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TBH, this isn't even an odd thing. This is speculation over what would happen if Lucius died and no being was directly responsible. Either he hasn't been killed in such a way, or there is a way in which he will survive if such a thing were to occur.

purplefood wrote:Ammo problems.
A multilaser would burn through a man portable battery very quickly.
Heavy stubbers fall down against heavy bolters for some reason... can't remember what.

hmm then how come we have lascannon teams? cos the power cell for a lascannon is meant to be quite big and only contains enough charge for one shot.
EDIT: deleting sentence as i read something wrong


and isnt one of the reaons the Eldar are so arrogant is because they were created to 'own' the Galaxy, they just dont know humans were as well (to replace them as stated earlier)

Besides the ghosts use Heavy Stubbers next to Tred Fethers and Autocannons with no adverse effects

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:Besides the ghosts use Heavy Stubbers next to Tred Fethers and Autocannons with no adverse effects

They also use heavy bolters...

Brother Coa wrote:Odd things? Like learning a while ago that "on most Imperial worlds is peace. They never saw conflict and they don't react to one". So only 20-30% of Imperium worlds is under some kind of warfare. Why rest 70% don't raise troops and send them as a support? If Imperium is already in danger to have it's border worlds overrun...

Troops are drawn from every world with a sufficient population, and 20-30% is still greatly overestimating the number of warzones in the Imperium.

And that planets are a little things in 40k when you need several Regiments of Guard ( 100.000 Guardsman ) to hold down entire planet ( when in reality you need a LOT more troops to hold a country ).

You've heard stories about the craziest things special forces have actually pulled off, right? The Guard is a full fledged army made entirely of the caliber of person who pulls those things off.

Or Imperium's clever use of troops ( in Ultramarines they used 100 Marines from IF to guard one book? They could stash it on Holly Terra and use that 100 Marines somewhere better ). I swear when I looked at that I wondered: "Somewhere in the Imperium 1000 Space Marines and 30 Guard Regiments are guarding the place where Emperor took a dump once - and now it's sacred".

Well, Space Marines are pretty useless, given that they're rarer than Titans and outnumbered by the main battle tanks of the Guard better than a hundred to one...

Laodamia wrote:

Corporal_Reznov wrote:
Friend, the books you're reading are Imperial Armour books. They never have the Imperium win any battle without first making them look incompetent. Even then the Imperium almost always lose. The Taros campaign is nothing but Tau masturbation at its finest since everything that could possibly go wrong for the Imperium did go wrong with the Tau not suffering any bad luck that seemed to plague the Imperium . As for Kastoreal Novem another fluff disaster, still better than G"masturbating Marines and Tau"W.

All right, so here's another one:

Why is Abbadon still alive, and in charge of the Black Crusades after 12 (and arguably 13) failed attempts to breach the Cadian Gate???

I thought the Chaos Gods lacked two main things: patience and mercy?!?

They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Grey Templar wrote:

Tyranic Marta wrote:

BaronIveagh wrote:No, wait, because that would being CS Goto into canon...

It would be an abomination that must never come to pass.

????? sorry i dont follow

blessed ignorence,

be glad your Mind hath not been raped by the abominations that hath flowed from the pen of former BL author C.S. Goto.


his great Fetish with Multi-lasers, the transforming tanks, the tank surfing Terminators being BFFs with Kasirkins....

ahhhhh ok, gottit


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BaronIveagh wrote:That and it doesn't work if he's killed by, say, Necons, or Tyranids, or even Tau, really, since they don't seem to take any satisfaction in killing.

Or if he would be, say, killed by a land mine, or a shell hit, or anything else that his killer has no idea that he killed anyone at all.

You have to remember, that this is Slaanesh's favorite, sure if he gets shot to pieces, or blown up, he should just die, but slaanesh wont let that happen, he would probably just choose some random cultist to die for his herald.

When talking about lucius you cant talk about him not being reborn if he dies outside of cc, what you have to think about is that it is a tiny tiny tiny tiny effort of slaanesh to make this work, and Lucius is a meaty herald for him, why shouldnt he be reborn?

That means the only way to control him is to capture him and lock him away like luthor

preeeety much

The Pandorica is READY!

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

the only reason it takes a million troops to hold a country on earth today is because the earth is hugely divided into many factions.

if the earth were simply a single planet under a government with many many planets and the entire population got along(or was simply under one government) then it would take less troops to hold.

Laodamia wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

He has failed thirteen times, at the first hurdle, everytime his force has disentergrated afterwards.
He even lost the PLanet Killer, the most potent weapon in his naval fleet.
So why have the gods forgiven him each time and allowed him the time to rebuild his force everytime.

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:

Laodamia wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

He has failed thirteen times, at the first hurdle, everytime his force has disentergrated afterwards.
He even lost the PLanet Killer, the most potent weapon in his naval fleet.
So why have the gods forgiven him each time and allowed him the time to rebuild his force everytime.

Probably with huge sacrifices and further promises/pacts with the Dark Gods.
and theres absolutely no way the Ruinous Powers arent paying attention to him btw, regardless of whether hes failing or not

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:

Laodamia wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

He has failed thirteen times, at the first hurdle, everytime his force has disentergrated afterwards.
He even lost the PLanet Killer, the most potent weapon in his naval fleet.
So why have the gods forgiven him each time and allowed him the time to rebuild his force everytime.

because the chaos gods don't want him to win,

they want a war that never ends,

more Skulls for the Skull Throne,

more bodies for Nurgle to corrupt,

more bodies for Slannesh to...well...ya know ,

more things for Tzeench to alter and change. Flux is his arena.


Horus wasn't meant to win the war, he was meant to start it,

Abbaddon will never win, he simply keeps it going.

Revenent Reiko wrote:

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:

Laodamia wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

He has failed thirteen times, at the first hurdle, everytime his force has disentergrated afterwards.
He even lost the PLanet Killer, the most potent weapon in his naval fleet.
So why have the gods forgiven him each time and allowed him the time to rebuild his force everytime.

Probably with huge sacrifices and further promises/pacts with the Dark Gods.
and theres absolutely no way the Ruinous Powers arent paying attention to him btw, regardless of whether hes failing or not

I didn't mean that they aren't paying attention but there is only so much time before Tzeench strikes him down with a lightning bolt.

Good point GT.
although i thought Horus was meant to do better than he did (ie destroy the IoM but not slaughter everyone, but enough so there was still an endless war)

its hinted that the Chaos Gods withdrew their protection from Horus when the Emperor came to him.

this can be interpreted one of 2 ways,


the Chaos Gods couldn't stand before the Anathema(their name for the Emperor) and withdrew for safety,

or they deliberatly left Horus vulnerable.


or possably both.

hmmm, wheres that from may i ask, purely cos ive never heard it
agree on the reason why it would happen though.
OT, i love your new sig GT

I belive i heard it in a HH book.

Lexicanum is absolutly silent on the subject so i really can't give any solid leads.


I know it came from somewhere, but can't find it now.

Revenent Reiko wrote:

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:

Laodamia wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

He has failed thirteen times, at the first hurdle, everytime his force has disentergrated afterwards.
He even lost the PLanet Killer, the most potent weapon in his naval fleet.
So why have the gods forgiven him each time and allowed him the time to rebuild his force everytime.

Probably with huge sacrifices and further promises/pacts with the Dark Gods.

Haaaaa! Ok I get it now!

Abbadon is trying to get to Terra because he needs money to pay for a new planet killer, since he ruined the paint job of the previous one!

Laodamia wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

They don't care about him. At all. Or, for that matter, *any* of their servants. The Chaos Gods are eternal, and know that, ultimately, their victory is assured, as the universe will undergo entropic heat-death and simply boil away into a chaotic miasma of dead stars and shattered worlds devoid of life, regardless of what they do. The forces of order in the IoM simply, by defeating the Chaos fleets, the cults, the machinations of Daemon Princes and Greater Daemons and their ilk, delay the inevitable.

This is, of course, a great source of entertainment and humor to the Ruinous Powers, so they continue to play the game, throwing away the lives, minds and souls of their mortal minions like so many toy soldiers on a battle-table spanning the galaxy.

Personally i think they watch abaddon the same way people watch those japanese endurance gameshows.

People are going to get tortured in infinite ugly ways for a 'prize' and watching them fail appeals even more.

Humanity is this dark, why not the chaos gods

Psienesis wrote:

Laodamia wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

They don't care about him. At all. Or, for that matter, *any* of their servants. The Chaos Gods are eternal, and know that, ultimately, their victory is assured, as the universe will undergo entropic heat-death and simply boil away into a chaotic miasma of dead stars and shattered worlds devoid of life, regardless of what they do. The forces of order in the IoM simply, by defeating the Chaos fleets, the cults, the machinations of Daemon Princes and Greater Daemons and their ilk, delay the inevitable.

This is, of course, a great source of entertainment and humor to the Ruinous Powers, so they continue to play the game, throwing away the lives, minds and souls of their mortal minions like so many toy soldiers on a battle-table spanning the galaxy.

40K!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Laodamia wrote:

Revenent Reiko wrote:

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:

Laodamia wrote:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
They probably haven't even noticed what he's doing yet. The Chaos gods are too big to concern themselves with any one war or potentially even one galaxy. Their lesser servants are the ones who care about conflicts, and Abbadon is roughly equal to any of them who would concern themselves with his actions.

Come on! Abbadon is leading the most powerful Chaotic armies since Horus and his heresy. I'm sure they pay attention to what he does, or else it means that they don't give a damn about all of their servants. They probably don't treat with him personally, but they must send their minions and greater daemons to interact with the Despoiler.

He has failed thirteen times, at the first hurdle, everytime his force has disentergrated afterwards.
He even lost the PLanet Killer, the most potent weapon in his naval fleet.
So why have the gods forgiven him each time and allowed him the time to rebuild his force everytime.

Probably with huge sacrifices and further promises/pacts with the Dark Gods.

Haaaaa! Ok I get it now!

Abbadon is trying to get to Terra because he needs money to pay for a new planet killer, since he ruined the paint job of the previous one!

Automatically Appended Next Post:
thanks GT, i really need to catch up on the HH novels so no wonder i havent read it yet.

Psienesis wrote:
They don't care about him. At all. Or, for that matter, *any* of their servants. The Chaos Gods are eternal, and know that, ultimately, their victory is assured, as the universe will undergo entropic heat-death and simply boil away into a chaotic miasma of dead stars and shattered worlds devoid of life, regardless of what they do. The forces of order in the IoM simply, by defeating the Chaos fleets, the cults, the machinations of Daemon Princes and Greater Daemons and their ilk, delay the inevitable.

This is, of course, a great source of entertainment and humor to the Ruinous Powers, so they continue to play the game, throwing away the lives, minds and souls of their mortal minions like so many toy soldiers on a battle-table spanning the galaxy.

There is a fail in your logic - what will Chaos Gods do when our universe is done for? Eventually die out?

And one more thing it is not logical to me - Baneblade. It's 319 tones heavy! How the hell roads support that weight?
I heard that Germans actually build one super-heavy tank ( 188 tones ), but it was so heavy that no bridge and no road could support it. Baneblade can go anywhere, enev on street fight - and it's almost double heavier.

Baneblade has a lot more horsepower than that thing. It just keeps on truckin'.

Brother Coa wrote:

Psienesis wrote:
They don't care about him. At all. Or, for that matter, *any* of their servants. The Chaos Gods are eternal, and know that, ultimately, their victory is assured, as the universe will undergo entropic heat-death and simply boil away into a chaotic miasma of dead stars and shattered worlds devoid of life, regardless of what they do. The forces of order in the IoM simply, by defeating the Chaos fleets, the cults, the machinations of Daemon Princes and Greater Daemons and their ilk, delay the inevitable.

This is, of course, a great source of entertainment and humor to the Ruinous Powers, so they continue to play the game, throwing away the lives, minds and souls of their mortal minions like so many toy soldiers on a battle-table spanning the galaxy.

There is a fail in your logic - what will Chaos Gods do when our universe is done for? Eventually die out?

And one more thing it is not logical to me - Baneblade. It's 319 tones heavy! How the hell roads support that weight?
I heard that Germans actually build one super-heavy tank ( 188 tones ), but it was so heavy that no bridge and no road could support it. Baneblade can go anywhere, enev on street fight - and it's almost double heavier.

Probably continue their eternal wars in the Warp, against one another and whatever Daemon Princes get uppity.

Or create an entirely new, Daemon-Universe in which to continue their endless intrigues.

Also... a road in the modern world is not a road in the IoM. IoM roads are built tough... Land Raider Tough.

Brother Coa wrote:And one more thing it is not logical to me - Baneblade. It's 319 tones heavy! How the hell roads support that weight?
I heard that Germans actually build one super-heavy tank ( 188 tones ), but it was so heavy that no bridge and no road could support it. Baneblade can go anywhere, enev on street fight - and it's almost double heavier.

It forces the road to support its weight by being super-awesome. That's all you need to know. Trying to think about it will only give you a baaaad headache.

Any operable Baneblades grant any Imperial unit or terrain around them a 2+ save bonus due to their "'I'm Sorry I Can't Hear You Over the Sound of How Awesome I Am' Field"

Laodamia wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:And one more thing it is not logical to me - Baneblade. It's 319 tones heavy! How the hell roads support that weight?
I heard that Germans actually build one super-heavy tank ( 188 tones ), but it was so heavy that no bridge and no road could support it. Baneblade can go anywhere, enev on street fight - and it's almost double heavier.

It forces the road to support its weight by being super-awesome. That's all you need to know. Trying to think about it will only give you a baaaad headache.

Baneblade. don't. need. road.


and the Mauss was actually meant to not use roads or bridges. it could go under water for short periods of time and would simply support its massive weight by driving on solid ground.


and belive it or not, a Abrams Tank only pushes down on the ground with something like 20 pounds per square inch due to the surface area of the treads.

someone in high heels exerts many times more force on the ground.