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In the fluff or in RL? As there's nothing stopping him from building them in RL.

There's also nothing stopping me from making Chaos Necrons or Chaos Tyranids.

It doesn't mean that it's a good idea.

Their (in fluff terms) no possible way for a grey knight, nid, or necron to become chaos taint/controlled. grey knights cant bet nurgle revived cause they typically burn the bodies. all others they are trained to fight always as well as nurgle. nids dont have vices and desires for chaos to take anvantage of. and ditto for necrons.

Everyone is thinking about this a bit to hard in my opinion.
the models would look awesome and even though the fluff is questionable at best, it's all about having fun and if its used as a proxy its not really a huge deal.

Kanluwen wrote:There's also nothing stopping me from making Chaos Necrons or Chaos Tyranids.

It doesn't mean that it's a good idea.

Those are slightly different from suits of Grey Knights power-armor recovered by a mad Dark Mechanicus priest and through an arduous process of ritual and Daemonic pacts, animates the outer-shells by possessing them with Daemons. That's not really fluff breaking, it's a manipulation of established fluff, but it isn't a contradiction.

What would be the point of playing WH40k if you don't follow the fluff? Don't Daemons possess a SM to destroy the Chapter from the inside? Why would they go through all that trouble to get into a dead SM whose armor makes them feel like they have explosive diarrhea?

Vires` wrote:What would be the point of playing WH40k if you don't follow the fluff? Don't Daemons possess a SM to destroy the Chapter from the inside? Why would they go through all that trouble to get into a dead SM whose armor makes them feel like they have explosive diarrhea?

Yeah, you just kinda, skimmed, a few words off of what I posted, missing what actually makes it a perfectly plausible idea.

iproxtaco wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:There's also nothing stopping me from making Chaos Necrons or Chaos Tyranids.

It doesn't mean that it's a good idea.

Those are slightly different from suits of Grey Knights power-armor recovered by a mad Dark Mechanicus priest and through an arduous process of ritual and Daemonic pacts, animates the outer-shells by possessing them with Daemons. That's not really fluff breaking, it's a manipulation of established fluff, but it isn't a contradiction.

No, they're not.

The closest thing to "animated suits of power-armor" is the Defiler--and that is purpose built for housing a Daemon within. It's not a "looted" vehicle.

There is absolutely no basis, whatsoever, for "breaking Grey Knight Power Armor" to have a Daemon possess it.
It would be, as I've said before, like placing a fish in lava--it's stupid to do and it will not work.

Could you feasibly break down the wards, et al of the Grey Knight Power Armor to allow for possession? Probably. But by that point it wouldn't be even remotely recognizable as Grey Knight Power Armor--it would be a broken mass of steel and ceramite, covered in blasphemous runes and scribbling.

Just like you can feasibly breed a "fish" to survive in lava--but it won't really ever look like a fish.

It doesn't break the fluff, it makes sense, even if there's no actual fluff reference for it.
I would never model them all silver and shiny, THAT would be the stupid part. If you were to actually seriously build this army, you would paint/model them to look all battered and rusty, with copious amounts of spikes for good measure.

Jesus christ. is everyone still posting about this? lol


Fluff-wise anything is feasible.

I would say that firstly; non-daemonic chaos worshippers would be able to get rid of any warding symbols/words ect as they are not troubled by the blessings, prayers or wards etched into the armor. That leaves only the invisible wards/blessings or whatever they are, which I am sure can be broken down by extremely powerful daemons 'eventually' ... nomatter how uncomfortable it may be for them. Once the armour is free of the emperors holy taint, it will be a perfect vessel for a daemon.
Now in this scenario, no grey knight has fallen to chaos necessarily (satisfying the hard core GK fluff followers) but the chaos followers HAVE captured GK armour in which can be made suitable as a demonic vessel.

So long story short ... I see no reason why making chaos grey knights and playing with them can not be justified.

Like I say, the only limit is your imagination and It will be a sad day when we stop making gak up lol

No. Even "battered and rusty with spikes" wouldn't work.

You're not comprehending this.
Grey Knight wargear, down to the base layer of metal, is layered in wards. You would have to break it apart down to the base layer and rebuild it.

It would not look like Grey Knight wargear. It would not look Imperial at all. It would look more like a golem, with a few recognizable pieces.

I still can't get past the whole part of someone recovering Grey Knight bodies to do anything with them. If a battle has gone so poorly that the entire Grey Knight contingent has been annihilated, the planet in question is going to be Exterminatus'd 400 times over. There won't be anything left to fiddle with.

@Rawr: there are no Chaos Grey Knights and you can't justify it from a fluff-point in any way. You could still do it and play it, but expect a lot of people to look at you funny and some to outright refuse to play you.

Omegus wrote:I still can't get past the whole part of someone recovering Grey Knight bodies to do anything with them. If a battle has gone so poorly that the entire Grey Knight contingent has been annihilated, the planet in question is going to be Exterminatus'd 400 times over. There won't be anything left to fiddle with.

@Rawr: there are no Chaos Grey Knights and you can't justify it from a fluff-point in any way. You could still do it and play it, but expect a lot of people to look at you funny and some to outright refuse to play you.

This is what I mean. No offence, but people like you just refuse to accept all possibilities.

Let me show you what i mean...

http://www.fictiondb.com/author/ben-counter~hammer-of-daemons~220503~b.htm

'Stripped of his armour and weapons, he is forced to fight as a gladiator for his daemonic masters, who worship their god Khorne with endless slaughter.'

Thats a pretty simple way of getting a GK's armour now isnt it? Beat him in single combat (they can be beaten. fact), then take them through the warp with you.

Lord draigo is another example. If he werent so badass and was just a normal GK, he could well have been taken down and stripped of his armour.


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Kanluwen wrote:Grey Knight wargear, down to the base layer of metal, is layered in wards. You would have to break it apart down to the base layer and rebuild it.

It would not look like Grey Knight wargear. It would not look Imperial at all. It would look more like a golem, with a few recognizable pieces.

Please show me the source of this information. I know quite abit about grey knights, and how everything works, but I've never seen a description like that.

Besides, if the chaos gods can grant Horus the power to defeat the emperor, Im sure they can help destroy any of those hexogramic wards GK armour has without even breaking a sweat.


ANYTHING is possible in fiction. can you just comprehend this? lol

Brother-Captain-Rawr! wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Grey Knight wargear, down to the base layer of metal, is layered in wards. You would have to break it apart down to the base layer and rebuild it.

It would not look like Grey Knight wargear. It would not look Imperial at all. It would look more like a golem, with a few recognizable pieces.

Please show me the source of this information. I know quite abit about grey knights, and how everything works, but I've never seen a description like that.

You mean other than Codex: Daemonhunters and Grey Knights?

Where they talk about "layered hexagrammic wards" and "anointing oils".

Besides, if the chaos gods can grant Horus the power to defeat the emperor, Im sure they can help destroy any of those hexogramic wards GK armour has without even breaking a sweat.
ANYTHING is possible in fiction. can you just comprehend this? lol

So you're saying that all four of the Ruinous Powers are acting in concert, just to ruin a set of armor so one of their minor minions can possess it?

Do you understand how ridiculous of a premise that is? It makes some of the over-the-top shenanigans of Draigo look tame.

Kanluwen wrote:

Brother-Captain-Rawr! wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Grey Knight wargear, down to the base layer of metal, is layered in wards. You would have to break it apart down to the base layer and rebuild it.

It would not look like Grey Knight wargear. It would not look Imperial at all. It would look more like a golem, with a few recognizable pieces.

Please show me the source of this information. I know quite abit about grey knights, and how everything works, but I've never seen a description like that.

You mean other than Codex: Daemonhunters and Grey Knights?

Where they talk about "layered hexagrammic wards" and "anointing oils".

Besides, if the chaos gods can grant Horus the power to defeat the emperor, Im sure they can help destroy any of those hexogramic wards GK armour has without even breaking a sweat.
ANYTHING is possible in fiction. can you just comprehend this? lol

So you're saying that all four of the Ruinous Powers are acting in concert, just to ruin a set of armor so one of their minor minions can possess it?

Do you understand how ridiculous of a premise that is? It makes some of the over-the-top shenanigans of Draigo look tame.

Okay, firstly, thankyou for the referance. The wards are indeed layrered. And? layers can be stripped. power armour is damaged all the time. LAYERS of damage are regularly repaired by techmarines/armourers. Its the 41st millenium...mechanical marvels can be woven...seriously, i could pay ben counter to say this in his next GK book and you would believe it because its written by him. who happens to be a person with an imagination. like me lol.

As for the Horus thing, That may have been a bad example. But it makes the point well enough I reckon. with a tiny fraction of the power it took to make horus what he was, It could be made completely possible to render a suit of GK armour devoid of its protections against daemons.

Let me get back to the book thing. because i think its really funny lol.

If i offered 2k to ben counter to add in acouple of my ideas, I'm sure he would'nt say no. I could have a coffie with mat ward and talk to him about quad-baneblades which are basically 4 baneblades strapped together with masking tape and if he thought it was a good idea, hed probably put it into a codex and everybody would acknowlege it. just like they have to acknowlege that Draigo carved a supreme grandmasters name on a demon-primarchs' heart.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Why should something ficticious be granted validity or otherwise based only on the creators ideas? why not our own? In addition, the 40k universe was put together by many, many different minds. Just like ours. Things which are non-existant, become reality in established fiction all the time (see what i did there? lol). It's within our rights as humans with minds to be able to add to a ficticious universe, because the ones who created THIS particular universe are not all knowing gods (well Dan abbnet is, but apart from him), they are US!

the point being that it would completely destroy the armor itself.

It would be far easier to steal a suit of PA that doesn't have all those annoying wards. they would take the easy way out and not do a pointless thing. it would be a waste of energy.



a regular CSm might steal the armor to fix his own, but the armor would be like wearing itchy wool on a hot day. It could be done, but it would be hella annoying for the marine. go steal a regular space marines armor, it doesn't chafe.

I am going to have to agree with Kanluen here, to begin with a demon is attracted by the flicker in the warp a psyker has. Demons do not willingly possess machinery, it takes sorcerers to force a demon inside of the machine and imprison it, with the wards protecting it the sorcerers would not even be able to begin the process of corrupting the armor enough to allow the demon to survive within it.
The wards are not only physically inscribed on the surface of the armor it is also psychicly warded by the artificers, as even the techmarines are psykers in the Grey Knights.

What Kanluen is suggesting is that you would have to retcon nearly all of the Grey Knight fluff to make this at all possible.

Arm.chair.general wrote:Hi there, I was thinking about buying Grey Knights, but I wanted to fit them into a chaos theme. I was thinking that they could be Grey Knights that have fallen in battle on countless daemon worlds, as they struggle to keep the chaos at bay, and are re-animated by some crazy apocathery by entombing a daemon in their armour. The daemon uses the corpse in the armour, almost like a host body. The daemon feeds off the corpses flesh and soul, giving it energy to walk round in this massive hulking suit of ancient sacred battle plate. What do you think? Is the explanation good enough to explain Chaos Grey Knights?

No.

Go Chaos SM if you want to be a baddy. That whole traitor thing is way over done. "Give me all the cool new stuff but don't call me a cheesmo since I'm traitor."

If you want to be bad play bad.

Actually do what makes you happy. My rant is finished.

Grey Templar wrote:the point being that it would completely destroy the armor itself.

It would be far easier to steal a suit of PA that doesn't have all those annoying wards. they would take the easy way out and not do a pointless thing. it would be a waste of energy.



a regular CSm might steal the armor to fix his own, but the armor would be like wearing itchy wool on a hot day. It could be done, but it would be hella annoying for the marine. go steal a regular space marines armor, it doesn't chafe.

Take this for example:

'Lord Krohl gazed upon the delicious pain etched onto the faces of those about to be sacrificed to the blood god. All of them being worthy tributes in possession of exceptional martial prowess and unchained savagery to the extremes of the souls dark confines.'
'Blood for the blood god. Shall the warp well swell with the screams of the corpse-Emporers mewling puppets' he uttered in a whisper which echoed throughout the dark citadel of B'aroz keep.

A hunched, abnormally formed figure appeared within the warp-fires. Hooded and cowering, the lesser daemon of Tzeentch approached his hulking new master.
'Lord Khrol', it gurgled. 'The light-purge is about to begin. The silver suits shall soon be bereft of all their power to harm my kind'.
'Master, what shall be done with them?'
The magnificently savage visage of Krohl was revealed to the slave daemon as the moon would eclipse the sun. Like aeons of dread condensed into a single place, and the crippled beast shuddered.
'They shall be symbols of the impending decay of mankind. Vessels that will be filled by champions from the very throne of khorne. A message to these 'Daemon hunters', that even they can fall.'
'A lie woven by the hand of Tzeentch, to be delivered by the hand of Khorne. A lie that shall see us take the material realm from the decaying tick that is the Imperium and all who will not submit to our terrible master.

Anything is possible if you want it to be

Brother-Captain-Rawr! wrote:
Besides, if the chaos gods can grant Horus the power to defeat the emperor, Im sure they can help destroy any of those hexogramic wards GK armour has without even breaking a sweat.


ANYTHING is possible in fiction. can you just comprehend this? lol

The only reason why Horus was able to injure the Emperor so bad was because he saw him as his son. He was the first Primarch The Emperor found and was the only one for many many years. It was when a lone Custodian entered the room of the Vengeful Spirit the valiant Imperial warrior roared and charged the Warmaster. He was flayed alive by a glancing psychic blast from Horus. Realizing at last that his favoured son was truly lost to the corruption of Chaos, the Emperor finally gathered his full and awesome psychic power in the Immaterium and unleashed a lance of pure Warp energy that pierced the gloating Horus' psychic defenses and ripped his body apart.

This is off-topic but I felt Over-Zealous and needed to post this. :

Horus actually didn't defeat the Emperor. it was the other way around.


Horus was completely annhilated. not even his soul escaped destruction.



all he did was cause grevious harm to the Emperor's body. the Emperor was unharmed on a psychic level. If anything, Horus destroying the Emperor's body gave the Emperor freedom to combat chaos on its own turf.

Arm.chair.general wrote:Hi there, I was thinking about buying Grey Knights, but I wanted to fit them into a chaos theme. I was thinking that they could be Grey Knights that have fallen in battle on countless daemon worlds, as they struggle to keep the chaos at bay, and are re-animated by some crazy apocathery by entombing a daemon in their armour. The daemon uses the corpse in the armour, almost like a host body. The daemon feeds off the corpses flesh and soul, giving it energy to walk round in this massive hulking suit of ancient sacred battle plate. What do you think? Is the explanation good enough to explain Chaos Grey Knights?

I'm not huge on Grey Knights fluff, but I'm not one to judge. My Sisters of Battle Mission's backstory has them being turned against the Imperium - though not against the Emperor - by nano-machines used by a xenos psyker who they were sent to kill or capture during a war against Chaos on an Imperial world, because he'd been consorting with Chaos according to their information, when really he had been turning them too. Much cuddles were then had by all. ^^

Brother-Captain-Rawr! wrote:Take this for example:

'Lord Krohl gazed upon the delicious pain etched onto the faces of those about to be sacrificed to the blood god. All of them being worthy tributes in possession of exceptional martial prowess and unchained savagery to the extremes of the souls dark confines.'
'Blood for the blood god. Shall the warp well swell with the screams of the corpse-Emporers mewling puppets' he uttered in a whisper which echoed throughout the dark citadel of B'aroz keep.

A hunched, abnormally formed figure appeared within the warp-fires. Hooded and cowering, the lesser daemon of Tzeentch approached his hulking new master.
'Lord Khrol', it gurgled. 'The light-purge is about to begin. The silver suits shall soon be bereft of all their power to harm my kind'.
'Master, what shall be done with them?'
The magnificently savage visage of Krohl was revealed to the slave daemon as the moon would eclipse the sun. Like aeons of dread condensed into a single place, and the crippled beast shuddered.
'They shall be symbols of the impending decay of mankind. Vessels that will be filled by champions from the very throne of khorne. A message to these 'Daemon hunters', that even they can fall.'
'A lie woven by the hand of Tzeentch, to be delivered by the hand of Khorne. A lie that shall see us take the material realm from the decaying tick that is the Imperium and all who will not submit to our terrible master.

Anything is possible if you want it to be

A - I love it.

B - I wish I could write like that. Enh, my own is good enough.

Brother-Captain-Rawr! wrote:ANYTHING is possible in fiction. can you just comprehend this? lol

Anything is possible for the authors of the setting. For the rest of us, if we want to stay within the boundaries of the fluff, we must have precedent. There is no precedent for Chaos Grey Knights, so your whole argument of "your imagination makes it happen!" is at best fanfic bullcrap. That's fine for 4chan, but no one else will take it remotely seriously... and that's saying something for a setting as silly as 40K.

But why would you go through the trouble of doing ALL that just to use the PA?

Grey Templar wrote:Horus actually didn't defeat the Emperor. it was the other way around.


Horus was completely annhilated. not even his soul escaped destruction.



all he did was cause grevious harm to the Emperor's body. the Emperor was unharmed on a psychic level. If anything, Horus destroying the Emperor's body gave the Emperor freedom to combat chaos on its own turf.

Horus defeated the Emperor, then hesitated before landing the final blow. Then the Emperor managed to kill him. And where does it say that the Emperor is battling the Chaos gods in the Warp? Because they never seem too bothered about him when they appear.

Durza wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:Horus actually didn't defeat the Emperor. it was the other way around.


Horus was completely annhilated. not even his soul escaped destruction.



all he did was cause grevious harm to the Emperor's body. the Emperor was unharmed on a psychic level. If anything, Horus destroying the Emperor's body gave the Emperor freedom to combat chaos on its own turf.

Horus defeated the Emperor, then hesitated before landing the final blow. Then the Emperor managed to kill him. And where does it say that the Emperor is battling the Chaos gods in the Warp? Because they never seem too bothered about him when they appear.

Horus wouldn't hesitate and has not done so.
It was a interfering loyalist that distracted him ( depends on the story if it was a guardsmen, custodian,etc ) and if we go with fluff as written, the emperor restrained himself from outright killing horus on sight and paid for that in wounds.

The emperor battling chaos is found in the rulebook and codex chaos demons.
Now, the "gods" of chaos aren't bothered since they never appear themselves and their minions always run away if confronted seriously.

The only way yo explain this is, some chaos gods or chaos worshipers thought GK armour looked cool and forged simmilar looking ones without all the wards and stuff.

Purely "looks like" a Gk armour.

Because like the above 500 posts You can't put a demon in a GK armour

Well you can, there's nothing to state that you can't. Like many people have said, it wouldn't look too much like Grey Knight armor, but if done well, it would look quite striking. And no, if you were to field that army then I can guarantee that you would get, "Cool man, nice army", rather than people refusing to play you. If that were to happen I would be VERY surprised.

No Chaos Grey Knights. Not for any fluff reason, just because it (along with female Marines) is an exceptionally tired idea that every 12 year old has to be SUPER COOL AND DIFFERENT.

Pouncey wrote:

Arm.chair.general wrote:Hi there, I was thinking about buying Grey Knights, but I wanted to fit them into a chaos theme. I was thinking that they could be Grey Knights that have fallen in battle on countless daemon worlds, as they struggle to keep the chaos at bay, and are re-animated by some crazy apocathery by entombing a daemon in their armour. The daemon uses the corpse in the armour, almost like a host body. The daemon feeds off the corpses flesh and soul, giving it energy to walk round in this massive hulking suit of ancient sacred battle plate. What do you think? Is the explanation good enough to explain Chaos Grey Knights?

I'm not huge on Grey Knights fluff, but I'm not one to judge. My Sisters of Battle Mission's backstory has them being turned against the Imperium - though not against the Emperor - by nano-machines used by a xenos psyker who they were sent to kill or capture during a war against Chaos on an Imperial world, because he'd been consorting with Chaos according to their information, when really he had been turning them too. Much cuddles were then had by all. ^^

Brother-Captain-Rawr! wrote:Take this for example:

'Lord Krohl gazed upon the delicious pain etched onto the faces of those about to be sacrificed to the blood god. All of them being worthy tributes in possession of exceptional martial prowess and unchained savagery to the extremes of the souls dark confines.'
'Blood for the blood god. Shall the warp well swell with the screams of the corpse-Emporers mewling puppets' he uttered in a whisper which echoed throughout the dark citadel of B'aroz keep.

A hunched, abnormally formed figure appeared within the warp-fires. Hooded and cowering, the lesser daemon of Tzeentch approached his hulking new master.
'Lord Khrol', it gurgled. 'The light-purge is about to begin. The silver suits shall soon be bereft of all their power to harm my kind'.
'Master, what shall be done with them?'
The magnificently savage visage of Krohl was revealed to the slave daemon as the moon would eclipse the sun. Like aeons of dread condensed into a single place, and the crippled beast shuddered.
'They shall be symbols of the impending decay of mankind. Vessels that will be filled by champions from the very throne of khorne. A message to these 'Daemon hunters', that even they can fall.'
'A lie woven by the hand of Tzeentch, to be delivered by the hand of Khorne. A lie that shall see us take the material realm from the decaying tick that is the Imperium and all who will not submit to our terrible master.

Anything is possible if you want it to be

A - I love it.

B - I wish I could write like that. Enh, my own is good enough.

Thanks pouncey Anyone can write like that if they want to. It's just that many of the posters above me NEED their rules and official fluff to get any kind of fun out of the game.

At the end of the day, this is a GAME and it's our right to be able to play how we want, create our own fluff (within reason) and even change stats and rules to our liking, so long as our opponent agrees.

Like the BRB states, "these rules are just guidelines'.

This outcry against Chaos GK is actually spurring me on to encourage everyone I can, to make their own Chaos GK lol. Me included