Sisters of Battle

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**Shandara**

I nearly always take Celestine and the Personal traits (hoping for a 6 in scoring missions of course) since I find they match the aggressive style you have to play her.

**Amerikon**

Shandara wrote:I nearly always take Celestine and the Personal traits (hoping for a 6 in scoring missions of course) since I find they match the aggressive style you have to play her.

This is what I've always done as well. I think mostly though, it's me being lazy. I know Personal has some goodies on it but I don't know the other tables well. I need to learn the other tables and figure out which situations merit which table.

Command is interesting for Celestine and I've pretty much just ignored it this whole time.

**Tagboard Wizard**

Is there a particular reason to pick Combi-weapons over Plasma pistols on our sister superiors? I started looking into converting Combi weapons and then did a quick glance over at Plasma pistols, only 5 extra points to have a permanent AP1 weapon on hand?

I understand 'gets hot' but up until I realized I had a sister with a plasma pistol, I figured they didn't have access. even if she pulls the trigger every turn, there is less then a 1/18 chance any one sister will die to the plasma... so Am i missing something here?

**pretre**

Tagboard Wizard wrote:Is there a particular reason to pick Combi-weapons over Plasma pistols on our sister superiors? I started looking into converting Combi weapons and then did a quick glance over at Plasma pistols, only 5 extra points to have a permanent AP1 weapon on hand?

I understand 'gets hot' but up until I realized I had a sister with a plasma pistol, I figured they didn't have access. even if she pulls the trigger every turn, there is less then a 1/18 chance any one sister will die to the plasma... so Am i missing something here?

Many reasons:
- Plasma is only AP2.
- It is not part of the holy trinity of Melta/Flamer/Bolter
- Gets Hot!
- More points
- Mid range utility. A combi-melta does the same thing better. (AP1, 1 more strength)
- How many times does your squad get to shoot multiple times?

I actually don't put combis on anyone but my doms nowadays.

**Tagboard Wizard**

Oh, lol, I thought they were all pistols!

I thought they were all combi-melta pistol, or whatev's. Ah, that does make a significant amount of more sense.

I figured that the flavor may have been a factor, but I honestly don't expect anyone to go follow the fluff any more then they have too when it comes to army building.

Thanks again for that speedy answer.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
So, would you recommend superior's getting just a bolter and forgetting the two cc weaponery? as it stands now, we're still pretty crappy in the hand to hand game and the extra attack is nice, but I would think that the sisters would get at least a couple shots off a game.

**pretre**

Nah, the Combis are Combi-Bolter and then whatever the other bit is.

Fluff is somewhat important in my decisions. I like to feel good when I put my army on the field. I balance my list decisions on efficacy and feel. Doesn't mean I can't make something work if I really want it to though.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tagboard Wizard wrote:So, would you recommend superior's getting just a bolter and forgetting the two cc weaponery? as it stands now, we're still pretty crappy in the hand to hand game and the extra attack is nice, but I would think that the sisters would get at least a couple shots off a game.

As dumb as it is, I go CCW/BP for my Sister Squad superiors and generally BP/Combi for my Dominion superiors. I like the models a lot better and the difference between bolter and CCW isn't that big a deal. The extra attack is entertaining sometimes.

From an efficacy standpoint, BP/Bolter or BP/Combi all the way. The difference is so small that I don't sweat it though.

**Amerikon**

pretre wrote:I actually don't put combis on anyone but my doms nowadays.

HERESY!

A combi-flamer is worth its points even if just for the Wall of Death.

**Tagboard Wizard**

Oh yeah, I s'pose that counts as your one shot huh? well, I wasn't planning on using the Combi-flamer for anything but Wall 'o Death anyway. Combi-Melta on the other hand....

**Amerikon**

Tagboard Wizard wrote:Oh yeah, I s'pose that counts as your one shot huh? well, I wasn't planning on using the Combi-flamer for anything but Wall 'o Death anyway. Combi-Melta on the other hand....

Combi-meltas can miss, just sayin'.

Ok, I'll go a little deeper here. Combi-weapons are very situational, so the one you want depends on how you plan to use the unit. I think like Pretre wrote it's an absolute no-brainer to combi your Dominions, so what about the regular Battle Sisters?

In the old days, I'd go with a combi-melta basically for "Dreadnought insurance". With the new rules, I can't imagine not putting a combi-flamer on my VSS. You're going to use it, either because you got there first and got to shoot, or because they charged you. Two flamers can actually have an effect against enemy charges. If you get charged with a combi-melta, you can pray for that 6, but good luck. If, for some reason, you don't get to shoot it, then your girls probably didn't see much action which is a good thing.

**Evil Lamp 6**

Tagboard Wizard wrote:Is there a particular reason to pick Combi-weapons over Plasma pistols on our sister superiors? I started looking into converting Combi weapons and then did a quick glance over at Plasma pistols, only 5 extra points to have a permanent AP1 weapon on hand?

I understand 'gets hot' but up until I realized I had a sister with a plasma pistol, I figured they didn't have access. even if she pulls the trigger every turn, there is less then a 1/18 chance any one sister will die to the plasma... so Am i missing something here?

I was in a similar way of thinking about 3 years ago re Combi-weapons. Since then, I've learned much. As has been said, you will probably get only one good round of shooting in with either a Combi-weapon or a pistol (well two now with the change to Rapid Fire if you have a Bolter/Combi). I almost always take a Combi-weapon on all my Sisters Superior that can. I find that getting that 3rd or "extra" shot is often critical to getting the desired result (either an additional hit/pen against a vehicle or 5+ more hits/wounds with a Combi-Flamer). And also as stated, Plasma is not part of the holy trinity of bolter/melta/flamer. That matters to me. Granted I still have some models with Plasma Pistols or Combi-Plasma, but I really haven't used them much. Now Plasma for my IG on the other hand...

Edited to add: Worse comes to worse, if you take a Combi-weapon, you still have a Bolter no matter what that can move and shoot out to 24". You can't say the same for a Pistol. And as mentioned, Combi-weapons are cheaper points-wise.

**pzbw7z**

Some of the original SoB models had plasma weapons - still do, since they're nearly all available. Plasma guns and pistols were available to any model that could buy wargear in the original codex. I'm pretty sure the knuckleheads on Yahoo! Battle-Sisters made up that crap about the weapon trinity during the play testing for Codex:Witch Hunters.

That said, plasma doesn't blow up tanks or fry infantry in quantity; combi's are preferable because they do those thing. Plasma is for MEQ and TEQ hunting and one shot doesn't make the unit suitable for that business. The pistol's just overpriced. I used to play a couple but those models were made for third edition when plasma was king.

**cygnnus**

pzbw7z wrote:Some of the original SoB models had plasma weapons - still do, since they're nearly all available. Plasma guns and pistols were available to any model that could buy wargear in the original codex. I'm pretty sure the knuckleheads on Yahoo! Battle-Sisters made up that crap about the weapon trinity during the play testing for Codex:Witch Hunters.

That said, plasma doesn't blow up tanks or fry infantry in quantity; combi's are preferable because they do those thing. Plasma is for MEQ and TEQ hunting and one shot doesn't make the unit suitable for that business. The pistol's just overpriced. I used to play a couple but those models were made for third edition when plasma was king.

"knuckleheads"?!?!?!

Valete,

JohnS

**pzbw7z**

cygnnus wrote:
pzbw7z wrote:Some of the original SoB models had plasma weapons - still do, since they're nearly all available. Plasma guns and pistols were available to any model that could buy wargear in the original codex. I'm pretty sure the knuckleheads on Yahoo! Battle-Sisters made up that crap about the weapon trinity during the play testing for Codex:Witch Hunters.

That said, plasma doesn't blow up tanks or fry infantry in quantity; combi's are preferable because they do those thing. Plasma is for MEQ and TEQ hunting and one shot doesn't make the unit suitable for that business. The pistol's just overpriced. I used to play a couple but those models were made for third edition when plasma was king.

"knuckleheads"?!?!?!

Valete,

JohnS

It's meant affectionately as I'm one of the knuckleheads. In fact, I was a moderator at the time. The weapon "trinity" was and is crap; that's not meant affectionately.

**pretre**

My sob have always used the holy trinity and they predate c:WH by a four or five years.

**KalashnikovMarine**

The theory that things exist in the game universe that excessive amounts of holy promethium or full auto micro RPG launchers aren't the best possible solution for killing is the foulest possible kind of heresy.

**pretre**

Exactly.

**Gar'Ang**

*draws a deep breath* ahh, I love the smell of fluff in the morning!

I usually go fluffwise whatever army I play! That's why my future Daemons army (Holy Emperor forgive for I have sinned but it will not fight your holy armies, only the races of ages past) who is mainly Tzeentch doesn't include ANY Nurgle, for Tzeentch and Nurgle kinda hate eachother

**pzbw7z**

pretre wrote:My sob have always used the holy trinity and they predate c:WH by a four or five years.

So, no Exorcist for you then. Right.

**pretre**

pzbw7z wrote:
pretre wrote:My sob have always used the holy trinity and they predate c:WH by a four or five years.

So, no Exorcist for you then. Right.

I started without it, so yeah. I added two during C: Chapter Approved and recently updated them to the actual model (previously using scratchbuild based on old rhino chassis) with the new WD Codex. You're trying to say something completely different than what I was. You were trying to make out the whole concept of Holy Trinity to be an invention of the C:WH playtesters, which is not true. Although there have been a few models with plasma weapons going back into SoB history, the vast majority of weapons have been from the Melta/Bolter/Flamer families. The only ones that I remember (I could be wrong here since I'm just spitballing) being plasma were the Vet Seraph Sup's Plasma pistol and the missionary with plasma gun from the old range. Any others were added during the C:WH years.

(Aha, went to the SOLegends 1998 catalog, link HERE and I am correct. THere were two models with plasma at that point and no new models were made until the C:WH years. One of them wasn't even a sister, but a missionary.)

Automatically Appended Next Post:
The 2004-2005 catalog shows a preview for C:WH which , as we know, added a Vet Sup with PP, a Vet Seraph Sup with PP/CS and a limited edition Inquisitor with PP. We also got access to the Plasma Cannon and Plasmagun through use of Warrior Henchmen (Servitors and normal Warriors). So basically, we had a total of 3 sisters models with Plasma pistols with one existing previous to the 2004/2005 C:WH update. I would hardly count that as part of our traditional armament. Even the Exorcist predates that by something like 4 years.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wow. While trying to find a source for the trinity comment, I found a hilarious post from 1999.

Please read this and tell me what you all think, and I hope that if
and when GW releases plastic Sisters, there will be greater
possibilities to use these ideas.
According to the army lists, Sisters of Battle, have a preference
for flamers and meltas, "to erradicate their opponents utterly."

Based on this , I find it suprising that only the Cannoness and
the Veteran Sister Superiors can select a plasma pistol from their
Weapons List, and that no heavier plasma weapons are availible to the
Adeptus Sororitas chapters.

I thus propose this humble suggestion, that the following
adjustments to the Sister's Army List be considered. Obviously, I am
planning on suggesting this to GW, since the Codex:Sisters of Battle
apparently won't come out until after all of the thousands of Marine
Chapters have individual Codexes, not to mention the other Codexes.
That should give them plenty of time to determine if these ideas work,
heh heh.

Thus, my stated goal is to get the following minor changes
"Chapter Approved" and any suggestions or comments are appreciated.

First, the Sisters of Battle Weapons List needs this line added:
Combi-weapons:
Bolter-plasmagun................+25 points

Next, the Options sections for Celestian Squads and Sisters
Squads needs to be retyped like so:

Options:
Up to one model may be armed with one of the following
weapons: flamer at +3 points, plasma gun at +6 points, or meltagun at
+10 points.
Up to one model may be armed with: heavy bolter at +10
points, heavy flamer at +15 points, multi-melta at +25 points, or a
plasma cannon at +35 points.

Likewise, the Retributor Squad entry should read:

Options: Up to four Battle Sisters may be armed with the following:
Heavy bolter at +10 points, heavy flamer at +15 points, multi-melta at
+25 points, or a plasma cannon at +35 points.

Lastly, under Heavy Support, I propose an additional Rhino
variant:

Redeemer Points:70 FA:11 SA:11 RA:10 BS:3

A powerful support variation on the Immolator, the Redeemer
replaces the awesome Inferno cannon (twin linked heavy flamers) with
powerful linked plasma cannons, for long-range fire support and
anti-vehicle work.

Type: Tank (note that the Redeemer is not considered open topped, as
the Battle Sisters crewing it are wearing powered armour.)

Crew: Battle Sisters

Weapons: The Redeemer is armed with linked plasma cannons.

Transport: The Redeemer can carry up to six Battle Sisters.

Note: Any unit that can be mounted in an Immolator can be mounted in
a Redeemer instead, for the same points cost.

If you're still reading, thanks for your time, let me know if
you think it was well spent. =)
Also, I am planning on building a Redeemer here shortly, it
will be my first signifigant conversion, but I need a source for the
plasma cannons, and any suggestions are welcome.

"By the manner of their death we shall know them."

Note that he references plastic sisters here. In 1999. Wow, so we've been waiting for it for even longer than I thought (first time I heard of it was around 2001). He also references the sister's preference for melta/flamer and tries to suggest plasma be added to that.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Link: https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en&fromgroups#!topic/rec.games.miniatures.warhammer/GITAg9sotEQ%5B1-25%5D

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another post from 1999, re: wishlisting a SoB codex:
Here

I agree there needs to be some changes/additions to the Sisters army
list, however I feel psykers and plasma weapons don't fit. In the 2nd
ed. having a psyker in the army negatively affected the battle rites,
remember, the Ecclesiarchy frowns on mutant psykers. The basis of the
army is to be the cleansing fire of the Imperium, so flamers and
melta-weapons are first choice, plasma weapons which use electrical
energy don't seem right. Its like asking a space marine to use a lasgun.
Also If any weapon system today malfunctioned one out of every six times
I guarantee NOBODY would want to use it.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Man, I love google groups searches.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Last one and I'm headed home for the night:

I then inspected
the Battle squads, three groups of six sisters, I had one of each of the
heavy weapons the mechanicus has ordained we are allowed, MultiMelta, Heavy
Bolter, and Heavy Flamer, and decided it prudent to use all three today.

Battle Report from 1998:
https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en&fromgroups#!topic/rec.games.miniatures.warhammer/jpJwgvS3G4U%5B1-25%5D

**Tagboard Wizard**

wow, a lot of fluff history in one post. I always wondered why the Holy (Weapon) Trinity existed...

[: Edit :]

Holy crap, I was just reading our allies options. Why, of all the chapters available, are Black Templar consider Desperate allies?! I thought the Inquisition and Space Wolves had beef with each other, but we can be allies of convenience? Why do we consider Dark Eldar Desperate Allies as well?! I can't think of one reason we would align with Eldar, let alone chaos Eldar... And we can align with the IG as battle brothers, but not Grey Knights?

I'm starting to get the impression that who ever wrote that chart forgot what the colors meant at the very end.

**KalashnikovMarine**

We can't take Grey Knight allies cause they have a thing about using SoBs as armor paint.

You'd think the Black Templars and the Sisters would get along just dandy though. "You like burning heretics to death? I like cutting them up with swords! ....hmmm I have an idea FIREY SWORDS!"

**Tagboard Wizard**

What? I seem to recall the sisters only being allowed psykers from the Grey knights as allies on the basis that they trusted the Grey Knights, ala 'The Inquisition is one big happy family!' thing.

and I also seem to recall the Black Templar having a long and Happy history with the Inquisition, Particularly the Witch hunters and by extension the SoB.

**Amerikon**

pretre wrote:Battle Report from 1998:
https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en&fromgroups#!topic/rec.games.miniatures.warhammer/jpJwgvS3G4U%5B1-25%5D

LOL. Hit/Misfire on the LRBT's Battle Cannon. Good 'ol 2nd edition!

**KalashnikovMarine**

Tagboard Wizard wrote:What? I seem to recall the sisters only being allowed psykers from the Grey knights as allies on the basis that they trusted the Grey Knights, ala 'The Inquisition is one big happy family!' thing.

and I also seem to recall the Black Templar having a long and Happy history with the Inquisition, Particularly the Witch hunters and by extension the SoB.

Google "Bloodtide" or "Khornate Knights" for a full explanation. But the short version is in the Grey Knights codex there's a story in which a unit of Grey Knights slaughter a convent of Sisters of Battle and paint their armor with their blood to help ward them against Chaos(tm) and in particular a rather nasty daemon residing on the same world as the convent.

I don't think that's the actual explanation for the allies set up with the GKs but it fits my personal fluff after that mess

**pretre**

Lemme just leave this here:

Rumored Release in late 2013:

- Sisters of Battle Canoness with Power Axe
- Sisters of Battle Seraphim / Patronica Squad
- Sisters of Battle Battle Sisters
- Sisters of Battle Exorcist / Catafalque of Sins
- Sisters of Battle Prioress Lazarea Verata
- Sisters of Battle Sister Superior Magdalenia
- Sisters of Battle Repentia Squad

**Voldrak**

Where are you getting those rumors from Pretre?

**pretre**

Thread over in N&R. Lemme get a link.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/468955.page

**Kris Knives**

pretre wrote:Lemme just leave this here:

Rumored Release in late 2013:

- Sisters of Battle Canoness with Power Axe
- Sisters of Battle Seraphim / Patronica Squad
- Sisters of Battle Battle Sisters
- Sisters of Battle Exorcist / Catafalque of Sins
- Sisters of Battle Prioress Lazarea Verata
- Sisters of Battle Sister Superior Magdalenia
- Sisters of Battle Repentia Squad

Oooooh how I hope this is true.

**KalashnikovMarine**

Those are named SCs.... that would seem to imply a /codex/ now wouldn't it.

**pretre**

/shrug

It could be a WD update as well. Add in two SC, Patronica and Catalfalque. That's less than the C:CD update.

I would love me a new codex though.