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Will probably make up an army list for my Iron Warriors here later on, but first I would like to ask how the Hell talons bombs work. It says that you may replace the incendiary bombs with a single warp bomb. Does that mean you may only bomb once the whole game?

Thanks, that would be appreciated. But yes, the Warp Bomb can only be used once due to its power, it should say so in the bombing run entry, however I will also edit its wargear entry to say 'one use'.

Oh I understood that, I just wondered if you lose the incendiary bombs completely if you take a warp bomb (as it says "replace").

Yeah, you do. This is once again to balance out the power of the warpbombs.

I'll try to make a variety of TAC lists based on a few Legions when I get home, to see how powerful a fluffy list can be. Then I'll do my damnedest to make a WAAC list. (Not something I'm good at).

That'll be great thanks Crazy! I'll do the same with the WAAC so don't worry and I'd like to think that I can manage that quite well. I think...

I've always been better at making awful, awful ideas work.


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Like 3rd ed. pure GK Daemonhunters; what a laugh. I'd always blow up every vehicle and decimate my friends in CC whenever I could.

Well, uhhh... some people just have a natural talent, eh Psycho?


Anyways, here's one of the more WAAC lists I can make I think

--HQ--

- Daemon Prince - Mark of the Night Lords - 210pts
Wings, Warptime

- Daemon Prince - Mark of the Night Lords - 210pts
Wings, Warptime

--Elites--

5 Chosen Chaos Space Marines - 175pts
4 Meltaguns, Rhino (Tank Hunters)

5 Chosen Chaos Space Marines - 175pts
4 Meltaguns, Rhino (Tank Hunters)

--Troops--

5 Chaos Space Marines - 125pts
Meltagun, Aspiring Champion w/ combi-melta, rhino

5 Chaos Space Marines - 125pts
Meltagun, Aspiring Champion w/ combi-melta, rhino

5 Chaos Space Marines - 120pts
Flamer, Aspiring Champion w/ combi-flamer, rhino

5 Chaos Space Marines - 120pts
Flamer, Aspiring Champion w/ combi-flamer, rhino

--Heavy Support--

Predator - 120pts
Autocannon Turret, Lascannon Sponsons

Predator - 120pts
Autocannon Turret, Lascannon Sponsons


1500pts

Not really fluffy, but I'd reckon pretty damn competitive. 2 Daemon Princes, 8 vehicles, 11 meltaguns. I'd say it's very competitive actually, unreasonably so or is this no worse than Razorspam?

i worry about this lists capability to cope with swarms

Teleporting Terminators is the answer to everything!

Still working on the army, but I thought I could give a little bit of critique on the writing: I have a bit of an issue with the way some of the Legion rules are written, primarily with the Death Guard, Emperor's Children, World Eaters and Thousand Sons. The way it's stated makes me immediately feel like I can take ANY cult unit, and then I'm informed that I can't. I'll give you an example of how I'd word it:

Icon of the Emperor’s Children
 0-1 Limit on Cult Units removed, but you may not select units with a Mark of Nurgle, Mark of Khorne or Mark of Tzeentch, such as Khorne Bezerkers or Plague Marines.
 May not give units any Mark other than the Mark of Slaanesh.

Instead of:
Icon of the Emperor’s Children
 0-1 Limit on Cult Units removed.
 May not select units with a Mark of Nurgle, Mark of Khorne or Mark of Tzeentch.

More wordy, yes, but it seems clearer (at least to me).


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Alright, I got me an army list going. It's fluffy with a lot of thought and about an hour of work behind it. Tell me what you think:

HQ:
Kharn, the Betrayer - 180 points

ELITES:
5 Terminators in a Land Raider-- Reaper Autocannon, Power Fist, Chain Fist, Pair of Lightning Claws - 440 points

5 Terminators in a Land Raider-- Reaper Autocannon, Power Fist, Chain Fist, Pair of Lightning Claws - 440 points

5 Terminators in a Land Raider-- Reaper Autocannon, Power Fist, Chain Fist, Pair of Lightning Claws - 440 points

TROOPS:
8 Khorne Bezerkers in a Rhino with a Twin-linked Bolter-- Two plasma pistols, Skull Champion w/Gift of the Gods, Plasma Pistol and Power Weapon. - 246 points

8 Khorne Bezerkers in a Rhino with a Twin-linked Bolter-- Two plasma pistols, Skull Champion w/Gift of the Gods, Plasma Pistol and Power Weapon. - 246 points

8 Khorne Bezerkers in a Rhino with a Twin-linked Bolter-- Two plasma pistols, Skull Champion w/Gift of the Gods, Plasma Pistol and Power Weapon. - 246 points

FAST ATTACK:
10 Raptors-- Two Flamers, one Aspiring Champion w/Melta bombs and Plasma Pistol - 205 points

HEAVY SUPPORT:
Chaos Predator-- Twin Linked Lascannon, Sponson Lascannons - 150 points

Chaos Predator-- Twin Linked Lascannon, Sponson Lascannons - 150 points

Chaos Predator-- Twin Linked Lascannon, Sponson Lascannons - 150 points



2453 points total, intended for a 2500 point game, with a bit of room for equipment upgrades.

The plan is very simple: Land Raiders behind Rhinos and Predators on the flanks. Once in range, unload, charge, fire, whatever. Ram with the Rhinos once that's done, Maim Kill Burn, Maim Kill Burn. I'm not sure if I brought enough Close Combat troops, but I think it's well balanced and could take on a lot of armies.

An Iron Warrior army, based on what models I have or soon will have:

HQ
Aaron
Daemon Prince - 160
Icon of the Iron Warriors - free
Daemon Weapon - 55
Warptime - 25
Chaos Armour - 25
Total - 265

Garnok the Technomancer
Sorcerer - 110
Icon of the Iron Warriors - free
Warsmith - 30
Mark of Slaanesh - 5
Doombolt, Lash of Submission - free
Total - 145

Elites
Chaos Terminators - 90
3 additional - 90
Mark of Khorne - 20
Champion - 10
(With Twin Lightning Claws - 10)
Power Fist, Combi-plasma - 15
Power Maul, Combi-flamer - 10
Chain Fist, Combi-melta - 20
Reaper Autocannon - 20
Total - 285

Troops
Chaos Space Marines - 75
5 additional - 75
Aspiring Champion - 10
(With Plasma Pistol and Power Fist - 35)
Meltagun - 10
Mark of Chaos Undivided - 10
Rhino - 35
Havoc Launcher - 15
Total: 265

Chaos Space Marines - 75
5 additional - 75
Warp Cannon - 20
Grenade Launcher - 15
Total - 185

Heavy Support
Chaos Vindicator - 115
Siege Shield - 10
Combi-grenade launcher - 10
Total - 135

2 Obliterators - 160

Defiler - 145
Warp Cannon - 10
Dreadnought CCW - free
Total - 155

Total: 1495

Note then that this is not really a that tactical list but what I think seem funny, and fluffy for IW:s.

I noted however that the pdf doesn't include the rules for Siege shields, but I assume that is that the vehicle ignores terrain altogether?

Somewhat fluffy IW list
Should be about 1,5k

Sorcerer w/Mark of IW
Vision of Chaos+Doombolt

2x Dreadnoughts w/DCCW+ML

3xFull CSM squads with meltas and Icon of chaos all in rhinos

2xFull squads of heretics with flamers(one squad has Champion with Combi-weapon)

2xDefilers

crazypsyko666 wrote:Teleporting Terminators is the answer to everything!

Still working on the army, but I thought I could give a little bit of critique on the writing: I have a bit of an issue with the way some of the Legion rules are written, primarily with the Death Guard, Emperor's Children, World Eaters and Thousand Sons. The way it's stated makes me immediately feel like I can take ANY cult unit, and then I'm informed that I can't. I'll give you an example of how I'd word it:

Icon of the Emperor’s Children
 0-1 Limit on Cult Units removed, but you may not select units with a Mark of Nurgle, Mark of Khorne or Mark of Tzeentch, such as Khorne Bezerkers or Plague Marines.
 May not give units any Mark other than the Mark of Slaanesh.

Thanks for the input Psyko, I always appreciate it!

Well, my reasoning was that if you can't take anything with a MoT/MoN/MoK then you can select as wargear either as your model would become invalid. I will make it a bit clearer with an example like you mentioned however, but I expect I'll largely keep the wording as it is (and it does still allow Chaos Undivided Marks)...
Thanks man!



Thanks again for the example lists guys, it's giving me a lot to think about. It's nice to see gift of the gods being taken (Psycho) as that's possibly my favourite piece of wargear.

Saint, I apologise but I don't have it as allowing Sorcerers to take Warsmith/Legion special rules for any warband other than the TS, I may change this in retrospect however. Also remember that meltaguns are free for Iron Warriors CSM's, so you can cut down points off your 1st CSM squad.

Thanks again for the feedback guys, I may increase the Dreadnought pts by 5pts however...

Working on a Thousand Sons army, and I've got another suggestion, this time regarding format. Wouldn't it be faster for page skimming if the Dedicated Transport section was placed between the Troops and Fast Attack Sections? This way readers don't have to skip through all of the tanks to get to the transport rules and upgrades. It would even be a little better if it was before the Heavy support section, because all but one unit that may take transports is ahead of that section.

Another thing: looking at the Sorcerer's Warcoven, what is this 'bonus' to psychic tests the sorcerer's coven special ability confers?

Oh, darn it. I'll just skip the Warsmith, then. I suppose they are mainly useful with a havoc squad, really. But I still wonder what the Siege shield does.

Have it this way, then:

HQ
Aaron
Daemon Prince - 160
Icon of the Iron Warriors - free
Daemon Weapon - 55
Wings - 25
Warptime - 25
Chaos Armour - 25
Total - 290

Garnok the Technomancer
Sorcerer - 110
Icon of the Iron Warriors - free
Mark of Slaanesh - 5
Doombolt, Lash of Submission - free
Total - 115

Elites
Chaos Terminators - 90
3 additional - 90
Mark of Khorne - 20
Champion - 10
(With Twin Lightning Claws - 10)
Power Fist, Combi-plasma - 15
Power Maul, Combi-flamer - 10
Chain Fist, Combi-melta - 20
Reaper Autocannon - 20
Total - 285

Troops
Chaos Space Marines - 75
5 additional - 75
Aspiring Champion - 10
(With Plasma Pistol and Power Fist - 35)
Meltagun - free
Mark of Chaos Undivided - 10
Rhino - 35
Havoc Launcher - 15
Extra Armour - 15
Total: 270

Chaos Space Marines - 75
5 additional - 75
Warp Cannon - 20
Grenade Launcher - 15
Total - 185

Heavy Support
Chaos Vindicator - 115
Siege Shield - 10
Combi-grenade launcher - 10
Total - 135

2 Obliterators - 160

Defiler - 145
Warp Cannon - 10
Dreadnought CCW - free
Total - 155

Total: 1495

Honestly, you know what's annoying me? How little feedback/views this has got. Chaos players are clearly unhappy with their Codex and I often see them wanting a suitable fandex in the least, and since I've posted the full PDF up I've had what... 8 people comment out of 60+ downloads and this thread has possibly the worst view-to-comment ratio out of any large thread on this board. *grumble*
Anyways, with that 'rant' of sorts out of the way...

-----

Sorry Saint, I'll be sure to include the Siege Shield in the PDF's next update, it should ignore all difficult terrain IIRC though; exactly the same as the loyalist siege shields. I'd actually argue the Warsmith to be more helpful with weapons that can scatter thanks to his BS6?

Oooh, I look forward to this TS list thanks Psyko; the bonus is basically a +1 modifier for each Sorcerer in the unit to any enemy psychic test within 18"(?), I'll try to clarify this in the PDF; good point.
I wasn't sure about the dedicated transport placement; in recent codices it seems to place it/them at the end of the army list, but I think I will place it in the middle as you suggested for ease of reference.

Thanks again guys, I appreciate your feedback. Cheers!

Macok wrote:There is just one thing I especially didn't like. There is too much of the stuff in here.
There are 9 warbands. Numerous special rules. 7 Specials, 4 HQs, 7 Elites, 8 Troops, 4FA and 12(!) HS and a rhino. PLUS 10 daemon units. That is almost double the amount what the other codex (plural codex?) have. This is an incredible long wall of text. While having many options is good I think you went a little over the top here.

You are right, but i disagree that it is a bad thing. C:CSM is essentially charged with covering rules for 4 legions, plus undivided heretic legions, plus "renegades", plus demons of all ilks, and the list goes on... It is a big undertaking. Partly why GW has failed so many times with it.

To be fair, I have cut it down since then, but yes, it is, as you pointed out, a squeeze to cover Chaos. However, let me put it like this if this is still a concern to anyone. I'm not saying this because I'm necessarily right, it just add some perspective I hope:

Codex Space Marines:
HQ - 15 (+2)
Elites - 8
Troops - 2 (+1)
Fast Attack - 7
Heavy Support - 9
Dedicated Transports - 3
Total - 44(+3)

My CSM Codex:
HQ - 11(+1)
Elites - 7 (1 exclusive)
Troops - 7 (1 exclusive)(+1)
Fast Attack - 4
Heavy Support - 8
Dedicated Transports - 1
Total - 38 (+2)

Just Dave wrote:Honestly, you know what's annoying me? How little feedback/views this has got. Chaos players are clearly unhappy with their Codex and I often see them wanting a suitable fandex in the least, and since I've posted the full PDF up I've had what... 8 people comment out of 60+ downloads and this thread has possibly the worst view-to-comment ratio out of any large thread on this board. *grumble*
Anyways, with that 'rant' of sorts out of the way...

I was at first hesatant to post here as well, a new codex for an army like csm's was initially not my cup of tea, im the first to admit that there are things that i would like changed about the current csm's but...... idk its like trying to fix something that isnt broken for me, i still win consistantly with the current dex and yeah... anyway i like the new one


oh and some feedback on the list i posted would be nice, or even an acknolegement, not fun to be ignored sos

Hopefully this message will become my Thousand Sons army list soon, but I thought I should mention the names of the daemonic gifts in the wargear section doesn't always match up to what it says in the unit profiles. I can still figure it out, (like Daemonic Mutation and Chaos Mutation) but it should be fixed.


Here it is: Surprisingly easy to make, really. Doombolt and Bolt of change are extremely powerful abilities, one can eat through infantry and the other through tanks. With so many free psychic powers, the choices are really obvious and easy. Flat out to the front, get out behind a screen of Rhinos, shoot everything to death, rinse repeat. SAFH, at your service.

HQ:
Daemon Prince-- Wings, Mark of Tzeentch, Doombolt, Bolt of Change, Icon of the Thousand Sons, Sorcerer Lord - 245


ELITES:
9 Sorcerer's Warcoven in a Rhino-- 2 Force Weapons, 6 Doombolt and 3 Bolt of Change - 405

9 Sorcerer's Warcoven in a Rhino-- 2 Force Weapons, 6 Doombolt and 3 Bolt of Change - 405

9 Sorcerer's Warcoven in a Rhino-- 2 Force Weapons, 6 Doombolt and 3 Bolt of Change - 405


TROOPS:
8 Rubric Marines in a Rhino-- 1 Aspiring Sorcerer (free) w/Force Weapon and Doombolt - 252

8 Rubric Marines in a Rhino-- 1 Aspiring Sorcerer (free) w/Force Weapon and Doombolt - 252

8 Rubric Marines in a Rhino-- 1 Aspiring Sorcerer (free) w/Force Weapon and Doombolt - 252

8 Rubric Marines in a Rhino-- 1 Aspiring Sorcerer (free) w/Force Weapon and Doombolt - 252

2468 points total.

@ JustDave
I found a few impressive wargear combinations that might need another one over regarding balance.

Shadow Lord + Daemonic Visage + Vision of Chaos

Terminator Champions + MoK + Twin lightning Claws + Daemonic Mutation + Warlord = 8 attacks per model.

Dreadnaught + Plasma Cannon + ML + Havoc Launcher + Chaos Theory = 5-7 template blasts per turn (9-11 during fire frenzy).


Can you also make it clear in the codex whether Fire Frenzy affects psychic shooting attacks? This seems like something that could be abused with chaos theory.

You also need to make it clear if a HQ with bike receives the” hit and run over” rule. At the moment it looks like he doesn’t and I’m not sure if this was on purpose or not.



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I’ve also noticed that unmarked Daemon Princes with a daemon weapon can achieve strength 8 (9 including unholy might).

Just Dave wrote:
But yes, stealing thunder from Daemon Players is an issue I want to avoid.

Don't be afraid, nearly 80% of Deamons Players where allready CSM players.

Plus Deamon codex is the worst possible codex that as ever seen the daylight...

Deamons, as Grey Knights should have stayed a bonus unit in their respectif ally's dexes, i mean its like giving Ratlings or Ogryns or even Snots their own Dex...

I'd rather see in the futur CSM dex, the Deamons as they are, i mean Bloodletters, Hounds, Juggers and my BT,along side my World Eaters, without the need to fill 2 FOC or play Apoc.

A solution would be to limit their numbers by the amount of Cult Units you have.

Example you can't take 4 units of Bloodletters if you only have 2 Zerkers squads in your FOC, you have 2 Zerkers squads?,then you can take 2 BL units or a Bloodletter unit+ a Bloodthirster or Prince or Flesh Hounds or whatever.

Someone mentioned that the Warbands rules wasn't that good and they where too restrictif if someone wanted to play other things alongside.

Personnaly i have 8k points of Zerkers, and nothing but Zerkers and Bloodletters.

Just Add the Undivided Glory rule where a Universal Chaos marked HQ permits you to take a squad of each Cult troops, but they count as Elite.

Also why isn't there any Gods specific wargear for their Cult Troops?, where's the Plaque Swords, Khorne's Axe and Collars?, where's the Banner of Rage or the Pandemic Totem?

For the rest i really like what you did.

If i may add a suggestion; latlely we see more and more characters/units with special ability's that arn't Psychic ones, namely the BrotherHood Champ GK with his Ultimae Warrior rule, or the DE Incubis with their special attacks.

Most of the time Khorne oriented HQ's get the short stick,where they have no powers and just gain an extra attack...

Why not give them the choice between various battle stances or special attacks?, you can only pick one for xxpts but you would have the choice to customize a bit more your HQ's to match your playstyle.

Slayer le boucher wrote:
Plus Deamon codex is the worst possible codex that as ever seen the daylight...

Umm, what?

This is awesome, I'll have to get my Chaos-playing friend to try this out sometime!

Andilus Greatsword wrote:This is awesome, I'll have to get my Chaos-playing friend to try this out sometime!

Thank you very much! If he does, then please tell me the results if that's possible? Cheers!

Tyranic Marta wrote:I was at first hesatant to post here as well, a new codex for an army like csm's was initially not my cup of tea, im the first to admit that there are things that i would like changed about the current csm's but...... idk its like trying to fix something that isnt broken for me, i still win consistantly with the current dex and yeah... anyway i like the new one


oh and some feedback on the list i posted would be nice, or even an acknolegement, not fun to be ignored sos

I apologise if you felt... 'neglected', I've constantly repeated my thanks to the supporters of this thread and I did say "Thanks also for the list Marta! That's exactly the kind of thing I'd like people to post right now". I apologise however, I don't really intend to provide competitive feedback on the lists, I could if you really desire, however my requests for the lists is so I can see what can be taken and check balance etc.
But yes, some people like the Chaos Codex, however most veterans do not and it is getting towards its time for an update in some opinions. Was an enjoyable exercise for me at least.

crazypsyko666 wrote:Hopefully this message will become my Thousand Sons army list soon, but I thought I should mention the names of the daemonic gifts in the wargear section doesn't always match up to what it says in the unit profiles. I can still figure it out, (like Daemonic Mutation and Chaos Mutation) but it should be fixed.


Here it is: Surprisingly easy to make, really. Doombolt and Bolt of change are extremely powerful abilities, one can eat through infantry and the other through tanks. With so many free psychic powers, the choices are really obvious and easy. Flat out to the front, get out behind a screen of Rhinos, shoot everything to death, rinse repeat. SAFH, at your service.

Thanks Psyko! I'll be sure to check out the naming inconsistencies; much appreciated!
Thanks for the list, though I'm not sure how SAFH you'd find the TS to be honest; you are still relying on AV11 transports, vulnerable to PotW and short-ranged, hopefully these are adequate balancing factors?

candy.man wrote:@ JustDave
I found a few impressive wargear combinations that might need another one over regarding balance.

Shadow Lord + Daemonic Visage + Vision of Chaos

Would you say it's balanced in that a Chaos Sorcerer cannot get Shadow Lord, whilst Vision of Chaos only affects psykers. I agree, Daemonic Visage & Shadow Lord could potentially be [over?]powerful, but is it unreasonably so and a bad thing to encourage combinations?

Terminator Champions + MoK + Twin lightning Claws + Daemonic Mutation + Warlord = 8 attacks per model.

Would you still argue this to be overpowered when the Terminator Squad alone costs 290pts, whilst needing a HQ, the charge and some form of transport?

Dreadnaught + Plasma Cannon + ML + Havoc Launcher + Chaos Theory = 5-7 template blasts per turn (9-11 during fire frenzy).

Yes, I have been reconsidering the ruling for Fire-frenzy, I may make it so it only affects one ranged weapon, or that the Havoc Launcher doesn't count towards it?
Also note that such a Dreadnought would cost 175pts whilst being no tougher than a normal dread.

I’ve also noticed that unmarked Daemon Princes with a daemon weapon can achieve strength 8 (9 including unholy might).

Much like the others, would you say this is still liable to being over-powered as it (whilst increasing the # of attacks), can hurt the DP itself, costs 215pts (235 w/unholy might. 260 w/ Wings & Unholy might), but is still liable to small arms and still weaker than Carnifex's, Wraithlords, Dreadknights, Furioso's etc?


Thanks for the feedback Candy.man, I do value your opinion so this is very helpful. I would like to point out that I'm not in any way rejecting your suggestions/thoughts, I'm simply trying to point out factors I thought could balance them to see what you thought including the factors I pointed out?

Can you also make it clear in the codex whether Fire Frenzy affects psychic shooting attacks? This seems like something that could be abused with chaos theory.

You also need to make it clear if a HQ with bike receives the” hit and run over” rule. At the moment it looks like he doesn’t and I’m not sure if this was on purpose or not.

I was unsure whether to clarify this for Fire Frenzy; I did intentionally make it so it stated "ranged weapons", I could clarify it further, bold/capatilise weapons or leave it as it is?

Yes, HQ's with bikes do not receive Hit and Run Over (intentionally), would you think this needs clarifying (also?), or best left to the common sense of the player?

Thanks again man.

Slayer le boucher wrote:*snip*

My intentions here weren't to recreate the Chaos factions, but the Chaos Space Marine Codex. The Daemons have their own Codex now and I don't intend to change that and I can't imagine GW will either.

As it stands, your example for the cult units is exactly how it works. Your auxiliaries shouldn't outnumber the core of the Codex, but if you do have 2 Zerker squads then you can get 2 squads of Bloodletters and a Bloodthirster.

When the person made that comment about the Warbands rule, my understanding was they had misunderstood the rule, whilst only the God-specific warbands impose actual limitations and even then they're very minor.

Well each cult troop should hopefully play differently and possess different stat-lines, rules and god-specific wargear. Whilst, yes, these aren't as numerous as you describe, they're still there. My hopes are that there's equal balance between the god-specific and undivided factions?

As it stands, a HQ from each warband can access a unique rule, whilst there are non-psychic powers available also. The Daemon Weapons have been improved, gifts have been added for further customisation also. My overall intentions behind this and the options were to give the players the options they need to make things their own, customise it to a reasonable extent and make it as fluffy or not as they like, whilst not forcing anything upon them. Hopefully I've achieved this. Hopefully.
I believed on of the problems of the 3.5 'dex to be too many options, whilst the 4th edition 'dex had too few options, I hope to achieve the balance between these.

As for special characters, what would you say to the current incarnation of Kharn? He obviously has non-psychic attack and does more than just receive a single additional attack; he receives an additional attack for each (enemy or friendly) model he kills amongst other things!

Thanks for the comments, hopefully I've been able to justify my choices and reasoning, if you still feel that change is needed, then please just say. Cheers.

Cheers for the feedback everyone!

I dunno, 18" flat out movement, plus another 18" range for bolt of change alone (especially at BS5) is a dangerous combination of speed and power. I hate to suggest this, but you might want to attach a minor points cost to each ability taken. It'll ratchet up the cost, definitely, but I'm seeing a Tzeentch army being deadly as all hell. I'm definitely going to playtest this with my friends when I get the chance, but I stand by my original assertion. This army could be dangerous as hell.

Did i miss something, but why would anyone take possessed champion? I mean, he has no war gear options and same stats as normal trooper but is 10 points more expensive.

You also need to re-word the effect of Mos for Possessed due the fact that there is no such thing as rendering USR.

crazypsyko666 wrote:I dunno, 18" flat out movement, plus another 18" range for bolt of change alone (especially at BS5) is a dangerous combination of speed and power. I hate to suggest this, but you might want to attach a minor points cost to each ability taken. It'll ratchet up the cost, definitely, but I'm seeing a Tzeentch army being deadly as all hell. I'm definitely going to playtest this with my friends when I get the chance, but I stand by my original assertion. This army could be dangerous as hell.

Isn't it 12" (rhino movement) + 18" range? Nonetheless, I think you may be onto something which I overlooked. However, I am now going to edit it so they're BS4 (still WS5), as I'd rather not charge for psychic powers as that's something that is - understandably - being moved away from in 5th edition I think...

Thanks man!

Devastator wrote:Did i miss something, but why would anyone take possessed champion? I mean, he has no war gear options and same stats as normal trooper but is 10 points more expensive.

You also need to re-word the effect of Mos for Possessed due the fact that there is no such thing as rendering USR.

Good catch on the Rendering; thanks man. And yeah, I'll have to change the possessed entry as they are supposed to be A2, with the Champion being A3 and eligible for possession, which would be any motivation to select him.

Thanks man, will edit it in now!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit: Devastator, I don't know if you're looking at the PDF or not, but on it it doesn't say 'rendering' but 'rending' as it should?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit 2: Right, those changes have been made and will be implemented when I next update the OP's PDF. Cheers!

Well, mate, it looks like you've been busy tweeking the Codex. I think this has gotten quite a bit of 'fan' fixes too. I've been hella busy so I'll have to download the new PDF.

Yes it is rending not rendering.