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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091123/ap_on_re_us/us_police_shooting

This kid must have been looking to die. What a moron.

Yep, you would think everybody in their teens or older would know that if you so much as point something that looks like a gun at a cop, they will shoot you, so it must have been either extreme drug-induced dementia or suicide by cop.

You should also never flip them off...

He's going to go tell the cop to **** off and I'm going to film it. It's going to be funny!
hahaha! Oh ****! Oh ****! Dude run!

I think the funniest thing I've seen on Youtube are all the "Police v. Skateboarder" videos.

You know, the ones where they cut their cameras on AFTER they mouthed off to the officer, etc?
And then act like they're the victims?

I'll get shot or go to prison.

A guy in London got shot for carrying a chair leg.

Kilkrazy wrote:A guy in London got shot for carrying a chair leg.

But think of the kids, he could of given them a splinter

Ten years ago, 22-year-old Amadou Diallo was killed when he was struck 19 times by 41 bullets fired by police officers who mistook his wallet for a gun. The officers were acquitted in the February 1999 fatal shooting of the African immigrant.

That's mental...

Sounds a bit 'overkill' to shoot the guy THAT many times.

Sounds about right. the natural reaction ina threat sitautation is keep pulling the trigger until the subject goes does. With adrenalin pumping and cop 9mms thats like 3 seconds of shooting. Thats life not hollywood.

Nearly 50% is an excellent hit rate FYI. Those boys had it together.

Hmm, not really. They killed an unarmed man. But in terms of accuracy, fair point.

Albatross wrote:Hmm, not really. They killed an unarmed man. But in terms of accuracy, fair point.

Read the article.

He then turned and pointed a 9mm semiautomatic pistol at them, Browne said.

Point a gun at a cop-you die. Problem/solution.

Nah, I meant the poor chap who only had a wallet, not a gun. Read my quote!

I have no info other than you're quote. I have no idea of jurisdiction, what he had, or what the conditions were. Straw Man ho!

Pretty sure there was another case where they filled a guy full of bullets because they thought the apple he was eating was a grenade.

New York cops need gun control laws.....

I remember a case where cops blew away a woman for having a baby stroller. Oh wait no, that didn't happen, but has about as much credence as the above.

Ten years ago, 22-year-old Amadou Diallo was killed when he was struck 19 times by 41 bullets fired by police officers who mistook his wallet for a gun. The officers were acquitted in the February 1999 fatal shooting of the African immigrant.

It's from the article the OP linked - my point was 'those boys had it together' is a bit wide of the mark if they mistook the wallet in the guy's hand for a gun. The threat evaluation was innaccurate in that particular situation - but as you say, the accuracy of those police officers was good. Probably not much comfort to the victim's family though.
How is any of this a strawman?

I have no idea of jurisdiction,

Well, it was in the US - I assume it's still legal to carry money around in a wallet or change-purse. You'd probably have more info on this subject though, let me know if I'm mistaken .

what he had

A wallet.

or what the conditions were

He was black and had a dark object in his hand. KILL HIM!!

Ok, I'm being a little facetious there.... here's what happened:

In the early morning of February 4, 1999, Diallo was standing near his building after returning from a meal. Police officers Edward McMellon, Sean Carroll, Kenneth Boss and Richard Murphy passed by in a Ford Taurus when they thought Diallo matched the description of a (since-captured) serial rapist and approached him. The officers were in plain clothes. The officers claimed that they loudly identified themselves as NYPD officers and that Diallo ran up the outside steps toward his apartment house doorway at their approach, ignoring their orders to stop and "show his hands". As the suspect reached into his jacket, Carroll believed Diallo was drawing a firearm and yelled "Gun!" to alert his colleagues. The officers opened fire on Diallo and during the burst McMellon fell down the steps, appearing to be shot. The four officers fired forty-one shots, hitting Diallo nineteen times. Investigation found no weapons on Diallo's body; the item he had pulled out of his jacket was not a gun, but a wallet.

A tragic accident perhaps, but there is touch of 'Racial Profiling' to this.

From your own quote, they thought he was a rapist and drawing a firearm, not they shot him because he had a wallet.

I'm not defending the NYPD especially as its genetically impossible for me to side with a damnyankee, but seriously, that has nothing to do with the original post and everything can be taken out of context.

'Cops shoot a guy with a boxcutter." Sounds horrible
'cops shoot a guy with a boxcutter thtreatening a woman with a bay.' Its all context. Moving on now.

Frazzled wrote:From your own quote, they thought he was a rapist and drawing a firearm, not they shot him because he had a wallet.

I'm not defending the NYPD especially as its genetically impossible for me to side with a damnyankee, but seriously, that has nothing to do with the original post and everything can be taken out of context.

'Cops shoot a guy with a boxcutter." Sounds horrible
'cops shoot a guy with a boxcutter thtreatening a woman with a bay.' Its all context. Moving on now.

That's not really an argument.....

(placeholder until Deadshane comes and breathes fire)
Sure it is. Its as good as what you posted.

'I remember when a cop saved five thousand people.'
'I remember when a cop arrested me, for no reason!'
'I remember when dinosaurs roamed the earth. '

No context, no info, just random incriminations. I have no love for, well anyone outside family, but I am fully aware of the bad rep cops get. Some of it is warranted, but a lot of it is BS by people with an axe to grind.

Here's the only relevant point of the initial post:

Vasconcellos and two others were spotted leaving a city park in Queens at about 11:30 p.m. Saturday by four officers in an unmarked car. Vasconcellos ran and was pursued by three officers. He then turned and pointed a 9mm semiautomatic pistol at them, Browne said.

"They ordered him to drop the gun, and he did not comply. Three officers fired a total of 14 shots," Browne said.

He was stupid. I don't think Suicide by Cop was an issue here.

Were not talking about what I said. I realize what I said is full of holes since I did not provide proof. I am just stating that I heard about it. Then I made a small joke about how cops need gun control.

What Albatross is saying (the info in question here) actually has stuff backing it up. You say you have no info other than his quote, but, the info is in the article posted by the OP.

I am not anti-police by any stretch of the imagination, and I think that the guy who pointed the gun at the undercover officers was a potential winner of 'The Darwin Award' for removing himself from the gene-pool. But to fire 40+ plus times at a man because he MIGHT be going for a gun is excessive in my opinion. No matter WHAT they thought he had - he ACTUALLY had a wallet, so a mistake was made. Just like the Jean Charles De Menezes case in Britain - he was shot in the head 7 times at point-blank range because he was mistaken for a suicide bomber. He wasn't, they had mistaken him for a terror suspect they were keeping an eye on. I know the Secret Service was only doing it's job trying to protect Britain, just as the NYC police officers where trying to protect the citizens of New York - but if an innocent person loses their life, it's not an acceptable loss if it can at all be avoided, IMHO.

Albatross wrote:I am not anti-police by any stretch of the imagination, and I think that the guy who pointed the gun at the undercover officers was a potential winner of 'The Darwin Award' for removing himself from the gene-pool. But to fire 40+ plus times at a man because he MIGHT be going for a gun is excessive in my opinion. No matter WHAT they thought he had - he ACTUALLY had a wallet, so a mistake was made. Just like the Jean Charles De Menezes case in Britain - he was shot in the head 7 times at point-blank range because he was mistaken for a suicide bomber. He wasn't, they had mistaken him for a terror suspect they were keeping an eye on. I know the Secret Service was only doing it's job trying to protect Britain, just as the NYC police officers where trying to protect the citizens of New York - but if an innocent person loses their life, it's not an acceptable loss if it can at all be avoided, IMHO.

lets bifurcate this as my original comment was to only a part, and I am not addressing the British case as that has nothing to do with this and my comment
Setting aside the reason for the shoot, to the actual "technicals:"
1) 40 round with a a near 50% hit rate is really really good. NYC average is 30% hit rate.
2) firing 40 rounds is understandable. Again we're talking adrenalin and 9mm guns. If three - four guys are shooting thats about 10 rounds per shooter. That equates to 2.5-3 seconds of shooting. Thats common for cop shoots and civilian shoots. Often the shooters will only stop shooting when the magazine clicks and they will keep squeezing the trigger. Again its common for the shooter to have no idea how many rounds they actually got off in that type of situation. Its a maximum freakout situation, not Hollywood.

The problem with the De Menezes case is not so much the error of shooting -- I can understand how keyed up the police probably were, just a few days after the 7/7 bombings.

The problem is the rather crude attempted coverup afterwards.

i remember that story about the just married guy at the strip club who got shot...

the police said that he told one of his friend to "go get my gun" then he reached for something...

now i know what your thinking. o the police are tellin a fib to protect their jobs, but go ahead... ask me if i trust drunk idiots comming out of a strip club more then i do police officers.

Envy89 wrote:i remember that story about the just married guy at the strip club who got shot...

the police said that he told one of his friend to "go get my gun" then he reached for something...

now i know what your thinking. o the police are tellin a fib to protect their jobs, but go ahead... ask me if i trust drunk idiots comming out of a strip club more then i do police officers.

Do you trust drunk idiots comming out of a strip club more then you do police officers?

Frazzled wrote:Do you trust drunk idiots comming out of a strip club more then you do police officers?

I wouldn't instinctively not trust either.

GG

Frazzled wrote:Do you trust drunk idiots comming out of a strip club more then you do police officers?

Ummm, ahhh. Can I have an easier question?

Albatross obviously knows NOTHING about gun battles.

That being said....

I am in law enforcement.

If I give you an instruction to lower your weapon and get on the ground, whether it be a gun, squirt gun, or dandelion, if you do anything but move in an unthreatening and compliant manner, you have just taken your own life in your hands.

I'm going home to my family tonight....period. People tend to forget that the police are just as much real people as the people that get shot. The police that stop and try to determine whether "that is a real gun or not" are the ones that wind up dead.

If a cop tells you to do something, comply. If he's in the wrong, sue the city later.

Drop that gun, squirt gun, or dandelion or I will shoot you in the face. I have the badge, do as I tell you. I'm not being a bully, I'm trying to keep order or get to the bottom of whatever is going on. As far as I'm concerned, its my life or yours.

Like I said, I'm going home tonight.

Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.