But we'll have the detachments anyway.


Unfortunately, Penitent Engines don't have the battle conclave rule, so they do take slots. I am half-contemplating taking a squad of mortifiers with heavy bolters as fire support once the kit comes out, 2 assault 3 heavy bolters on a reasonably survivable platform that can defend themselves from melee threats for under 60 points apiece sounds decent, though my local meta is admittedly rather soft.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 06:40:37


Post by: Lammia


Shivan Reaper wrote:
Lammia wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
Rogerio134134 wrote:
I'll be taking 3 excorcists absolute guaranteed. They are a fantastic unit and are actually relatively durable with T8 3+ and 6++. Not only are they brilliant anti tank units but they can also put down a massive rate of fire against infantry as well with the conflagration rockets.

With that being the bedrock of the list Im not sure which direction to go with the rest of the list. I think Dominion squads with storm bolters and retributors are both great for big firepower and I'll be looking into them.

I think I'll throw a portion of the army forward to martyr itself for the God emperor in the form of multiple units of penitent engines and repentia. Add in a few battle sister squads in immolators with lots of flame weapons and I think the enemy will have a few questions to ask about target priority!


sadly pentinent engines are the same slot as exorcists sadly so if you take 3 pentient engines would require you to take another detachment for.
Not if you take a Missionary! But we'll have the detachments anyway.


Unfortunately, Penitent Engines don't have the battle conclave rule, so they do take slots. I am half-contemplating taking a squad of mortifiers with heavy bolters as fire support once the kit comes out, 2 assault 3 heavy bolters on a reasonably survivable platform that can defend themselves from melee threats for under 60 points apiece sounds decent, though my local meta is admittedly rather soft.
...Huh, they don't.

Mortifiers are definitely a way to go, the're fast enough to get into combat T2 and cheap enough to serve as a distraction


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 07:10:30


Post by: MrMoustaffa


This is the first codex I've seen in a while where I'm genuinely stumped on which direction I want to take it. I'm heavily tempted to make a custom order and just play around with the rules. I really like how the codex is hinting that you really need to overlap abilities and auras though, the codex is clearly meant to be strong when you're combining abilities, as each on their own are fairly minor.

I have a feeling mine will stay allies for a long time, most likely a few small squads of sisters and something like mortifiers to fill gaps guard have. They also seem like a great choice for a cp battery batallion. Bare minimum you have the 4+ deny and with proper overlapping of tricks even a small detachment of sisters could provide serious pysker defense.

For pure sisters, I'd love to see a pure infantry army maximizing aura overlaps to make sisters very tough to shift. Order of the Valorous heart combined with imagifiers for stoic ability, the indomitable belief warlord trait combo'd with the book of Saint Lucius, Celestine, and spirit of the martyr makes for a sister that has a 3+/4++/6+++, who ignores AP2 or less, anything Ap3 only hurts them half the time, and when you kill them on a 5+ they get one last attack. The question is what to combine with it. I feel like lots of meltas is a good idea if you're foot slogging, you'll need the AT, and then perhaps stuff like repentia, mortifiers, and these new zephyrim (I'm assuming new at least) to provide melee protection and push up ahead. It may not be the most competitive, but you can completely remove the use of any AT your opponent has, while simultaneously punishing most anti infantry weapons as well. I feel stuff like retributors are mandatory but they're not going to last long. So you take 2 melta and a combimelta in the sister squads. Plus you take the triumph of St Katherine and get all those bonus abilities as well and it's even more t3 wounds to chew through.

No idea how competitive it would be, but man would it be a sight to behold on the table top. Tons of cp, a good amount of miracle dice, and has a lot of flexibility. And probably talking 100+ sisters you're trying to chew through with a ton of different auras and buffs that can be leveraged with proper play to buff melee (priests/imagifier/zephyrim/katherine/Valorous heart melee T debuff relic) shooting (canoness, strats) or durability (see above)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 07:37:53


Post by: BrianDavion


Anyone seeing any obvious Sisters/Inqusition synergies? not seeing any myself but given we can toss an inqusitor in without losing our sacred rites and the sisters links to the ordo Hereticus I figure it's worth looking


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 07:50:07


Post by: Lammia


BrianDavion wrote:
Anyone seeing any obvious Sisters/Inqusition synergies? not seeing any myself but given we can toss an inqusitor in without losing our sacred rites and the sisters links to the ordo Hereticus I figure it's worth looking
There's definitely plenty of room for Hereticus (or even bring in the ol' Order of the Hammer) synergies. It just depends on how you want to learn into that...


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 08:32:49


Post by: Bdrone


Careful about the Deny's MrMoustarra- isn't that bonus deny a sacred rite, and therefore you can't ally in for that benefit on shield of faith?

im definately seeing sisters syncing with an inquisitor. if your really dealing with lots of psyker, you can drop in one. i was thinking Greyfax for extra denies, or coteaz in specific, since they also have higher armor saves than base inquisitors, but the basic ones could do as well.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 09:03:37


Post by: Unit1126PLL


I have a 2k list of 20 CP and 127 models of the Order of the Luminous Beacon (an Argent Shroud minor order)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 11:12:12


Post by: Tyel


 Kapitan Montag wrote:
I don't think you can shoot 8 times because the strat to increase range only works for that phase (movement phase)


Yeah, on re-reading I think you are right. I was thinking "okay, I've set them up, now its the shooting phase, play stratagem, shoot twice" - but its fairly clear that isn't the intention.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 11:58:25


Post by: Bdrone


Nice thing about the strategem being firing in the movement phase though- you can potentially gain a miracle die from taking out a unit with it, if it interests you and the rules for miracle die allow for that. something ive seen and repeated a bit myself is using it to drop a unit specifically to fire on chaff, likely as bloody rose (who can do all the drops the best...). if you kill em on drop, then they are gone and you get a miracle point. if you went full bolt pistols, and they lived, or you have another target within reach, the full unit can fire again in shooting along with anything else that dropped or got in range.

Same logic if you drop with other pistols, just gotta subtract the models that can't hit the second time. i favor inferno and bolt drops on this one, not sure which id take more.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 13:04:30


Post by: tneva82


BrianDavion wrote:
Rogerio134134 wrote:
I'll be taking 3 excorcists absolute guaranteed. They are a fantastic unit and are actually relatively durable with T8 3+ and 6++. Not only are they brilliant anti tank units but they can also put down a massive rate of fire against infantry as well with the conflagration rockets.

With that being the bedrock of the list Im not sure which direction to go with the rest of the list. I think Dominion squads with storm bolters and retributors are both great for big firepower and I'll be looking into them.

I think I'll throw a portion of the army forward to martyr itself for the God emperor in the form of multiple units of penitent engines and repentia. Add in a few battle sister squads in immolators with lots of flame weapons and I think the enemy will have a few questions to ask about target priority!


sadly pentinent engines are the same slot as exorcists sadly so if you take 3 pentient engines would require you to take another detachment for.


Seeing sisters want either brigade or 2 bat for cp both being 6 hs not an issue


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 16:56:09


Post by: ClockworkZion


BrianDavion wrote:
So what's everyone think of the Chapter tactics? what are the good? what are the situational? what are the "word bearer equivilants"?


I'm split between Martyred Lady (I expect to lose models pretty fast and they reward that, plus they have the pulpit) and Argent Shroud (mobility can often be kind after all). I'm making a custom order though so I'll likely try them all given enough time.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 19:59:19


Post by: Sim-Life


 ClockworkZion wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
So what's everyone think of the Chapter tactics? what are the good? what are the situational? what are the "word bearer equivilants"?


I'm split between Martyred Lady (I expect to lose models pretty fast and they reward that, plus they have the pulpit) and Argent Shroud (mobility can often be kind after all). I'm making a custom order though so I'll likely try them all given enough time.


Honestly the army seems like its specifically written around mixing orders and it's kind of a pain cause it's not something I like doing.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 20:04:48


Post by: tneva82


 ClockworkZion wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
So what's everyone think of the Chapter tactics? what are the good? what are the situational? what are the "word bearer equivilants"?


I'm split between Martyred Lady (I expect to lose models pretty fast and they reward that, plus they have the pulpit) and Argent Shroud (mobility can often be kind after all). I'm making a custom order though so I'll likely try them all given enough time.


Considered the speedy ones but seeing my necrons are max advance guys figured new style so i went for ap ignoring one. With imaginers around need -3 to worry. Take that numarines with your -2 bolters!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 22:08:37


Post by: BrianDavion


tneva82 wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
So what's everyone think of the Chapter tactics? what are the good? what are the situational? what are the "word bearer equivilants"?


I'm split between Martyred Lady (I expect to lose models pretty fast and they reward that, plus they have the pulpit) and Argent Shroud (mobility can often be kind after all). I'm making a custom order though so I'll likely try them all given enough time.


Considered the speedy ones but seeing my necrons are max advance guys figured new style so i went for ap ignoring one. With imaginers around need -3 to worry. Take that numarines with your -2 bolters!


yeah I'm considering if I go that route putting a book of st lucius oin an imaginifier, 9 inch ignore -2 bubble


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 22:19:59


Post by: tneva82


Certainly decent option. I do have brigad(army list on the list subsection) so would have 15 CP. 1 for extra relic, 1 for extra warlord trait so 13 left. Guess I could consider replacing 1 imaginifier for that one. Would give me 5 extra sisters for example. Or just go with 3 imaginifiers with 6" bubbles.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/01 23:17:37


Post by: ERJAK


Got 2 games in, one against a softened Eldar flyer list. (Only 2 CHE, only using the -2, a couple other non-standard unit choices.) and a White Scars list (repulsor+Executionor+standard white scars stuff)

My list was:

BR Battalion: 3x3SB BSS, Missionary, Canoness with IP, Admonition, 10 Zephyrim, 5 IP Seraphim, 10 hf Seraphim.

OoML battalion Missionary, Celestine 3x3SB BSS, 3x HB Mortifiers(2 flails, blade on the leader), 3xPenitent Engines(2blades, 1 flail)

Valorous Heart Battalion: Canoness Rod, Book, Canoness Brazier, Litanies, 3xSB BSS, 2x exorcists, Imagifier, Dialogus.

Obviously build to test out a bunch of different things, not win tournaments.


First game, exorcist killed a CHE from 60" out basically instantly. -3 to hit wouldn't have helped. Mortifiers shredded infantry with their heavy bolters while zipping down field and pressuring his flank. everything else didn't really do anything.

His turn, he bounced off the exorcists and killed 2 mortifiers.

My turn, I deepstrike the 10 Zephyrim behind his dark reapers, dark reapers Stratagem to shoot, and get overwatch, kills 4 zephyrim. Zephyrim auto charge with miracle dice, kill all the dark reapers. Exorcist pops his wave serpent, Seraphim Deadly descent a nightspinner and fail utterly, Exorcist auto kills another flyer. It was basically over after that.


Game 2, Gave my opponent first turn to see how much worse going second was. Executioner and regular repulsor put both exorcists on the last bracket immediately and killed 2 mortifiers.

My turn, Both exorcists shot at the executioner, 5s rerolling 1s. First one gets a shot through, put 6 damage down with MD. Second one somehow got TWO through and I was left staring at a 6, a 4, and an unused Dialogus. I go 'whatever' roll for damage get 2. Bracketed it but that was it.

The last remaining mortifier charges some hellblasters and kills the squad. Bolters and Blessed bolt stormbolters trim down some of the intercessor squads.

His turn, he outflanks some aggressors and drops some of the primaris drop guys, he pops one exorcist and the mortifier, kills a handful of battle sisters and a penitent engine, repulsors lascannons whiff and the incedental shots bounce off Valorous heart. Second exorcist survives, he tries to charge it with the aggressor and I use a 6 to guarantee a hit in overwatch, get 2 more hits, kill 2 leave 1 with 1 wound, he fails the charge.

My turn, bring down the IP seraphim near the Executioner and the Zephyrim near his drop troops. Shave off some stuff with heavy bolters, do 5 wounds to the remaining repulsor with my barely alive exorcist, Deadly descent kills the executionor with an MD 6 to help. lose 2 Zephyrim on the charge but totally wipe the drop troops. Penitent engines and Celestine move up. Celestine succeeds in charging but dies to a Thammer interrupt(whoops), gets back up but is out in the open.

His turn, kills Celestine, the last exorcist, the zephyrim down to four, and most of my battle sisters.puts some wounds on a penitent engine.

My turn, out of CP, can barely kill anything anymore, penitent engine still manages to waste the repulsor and zephyrim kills his librarian but the characters he has left could wipe my entire army with good rolls. I was so far ahead on objective points that we called it though.



Take aways: Quite a bit stronger than I thought:

Miracle dice are AMAZING. I was using the weaker 'single dice interpretation the whole game and they were still a major deciding factor. WAY stronger than I thought it would be.

As such, Litanies is a must have, same with Beacon.

Sacred Rites are meh, though I did roll doubles both games.

Exorcists are absolutely incredible. I totally forgot about my FNP and they still survived a repulsor executionor in devastator doctrine, with CM and Lt. Rerolls. Eldar flyer lists have to watch out because it's trivial to down a CHE or even a Hemlocke in a single volley.

Zephyrim are a lot better than I gave them credit for. They're still hamstrung by being basically bloody rose only and having issues with overwatch, but they hit incredibly hard and can charge from outside of overwatch range with 0 difficulty. You afraid of Assault centurions? Not with these girls you're not.

2 units of Deadly Descent Seraphim are mandatory in every list. Best run as bloody rose, but any OC will do. So, so good.

Mortifiers are a must have. They're incredibly fast, have about the same shooting point for point as heavy bolter retributors, and are surprisingly harder to kill than I thought they'd be.

Penitent engines are good too, their problem is they trade speed for better durability, and I'm not sure it works for them.

4++ bubble not really all that relavent anymore. Everything getting shot at doesn't really benefit from it.

Taking a brazier on a canoness is a surprisingly good option because it leaves you free to tool your list into anti-psyker or anti-demon outta nowhere.

Weaknesses:

Definitely problems with longevity, which was true in the index as well. You can practically hear the brakes kick on once you run out of CP.

Incredibly CP dependent. Triple Battalion or Brigade, battalion are most likely going to be the common builds. I had 18 CP and I would have KILLED for 2 more.

Leveraging the troops is gonna be hard, especially when triple stormbolter goes to Legends. I had 9 units of battle sisters I feel like accomplished nothing but capping objectives all game, and 3 of them could have done that just as well.

Ironhands will smoke us 100% of the time, but it's only slightly better for everyone else.

Going forward I still want to test out repentia (their damage output is off the wall, like instantly nuke a Castellan off the wall), arcos, more penitent stuff, the battle sanctum and Triumph.

The FAQ is also going to be pretty big because if we get more canoness equipment options and Dominions back, we could be off the chain.


Overall, I still say the book is pretty middle of the pack in terms of strength, but some really favorable matchups against top tournament armies, combined with excellent unit selection and a large number of varied strategies, leaves me feeling perfectly content to spend the next year+ with this book.






Automatically Appended Next Post:
BrianDavion wrote:
Anyone seeing any obvious Sisters/Inqusition synergies? not seeing any myself but given we can toss an inqusitor in without losing our sacred rites and the sisters links to the ordo Hereticus I figure it's worth looking


I almost always take at least 2 CTs. Valorous heart exorcists and Bloody rose deepstrikers are just so freaking good. Even Argent shroud and OoML have some really interesting combos they can kick out.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 00:56:23


Post by: BrianDavion


yeah I'm running pure 1 order myself, otherwise it'lll be confusing.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 00:58:19


Post by: KestrelM1


Cute idea with the new codex: Give your Our Martyred Lady Sister Superiors a Plasma Pistol. While shooting, supercharge and use a Miracle die of 1 (after any modifiers you can find) to give the rest of the unit +1 to hit. As far as I can tell, since shooting attacks are made sequentially, this should work immediately. Give your sisters 2+ to hit, likely re-rolling 1s, as well as provide an outlet for your low Miracle Dice rolls.



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 01:21:51


Post by: IanVanCheese


 MacPhail wrote:
Initial plans... Valorous Heart backfield, Bloody Rose forward elements, maybe backing off of mechanized infantry a bit in favor of Seraphim, but I'll initially run a mainly Sororitas (as opposed to Ministorum) list as I have been. That should give me a chance to explore new Stratagems and Relics while I acquire and build some of the units my collection has been missing: Engines, Arcos, and Repentia.

Despite some dismay at the previews, I'm very excited for this Codex, the new model range, and the energy of all the assembled Sororitas fans on Dakka to help find our way forward. The Emperor Protects!


This is my initial plan too. Since I'm planning on getting the Triumph and painting each sister as a different order, I can fluff excuse myself for mixing Orders in the competitive games and in casual games I'll just revert to one order and no one will mind.

Valorous Heart is soooo good and the perfect counter to the current marine meta, but Bloody Rose Seraphim are tasty af. Excited though, a solid 90% of the book looks properly viable. Coming from my current Necrons, that's mind blowing to me.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 01:33:42


Post by: Unit1126PLL


Got 2 games in, one at 1k against Tau and one at 2k against a different Tau.

First Tau was a fun & fluffy Kroot list. My 1k list was 3x rets / Canoness (in a Spearhead) and 3x BSS 2x Canoness in a battalion. I wiped the floor with them - I had far more retributors then they had bullets, and when I closed to the 12" range that Sororitas like to be at, it was over.

Second Tau was a triptide competitive list with my 20CP 2k list (BDE + BN). It had 3 zoot suits (what we call the coldstar commanders with meltas, because they zoot across the board), and 3 regular crisis suits. Plus Shadowsun, like 15 or 20 Fire Warriors and 10 Kroot, and a couple fireblades.

It was a fairly balanced game, but I came through in the end. He simply didn't have enough gun (which was weird for Triptide Tau). The first two turns I didn't get much past his 3+ invuln on the triptides because he had CP (for rerolls), but I got enough through to bracket a couple of them. Turn 3 it was all over - even after a couple turns of tau firepower, I had more gun than him, was more mobile than him, and he ran out of CP for rerolling his triptide 3+ saves so I melted the triptides.

The coldstars flew close to my lines, assassinated my warlord (after almost the entire rest of his army killed the 10 Celestians that were around her!) and then I Divine Interventione'd her back. I've never seen someone get so thoroughly disappointed - he traded all 3 Coldstars for 2 CP and one Miracle Die.

Miracle Dice are super useful, even if you aren't using them a ton. Moment of Grace and Divine Intervention
are both very useful!

Argent Shroud worked exactly like I expected them to - I got all over the board quite rapidly, and didn't get many charges off (because charging triptide Tau gunlines is suicide!) but I didn't need to. Once I raced up to within 12" (which was super quick with Argent Shroud) I simply outgunned him. He, of course, outgunned me at longer ranges, but that's why I picked Argent Shroud. To get under his guard, as it were, and then blaze away with fire, melta, and bolter until they're wreckage.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 01:57:33


Post by: Rynner


I've played 5 with the new codex. I played twice vs Chaos, once vs Iron Hands, Necrons, and Tau. Each game was at 1500 because of a local 1 day GT around here everyone wants to practice for.

I used the weaker ruling of Miracle die too. I think its a really strong mechanic. After getting some games in I'm really happy with the book. My next concern is model availably for LVO as the stuff I want to add to my list (Zeraphim/Mortifers are not out yet) but thats a somewhat later problem,.

It's really amusing, Tau used to be a horrendous match up but now it's laughably easy.

I technically lost the Necron match up by a 2 points but that was only because I forgot they could deep strike and let them come in and kill all my engineers turn 1.

I won both Chaos match ups. Thermal knights hurt but you can put a hurt on them.

I also won the Iron Hand's game pretty big. When RepEx don't have a 5++ they die really easily.

There's defiantly some play in the book. I'm still hoping for a FAQ to allow dominions to scout in transports and their 5th storm bolter back but even if we get it I'm not sure I'll use them.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 02:42:44


Post by: BrianDavion


Sister's beat Iron Hands? intreasting was that a fluke or are sisters capable of dealing with the Kings of the Meta for some reason?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 04:03:27


Post by: Purifying Tempest


I've been pondering a Valorous Heart castle, I think they can be really tough to shift around throughout the game with ignoring up to -2 AP and camping cover. Things like MM Rets and Exorcists seem like they'll stand out in those matches.

I've also been thinking up ways to Sacred Rose horde the table with tons of MD gimmicks and bolter fire. I have a huge post of thoughts over on B&C forum, but I think it is a bit big to dump into here.

Sacred Rite wise, I think it'll shake out like this:

Hand of the Emperor: Argent Shroud and Bloody Rose are going to eat this up.

Spirit of the Martyr: Probably going to be the default when nothing else is more appropriate, "default" mode.

Aegis of the Emperor: When you see a bunch of psykers and decide that your preferred Sacred Rite isn't worth shutting them down. The other "default", match-up depending.

Divine Guidance: Horde lists are going to go here, and I think Sacred Rose will prefer it since their rules seem to push them into bolt weapons (lots of dakka).

The Passion: I think more foot-based Bloody Rose lists will take this. I think drop-based BR will opt to take Hand of the Emperor, still.

Light of the Emperor: Womp womp, not everything can be a winner. Super niche and probably not worth it even then. The two "default" ones are probably better in just about every scenario.

I don't think I'd roll, either, nor swap. Seems to fly in the face of the army that uses "fixed" dice (MD system) to skirt fate... only to turn its fate over to the little six-sided monsters. I think once things settle down, we'll have clear favorite Sacred Rites that armies will lean on a bit (not going to be a massive boost, but noticeable).


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 04:05:08


Post by: Unit1126PLL


Yeah. Can definitely backup that Sisters matchup has changed.

Tau, what used to be a nightmare matchup for my foot girls, now can't hold the range open faster than we advance. Within 12" we have incredible firepower. Gun for gun I was outshooting Tau, and I had enough melta to deal with 3++ Riptides without too many losses.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 04:19:16


Post by: Rynner


BrianDavion wrote:
Sister's beat Iron Hands? intreasting was that a fluke or are sisters capable of dealing with the Kings of the Meta for some reason?


Yeah. They did. In the old book I lost 2 out of maybe 20-30 games vs the new Marines, the new book looks to be pretty strong vs them too. The list I played against was a nasty IH gun line. By the end of the game the only things he had left were a thunder fire and some characters.

We played one of the ITC missions. I took recon, engineers, and big game hunter. Engineers in decent/good terrain with Valorous heart is a free 4 points a game. 5 Sisters behind LOS cover that ignore ap -2 will never die unless you dedicate ap-3 or better fire power to them.

Miracle dice and terrain will do wonders.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 04:23:59


Post by: ERJAK


Rynner wrote:
I've played 5 with the new codex. I played twice vs Chaos, once vs Iron Hands, Necrons, and Tau. Each game was at 1500 because of a local 1 day GT around here everyone wants to practice for.

I used the weaker ruling of Miracle die too. I think its a really strong mechanic. After getting some games in I'm really happy with the book. My next concern is model availably for LVO as the stuff I want to add to my list (Zeraphim/Mortifers are not out yet) but thats a somewhat later problem,.

It's really amusing, Tau used to be a horrendous match up but now it's laughably easy.

I technically lost the Necron match up by a 2 points but that was only because I forgot they could deep strike and let them come in and kill all my engineers turn 1.

I won both Chaos match ups. Thermal knights hurt but you can put a hurt on them.

I also won the Iron Hand's game pretty big. When RepEx don't have a 5++ they die really easily.

There's defiantly some play in the book. I'm still hoping for a FAQ to allow dominions to scout in transports and their 5th storm bolter back but even if we get it I'm not sure I'll use them.


That's his fault for still using executioners like a noobcake,


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 06:50:54


Post by: tneva82


Okay quick double check I have got miracle dice right. Exorcist shoots at some tank with 12 wounds. I get 3 past saves. Yey. I can then roll 1 dice(4) for damage, 2nd damage(3) and now with 7 wounds in pool as all 3 missiles are their own attack sequence I can NOW decide to use act of faith and use 5 to autokill the vehicle?

OTOH as all 3 are separate sequences I can't use 3 miracle dice to fix all 3 damages(well not without ability to perform multiple acts of fate in same phase and don't think exorcists had that.

Incidentally this means opponents shouldn't really be fast rolling their saves either as this affects command rerolls. If they fail 3 the CP reroll for saves becomes more important for the last one if they know I can use miracle dice to one shot vehicle. Going to slow down games a bit.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 09:06:12


Post by: Lemondish


That is also how I read it.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 15:18:09


Post by: tneva82


One thing i like about sister stratagems is there doesn't seem to be any key one on which army hangs around. Makes facing stealer cult and dark eldar easier as they can't screw your plan easily by negating key stratagem. Sister ones aren"t as essential and often 1cp making it less of an hindrance to get negated


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 15:27:21


Post by: Audustum


Lemondish wrote:
That is also how I read it.


This is gonna need to be FAQ'd because people are debating that all over I think. I personally read it as saying you could use a Miracle Die for each one because they're all part of the same shooting attack in the same phase.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 15:46:41


Post by: Lemondish


Audustum wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
That is also how I read it.


This is gonna need to be FAQ'd because people are debating that all over I think. I personally read it as saying you could use a Miracle Die for each one because they're all part of the same shooting attack in the same phase.


Perhaps, but if you assume you can't because you only have one Miracle Dice available then the question still has merit. Since saves and damage are not part of fast rolling, and every attack is written in the core rules as taking place one at a time, it makes sense that you'd be in a situation where you could be free to substitute prior to making any of your damage rolls between the first and the last. The scenario mentioned actually makes sense to me and follows what we know about the core rules. We'll see what happens, but I can't see how they'd FAQ this without extending fast rolling to damage and messing up sequencing.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 15:47:07


Post by: Grundz


BrianDavion wrote:
Sister's beat Iron Hands? intreasting was that a fluke or are sisters capable of dealing with the Kings of the Meta for some reason?


Valorous heart basically negates the entire current meta
They don't care about ap -1/-2 anti horde firepower, saves are too good unless you are throwing ork levels of dice at them
They don't care about multi wound shots, they shouldn't give you many/any shots on anything besides exo's
They don't really care much about -'s to hit with flamers and stratagems able to negate them
They don't care a ton about super mega overkill melee units either, they can tank a lot of charges.
They don't care a ton about bubble wrapped fire bases

They /do/ care about getting their characters sniped out
They /do/ care about area of effect mortal wounds like exploding vehicles

Your typical current meta "power list" doesn't really have an answer for most of what sisters do, they can pull out wins but they will be by points, not tabling the person in two turns.
Sisters don't bring withering firepower so they won't be really "dangerous" but they present problems that people may need to consider in their lists.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 15:49:20


Post by: Lemondish


 Grundz wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
Sister's beat Iron Hands? intreasting was that a fluke or are sisters capable of dealing with the Kings of the Meta for some reason?


Valorous heart basically negates the entire current meta
They don't care about ap -1/-2 anti horde firepower, saves are too good unless you are throwing ork levels of dice at them
They don't care about multi wound shots, they shouldn't give you many/any shots on anything besides exo's
They don't really care much about -'s to hit with flamers and stratagems able to negate them
They don't care a ton about super mega overkill melee units either, they can tank a lot of charges.
They don't care a ton about bubble wrapped fire bases

They /do/ care about getting their characters sniped out
They /do/ care about area of effect mortal wounds like exploding vehicles

Your typical current meta "power list" doesn't really have an answer for most of what sisters do, they can pull out wins but they will be by points, not tabling the person in two turns.
Sisters don't bring withering firepower so they won't be really "dangerous" but they present problems that people may need to consider in their lists.


That makes them a good fit for the new Maelstrom rules in CA19, I think.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 16:04:53


Post by: Unit1126PLL


Ironically, my experience has been the opposite, playing Argent Shroud.

I can outshoot Tau by closing to rapid fire with ridiculous speed - their damage output is insane.

But they definitely aren't as durable as VH.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 16:20:44


Post by: ERJAK


tneva82 wrote:
Okay quick double check I have got miracle dice right. Exorcist shoots at some tank with 12 wounds. I get 3 past saves. Yey. I can then roll 1 dice(4) for damage, 2nd damage(3) and now with 7 wounds in pool as all 3 missiles are their own attack sequence I can NOW decide to use act of faith and use 5 to autokill the vehicle?

OTOH as all 3 are separate sequences I can't use 3 miracle dice to fix all 3 damages(well not without ability to perform multiple acts of fate in same phase and don't think exorcists had that.

Incidentally this means opponents shouldn't really be fast rolling their saves either as this affects command rerolls. If they fail 3 the CP reroll for saves becomes more important for the last one if they know I can use miracle dice to one shot vehicle. Going to slow down games a bit.


No one actually knows yet. I don't think GW really considered what they were getting into when they copy pasted the rule over from Sigmar. This is going to be one of the most meaningful FAQs we've seen for a book this edition. Right up there with the emergency Ironhands nerf.



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 16:24:18


Post by: Grundz


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Ironically, my experience has been the opposite, playing Argent Shroud.

I can outshoot Tau by closing to rapid fire with ridiculous speed - their damage output is insane.

But they definitely aren't as durable as VH.


Argent shroud is another option, if you are able to change your order/warlord/relics before the game in your format, they are a great alternate.

I Just feel like iron hands and other easy access ap-2 dice storms make valorous heart a requirement

Ive been playing with my list but I really want to run a ton of cherubs and banners, and I know its a waste until I figure out optimal usages.

How many Mdice have you guys come out with in your games? I feel like if you are paying attention to all the requirements you should have a ton of them


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 17:00:49


Post by: Rynner


Miracle dice are a strange mechanic. I almost never have enough for the first turn or so but by turn 3-4 I have more than I'll spend.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 17:09:37


Post by: tneva82


 Grundz wrote:


Argent shroud is another option, if you are able to change your order/warlord/relics before the game in your format, they are a great alternate.


Changing relics etc is norm here but where you can change chapter etc pregame?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 17:14:53


Post by: deviantduck


ERJAK wrote:
Zephyrim are a lot better than I gave them credit for. They're still hamstrung by being basically bloody rose only and having issues with overwatch, but they hit incredibly hard and can charge from outside of overwatch range with 0 difficulty. You afraid of Assault centurions? Not with these girls you're not.
Not sure what you mean. Even though they can charge 13", they can't declare a charge from outside 12". Unless you mean from outside 8" flamer range. If not, then no matter what they have to be inside overwatch range in order to declare a charge.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 17:41:51


Post by: tneva82


Audustum wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
That is also how I read it.


This is gonna need to be FAQ'd because people are debating that all over I think. I personally read it as saying you could use a Miracle Die for each one because they're all part of the same shooting attack in the same phase.


But it\s done for one dice roll. As in 1 roll of X dices, not X rolls of 1 dice. And attacks are as per rulebook one at a time. Fast dice rolling is just convenience when it doesn't affect things.

Swapping all rolls from 3d3 of exorcist fine. Swapping all rolls from multiple attackers no.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 17:59:18


Post by: Grundz


tneva82 wrote:

Swapping all rolls from 3d3 of exorcist fine. Swapping all rolls from multiple attackers no.


each shot from the exorcist is its own hit , wound and damage roll

You can't just replace whatever you want, you can pick one dice, and replace it

the only time you can replace multiple dice is if the individual roll is multiple dice, for example 2d6 damage or a charge roll, not if the model is shooting multiple shots


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 18:14:20


Post by: tneva82


Yes. Exorcist fires 3d3 shots. Replacing 1 or 3 of those 3d3 is legal. However rolling damage from multiple different shots like 4 meltas from dominion squad isn't

(btw would only 1, 2 and 3 be useful for d3 roll?)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 18:17:57


Post by: Grundz


tneva82 wrote:
Yes. Exorcist fires 3d3 shots. Replacing 1 or 3 of those 3d3 is legal. However rolling damage from multiple different shots like 4 meltas from dominion squad isn't

(btw would only 1, 2 and 3 be useful for d3 roll?)


replacing none of those is legal because number of shots is not listed under a legal roll to replace for miracle dice (?)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 18:27:06


Post by: deviantduck


Since Repressors are in the chapter approved and not getting the legends treatment, I had this idea. 1 repressor, 2x 5 rets, 3x MM, 2x Cherub. If argent shroud you could move 13-18" and shoot 10x MM out of the repressor. The cherubs grant 1 model to fire twice, the fire points grant 6 models. So 2 models shoot normally, and 4 models shoot twice. Granted it's at -1 unless you skip advance, or unless the new Rets ignore that? or is that only on the flamers? It's then 6x MM the remaining turns.

Just an idea...


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 18:27:55


Post by: Unit1126PLL


 deviantduck wrote:
Since Repressors are in the chapter approved and not getting the legends treatment, I had this idea. 1 repressor, 2x 5 rets, 3x MM, 2x Cherub. If argent shroud you could move 13-18" and shoot 10x MM out of the repressor. The cherubs grant 1 model to fire twice, the fire points grant 6 models. So 2 models shoot normally, and 4 models shoot twice. Granted it's at -1 unless you skip advance, or unless the new Rets ignore that? or is that only on the flamers? It's then 6x MM the remaining turns.

Just an idea...


New rets let you fire without movement penalty. It's part of the huge reason my Argent Shroud list works at all.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 18:38:24


Post by: Grundz


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 deviantduck wrote:
Since Repressors are in the chapter approved and not getting the legends treatment, I had this idea. 1 repressor, 2x 5 rets, 3x MM, 2x Cherub. If argent shroud you could move 13-18" and shoot 10x MM out of the repressor. The cherubs grant 1 model to fire twice, the fire points grant 6 models. So 2 models shoot normally, and 4 models shoot twice. Granted it's at -1 unless you skip advance, or unless the new Rets ignore that? or is that only on the flamers? It's then 6x MM the remaining turns.

Just an idea...


New rets let you fire without movement penalty. It's part of the huge reason my Argent Shroud list works at all.


I feel like rets in a repressor are just too many points when I could be spreading all those meltas out into 10 man squads where they are impossible to scalpel out, -1 to hit be damned


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 19:02:02


Post by: Unit1126PLL


 Grundz wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 deviantduck wrote:
Since Repressors are in the chapter approved and not getting the legends treatment, I had this idea. 1 repressor, 2x 5 rets, 3x MM, 2x Cherub. If argent shroud you could move 13-18" and shoot 10x MM out of the repressor. The cherubs grant 1 model to fire twice, the fire points grant 6 models. So 2 models shoot normally, and 4 models shoot twice. Granted it's at -1 unless you skip advance, or unless the new Rets ignore that? or is that only on the flamers? It's then 6x MM the remaining turns.

Just an idea...


New rets let you fire without movement penalty. It's part of the huge reason my Argent Shroud list works at all.


I feel like rets in a repressor are just too many points when I could be spreading all those meltas out into 10 man squads where they are impossible to scalpel out, -1 to hit be damned


That's how I currently run them. 2x10 with MMs and a simulacrum. I also have a 1x10 Ret Heavy Flamer squad, to just run forwards and melt things.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 19:05:01


Post by: Grundz


 Unit1126PLL wrote:


That's how I currently run them. 2x10 with MMs and a simulacrum. I also have a 1x10 Ret Heavy Flamer squad, to just run forwards and melt things.


Sounds good, I was thinking that it is a better use of cherubs and you'll get more shots throughout the game


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 19:07:34


Post by: Unit1126PLL


 Grundz wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:


That's how I currently run them. 2x10 with MMs and a simulacrum. I also have a 1x10 Ret Heavy Flamer squad, to just run forwards and melt things.


Sounds good, I was thinking that it is a better use of cherubs and you'll get more shots throughout the game


I actually don't run the Cherubs. Unfortunately, part of that 127 models accomplishment is cutting fancy wargear somewhere, and the Cherubs suffered.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 19:53:18


Post by: ERJAK


 Grundz wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

Swapping all rolls from 3d3 of exorcist fine. Swapping all rolls from multiple attackers no.


each shot from the exorcist is its own hit , wound and damage roll

You can't just replace whatever you want, you can pick one dice, and replace it

the only time you can replace multiple dice is if the individual roll is multiple dice, for example 2d6 damage or a charge roll, not if the model is shooting multiple shots


Speculation, no one but GW ACTUALLY knows how it works yet.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 19:58:14


Post by: Grundz


ERJAK wrote:


Speculation, no one but GW ACTUALLY knows how it works yet.


I guess GW are the only ones that have read the 8e battle primer


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 20:47:19


Post by: tneva82


ERJAK wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

Swapping all rolls from 3d3 of exorcist fine. Swapping all rolls from multiple attackers no.


each shot from the exorcist is its own hit , wound and damage roll

You can't just replace whatever you want, you can pick one dice, and replace it

the only time you can replace multiple dice is if the individual roll is multiple dice, for example 2d6 damage or a charge roll, not if the model is shooting multiple shots


Speculation, no one but GW ACTUALLY knows how it works yet.


Well we know what the rules currently say. Did we know how marine doctrine system worked when codex released?

Not everything needs FAQ right away. Rule wise this isn't particularly difficult. It's one roll. 3 multimeltas firing is 3 separate rolls. If you don't believe here's question. Imagine there's unit that has special rule "can reroll damage roll". So it fires 4 multimeltas and gets all past save. If you arque miracle dice can be replace all 4 multimeltas you are arquing those are one dice roll and ergo this rerolling unit can reroll all at once but must reroll all if it's going to reroll any. All or nothing.

(even more if they are one roll then enemy can save them with one save. All or nothing)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 20:50:56


Post by: Unit1126PLL


Even playing it the weaker way I have found success with it!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 21:12:11


Post by: ERJAK


 Grundz wrote:
ERJAK wrote:


Speculation, no one but GW ACTUALLY knows how it works yet.


I guess GW are the only ones that have read the 8e battle primer


No, they're the ones who haven't.

Also, being a jerk about it doesn't make you right, especially considering that exact same battle primer can be used to prove multiple miracle dice work thanks to fast rolling EXPLICITLY REPLACING THE INDIVIDUAL ATTACK SEQUENCE, at least for hits and wounds.

It might be 1 dice per roll. It might be multiple dice per roll. It might be multiple dice only work for fast dice. It might get totally reworded because GW didn't consider how the attack sequence works in 40k vs Sigmar when they copy pasted it.

To pretend like you know 100% for sure how it works or how it's intended to work is delusional overconfidence. You're sure of your interpretation. Neat. Doesn't mean a god dam thing.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 21:21:43


Post by: Sim-Life


Battlescribe update WHEEEEEEEN. It's been like 2 days now.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 22:37:53


Post by: Grundz


ERJAK wrote:

To pretend like you know 100% for sure how it works or how it's intended to work is delusional overconfidence. You're sure of your interpretation. Neat. Doesn't mean a god dam thing.


Oh I know man, you can play how you want, no one can force you to follow the rules.

There's no reason to throw a temper tantrum about it though


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 22:38:50


Post by: Waaaghpower


What's the take on Bloody Rose? Losing the +1 Strength really seems to hurt our melee capabilities, and taking Imagifiers to replace that seems like a costly substitute. We probably want Imagifiers anyways for the "Ignore AP-1", though, and Venerated Saint isn't the worst tax ever for an army that can be pretty flush with Command Points pretty easily.

Has anyone playtested Bloody Rose and would like to give feedback?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 22:48:56


Post by: tneva82


ERJAK wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
ERJAK wrote:


Speculation, no one but GW ACTUALLY knows how it works yet.


I guess GW are the only ones that have read the 8e battle primer


No, they're the ones who haven't.

Also, being a jerk about it doesn't make you right, especially considering that exact same battle primer can be used to prove multiple miracle dice work thanks to fast rolling EXPLICITLY REPLACING THE INDIVIDUAL ATTACK SEQUENCE, at least for hits and wounds.

It might be 1 dice per roll. It might be multiple dice per roll. It might be multiple dice only work for fast dice. It might get totally reworded because GW didn't consider how the attack sequence works in 40k vs Sigmar when they copy pasted it.

To pretend like you know 100% for sure how it works or how it's intended to work is delusional overconfidence. You're sure of your interpretation. Neat. Doesn't mean a god dam thing.


a) you can only use fast dice rolling to fast roll it when it doesn't affect results. If there's going to be difference on end result it can't be used
b) I'm sure you don't have problem with me rolling all 10 saves with one dice Helpful as one command reroll works for all. After all you are arguing all the individual shots are considered one dice roll due to fast rolling...

I can't know what GW intended but I know what rules currently say and it's not even particularly clear. By your logic when game was released we needed FAQ that you can move partial movement and don't have to move full. And that you can indeed stay still! After all we didn't have FAQ for that and regardless of how clear rule is we need FAQ for everything or we can't know how rule is supposed to be played!

And maybe we need FAQ for a FAQ. After all we can't be sure what the FAQ is supposed to say...We can only guess. And FAQ for a FAQ for a FAQ.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 22:52:19


Post by: Grundz


tneva82 wrote:

And maybe we need FAQ for a FAQ. After all we can't be sure what the FAQ is supposed to say...We can only guess. And FAQ for a FAQ for a FAQ.


The rules don't say I can't, therefore I can


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:04:56


Post by: Lemondish


ERJAK wrote:
You're sure of your interpretation. Neat. Doesn't mean a god dam thing.


Pot calling the kettle black.

Cool down.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:07:24


Post by: MrMoustaffa


Wait, what's the confusion with miracle dice? It seemed pretty straightforward, when you go to roll for something, you could sub in a miracle dice per roll as long as you stayed within the confines of however many you got per turn and all that.

So if you shot say 4 meltas at something, you could burn two miracle dice to ensure two shots automatically hit. The other two roll normally. Then you're good.

What's the confusing part I'm missing here? It felt pretty cut and dry, especially with the examples GW provided.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:21:42


Post by: Lammia


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
Wait, what's the confusion with miracle dice? It seemed pretty straightforward, when you go to roll for something, you could sub in a miracle dice per roll as long as you stayed within the confines of however many you got per turn and all that.

So if you shot say 4 meltas at something, you could burn two miracle dice to ensure two shots automatically hit. The other two roll normally. Then you're good.

What's the confusing part I'm missing here? It felt pretty cut and dry, especially with the examples GW provided.
each of those Melta shots are completely separate attack rolls, so you can only replace 1. You can replace 2 dice in a charge roll though, because that roll is 2d6


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:32:37


Post by: Grundz


Lammia wrote:
 MrMoustaffa wrote:
Wait, what's the confusion with miracle dice? It seemed pretty straightforward, when you go to roll for something, you could sub in a miracle dice per roll as long as you stayed within the confines of however many you got per turn and all that.

So if you shot say 4 meltas at something, you could burn two miracle dice to ensure two shots automatically hit. The other two roll normally. Then you're good.

What's the confusing part I'm missing here? It felt pretty cut and dry, especially with the examples GW provided.
each of those Melta shots are completely separate attack rolls, so you can only replace 1. You can replace 2 dice in a charge roll though, because that roll is 2d6


*Caveat: I'd have to check but I think you are able to use a second dice on the same unit like that if it is your first dice used that phase /and/ they have a banner but I'd have to check the exact wording


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:34:40


Post by: Hankovitch


Am I missing something or is the Battle Sanctum, uhm...not bad?

50 points for a chunk of cover that you can place at will, can't be destroyed, and gives you a miracle die every round? Seems worth it just to park a squad of retributors behind it and let them shoot from cover all game.

Obviously we don't know what it'll look like. I'm assuming it'll be shaped more or less like a mini bastion, or wall of martyrs piece? Hard to imagine it having a physical size that makes it unusable.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:47:56


Post by: Lammia


Hankovitch wrote:
Am I missing something or is the Battle Sanctum, uhm...not bad?

50 points for a chunk of cover that you can place at will, can't be destroyed, and gives you a miracle die every round? Seems worth it just to park a squad of retributors behind it and let them shoot from cover all game.

Obviously we don't know what it'll look like. I'm assuming it'll be shaped more or less like a mini bastion, or wall of martyrs piece? Hard to imagine it having a physical size that makes it unusable.
It's pretty good. It's drawback is it's taking a whole detachment, so you have to pick between that or a BR Vanguard/Outrider detachment and 1 CP


Automatically Appended Next Post:
(Or a third Battalion)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:51:22


Post by: Kaffis


The wording seems pretty clear to me that fast rolling is not considered one roll. You can substitute one or more dice on a charge roll, or a melta damage roll.

Also, for those pointing out that miracle dice seem likely to pile up faster than you can use them in this interpretation -- I feel like that's by design. The reason they pile up is so that you have a variety of good ones to use over the course of the game, and you can end your game with your 2's, 3's, and 4's in a little shrine of blessedness that you didn't have to resort to them because you were awash with their 1's, 5's, and 6's sisters.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:51:28


Post by: BrianDavion


Lammia wrote:
Hankovitch wrote:
Am I missing something or is the Battle Sanctum, uhm...not bad?

50 points for a chunk of cover that you can place at will, can't be destroyed, and gives you a miracle die every round? Seems worth it just to park a squad of retributors behind it and let them shoot from cover all game.

Obviously we don't know what it'll look like. I'm assuming it'll be shaped more or less like a mini bastion, or wall of martyrs piece? Hard to imagine it having a physical size that makes it unusable.
It's pretty good. It's drawback is it's taking a whole detachment, so you have to pick between that or a BR Vanguard/Outrider detachment and 1 CP


Also sisters work best as a highly agressive offensive army, and terrain features tend to work best when defending.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:54:09


Post by: Grundz


Kaffis wrote:
The wording seems pretty clear to me that fast rolling is not considered one roll. You can substitute one or more dice on a charge roll, or a melta damage roll.

Also, for those pointing out that miracle dice seem likely to pile up faster than you can use them in this interpretation -- I feel like that's by design. The reason they pile up is so that you have a variety of good ones to use over the course of the game, and you can end your game with your 2's, 3's, and 4's in a little shrine of blessedness that you didn't have to resort to them because you were awash with their 1's, 5's, and 6's sisters.


The other part is people probably aren't using them for things like invulnerable saves on your canonesses or advance rolls.

mid range dice still have their uses!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:55:44


Post by: Waaaghpower


BrianDavion wrote:
Lammia wrote:
Hankovitch wrote:
Am I missing something or is the Battle Sanctum, uhm...not bad?

50 points for a chunk of cover that you can place at will, can't be destroyed, and gives you a miracle die every round? Seems worth it just to park a squad of retributors behind it and let them shoot from cover all game.

Obviously we don't know what it'll look like. I'm assuming it'll be shaped more or less like a mini bastion, or wall of martyrs piece? Hard to imagine it having a physical size that makes it unusable.
It's pretty good. It's drawback is it's taking a whole detachment, so you have to pick between that or a BR Vanguard/Outrider detachment and 1 CP


Also sisters work best as a highly agressive offensive army, and terrain features tend to work best when defending.

It seems to me like a pretty good choice for your back field, because even as a defensive army you'll want something on your back rank to protect against Deep Strikers and hold objectives. Depending on what it looks like, (and assuming it offers some LoS blocking,) it could grant bespoke cover on your most important backfield objective on top of the other benefits.
The only reason not to take it, as Lammia pointed out, is the detachment. I've already got several list ideas I'm toying around with, and a big chunk of them have two Battalions and a third Vanguard or Outrider group to take advantage of another chapter. (Since new Sisters seem built from the ground up to run multiple chapters side-by-side.)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/02 23:56:49


Post by: BrianDavion


there are some decent strats that require you to spend Mircle dice mind you, those are good to discard the chaff with. partiuclarly moment of grace as you can add it after, rolled a 3 and needed a 4 to wound? moment of grace that sucker!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 00:05:26


Post by: Kaffis


 Grundz wrote:
Kaffis wrote:
The wording seems pretty clear to me that fast rolling is not considered one roll. You can substitute one or more dice on a charge roll, or a melta damage roll.

Also, for those pointing out that miracle dice seem likely to pile up faster than you can use them in this interpretation -- I feel like that's by design. The reason they pile up is so that you have a variety of good ones to use over the course of the game, and you can end your game with your 2's, 3's, and 4's in a little shrine of blessedness that you didn't have to resort to them because you were awash with their 1's, 5's, and 6's sisters.


The other part is people probably aren't using them for things like invulnerable saves on your canonesses or advance rolls.

mid range dice still have their uses!

That's a good point, too -- you can sure burn up a lot of rolls if you put your mind to using mediocre ones in spots they're "good enough" to make sure you use one every phase.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 00:22:10


Post by: Grundz


Kaffis wrote:

mid range dice still have their uses!

That's a good point, too -- you can sure burn up a lot of rolls if you put your mind to using mediocre ones in spots they're "good enough" to make sure you use one every phase.


Its tough to imagine how crazy our alpha strike would be if we had a stack of them on turn one and could use them like the above people claim.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 00:31:13


Post by: Waaaghpower


 Grundz wrote:
Kaffis wrote:

mid range dice still have their uses!

That's a good point, too -- you can sure burn up a lot of rolls if you put your mind to using mediocre ones in spots they're "good enough" to make sure you use one every phase.


Its tough to imagine how crazy our alpha strike would be if we had a stack of them on turn one and could use them like the above people claim.

How many Miracle Dice can we actually get on turn one? I'm trying to think of what that number is in a reasonable list.
One automatic, of course. One from Triumph, and one from the fortification. One from the Warlord Trait. With a command point and some shenanigans, Sacred Rose can use Vessel of the Emperor's Will to turn 1 Miracle Dice into 2 in the first movement phase. That's 4-5 to start with. (Probably 4 for me, because I'm not a fan of Sacred Rose.) Any tools or tricks I'm missing to increase this?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 00:57:58


Post by: Grundz


Waaaghpower wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
Kaffis wrote:

mid range dice still have their uses!

That's a good point, too -- you can sure burn up a lot of rolls if you put your mind to using mediocre ones in spots they're "good enough" to make sure you use one every phase.


Its tough to imagine how crazy our alpha strike would be if we had a stack of them on turn one and could use them like the above people claim.

How many Miracle Dice can we actually get on turn one? I'm trying to think of what that number is in a reasonable list.
One automatic, of course. One from Triumph, and one from the fortification. One from the Warlord Trait. With a command point and some shenanigans, Sacred Rose can use Vessel of the Emperor's Will to turn 1 Miracle Dice into 2 in the first movement phase. That's 4-5 to start with. (Probably 4 for me, because I'm not a fan of Sacred Rose.) Any tools or tricks I'm missing to increase this?


You could sub in a 1 during your shooting phase to kill your warlord with a combi plasma then turn it into D3 more


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 01:32:55


Post by: Lammia


At the low, low cost of your WL. (Actually, could be fun with Terrible Knowledge for one whole game...)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wait, how are you getting Faith points for your Warlord? Martyred goves you CPs


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 01:45:58


Post by: Grundz


Lammia wrote:
At the low, low cost of your WL. (Actually, could be fun with Terrible Knowledge for one whole game...)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wait, how are you getting Faith points for your Warlord? Martyred goves you CPs


Oh I may have gotten that mixed up


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 02:00:55


Post by: Lammia


You can potentially get 1 at then end of the shooting phase for Sacrifice and another one from OoOML and one from a Repentia squad dieing.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 02:49:16


Post by: MrMoustaffa


Is everyone just forgetting about order of the ebon chalice? You can get 6 at the start of the first game round with their warlord trait. Wouldn't that mean you could start with around 10 start of the game?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 03:07:21


Post by: Waaaghpower


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
Is everyone just forgetting about order of the ebon chalice? You can get 6 at the start of the first game round with their warlord trait. Wouldn't that mean you could start with around 10 start of the game?

You might want to re-read that rule...


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 03:09:26


Post by: Lammia


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
Is everyone just forgetting about order of the ebon chalice? You can get 6 at the start of the first game round with their warlord trait. Wouldn't that mean you could start with around 10 start of the game?
That's... not what Ebon Chalice does...

Terrible Knowledge wrote:If this Warlord is on the battlefield, the Miracle dice you gain at the start of the first battle round is a 6. At the start of the first battle round,if your army is battle-forged and this Warlord is on the battlefield, you gain D3 Command Points.


So your first dice starts at a six, you don't get six dice.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 03:14:50


Post by: ZergSmasher


I've been looking through the codex to try and find any nifty wombo-combos, but I haven't really found anything super game-breakingly good. One thing I do want to try sometime would be a max squad of Bloody Rose Repentia with an Imagifier, Repentia Superior, and Preacher nearby. On the charge they get 4 attacks apiece, hitting on a 4+ rerollable, at S8 AP-4 D2, with all of those buffs. Only problem is delivery, as a max squad of 9 models can only have one character in a Rhino with them and they really want to have all 3 characters. You could probably live without the Superior, but the Preacher and Imagifier are must haves to make the attack viable. On average dice this kills a Knight in one round of combat! The real trick is getting the Repentia into melee in one piece, as they aren't terribly resilient. I guess charging through ruins is a must for this tactic.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 03:26:46


Post by: Waaaghpower


 ZergSmasher wrote:
I've been looking through the codex to try and find any nifty wombo-combos, but I haven't really found anything super game-breakingly good. One thing I do want to try sometime would be a max squad of Bloody Rose Repentia with an Imagifier, Repentia Superior, and Preacher nearby. On the charge they get 4 attacks apiece, hitting on a 4+ rerollable, at S8 AP-4 D2, with all of those buffs. Only problem is delivery, as a max squad of 9 models can only have one character in a Rhino with them and they really want to have all 3 characters. You could probably live without the Superior, but the Preacher and Imagifier are must haves to make the attack viable. On average dice this kills a Knight in one round of combat! The real trick is getting the Repentia into melee in one piece, as they aren't terribly resilient. I guess charging through ruins is a must for this tactic.

Another option depending on terrain, instead of charging through ruins, is to charge with the Rhino.
This same combo was viable minus the Imagifier pre-codex, and was equally deadly then. (Less AP but a smaller character tax.)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 04:12:01


Post by: pretre


Keep it coming. This is good stuff (minus the rules debate that should be taken to YMDC)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 04:21:49


Post by: Grundz


 ZergSmasher wrote:
I've been looking through the codex to try and find any nifty wombo-combos, but I haven't really found anything super game-breakingly good. One thing I do want to try sometime would be a max squad of Bloody Rose Repentia with an Imagifier, Repentia Superior, and Preacher nearby. On the charge they get 4 attacks apiece, hitting on a 4+ rerollable, at S8 AP-4 D2, with all of those buffs. Only problem is delivery, as a max squad of 9 models can only have one character in a Rhino with them and they really want to have all 3 characters. You could probably live without the Superior, but the Preacher and Imagifier are must haves to make the attack viable. On average dice this kills a Knight in one round of combat! The real trick is getting the Repentia into melee in one piece, as they aren't terribly resilient. I guess charging through ruins is a must for this tactic.


If you use the bloody rose stratagem, each repentia will do 2.7(ish) wounds to the knight or 5.4 if you use the fight twice stratagem at the end of the phase to finish the job if necessary.
If that canoness joins in the fun with the casket of penance, that goes up to 5 wounds (10 if fighting twice) PER REPENTIA as they butcher the thing needing 2's to wound

also:
A valorous heart canoness with the iron surplice of saint istaela takes less than 3 wounds from a full round of knight stomping




Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 05:25:23


Post by: MrMoustaffa


@lamia and waaaaagh, I see what you mean now, my bad. Still getting a grip on this codex. Not quite as useful of a warlord trait I see. Thanks for pointing that out.

I think I'm going to go with Valorous heart as my order. The durability their main trait offers combined with the strat allowing a unit to ignore hit modifiers is very good. It plays into an army style I like of mass infantry, and offers solid durability as well as some offense. The relic gives some interesting utility with proper play but isn't anything crazy, but might help sisters wound all the marines out there on 4's at least. Combo'd with the imagifier ability you could potentially wound marines on 3's. Warlord trait is kind of useless unfortunately. Overall though it's a solid package and is one that is "always on" for lack of a better term. I understand defensive traits aren't always the best in 40k, but I do feel you could build an extremely difficult to kill infantry horde with Valorous Heart, perhaps the toughest to shift in the game as far as infantry goes. With everyone, including marines, kitting out to kill marines, just outright ignoring most AP weapons is pretty good.

Need to get some games though to see how it goes. I hate that the box comes with only ten sisters, I really need like 30 to test the theory at small level games. Not to mention not a single melta, this starter set sets you off on a rough foot when it comes to fighting vehicles at anything but melee range. Here's hoping the full kits drop soon.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 05:33:59


Post by: Waaaghpower


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
@lamia and waaaaagh, I see what you mean now, my bad. Still getting a grip on this codex. Not quite as useful of a warlord trait I see. Thanks for pointing that out.

It's still a pretty darned useful Warlord Trait, though. Warlord Traits can be bought for 1cp, so their value is weighted against whether the benefit outweighs or is outweighed by 1cp. In the case of this trait, worst case scenario you get your 1cp back and also get an automatic 6, which can be invaluable. Best case scenario, you also get an extra two CPs.
It's not good enough to take a detachment by itself just to get the warlord trait, but it's still quite potent.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 05:35:51


Post by: Jancoran


Audustum wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
That is also how I read it.


This is gonna need to be FAQ'd because people are debating that all over I think. I personally read it as saying you could use a Miracle Die for each one because they're all part of the same shooting attack in the same phase.


The rules actually do one die at a time though, So. Unless two dice are cast together...,


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 06:22:48


Post by: Giantwalkingchair


While I was disappointed to see bloody rose lose the extra strength on the charge, that extra ap is quite nice and actually helps out Celestians of all things.
Given the presence of a priest and a +1S imagifier and a Cannoness, those girls are throwing out 4 s4 ap-1 attacks each rerolling hits and able to reroll wounds. If you go Passion (which if bloody rose you are) you get extra hits on 6s to hit.
That's surprisingly nice. I could see myself putting in a squad as chaff clearer.

Repentia get nasty too with passion and double fight.

Now I've just gotta decide whether to give my Cannoness in this situation a blessed blade for min 6 s6 ap-4 Dd3 attacks or the chainsword relic for min 9 s5 ap-3 D2 attacks.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 06:29:19


Post by: pm713


Do Celestians have a use now or are they still awful?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 06:41:06


Post by: Lammia


They're better. But not necessarily by enough.

Their bodyguard is the Post Acolyte disappoint, but they make a -super- Chapter Master out of their Canoness and can get an Lt. Effect for 2CP


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 06:41:50


Post by: Jancoran


pm713 wrote:
Do Celestians have a use now or are they still awful?


They actually do.

Only 1 point premium over a sister. Mainly You get:

Better weapon options (can do 3 meltas essentially or two and one multimelta)
Bodyguard feature
Most important: twin-linked weapons!!! (When near Canoness). That... is boss.
Extra attack.

All for 1 point. Seems legit.

Not as important: stratagem to re-roll wounds and hits for 2 cp. They already reroll hits w canoness so...)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 06:43:12


Post by: Lammia


Actually, it's a plain reroll fot Wounding too... (with the CP)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 06:46:36


Post by: pm713


 Jancoran wrote:
pm713 wrote:
Do Celestians have a use now or are they still awful?


They actually do.

Only 1 point premium over a sister. Mainly You get:

Better weapon options (can do 3 meltas essentially or two and one multimelta)
Bodyguard feature
Most important: twin-linked weapons!!! (When near Canoness). That... is boss.
Extra attack.

All for 1 point. Seems legit.

Not as important: stratagem to re-roll wounds and hits for 2 cp. They already reroll hits w canoness so...)

Bodyguarding something that you can hide behind all units seems a bit pointless. Maybe for things like the Triumph though?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 06:54:17


Post by: Lammia


pm713 wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
pm713 wrote:
Do Celestians have a use now or are they still awful?


They actually do.

Only 1 point premium over a sister. Mainly You get:

Better weapon options (can do 3 meltas essentially or two and one multimelta)
Bodyguard feature
Most important: twin-linked weapons!!! (When near Canoness). That... is boss.
Extra attack.

All for 1 point. Seems legit.

Not as important: stratagem to re-roll wounds and hits for 2 cp. They already reroll hits w canoness so...)

Bodyguarding something that you can hide behind all units seems a bit pointless. Maybe for things like the Triumph though?
Triumph can't be bodyguarded. But the still fill a spare Elite slot better than a Preacher


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 06:57:01


Post by: Arcanis161


I've been patiently waiting for Battlescribe to update so I can play around with some builds. I've been curious on what I could potentially do with Valorous Heart, Argent Shroud, and Bloody Rose.

I know it would be tough to fit all three together, but I am curious how it could be done. What do you guys think?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 07:07:35


Post by: tneva82


pm713 wrote:
Bodyguarding something that you can hide behind all units seems a bit pointless. Maybe for things like the Triumph though?


Eliminators say "hi"


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 09:27:37


Post by: Jancoran


Some good snipers around. Just a few Celestians can make a difference for very little points cost. Also... twin linked is awesome.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 09:29:13


Post by: BrianDavion


tneva82 wrote:
pm713 wrote:
Bodyguarding something that you can hide behind all units seems a bit pointless. Maybe for things like the Triumph though?


Eliminators say "hi"


which raises a point here.. space Marines are powerful no doubt there, they're the reigning kings of the meta. with -1 AP bolt guns and -2 AP bolt rifles (when in tactical doctrine) eliminators that can make short work of HQs with the right dice rolls, is it just me or do sisters seem like they have some answers to some of the new marine tricks?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 09:42:18


Post by: tneva82


BrianDavion wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
pm713 wrote:
Bodyguarding something that you can hide behind all units seems a bit pointless. Maybe for things like the Triumph though?


Eliminators say "hi"


which raises a point here.. space Marines are powerful no doubt there, they're the reigning kings of the meta. with -1 AP bolt guns and -2 AP bolt rifles (when in tactical doctrine) eliminators that can make short work of HQs with the right dice rolls, is it just me or do sisters seem like they have some answers to some of the new marine tricks?


Well certainly ignoring -2 so prevalent in marines is nice Which does btw help with eliminators(phew) though mortals still out there. But since sisters benefit a lot from their characters losing them hurts so some bodyguards could be good. too bad sisters have the inferior bodyguard rule compared to tau drones.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 10:21:25


Post by: IanVanCheese


BrianDavion wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
pm713 wrote:
Bodyguarding something that you can hide behind all units seems a bit pointless. Maybe for things like the Triumph though?


Eliminators say "hi"


which raises a point here.. space Marines are powerful no doubt there, they're the reigning kings of the meta. with -1 AP bolt guns and -2 AP bolt rifles (when in tactical doctrine) eliminators that can make short work of HQs with the right dice rolls, is it just me or do sisters seem like they have some answers to some of the new marine tricks?


Sisters are the perfect answer to marines to be honest. Resistant to their firepower and we have a ton of cheap, basically throw away anti-tank options that we can miracle dice to always go our way. Also Exorcists are disgustingly efficient at removing just about anything they look at.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 12:45:46


Post by: Hoc Est Bellum


I'm leaning towards Ebon Chalice myself. I feel like having a fistful of 6s on command helps in a huge amount of situations. That Lascannon is bouncing off my Exorcist. That CHE is taking a missile to the face regardless of the -3.

Their Conviction means you can fully lean into generation of MD without worrying about duff rolls. I'm not 100% on the wording, but I think you could even use a MD generated by a Cherub as discard fodder for a different unit (they don't get discarded until the end of the phase)

Celestians have a nice little synergy, too, as the Conviction lets them FNP the Bodyguard wounds.
If your Canoness was taking a MW, it seems like the sequence is that she would try to save, and if she fails the Celestians can bodyguard it, and then they get to try to save it as well. It won't come up that often, but it's good to know about.

Plus I just want to incinerate something with that Strategem. Like, go full Trogdor with Cleansing Flames, Holy Trinity and Storm of Retribution for 36 S5 hits with +1 to wound and rerolls. Such a lot of CPs, though...


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 12:56:56


Post by: Sterling191


tneva82 wrote:

Well certainly ignoring -2 so prevalent in marines is nice Which does btw help with eliminators(phew) though mortals still out there. But since sisters benefit a lot from their characters losing them hurts so some bodyguards could be good. too bad sisters have the inferior bodyguard rule compared to tau drones.


I will point out that if you're up against any of the Devastator based super-doctrines, Eliminators are punching at AP3. Given how prevalent the Dev based chapters are (IF and IH) you're going to need those bodyguards.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 13:00:54


Post by: tneva82


Good point. Luckily local meta has mostly ultramarines with some ravenguard(which did they have?) and salamander to mix. Iron hands are blessedly sparse(albeit I play mostly on the casual tournaments)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Hoc Est Bellum wrote:
I'm leaning towards Ebon Chalice myself. I feel like having a fistful of 6s on command helps in a huge amount of situations. That Lascannon is bouncing off my Exorcist. That CHE is taking a missile to the face regardless of the -3.

Their Conviction means you can fully lean into generation of MD without worrying about duff rolls. I'm not 100% on the wording, but I think you could even use a MD generated by a Cherub as discard fodder for a different unit (they don't get discarded until the end of the phase)


Did Ebon have any special rule regarding cherub? As normally cherub is for the squad itself. And lost if not used which is why I put banners on squads with cherubs.

CHE's I deal with "ignore modifiers" strat Take salvo of missiles hitting on 3+!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 13:46:28


Post by: Lemondish


tneva82 wrote:

Did Ebon have any special rule regarding cherub? As normally cherub is for the squad itself. And lost if not used which is why I put banners on squads with cherubs.


Just the ability to discard a MD to make another one a 6 I think. Don't see any limitation that says you can't just discard it for the effect even if you're going to use the other dice somewhere else. Not sure it's worth it given how the Cherub dice is probably going to be a decent value given the roll 2 pick your poison idea.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 14:06:15


Post by: Unit1126PLL


I've decided to make 2 armies. This means my metals can stay one army and stay together, while my plastics can be another and stay together. The Argent Shroud playstyle is fun, but I am also looking forwards to Bloody Rose.

So... goodness. I feel like it's completely different. Lots of jump pack infantry. Lots of elites choices. How does one go for CP in Bloody Rose? You can't just bundle together a brigade and go whole-hog on troops. Rely on melee for anti-tank?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 14:16:10


Post by: Grundz


pm713 wrote:

Bodyguarding something that you can hide behind all units seems a bit pointless. Maybe for things like the Triumph though?


One unit of snipers capable of shooting characters can pick up one of your support characters a turn under the right circumstances

you're just guardsmen with bolters without any support characters


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 14:50:27


Post by: Hoc Est Bellum


Lemondish wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

Did Ebon have any special rule regarding cherub? As normally cherub is for the squad itself. And lost if not used which is why I put banners on squads with cherubs.


Just the ability to discard a MD to make another one a 6 I think. Don't see any limitation that says you can't just discard it for the effect even if you're going to use the other dice somewhere else. Not sure it's worth it given how the Cherub dice is probably going to be a decent value given the roll 2 pick your poison idea.


Yeah, it's more a risk mitigation thing. You have to use the Cherub at the start of the phase, and the die is lost at the end of the phase. But most squads don't have that much use for the Cherub; it's BSS, Dominion and Celestians that can take them, so I guess you could use it on some melta damages but you run the risk of missing or not wounding. Probably more use for advancing or Deny.

But for Ebon Chalice a Cherub pretty much becomes '5pts, turn a dice into a 6 this phase' which might even be worth it without the Simulacrum Imperialis on the units. If you were running 2 Batallions or a Brigade you have the option to pay 30 points to have 6 guaranteed 6s, kind of. That's pretty excellent


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 15:00:46


Post by: Raulengrin


Here is an idea. Not 100% sure it is legal - would have to check FAQs. But because superiors can change boaters for bolt pistols, one could give a superior 2 bolt pistols and change them both for an inferno pistol and a hand flamer for 8 points. Put said superior in a squad of Argent Shroud Storm Bolter dominions for a not terrible use of holy trinity with blessed bolts. Argent shroud would allow them to advance and fire their pistols, and with the extra movement it shouldn't be much of an issue for them to get within 6 inches of a vehicle.

Food for thought.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 15:03:57


Post by: Unit1126PLL


Raulengrin wrote:
Here is an idea. Not 100% sure it is legal - would have to check FAQs. But because superiors can change boaters for bolt pistols, one could give a superior 2 bolt pistols and change them both for an inferno pistol and a hand flamer for 8 points. Put said superior in a squad of Argent Shroud Storm Bolter dominions for a not terrible use of holy trinity with blessed bolts. Argent shroud would allow them to advance and fire their pistols, and with the extra movement it shouldn't be much of an issue for them to get within 6 inches of a vehicle.

Food for thought.


Inferno pistols only have a 6" range, so it's difficult, but do-able.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 15:10:11


Post by: Grundz


Raulengrin wrote:
Here is an idea. Not 100% sure it is legal - would have to check FAQs. But because superiors can change boaters for bolt pistols, one could give a superior 2 bolt pistols and change them both for an inferno pistol and a hand flamer for 8 points. Put said superior in a squad of Argent Shroud Storm Bolter dominions for a not terrible use of holy trinity with blessed bolts. Argent shroud would allow them to advance and fire their pistols, and with the extra movement it shouldn't be much of an issue for them to get within 6 inches of a vehicle.

Food for thought.


An interesting one, I knew about two pistols but hadn't thought to replace them with inferno pistols (or hand flamers)

14 points for two inferno pistols over one meltagun is a win in my book


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 15:16:48


Post by: Unit1126PLL


 Grundz wrote:
Raulengrin wrote:
Here is an idea. Not 100% sure it is legal - would have to check FAQs. But because superiors can change boaters for bolt pistols, one could give a superior 2 bolt pistols and change them both for an inferno pistol and a hand flamer for 8 points. Put said superior in a squad of Argent Shroud Storm Bolter dominions for a not terrible use of holy trinity with blessed bolts. Argent shroud would allow them to advance and fire their pistols, and with the extra movement it shouldn't be much of an issue for them to get within 6 inches of a vehicle.

Food for thought.


An interesting one, I knew about two pistols but hadn't thought to replace them with inferno pistols (or hand flamers)

14 points for two inferno pistols over one meltagun is a win in my book

Just don't forget the range problem. I like to be within 6" where possible, but it's much easier for the enemy to avoid that range band than it is for them to avoid a 12" one.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 15:18:25


Post by: tneva82


Raulengrin wrote:
Here is an idea. Not 100% sure it is legal - would have to check FAQs. But because superiors can change boaters for bolt pistols, one could give a superior 2 bolt pistols and change them both for an inferno pistol and a hand flamer for 8 points. Put said superior in a squad of Argent Shroud Storm Bolter dominions for a not terrible use of holy trinity with blessed bolts. Argent shroud would allow them to advance and fire their pistols, and with the extra movement it shouldn't be much of an issue for them to get within 6 inches of a vehicle.

Food for thought.


Keep in mind each bullet point in wargear options can be picked once per unit. So if you have "replace bolt pistol with x" it can be picked once. If you replace other weapon with bolt pistol can't pick bullet point again. Bullet point specifically needs to allow swapping multiple pistols.

Don't have codex with me to check wording.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 15:20:11


Post by: Grundz


 Unit1126PLL wrote:

14 points for two inferno pistols over one meltagun is a win in my book

Just don't forget the range problem. I like to be within 6" where possible, but it's much easier for the enemy to avoid that range band than it is for them to avoid a 12" one.


I'm not worried about much range, its up close where people are throwing enough dice to actually whittle down sisters that I need them.
Yes, not every squad would get the loadout but one or two might

Thought: doing this with celestians gives you 4 meltaguns in a celestian squad with a 2cp "reroll everything" stratagem at less points than a dom squad


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 15:59:45


Post by: the_scotsman


Raulengrin wrote:
Here is an idea. Not 100% sure it is legal - would have to check FAQs. But because superiors can change boaters for bolt pistols, one could give a superior 2 bolt pistols and change them both for an inferno pistol and a hand flamer for 8 points. Put said superior in a squad of Argent Shroud Storm Bolter dominions for a not terrible use of holy trinity with blessed bolts. Argent shroud would allow them to advance and fire their pistols, and with the extra movement it shouldn't be much of an issue for them to get within 6 inches of a vehicle.

Food for thought.


While technically legal, GW has never failed to remove any option that requires you to swap a weapon, then swap again in all 2-week FAQs.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 16:00:22


Post by: tneva82


Check rulebook faq. No using same bullet point twice


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 16:04:47


Post by: deviantduck


It looks like your options are: (2 BP), or (1 BP + 1 IP), or (1 BP + 1 HF). I don't see how to get 2 IP or 2 HF


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 16:07:49


Post by: IanVanCheese


 Grundz wrote:
pm713 wrote:

Bodyguarding something that you can hide behind all units seems a bit pointless. Maybe for things like the Triumph though?


One unit of snipers capable of shooting characters can pick up one of your support characters a turn under the right circumstances

you're just guardsmen with bolters without any support characters


Yeah I feel like Celestians are going to be vital if you're running a character heavy list. Gotta keep those Imagifiers alive as long as possible.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 17:38:51


Post by: warmaster21


Its a shame celestians can only protect half the characters in the book since the other half doesn't have an order tag


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 18:23:12


Post by: Salted Diamond


What do people think about the need to take a Simulacrum Imperialis. They used to be pretty much mandatory, not so sure anymore. What is the consensus with the new codex?


And I'm pretty sure I saw previously in a different thread, but they removed the option for Superiors to take a stormbolter, correct?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 18:41:19


Post by: Rynner


Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 18:44:14


Post by: pm713


What are people thinking on the terrain unit? I like it, a dependable miracle dice for a low price. It's nice to have terrain I'd use rules for rather than just decoration. *coughwebwaygatecough*


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 18:48:13


Post by: the_scotsman


Can anyone verify - I've heard mixed messages from some reviews, some mentioning it and some not - can a 10-woman squad of Seraphim have 4 models with special pistols, or is it only 2 models that can take hand flamers or inferno pistols regardless of unit size?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.



I'll need to see the rule on the Cherub personally to make a call on the Simulacrum.

I know there's a lot of wording surrounding the Cherub's "Special Case Miracle Die" roll. If that miracle die still counts as the one you can use that phase, then I would probably stick a Cherub+Simulacrum on some units. If the Cherub's special miracle die is separate from the one you get to use that phase, then I think only having a cherub on most units who will be regularly using miracle dice would be fine.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 18:55:57


Post by: Grundz


the_scotsman wrote:


I know there's a lot of wording surrounding the Cherub's "Special Case Miracle Die" roll. If that miracle die still counts as the one you can use that phase, then I would probably stick a Cherub+Simulacrum on some units. If the Cherub's special miracle die is separate from the one you get to use that phase, then I think only having a cherub on most units who will be regularly using miracle dice would be fine.


It only gives you the dice, it doesn't give you additionally the ability to use it


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:01:23


Post by: Lemondish


pm713 wrote:
What are people thinking on the terrain unit? I like it, a dependable miracle dice for a low price. It's nice to have terrain I'd use rules for rather than just decoration. *coughwebwaygatecough*


The opportunity cost is a separate detachment solely for this piece. Depending on the type of match you're going for that will often mean you're trading 1 CP for approximately 5 miracle dice and guaranteed cover where you want it. That is unless you've built a triple battalion list. It may also provide LoS protection, but we aren't sure what it looks like yet so that's still up in the air.

I find the sacrifice you need to make to field a triple battalion list is greater than that of committing to the fortification detachment. I'm eager to field one just as soon as I know what the bloody thing looks like.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:05:32


Post by: deviantduck


Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.

You can take them as long as the index still exists.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:07:07


Post by: Grundz


 deviantduck wrote:
Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.

You can take them as long as the index still exists.


so a weekish


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:12:13


Post by: Lemondish


the_scotsman wrote:
Can anyone verify - I've heard mixed messages from some reviews, some mentioning it and some not - can a 10-woman squad of Seraphim have 4 models with special pistols, or is it only 2 models that can take hand flamers or inferno pistols regardless of unit size?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.



I'll need to see the rule on the Cherub personally to make a call on the Simulacrum.

I know there's a lot of wording surrounding the Cherub's "Special Case Miracle Die" roll. If that miracle die still counts as the one you can use that phase, then I would probably stick a Cherub+Simulacrum on some units. If the Cherub's special miracle die is separate from the one you get to use that phase, then I think only having a cherub on most units who will be regularly using miracle dice would be fine.


Re: Seraphim...

"Up to 2 Seraphim can be equipped with one of the following instead of 2 bolt pistols: 2 hand flamers; 2 inferno pistols"

There is no alteration here for unit size. Always simply 2, and you cannot spread out the pistols so that 4 models have 1, for instance.

Re: Incensor Cherub...

"If this unit has an Incensor Cherub, then once per battle, at the beginning of a phase, that Incensor Cherub can intercede. If it does, that Incensor Cherub is removed from play and you gain one Miracle dice: roll two D6 when you do so and select which one to keep. The Miracle dice you gain can only be used to perform an Act of Faith for this unit, and only in that phase - at the end of the phase, if the dice has not been used, it is lost."

Rereading it, the part that makes me think we maybe can't sacrifice it for other purposes (Stratagems, Ebon Chalice conviction) is that it can only be used on an Act of Faith for that unit, which reads as if that is the exclusive purpose.

In any case, they synergize very well with the Simulacrum Imperialis letting you perform multiple Acts in one phase using dice generated for that purpose, so likely in the first turn. Then the units maintain the ability to perform simultaneous Acts later in the game with the Simulacrum as you have gained dice to fuel it naturally.

I think it sounds really fun.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:16:23


Post by: deviantduck


 Grundz wrote:
 deviantduck wrote:
Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.

You can take them as long as the index still exists.


so a weekish
Hey man, I might be playing in a tourney Saturday and it's suns out guns out. Storm bolters for all. Legends isn't dropping until January, correct?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:17:11


Post by: Grundz


 deviantduck wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
 deviantduck wrote:
Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.

You can take them as long as the index still exists.


so a weekish
Hey man, I might be playing in a tourney Saturday and it's suns out guns out. Storm bolters for all. Legends isn't dropping until January, correct?


I thought the chapter approved point list was the replacement until legends


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:19:50


Post by: deviantduck


 Grundz wrote:
 deviantduck wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
 deviantduck wrote:
Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.

You can take them as long as the index still exists.


so a weekish
Hey man, I might be playing in a tourney Saturday and it's suns out guns out. Storm bolters for all. Legends isn't dropping until January, correct?


I thought the chapter approved point list was the replacement until legends
Sure for points, but the Index still exists until Legends comes out. CA19 could change the storm bolter points in the index, but the option is still in the index. (unless CA19 IS legends? I thought legends was going to be it's own digital download)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:24:35


Post by: Waaaghpower


I'm *thrilled* about the change to Storm Bolters. I think this is the sixth or seventh time that I've had previously-legal models that I've carefully customized for my army become illegal because GW decided to scrap a formerly legal option.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:29:16


Post by: deviantduck


Waaaghpower wrote:
I'm *thrilled* about the change to Storm Bolters. I think this is the sixth or seventh time that I've had previously-legal models that I've carefully customized for my army become illegal because GW decided to scrap a formerly legal option.
Yup. I've got a lot of superiors that will have broken arms soon.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:34:42


Post by: Waaaghpower


 deviantduck wrote:
Waaaghpower wrote:
I'm *thrilled* about the change to Storm Bolters. I think this is the sixth or seventh time that I've had previously-legal models that I've carefully customized for my army become illegal because GW decided to scrap a formerly legal option.
Yup. I've got a lot of superiors that will have broken arms soon.

I'm just going to call them regular Storm Bolter sisters that just happen to have decorative other weapons. It's not worth it to snap off all the chainswords and make new hands when I have new plastics to be working on.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 19:59:15


Post by: Salted Diamond


Waaaghpower wrote:
 deviantduck wrote:
Waaaghpower wrote:
I'm *thrilled* about the change to Storm Bolters. I think this is the sixth or seventh time that I've had previously-legal models that I've carefully customized for my army become illegal because GW decided to scrap a formerly legal option.
Yup. I've got a lot of superiors that will have broken arms soon.

I'm just going to call them regular Storm Bolter sisters that just happen to have decorative other weapons. It's not worth it to snap off all the chainswords and make new hands when I have new plastics to be working on.

This is how I've been treating my evicerator armed Seraphim Superior. Modded her up way back in Codex Witchhunters. I refuse to remove it.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 20:08:43


Post by: the_scotsman


Lemondish wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Can anyone verify - I've heard mixed messages from some reviews, some mentioning it and some not - can a 10-woman squad of Seraphim have 4 models with special pistols, or is it only 2 models that can take hand flamers or inferno pistols regardless of unit size?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.



I'll need to see the rule on the Cherub personally to make a call on the Simulacrum.

I know there's a lot of wording surrounding the Cherub's "Special Case Miracle Die" roll. If that miracle die still counts as the one you can use that phase, then I would probably stick a Cherub+Simulacrum on some units. If the Cherub's special miracle die is separate from the one you get to use that phase, then I think only having a cherub on most units who will be regularly using miracle dice would be fine.


Re: Seraphim...

"Up to 2 Seraphim can be equipped with one of the following instead of 2 bolt pistols: 2 hand flamers; 2 inferno pistols"

There is no alteration here for unit size. Always simply 2, and you cannot spread out the pistols so that 4 models have 1, for instance.

Re: Incensor Cherub...

"If this unit has an Incensor Cherub, then once per battle, at the beginning of a phase, that Incensor Cherub can intercede. If it does, that Incensor Cherub is removed from play and you gain one Miracle dice: roll two D6 when you do so and select which one to keep. The Miracle dice you gain can only be used to perform an Act of Faith for this unit, and only in that phase - at the end of the phase, if the dice has not been used, it is lost."

Rereading it, the part that makes me think we maybe can't sacrifice it for other purposes (Stratagems, Ebon Chalice conviction) is that it can only be used on an Act of Faith for that unit, which reads as if that is the exclusive purpose.

In any case, they synergize very well with the Simulacrum Imperialis letting you perform multiple Acts in one phase using dice generated for that purpose, so likely in the first turn. Then the units maintain the ability to perform simultaneous Acts later in the game with the Simulacrum as you have gained dice to fuel it naturally.

I think it sounds really fun.



Hmmm. That definitely reduces the power of the Cherub in my eyes, because effectively I would consider it a 10pt upgrade unless I was absolutely CERTAIN that the unit using the cherub would absolutely need a miracle die in one particular phase and nothing else was.

Looking at the basic loadout for a simple sisters squad, I thought 5 ladies+Storm Bolter+Superior with Chainsword, Boltgun and Inferno Pistol made a nice, neat package. The Inferno Pistol adds that little bit more threat to heavy units, characters, etc that might make an opponent think a little harder about your basic battle sisters squads.

Those two upgrades are only 9 points. To add both a Simulacrum and a Cherub to the squad would be an additional 10, which seems not super worth it to me, nice as it would be to have those two in combination with the One Angry Shot from the inferno pistol. You're only 1CP from a 5-woman battle sister squad being able to very nearly guarantee d6 points of damage to anything that doesn't have an invuln save.

But I don't think that guarantee is worth 10 additional points.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 20:21:03


Post by: Grundz


the_scotsman wrote:


But I don't think that guarantee is worth 10 additional points.


It isn't, but if you are, say, argent shroud and drop a multimelta into your basic squads, it may be worth it just for one shot


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 22:01:38


Post by: epronovost


 Jancoran wrote:
pm713 wrote:
Do Celestians have a use now or are they still awful?


They actually do.

Only 1 point premium over a sister. Mainly You get:

Better weapon options (can do 3 meltas essentially or two and one multimelta)
Bodyguard feature
Most important: twin-linked weapons!!! (When near Canoness). That... is boss.
Extra attack.

All for 1 point. Seems legit.

Not as important: stratagem to re-roll wounds and hits for 2 cp. They already reroll hits w canoness so...)


Don't they also hit on 3+ in close combat compared to 4+ for regular Sisters?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/03 22:12:04


Post by: tneva82


epronovost wrote:


Don't they also hit on 3+ in close combat compared to 4+ for regular Sisters?


Correct.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 deviantduck wrote:

so a weekish
Hey man, I might be playing in a tourney Saturday and it's suns out guns out. Storm bolters for all. Legends isn't dropping until January, correct?


GW linked the two together in commnity article so could pop out for download next weekend. Or maybe bit later. They didn't gave exact date. Just "together with chapter approved 2019"


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 01:28:59


Post by: Grundz


Thought:

Cherubs you roll two dice, pick one, and it must be used by that unit or it is lost

order of the sacred rose warlord trait: when the warlord uses a miracle, get another miracle dice, isn't super useful because it negates the order roll, but the one that gives you one on each turn doesn't for some reason, take that
order of the sacred rose: whenever you commit an act of faith, on a 5+ you gain another miracle dice

1cp test of faith for D3 more when used on a character.

This seems like a significant dice economy.
All your squads take a banner and cherub, your warlord takes the relic bolt pistol
Warlord moves up and shoots, you burn a dice on one of the rolls, on a 5+ you gain another one from the order, for 1cp you gain D3 more on top of that, you can do this every turn.
now your squads eat their cherubs and shoot or whatever, you use the dice on a 5+ you gain another one for each spent
You burn a cp whenever you commit valor (most turns(?) for another D3
All these rolls can be increased by 1 by a dialogus

so every round you're getting 2, plus another D3 from the warlord, plus another one on a 5+, so an average of 5 or 6 dice a turn
then a third of the ones you are spending on your squads are being refunded, plus another D3 on most turns, this seems like it will either snowball or every damage roll you ever make you can sub in dice

If you have the room for a detachment of mostly-not-sororitas models, taking a high churn unit like melta retributors as ebon chalice lets you recycle your low rolls into even more 6's

I dont know, it seems like it may be feasable, if silly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
for example, if my warlord does this 4 turns, and I trigger valor 3 times in a game, lasts 5 turns


I use 7 cp
I generate 7d3, lets say 14 miracle dice
Warlord generate 4 dice (1/turn)
1/turn generates 5 dice
cherubs generate lets say 5 more
regular usage, lets say we generate 10 dice through the game through the other ways

38 dice
those generate 12.65 more from the order
those generate 4.2 more from the order
those generate 1 more from the order

Thats 55 miracle dice in one game


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 01:52:48


Post by: Drider


Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 02:13:44


Post by: Lammia


 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?
There have been a few discussions on that in the Rumors thread and a YMDC thread.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 02:29:38


Post by: ZergSmasher


 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?

I had noticed, and I hope GW is smart enough to correct the problem in the upcoming FAQ for the codex.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 08:08:05


Post by: volcanoisme


Rynner wrote:
I've played 5 with the new codex. I played twice vs Chaos, once vs Iron Hands, Necrons, and Tau. Each game was at 1500 because of a local 1 day GT around here everyone wants to practice for.

It's really amusing, Tau used to be a horrendous match up but now it's laughably easy.


Kinda curious to what list you’ve been testing to that result, if you dont mind me asking!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 09:46:25


Post by: Hoc Est Bellum


 Grundz wrote:
Thought:

Cherubs you roll two dice, pick one, and it must be used by that unit or it is lost

order of the sacred rose warlord trait: when the warlord uses a miracle, get another miracle dice, isn't super useful because it negates the order roll, but the one that gives you one on each turn doesn't for some reason, take that
order of the sacred rose: whenever you commit an act of faith, on a 5+ you gain another miracle dice

1cp test of faith for D3 more when used on a character.

This seems like a significant dice economy.
All your squads take a banner and cherub, your warlord takes the relic bolt pistol
Warlord moves up and shoots, you burn a dice on one of the rolls, on a 5+ you gain another one from the order, for 1cp you gain D3 more on top of that, you can do this every turn.
now your squads eat their cherubs and shoot or whatever, you use the dice on a 5+ you gain another one for each spent
You burn a cp whenever you commit valor (most turns(?) for another D3
All these rolls can be increased by 1 by a dialogus

so every round you're getting 2, plus another D3 from the warlord, plus another one on a 5+, so an average of 5 or 6 dice a turn
then a third of the ones you are spending on your squads are being refunded, plus another D3 on most turns, this seems like it will either snowball or every damage roll you ever make you can sub in dice

If you have the room for a detachment of mostly-not-sororitas models, taking a high churn unit like melta retributors as ebon chalice lets you recycle your low rolls into even more 6's

I dont know, it seems like it may be feasable, if silly.


You've got the things slightly mixed up here. Vessel of the Emperor's Will is the one that gives you a single Miracle Dice whenever a character performs an Act of Faith. Test of Faith is the one that gives d3 Miracle Dice whenever you gain a Miracle Dice from Purity or Valour. Test of Faith is strong enough that I don't actually consider Light of the Emperor to be a dud Rite; every morale test is a 30% chance of 2-4 Miracle Dice.

However, Vessel does stack with the Sacred Rose Warlord Trait, so you can throw a crappy dice into a 2+ to hit roll or something and get two Miracle Dice out of the other end. I'm not sure that's the best use of CPs though.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 10:35:09


Post by: lash92


Quick rules check:
If I take a Retributor squad with 2 Armorium Cherbus: I can use both of them in the same turn right?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 11:03:07


Post by: Lammia


 lash92 wrote:
Quick rules check:
If I take a Retributor squad with 2 Armorium Cherbus: I can use both of them in the same turn right?

Armorium Cherub wrote:If this unit has an Armoriun Cherub, then after a model in this unit shoots with a ranged weapon, that Armorium Cherub can reload that model's weapon.if it does, that Armorium Cherub is removed from play and that model can immediately shoot with that ranged weapon again.

An Armorium Cherub is represented by an Armorium Cherub model, but does not count as a model for any rules purposes. Whilst a unit with an Armorium Cherub is on the battlefield, that Armorium Cherub must be within 2" of it.

Nothing in that is limiting you. And it seems to actually be carefully written, so I would say so.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:06:18


Post by: the_scotsman


I am confused why there seems to be such hate directed towards the Triumph. to me, the model seems like the ideal distraction carnifex centerpiece to a foot based sisters army.

imagine the Triumph in the middle of a Valorous Heart foot list. You will have at least one Imagifier providing ignore -1AP for obvious reasons in the list. You will probably have Mortifiers tempting the enemy to direct D6 damage type weaponry at them because Mortifiers look really good and she gives them +1 to hit, and you'll definitely have a good number of Celestians to protect your canonesses and imagifiers from snipers.

To hurt the Triumph your opponent will be shooting into -1 to hit, 4++ invuln, then a 2+ to shrug to a celestian who gets a 6++ FNP against the mortal wound. A 35pt Hospitallier can heal the thing every turn for D3 wounds with no need to roll. You can use two fate dice in the enemy shooting phase if you want to and adjust them up by 1, so any fate die you have that shows 3 or more is an attack that will not hurt the Triumph guaranteed.

So yeah, it's gonna soak a holy buttload of fire. But it also seems perfectly set up to do exactly that and keep your opponent from targeting other models you want to protect like Mortifiers or Retributors or Storm Bolter Dominions looking to use the blessed bolts stratagem with 2+ rerollable to hit.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:07:55


Post by: IanVanCheese


the_scotsman wrote:
I am confused why there seems to be such hate directed towards the Triumph. to me, the model seems like the ideal distraction carnifex centerpiece to a foot based sisters army.

imagine the Triumph in the middle of a Valorous Heart foot list. You will have at least one Imagifier providing ignore -1AP for obvious reasons in the list. You will probably have Mortifiers tempting the enemy to direct D6 damage type weaponry at them because Mortifiers look really good and she gives them +1 to hit, and you'll definitely have a good number of Celestians to protect your canonesses and imagifiers from snipers.

To hurt the Triumph your opponent will be shooting into -1 to hit, 4++ invuln, then a 2+ to shrug to a celestian who gets a 6++ FNP against the mortal wound. A 35pt Hospitallier can heal the thing every turn for D3 wounds with no need to roll. You can use two fate dice in the enemy shooting phase if you want to and adjust them up by 1, so any fate die you have that shows 3 or more is an attack that will not hurt the Triumph guaranteed.

So yeah, it's gonna soak a holy buttload of fire. But it also seems perfectly set up to do exactly that and keep your opponent from targeting other models you want to protect like Mortifiers or Retributors or Storm Bolter Dominions looking to use the blessed bolts stratagem with 2+ rerollable to hit.


Celestian's can't cover the Triumph, it doesn't have the Order keyword. If it did, then yeah it'd be fantastic. I agree that I think it's decent though.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:10:14


Post by: Mmmpi


the_scotsman wrote:
I am confused why there seems to be such hate directed towards the Triumph. to me, the model seems like the ideal distraction carnifex centerpiece to a foot based sisters army.

imagine the Triumph in the middle of a Valorous Heart foot list. You will have at least one Imagifier providing ignore -1AP for obvious reasons in the list. You will probably have Mortifiers tempting the enemy to direct D6 damage type weaponry at them because Mortifiers look really good and she gives them +1 to hit, and you'll definitely have a good number of Celestians to protect your canonesses and imagifiers from snipers.

To hurt the Triumph your opponent will be shooting into -1 to hit, 4++ invuln, then a 2+ to shrug to a celestian who gets a 6++ FNP against the mortal wound. A 35pt Hospitallier can heal the thing every turn for D3 wounds with no need to roll. You can use two fate dice in the enemy shooting phase if you want to and adjust them up by 1, so any fate die you have that shows 3 or more is an attack that will not hurt the Triumph guaranteed.

So yeah, it's gonna soak a holy buttload of fire. But it also seems perfectly set up to do exactly that and keep your opponent from targeting other models you want to protect like Mortifiers or Retributors or Storm Bolter Dominions looking to use the blessed bolts stratagem with 2+ rerollable to hit.



Imagifers only work on units with the same order, while the ToSK doesn't have an order. Same with trying to body guard it with Celestians. They only body guard the same order. Only a -1 isn't that insurmountable, and most armies that want it dead won't have much trouble doing far more than 1d3 wounds to it a turn.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:11:56


Post by: Unit1126PLL


the_scotsman wrote:
I am confused why there seems to be such hate directed towards the Triumph. to me, the model seems like the ideal distraction carnifex centerpiece to a foot based sisters army.

imagine the Triumph in the middle of a Valorous Heart foot list. You will have at least one Imagifier providing ignore -1AP for obvious reasons in the list. You will probably have Mortifiers tempting the enemy to direct D6 damage type weaponry at them because Mortifiers look really good and she gives them +1 to hit, and you'll definitely have a good number of Celestians to protect your canonesses and imagifiers from snipers.

To hurt the Triumph your opponent will be shooting into -1 to hit, 4++ invuln, then a 2+ to shrug to a celestian who gets a 6++ FNP against the mortal wound. A 35pt Hospitallier can heal the thing every turn for D3 wounds with no need to roll. You can use two fate dice in the enemy shooting phase if you want to and adjust them up by 1, so any fate die you have that shows 3 or more is an attack that will not hurt the Triumph guaranteed.

So yeah, it's gonna soak a holy buttload of fire. But it also seems perfectly set up to do exactly that and keep your opponent from targeting other models you want to protect like Mortifiers or Retributors or Storm Bolter Dominions looking to use the blessed bolts stratagem with 2+ rerollable to hit.


So here's why:

You can't 2+ shrug to a Celestian, as the Triumph lacks the <Order> keyword that the Celestians protect. She doesn't benefit from the Imagifier's "ignore -1 rend" for the same reason. You can heal her with the Hospitaller, but then you aren't healing something else (like, say, returning a member to a multi-melta ret squad and already making her points back. Much better than 1 wound on the Triumph, and only slightly less good than 3). You can use 1 Miracle Dice to protect her in the enemy Shooting Phase, not 2, as she doesn't have a Simulacrum, and then you can't use that die for anything else (since it's only 1 per phase), and she has the same invuln and abilities as a Canoness near a Dialogus (4++ with +1/-1 modifier), which even combined are much cheaper. You can also use the Moment of Grace stratagem to add up to +3 to a Canoness's save roll, if I remember correctly.

So no, you can't pawn wounds off to Celestians.
She can't ever ignore -1 armor.
No, she's not a great target for a Hospitaller compared to some others.
And she sucks down as many Miracle Dice keeping her alive as she generates.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:28:16


Post by: the_scotsman


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
I am confused why there seems to be such hate directed towards the Triumph. to me, the model seems like the ideal distraction carnifex centerpiece to a foot based sisters army.

imagine the Triumph in the middle of a Valorous Heart foot list. You will have at least one Imagifier providing ignore -1AP for obvious reasons in the list. You will probably have Mortifiers tempting the enemy to direct D6 damage type weaponry at them because Mortifiers look really good and she gives them +1 to hit, and you'll definitely have a good number of Celestians to protect your canonesses and imagifiers from snipers.

To hurt the Triumph your opponent will be shooting into -1 to hit, 4++ invuln, then a 2+ to shrug to a celestian who gets a 6++ FNP against the mortal wound. A 35pt Hospitallier can heal the thing every turn for D3 wounds with no need to roll. You can use two fate dice in the enemy shooting phase if you want to and adjust them up by 1, so any fate die you have that shows 3 or more is an attack that will not hurt the Triumph guaranteed.

So yeah, it's gonna soak a holy buttload of fire. But it also seems perfectly set up to do exactly that and keep your opponent from targeting other models you want to protect like Mortifiers or Retributors or Storm Bolter Dominions looking to use the blessed bolts stratagem with 2+ rerollable to hit.


So here's why:

You can't 2+ shrug to a Celestian, as the Triumph lacks the <Order> keyword that the Celestians protect. She doesn't benefit from the Imagifier's "ignore -1 rend" for the same reason. You can heal her with the Hospitaller, but then you aren't healing something else (like, say, returning a member to a multi-melta ret squad and already making her points back. Much better than 1 wound on the Triumph, and only slightly less good than 3). You can use 1 Miracle Dice to protect her in the enemy Shooting Phase, not 2, as she doesn't have a Simulacrum, and then you can't use that die for anything else (since it's only 1 per phase), and she has the same invuln and abilities as a Canoness near a Dialogus (4++ with +1/-1 modifier), which even combined are much cheaper. You can also use the Moment of Grace stratagem to add up to +3 to a Canoness's save roll, if I remember correctly.

So no, you can't pawn wounds off to Celestians.
She can't ever ignore -1 armor.
No, she's not a great target for a Hospitaller compared to some others.
And she sucks down as many Miracle Dice keeping her alive as she generates.


One of Katherine's relics is a Simulacrum Imperialis for all Adepta Sororitas units within 6", is it not? Which would include her. So you can use 2 miracle dice per turn of 3+ or better to keep her from taking wounds.

A canoness is indeed easier to protect, particularly because she is a character, but in my eyes that is part of the point of st katherine. Your opponent looks at T3, and looks at 18W, and then at a bunch of say Imperial Fist heavy bolters or autocannons and decides to direct them towards Katherine rather than towards the Retributors or Mortifiers you have nearby. An imp fist heavy bolter does 1.9 damage to a Mortifier on average if it's got a Captain and a Lieutenant in dev doctrine, and 0.68 to Katherine. It does less damage to a Retributor with a heavy boltgun if you're Valorous Heart, but still removes more points because Katherine pays 10pts per wound while retributors pay double that.

You can use a Dialogus and a Canoness with the Litanies for about half the point cost and get the same generation of miracle dice, the same +1/-1 shift, a slightly worse hit buff and you basically only give up the autopass morale and the 6" Simulacrum bubble, but you give up a very very good distraction carnifex. In my eyes, who cares if she uses 2 miracle dice in a shooting phase to make 2 lascannons not wound her? That's still a pair of lascannons that had exactly the same odds of hitting+wounding as against any of your vehicles (-1 to hit, and a 2+ to wound instead of a 3+) and you can use shittier miracle dice to save vs them than any other unit in your army.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:42:09


Post by: Unit1126PLL


the_scotsman wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
I am confused why there seems to be such hate directed towards the Triumph. to me, the model seems like the ideal distraction carnifex centerpiece to a foot based sisters army.

imagine the Triumph in the middle of a Valorous Heart foot list. You will have at least one Imagifier providing ignore -1AP for obvious reasons in the list. You will probably have Mortifiers tempting the enemy to direct D6 damage type weaponry at them because Mortifiers look really good and she gives them +1 to hit, and you'll definitely have a good number of Celestians to protect your canonesses and imagifiers from snipers.

To hurt the Triumph your opponent will be shooting into -1 to hit, 4++ invuln, then a 2+ to shrug to a celestian who gets a 6++ FNP against the mortal wound. A 35pt Hospitallier can heal the thing every turn for D3 wounds with no need to roll. You can use two fate dice in the enemy shooting phase if you want to and adjust them up by 1, so any fate die you have that shows 3 or more is an attack that will not hurt the Triumph guaranteed.

So yeah, it's gonna soak a holy buttload of fire. But it also seems perfectly set up to do exactly that and keep your opponent from targeting other models you want to protect like Mortifiers or Retributors or Storm Bolter Dominions looking to use the blessed bolts stratagem with 2+ rerollable to hit.


So here's why:

You can't 2+ shrug to a Celestian, as the Triumph lacks the <Order> keyword that the Celestians protect. She doesn't benefit from the Imagifier's "ignore -1 rend" for the same reason. You can heal her with the Hospitaller, but then you aren't healing something else (like, say, returning a member to a multi-melta ret squad and already making her points back. Much better than 1 wound on the Triumph, and only slightly less good than 3). You can use 1 Miracle Dice to protect her in the enemy Shooting Phase, not 2, as she doesn't have a Simulacrum, and then you can't use that die for anything else (since it's only 1 per phase), and she has the same invuln and abilities as a Canoness near a Dialogus (4++ with +1/-1 modifier), which even combined are much cheaper. You can also use the Moment of Grace stratagem to add up to +3 to a Canoness's save roll, if I remember correctly.

So no, you can't pawn wounds off to Celestians.
She can't ever ignore -1 armor.
No, she's not a great target for a Hospitaller compared to some others.
And she sucks down as many Miracle Dice keeping her alive as she generates.


One of Katherine's relics is a Simulacrum Imperialis for all Adepta Sororitas units within 6", is it not? Which would include her. So you can use 2 miracle dice per turn of 3+ or better to keep her from taking wounds.

A canoness is indeed easier to protect, particularly because she is a character, but in my eyes that is part of the point of st katherine. Your opponent looks at T3, and looks at 18W, and then at a bunch of say Imperial Fist heavy bolters or autocannons and decides to direct them towards Katherine rather than towards the Retributors or Mortifiers you have nearby. An imp fist heavy bolter does 1.9 damage to a Mortifier on average if it's got a Captain and a Lieutenant in dev doctrine, and 0.68 to Katherine. It does less damage to a Retributor with a heavy boltgun if you're Valorous Heart, but still removes more points because Katherine pays 10pts per wound while retributors pay double that.

You can use a Dialogus and a Canoness with the Litanies for about half the point cost and get the same generation of miracle dice, the same +1/-1 shift, a slightly worse hit buff and you basically only give up the autopass morale and the 6" Simulacrum bubble, but you give up a very very good distraction carnifex. In my eyes, who cares if she uses 2 miracle dice in a shooting phase to make 2 lascannons not wound her? That's still a pair of lascannons that had exactly the same odds of hitting+wounding as against any of your vehicles (-1 to hit, and a 2+ to wound instead of a 3+) and you can use shittier miracle dice to save vs them than any other unit in your army.


But if her only function is to be a distraction carnifex, she's not distracting anymore. A distraction carnifex is a distraction because if you ignore it, it can still smash you. It just isn't your main effort.

Meanwhile, the Triumph... does nothing. A couple wounds that you throw miracle dice at for saves means you suck down more miracle dice than it creates, meaning that for your opponent, aside from throwing those two shots at it, it's better to leave it alive because it's actively detrimental. If you don't throw the Miracle Dice into the saves, then you take wounds rapidly and die.

So you're losing Miracle Dice to keep her alive, and you're gaining autopass morale in an army that wants to roll as many morale checks as possible to generate 1+d3 miracle dice, and a 6" bubble of something that costs 5pts per unit anyways. For 185 points.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:43:41


Post by: A.T.


the_scotsman wrote:
Your opponent looks at T3, and looks at 18W, and then at a bunch of say Imperial Fist heavy bolters or autocannons and decides to direct them towards Katherine rather than towards the Retributors or Mortifiers you have nearby.
I guess once opponents become more used to seeing the sisters there is the question of how much the buffs and unit itself contributes when the retributors and mortifiers get target priority. She doesn't make anything particularly harder to kill beyond moral checks, and doesn't buff shooting or contribute shooting herself other than handing out miracle dice.
A gunline sitting back and shooting at the sisters wouldn't seem to be under any real pressure to target her until she gets into rapid fire range.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:59:26


Post by: generalchaos34


Whats everyones opinion on the Order of our Martyred Lady? I'm not going to lie, as a Ultramarine/House Terryn/Mars/Cadian player I have weird thing for playing the poster armies (or as my wife calls me, Basic, >< ). So its likely I will be painting them up as that Order. I like the extra miracle dice and the +1 to hit, plus the special character is pretty rad. I really want to build this army right and will be my first ever planned from the start army (usually mine are the "ill split a box special" or second hand) and I want to make it something special. I imagine that OooML is going to be infantry heavy in order to really shine.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 15:59:54


Post by: the_scotsman


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
I am confused why there seems to be such hate directed towards the Triumph. to me, the model seems like the ideal distraction carnifex centerpiece to a foot based sisters army.

imagine the Triumph in the middle of a Valorous Heart foot list. You will have at least one Imagifier providing ignore -1AP for obvious reasons in the list. You will probably have Mortifiers tempting the enemy to direct D6 damage type weaponry at them because Mortifiers look really good and she gives them +1 to hit, and you'll definitely have a good number of Celestians to protect your canonesses and imagifiers from snipers.

To hurt the Triumph your opponent will be shooting into -1 to hit, 4++ invuln, then a 2+ to shrug to a celestian who gets a 6++ FNP against the mortal wound. A 35pt Hospitallier can heal the thing every turn for D3 wounds with no need to roll. You can use two fate dice in the enemy shooting phase if you want to and adjust them up by 1, so any fate die you have that shows 3 or more is an attack that will not hurt the Triumph guaranteed.

So yeah, it's gonna soak a holy buttload of fire. But it also seems perfectly set up to do exactly that and keep your opponent from targeting other models you want to protect like Mortifiers or Retributors or Storm Bolter Dominions looking to use the blessed bolts stratagem with 2+ rerollable to hit.


So here's why:

You can't 2+ shrug to a Celestian, as the Triumph lacks the <Order> keyword that the Celestians protect. She doesn't benefit from the Imagifier's "ignore -1 rend" for the same reason. You can heal her with the Hospitaller, but then you aren't healing something else (like, say, returning a member to a multi-melta ret squad and already making her points back. Much better than 1 wound on the Triumph, and only slightly less good than 3). You can use 1 Miracle Dice to protect her in the enemy Shooting Phase, not 2, as she doesn't have a Simulacrum, and then you can't use that die for anything else (since it's only 1 per phase), and she has the same invuln and abilities as a Canoness near a Dialogus (4++ with +1/-1 modifier), which even combined are much cheaper. You can also use the Moment of Grace stratagem to add up to +3 to a Canoness's save roll, if I remember correctly.

So no, you can't pawn wounds off to Celestians.
She can't ever ignore -1 armor.
No, she's not a great target for a Hospitaller compared to some others.
And she sucks down as many Miracle Dice keeping her alive as she generates.


One of Katherine's relics is a Simulacrum Imperialis for all Adepta Sororitas units within 6", is it not? Which would include her. So you can use 2 miracle dice per turn of 3+ or better to keep her from taking wounds.

A canoness is indeed easier to protect, particularly because she is a character, but in my eyes that is part of the point of st katherine. Your opponent looks at T3, and looks at 18W, and then at a bunch of say Imperial Fist heavy bolters or autocannons and decides to direct them towards Katherine rather than towards the Retributors or Mortifiers you have nearby. An imp fist heavy bolter does 1.9 damage to a Mortifier on average if it's got a Captain and a Lieutenant in dev doctrine, and 0.68 to Katherine. It does less damage to a Retributor with a heavy boltgun if you're Valorous Heart, but still removes more points because Katherine pays 10pts per wound while retributors pay double that.

You can use a Dialogus and a Canoness with the Litanies for about half the point cost and get the same generation of miracle dice, the same +1/-1 shift, a slightly worse hit buff and you basically only give up the autopass morale and the 6" Simulacrum bubble, but you give up a very very good distraction carnifex. In my eyes, who cares if she uses 2 miracle dice in a shooting phase to make 2 lascannons not wound her? That's still a pair of lascannons that had exactly the same odds of hitting+wounding as against any of your vehicles (-1 to hit, and a 2+ to wound instead of a 3+) and you can use shittier miracle dice to save vs them than any other unit in your army.


But if her only function is to be a distraction carnifex, she's not distracting anymore. A distraction carnifex is a distraction because if you ignore it, it can still smash you. It just isn't your main effort.

Meanwhile, the Triumph... does nothing. A couple wounds that you throw miracle dice at for saves means you suck down more miracle dice than it creates, meaning that for your opponent, aside from throwing those two shots at it, it's better to leave it alive because it's actively detrimental. If you don't throw the Miracle Dice into the saves, then you take wounds rapidly and die.

So you're losing Miracle Dice to keep her alive, and you're gaining autopass morale in an army that wants to roll as many morale checks as possible to generate 1+d3 miracle dice, and a 6" bubble of something that costs 5pts per unit anyways. For 185 points.


So, I've played with several people who play daemons all edition, and we have always ruled that there is nothing preventing a unit that automatically passes morale tests from making a morale roll if it has an ability that benefits from rolling a particular number (such as the daemons' banners).

The morale rule simply says you make a morale check for all units that have suffered 1 or more casualties during a turn, and compare to its leadership value to determine if you fail. An ability to automatically pass just means you never fail. Not rolling the dice when you automatically pass is, technically speaking, a house rule.

She also does have a +1 to hit aura, and can certainly carve up most infantry targets in melee with her 14 attacks if ignored.

I'm not arguing that Katherine works in every sisters list, she for sure doesn't. But I'm definitely way more interested in her than I am in either Judith or Celestine, particularly in lists where you want something else for enemy D6 damage anti tank weapons to target (i.e., lists that use Exorcists) or lists where you want to funnel enemy mid strength multidamage weaponry like Autocannons (i.e., lists that use Mortifiers).

In a pure valorous heart foot list...yeah, you'd probably be better off sticking with a Rod of Office+Litanies of Faith Canoness (not that you can't also have one of those with Katherine).


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 16:02:35


Post by: Unit1126PLL


The +1 to-hit only works in Melee, remember.

And the "you can still roll even if you auto-pass" thing is technically true, but I can't imagine the number of veins popping on my opponent's forehead when I start rolling 6s, generating miracle dice on a 1, and being like "sorry, I autopass", rolling a 6 with one girl left.

And I agree with you on not being interested in Judith or Celestine. I'm also not interested in the Triumph. I think the most powerful options available to us, given our stratagems, are actually the more basic units. The Special Characters just don't excite me.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 16:15:39


Post by: Frowbakk


Let us not forget the most glaring weakness of >>> Toughness 3 <<< means the Triumph will get wounded by everything on a 2+ or 3+, which'll chew through those wounds really quickly, 3+, 4++, 6+++ or not.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 16:16:05


Post by: the_scotsman


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
The +1 to-hit only works in Melee, remember.

And the "you can still roll even if you auto-pass" thing is technically true, but I can't imagine the number of veins popping on my opponent's forehead when I start rolling 6s, generating miracle dice on a 1, and being like "sorry, I autopass", rolling a 6 with one girl left.

And I agree with you on not being interested in Judith or Celestine. I'm also not interested in the Triumph. I think the most powerful options available to us, given our stratagems, are actually the more basic units. The Special Characters just don't excite me.


I mean, you can't really count "my opponent might get angry at me for playing the rules correctly in a situation where doing so gives me an advantage" against the efficacy of a unit.

Right now, the strongest sisters setup is almost certainly a valorous heart foot build aiming at completely hosing the mid-strength -1/-2AP multidamage weapon spam space marine meta. Multiple imagifiers granting ignore -2AP, no vehicles for Imp Fists to get bonus damage against, lots of celestians to tank Raven Guard eliminator wounds on your characters, and a canoness with the +1 to shield of faith trait buffing a screen line of Seraphim who do not give a feth about infiltrating assault centurions. Just swarm onto objectives with a sea of ridiculously durable 9pt bodies with the occasional inferno pistol ready to be supremely irritating with miracle dice.

Until doctrines get nerfed basically nobody should be looking past valorous heart, it is far and away the best trait any faction in the game has to deal with doctrines unless you're one of the factions that just has invulnerable saves anyway.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Frowbakk wrote:
Let us not forget the most glaring weakness of >>> Toughness 3 <<< means the Triumph will get wounded by everything on a 2+ or 3+, which'll chew through those wounds really quickly, 3+, 4++, 6+++ or not.


Toughness 3 and -1 to hit though, and she pays just slightly over 10 points per wound, meaning only a basic battle sister is more efficient defensively against anti-infantry weapons, and against S8+ weaponry she's exactly as efficient to hit and wound as all your vehicles.



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 16:21:39


Post by: Rynner


volcanoisme wrote:
Rynner wrote:
I've played 5 with the new codex. I played twice vs Chaos, once vs Iron Hands, Necrons, and Tau. Each game was at 1500 because of a local 1 day GT around here everyone wants to practice for.

It's really amusing, Tau used to be a horrendous match up but now it's laughably easy.


Kinda curious to what list you’ve been testing to that result, if you dont mind me asking!


I've only played 1500 point games as theres an Iron Man event coming up in the area (1500 points, 1 day, 5 rounds) that I'm running. I'm not playing in the event but people wanted to practice and get used to the time limit so I played vs them.

The list was roughly:

Valorous Heart Battalion:

Canoness
Preist
3x Stock BSS Squads
1x Imaginifer
1x Dialogues
3x Exorcists

Bloody Rose Outrider

Canoness - Chainsword/Inferno Pistol
Celestine
3x 10 Woman Seraphim Squads with 4x Inferno Pistols, 1x Plasma Pistol

Edit:

LEGENDS IS LIVE.

RIP Storm Bolter Superiors.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/c579975b.pdf


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 17:42:15


Post by: deviantduck


 Grundz wrote:
 deviantduck wrote:
Rynner wrote:
Simulacrum Imperialis - I didn't take them in the beta and none of the list's I'm working on have a need for them. I could see their value in Retribiturs, large BSS squads, or Dome but I don't see myself using those units right now.

Superiors can't take a Storm Bolter anymore.

You can take them as long as the index still exists.


so a weekish
Legends just dropped. Quick weekish! I was way off with January. So.. what this tell us is that we can still use stormbolters on superiors all day long, unless our TOs ban Legends? I'm waiting to see ITC's stance on it.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 17:44:04


Post by: pm713


I'm now thinking how to put storm bolters on everyone.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 17:44:13


Post by: Rynner


Legends is allowed at this year's LVO before going into effect next season. Reece talked about on a podcast.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 17:45:07


Post by: A.T.


Rynner wrote:
LEGENDS IS LIVE.
RIP Storm Bolter Superiors.
I guess everyone just remember to poke GW in their feedback as appropriate - that options should not be culled for models that exist in the new plastic kits, notably the canoness weapon swaps, seraphim pistols, and sticking a superiors head on a stormbolter model.


Kyrinov... probably not valid anywhere competitively but 22 extra points to get a choice of two moral dice when hunting for 1s. Plus an extra wound and actual contribution in the combat phase.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 17:54:03


Post by: Sim-Life


Playing Custodes in about an hour, Battalion/Vanguard pure Valourous Heart. Our group posts our lists pre game but don't tailor and as a personal rule I don't mix traits in an army unless my opponent does it first.

I tried to keep the list simple as I've not got the codex and Battlescribe hasn't updated so its nothing fancy as I wouldn't be able to keep all the rules straight in my head.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 17:58:53


Post by: warmaster21


for a second i thought new cannoness came with a bolter by standard and was thinking of the sillyness of 2 bolters + storm bolter with legacy options, but at least i can still use my double bolter cannoness or bolter+SB cannoness


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 18:27:59


Post by: deviantduck


 Sim-Life wrote:
Playing Custodes in about an hour, Battalion/Vanguard pure Valourous Heart. Our group posts our lists pre game but don't tailor and as a personal rule I don't mix traits in an army unless my opponent does it first.

I tried to keep the list simple as I've not got the codex and Battlescribe hasn't updated so its nothing fancy as I wouldn't be able to keep all the rules straight in my head.
Live stream it. Let's rock!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 18:43:00


Post by: Frowbakk


So I think I'll try and take this list for a whirl this weekend.

It's a far cry from Ye Olde Immolator Spammmmm...e but should be fun to have tanks shoot Infantry and Infantry shoot tanks.

Also trying out 'Jetbike Junith" and see if she's worth re-rolling 1's to hit and wound for 2 Exorcists in the early game before linking up with Seraphim from reserve.

8th Ed “Witch Hunters” List: 2000 points, 14 ~ 16 CP


Spoiler:

=][= Vanguard Detachment (+1 CP) 251 points

74 HQ =][= Minoris, Combi Plasma, Force Sword

57 EL 3 Acolytes, 3 Plasma

22 EL 1 Jokaero

76 EL 4 Acolytes. 4 Plasma

22 EL 1 Jokaero



Ebon Chalice Battalion Detachment (+5 CP) 555 points

45 HQ Canoness (-1 CP) WARLORD: +d3 CP, 1st MD = 6

38 HQ Missionary

49 TR 5 Sisters, 2 Storm Bolters

49 TR 5 Sisters, 2 Storm Bolters

66 TR 5 Sisters, Heavy Flamer, Flamer, Hand Flamer

131 HV 5 Retributors, 4 Heavy Flamers, CombiMelta, 2 Cherub

67 DT Rhino, Storm Bolter

110 DT Immolator, Immolation Cannon, Heavy Bolter



Martyred Lady Battalion Detachment (+5 CP) 1194 points

131 HQ Junith Erutia

60 HQ Canoness, Chainsword, Relic Inferno Pistol, Brazier of Holy Fire, WARLORD: +1 MD/turn

98 TR 5 Sisters, 2 Meltas, CombiMelta, Cherub, Simulacrum

70 TR 5 Sisters, 2 Storm Bolters, CombiPlasma, Cherub, Simulacrum

70 TR 5 Sisters, 2 Storm Bolters, CombiPlasma, Cherub, Simulacrum

70 TR 5 Sisters, 2 Storm Bolters, CombiPlasma, Cherub, Simulacrum

94 FA 6 Seraphim, 4 Inferno Pistols

170 HV Exorcist, Exorcist launcher, Heavy Bolter

170 HV Exorcist, Exorcist launcher, Heavy Bolter

107 DT Repressor, Heavy Flamer, Storm Bolter

107 DT Repressor, Heavy Flamer, Storm Bolter

110 DT Immolator, Immolation Cannon, Heavy Bolter


Looking forward to shooting Inquisitorial Plasma out of the back of Repressors for gitz and shiggles.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 19:32:29


Post by: Tyel


I was massively anti the Triumph when it was first revealed but I'm coming round.

The defence is a bit of an illusion. Yes they can kill it - but I don't think there is a way to do so especially efficiently. Feel free to hose it with heavy bolters - they would tear apart regular sisters squads all over the place instead. Lascannons etc meanwhile can be relatively easily miracle dice saved.

I think the issue is whether it does enough offensively. You have essentially no conventional shooting - and the ebon chalice blam to units in 6" isnt going to come up in the first turn at least. 14 attacks may sound like a lot, but its not really for 185 points - certainly 10 S5 AP-1 attacks, even at effectively WS2+, isn't worth that much. She kills a fair few orks but I think you would expect her to kill 3.5 Primaris a go.

Its really about whether the miracle dice economy "works" (and with it the various buffs related to that). I was very cynical, but I may be coming round - and it might be what makes Matyred Lady and Sacred Rose really good. I'm thinking silly things like having the Triumph deployed close enough to Exorcists on deployment - my opponent wants to try and wittle them down with say Butcher Cannons (or other low AP/2 damage weapons)? Well I can break out two definite saves using miracle dice down to 3s. Or use them to just give me some guaranteed hits if I go first. On the basis of cascading effectiveness it potentially warps the entire game.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 20:15:08


Post by: the_scotsman


I think part of the problem is that it's particularly poorly suited to the current marine meta moment. The current lists to beat all

A) Rely very heavily on S4-S5 AP-1/AP-2 firepower

B) Sit stationary at 30" range and rely heavily on killing large amounts of models at range, rather than in melee, and generally only look to assert board control after they've dismantled a large fraction of the enemy army.

the Triumph is a big weak spot in your list's armor against a setup like that. But imagine a meta based around something more like competitive Orks: A battery of single shot, BS4+ AP-3 D6 damage artillery that wants to kill your heavy stuff with swarms of T4 6+ W1 bodies that will be using Da Jump to deep strike 30 boyz at a time at you in an attempt to slow you down so they can go establish objective control.

Suddenly the optimal list to handle that shifts more towards the Bloody Rose instead of Valorous Heart, because you're not facing really any AP-1/Ap-2 and a unit that can heroically intervene and chew up 8 ork boyz in combat is a pretty big pain in the ass especially if the front line of your list has Retributors with 12" range heavy flamers who are already going to put a dent in overwatch.

It never fails that people are perfectly happy to gauge a unit's overall usefulness solely on its performance in this exact meta moment, despite there being a pretty solid monthly rotation in what exactly is the style of list to beat.

I'd also strongly encourage folks to do a little math and see exactly how vulnerable to firepower this thing is. Why, it only takes the combined firepower from...let's see...six leman russ punishers double tapping into it to get through its 18 wounds in one turn!

That kind of firepower attacking Ork Boyz would only kill 466 points of them!


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 20:36:14


Post by: ERJAK


Stormbolter sergeants are out for tournament players. That's a pretty big hit considering there's no sergeant equipment even close to as good as the stormbolter AND we're not getting all that many points back for it. A brigade+battalion list would only save 18pts max.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
the_scotsman wrote:
I think part of the problem is that it's particularly poorly suited to the current marine meta moment. The current lists to beat all

A) Rely very heavily on S4-S5 AP-1/AP-2 firepower

B) Sit stationary at 30" range and rely heavily on killing large amounts of models at range, rather than in melee, and generally only look to assert board control after they've dismantled a large fraction of the enemy army.

the Triumph is a big weak spot in your list's armor against a setup like that. But imagine a meta based around something more like competitive Orks: A battery of single shot, BS4+ AP-3 D6 damage artillery that wants to kill your heavy stuff with swarms of T4 6+ W1 bodies that will be using Da Jump to deep strike 30 boyz at a time at you in an attempt to slow you down so they can go establish objective control.

Suddenly the optimal list to handle that shifts more towards the Bloody Rose instead of Valorous Heart, because you're not facing really any AP-1/Ap-2 and a unit that can heroically intervene and chew up 8 ork boyz in combat is a pretty big pain in the ass especially if the front line of your list has Retributors with 12" range heavy flamers who are already going to put a dent in overwatch.

It never fails that people are perfectly happy to gauge a unit's overall usefulness solely on its performance in this exact meta moment, despite there being a pretty solid monthly rotation in what exactly is the style of list to beat.

I'd also strongly encourage folks to do a little math and see exactly how vulnerable to firepower this thing is. Why, it only takes the combined firepower from...let's see...six leman russ punishers double tapping into it to get through its 18 wounds in one turn!

That kind of firepower attacking Ork Boyz would only kill 466 points of them!


I would argue that it's worse against Orkz than marines because orkz can kill it with less resource investment. Ork pistols will grind through it fairly quickly.

The things not worried about dying to lascannons, it's worried about soaking up every 'well, I've got nothing better to shoot at...' gun on the table. Especially considering that its chart is brutal.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 20:50:54


Post by: the_scotsman


ERJAK wrote:
Stormbolter sergeants are out for tournament players. That's a pretty big hit considering there's no sergeant equipment even close to as good as the stormbolter AND we're not getting all that many points back for it. A brigade+battalion list would only save 18pts max.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
the_scotsman wrote:
I think part of the problem is that it's particularly poorly suited to the current marine meta moment. The current lists to beat all

A) Rely very heavily on S4-S5 AP-1/AP-2 firepower

B) Sit stationary at 30" range and rely heavily on killing large amounts of models at range, rather than in melee, and generally only look to assert board control after they've dismantled a large fraction of the enemy army.

the Triumph is a big weak spot in your list's armor against a setup like that. But imagine a meta based around something more like competitive Orks: A battery of single shot, BS4+ AP-3 D6 damage artillery that wants to kill your heavy stuff with swarms of T4 6+ W1 bodies that will be using Da Jump to deep strike 30 boyz at a time at you in an attempt to slow you down so they can go establish objective control.

Suddenly the optimal list to handle that shifts more towards the Bloody Rose instead of Valorous Heart, because you're not facing really any AP-1/Ap-2 and a unit that can heroically intervene and chew up 8 ork boyz in combat is a pretty big pain in the ass especially if the front line of your list has Retributors with 12" range heavy flamers who are already going to put a dent in overwatch.

It never fails that people are perfectly happy to gauge a unit's overall usefulness solely on its performance in this exact meta moment, despite there being a pretty solid monthly rotation in what exactly is the style of list to beat.

I'd also strongly encourage folks to do a little math and see exactly how vulnerable to firepower this thing is. Why, it only takes the combined firepower from...let's see...six leman russ punishers double tapping into it to get through its 18 wounds in one turn!

That kind of firepower attacking Ork Boyz would only kill 466 points of them!


I would argue that it's worse against Orkz than marines because orkz can kill it with less resource investment. Ork pistols will grind through it fairly quickly.

The things not worried about dying to lascannons, it's worried about soaking up every 'well, I've got nothing better to shoot at...' gun on the table. Especially considering that its chart is brutal.


Yeah, if your opponent can manage to get...let's see...

477 slugga boyz within 12", they'll tear through the Triumph like nothing!

If you run the Triumph alongside pretty much any of the more expensive sororitas units like Retributors or Seraphim, the Triumph is a less efficient target than those units for anti-infantry weaponry of basically every profile. I HOPE my opponent throws sluggas, choppa attacks, random heavy bolters, etc the direction of the Triumph - they're demonstrably less effective at attacking it than most every other unit I can field unless, again, I'm bringing a big Valorous Heart bodyspam list with tons of sisters.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/04 23:42:23


Post by: Grundz


Hoc Est Bellum wrote:


However, Vessel does stack with the Sacred Rose Warlord Trait, so you can throw a crappy dice into a 2+ to hit roll or something and get two Miracle Dice out of the other end. I'm not sure that's the best use of CPs though.


You're right, Its probably not a great use of CP outside of the first turn when you just need more dice to start your recycling train going, the trick seems to be having 1-2 dialogus around, any 1/2's you recycle through your warlord as fast as you can for any reason, 3's are useful, 4's can become automatic overwatch hits, 5/6's are for your damage rolls.

If you aren't going to just blow constant dice through your warlord to recycle them as armor saves, advances, hits, ect. you are going to need some more mechanics to discard them, I think I prefer churning 2-3 dice through the warlord a turn, once the lines meet your warlord could do silly things like sub in two 1's for charge roll just to recycle them.

by turn 3 you should be able to move and shoot heavy weapons and such at will just because you have so many dice stored up that anything you want to happen, does.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 00:02:17


Post by: Lemondish


the_scotsman wrote:


Yeah, if your opponent can manage to get...let's see...

477 slugga boyz within 12", they'll tear through the Triumph like nothing!

If you run the Triumph alongside pretty much any of the more expensive sororitas units like Retributors or Seraphim, the Triumph is a less efficient target than those units for anti-infantry weaponry of basically every profile. I HOPE my opponent throws sluggas, choppa attacks, random heavy bolters, etc the direction of the Triumph - they're demonstrably less effective at attacking it than most every other unit I can field unless, again, I'm bringing a big Valorous Heart bodyspam list with tons of sisters.


Thanks for showing this with actual math. It's surprisingly more durable than I thought. Exalted.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 00:27:16


Post by: Waaaghpower


Lemondish wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:


Yeah, if your opponent can manage to get...let's see...

477 slugga boyz within 12", they'll tear through the Triumph like nothing!

If you run the Triumph alongside pretty much any of the more expensive sororitas units like Retributors or Seraphim, the Triumph is a less efficient target than those units for anti-infantry weaponry of basically every profile. I HOPE my opponent throws sluggas, choppa attacks, random heavy bolters, etc the direction of the Triumph - they're demonstrably less effective at attacking it than most every other unit I can field unless, again, I'm bringing a big Valorous Heart bodyspam list with tons of sisters.


Thanks for showing this with actual math. It's surprisingly more durable than I thought. Exalted.

That's a horribly unfair comparison. A unit that isn't designed for shooting, who is hit as much as possible by the -1 to hit, that only has its shooting and not its melee compared is not a good example.

The math is also incorrect. He seems to have forgotten that Orks get extra shots on an unmodified 6 to hit - By my calculations, it takes only 420 shoota attacks to kill the Triumph.

Here's a better comparison: Let's have 30 of those same Ork Boyz charge after they shoot, and let's give them an actual Klan. (Say, Deff Skullz, not even a particularly good Klan when trying to maximize dps.)

So, first the pistols attack. Taking into account Dakka Dakka Dakka and the free reroll to-hit and to-wound, you get 6 hits and 1.5 wounds.
Then, they charge. The sisters kill less than half an Ork with overwatch.
The Orks attack. 90 attacks gets 11 more failed saved.

So, those 30 ork boyz (costing 210 points) took a 180 point model down from full health to 1/3rd health in a single turn, with a suboptimal klan and no buffs. Stratagem or buff access easily turns this into a kill.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 00:51:59


Post by: Sim-Life


So back from my game. Won 9-6, I think it was a CA 2018 where the players roll off and move objectives 3".

I won't go into great detail cause I'm tired and cold but I'll give my initial impressions I guess. 1500pts, I went MSU with 3 squads of 5 with two storm bolters, 3 with 6 sisters and 3 storm bolters. 8 repentia with a mistress and Missionary in a rhino, two exorcists and 6 rets with 4 multimeltas in an Immolator, 3 imagifiers and a diologus. Not the most hardcore list but like I said, wanted it simple since I was basically working with just my brain and a page of notes about specific rules.

- First miracle dice of the game was a 6. Used it and rolled the other to put 10 damage on a telemon dread from my first exorcist. Second exorcist finished it.

-Speaking of my exorcists always rolled below average number of shot prior to the codex and continued to do so. Even with the reroll strat they consistantly rolled 5 shots.

- custodes telemon shot the rhino down to 4 wounds and some jetbikes finished it off. 4 repentia died getting out, a diologus charged the jetbikes to keep the remaining repentia from overwatch then the shield captain countered charged them and killed two before the remaining 4 got to swing. Even so those 2 repentia did a good chunk of damage before they went down between their own hits and the mortal wound strat. If I hadn't rolled so badly on the transport desrruction and the shield captain wasn't an ass I think they'd have stood a decent chance of wiping the jetbikes.

- I went with Divine Guidence as my sacred right and it really paid off with the weight of bolter shots forcing 2+'s to 3+s

- Blessed Bolts was great but felt like a waste on MSU units honestly. I probably would have taken SB Dominions had I full access to the rules but it worked out okay.

-Valerous Heart Canonesses are a pain to put down. Trajan Valoris went for slay the warlord in the late game. He got one hit through, his buddies tried to finish her off but I kept her up with Divine Intervention, Trajan used Moment Shackle to attack again, got 3 damage through, miracle'd a 6+++, passed one normally then used Moment of Grace to pass the third by increasing a 5 to a 6.

- I forgot totally about the rets cherubs but they still killed 2 storm shield custodes in the second turn.

- Stacking the AP rules was generally wasted as Custodes don't have a lot of AP -1/2 and their melee was all -3

- as others have noted MDs are thin on the ground at the start of the game when you want them, more numerous mid-game. I actually didn't use them much cause my list and opponent didn't lend itself to really making use of them. Once the dread was dead I didn't have much I needed to do big damage against.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 03:59:20


Post by: Crimson


Kyrinov's Icon of Chiros ability seems like a nice way to generate some extra Miracle Dice. It basically doubles your chances of gaining them from morale checks.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 04:10:11


Post by: Crazyterran


The earlier posts in this thread are making me really lean towards Argent Shroud foot list, as it seems kinda fun to have a bunch of battle sisters screaming across the field suddenly being up in peoples faces to melt them.

Don't really like Repentia, so I probably won't run any, but maybe will do the Mortifiers/Penitent engines, since I do like stompy robots. Though, those don't benefit from the army wide +1 to advance and charge, right? I haven't got a codex yet, just been gleaning what I can from the interwebs.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 04:17:26


Post by: MrMoustaffa


A.T. wrote:
Rynner wrote:
LEGENDS IS LIVE.
RIP Storm Bolter Superiors.
I guess everyone just remember to poke GW in their feedback as appropriate - that options should not be culled for models that exist in the new plastic kits, notably the canoness weapon swaps, seraphim pistols, and sticking a superiors head on a stormbolter model.


Kyrinov... probably not valid anywhere competitively but 22 extra points to get a choice of two moral dice when hunting for 1s. Plus an extra wound and actual contribution in the combat phase.

Good luck, I've been emailing GW for 3 years to allow IG to actually give their sergeants lasguns since we get 10 in the kit and they've yet to give it to us. And that's a simple option mentioned in every single fluff book written about them, an option included in the box, and an option even FW gave their regiments. An option that almost every codex gets (marines, sisters, admech, chaos, Tau, etc. All can take their regular gun on the sarge) If they won't do that, one of the most obvious changes that takes 0 effort on their part and has models for it, I'm not holding my breath on sisters getting stormbolters on their Sarge's back.

Then again, I sent them an email one time pointing out the new Scion box has a holstered hotshot lasgun modeled on the vox operator and flag bearer and they had no problem faqing that in out of the blue so all I figure is the rules team is preventing IG from taking lasguns on our Sarge's out of spite at this point.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 05:24:37


Post by: Lammia


 Crazyterran wrote:
The earlier posts in this thread are making me really lean towards Argent Shroud foot list, as it seems kinda fun to have a bunch of battle sisters screaming across the field suddenly being up in peoples faces to melt them.

Don't really like Repentia, so I probably won't run any, but maybe will do the Mortifiers/Penitent engines, since I do like stompy robots. Though, those don't benefit from the army wide +1 to advance and charge, right? I haven't got a codex yet, just been gleaning what I can from the interwebs.
They don't have the Sacred Rites ability, no.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 06:50:18


Post by: tneva82


Waaaghpower wrote:

So, those 30 ork boyz (costing 210 points) took a 180 point model down from full health to 1/3rd health in a single turn, with a suboptimal klan and no buffs. Stratagem or buff access easily turns this into a kill.


And how many pts of bss/retributors/etc they would kill with same unit?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 07:41:16


Post by: Waaaghpower


tneva82 wrote:
Waaaghpower wrote:

So, those 30 ork boyz (costing 210 points) took a 180 point model down from full health to 1/3rd health in a single turn, with a suboptimal klan and no buffs. Stratagem or buff access easily turns this into a kill.


And how many pts of bss/retributors/etc they would kill with same unit?

That's a very silly answer.
I was pointing out how completely ridiculous it was to use the shooting ability of an almost pure melee unit as your metric for durability. (I mean, seriously. Comparing the shootiness of Choppa boyz is the next best thing to comparing the shootiness of Khorne Daemons.) Actually breaking down unit-by-unit dps relative to their targets isn't particularly helpful unless you also break down how those units will be used, what their relative value is on the board, how vulnerable they'll be to assault, etc.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 07:59:17


Post by: tneva82


Waaaghpower wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
Waaaghpower wrote:

So, those 30 ork boyz (costing 210 points) took a 180 point model down from full health to 1/3rd health in a single turn, with a suboptimal klan and no buffs. Stratagem or buff access easily turns this into a kill.


And how many pts of bss/retributors/etc they would kill with same unit?

That's a very silly answer.
I was pointing out how completely ridiculous it was to use the shooting ability of an almost pure melee unit as your metric for durability. (I mean, seriously. Comparing the shootiness of Choppa boyz is the next best thing to comparing the shootiness of Khorne Daemons.) Actually breaking down unit-by-unit dps relative to their targets isn't particularly helpful unless you also break down how those units will be used, what their relative value is on the board, how vulnerable they'll be to assault, etc.


And I'm saying it's silly it is to say how vulnerable the model is if it is in fact as durable or even more durable per point than other options. It has 18W for 180W. 10 pts per wound. Same as retributor. Is retributor harder to get wound through than this one?

Much is complained about how fast this dies to heavy bolters etc. But so do regular sisters etc who cost just 1 pts less per wound but have no 4++ nor -1 to hit. So survivability wise that doesn't look that bad. Your regular sister units are losing more points for same shooting.

If you look at durability you need to compare to other things. Not just in vacuum.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 08:32:52


Post by: Lemondish


Waaaghpower wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:


Yeah, if your opponent can manage to get...let's see...

477 slugga boyz within 12", they'll tear through the Triumph like nothing!

If you run the Triumph alongside pretty much any of the more expensive sororitas units like Retributors or Seraphim, the Triumph is a less efficient target than those units for anti-infantry weaponry of basically every profile. I HOPE my opponent throws sluggas, choppa attacks, random heavy bolters, etc the direction of the Triumph - they're demonstrably less effective at attacking it than most every other unit I can field unless, again, I'm bringing a big Valorous Heart bodyspam list with tons of sisters.


Thanks for showing this with actual math. It's surprisingly more durable than I thought. Exalted.

That's a horribly unfair comparison. A unit that isn't designed for shooting, who is hit as much as possible by the -1 to hit, that only has its shooting and not its melee compared is not a good example.


It was the example the other poster used. I'll exalt anything that debunks nonsense hyperbolic suggestions that don't actually happen in games. Follow the conversation closer - the unit wasn't selected because it's an example to show durability, it was selected by a poster making a ridiculous claim.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 08:39:40


Post by: tneva82


What are people's favourite relics so far looking to be?

Mine are reroll miracle dice and the 2+/can't be wounded better than 4+. Maybe the upgraded blessed blade if facing plenty of W3 models though vs custodians lack of survivability boost is bit of a worry when they are rocking 3++ to reduce the damage output.

The 9" bubble could also be cool if I don't run 3 imagiers or maybe even with it.

Warlord trait wise not seeing much use unless I want to build blender canoness. Other than that the extra MD is no brainer.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 08:40:58


Post by: Lemondish


 Sim-Life wrote:


-Valerous Heart Canonesses are a pain to put down. Trajan Valoris went for slay the warlord in the late game. He got one hit through, his buddies tried to finish her off but I kept her up with Divine Intervention, Trajan used Moment Shackle to attack again, got 3 damage through, miracle'd a 6+++, passed one normally then used Moment of Grace to pass the third by increasing a 5 to a 6.


Great breakdown, but I sadly do not think you can miracle wound shrug :(


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 11:35:57


Post by: frgsinwntr


Lemondish wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:


-Valerous Heart Canonesses are a pain to put down. Trajan Valoris went for slay the warlord in the late game. He got one hit through, his buddies tried to finish her off but I kept her up with Divine Intervention, Trajan used Moment Shackle to attack again, got 3 damage through, miracle'd a 6+++, passed one normally then used Moment of Grace to pass the third by increasing a 5 to a 6.


Great breakdown, but I sadly do not think you can miracle wound shrug :(


Yea... i don't think you can use MD on FNPs... or the strat on the FNPs for that matter


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 13:01:25


Post by: the_scotsman


Waaaghpower wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:


Yeah, if your opponent can manage to get...let's see...

477 slugga boyz within 12", they'll tear through the Triumph like nothing!

If you run the Triumph alongside pretty much any of the more expensive sororitas units like Retributors or Seraphim, the Triumph is a less efficient target than those units for anti-infantry weaponry of basically every profile. I HOPE my opponent throws sluggas, choppa attacks, random heavy bolters, etc the direction of the Triumph - they're demonstrably less effective at attacking it than most every other unit I can field unless, again, I'm bringing a big Valorous Heart bodyspam list with tons of sisters.


Thanks for showing this with actual math. It's surprisingly more durable than I thought. Exalted.

That's a horribly unfair comparison. A unit that isn't designed for shooting, who is hit as much as possible by the -1 to hit, that only has its shooting and not its melee compared is not a good example.

The math is also incorrect. He seems to have forgotten that Orks get extra shots on an unmodified 6 to hit - By my calculations, it takes only 420 shoota attacks to kill the Triumph.

Here's a better comparison: Let's have 30 of those same Ork Boyz charge after they shoot, and let's give them an actual Klan. (Say, Deff Skullz, not even a particularly good Klan when trying to maximize dps.)

So, first the pistols attack. Taking into account Dakka Dakka Dakka and the free reroll to-hit and to-wound, you get 6 hits and 1.5 wounds.
Then, they charge. The sisters kill less than half an Ork with overwatch.
The Orks attack. 90 attacks gets 11 more failed saved.

So, those 30 ork boyz (costing 210 points) took a 180 point model down from full health to 1/3rd health in a single turn, with a suboptimal klan and no buffs. Stratagem or buff access easily turns this into a kill.


So first off, two things. 1, I was specifically responding to a poster claiming that they were worried "ork pistols would tear through that thing". I'm sorry in my jokey reply I did not take DDD into account, but to be fair, in yours you forgot 30 ork boyz make 120 attacks, not 90, so Let He Without Mathhammer Sin Cast the First Stone.

You know what other 180-ish point characters 30 ork boyz getting their full shooting and melee off on kill? Like, most of them, man. Hive Tyrant takes 11/12 wounds with average rolls and almost always costs over 200. Great Unclean one takes 14/18 wounds, and he costs like 275. Ork boyz over the 20 model mark are one of the most efficient units at murdering things in melee in the entire game if you suppose they just appear there and they all get to make their attacks. You have to get to T5+ 2+sv 7+ wounds to survive 30 orks.

The way to avoid that happening would be to put something, anything in front of the triumph to screen it. Heavy Flamer Retributors maybe? An Immolator? Basic "playing a real game of warhammer 40,000" stuff.

This is why I hate internet tactics discussion sometimes.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
tneva82 wrote:
What are people's favourite relics so far looking to be?

Mine are reroll miracle dice and the 2+/can't be wounded better than 4+. Maybe the upgraded blessed blade if facing plenty of W3 models though vs custodians lack of survivability boost is bit of a worry when they are rocking 3++ to reduce the damage output.

The 9" bubble could also be cool if I don't run 3 imagiers or maybe even with it.

Warlord trait wise not seeing much use unless I want to build blender canoness. Other than that the extra MD is no brainer.


I think the Iron Suplice of St. Istaela is not only great, but also sounds like the finishing move for a pro wrestler which makes it extra fantastic. Litany+Beacon is going to be the standard for el cheapo canoness, Iron Suplice+chainsword for the canoness who is still very cheap but also can tank certain big units unexpectedly, and Blade of Admonition+Brazier+Righteous Rage for smash canoness.

The only order-specific stuff I'd consider is bloody rose for an alternate melee canoness build. 8 S4 AP-3 D2 melee attacks that reroll to wound and she's still only 45pts, that's a pretty spicy meatball.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 14:15:31


Post by: Unit1126PLL


I kind of want to fit Kyrinov into my Argent Shroud list, fishing for 1s on Morale. I am even tempted to give him the +3" relic.

As for Legends/Storm Bolters, I'm not planning to rebase my metal Sisters, so cutting Storm Bolters off of them to make them more legal for tournament play seems naff. I plan to keep them, and my Canoness's Combi-Melta.

That said, the second army I am building (out of the plastic girls) is going to be Bloody Rose, I think. Any thoughts on Seraphim? I know the math on Bloody Rose Repentia is pretty cool (which makes me want to get a rhino to carry 8 + Imagifier+repentia superior), but Zephyrim seem like a super cool unit and I've already converted some from my Gemini and the Seraphim in the box.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 14:43:33


Post by: Grundz


the_scotsman wrote:


The only order-specific stuff I'd consider is bloody rose for an alternate melee canoness build. 8 S4 AP-3 D2 melee attacks that reroll to wound and she's still only 45pts, that's a pretty spicy meatball.


The casket, relic brazier and relic inferno pistol are all pretty good but are only coincidental if you are already on that order


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 14:45:17


Post by: Unit1126PLL


 Grundz wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:


The only order-specific stuff I'd consider is bloody rose for an alternate melee canoness build. 8 S4 AP-3 D2 melee attacks that reroll to wound and she's still only 45pts, that's a pretty spicy meatball.


The casket, relic brazier and relic inferno pistol are all pretty good but are only coincidental if you are already on that order


The only Order relic I'm super envious of as Argent Shroud is the Inferno Pistol, but that's mostly because I like having loads of melta, not because it's super meaningful (though it is, as you mentioned, good).


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 14:55:24


Post by: Grundz


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:


The only order-specific stuff I'd consider is bloody rose for an alternate melee canoness build. 8 S4 AP-3 D2 melee attacks that reroll to wound and she's still only 45pts, that's a pretty spicy meatball.


The casket, relic brazier and relic inferno pistol are all pretty good but are only coincidental if you are already on that order


The only Order relic I'm super envious of as Argent Shroud is the Inferno Pistol, but that's mostly because I like having loads of melta, not because it's super meaningful (though it is, as you mentioned, good).


Ive been talking about a dice-churn list and the relic brazier being able to reload and fire every turn for a couple mortal wounds at the cost of one dice you don't care about seems pretty okay
I don't see a list that doesn't have one aura/command rod canoness with probably the relic bolt pistol and two melee canonesses happening though, they are just stellar for 45 points and a pretty good anchor for counter charging especially in groups


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 14:59:07


Post by: Unit1126PLL


 Grundz wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:


The only order-specific stuff I'd consider is bloody rose for an alternate melee canoness build. 8 S4 AP-3 D2 melee attacks that reroll to wound and she's still only 45pts, that's a pretty spicy meatball.


The casket, relic brazier and relic inferno pistol are all pretty good but are only coincidental if you are already on that order


The only Order relic I'm super envious of as Argent Shroud is the Inferno Pistol, but that's mostly because I like having loads of melta, not because it's super meaningful (though it is, as you mentioned, good).


Ive been talking about a dice-churn list and the relic brazier being able to reload and fire every turn for a couple mortal wounds at the cost of one dice you don't care about seems pretty okay
I don't see a list that doesn't have one aura/command rod canoness with probably the relic bolt pistol and two melee canonesses happening though, they are just stellar for 45 points and a pretty good anchor for counter charging especially in groups


I have all 3 melee canonesses and no Rod. The Rod doesn't actually do much for you, because it only works on her RR1s ability, and if you have 3 then you have pretty excellent coverage. I've even been considering dropping the +3" range book and the Warlord Trait for the 5++, because the extra +1 invuln hasn't hardly come up in the games I've played; they've been such whirlwinds with Argent Shroud that it doesn't look like it's needed. Probably would be great with Celestine for a 4++ though.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 15:02:39


Post by: Grundz


 Unit1126PLL wrote:

I have all 3 melee canonesses and no Rod. The Rod doesn't actually do much for you, because it only works on her RR1s ability, and if you have 3 then you have pretty excellent coverage. I've even been considering dropping the +3" range book and the Warlord Trait for the 5++, because the extra +1 invuln hasn't hardly come up in the games I've played; they've been such whirlwinds with Argent Shroud that it doesn't look like it's needed. Probably would be great with Celestine for a 4++ though.


ah I haven't fine tooth combed the book yet, been busy with painting the models, I didn't realise that the rod didn't effect her warlord trait

in that case then thats a tough sell to take the bolt pistol relic for a "hang back" canoness when you can just put the warlord trait on a imagifier whom will be surrounded by bodyguards anyway


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also don't discount the casket, it brings T8 gargets down to 3+ / (2+ bloody rose) to wound territory for repentia


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 15:33:39


Post by: tneva82


One thing i'm enjoying about sisters is internal balance seems to be surprisingly good. No glaringly bad units like nob bikers and killa kans for orks. I can see myself using bigger % of units than with orks. Particularly good with small number of units we have


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 15:48:44


Post by: the_scotsman


tneva82 wrote:
One thing i'm enjoying about sisters is internal balance seems to be surprisingly good. No glaringly bad units like nob bikers and killa kans for orks. I can see myself using bigger % of units than with orks. Particularly good with small number of units we have


Personally, I think there's a tiny bit of an ogryn/bullgryn situation going on with Mortifiers and Penitents - basically, Morties get a whole host of fancy pantsy special powers for a very cheap price and they just so happen to be the one nobody already has in their model collection... Penitents don't seem awful, but a tiny number of points to give one of them a 3+ save, give them WS3+ (ok, zealot makes that not matter too much) and get the snazzy heavy bolter/pistol ability seems pretty cheap.

Dominions also don't seem super great, I think the big reason to go for them a unit with 4x storm bolters to use the blessed bolts strat. They seem alright in ardent shroud. Most of the time though I'd reach for retributors or celestians.

Zephyrim are alright, drop a squad of 5 with a banner in any melee-oriented sisters list and I think you're pretty much set. No real reason to want more of them than that, they're a charge aura and a reroll 1s to wound aura you can plop down onto the board.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 16:19:19


Post by: Frowbakk


I find myself liking Argent Shroud for the one reason i keep hearing on every competitive podcast:

"Games are won in the Movement phase."

Along with Hand of the Emperor, Infantry moving 8" ~ 13" per turn AND still firing has some definite advantages.



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 16:55:40


Post by: tneva82


the_scotsman wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
One thing i'm enjoying about sisters is internal balance seems to be surprisingly good. No glaringly bad units like nob bikers and killa kans for orks. I can see myself using bigger % of units than with orks. Particularly good with small number of units we have


Personally, I think there's a tiny bit of an ogryn/bullgryn situation going on with Mortifiers and Penitents - basically, Morties get a whole host of fancy pantsy special powers for a very cheap price and they just so happen to be the one nobody already has in their model collection... Penitents don't seem awful, but a tiny number of points to give one of them a 3+ save, give them WS3+ (ok, zealot makes that not matter too much) and get the snazzy heavy bolter/pistol ability seems pretty cheap.

Dominions also don't seem super great, I think the big reason to go for them a unit with 4x storm bolters to use the blessed bolts strat. They seem alright in ardent shroud. Most of the time though I'd reach for retributors or celestians.

Zephyrim are alright, drop a squad of 5 with a banner in any melee-oriented sisters list and I think you're pretty much set. No real reason to want more of them than that, they're a charge aura and a reroll 1s to wound aura you can plop down onto the board.


Oh it's not perfect but even penintent engines are nowhere near killa kan level. And more accuracy is nice. Penitent 75% hits, morti's 66%。

Dominions also do have use thanks to stratagem. 4 sb with -2 dam2 isn't total junk with marine meta.

Zephryms don't seem that bad for punching. Sure s3 but with rerolls better than s4.

And even here it's not junk level like killa kans, necron arachid something(flying guys with melta weapon), pre ca19 praetorians, squigbuggy or heaven forbid stompa. And our terrain at least benefits us. Ork one is so bad opponent might give orks some points and free terrain as long as ork agrees to use it :lol:


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Frowbakk wrote:
I find myself liking Argent Shroud for the one reason i keep hearing on every competitive podcast:

"Games are won in the Movement phase."

Along with Hand of the Emperor, Infantry moving 8" ~ 13" per turn AND still firing has some definite advantages.



Yep. Argent shroud is imo definitely top2 order for competive builds. It's bit different style of mobility as my speedy necron dynasty(which goes faster but is hurt more by advance so uses advance less but when does goes faster and ignores terrain like fly) and i have learned to love that speed.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2018/12/05 18:33:07


Post by: Niiru


So I'm considering a detachment of Sisters (possibly a whole army), and I had a question. If I was to make an army based around lots of flamers and meltas (which sisters seems a good fit for) is there a recomended Order for it? Ebon Chalice seems like a decent choice, with a related stratagem and the ability to make a miracle dice into a 6 (6 for melta damage when needed?)



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 18:47:15


Post by: Mavnas


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:


The only order-specific stuff I'd consider is bloody rose for an alternate melee canoness build. 8 S4 AP-3 D2 melee attacks that reroll to wound and she's still only 45pts, that's a pretty spicy meatball.


The casket, relic brazier and relic inferno pistol are all pretty good but are only coincidental if you are already on that order


The only Order relic I'm super envious of as Argent Shroud is the Inferno Pistol, but that's mostly because I like having loads of melta, not because it's super meaningful (though it is, as you mentioned, good).


Ive been talking about a dice-churn list and the relic brazier being able to reload and fire every turn for a couple mortal wounds at the cost of one dice you don't care about seems pretty okay
I don't see a list that doesn't have one aura/command rod canoness with probably the relic bolt pistol and two melee canonesses happening though, they are just stellar for 45 points and a pretty good anchor for counter charging especially in groups


I have all 3 melee canonesses and no Rod. The Rod doesn't actually do much for you, because it only works on her RR1s ability, and if you have 3 then you have pretty excellent coverage. I've even been considering dropping the +3" range book and the Warlord Trait for the 5++, because the extra +1 invuln hasn't hardly come up in the games I've played; they've been such whirlwinds with Argent Shroud that it doesn't look like it's needed. Probably would be great with Celestine for a 4++ though.


Do the book and Rod not work for the +1 invuln WL trao
It?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 20:03:17


Post by: ERJAK


Mavnas wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 Grundz wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:


The only order-specific stuff I'd consider is bloody rose for an alternate melee canoness build. 8 S4 AP-3 D2 melee attacks that reroll to wound and she's still only 45pts, that's a pretty spicy meatball.


The casket, relic brazier and relic inferno pistol are all pretty good but are only coincidental if you are already on that order


The only Order relic I'm super envious of as Argent Shroud is the Inferno Pistol, but that's mostly because I like having loads of melta, not because it's super meaningful (though it is, as you mentioned, good).


Ive been talking about a dice-churn list and the relic brazier being able to reload and fire every turn for a couple mortal wounds at the cost of one dice you don't care about seems pretty okay
I don't see a list that doesn't have one aura/command rod canoness with probably the relic bolt pistol and two melee canonesses happening though, they are just stellar for 45 points and a pretty good anchor for counter charging especially in groups


I have all 3 melee canonesses and no Rod. The Rod doesn't actually do much for you, because it only works on her RR1s ability, and if you have 3 then you have pretty excellent coverage. I've even been considering dropping the +3" range book and the Warlord Trait for the 5++, because the extra +1 invuln hasn't hardly come up in the games I've played; they've been such whirlwinds with Argent Shroud that it doesn't look like it's needed. Probably would be great with Celestine for a 4++ though.


Do the book and Rod not work for the +1 invuln WL trao
It?


Book does, Rod doesn't.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Niiru wrote:
So I'm considering a detachment of Sisters (possibly a whole army), and I had a question. If I was to make an army based around lots of flamers and meltas (which sisters seems a good fit for) is there a recomended Order for it? Ebon Chalice seems like a decent choice, with a related stratagem and the ability to make a miracle dice into a 6 (6 for melta damage when needed?)



The whole army is built around meltas. Putting meltas on stuff is a stock standard aspect of Sisters and works in basically any conviction.

It comes down to what type of meltas you want. Inferno Pistols? Bloody rose or Argent Shroud. Regular Melta squads? Argent shroud or Valorous Heart. Multimeltas? Valorous Heart or Argent Shroud. Even then, they work fine in SR, EC, and OoML.

Flamers are a little different because you're constantly fighting against how badly flamers suck. For hand flamers, basically ONLY bloody rose. For standard flamers...take stormbolters and pretend they were flamers. For Heavy flamers, Argent Shroud will get you the best chance to actually use them, but the Ebon Chalice strat is incredibly good.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
the_scotsman wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
One thing i'm enjoying about sisters is internal balance seems to be surprisingly good. No glaringly bad units like nob bikers and killa kans for orks. I can see myself using bigger % of units than with orks. Particularly good with small number of units we have


Personally, I think there's a tiny bit of an ogryn/bullgryn situation going on with Mortifiers and Penitents - basically, Morties get a whole host of fancy pantsy special powers for a very cheap price and they just so happen to be the one nobody already has in their model collection... Penitents don't seem awful, but a tiny number of points to give one of them a 3+ save, give them WS3+ (ok, zealot makes that not matter too much) and get the snazzy heavy bolter/pistol ability seems pretty cheap.

Dominions also don't seem super great, I think the big reason to go for them a unit with 4x storm bolters to use the blessed bolts strat. They seem alright in ardent shroud. Most of the time though I'd reach for retributors or celestians.

Zephyrim are alright, drop a squad of 5 with a banner in any melee-oriented sisters list and I think you're pretty much set. No real reason to want more of them than that, they're a charge aura and a reroll 1s to wound aura you can plop down onto the board.


Disagree about Zephyrim, under bloody rose they're killy as F*** in practice. I take 10 and don't bother with the banner or reroll 1s to wound.

I usually ignore the buffs because only 2 other units in the army really care: repentia, who have much easier access to the same buffs with their superior, and Mortifiers who take care of business just fine on their own honestly.

Remember, these are a melee unit that with 1cp will kill 2 full squads of intercessors, 2 primaris librarians, a smash captain, 4ish aggressors or 5+ assault centurions, while being able to GUARANTEE a successful charge, even outside of 11" flamer overwatch with a bit of luck.

And if they're in range to get the reroll charge/reroll 1s to wound aura, they're likely ALSO in range of +1S reroll 1s to hit at which point they'll decimate anything less than T8 that doesn't have a super high invul. Imagine dropping down and wrapping up a wave serpent with a 12" charge+pile-in and using our fancy new 32mm base to deny disembarking after their 31 Ap-4 attacks pop it like a balloon, Or just pull a Hemlock Wraithfighter out of the sky. Get a missionary in there for the luls if you so desire as well.

Basically anything with a good armor save and no/bad invul has to be terrified of Zephyrim...provided they can survive the overwatch.

Also about the penitents, don't forget that their 5+ invul makes them much more survivable than mortis, even account for the 3+ save leader and their 6+FNP.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
I kind of want to fit Kyrinov into my Argent Shroud list, fishing for 1s on Morale. I am even tempted to give him the +3" relic.

As for Legends/Storm Bolters, I'm not planning to rebase my metal Sisters, so cutting Storm Bolters off of them to make them more legal for tournament play seems naff. I plan to keep them, and my Canoness's Combi-Melta.

That said, the second army I am building (out of the plastic girls) is going to be Bloody Rose, I think. Any thoughts on Seraphim? I know the math on Bloody Rose Repentia is pretty cool (which makes me want to get a rhino to carry 8 + Imagifier+repentia superior), but Zephyrim seem like a super cool unit and I've already converted some from my Gemini and the Seraphim in the box.


Zephyrim are a fantastic scalpel unit that see massive ROI on miracle dice and Bloody rose Seraphim are the nastiest deepstrike surprise you could possibly buy for 83-88pts.

Zephyrim are hilarious against flyer lists, especially with decent LoS terrain. A unit of 10 will kill a Hemlocke/CHE most of the time. Bonus points for the Hemlocke likely being close enough to give the Zephyrim +1 S Reroll 1s, +1 Attack, at which point they'd kill TWO.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 21:03:41


Post by: Togusa


Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 21:18:38


Post by: Lammia


 Togusa wrote:
Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?
Several reasons, but the newness of the Codex and the fact that a lot of our army has the same basic profile and weapon options make such a list have little meaning.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?
Can't have the Rod and Plasma Pistol.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 21:35:22


Post by: Togusa


Lammia wrote:
 Togusa wrote:
Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?
Several reasons, but the newness of the Codex and the fact that a lot of our army has the same basic profile and weapon options make such a list have little meaning.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?
Cant have the Rod and Plasma Pistol.


The Canoness data sheet says they can take one thing from the pistol list to replace their bolt pistol. I don't see the problem.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 21:44:08


Post by: Lammia


They can't replace their Bolt Pistol after they've already replaced their Bolt Pistol and Chainsword to take the Rod though


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 22:05:31


Post by: tneva82


 Togusa wrote:
Lammia wrote:
 Togusa wrote:
Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?
Several reasons, but the newness of the Codex and the fact that a lot of our army has the same basic profile and weapon options make such a list have little meaning.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?
Cant have the Rod and Plasma Pistol.


The Canoness data sheet says they can take one thing from the pistol list to replace their bolt pistol. I don't see the problem.


If you do that you don't have bolt pistol and chainsword to replace to boltgun and power sword which is required to get rod. And if you do that you don't have bolt pistol to replace to plasma pistol


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 22:08:02


Post by: Rihgu


 Togusa wrote:
Lammia wrote:
 Togusa wrote:
Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?
Several reasons, but the newness of the Codex and the fact that a lot of our army has the same basic profile and weapon options make such a list have little meaning.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?
Cant have the Rod and Plasma Pistol.


The Canoness data sheet says they can take one thing from the pistol list to replace their bolt pistol. I don't see the problem.


Only a Canoness equipped with 1 boltgun and 1 power sword can take a Rod of Office.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 22:23:51


Post by: JNAProductions


How do you get 4ish Agrressor kills, but 5 Centurion kills?

Centurions have better armor and more wounds at the same toughness.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/05 23:08:18


Post by: MrMoustaffa


 Togusa wrote:
Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?

I always felt unit rankings were kind of pointless. Especially now a days with <chapter traits>, formations, allies interaction, and countless other little things, a unit can vary wildly in effectiveness just based on how it's run. You'll notice most of the tactics threads that have one is almost always woefully out of date within months, and that's if a group can agree on it. They're really just more trouble than they're worth in my opinion.

For example, take the battlesisters squad, depending on order it's either ignoring Ap2 and less, advancing and shooting with no penalties, or doubling it's attacks in melee. How do you rank that? Also, how do you rank it as it's the only troop choice you have? It could be absolutely garbage but if you want to run sisters you don't have much of a choice do you? Or maybe you do, if you consider allies a solution. Simply put theyre gonna be great for some lists, not as much for others. There's nothing wrong with discussing strengths and weaknesses of a unit, but most of time I feel people fall into this trap of "internet says unit X is good, so I'll run that" without understanding why it's being run or what purpose it serves. You can see that when a tournament winning list gets posted and inevitably someone posts "well that units trash, I can't believe he won using that." Alternatively, you can often spot a new player because they just copied a winning list from a tourney or spam a unit beloved to be powerful, and yet they lose because they don't get *why* it was being used.

But maybe that's a discussion for another time.

As for sisters specifically, I'm pleasantly surprised with the internal balance of the units. There are very few units I looked at that were blatantly superior to the alternative, and the one case that I immediately noticed (mortifiers vs penitent engines) a quick reread showed the penitent engines do have some interesting trade offs like a better FNP and zealot. I'm sure there are a couple of duds aside from the weird little units like Arco flagellants, but the main sisters units seem solid all around for the most part. I feel you could make a favorite unit work pretty well if you built with it in mind.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2120/07/05 23:38:27


Post by: BrianDavion


 Frowbakk wrote:
I find myself liking Argent Shroud for the one reason i keep hearing on every competitive podcast:

"Games are won in the Movement phase."

Along with Hand of the Emperor, Infantry moving 8" ~ 13" per turn AND still firing has some definite advantages.



yeah, argent shroud IMHO are basicly what the black legion trait should be.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 01:09:47


Post by: ERJAK


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
 Togusa wrote:
Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?

I always felt unit rankings were kind of pointless. Especially now a days with <chapter traits>, formations, allies interaction, and countless other little things, a unit can vary wildly in effectiveness just based on how it's run. You'll notice most of the tactics threads that have one is almost always woefully out of date within months, and that's if a group can agree on it. They're really just more trouble than they're worth in my opinion.

For example, take the battlesisters squad, depending on order it's either ignoring Ap2 and less, advancing and shooting with no penalties, or doubling it's attacks in melee. How do you rank that? Also, how do you rank it as it's the only troop choice you have? It could be absolutely garbage but if you want to run sisters you don't have much of a choice do you? Or maybe you do, if you consider allies a solution. Simply put theyre gonna be great for some lists, not as much for others. There's nothing wrong with discussing strengths and weaknesses of a unit, but most of time I feel people fall into this trap of "internet says unit X is good, so I'll run that" without understanding why it's being run or what purpose it serves. You can see that when a tournament winning list gets posted and inevitably someone posts "well that units trash, I can't believe he won using that." Alternatively, you can often spot a new player because they just copied a winning list from a tourney or spam a unit beloved to be powerful, and yet they lose because they don't get *why* it was being used.

But maybe that's a discussion for another time.

As for sisters specifically, I'm pleasantly surprised with the internal balance of the units. There are very few units I looked at that were blatantly superior to the alternative, and the one case that I immediately noticed (mortifiers vs penitent engines) a quick reread showed the penitent engines do have some interesting trade offs like a better FNP and zealot. I'm sure there are a couple of duds aside from the weird little units like Arco flagellants, but the main sisters units seem solid all around for the most part. I feel you could make a favorite unit work pretty well if you built with it in mind.



Arcos actually are also pretty great with their massive number of attacks and cheap bodies.

Honestly, the only things in the book that are 'bad' are crusaders, DCA, and Immolators. Crusaders and DCA because of their unit sizes and just being worse arcos and Immolators thanks to the nerfs to dominions and some really baffling nerfs to the tank itself.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 01:09:59


Post by: rbstr


 JNAProductions wrote:
How do you get 4ish Agrressor kills, but 5 Centurion kills?

Centurions have better armor and more wounds at the same toughness.


Probably damage/wound rollover?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 01:12:12


Post by: ERJAK


 JNAProductions wrote:
How do you get 4ish Agrressor kills, but 5 Centurion kills?

Centurions have better armor and more wounds at the same toughness.


Don't aggressors have 3 and Centurions have 2? I may have screwed that up.

Point is, Zephyrim are cool.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 01:17:56


Post by: JNAProductions


Centurions have 4.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 02:07:26


Post by: Lammia


ERJAK wrote:
Spoiler:
 MrMoustaffa wrote:
 Togusa wrote:
Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?

I always felt unit rankings were kind of pointless. Especially now a days with <chapter traits>, formations, allies interaction, and countless other little things, a unit can vary wildly in effectiveness just based on how it's run. You'll notice most of the tactics threads that have one is almost always woefully out of date within months, and that's if a group can agree on it. They're really just more trouble than they're worth in my opinion.

For example, take the battlesisters squad, depending on order it's either ignoring Ap2 and less, advancing and shooting with no penalties, or doubling it's attacks in melee. How do you rank that? Also, how do you rank it as it's the only troop choice you have? It could be absolutely garbage but if you want to run sisters you don't have much of a choice do you? Or maybe you do, if you consider allies a solution. Simply put theyre gonna be great for some lists, not as much for others. There's nothing wrong with discussing strengths and weaknesses of a unit, but most of time I feel people fall into this trap of "internet says unit X is good, so I'll run that" without understanding why it's being run or what purpose it serves. You can see that when a tournament winning list gets posted and inevitably someone posts "well that units trash, I can't believe he won using that." Alternatively, you can often spot a new player because they just copied a winning list from a tourney or spam a unit beloved to be powerful, and yet they lose because they don't get *why* it was being used.

But maybe that's a discussion for another time.

As for sisters specifically, I'm pleasantly surprised with the internal balance of the units. There are very few units I looked at that were blatantly superior to the alternative, and the one case that I immediately noticed (mortifiers vs penitent engines) a quick reread showed the penitent engines do have some interesting trade offs like a better FNP and zealot. I'm sure there are a couple of duds aside from the weird little units like Arco flagellants, but the main sisters units seem solid all around for the most part. I feel you could make a favorite unit work pretty well if you built with it in mind.


Arcos actually are also pretty great with their massive number of attacks and cheap bodies.

Honestly, the only things in the book that are 'bad' are crusaders, DCA, and Immolators. Crusaders and DCA because of their unit sizes and just being worse arcos and Immolators thanks to the nerfs to dominions and some really baffling nerfs to the tank itself.
Lammia's hot take: Immolators are definitely overpriced for what they do, but not actually outrageously so. Plus, they're only competing with the Repressor, so there's not a whole lot of options...


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 02:39:38


Post by: Tel11


Can Dominions fire blessed bolts out of Repressors?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 03:00:59


Post by: JNAProductions


Tel11 wrote:
Can Dominions fire blessed bolts out of Repressors?
Unless you can target them with the strat when they’re not on the battlefield, no, you cannot.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 03:07:49


Post by: Tel11


 JNAProductions wrote:
Tel11 wrote:
Can Dominions fire blessed bolts out of Repressors?
Unless you can target them with the strat when they’re not on the battlefield, no, you cannot.


Ah, thank you. Takes that off the list for me.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 8000/12/04 01:19:35


Post by: BrianDavion


Lammia wrote:
ERJAK wrote:
Spoiler:
 MrMoustaffa wrote:
 Togusa wrote:
Why doesn't this tactica have all the units ranked like all the other tactica threads? Or is that rank in another thread?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Drider wrote:
Anyone else notice that the canoness in the box has an illegal load out according to the sheet in the codex?


How so? I don't see what's wrong with her loadout?

I always felt unit rankings were kind of pointless. Especially now a days with <chapter traits>, formations, allies interaction, and countless other little things, a unit can vary wildly in effectiveness just based on how it's run. You'll notice most of the tactics threads that have one is almost always woefully out of date within months, and that's if a group can agree on it. They're really just more trouble than they're worth in my opinion.

For example, take the battlesisters squad, depending on order it's either ignoring Ap2 and less, advancing and shooting with no penalties, or doubling it's attacks in melee. How do you rank that? Also, how do you rank it as it's the only troop choice you have? It could be absolutely garbage but if you want to run sisters you don't have much of a choice do you? Or maybe you do, if you consider allies a solution. Simply put theyre gonna be great for some lists, not as much for others. There's nothing wrong with discussing strengths and weaknesses of a unit, but most of time I feel people fall into this trap of "internet says unit X is good, so I'll run that" without understanding why it's being run or what purpose it serves. You can see that when a tournament winning list gets posted and inevitably someone posts "well that units trash, I can't believe he won using that." Alternatively, you can often spot a new player because they just copied a winning list from a tourney or spam a unit beloved to be powerful, and yet they lose because they don't get *why* it was being used.

But maybe that's a discussion for another time.

As for sisters specifically, I'm pleasantly surprised with the internal balance of the units. There are very few units I looked at that were blatantly superior to the alternative, and the one case that I immediately noticed (mortifiers vs penitent engines) a quick reread showed the penitent engines do have some interesting trade offs like a better FNP and zealot. I'm sure there are a couple of duds aside from the weird little units like Arco flagellants, but the main sisters units seem solid all around for the most part. I feel you could make a favorite unit work pretty well if you built with it in mind.


Arcos actually are also pretty great with their massive number of attacks and cheap bodies.

Honestly, the only things in the book that are 'bad' are crusaders, DCA, and Immolators. Crusaders and DCA because of their unit sizes and just being worse arcos and Immolators thanks to the nerfs to dominions and some really baffling nerfs to the tank itself.
Lammia's hot take: Immolators are definitely overpriced for what they do, but not actually outrageously so. Plus, they're only competing with the Repressor, so there's not a whole lot of options...


and the repressor is an OOP FW mini so for a lotta people it might as well not exist


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 04:57:45


Post by: Lammia


I mean, that's a big thing.

I was mostly thinking of the fact that Unless you're doing the Melta-box or Heavy Flamer box, the Immolator has the advantage of Sacred Rites and Acts of Faith to do its job, though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As well as a potentially useful specific Stratagem


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 06:37:45


Post by: BrianDavion


.. thats right, unless the repressor is updated technicly it doesn't get that. although things like that should obviously be assumed for friendly games.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 13:48:56


Post by: Lemondish


BrianDavion wrote:
.. thats right, unless the repressor is updated technicly it doesn't get that. although things like that should obviously be assumed for friendly games.


While you're unlikely to run into any issues in friendly games, I caution people from making assumptions. That's how uncomfortable conflicts occur midgame and can easily be avoided


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 14:15:29


Post by: Unit1126PLL


IMHO Sororitas mech should play a supporting rather than starring role anyways, and then be flavored to taste.

For example, Exorcists are pretty good support tanks, but being unable to choose which missile it fires means it can't really be your bread and butter, though it can be tailored to support in a specific way.

Similarly, Rhinos are great for just blasting upfield. Need some characters to catch up to the Zephyrim? Need some Repentia delivered, stat? Rhinos have you covered on the cheap.

Immolators are just as good at getting upfield as Rhinos and have more firepower to boot while they do so, but they only carry 6 and are considerably more expensive. I'd use these in the flank attack or reaction role - they're not durable enough to make up the main effort IMO (especially for cost) but they have plenty of power to make themselves and their contents felt while the enemy is more heavily engaged elsewhere on the table. One battalion of Immolators, with 3x melta BSS and 2x Canoness, perhaps with 1x Imagifier, would make a fine speedy flanking force, using all the transport slots while having considerable anti-infantry firepower and the speed to get the meltas close to something critical. It'd still be small enough to ignore as well, if your main effort (e.g. Celestine + Zephyrim or angryhurricane Argent Shroud blobs) are causing a dust-up somewhere else.

The Repressor is actually not that great. I own 3, and I simply think that the new age of Sisters mech killed it. Mech plays a supporting role, while the Repressor wants to be the star. You're either not using all 6 fire points for useful guns (yay, bolters), you're spending a billion points on it and the contents (multi-melta rets) when it might be better just to take a second copy of the contents, or you're overpaying for a Rhino. Ironically I think this transport is beset employed with Inquisitorial Acolytes and an Inquisitor on-board, since they can have 6x (or even 5x) special weapons.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 14:37:27


Post by: Salted Diamond


 Unit1126PLL wrote:

The Repressor is actually not that great. I own 3, and I simply think that the new age of Sisters mech killed it. Mech plays a supporting role, while the Repressor wants to be the star. You're either not using all 6 fire points for useful guns (yay, bolters), you're spending a billion points on it and the contents (multi-melta rets) when it might be better just to take a second copy of the contents, or you're overpaying for a Rhino. Ironically I think this transport is beset employed with Inquisitorial Acolytes and an Inquisitor on-board, since they can have 6x (or even 5x) special weapons.


If you own 3 an feel it's been killed, then you wouldn't mind parting ways with 1-2 of them, right?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 15:39:05


Post by: Sim-Life


 Salted Diamond wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:

The Repressor is actually not that great. I own 3, and I simply think that the new age of Sisters mech killed it. Mech plays a supporting role, while the Repressor wants to be the star. You're either not using all 6 fire points for useful guns (yay, bolters), you're spending a billion points on it and the contents (multi-melta rets) when it might be better just to take a second copy of the contents, or you're overpaying for a Rhino. Ironically I think this transport is beset employed with Inquisitorial Acolytes and an Inquisitor on-board, since they can have 6x (or even 5x) special weapons.


If you own 3 an feel it's been killed, then you wouldn't mind parting ways with 1-2 of them, right?


1.Buy Garden of Morr set or whatever its called now
2.Buy some cheap rhinos on facebook/ebay
3.????
4. PROFIT


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 15:44:49


Post by: Unit1126PLL


 Salted Diamond wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:

The Repressor is actually not that great. I own 3, and I simply think that the new age of Sisters mech killed it. Mech plays a supporting role, while the Repressor wants to be the star. You're either not using all 6 fire points for useful guns (yay, bolters), you're spending a billion points on it and the contents (multi-melta rets) when it might be better just to take a second copy of the contents, or you're overpaying for a Rhino. Ironically I think this transport is beset employed with Inquisitorial Acolytes and an Inquisitor on-board, since they can have 6x (or even 5x) special weapons.


If you own 3 an feel it's been killed, then you wouldn't mind parting ways with 1-2 of them, right?


Depends on how much people are paying


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 15:53:07


Post by: Rynner


 Salted Diamond wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:

The Repressor is actually not that great. I own 3, and I simply think that the new age of Sisters mech killed it. Mech plays a supporting role, while the Repressor wants to be the star. You're either not using all 6 fire points for useful guns (yay, bolters), you're spending a billion points on it and the contents (multi-melta rets) when it might be better just to take a second copy of the contents, or you're overpaying for a Rhino. Ironically I think this transport is beset employed with Inquisitorial Acolytes and an Inquisitor on-board, since they can have 6x (or even 5x) special weapons.


If you own 3 an feel it's been killed, then you wouldn't mind parting ways with 1-2 of them, right?


Not to derail things but if you really want 3 I know a site that has them. Send me a pm.

Re Immolators - I didn't think they were worth taking when they could have a 4++. I don't think they are worth it now. To be fair I also am struggling to see the value in Dominions at this point in time too.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 16:05:47


Post by: craggy


stupid question: Crusaders, DCA, Arcos...and Repentia Superiors...they don't take up slots, right? So can I just take loads of them? I remember seeing some units (like the Court Of The Archon) that had "if you include x unit, you can take y-number of these and they don't use up a slot" but there doesn't seem to be a restriction to the number of priestly buddies or whip ladies I can take.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 16:40:47


Post by: Khenir


I think RAI you would be allowed 1 per unit that makes them not take a slot, not sure about RAW.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 16:52:55


Post by: Bdrone


While i still favor mech sisters, i more or less agree with Unit here. the cost increases due to heavy bolters on immolators. loss of dominion vanguard, plus the loss of a special weapon option or two per unit took out my interest in running as much mech. im still eyeing the repressor depending on plausible rule interactions, but if that falls through the best argument to the repressor currently is it can still be advanced and pop it's flamer under argent shroud, making it almost compete with the immolator. but at those points theres probably better things to buy.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 17:12:06


Post by: Unit1126PLL


Don't be too despairing, I didn't say mech is dead or uninteresting. For example, my Bloody Rose list is looking at using loads of Zephyrim and Celestine, and then anyone else rocking up behind them in Rhinos.

We still do mech best - even with the Sister Superior nerf, we still have a whole buttfuckload of special weapons in our army, and our heavy weapon infantry can move (re: disembark) and shoot without penalty.

I am using my Argent Shroud infantry to close quickly in my Argent Shroud metal-girls list, but the reason I'm planning on Rhino-rushing with Bloody Rose is speed. Sororitas still prefer to be <12" away or in melee, so I think mech is a good way to get there Turn 2, and smoke generators are a good way to endure Turn 1.

It's a great way to get characters pre-positioned for deep-striking Zephyrim, or to keep up with Zephyrim deployed on the board (for example).


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 18:01:27


Post by: Lemondish


Other than the inability to take an extra boltgun taped to your current boltgun, how have Sisters Superior been nerfed? Your basic squads can still bring 3 special weapons thanks to combis, no?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 18:28:17


Post by: Unit1126PLL


Lemondish wrote:
Other than the inability to take an extra boltgun taped to your current boltgun, how have Sisters Superior been nerfed? Your basic squads can still bring 3 special weapons thanks to combis, no?

Well, yes, other than the way in which they've been nerfed, they've not been nerfed, it's true.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 19:07:40


Post by: KestrelM1


Lemondish wrote:
Other than the inability to take an extra boltgun taped to your current boltgun, how have Sisters Superior been nerfed? Your basic squads can still bring 3 special weapons thanks to combis, no?


Yeah, despite losing Storm Bolters, Sister Superiors still have some interesting options. Twin Bolt Pistols, Hand Flamers, Inferno Pistols, and Plasma Pistol/Combi Plasma all add some interesting options to choose from.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 19:08:00


Post by: the_scotsman


craggy wrote:
stupid question: Crusaders, DCA, Arcos...and Repentia Superiors...they don't take up slots, right? So can I just take loads of them? I remember seeing some units (like the Court Of The Archon) that had "if you include x unit, you can take y-number of these and they don't use up a slot" but there doesn't seem to be a restriction to the number of priestly buddies or whip ladies I can take.


Well if by loads you mean three, then yeah.

Rule of 3 kicks in pretty quick.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
KestrelM1 wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
Other than the inability to take an extra boltgun taped to your current boltgun, how have Sisters Superior been nerfed? Your basic squads can still bring 3 special weapons thanks to combis, no?


Yeah, despite losing Storm Bolters, Sister Superiors still have some interesting options. Twin Bolt Pistols, Hand Flamers, Inferno Pistols, and Plasma Pistol/Combi Plasma all add some interesting options to choose from.


Also, for you bloody rose fans out there, twin chainsword


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 19:56:25


Post by: Crimson


the_scotsman wrote:

Also, for you bloody rose fans out there, twin chainsword

I don't think that's possible...


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 21:18:15


Post by: Bdrone


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Don't be too despairing, I didn't say mech is dead or uninteresting. For example, my Bloody Rose list is looking at using loads of Zephyrim and Celestine, and then anyone else rocking up behind them in Rhinos.

We still do mech best - even with the Sister Superior nerf, we still have a whole buttfuckload of special weapons in our army, and our heavy weapon infantry can move (re: disembark) and shoot without penalty.

I am using my Argent Shroud infantry to close quickly in my Argent Shroud metal-girls list, but the reason I'm planning on Rhino-rushing with Bloody Rose is speed. Sororitas still prefer to be <12" away or in melee, so I think mech is a good way to get there Turn 2, and smoke generators are a good way to endure Turn 1.

It's a great way to get characters pre-positioned for deep-striking Zephyrim, or to keep up with Zephyrim deployed on the board (for example).


it's not so much that mech is either of those things, just to me looking to be inefficient unless your sending rhino's down the opponents teeth, as your pointing out. i just preferred the repressor most out of the carpark and id be less liable to build a list with it or an immolator as of now.

I also recognize I overemphasize on Storm bolters, but it still just gauls me that something so basic that we can have on multiple sisters in the same squad, is now not allowed on the superior, especially when i want to go cheap as possible but optimize downwind shots. yeah, we still have other options for them, but ill glare at that and blessed bolts getting an indirect hit regardless. it definately still works if you've got enough threats instead of through blistering speed.. and there's more than enough of that to take attention.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 21:58:36


Post by: MrMoustaffa


It's definitely odd. I fail to see what makes a stormbolters more powerful than a combi plas/melta on them.

I would say it feels like a glaring oversight if it wasn't for Legends just coming oit


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 22:06:01


Post by: BrianDavion


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
It's definitely odd. I fail to see what makes a stormbolters more powerful than a combi plas/melta on them.

I would say it feels like a glaring oversight if it wasn't for Legends just coming oit


the cynical answer is that people with current sisters armies will have to buy at least SOME new minis to replace their stormbolter superior sisters


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 22:06:41


Post by: Tel11


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
It's definitely odd. I fail to see what makes a stormbolters more powerful than a combi plas/melta on them.

I would say it feels like a glaring oversight if it wasn't for Legends just coming oit


In my opinion it's Two things.

1. The cost difference between a Plasma and a SB is the exact cost of buying another whole sister.

2. Mono kitting a unit gives it a direct specialized role and target in an edition where generalists are heavily punished. A full bolter/sb unit is dedicated to killing chaff, and becomes quite good at it.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 22:28:36


Post by: MrMoustaffa


Tel11 wrote:
 MrMoustaffa wrote:
It's definitely odd. I fail to see what makes a stormbolters more powerful than a combi plas/melta on them.

I would say it feels like a glaring oversight if it wasn't for Legends just coming oit


In my opinion it's Two things.

1. The cost difference between a Plasma and a SB is the exact cost of buying another whole sister.

2. Mono kitting a unit gives it a direct specialized role and target in an edition where generalists are heavily punished. A full bolter/sb unit is dedicated to killing chaff, and becomes quite good at it.

To be fair though, you're only gaining 2 more boltgun shots. I guess the worry was that blessed bolts would be OP, but if that's the case what's the difference between 16 shots and 20 honestly speaking? Especially compared to other units out there. They could've made the stormbolters cost more for characters too, wouldn't be the first weapon with two separate costs.

I dunno, in the grand scheme of things it's not the worst, at least sisters can still take boltguns on the sarge equivalent. You could be like guard and be pretty much locked into pistol/cqc weapon for what is supposed to be a ranged army


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 22:29:13


Post by: frgsinwntr


Tel11 wrote:
 MrMoustaffa wrote:
It's definitely odd. I fail to see what makes a stormbolters more powerful than a combi plas/melta on them.

I would say it feels like a glaring oversight if it wasn't for Legends just coming oit


In my opinion it's Two things.

1. The cost difference between a Plasma and a SB is the exact cost of buying another whole sister.

2. Mono kitting a unit gives it a direct specialized role and target in an edition where generalists are heavily punished. A full bolter/sb unit is dedicated to killing chaff, and becomes quite good at it.


I completely agree with you. It is worth the consideration however, to put a melta pistol on a sister superior. Its basically a 6 inch melta bomb for 7 points. obviously these are the first things to be cut if you are looking for points due to how infrequently this comes up. But a bit of them splashed into a unit here and there won't break the bank or hurt efficiency too much when the opportunity to use them comes up.

That said, I personally don't run them as I lean closer to your alignment with unit efficiency and singularity of purpose.



Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 22:35:50


Post by: Bdrone


Maybe Tel, but even that rings hollow to me considering the models i can think in other armies of that throw quite a few shots downwind. or can use their bolter variants in more ways than the rapid fire variant at better effectiveness. killing chaff is doable as is.

*sigh* anyway, id say the Rhino is the transport to go for now unless you have a specific plan in mind with the other two. im hearing conflicts on how say, targeting a repressor with some strategems could affect units inside, but even if it works, i can't imagine for how long that will be the case. works for me, less effort and frills.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/06 22:50:26


Post by: Rogerio134134


Not written any lists yet but I'm thinking of running an infantry heavy argent shroud force with a few decent blobs of sisters running forward pumping out fire backed up by the cannonness. Will be most definitely taking a couple of units of mortifiers and 3 excorcists too.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2118/12/07 00:01:22


Post by: Tel11


I definitley don't think a combi weapon is a bad choice, and in argent shroud mass charging sisters playstyle I think it has some really interesting applications.

I was just approaching it from a raw efficiency, grit your teeth competitive viewpoint. Another body, another wound, and 2-4 bolter shots vs. 1-2 plasma shots. Embedded special/heavies also have the awkward issue of often being in range of either bolter efficient targets, or special/heavy weapon targets, but not nessecarily both, and if you can be in range for both that often forces you to move in a way that's not objective efficient. It's just an issue with generalists who have a spread of different short range weapons in one squad.

Ultimately it's a moot point, and the better question is combi, pistol, or bolt gun. I lean towards boltgun for reasons stated above.

I will admit, I was first an eldar player so that's left a serious imprint on how I look at things, and without real playtesting theres no way to fully appriciate the potential effectiveness of slapping melta in a BSS and being about to near guarantee 6 damage to vehicles around the board.

I just tend to view bss as more for board control and CP than as a tool for removal.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 00:08:16


Post by: BrianDavion


I think a combi-plasma might not be a bad way to go for sister superiors. gives you a good way to handle heavier infantry that you'd otherwise have to close to melta range to really deal with.

course another option is to take a superior with combi metla, and put melta's on 2 of your sisters and just dial the melta up to 11


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 00:37:01


Post by: MrMoustaffa


For my planned infantry horde with Valorous heart, combi melta on superior and as many meltas as the regular sisters can carry. For the stormbolters squads that push up the table, they'll get a combo plas since that combos decently with the sacred bolt ability.

If it was any other army, combiplas all the way, but since sisters don't get regular plas may as well just take the weapons that match up with what the squad gets. Honestly I'll probably stick combimeltas on almost anyone that can carry one. Maybe give the odd canoness an inferno pistol, but for the most part I feel they're usually in places to hit way above their weight with melta, at least it's worked for me with my alpha legion and lamenters marine armies. Let's them deal with problems developing in your line usually in my experience, and worst case scenario it misses, unlike plasma.

I feel like sisters need to maximize their special weapons taken if they're going infantry heavy. Trying to go a pure approach of one unit getting all the weapons and another is just stock just makes target priority easy for the opponent. Yes you'll have less sisters overall, but each squad is a threat down to the last woman, and that's what I care about with a trait that focuses on serious durability.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 02:08:08


Post by: Lemondish


 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
Other than the inability to take an extra boltgun taped to your current boltgun, how have Sisters Superior been nerfed? Your basic squads can still bring 3 special weapons thanks to combis, no?

Well, yes, other than the way in which they've been nerfed, they've not been nerfed, it's true.


I thought the statement made was that they were nerfed in a way that made then intelligible to bring special weapons. I think that was a weird way to say it if all that's missing is an extra boltgun. Hardly worth worrying about, I'd think.

This is following a conversation about the viability of committing to mech sisters, which will have a far greater swing in your army's potential performance than a couple of BS 3+ Str 4 AP0 D1 attacks.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 02:22:33


Post by: ERJAK


the_scotsman wrote:
craggy wrote:
stupid question: Crusaders, DCA, Arcos...and Repentia Superiors...they don't take up slots, right? So can I just take loads of them? I remember seeing some units (like the Court Of The Archon) that had "if you include x unit, you can take y-number of these and they don't use up a slot" but there doesn't seem to be a restriction to the number of priestly buddies or whip ladies I can take.


Well if by loads you mean three, then yeah.

Rule of 3 kicks in pretty quick.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
KestrelM1 wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
Other than the inability to take an extra boltgun taped to your current boltgun, how have Sisters Superior been nerfed? Your basic squads can still bring 3 special weapons thanks to combis, no?


Yeah, despite losing Storm Bolters, Sister Superiors still have some interesting options. Twin Bolt Pistols, Hand Flamers, Inferno Pistols, and Plasma Pistol/Combi Plasma all add some interesting options to choose from.


Also, for you bloody rose fans out there, twin chainsword


Inferno pistols, plasma pistols, an combi weapons are mostly gak on Sister superiors.

IP is impractical and unlikely to ever get a chance to shoot, plasma pistols are always stupid, combi weapons are only good in units that already have 2 of the weapon being combi-ed, why would you WANT double bolt pistol?

Hf and Condemnor are cheap but offer no help.

The SB was a 2pt gun that did as much damage as a flamer and had FOUR shots that benefited from blessed bolts.

It was massively better than any othe SS equipment option and losing it is a big loss.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Lemondish wrote:
 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Lemondish wrote:
Other than the inability to take an extra boltgun taped to your current boltgun, how have Sisters Superior been nerfed? Your basic squads can still bring 3 special weapons thanks to combis, no?

Well, yes, other than the way in which they've been nerfed, they've not been nerfed, it's true.


I thought the statement made was that they were nerfed in a way that made then intelligible to bring special weapons. I think that was a weird way to say it if all that's missing is an extra boltgun. Hardly worth worrying about, I'd think.

This is following a conversation about the viability of committing to mech sisters, which will have a far greater swing in your army's potential performance than a couple of BS 3+ Str 4 AP0 D1 attacks.


Why would it have a far greater swing when the answer is a pretty straightforward 'mech sisters isn't very good, bring 3 exorcists and a rhino if you want but immolators and repressors are mostly for friendly games'.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 MrMoustaffa wrote:
For my planned infantry horde with Valorous heart, combi melta on superior and as many meltas as the regular sisters can carry. For the stormbolters squads that push up the table, they'll get a combo plas since that combos decently with the sacred bolt ability.

If it was any other army, combiplas all the way, but since sisters don't get regular plas may as well just take the weapons that match up with what the squad gets. Honestly I'll probably stick combimeltas on almost anyone that can carry one. Maybe give the odd canoness an inferno pistol, but for the most part I feel they're usually in places to hit way above their weight with melta, at least it's worked for me with my alpha legion and lamenters marine armies. Let's them deal with problems developing in your line usually in my experience, and worst case scenario it misses, unlike plasma.

I feel like sisters need to maximize their special weapons taken if they're going infantry heavy. Trying to go a pure approach of one unit getting all the weapons and another is just stock just makes target priority easy for the opponent. Yes you'll have less sisters overall, but each squad is a threat down to the last woman, and that's what I care about with a trait that focuses on serious durability.


See, I see it as the exact opposite. If you're going infantry heavy maximize your bodies and take only the specials you really need.

11 points for a combi-plasma is too much for a gun that's more likely to kill 20pts of your army than a significant amount of theirs.

Target priority you can manipulate by making large squads with meltas (and morale protection) and small squads with stormbolters. Sure, they can try to target out the meltas, but it'll take 8-13 kills to do it. You could spend tons of points to make the one remaining sister in a unit is always spooky, or you could spend points on making it almost impossible to get to the last girl.

Look at it like this, SoB don't really care about morale, and losing 12 sisters out of a 15 sister squad would leave you with 3 melta shots. Losing 12 sisters out of 3 squads of 5 wirh doublemelta/combi would ALSO leave you with 3 melta shots but one is a loss of 108pts and the other loses 164.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 10:38:35


Post by: Spoletta


For bloody rose double bolt pistols makes a lot of sense.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 12:13:39


Post by: Khenir


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
For my planned infantry horde with Valorous heart, combi melta on superior and as many meltas as the regular sisters can carry. For the stormbolters squads that push up the table, they'll get a combo plas since that combos decently with the sacred bolt ability.

If it was any other army, combiplas all the way, but since sisters don't get regular plas may as well just take the weapons that match up with what the squad gets. Honestly I'll probably stick combimeltas on almost anyone that can carry one. Maybe give the odd canoness an inferno pistol, but for the most part I feel they're usually in places to hit way above their weight with melta, at least it's worked for me with my alpha legion and lamenters marine armies. Let's them deal with problems developing in your line usually in my experience, and worst case scenario it misses, unlike plasma.

I feel like sisters need to maximize their special weapons taken if they're going infantry heavy. Trying to go a pure approach of one unit getting all the weapons and another is just stock just makes target priority easy for the opponent. Yes you'll have less sisters overall, but each squad is a threat down to the last woman, and that's what I care about with a trait that focuses on serious durability.


This is where Triumph of St Katherine finds its use cases.

You either have to take out Triumph which will allow the sisters up, or risk spending most of the game trying to chew through everything else.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 12:14:26


Post by: Nevelon


Seems like miracle dice would pair well with overheated plasma. Not that Sisters have a huge amount of it kicking around. Takes the risk out and you don’t need to castle up around re-roll buffs.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 13:15:17


Post by: Unit1126PLL


My infantry horde is a mix. 3 Storm Bolter/Bolter squads (10 girl), 2 Storm Bolter/Bolter throwaway squads (5 girl), 1 melta/combi-melta squad (10 girls), 3 Heavy Bolter/Bolter objective sitter squads (5 girls).

Those are my troops. The little squads cover the flanks or squat on objectives.

Heavy Support is 3x10 Retributors, 2 with 4x Multi-meltas, 1 with 4x Heavy Flamers.

Fast Attack is 1x melta Seraphim, 1x hand flamer Seraphim, 1x melta Dominions

Elites is mostly characters but also 1x10 Celestians with meltas/combi-meltas


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 13:43:47


Post by: A.T.


Lemondish wrote:
I think that was a weird way to say it if all that's missing is an extra boltgun. Hardly worth worrying about, I'd think.
A full third of your blessed bolts firepower goes with that stormbolter.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 13:54:48


Post by: Gareth_Evans


I'm not understanding the Plasmagun hate. Sisters have multiple ways to avoid them exploding.

OooML +1 to hit
Miracle Dice
Cherub dice
Re-rolls from Cannoness.
Moment of grace (you can use this after you've rolled even)

There's probably more.

It's also the same range profile as the bolters they carry. You trade double strength, more AP for 2 less shots when in RF (assuming blessed bolts)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 14:10:16


Post by: MrMoustaffa


@ERJAK, you said you used to be an eldar player right? Probably explains our difference in approach a bit. I'm used to guard where if you're going with a loadout, every squad gets that loadout unless you're taking something ridiculous like 200+ guardsmen. You can't really afford to mix and match with footslogging infantry, especially with such short ranged weapons. Yeah a squad or two with stormbolters isn't a bad idea to camp an objective, but anything going up the table should be uniform in my experience. Even with all the Valorous heart buffs, sisters are not invincible, you need redundancy. Unless you plan on all the melta squads going one way and the Bolter squads go the other for some odd reason, and even there a fast opponent will just redeploy and not care.

I also plan on no vehicle bigger than a mortifier so that's going to explain some of the difference too. I'm not planning on anything with a rhino chassis, I'm just going to double down on infantry. Basically overwhelm their target priority to the point where they're going to be firing lascannons at sisters because they don't have anything else to target. With that kind of list, every squad needs its own way to deal with a rogue tank, monster, or knight in their way.

For a hybrid list like youre talking yeah, maybe you don't need to double down as much, but for pure infantry like I'm talking I think melta spam is a must. You're going to have more bolters than you know what to do with for infantry, all you need from there is a weapon that can kill tanks and you're golden. And since sisters have ways to survive morale shock, that makes enemies finish off squads rather than risking two meltas just sticking around and smacking a tank around. Anytime you can force an opponent to finish off a squad will usually mean they have to waste some shots that could've done more damage in a bigger squad, which can save you models in the long run.

But yeah that's just my experience. I'm also used to infantry that die to a stiff breeze so it may turn out this is a bit overkill after I play with it a bit.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 14:40:46


Post by: Crimson


I really don't want all squads to have same loadout. It is boring both visually and gameplay wise.

And about pistols. I think hand flamer should be OK for flamer squads, Bloody Rose in particular. If you have other flamers you need to get pretty close anyway. As BR the hand flamer gets bonus AP. And of course you can use it in close combat, which is something you might want to do as Bloody Rose.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 16:00:59


Post by: the_scotsman


Why not just use storm bolter dominions if you want to use blessed bolts?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 16:06:59


Post by: A.T.


the_scotsman wrote:
Why not just use storm bolter dominions if you want to use blessed bolts?
They have still lost 20% of their firepower as far as the superior nerf goes.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 16:33:32


Post by: craggy


the_scotsman wrote:
craggy wrote:
stupid question: Crusaders, DCA, Arcos...and Repentia Superiors...they don't take up slots, right? So can I just take loads of them? I remember seeing some units (like the Court Of The Archon) that had "if you include x unit, you can take y-number of these and they don't use up a slot" but there doesn't seem to be a restriction to the number of priestly buddies or whip ladies I can take.


Well if by loads you mean three, then yeah.

Rule of 3 kicks in pretty quick.




It does. In matched play.
(I did forget about the Rule Of Three, TBF but also it does only affect Battleforged armies in one mode of play)


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 16:36:46


Post by: dracpanzer


I have now gotten in 5 games with the Dex. All of you foot Sisters enthusiasts can have them, I don't care about their effectiveness, I don't want to play them. I have been running a Brigade with BSS doubled up with 2IP and 4SB in Repressors.

Two Exo's and a unit of Mortifiers for HS, three Seraphim squads for FA (2 at 5 girls with IP and one at 10 with HF to make them a cheap escort for Celestine). There is a repentia bomb to fill out my Elites who ride along with the 2 Canoness.

I am pleasantly surprised at the fix for Exo's. They were terribly inconsistent for me with the Index and Betadex. Mortifiers are scary enough to cause trouble enough to get everyone close.

My biggest issue is deciding which Conviction to stick with. It's been smooth sailing in all my games save for an early one against IH that I used a lot more foot than I'm used too.

I tend to build up enough MD early on that keep the list going as my CP's start to die out. Not a gigantic boost, but certainly happy overall.

Sticking true to my word, ERJAK I have some NoS Sisters for you!




Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 16:42:57


Post by: Crimson


craggy wrote:

It does. In matched play.
(I did forget about the Rule Of Three, TBF but also it does only affect Battleforged armies in one mode of play)

Not even that. It is not a matched play rule, it is a tournament suggestion.


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 16:54:56


Post by: craggy


 dracpanzer wrote:
I have now gotten in 5 games with the Dex. All of you foot Sisters enthusiasts can have them, I don't care about their effectiveness, I don't want to play them. I have been running a Brigade with BSS doubled up with 2IP and 4SB in Repressors.

Two Exo's and a unit of Mortifiers for HS, three Seraphim squads for FA (2 at 5 girls with IP and one at 10 with HF to make them a cheap escort for Celestine). There is a repentia bomb to fill out my Elites who ride along with the 2 Canoness.

I am pleasantly surprised at the fix for Exo's. They were terribly inconsistent for me with the Index and Betadex. Mortifiers are scary enough to cause trouble enough to get everyone close.

My biggest issue is deciding which Conviction to stick with. It's been smooth sailing in all my games save for an early one against IH that I used a lot more foot than I'm used too.

I tend to build up enough MD early on that keep the list going as my CP's start to die out. Not a gigantic boost, but certainly happy overall.

Sticking true to my word, ERJAK I have some NoS Sisters for you!



I'm confused. You sound like you've had a good experience with the army, but say you're done with them? Are they too good? Just not your play style?


Sisters of Battle 2019 Codex Tactics @ 2019/12/07 17:42:49


Post by: dracpanzer


craggy wrote:
 dracpanzer wrote:
I have now gotten in 5 games with the Dex. All of you foot Sisters enthusiasts can have them, I don't care about their effectiveness, I don't want to play them. I have been running a Brigade with BSS doubled up with 2IP and 4SB in Repressors.

Two Exo's and a unit of Mortifiers for HS, three Seraphim squads for FA (2 at 5 girls with IP and one at 10 with HF to make them a cheap escort for Celestine). There is a repentia bomb to fill out my Elites who ride along with the 2 Canoness.

I am pleasantly surprised at the fix for Exo's. They were terribly inconsistent for me with the Index and Betadex. Mortifiers are scary enough to cause trouble enough to get everyone close.

My biggest issue is deciding which Conviction to stick with. It's been smooth sailing in all my games save for an early one against IH that I used a lot more foot than I'm used too.

I tend to build up enough MD early on that keep the list going as my CP's start to die out. Not a gigantic boost, but certainly happy overall.

Sticking true to my word, ERJAK I have some NoS Sisters for you!



I'm confused. You sound like you've had a good experience with the army, but say you're done with them? Are they too good? Just not your play style?


I have a mountain of painted metals I have accumulated over 20+ years I love. Don't need the plastics...