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The Monk wrote:

CpatTom wrote:The Emperor killed Horus, and Horus killed the Emperor. Pretty even on the combat ability.

There is a difference in what the Hours did to the Emperor and vise versa.
Horus's soul was utterly destroyed so the Big four could not bring him back as a Deamon.
The Emp was still alive when he left the battle barge and gave instructions verbally on how to bring the Golden Throne up to spec.

See definition: Life, Kill.

CpatTom wrote:

The Monk wrote:

CpatTom wrote:The Emperor killed Horus, and Horus killed the Emperor. Pretty even on the combat ability.

There is a difference in what the Hours did to the Emperor and vise versa.
Horus's soul was utterly destroyed so the Big four could not bring him back as a Deamon.
The Emp was still alive when he left the battle barge and gave instructions verbally on how to bring the Golden Throne up to spec.

See definition: Life, Kill.

You can get pedantic on the definitions of the word kill if you want. But..
As stated you must admit that what happened to each of the two combatants was vastly different. There for not "pretty even".

So although you can technically use one word with a generalised definition to describe the eventuall outcome. To argue the point of their similarties based on that one word is incorrect because what happened trancended the definition. By the clash trancending the material universe into the non-physical relm.

See definition: Context.

Ah, Horus is still winning And Magnus is in second!

The Monk wrote:

CpatTom wrote:

The Monk wrote:

CpatTom wrote:The Emperor killed Horus, and Horus killed the Emperor. Pretty even on the combat ability.

There is a difference in what the Hours did to the Emperor and vise versa.
Horus's soul was utterly destroyed so the Big four could not bring him back as a Deamon.
The Emp was still alive when he left the battle barge and gave instructions verbally on how to bring the Golden Throne up to spec.

See definition: Life, Kill.

You can get pedantic on the definitions of the word kill if you want. But..
As stated you must admit that what happened to each of the two combatants was vastly different. There for not "pretty even".

So although you can technically use one word with a generalised definition to describe the eventuall outcome. To argue the point of their similarties based on that one word is incorrect because what happened trancended the definition. By the clash trancending the material universe into the non-physical relm.

See definition: Context.

Horus has more KP's than the Emperor. Sanguinius and the Emperor. Horus wins.

Lol,

Hey at least I aggree with you on one point, Hours Was definatly the most powerfull Primarch IMHO even without his Chaos powers.

But Hours win's over the Emp, im sorry. thats just plain laughable.

Most powerful Primarch is Ghazghkull.
/thread.

KilroyKiljoy wrote:Most powerful Primarch is Ghazghkull.
/thread.

IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW.

Its all irrelevant anyhow, Draigo is more powerful than the Warp Undivided. The hate that seethes from the debate over his accomplishments as turned him into the most powerful being in the 40k Universe.

Why does everybody think Draigo is so powerful?

Ogryn wrote:Why does everybody think Draigo is so powerful?

Ignorance. Inability to read the fluff for themselves. Reliance on sources like 1d4chan and general Internet hyperbole. Irrational hatred of Mat Ward.

Haha, I also meant compared to a Primarch.

Well that's the reason. He's done things other characters have done in the past, and he's far more powerful than those. Dante beat Ka'bandha single handed, Hector Rex beat Ann'grath single handed, Thawn beat Ku'gath single handed, Draigo's beaten N'kari countless times, but I've never seen any of these complained about.

People like to make stupid arguments about why they are right.

iproxtaco wrote:Dante beat Ka'bandha single handed

Dante beat Skarbrand single handed, IIRC he never bested Ka'Bhanda.

Want to know what no one else has done though?

Walk into the realm of a Chaos God and turn it to ruin.

Draigo is considered extremely powerful because he is.

Nothing in the Warp has given him pause.

I can't actually think of anyone who has beaten a Greater Daemon in the Warp (Though it may of happened).

Horus is not the most powerful, The Emperor basically toyed with him till he killed him finally.


Leman Russ is, the toughest tank in the universe is named after him

or maybe Angron

DIDM wrote:Horus is not the most powerful, The Emperor basically toyed with him till he killed him finally.


Leman Russ is, the toughest tank in the universe is named after him

or maybe Angron

The part about the Emperor and his fight with Horus is so wrong it's funny.

Coolyo294 wrote:

DIDM wrote:Horus is not the most powerful, The Emperor basically toyed with him till he killed him finally.


Leman Russ is, the toughest tank in the universe is named after him

or maybe Angron

The part about the Emperor and his fight with Horus is so wrong it's funny.

is it really? Why didn't he just kill him instantly then? He didn't want to, and BASICALLY toyed with him, he didn't go all out and just destroy him.

maybe toyed isn't the greatest word, but when you don't go all out I see that as toying

Yes I'm sure the Emperor was definitely toying with Horus when Horus cut his chest open.

Or when Horus ripped his jugular out with a power claw.

Or when Horus burned the Emperor with lightning until one of the Emperor's eyes popped.

Or when Horus ripped one of the Emperor's arms off.

Or when Horus broke the wrist on his remaining arm, lifted him into the air, and snapped his spine over his knee.

The fluff dictates the Emperor needed his "full power" to defeat a Chaos Empowered Horus. Compare this to when the Emperor fought Leman Russ. The Emperor proceeded to toy with Russ, and when he wanted to end the fight, he ended it with one blow.

Leman Russ was also getting his ass kicked by Magnus for most of the fight, even though Magnus' full power was not brought to bare.

Oh, and Corax apparently thinks only Horus and maybe Sanguinius could best Angron in martial combat. Russ is not on that list. Though, Corax could be mistaken I admit.

Kurze - he was powerful enough to resist chaos, which even HORUS could not do. He even had the courage and bravery to allow the M'shen to kill him. Other than him, Mortarion or Alpharius/Omegon. Tricky Gits...
Sqallum

Dorn is the master of defense(forget perturabo), sanguinius and Corax had wings and they both were beast( though corax is better if you ask me) Vulcan was wise, Russ is just an animal.

Overall all the primarchs have there strengths so they could be equals.

Except Lorger he just sucks all round.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Seriously? Horus sucks, he fell to chaos so he was only strong enough because he had help from chaos and even with that he still got killed.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
By the Emperor!

Void__Dragon wrote:Yes I'm sure the Emperor was definitely toying with Horus when Horus cut his chest open.

Or when Horus ripped his jugular out with a power claw.

Or when Horus burned the Emperor with lightning until one of the Emperor's eyes popped.

Or when Horus ripped one of the Emperor's arms off.

Or when Horus broke the wrist on his remaining arm, lifted him into the air, and snapped his spine over his knee.

The fluff dictates the Emperor needed his "full power" to defeat a Chaos Empowered Horus. Compare this to when the Emperor fought Leman Russ. The Emperor proceeded to toy with Russ, and when he wanted to end the fight, he ended it with one blow.

Leman Russ was also getting his ass kicked by Magnus for most of the fight, even though Magnus' full power was not brought to bare.

Oh, and Corax apparently thinks only Horus and maybe Sanguinius could best Angron in martial combat. Russ is not on that list. Though, Corax could be mistaken I admit.

Hilarious.

Wasn't Russ a guardsmen at a point? Retconned into a primarch, or some such nonsense.

Yes, I have heard that. It is apparently the original reason for the naming of the tank; Russ was a renowned IG commander.

You forgot Bruce Campbell...



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Void__Dragon wrote:Yes, I have heard that. It is apparently the original reason for the naming of the tank; Russ was a renowned IG commander.

Wait, what? How did that happen?

Just verifying. I haven't been around the hobby long enough to have read any of that first hand. Thanks.

Void__Dragon wrote:Manus was pretty boss really.

He IMO might of been the most endurant Primarch, taking a massive Thunder Hammer (For lack of better term, was stronger) wielded by Fulgrim to the temple, and proceeded to nearly disembowel him.

Were it not for the Laer sword, Fulgrim would be dead.

In fairness to Fulgrim, he wasn't exactly in optimal condition when they fought, and regardless of the daemon, was unwilling to kill his brother. Manus, on the other hand, viewed Fulgrim as a brother no more. If both had brought their A-game, I'd say it would have been a fight to standstill if the daemon didn't intervene.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Void__Dragon wrote:Yes I'm sure the Emperor was definitely toying with Horus when Horus cut his chest open.

Or when Horus ripped his jugular out with a power claw.

Or when Horus burned the Emperor with lightning until one of the Emperor's eyes popped.

Or when Horus ripped one of the Emperor's arms off.

Or when Horus broke the wrist on his remaining arm, lifted him into the air, and snapped his spine over his knee.

The fluff dictates the Emperor needed his "full power" to defeat a Chaos Empowered Horus. Compare this to when the Emperor fought Leman Russ. The Emperor proceeded to toy with Russ, and when he wanted to end the fight, he ended it with one blow.

Leman Russ was also getting his ass kicked by Magnus for most of the fight, even though Magnus' full power was not brought to bare.

Oh, and Corax apparently thinks only Horus and maybe Sanguinius could best Angron in martial combat. Russ is not on that list. Though, Corax could be mistaken I admit.

One blow of a power fist to an unarmoured head. Not really fair... (well, it's described as powered gauntlet).

Durza wrote:In fairness to Fulgrim, he wasn't exactly in optimal condition when they fought, and regardless of the daemon, was unwilling to kill his brother. Manus, on the other hand, viewed Fulgrim as a brother no more. If both had brought their A-game, I'd say it would have been a fight to standstill if the daemon didn't intervene.

How was Fulgrim not in optimal condition? And he was very much fighting to kill his brother for the first part of the fight. One does not swing a massive thunder hammer at someone's temple without the intent to kill. Manus survived that blow due to his sheer toughness.

One blow of a power fist to an unarmoured head. Not really fair... (well, it's described as powered gauntlet).

He was also knocked out by a punch to the chin from the Lion as well.

Then of course there is Magnus, who punched a hole through Russ' chest.

Don't get me wrong, Leman Russ is by no means a wimp, and IMO would certainly be one of the stronger Primarchs in martial combat, but above Chaos Empowered Horus he certainly wasn't, not even close.

Leman Russ is probably my second vote. I mean, he is the Primarch of powerful drunks.

Before he had the backing of the Chaos gods Horus was declared the Warmaster and second in command to the Emperor, that alone suggests to me that in the Emperor's opinion Horus was the best Primarch. With the Chaos gods backing? I dont think there can really be any debate. Let's face it, he throttled Sanguinious to death before taking on the Emperor and narrowly failing in killing him! It's a shame because Rogal Dorn is my favourite - I think he was probably the most pure hearted of them all!

I cannot stand that that dumb Space Puppie is higher then Sabguinus

Sanguinius was the most pure, had the most psyking power and should have been warmaster, as he just wanted peace, unlike other Primarchs who wanted eternal war. Khorne loonies they are.

It is pretty simple who the best primarch is and that is curze for the simple fact is none of the others are as skilled in both combat speed and infiltration and being able to devastate whole planets from within the shadows is strong.