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2012/01/01 05:13:59
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Tunneling Trygon
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im2randomghgh wrote:
McNinja wrote:If a Golden Age world existed, it is doubtful that they would not have already fallen under current imperial rule. If they had not, they would not give up their tech lightly (even in the golden age, the imperium was not exactly friendly).
If the Tau just found an STC on some planet, the Imperium/AdMech would never know, so would never go get it.
Also, the Tau would only be able to reverse engineer it, not necessarily understand the language on the directions.
STCs are blueprints, so that wouldn't be a problem,
And there is no reason they couldn't figure it out. I am pretty sure the Imperials figure it out when they find a semi-complete, and they either had to started from scratch, or they're in gothic (which the tau understand)
STC's are not in Gothic, Gaunt's Ghosts pretty clearly states that the designs are full of crazy patterns and symbols that only the wisest admech psykers would be able to fully understand. It would take Tau lifetimes (they're supposed to have 35 year or so lifespans, right?) to reverse engineer an STC.
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  Hive Fleet Aquarius 2-1-0
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/527774.page |
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2012/01/01 05:18:02
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
Thousand Sons Battleship wandering the galaxy...
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Finally, someone understands. STCs are in proto-Gothic/proto-Binary, which are understood only by a handful of adepts and the Librarians. And while they're struggling to study them, word gets out, and the Imperium angrily demands the STC given back. The Tau procrastinate, the Mechanicus call in a few favors, and the Astartes and Titan Legions close in to bust some heads.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/01 05:19:27
I should have left him there. He had served his purpose. He owed me nothing - yet he gave himself to me willingly. Why? I know not. He is nothing more than a pathetic human. An inferior race. A mon-keigh. But still I broke off my wings so that I might carry him easier. I took him from that place, into the snowstorm where our tracks will not be found. He is heavy. And he is dying. And he is slowing me down. But I will save him. Why? I know not. He is still warm. I can feel his blood ebbing across me. For every beat of his heart, another, slight spill of heat. The heat blows away on the winter wind. His blood is still warm. But fading. And I have spilled scarlet myself. The snow laps greedily at our footsteps and our lifeblood, covering them without a trace as we fade away.
'She sat on the corner, gulping the soup down, uncaring of the heat of it. They had grown more watery as of late she noted, but she wasn't about to beggar food from the Imperials or the "Bearers of the Word." Tau, despite their faults at least didn't have a kill policy for her race.' |
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2012/01/01 05:21:16
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Fireknife Shas'el
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I keep forgetting that STCs are Blueprints and not actual machines.
That being said, if they found an original STC construct (ancient Land Raider/other tank/power armor) they would be able to reverse engineer it much quicker than if they just had Blueprints printed in an ancient language.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/01 05:25:35
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2012/01/01 05:24:00
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Deathwing Terminator with Assault Cannon
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McNinja wrote:I keep forgetting that STCs are Blueprints and not actual machines.
That being said, if they found an original STC construct (ancient Land Raider/other tank/power armor) they would be able to reverse engineer it much quicker than if they had Blueprints printed in an ancient language.
It seems to me they are both, reason I say that is the STC in gaunts ghosts is actively producing men of iron iirc
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DA 4000 points  W/L/D 6e 3/2/0
IG 1500 points  W/L/D 6e 0/2/0
And 100% Primed!  |
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2012/01/01 05:27:15
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Fireknife Shas'el
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The crazy patterns and symbols are most likely chemical formulas, molecular structures and mathematical equations.
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2012/01/01 05:31:32
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Tunneling Trygon
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Wardragoon wrote:McNinja wrote:I keep forgetting that STCs are Blueprints and not actual machines.
That being said, if they found an original STC construct (ancient Land Raider/other tank/power armor) they would be able to reverse engineer it much quicker than if they had Blueprints printed in an ancient language.
It seems to me they are both, reason I say that is the STC in gaunts ghosts is actively producing men of iron iirc
Yeah, they seem like static computers, they can't take in new data, they turn the symbols, formulas, etc... written on them and turn them into a product. The Imperium only needs the writing, they can destroy the original construct and presumably build a new one, the formulas are the important part.
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Hive Fleet Aquarius 2-1-0
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/527774.page |
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2012/01/01 05:31:40
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
Thousand Sons Battleship wandering the galaxy...
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No, the one in Gaunt's Ghosts was destroyed. And even if the Tau find a functional STC, it's only a matter of time before the Imperium finds out. Once they do, the Tau would get buried in corpses.
Unfortunately, a complete STC is probably a hopeless dream.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/01 05:32:50
I should have left him there. He had served his purpose. He owed me nothing - yet he gave himself to me willingly. Why? I know not. He is nothing more than a pathetic human. An inferior race. A mon-keigh. But still I broke off my wings so that I might carry him easier. I took him from that place, into the snowstorm where our tracks will not be found. He is heavy. And he is dying. And he is slowing me down. But I will save him. Why? I know not. He is still warm. I can feel his blood ebbing across me. For every beat of his heart, another, slight spill of heat. The heat blows away on the winter wind. His blood is still warm. But fading. And I have spilled scarlet myself. The snow laps greedily at our footsteps and our lifeblood, covering them without a trace as we fade away.
'She sat on the corner, gulping the soup down, uncaring of the heat of it. They had grown more watery as of late she noted, but she wasn't about to beggar food from the Imperials or the "Bearers of the Word." Tau, despite their faults at least didn't have a kill policy for her race.' |
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2012/01/01 05:32:21
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Fireknife Shas'el
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That would make sense, but if only the highest and wisest AdMech can understand it, that really says something about the rest of the AdMech.
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2012/01/01 05:32:30
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps
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Tadashi wrote:No, Webway travel is instant when viewed from outside the Webway. Time is experienced normally by those travelling in the Webway. And the Imperium is progressing under the Imperial Truth, as such Imperial technology would be like the Eldar (since the Humans would take everything the Eldar have), bordering on magic and bending the fabric of reality itself. And all Humans are psykers on Eldar level, meaning that 'the very stars live and die by our dreams'. You never really addressed my points. And if the Tau really were protected, which I doubt, why would He protect them when the Imperium is living up to His expectations. And hello, what do you mean Chaos fights for them? Chaos is crippled by the Imperial Truth. And even if they deciphered an STC, how are they going to take on a million worlds? The Imperium would bury them in corpses.
Well the Polity has more worlds than the Imperium for one...
And also, with chaos fight for them, I meant if instead of destruction, in your scenario the Emperor fought alongside the Chaos Gods, it still wouldn't be enough.
And how, praytell, does the IoM not attacking itself put them technologically on par with a race of longer-lived, smarter, more powerful individuals who have been steadily advancing for the past several million years?
And humans wouldn't evolve to be 100% psykers for millions of years.
AND even once they do, they would be weaker than Eldar still, because Eldar have always been psykers, and because a warlock/farseer is what they are naturally like, when not inhibited.
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2012/01/01 05:33:48
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Tunneling Trygon
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Tadashi wrote:No, the one in Gaunt's Ghosts was destroyed. And even if the Tau find a functional STC, it's only a matter of time before the Imperium finds out. Once they do, the Tau would get buried in corpses.
The one in Gaunt's Ghosts actually cranked out a few Iron Men before it could be destroyed, it was operational, however tainted by Chaos.
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Hive Fleet Aquarius 2-1-0
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/527774.page |
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2012/01/01 05:34:53
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps
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McNinja wrote:I keep forgetting that STCs are Blueprints and not actual machines.
That being said, if they found an original STC construct (ancient Land Raider/other tank/power armor) they would be able to reverse engineer it much quicker than if they just had Blueprints printed in an ancient language.
There seem to be three representations of STC in 40k:
1. Examples. An stc would be like a prototype/example
2. Blueprints, actual, printed blue prints.
3. Computer-like devices which hold blueprints for EVERY stc design. Automatically Appended Next Post: Squidmanlolz wrote:Tadashi wrote:No, the one in Gaunt's Ghosts was destroyed. And even if the Tau find a functional STC, it's only a matter of time before the Imperium finds out. Once they do, the Tau would get buried in corpses.
The one in Gaunt's Ghosts actually cranked out a few Iron Men before it could be destroyed, it was operational, however tainted by Chaos.
No, it cranked out machines inhabited by Men of Iron.
Men of Iron were intelligences that could hop from physical body to physical body.
One of the best topics you'll ever read:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/401993.page
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/01 05:36:20
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2012/01/01 05:41:34
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Fireknife Shas'el
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McNinja wrote:That would make sense, but if only the highest and wisest AdMech can understand it, that really says something about the rest of the AdMech.
In the grim darkness of the far far future, there is no trigonometry.
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2012/01/01 05:42:06
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
Thousand Sons Battleship wandering the galaxy...
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im2randomghgh wrote:Tadashi wrote:No, Webway travel is instant when viewed from outside the Webway. Time is experienced normally by those travelling in the Webway. And the Imperium is progressing under the Imperial Truth, as such Imperial technology would be like the Eldar (since the Humans would take everything the Eldar have), bordering on magic and bending the fabric of reality itself. And all Humans are psykers on Eldar level, meaning that 'the very stars live and die by our dreams'. You never really addressed my points. And if the Tau really were protected, which I doubt, why would He protect them when the Imperium is living up to His expectations. And hello, what do you mean Chaos fights for them? Chaos is crippled by the Imperial Truth. And even if they deciphered an STC, how are they going to take on a million worlds? The Imperium would bury them in corpses.
Well the Polity has more worlds than the Imperium for one...
And also, with chaos fight for them, I meant if instead of destruction, in your scenario the Emperor fought alongside the Chaos Gods, it still wouldn't be enough.
And how, praytell, does the IoM not attacking itself put them technologically on par with a race of longer-lived, smarter, more powerful individuals who have been steadily advancing for the past several million years?
And humans wouldn't evolve to be 100% psykers for millions of years.
AND even once they do, they would be weaker than Eldar still, because Eldar have always been psykers, and because a warlock/farseer is what they are naturally like, when not inhibited.
Under the Emperor during the Great Crusade, the Imperium progressed more in two hundred years than in ten thousand years under the High Lords of Terra. What more can they can they progress if the Emperor actively led them? And the Emperor planned to accelerate Human evolution. Taking control of the Webway did not only mean to free Mankind from warp travel and astrotelepathy, it was meant to set the stage for this acceleration of Human evolution.
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I should have left him there. He had served his purpose. He owed me nothing - yet he gave himself to me willingly. Why? I know not. He is nothing more than a pathetic human. An inferior race. A mon-keigh. But still I broke off my wings so that I might carry him easier. I took him from that place, into the snowstorm where our tracks will not be found. He is heavy. And he is dying. And he is slowing me down. But I will save him. Why? I know not. He is still warm. I can feel his blood ebbing across me. For every beat of his heart, another, slight spill of heat. The heat blows away on the winter wind. His blood is still warm. But fading. And I have spilled scarlet myself. The snow laps greedily at our footsteps and our lifeblood, covering them without a trace as we fade away.
'She sat on the corner, gulping the soup down, uncaring of the heat of it. They had grown more watery as of late she noted, but she wasn't about to beggar food from the Imperials or the "Bearers of the Word." Tau, despite their faults at least didn't have a kill policy for her race.' |
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2012/01/01 09:08:02
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander
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nomotog wrote:So we might have a Machine sprite revolt. 
Traitors had to replace the machine spirits of Land Raiders..per this old release of the LR fluff.
Loyality is a concept there. Even necrons had programmed loyality once. I doubt the MS would revolt. Rather oppose a revolt...
im2randomghgh wrote:
The pre-fall Eldar were many, ,many times more powerful than the Imperium of man.
Says a space elf...who we know cannot be trusted.
im2randomghgh wrote:
In fact, most sci-fi universes could easily trump the IoM.
Oh no! Beaten by WHOLE universe! 
im2randomghgh wrote:
But either way, united orks, fully mustered Necrons, post-Ynnead Eldar, post-full strength slaanesh chaos etc. could all beat the IoM.
Orks could, but they are inable to unite. Inbreed security it seems ...
Necrons ruled once, but also splintered and powered down a lot now.. plus seem to like humans since they talk to them...
Eldar.... pansy space elfs. Let them dream of the days gone, they never return. Elfs in general are all on the past-golden-era-and-soon-to- leave kind of race.
Chaos has proven to be inable to beat the IoM. The villains who always fail, twist their mustaches and swear vengeance...
I consider your followup "points" as the usual nonsense since we don't need universe x vs 40k at all.
Everyone knows 40k beats all of them.
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I think people miss the point of STC. The STC were meant to go along settlers, thus in a possible unfriendly environment. STC provides means of defense too. Surely these important ressources are protected against misuse.
One layer of security would be to grant or deny access.
I am sure a STC may identify its user and in doing so, would reveal the truth with tech. Humans may have permission to access, non-humans? Unlikely...
The STC could defend itself by erasing its data or self-destruction too.
Maybe a reason they are so rare. In an age of strife, some of the formerly widespread STC could have fallen into hands not meant to touch and destroyed themself.
Looking at the issues archeologist have to translate old text, its questionable a "alien" piece of information is so easily accessible like many seem to assume here.
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Target locked,ready to fire  
           
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
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2012/01/01 18:13:46
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps
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1hadhq wrote:
Everyone knows 40k beats all of them.
EPIC TROLL
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2012/01/01 18:27:55
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Fireknife Shas'el
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1hadhq wrote:nomotog wrote:So we might have a Machine sprite revolt.
Traitors had to replace the machine spirits of Land Raiders..per this old release of the LR fluff.
Loyality is a concept there. Even necrons had programmed loyality once. I doubt the MS would revolt. Rather oppose a revolt...
A counter revolt. If they have the ability to oppose a revolt, then I think they have the ability to revolt themselves. The idea that a MS is revolt proof doesn't hold as much water.
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2012/01/01 22:44:58
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander
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nomotog wrote:1hadhq wrote:nomotog wrote:So we might have a Machine sprite revolt.
Traitors had to replace the machine spirits of Land Raiders..per this old release of the LR fluff.
Loyality is a concept there. Even necrons had programmed loyality once. I doubt the MS would revolt. Rather oppose a revolt...
A counter revolt. If they have the ability to oppose a revolt, then I think they have the ability to revolt themselves. The idea that a MS is revolt proof doesn't hold as much water.
Necrons were not able to overcome their loyality programming. Why should the less compliated MS be able to?
The dark mech also seems unable to turn MS, looks pretty solid this case of unwavering loyality. 
To counter a revolt is just restoring order. Order and logic are the playing ground of the machine. A cryptek could reprogram your machine to switch loyality to him, but this wouldn't enable the machine to revolt. It only alters the basic routines. And thats all a machine understands.
0 and 1. The self awareness true AI has, isn't found in imperial MS.
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Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
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2012/01/02 00:33:16
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard
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nomotog wrote:So we might have a Machine sprite revolt.
Machine Spirits believe that Emperor is a God.
Would you turn against your God? Automatically Appended Next Post: im2randomghgh wrote:
Star Trek could kick 40k's ass.
Epic Trolling is Epic. Automatically Appended Next Post: im2randomghgh wrote:1hadhq wrote:
Everyone knows 40k beats all of them.
EPIC TROLL
he is quite right, rarely any other sci-fi universe can beat 40k. Automatically Appended Next Post: Squidmanlolz wrote:[It could be destroyed, it was operational, however tainted by Chaos.
This I don't understand, how can a machine be tainted by Chaos?
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2012/01/02 00:37:48
 For Emperor and Imperium!!!!
None shall stand against the Crusade of the Righteous!!! 
Kanluwen wrote: "I like the Tau. I just don't like people misconstruing things to say that it means that they're somehow a huge galactic threat. They're not. They're a threat to the Imperium of Man like sharks are a threat to the US Army."
"Pain is temporary, honor is forever"
Emperor of Mankind:
"The day I have a sit-down with a pansy elf, magic mushroom, or commie frog is the day I put a bolt shell in my head."
 in your name it shall be done"
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/2SSSR2
Viersche wrote:
Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
the Emperor might be the greatest psyker that ever lived, but he doesn't have the specialized training that a Grey Knight has. Also he doesn't have a Grey Knight's unshakable faith in the Emperor.
The Emperor doesn't have a GKs unshakable faith in the Emperor which is....basically himself?
Ronin wrote:
"Brother Coa (and the OP Tadashi) is like, the biggest IoM fanboy I can think of here. It's like he IS from the Imperium, sent back in time and across dimensions."
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2012/01/02 03:01:46
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Fireknife Shas'el
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Brother Coa wrote:nomotog wrote:So we might have a Machine sprite revolt.
Machine Spirits believe that Emperor is a God.
Would you turn against your God?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Squidmanlolz wrote:[It could be destroyed, it was operational, however tainted by Chaos.
This I don't understand, how can a machine be tainted by Chaos?
Well you can ask the necrons that question.
Machines get tainted by chaos quite a bit. A demon can just go in and take over. I think CSMs can take demon possession as a upgrade.
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2012/01/02 03:18:44
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard
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When was an Necron infested by Chaos?
That doesn't make sense, Daemons work on spiritual level. They took control lover and posses living beings. Machine is a bunch of electronics and wiring with no souls and no true self awareness. How can Daemon control something with no spirit or soul?
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For Emperor and Imperium!!!!
None shall stand against the Crusade of the Righteous!!!
Kanluwen wrote: "I like the Tau. I just don't like people misconstruing things to say that it means that they're somehow a huge galactic threat. They're not. They're a threat to the Imperium of Man like sharks are a threat to the US Army."
"Pain is temporary, honor is forever"
Emperor of Mankind:
"The day I have a sit-down with a pansy elf, magic mushroom, or commie frog is the day I put a bolt shell in my head."
in your name it shall be done"
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/2SSSR2
Viersche wrote:
Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
the Emperor might be the greatest psyker that ever lived, but he doesn't have the specialized training that a Grey Knight has. Also he doesn't have a Grey Knight's unshakable faith in the Emperor.
The Emperor doesn't have a GKs unshakable faith in the Emperor which is....basically himself?
Ronin wrote:
"Brother Coa (and the OP Tadashi) is like, the biggest IoM fanboy I can think of here. It's like he IS from the Imperium, sent back in time and across dimensions."
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2012/01/02 03:34:29
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps
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Brother Coa wrote: im2randomghgh wrote:
Star Trek could kick 40k's ass.
Epic Trolling is Epic.
Okay well they have an entire race of omnipotent beings, 40k doesn't. im2randomghgh wrote:1hadhq wrote: Everyone knows 40k beats all of them.
EPIC TROLL
he is quite right, rarely any other sci-fi universe can beat 40k.
Again, I refer to the Polity novels. They have an infantry weapon called APWs, as light as any other, that can burn hundreds of meters into the earth with a single shot and reduce anything they shoot to nothing. They best way to represent them in 40k would be hellstorm template Str D AP1 Assault 5. Also, they have ships that outweight planets, and technology that can enhance a human past the level of power of the Emperor. Also, they have indestructible war drones and golems which are harder to kill than terminators and immune to everything except APWs. 40k is nothing special, the only reason I am involved with it at all is the epic game, and the tau fluff. Automatically Appended Next Post: Squidmanlolz wrote:[It could be destroyed, it was operational, however tainted by Chaos.
This I don't understand, how can a machine be tainted by Chaos?
Men of Iron. Automatically Appended Next Post: 1hadhq wrote:nomotog wrote:1hadhq wrote:nomotog wrote:So we might have a Machine sprite revolt.
Traitors had to replace the machine spirits of Land Raiders..per this old release of the LR fluff.
Loyality is a concept there. Even necrons had programmed loyality once. I doubt the MS would revolt. Rather oppose a revolt...
A counter revolt. If they have the ability to oppose a revolt, then I think they have the ability to revolt themselves. The idea that a MS is revolt proof doesn't hold as much water.
Necrons were not able to overcome their loyality programming. Why should the less compliated MS be able to?
The dark mech also seems unable to turn MS, looks pretty solid this case of unwavering loyality.
To counter a revolt is just restoring order. Order and logic are the playing ground of the machine. A cryptek could reprogram your machine to switch loyality to him, but this wouldn't enable the machine to revolt. It only alters the basic routines. And thats all a machine understands.
0 and 1. The self awareness true AI has, isn't found in imperial MS.
That makes sense, however my personal opinion is that Machine Spirits ARE truly sentient. They have been shown to be capable of anger, hate etc. which are emotions, and a sentient creature is something that has the capacity to 'feel'
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/01/02 03:36:15
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2012/01/02 04:22:22
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard
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im2randomghgh wrote:
Again, I refer to the Polity novels. They have an infantry weapon called APWs, as light as any other, that can burn hundreds of meters into the earth with a single shot and reduce anything they shoot to nothing. They best way to represent them in 40k would be hellstorm template Str D AP1 Assault 5. Also, they have ships that outweight planets, and technology that can enhance a human past the level of power of the Emperor. Also, they have indestructible war drones and golems which are harder to kill than terminators and immune to everything except APWs. 40k is nothing special, the only reason I am involved with it at all is the epic game, and the tau fluff.
Chaos Gods?
That makes sense, however my personal opinion is that Machine Spirits ARE truly sentient. They have been shown to be capable of anger, hate etc. which are emotions, and a sentient creature is something that has the capacity to 'feel'
They are, read "Titan" bt Dan Abnett. Titan Machine Spirit is taking to the Princeps, the Titan show sings of full awareness and think of himself as Emperor's diving wrath.
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For Emperor and Imperium!!!!
None shall stand against the Crusade of the Righteous!!!
Kanluwen wrote: "I like the Tau. I just don't like people misconstruing things to say that it means that they're somehow a huge galactic threat. They're not. They're a threat to the Imperium of Man like sharks are a threat to the US Army."
"Pain is temporary, honor is forever"
Emperor of Mankind:
"The day I have a sit-down with a pansy elf, magic mushroom, or commie frog is the day I put a bolt shell in my head."
in your name it shall be done"
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/2SSSR2
Viersche wrote:
Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
the Emperor might be the greatest psyker that ever lived, but he doesn't have the specialized training that a Grey Knight has. Also he doesn't have a Grey Knight's unshakable faith in the Emperor.
The Emperor doesn't have a GKs unshakable faith in the Emperor which is....basically himself?
Ronin wrote:
"Brother Coa (and the OP Tadashi) is like, the biggest IoM fanboy I can think of here. It's like he IS from the Imperium, sent back in time and across dimensions."
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2012/01/02 04:26:09
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Fireknife Shas'el
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Brother Coa wrote:When was an Necron infested by Chaos?
That doesn't make sense, Daemons work on spiritual level. They took control lover and posses living beings. Machine is a bunch of electronics and wiring with no souls and no true self awareness. How can Daemon control something with no spirit or soul?
No the necrons rebelled on there gods.
Because there demons. It's what they do. It also dosen't help that the IoM use human parts in there MS.
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2012/01/02 04:28:48
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps
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Brother Coa wrote:im2randomghgh wrote:
Again, I refer to the Polity novels. They have an infantry weapon called APWs, as light as any other, that can burn hundreds of meters into the earth with a single shot and reduce anything they shoot to nothing. They best way to represent them in 40k would be hellstorm template Str D AP1 Assault 5. Also, they have ships that outweight planets, and technology that can enhance a human past the level of power of the Emperor. Also, they have indestructible war drones and golems which are harder to kill than terminators and immune to everything except APWs. 40k is nothing special, the only reason I am involved with it at all is the epic game, and the tau fluff.
Chaos Gods?
What about them? are you asking is they are my reason for liking for 40k? Because the Polity would eat them.
That makes sense, however my personal opinion is that Machine Spirits ARE truly sentient. They have been shown to be capable of anger, hate etc. which are emotions, and a sentient creature is something that has the capacity to 'feel'
They are, read "Titan" bt Dan Abnett. Titan Machine Spirit is taking to the Princeps, the Titan show sings of full awareness and think of himself as Emperor's diving wrath.
Do you mean titanicus?
And the same in the night lords novels: Octavia has conversations with the ships MS.
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2012/01/02 04:29:12
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard
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Iwas talking about Chaso corruption here, who mentioned C'tan at all.... 
So, Daemons can take control of my wristwatch?
Humans are doing the other way around, they are using Machine parts with Human body ( Techpriest ).
The only real connection with the Machine Spirit would be only mental ( Titans ).
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For Emperor and Imperium!!!!
None shall stand against the Crusade of the Righteous!!!
Kanluwen wrote: "I like the Tau. I just don't like people misconstruing things to say that it means that they're somehow a huge galactic threat. They're not. They're a threat to the Imperium of Man like sharks are a threat to the US Army."
"Pain is temporary, honor is forever"
Emperor of Mankind:
"The day I have a sit-down with a pansy elf, magic mushroom, or commie frog is the day I put a bolt shell in my head."
in your name it shall be done"
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/2SSSR2
Viersche wrote:
Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
the Emperor might be the greatest psyker that ever lived, but he doesn't have the specialized training that a Grey Knight has. Also he doesn't have a Grey Knight's unshakable faith in the Emperor.
The Emperor doesn't have a GKs unshakable faith in the Emperor which is....basically himself?
Ronin wrote:
"Brother Coa (and the OP Tadashi) is like, the biggest IoM fanboy I can think of here. It's like he IS from the Imperium, sent back in time and across dimensions."
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2012/01/02 04:38:49
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps
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Brother Coa wrote:Iwas talking about Chaso corruption here, who mentioned C'tan at all....
So, Daemons can take control of my wristwatch?
Humans are doing the other way around, they are using Machine parts with Human body ( Techpriest ).
The only real connection with the Machine Spirit would be only mental ( Titans ).
Daemons can control anything with a MS because of scrapcode, and show a member of the Admech (Tech priest) being controlled by it in the last Salamanders novel.
And who mentioned the C'tan?
The polity has biotech so powerful it can take complete control of every living organism on an entire planet from orbit. Chaos corruption is NOTHING compared to that.
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2012/01/02 04:44:13
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard
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im2randomghgh wrote:
Daemons can control anything with a MS because of scrapcode.
Alright for that, I was talking about a Machine with no AI, MS or whatever sentient program at all ( like ordinary Leman Russ tank )
Automatically Appended Next Post: im2randomghgh wrote:
And who mentioned the C'tan?
That's what i am to asking here?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/02 04:44:33
For Emperor and Imperium!!!!
None shall stand against the Crusade of the Righteous!!!
Kanluwen wrote: "I like the Tau. I just don't like people misconstruing things to say that it means that they're somehow a huge galactic threat. They're not. They're a threat to the Imperium of Man like sharks are a threat to the US Army."
"Pain is temporary, honor is forever"
Emperor of Mankind:
"The day I have a sit-down with a pansy elf, magic mushroom, or commie frog is the day I put a bolt shell in my head."
in your name it shall be done"
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/2SSSR2
Viersche wrote:
Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
the Emperor might be the greatest psyker that ever lived, but he doesn't have the specialized training that a Grey Knight has. Also he doesn't have a Grey Knight's unshakable faith in the Emperor.
The Emperor doesn't have a GKs unshakable faith in the Emperor which is....basically himself?
Ronin wrote:
"Brother Coa (and the OP Tadashi) is like, the biggest IoM fanboy I can think of here. It's like he IS from the Imperium, sent back in time and across dimensions."
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2012/01/02 04:48:33
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps
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Brother Coa wrote:im2randomghgh wrote:
Daemons can control anything with a MS because of scrapcode.
Alright for that, I was talking about a Machine with no AI, MS or whatever sentient program at all ( like ordinary Leman Russ tank )
Actually Leman Russ' have MS, just lesser ones. According to the AdMech, even lasguns have machine spirit. Every imperial piece of tech that isn't heresy has a MS.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
im2randomghgh wrote:
And who mentioned the C'tan?
That's what i am to asking here?
Well you're the one who brought them up...because I didn't mention them...
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2012/01/02 04:54:44
Subject: Re:Tau and STC.
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Stalwart Space Marine
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I would like to point out that one STC seems to have been overlook: the Titan STC from the GreyKnights novel.
Basicly for those who did not read the book witout getting any spoilers out there, this STC was basicly a walking robot that could comunicate with anyone who wanted to.
In this case only in high and low gothic, but from the looks of it, it could quite possibly learn other language with ease.
Taking this in consideration, if the Tau could find a similar STC they could talk to, would help the Tau to Advance farely quickly.
Who knows, maybe part of the technology the Tau have is really human technology from the dark age.
As for the corruption of the Machine spirit: the Man of Iron Gaunt found were already corrupt, but who knows how long it took them to get to that point. The Corruption of the MS could have taken years, centuries to do, you do not neet a soul or a spirit to corrupt, simply a mind.
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2012/01/02 04:55:51
Subject: Tau and STC.
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Fireknife Shas'el
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I think demons can even possess swords or other non mechanical items.
It also wouldn't surprise me to see a tau drone possessed by a demon
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/01/02 05:09:00
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