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Made in us
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





Voodoo Boyz wrote:

I know I rated them "Competitive" in the new Dex, and while they're kind of a special case in terms of utility I'm thinking they could be useful. There are only two downsides to using them though:

1.) If you play against an all Mech List in escalation and you are forced to go first, they can come on and then just get shot. :(
2.) In almost any match up I can conceive of for these guys I see them getting ground down and killed. The question is if sacrificing a 265 point squad fully loaded is worth the amount of disruption and "they're not shooting me" that the unit will cause in enemy lines.


for 1: you should be able to pick what terrain you can end up in by choosing table edge to come in from - that will help them stay alive. Hell, if you have a couple of rokkits instead of burnas in the squad, you could potentially set up in some 4+ terrain and take pot shots with them. Or, try to hide them near an objective and keep them out of LOS, protecting the VPs they entail. Granted, none of these are optimal solutions, but vs all mech it might be the best you can do with snikrots mob.

2: depends on the opponent - if you're facing shooty IG that unit could win you the game. Same for shooty tau - even mech tau the crisis suits will be vulnerable if they are anywhere near a table edge. Against SM they probably will eventually be ground down, but if they can take out the devs first, that's killing a lot of shooting that could gut the rest of the army.

They will definitely be in my army. I just need to convert up a snikrot now...
   
Made in se
Fresh-Faced New User




I really need to vent my opinion about the new (leaked) codex. I'm an old ork tournament veteran, with a few victories, and a few losses under my belt, so take this for what its worth (a lot in my opinion, probably not so much in the eyes of the really experienced players *grins*)

HQ
The warboss: Really a mixed reaction here. I for one used to give him the cheap weapon option: Slugga/choppa. This worked really well, and my warboss/nob unit was feared across several tournaments (I did by the way test the power claw option, but I never really liked it). Now the choppa option is dead, so giving him a claw is really the only way to go (the big choppa is really pointless). At T5 S5 WS5, A4, you get a really nice char for your 60points. All in all, I would say that he is good. A boss on a bike might be the best option here. T6, and a claw will almost put him on pair with a fex.

Big mek:Another really nice char. While his stats are comparable to that of a nob, 35 points aint that bad for a HQ. The shokk attack gun (at 60 points) makes him a fantastic heavy infantry slayer... although it’s farley unpredictable. Might not be the kind of unit that you want to rely on in a tournament, but he is still good. (giving him a force field might also be a good idea... although that costs 50 points)


Weirdboy: At 55 points, he is a bit more expensive than the mek, and extremely unpredictable. The warphead upgrade (30 points) is close to mandatory (it makes him a bit less unpredictable). I for one aint a big fan of unpredictable units, although I can see a use for this fellow. Make sure to put him in a mob, so that he won’t fail his psyker tests as often (it would be a real bummer to spend 85 points at something that would not even work...)
All in all, I find him to be ok

Elite
Nobz: These have the same statline as they did in the old dex, and they cost as much. The choppa "nerf" really hurts them thought, as they won’t be nearly as good at marine/necron/sister slaying. It’s a real bummer, as one of the greatest units in the army suddenly turned ok, and not much more. Transports (or bikes) are still mandatory for these guys. The painboss will at least make it hard to kill (at +30 points).

Meganobz: Slow... A trukk, or battlewagon IS mandatory here. This unit does not seem to be that great thought. 40 points, for a unit that clearly is ment to get into hand to hand combat.. And it does not even get the +1A charge bonus. Its an expensive unit, that might work wonderfully well against everything that is unable to get trough its armour... but it will get slaughtered by anything that can deal with the 2+ save. I for one find this unit to be sub-par

Burna boyz: Ork players love burnas, it’s as simple as that, and these guys come with a burna each. You can also replace up to 3 burna boyz with meks, who get mega blastas. But why, oh why would you do that? S8, Ap 2 in all its glory, but the mega blasta has a 1/6 chance of burning the one who uses it, and a 1/3 chance of hitting. You will also lose the power weapon (burna). This unit might really be your best bet against units with a +2 save, although for them to shine, they need a battle wagon. All in all, it’s an ok unit, but its 15points/model, and they are as fragile as any other ork boy.

Tank bustas: Erm... why? The glory hog rule means that they will have to shoot at the tank. While they are ment for tank hunting, this rule limits their usefulness. The tank hammer is a S10, 2 handed weapon (and therefore a lot better than the 'uge choppa), but it lacks any form of Ap, which limits its usefulness against infantry. It might be our best bet against the dreaded 14/14/14 tanks thought (that, or a weirdboy.. but those are a bit too random). For that to work, they NEED to be placed in a battlewagon, and it’s still not a safe bet that they will get to the tank. All in all, I would rate this unit sub-par

Lootas: Another 15 point ork elite. S7 Ap4, 48' range.. but a random amount of shots. This is another of those "can be extremely powerful.. with some luck" units. But even if you end up shooting 1shot/ork, they can be somewhat dangerous. In fact, its one of the best units in the ork army (in my opinion), and a unit of these seem to be near-mandatory. There is no better way for us to real with light tanks, is there? And they might also end up being fantastic infantry slayers, but again, with some luck. I would take this great unit in almost all of my none-speed freek lists.

Kommandos: Kommandos seem to be a little bit to expensive for what they are: infiltrating orks. Not all scenarios let you infiltrate troops, which limits their usefulness, unless you know that you will be using their infiltration ability. Move trough cover is nice thought. This is the only none mek, none burnaboy unit that can take burnas... at 15 points. Expensive, but infiltrating flamers can be really dangerous. All in all, I find this unit to be ok.

troops
Boyz: The boyz have changed from the old codex. They now cost 2-3 points less (depending on if your talking about slugga, or shoota boyz. The shoota has been improved, while the slugga has been nerfed. You can give them a trukk thought, which means that you won’t have to spend those important fast attack slots on trukk boyz. Let’s do some math to see how much better these guys are, against the most common opponent in the universe: marines. Lets say that you have 12 slugga boyz (enough for 1 trukk), who charge 10 marines. The marines will strike first, 5 will hit, 2,5 will wound, 2.08 orks will die. The orks will strike back, with 10*4 attacks, 20 will hit, 10 will wound, 3.333 marines will die. If the marines charge, 4.16 orks will die, 8 orks will strike back, 1.333 marines will die. (With the old 'dex, the numbers would have been 4, resp 2).Not bad, for 6 points. (with a nob, the unit would, of course, be even better) The shoota boyz are also useful now, with their 18', assault 2 weapons. All in all, the boyz, the most important unit in the army are great

Gretchin: The grots still have their use: as meat shields. With the improved boyz, have lost a lot in value thought. All in all, I find them to be kind of sub-par, although some people wont agree with me.

Fast attack
Storm boyz: The storm boyz costs 3 points less, and can move even faster than before. The 1/6 chance of loosing an ork every turn is really nothing to worry about, when the price/model is 12 points. Their is not much to say about these, really. They are a great jump pack unit, which will see a lot of use. Expect most armies to include at least one unit of these fellows.

Warbuggies: The price drop on the big shoota is understandable. They now come with one by default, and the rokkits/schorcha upgrade costs extra. I for one still find the schorcha to be the superior choice, although not with a wide margin. With the exception of the change in price, they are kind of the same as before, and therefore still a good option.

Warbikes: Warbikes costs 5 points less, have a better save, and get the slugga/choppa +1A by default. They are not fearless anymore, and thy don’t get to shoot as they charge into combat. The loss "fearless" really hurts them, as they only have an LD of 7, so unless they charge a weak unit, chances are that they will turn their tail, and run. Still, they are a good option, thought getting more storm boyz might be a better idea.

Deffkoptas: Deffkoptas are basically orks, with big shootas, on jet bikes. They are somewhat expensive, and their close combat upgrade is so expensive that it’s downright silly (the buzzaw costs 25 points, and counts as a power claw. Do you really want to spend 25 points, on a model with basic ork stats, to give him that?). Not the best option around, but as mobile fire platforms, they might well be worth it. This is another good fast attack unit.

Heavy support
Battlewagon The battle wagon is a heavy ork tank. 14 in front armour means that only heavy anti tank weapons can deal with it, unless it’s attacked from the side, or rear. The thing can be a mobile gun platform, with a lot of anti-infantry, or anti tank guns mounted to it (up to 4 big shootas, or rokkit launchas+either a kanon, lobba or zzap gun). It can also transport up to 20 models, which is nice (it’s not fast thought, so if you really want to get your troops into hand to hand combat fast, trukks might be better). The killcanon seem to be a bit lackluster for its cost thought: 60 points, 24', S7 Ap3, ordinance 1, large blast. With the canon, the battlewagon can only transport 12 orks. It does seem to be a good, although somewhat expensive unit.

deff dread: It’s the ork dread that we all know, and love. Its as good as it was in the old rules, so no comments needed here.

Killa kans: Same here, another old but good unit.

Flash gits: Flash gits are nobz, with large guns. Snazzguns have random AP, so they are not reliable marine killers. With some luck, they can end up obliterating a marine unit.. and with some poor luck, they might end up killing 1-2 marines. The more dakka upgrade seem to be a no-brainer, really. Turning the weapon from assault 1, to assault 2. The gitfindas might be useful for people who are new to the game, and cant judge distances that well. All in all, this unit seem to be good.

Big gunz: I for one never really liked the bug gunz. Now that grots have Bs3, the kannon might at least be a bit useful (although I still think it’s too expensive). The zzap gun has increased range.. but again, I find it too expensive. The only one I would take is the lobba. Although I know that a lot of people will disagree with me, I find this unit to be sub-par.

looted wagon: This is not the looted basilisk that you all knew, it’s not the looted russ either. Its armour is really weak, at 11/11/10. It can transport troops, by default, although if you upgrade it with a "boomgun (36', S8 Ap3, ordinance 1, large blast), it looses that capability. Although some people might claim that the orks "need" a basilisk, or a russ to win, I have won tournaments without them. If I can do it, so can you. I find this unit a bit too expensive for what it is, and therefore sup-bar.


The orks are more powerful now, than they were in the old codex. They don’t have any real "wow" units, although I would claim that they have enough good units to be seen as a good army. +2saves & tanks with an AV of 14 will give the poor orks a hard time thought. It would be nice to have some way to deal with these, without huge point investments.
   
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Battlefortress Driver with Krusha Wheel






Fnord wrote:I really need to vent my opinion about the new (leaked) codex. I'm an old ork tournament veteran, with a few victories, and a few losses under my belt, so take this for what its worth (a lot in my opinion, probably not so much in the eyes of the really experienced players *grins*)



Edit your post, you cant list points costs until the codex is out.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2007/12/07 17:56:34


warhammer 40k mmo. If I can drive an ork trukk into the back of a space marine dread and explode in a fireball of epic, I can die happy!

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Krazed Killa Kan






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Just an FYI, I saw the actual codex at the local GW store tonight. The leak is the final print copy.
   
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[ADMIN]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Los Angeles, CA


Voodoo Boyz wrote:Just an FYI, I saw the actual codex at the local GW store tonight. The leak is the final print copy.



Including all of the typos? Really? Even the stuff like some unit having the Waaagh! rule in their fluff section but not in the army list?

Wow. If so, that's really pathetic. That would make this one of the worst typo ridden codices to date.


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Krazed Killa Kan






South NJ/Philly

Hrmm, didn't check that one, I may tomorrow when I go back. The Power Klaw Nob is worded the same as the leak, Glory Hogs is still there, the Storm Boyz are the same. It all looked spot on, I'll see if I can get a shot at it again tomorrow to double check it.

From my looking through to confirm points and rules wordings, yeah it looked completely the same.
   
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[ADMIN]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Los Angeles, CA


Yeah, I'd check those and the looted wagon reference in the army list. It references page 56 when the Looted Wagon is actually on page 54.

If those are the same then it definitely is exactly the same.


I play (click on icons to see pics): DQ:70+S++G(FAQ)M++B-I++Pw40k92/f-D+++A+++/areWD104R+T(D)DM+++
yakface's 40K rule #1: Although the rules allow you to use modeling to your advantage, how badly do you need to win your toy soldier games?
yakface's 40K rule #2: Friends don't let friends start a MEQ army.
yakface's 40K rule #3: Codex does not ALWAYS trump the rulebook, so please don't say that!
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Scarred Ultramarine Tyrannic War Veteran






Maple Valley, Washington, Holy Terra

I wouldn't be surprised to hear that the leak was the final version. It was completely laid-out, which you normally wouldn't do until you had the text finalized, I should think.

"Calgar hates Tyranids."

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Battlefortress Driver with Krusha Wheel






so guess we can wait a year or two for a f.a.q. to be released. Arent eldar still waiting for theirs?

warhammer 40k mmo. If I can drive an ork trukk into the back of a space marine dread and explode in a fireball of epic, I can die happy!

8k points
3k points
3k points
Admech 2.5k points
 
   
Made in de
Dominating Dominatrix






Piercing the heavens

so, what do you guys think about the vehicle upgrades?

personally, I don't see how closed top could ever be a good choice on trucks, maybe on a battlewagon filled with tankbustas.

the boarding rank obviously only makes sense with tanbustas or a powerklaw.

the wreckin ball sounds rather nice, since it is one of the few S 9 things the new orks can have.
   
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[ADMIN]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Los Angeles, CA


Yeah, closed top is only ever going to be useful on Looted Wagons and Battlewagons.


I play (click on icons to see pics): DQ:70+S++G(FAQ)M++B-I++Pw40k92/f-D+++A+++/areWD104R+T(D)DM+++
yakface's 40K rule #1: Although the rules allow you to use modeling to your advantage, how badly do you need to win your toy soldier games?
yakface's 40K rule #2: Friends don't let friends start a MEQ army.
yakface's 40K rule #3: Codex does not ALWAYS trump the rulebook, so please don't say that!
Waaagh Dakka: click the banner to learn more! 
   
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Pragmatic Primus Commanding Cult Forces






Southeastern PA, USA

Some things in the new Ork codex make me wonder if they weren't done with 5th edition in mind. The armor option for Nobz might point to a change in upgrade character rules. Gretchin might look different with the addition of forced march and different targeting rules. Glory Hogs just seems odd. Stuff like that.

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While good in practice, there is one possible flaw in your plan. Yes you can let the elite squad escape if the enemy unit is also engaged with other boys, but you did have to fail the moral check for them to break it off its never voluntary for the orks. Because of the small number of models in elite squads, there is a strong chance that your under half strength. If this is the case say bye-bye to that squad. Were not marines, we don't regroup. We flee. In the case of bikers... we flee very fast.


Actually, my post was about how not to die to sweeping advance. The #1 way not to die to sweeping advance is not to fail a morale check (see my #1 point). If they don't break and remain in combat, that's what you want? I don't see how this can be perceived as a flaw.

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Pragmatic Primus Commanding Cult Forces






Southeastern PA, USA

So if you have the points for 15 Lootas and three open Elites slots, do you field three min-sized units, two medium-sized units or one big one? The big squad has some Ld advantages at first, but those disappear quickly and you could lose the entire unit to sub-50% fall back from just one drop pod landing next to you. Small squads will likely run if breathed on and may have targeting priority issues, but at least you've created three separate targets.

Thoughts?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2007/12/11 19:29:07


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Executing Exarch





Two medium-sized units is the clear worst choice. That would mean 7 in one squad and 8 in the other, giving you no significant morale advantage over the three min units.

Between the other two, I have no clue. The larger unit is more resistant to long-ranged shooting, but more vulnerable to fast units that will take the fight right to you. It also suffers from having to direct all that S7 goodness at a single target, quite a downer when your aim is to shakelock Falcons.

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gorgon wrote:Some things in the new Ork codex make me wonder if they weren't done with 5th edition in mind. The armor option for Nobz might point to a change in upgrade character rules. Gretchin might look different with the addition of forced march and different targeting rules. Glory Hogs just seems odd. Stuff like that.


I was thinking about this, and I really hope that this is the case.
   
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Krazed Killa Kan






South NJ/Philly

yakface wrote:
Voodoo Boyz wrote:Just an FYI, I saw the actual codex at the local GW store tonight. The leak is the final print copy.



Including all of the typos? Really? Even the stuff like some unit having the Waaagh! rule in their fluff section but not in the army list?

Wow. If so, that's really pathetic. That would make this one of the worst typo ridden codices to date.



Yep, Dethkoptas and Storm Boyz still have the "WAAAGH" rule in their fluff section but not in the army list. I forgot to check the Looted Wagon entry, but I'm willing to bet it's there.
   
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According to what I've heard, everything from BA on has been written with 5th in mind.
   
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UK

wheres this long awaited Heavy support section mr voodoo!

 
   
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South NJ/Philly

Working on it, will have it up today I hope. Sorry for the delay, I've been too busy Dipping Orks and painting Dwarfs (did I mention I've been bitten by the Fantasy bug again?).

Sorry, I've been skirting the section, mostly since it seems people already ON Dakka already know what I'm going to say here, but I really do want to get this completed and posted somewheres.
   
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Well, I may know what you're going to say in general (what's hot, what's not), but I'm sure you've considered some details that haven't occurred to me. I'm still waiting to hear what you think the best way to outfit Battlewagon Boyz is.

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Unit Evaluation: Trukk Transports

Utility: Competitive

I didn’t really cover the deceptively humble Trukk in the Troops or Elites section where it can be taken as a dedicated transport and it is such a useful item in an Ork army that I feel it deserves its own unit evaluation.

The Trukk is still an AV10 Open Topped Fast Vehicle. This makes it a very good transport that can get units into combat pretty reliably when used in conjunction with Terrain. This gets even better in the new Codex with the new Waaagh rules giving Orks at least one fleet move in a game, making that turn you use the fragile Trukk to deliver your CC troops that much more effective, and it got an amazing boost with the new Ramshackle special rules.

Ramshackle basically makes it so that Orks are not automatically entangled when their Trukk gets blown up, not following the normal damage rules but instead taking a S3 hit for each model and a pinning test. What’s better is that even 1/3 of the time you won’t even suffer that and can potentially move closer to the enemy when shot. I won’t go through the specifics of the rule, but the gist of it is that 1/3 of the time you get blown up you roll a scatter dice and 3D6 to determine where and how far your truck moves before you take a pinning test and the S3 hits described above. The best part is that if you roll a ‘Hit’ for the scatter, you get to move the Trukk as you wish the distance rolled!

Equipping your Trukk
So given this incredible reliability that now comes with the basic Trukk, lets look at the options you have when setting up your Trukk:

-Rokkit Launcha: For a nominal amount of points you can upgrade the Trukk’s standard Big Shoota to a Rokkit. Personally, I don’t see this as worthwhile since the weapon exists solely as something that prevents “Weapon Destroyed” from becoming “Immobilized” on the damage chart. Save the points and move on to other things.

-Red Paint Job: Move an extra inch for free, for a small amount of points to boot. This upgrade is mandatory for any Trukk I take because when when you want to transport a unit into combat, that extra inch goes a mile! I can’t imagine a time I’d take a Trukk and NOT give it a Red Paint Job.

-Grot Riggers: What was once always taken on my Trukks will now get left behind. It does the same job for a little bit more points, but it does it in the shooting phase now, not before the movement phase like before, meaning you can’t save your bacon if your truck is stuck immobile somewhere waiting to deliver a squad.

-Stikkbomb Chukka: It gives your squad Grenades when charging out of the Trukk. This is useful for Nobz Mobz who can’t take grenades, but it only saves you 7 Points instead of taking Frags on your Boyz mob that can be transported in the Trukk if you fill up the max transport capacity of 12 Boyz. Still if you need to cut points from the list, dropping Frags and adding a Stikkbomb Chukka to a units Trukk is one way to do it.

-Armor Plates: Extra armor for Trukks! This was something I initially had on all my Trukks, but from a discussion with Dakka Member Redbeard, I'm going to be leaving it off. If you ever suffer something with just a "Stunned" result, this can keep your Trukk moving, but with AV10 and Open Topped, it's not something that's going to come up very often since if a Trukk is being shot at it is probably going to suffer a lot more damage. Still for the times when you're being shot with Bolters and are glanced, this upgrade may be worthwhile. I suggest playtesting with and without this upgrade before settling on what suits your playstyle better.

-Boarding Plank: One of the upgrades I just don’t see a whole lot of utility for. Embarked Troops can perform close combat attacks on an enemy vehicle within 2” if the ‘Wagon hasn’t moved more than 12” that turn. The problem is that most of the time you will have to get out to charge to even reach a vehicle controlled by a good player. I just don’t see it being very useful and the whole idea that if your Trukk can be seen while trying to make this attack it probably will get blown up next turn which is safer than it was before, but it’s never a good thing.

-Wreckin Ball: Another upgrade I’m not too thrilled about. If you move less than 12” you can make a S9 attack on a unit within 2” on a 4+. It’s OK vs. Vehicles if you can get it to go off, but how often will you be so close to an enemy vehicle to make it work? Likewise it’s still not that great vs. infantry units since it’s one hit that allows armor saves. And it’s pretty expensive to boot.

-Reinforced Ram: Cheap upgrade to re-roll dangerous terrain tests, which can be a godsend if you have to go through terrain. Personally I haven’t been throwing it on my Trukks in the KoS lists I’ve tested, but I may just start since I’ve had to go through terrain to make charges many times in the old KoS I used to run and having this would have saved me from many losses I suffered because a truck couldn’t get a charge off and immobilized itself when it was forced to cut through terrain.

Trukk Summary

The Trukks I’ve been using come out to a paltry 50 Points using Red Paint and Armor Plates. You could make them a bit more expensive with a Reinforced Ram and/or a Stikkbomb Chukka, but then they start to become even more expensive. Personally I see Reinforced Ram as the only really compelling option to add, but a case could be made for either combination. It’s also arguable if Armor Plates are worth it, or for the same cost you could drop Armor Plates and add both the Reinforced Ram and the Stikkbomb Chukka, which is another viable build for the Trukk.

The end of it is, if you’re using your Trukks properly, they’re not getting shot at until they’ve delivered their payload, so in the end if you’re confident you will have enough terrain to hide behind on a table or you’re taking a bunch of screening units for the Trukks, then the second combo of Red Paint, Reinforced Ram, and Stikkbomb Chukka may be the better option for you. If you’re going to go balls to the wall style and run your Trukks out there and dare your opponent to stop them all, then the first option is probably best. Though to be honest, it’s probably not a good idea to go for the target overload approach unless your opponent has a serious lack of firepower in his army.

Per some discussion with Dakka Member Redbeard I will start playtesting my Trukks without Armor Plates and with the Reinforced Ram instead, since it's very true that the time when you're only suffering from Crew Stunned is rare indeed.

Unit Evaluation: Heavy Support
Battlewagon
Utility: Competitive

This entry right here is something special for the Orks, because it’s both a source of competitive advantage in some tournament armies (when built a specific way) and in other ways it’s the key to using Poor units effectively in friendly games.

BTW, in case you were wondering, all your old 3rd Edition “Looted Tanks” want to use this entry to “Count-As” in the new rules.

Evaluating the Battlewagon is pretty hard because of the duality of its uses. On one hand, it’s a pretty nice tank with good anti-troop (including anti-MEQ) firepower that can be expensive when kitted out this way. On the other hand it’s still a tracked vehicle, and those units are just generally not worth it in 4th Edition 40k Competitive Armies.

The end of the debate for me, putting the Battlewagon firmly in the “Competitive” category was the fact that they’re useful in the context of a competitive army. They’re easily one of the best Heavy Choices and against MEQ’s they’re a pretty damn good tank, drawing fire from the rest of the army and putting out good firepower. They can also be used to devastating effect screening Trukks to get critical assaults off. I can’t see taking a KoS style army and not including Battlewagons for this reason.

Now it should be stated that while this unit is definitely “Competitive”, there are bad options for this tank and they need to be handled with care. They’re not Falcons or even Hammerheads in terms of survivability, but they are good and can be used properly to secure a victory for the Waaaagh.

Equipping the Battlewagons

Equipping your ‘Wagon is based very much on the task you want to set out before it. Do you want a cheap screen for trucks? Do you want to transport 20 Boyz somewhere? Do you want to Transport only 12 Boyz somewhere? Do you want a main battle tank that can dish out firepower galore?

These are the questions you need to ask yourself when you think about taking a battlewagon. Just slapping some of the many options together and putting it on the table will likely result in failure. The key here is to pick a task and then equip the wagon accordingly. Of course there are some options that should always be taken and some that should always be avoided.

-Killkannon: It’s a limited version of the Battlecannon: 24” S7 AP3 Pie plate. It won’t instant kill characters, and it’s short ranged, but you can move and fire this sucker. Obviously, if you want a BattleWagon that’s a Main Battle Tank that will kill just about anything it shoots at; this is the upgrade for you.

-‘Ard Case: Close the top of the Battlewagon. I consider this almost mandatory for Main Battle Tank ‘Wagons, bad for Transport Wagons. It could be argued that if you want to transport a shooty unit, then this upgrade is pretty good for a Transport Wagon, but for the most part any shooty unit should probably be on foot anyway.

-Deff Rolla: Some people go on and on about this upgrade and I can’t honestly see why. Sure it lets you re-roll difficult terrain tests for the tank, and it can do D6 S10 hits when tank-shocking (or 2D6 when someone death or glories), but I just don’t see it being that useful vs. a knowledgeable opponent. First off, the Tank Shock hits allow armor saves, so honestly who cares if it’s S10, after it went above S8, it doesn’t matter since you can maybe do some casualties, but not a whole lot to matter. It’s not bad vs. AV13 vehicles, but you can’t tank shock what S10 would help against that Orks have problems with: AV14 Vehicles. So unless you plan on getting your Battlewagon to the other side of the table to tank shock a predator, it’s not going to be all that worth it. For what it does, I see it as too expensive and not that useful. You shouldn’t get near any tank you’d want to tank shock, and unless you’re fighting other Orks or maybe horde Nids, then the hits from Tank Shocks aren’t that great.

-Red Paint Job: Move an extra inch for free, for a small amount of points to boot. For ANY ‘Wagon, this is an almost mandatory upgrade for me. When you want to shoot your 24” Killkannon you can move 7” and fire, which is crucial to getting range. When you want to transport a unit into combat, that extra inch goes a mile! I can’t imagine a time I’d take a Battlewagon and NOT give it a Red Paint Job.

-Grot Riggers: More expensive this time around and not as good as they were before. Now they work in the shooting phase instead of at the start of the turn to re-mobilize an immobile vehicle. Still, it’s relatively cheap and if you’re taking it on a Heavy Support Battlewagon, especially a Main Battle Tank that is a Scoring Unit, I would always take them. In the first game I played with a Battlewagon they re-mobilized me on Turn 5, which let me move the Tank to score on an objective on Turn 6. I wouldn’t take this on Dedicated Transport Battlewagons though, since they’re not scoring and once they can’t move, they’re essentially dead anyway.

-Stikkbomb Chukka: Basically if you charge out of the Battlewagon, you count as having Frags. Critical for transporting say Burna Boyz or Nobz, but not so useful for just about anything else. It’s cheap, but I think maybe a little too expensive for what it does. If you’re going to use the Wagon as a dedicated Transport for Nobz it’s worth it, but not for Mega Nobz. Boyz in the Wagon it’s arguable since it’s cheaper than giving the whole squad Frags.

-Armor Plates: Extra Armor for Orks! This is one of the upgrades I would always take on a Battlewagon regardless of its mission in life. It keeps your transports moving, and your scoring units moving. Critical for staying alive or delivering cargo.

-Boarding Plank: One of the upgrades I just don’t see a whole lot of utility for. Embarked Troops can perform close combat attacks on an enemy vehicle within 2” if the ‘Wagon hasn’t moved more than 12” that turn. The problem is that most of the time you will have to get out to charge to even reach a vehicle controlled by a good player. I just don’t see it being very useful.

-Wreckin Ball: Another upgrade I’m not too thrilled about. If you move less than 12” you can make a S9 attack on a unit within 2” on a 4+. It’s OK vs. Vehicles if you can get it to go off, but how often will you be so close to an enemy vehicle to make it work? Likewise it’s still not that great vs. infantry units since it’s one hit that allows armor saves. And it’s pretty expensive to boot. For 10 Points more you can get a Deff Rolla if you really wanted to get up close and personal with your Battlewagons.

-Grabbin Klaw: Well here’s something that will make Skimmers sad! Get within 2” of a ‘Wagon with this and on a 4+ in the Movement phase, the enemy vehicle can’t move the next turn! The pay off here vs. Falcons and the like is absolutely huge, but honestly it’s something your opponent has to fall for and it’s not that great since your Wagons can be avoided by most vehicles in the game that this would be useful against! Still, if I have extra points when making a list and I need to buy something, I’ll put some Grabbin Klaws on my Battlewagons.

-Reinforced Ram: Cheap upgrade to re-roll dangerous terrain tests. Only 25% of the cost of the Deff Rolla, so if you want a Transport ‘Wagon, this is your upgrade!

-Kannon: Oh look, you can take a Kannon on your Battlewagon! Except it’s one shot and you’re BS2. And it’s no better than a Rokkit except for range and the option for a crappy blast template! Still if you’re looking for a cheap gun to put on a Transport Wagon so that the first “Weapon Destroyed” result doesn’t immobilize your vehicle, this isn’t a bad choice.

-Lobba: One must ask why you’d put this pretty crappy weapon on a Battlewagon. It’s only “good” in artillery because you can fire it indirectly at enemy troops, in groups of 3 for a barrage. And they somehow thought it was good enough to be more expensive than the Kannon upgrade. Avoid this bad idea like the plague.

-Zzap Gun: Once the Zzap Gun no longer auto-hit and the 2D6 penetration rules are gone, it stopped being very good. It’s being fired by a BS2 Vehicle, it’s not worth it compared to say the Kannon if you want a big gun on the tank that you have to roll to hit for using your Ballistic Skill.

-Big Shootas: You can have up to 4 of these things on the Wagon, and they’re not fired by the embarked crew anymore! They’re pretty cheap for what you get, so if you wanted to build say a very cheap AV14 Dakka Wagon it’s not the worst idea in the world anymore. I don’t see this as a competitive option, other than being the absolute cheapest “gun” you can throw on a Transport Wagon to prevent “Weapon Destroyed” from becoming “Immobilized”.

-Rokkit Launchas: Twice the price of the Big Shoota upgrade (which still isn’t that many points) you get a Rokkit to shoot. You can take up to 4 of these on your Wagon, but you have to stay still in order to fire all of them. Because it’s the same points cost as a Kannon big gun, I can honestly recommend staying away from this upgrade. You almost always want to be moving your wagon to fire, and you need to move to get units within the 24” range of this Gun. So you can effectively only take one Rokkit if you want to move and fire, and at the same points cost the admittedly crappy Kannon is a better buy because of the increased range.

As you can see that’s a lot of options! I hope that the breakdown here gives you a good idea of what you should and should not take on your wagons depending on what you want your wagons to do. Just remember this one guiding factor when it comes to building your Battlewagon: Remember the job you want and do not get bogged down throwing random upgrades on the thing! Keep it as cheap as you can while still giving it the tools it needs to get the job done – nothing more!

Recommended Configurations!

Since the Codex did such a terrible job of giving three example configurations of a Battlewagon, I figured I’d put down my three favorite configs:

1.) Main Battle Tank – 185 Points
Killkannon, ‘Ard Case, Red Paint Job, Grot Riggers, Armor Plates

2.) Transport ‘Wagon - 120 Points
Red Paint Job, Armor Plates, Big Shoota, Reinforced Ram

3.) Trukk Screener: 110 Points
Red Paint Job, Armor Plates

Viable Transport Combos

One thing to note here before we go into specific units is that even though you would be tempted to take 12 or less Boyz and realize you can transport them in a Killkannon Battlewagon. I recommend not transporting units in a Killkannon wagon for a couple reasons. First off it makes the ‘Wagon much more expensive and once you’re transporting a unit 99% of the time you’re going to want the Tank to be open topped. The base points for a Killkannon wagon is 150 Points, before you add any kind of upgrades on the thing that you’re going to want. That’s a lot of points for a tank that’s going to get +1 to the damage results when it does get hurt.

It also makes the tank that much more of a target and you’re tempted to not move the tank the full distance to transport them so that you can fire the Killkannon. This makes for a bad combination, since if you get one round of firing off and the tank gets gimped, you’re looking at a much longer footslog to the enemy with your transported squad.

The idea here is that if you’re going to transport something - do it all the way. Your goal is to limit shots on the ‘Wagon till you can deliver the payload and then you can worry about doing something else with it. Combining two functions into an expensive and somewhat fragile package is not a good idea.

Also remember that the rules that apply to the new Trukks do not apply to Battlewagons. If you get penetrated while moving fast, you will likely lose 75% of your Boyz being transported unless they’ve got some kind of an armor or FNP save. Taking Boyz in a Wagon as a transport is a risk, far more than taking them in

Now that I’ve stated some general advice, let’s get into specifics. One of the things that I want to cover here in this section are the different kinds of squads that one would want to take a Battlewagon for a transport. Some of these ideas are good and some are bad.

1.) Burna Boyz – This is the squad that could, if only they could take a Trukk to get them into assaults or up close. So while they can’t take a Trukk, they can get in a Battlewagon which works almost as well for delivering this expensive but hard hitting squad. In my opinion the Battlewagon is the only way to make Burna Boyz worth it as an Elites choice, but even then the combo isn’t good enough to make me want to take it competitively.

2.) Slugga Boyz – To be fair about it, there is something to be said about getting a delivery of 20 Slugga Boyz w/ PK Nob into combat. It’s devastating when it works and it’s not a terrible amount of points for the combo, and it keeps your deployment less cluttered and it “protects” 20 Boyz from small arms shooting.

There is a problem here though. For the “optimal” load outs (which is 20 Sluggas, with only a PK Nob + Bosspole with the above Transport ‘Wagon) you could get 20 Storm Boyz w/ PK Nob & Bosspole for the same cost or pay 44 Points more and get two units of 12 Boyz in a Trukk w/ PK Nob & Bospole. Once you consider these options, you start to understand why this combo isn’t all that efficient over other fast CC options available elsewhere in the list, and unlike Burnas you don’t get anything special with this squad you can’t get elsewhere with the aforementioned options.

3.) Nobz & MegaNobz – These guys make it exceptionally tempting to take a Battlewagon Transport because they can both take one as a dedicated transport that doesn’t use up a heavy slot! And that Wagon can’t take a Killkannon, so it follows my advice about dedicating yourself to working as a transport, so it must be a good idea right?

Wrong.

First off, if you take a Battlewagon as a dedicated transport, it’s not a scoring unit, and as you will find out they’re an expensive proposition no matter how you look at it, and they don’t bring a whole lot of firepower to the table either to make them worth their cost.

Second off, these two units can both take a Trukk as a dedicated transport, which is about half the cost of the Battlewagon when kitted out right and it offers a lot more speed and amazingly more protection if you do get shot and take damage because of the Trukks Ramshackle special rule.

4.) Shoota Boyz – Now this is one special case unit that I can see being pretty good in a Battlewagon, unlike their Slugga counterparts. The idea here is that you can take a Battlewagon, zoom up 13”, disembark, and start shooting on turn 1, giving your opponent 20 Orks w/ PK Nob to deal with right off the bat. This isn’t a terribly bad idea and it gives you an application for the Wagon that can be used right at the start and it only needs to be able to move for one turn in order to be effective – making it much easier to use and get results from. Taken three times over, it could give you a good model count for your Boyz while at the same time keeping you from deploying and moving a horde up the table. It’s vulnerable if you can’t hide all your stuff on turn 1 from opponents like Tau or Necrons, but for the most part it’s probably not a bad application of a Transport Wagon.

5.) Tankbustas – The other elite unit that’s probably not worth taking for a variety of reasons, but becomes somewhat useful when combined with a Battlewagon. By taking a Battlewagon and disembarking from the side you can screen your own LOS arcs to ensure you can target what you want with your unit. This is also a case where you could argue for a closed top transport ‘Wagon since disembarking from the side is a good idea with this unit. It’s also a case where you could make a weak argument to take them in tandem with a Killkannon ‘Wagon, since you probably won’t take more than 12 of these Boyz in the unit and they can work well together somewhat. I still don’t think that this is an optimal configuration, but if you want to try something for fun, I can see some skill making it work against other suboptimal lists in friendly games.

6.) Flash Gitz – Another Nob option that isn’t all that great on its own that can be made somewhat better using a Battlewagon. Much like the Shootas their primary goal is to get out and shoot, so a closed top isn’t a bad idea. Likewise their small mob size and 24” shooting range means that combining them with a Killkannon wagon is not a bad idea at all. The trick to using that will be the fact that you can move the ‘Wagon up 7” and fire like normal, but you can disembark the Gitz on the side of the tank (screening them from some shooting) and open up on a target 24” away with your D6 AP guns. Again, just like the Shoota Boyz, this is a combo that can be done on Turn 1, meaning that you don’t need your Wagon to spend a turn potentially being shot at for it to work out well and execute what you need done. Granted this is certainly not the most optimal combination in the codex, but boy does it take two fun units (that also can look awesome if converted right) and make them work in friendly games. I know that I personally will run this combo for my army in friendly games when I want to use the new Flash Gitz I’m converting.

7.) The final combination I can think of for Wagons is not a very good one. The idea is using it as a firing platform for Lootas. By keeping it open topped, you can park it as an AV14 bunker for Lootas to shoot from. Granted you can’t move and fire from there, but it could be useful against armies without a lot of AV14 busting capability, but those armies are few and far between. You’re still looking at an open topped AV14 vehicle that has to sit out in LOS without moving to perform it’s function – this is a very bad application for a Wagon, although you could do it with just the cheapest Wagon possible it’s probably not a good idea.

I think that’s about as much as I can say for the Battlewagons, covering just about any kind of unit you could possibly throw into one. Hopefully this lengthy section has been useful and given you insight to ways you could use a Wagon in your army competitively or even just in friendly games.

Deff Dread
Utility: Poor*

It’s such a shame to see that the Dread got no love going from the Old Codex to the new one. He’s gotten an extra attack, but his gun options went through the roof! And to be blatantly honest, he pales in comparison to the little brother the Killa Kanz.

One thing to remember is that no matter what you do, you’re dealing with a pretty expensive BS2 Walker that’s AV12. This thing will never be hard to neutralize unless you take a LOT of armored targets. The upside is that in the new Codex, you can take a lot of armored targets!

*Special Considerations
The utility of the Dread could be upgraded to Semi-Competitive based on the fact that you can take him as a troops choice by taking a Big Mek HQ choice. As a Heavy Choice, he is pretty poor, but the fact that you can get him as a decently survivable Troops choice for a cheap amount of points (if kitted right) then it’s not a bad idea if you’re looking to max out on other areas of the FOC.

Equipping your Dread
Well you have to figure out what you want your dread to do before equipping him.

You can go all assault, which is risky since it needs to see combat to survive, which is hard to do with a unit that moves 6” a turn and doesn’t start on the table in escalation, which is pretty expensive, or you can throw guns on there to shoot at BS2. Granted you can buy two guns, and they don’t count as Twin-Linked, so it’s not bad, but you need to decide what you want as you must take two of the following options to field a legal Dread:

-Big Shoota: Cheapest option. Not the greatest since you can get lots of dakka elsewhere in the list, but if you want a dead cheap dread, this is the way to go.

-Rokkits: Again twice the cost of the Big Shoota, but with two shots and the fact that you can move and fire both guns, you get something pretty decent here and Orks need all the Anti-Tank fire they can get.

-Kustom Mega Blasta: This is the most expensive gun, but it’s also the best. It’s effectively a Rokkit with AP2 and because the Dread is a Vehicle it gets to ignore any pesky Gets Hot rolls that otherwise make the gun suck for Ork infantry.

-Skorcha: Well it’s as cheap as the Big Shoota, but you have to get close to use it. I just don’t like Heavy Flamer options on Dreads unless they’re going in a Drop Pod, and since Orks don’t get Drop Pods, I don’t like it on the Deff Dread. This is one upgrade that should be avoided at all costs.

-Extra DCCW: Same cost as the Kustom Mega Blasta, but only effective in CC. It gives you a boatload of attacks if you take two, which at S10, I3, and ignoring armor saves, is pretty good. Still it’s expensive and only useful if you make it to assault and if you’re going to spend that many points on the dread, the better option is potentially the KMB. Pretty good to go all assault in a Cityfight game though.

Options:

-Grot Riggers: Pretty cheap and they can re-mobilize you in the shooting phase, which means you don’t get to move the turn you get fixed. This reason makes me want to ignore taking them. I won’t throw these on a dread till after I’ve run out of other places in the list to spend points.

-Armor Plates: While being twice the cost of Grot Riggers I think this is one of the “always take” options for the dread. In case of being stunned, which is pretty common, you get to keep moving. This gets you into assaults and gets you behind terrain if you’re in danger. It is moderately expensive on what is an AV12 target, so I can see an argument for not taking it, but if you’re committing to taking a dread, you may as well give it as many chances of being useful as possible.

Killa Kanz
Utility: Competitive

Well talk about making some changes from the last codex, Kanz are piloted by Grots! This brings some inherent advantages and not a whole lot of disadvantages. The big plus is that you didn’t lose any armor or attack values, and you’re now BS3! Granted the Kanz are only WS2 now, but you’ll still hit WS4 troops on a 4+, which is mainly what these guys should be going after.

Because of these changes, these guys make for some pretty good fire support units. No morale tests to worry about, moderate survivability, and they can hold their own in CC.

Equipping the Kanz

-Big Shoota: The cheapest gun, and honestly I feel it’s a waste here. The goal of the Kanz is fire support and if there’s one thing you don’t need in a properly built Ork army is more anti-infantry shots.
-Rokkits: Three times the cost of the Big Shoota, but it brings somewhat accurate anti-tank fire. Honestly, with move and fire, the ability to ignore target priority checks, and BS3, this seems like a great option until you see….

-Kustom Mega Blasta: For 5 points more than a Rokkit, you get what amounts to the same thing with AP2. Given that Orks have little to no good ranged armor ignoring weapons, and the fact that the KMB is now S8, you get all the goodness of the Rokkit with the ability to knock some 2+ Save units out too. Granted it’s 5 points more per Kan to upgrade, but you have to ask yourself, is it worth 5 Points to go from AP3 to AP2? I feel it is, but it’s not going to be the same for everyone depending on how they build their list. Answer that question for yourself and you will know how to arm your Kanz.

-Skorcha: Look a heavy flamer on a walker with the highest Ballistic Skill in your army! Avoid like the plague!

-Grotzooka: A new weapon for the new codex and a new option to ignore. A S5 small blast template that’s double the cost of the Big Shoota. It’s got two shots, but I see the same kind of thing that was said about the big shoota being applicable here. You don’t need more anti-infantry shots in an Ork army, and not on the most reliable unit with BS3 in the list.

Obviously I’m feeling that the Anti-Tank weapons here are your best bet for fire support. The Kanz are your most reliable BS3 unit in the army. Your biggest question is if its worth the points to upgrade to AP2 on your anti-tank guns or not. The choice of what you should probably be taking for your ranged gun is relatively clear: Rokkits or Kustom Mega Blastas.

Options:

-Grot Riggers: Pretty cheap and they can re-mobilize you in the shooting phase, which means you don’t get to move the turn you get fixed. This reason makes me want to ignore taking them. I won’t throw these on a dread till after I’ve run out of other places in the list to spend points.

-Armor Plates: While being twice the cost of Grot Riggers I think this is one of the “always take” options for the dread. In case of being stunned, which is pretty common, you get to keep moving. This upgrade is especially important for Kanz because they’re fielded in Squadrons, and if one gets Shaken and can’t move, it gets destroyed if the other Kanz in the Squadron move away from it. This keeps them all moving till ones dead or immobilized. I’d put it on my “always taken with Kanz” list.

Extra Advice

Kanz are best fielded in squadrons. Like unit sizes even numbers are better than odd because of the scoring unit rules. Because of this always try to maximize the use of your FOC slots. If you’re going to take 6 Kanz, take 3 units of 2 if you can help it. Likewise, if you’re going to field 3 Kanz, take a unit of two and a unit of one. Fielding 9 Kanz is inefficient in terms of scoring unit sizes but it gives you the maximum durability for the unit. And for an army it’s is pretty appealing and when combined with a horde style list I think it is a pretty good choice.

Flash Gitz
Utility: Poor

Right off the bat I’m going to state that if you’re looking for something competitive, these guys aren’t it. They’re a very interesting unit but they cost way too much for what they do and they’re easily neutralized. That said; they’re a very interesting unit with a lot of options so I will dedicate some space to them. If you’re not interested in ways to make a mediocre unit work in friendly games, skip this section.

Sadly these guys are another unit of seemingly hard to kill Orks that are saddled with terrible LD problems that ensure that once you do lose some of these very expensive models, you’re going to take a LD test, fail, and they’ll be gone for good. And because of their high cost and max unit size of 10, they can’t really benefit from the special Ork LD rules.

This all said, out of all the Ork units that suffer from this problem, Flash Gitz are probably the most useful of these units in terms of what they bring to your army, though they do cost an arm and a leg to do it.

Here’s what they do: They have D6 AP on their guns. To start with they’re Assault 1, S5, 24”. So what you’re looking at is something that can move and fire some potentially devastating shots, depending on what you roll for the squads AP value. The problem is that they’re BS2 and only one shot!

Additionally these guys are Nobz with ‘Eavy Armor, so in terms of survivability they’re pretty good (for an Ork), especially if you give them the Painboy option, which should always be taken to give the unit the Feel No Pain Special Rule.

Equipping the Gitz

The Gitz have three upgrade options for their guns, which can be combined in any way for the unit to give them a custom gun setup. They all cost the same amount of points to upgrade, and of course some upgrades are better than others, so lets review:

-More Dakka: This is by far the best upgrade you can give to Flash Gitz. They’re only BS2 and with only 1 shot on their guns, it’s not going to do a whole lot. By increasing their guns to Assault 2 with no downside and the same points cost as the rest of the upgrades, you’re looking at something that should always be taken if you’re considering Flash Gitz as a unit.

-Shootier: This increases the strength of the gun to S6, which means you’re wounding most things on 2’s. Personally I see this as the least taken upgrade since the draw with the Gitz is that you’re getting D6 AP, and with S5 you’ve got the strength to put wounds on a unit already. As a single upgrade it pales in comparison to More Dakka and if you wanted to throw it in combination with More Dakka you almost have to ask yourself why you’d want to for the points cost involved.

-Blastas: Well this one is tempting in the same manner that juggling hand grenades would be: Dangerous as hell but boy would it look cool! This gives you -1 to the roll for your AP value on your guns but adds the “Gets Hot!” special rule. When combined with the More Dakka upgrade which is almost mandatory for the unit, you have a better chance of wounding yourself than you do of wounding the enemy with your shooting. Of course with a 4+ armor save and Feel No Pain if you took the Painboy (and you should) I can see this being somewhat tempting as 75% of the time you do take a wound, it’s saved, it’s still expensive and dangerous to yourself. I can see taking it for a laugh, because it makes the unit more interesting, but if I wanted to “make Flash Gitz work” then I’d avoid the upgrade. Of course if you’re playing competitively you’re probably not taking Flash Gitz anyway, so this might not be such a bad upgrade if you are going to use them for fun.

Now that we’ve covered their guns options, lets look at what else you can take:

-Ammo Runts: You can take up to three of these guys which will let you re-roll a single miss on your to hit rolls. Their points cost isn’t that high, but again it’s more stuff for an already expensive unit. One thing can be said for certain if you’re looking at these guys: If you’re taking Blastas and More Dakka on your guys, buy the ammo runts, since it can save you from an overheat. Other than that, it’s really your call if you want to blow points on this upgrade or not.

-Painboy: For a decent amount of points you can have one of your models in the unit give up his heavy armor, snazzgun, and git finda to be a Painboy. Why do this for what probably amounts to double the cost of the base model (if you took a gun upgrade)? Well he gives you two things: Feel No Pain and the ability to take Cybork Body for the entire mob. To be blatantly honest, he’s worth it for Feel No Pain alone, and if you wanted to make the unit more of a points sink you could give them the Cybork Body upgrade, but it’s probably not worth it. Still, I would never take Flash Gitz without a Painboy in the unit, the added resilience of Feel No Pain is too good to pass up.

-Cybork Body: Arguably Cybork Body could make them more resilient against AP4 shooting, which is what will mainly be directed at the unit, but it’s a lot of points to upgrade an already very expensive model. Still, I can see some people taking it for fun.

Special Character
One unit of Flash Gitz in an army be led by Kaptin Badrukk, for a whole boatload of points.

Basically with this guy, you’re almost buying another Warboss, albeit one with only two wounds, but still he’s not a bad addition to the unit if you wanted to blow a ton of points in one spot. He gives you LD9, which I feel is his main draw, since it eliminates the Morale problem of the Gitz. His second draw is his gun, which is more like playing Russian Roulette than it is firing a weapon in 40k. It’s an Assault 3, S7 AP2 gun with the Gets Hot special rule. So basically you REALLY have a higher chance of wounding yourself than you do actually hitting the enemy, let alone hitting and wounding the enemy (he overheats on a roll of 1-3, hitting the enemy on a 5 or 6). Still, he comes with 3 Ammo Runts that let you re-roll some of his shooting, which is in addition to the 3 you can already take for the unit. Additionally he has a 3+ Armor save, so when you combine that with the fact that with a Painboy you’re looking at the prospect that he’s going to take a wound 1/6th of the time when he does overheat.

To be honest, I’m not sure how worth it Badrukk is. If you’re taking Flash Gitz you’re probably not being competitive in the first place, and he REALLY makes the unit a points sink that’s pretty easy to kill for your opponent, but boy I’m sure he’ll be great for a laugh if you do use him with some More Dakka+Blastas Flash Gitz.
The final thing that can be said for the Gitz is that they can be used pretty well with a Killkannon Battlewagon with an ‘Ard Case. This doesn’t make them even Semi-Competitive, but if you were looking for a way to use them intelligently, this is the way to be. See the Battlewagon entry for more details if you missed it.

Big Gunz
Utility: Poor

Ahh the Artillery made it into the new Codex, and despite the fact that they’re buffed because of Grots now having BS3 they’re still a terrible choice to field because of the slowed Artillery rules which make them very easy to kill. This combined with the natural low leadership of Orks, T2 of Grots, and the idea that if a stiff breeze even comes near an Big Gunz emplacement that it’ll go away makes it a very unappealing choice.

The only benefit the unit has is that it’s cheap and it’s somewhat accurate for Ork shooting possibilities. A unit of three of even the most expensive big Gunz with a Runtherd to give them a staggering LD7 will come in only at 100 Points, and it’s even less for other Big Gunz.

Still with only LD7 at best it’s not going to be good to select the best targets that aren’t already the closest of their kind that you want to shoot, and they’ll run when they take their first 25% casualties, which isn’t hard to do with only T2 as the majority toughness. Sure you can re-roll because of the Squighound, but then you’re losing D3 Grots to do it, and if you’ve taken shooting casualties, you’re going to be looking at having lost a good amount of grots from shooting and then more from having the re-roll. You can buy up to 6 additional crew members, but it’s still not that great for what you get.

The only good thing I can think of with them is you can take a cheap battery of Lobbas which can hide and claim a table quarter in Cleanse, while not being shot all game. That said, lets go through the three types of Guns available.

-Kannons: The default and cheapest option. It’s a Rokkit with 36” Range or a Frag missile with also 36” range. Whoopty do. The best you can hope for is a good round of shooting at BS3, with some ammo runts if you purchased them. With only S8 it’s not bad, but still nothing all that spectacular. It is very cheap though, but even at the tiny cost I can think of other places to spend the points.

-Lobbas: The second cheapest option is not terrible for what it costs, but it doesn’t do a whole lot. It can fire indirectly, so you negate the survivability and LD problems of the unit, but all you’re looking at is 1 to 3 S5 AP5 small blast templates firing as a barrage. It does cause pinning, but it’s still not all that great.

-Zzap Guns: The most expensive gun is still pretty cheap, but it’s no where near what it was last edition. It’s range increased to 36” but it lost the 2D6 Penetration bonus! It’s still got a random strength and AP2, and if you roll above 10 for the strength you still lose a grot as a casualty, but now the shot is fired anyway at S10. The biggest loss is that it no longer auto-hits, but at least it can shoot at long range now which is somewhat of a plus. Still it’s not very good compared to other options you could have when selecting shooting units in the Ork Codex.

To be honest, this is one of the poorest units in the Codex. There aren’t any compelling ways to use this entry and even then their application isn’t all that great. The only good thing I can say about them is that in a horde shooty list, they can provide some support to your list while either drawing fire that could be directed at your Boyz. Still there are better ways to spend the points in a horde than on these Gunz.

Looted Wagon
Utility: Poor

And here we have one of the most useless entries in the book. If this was supposed to be the entry that let players use their old Looted Tanks to “Counts As” a Looted Wagon, they sure did a poor job. Old looted tanks should “Counts As” a Battlewagon with Killkannon and nothing else. If anything, if there were players who liked fielding really crappy unit options from the old Ork codex, then this is the entry for you.

The first thing you’ll notice is that this is an Open Topped Rhino that takes a breakdown test. You roll a dice for each Looted Wagon in your army each turn and on a 1 you zoom forward the maximum possible distance.

It has a myriad of options like the Battlewagon Entry and I’m not going to cover each of them since almost anything you could say about them in that entry is applicable here.

The only “draw” to the Wagon is that you can field it with a Boom Gun, which is a 36” S8 AP3 Pie Plate. The problem here is that this pie plate is mounted on an AV11 vehicle that can not be relied upon to always do what you want it to do. It comes together pretty cheaply when kitted out, but think about this as an opponent, if you see an AV11 vehicle with a 36” Battlecannon on it, how high does it rate on your target priority list? Even the most modest anti-tank firepower will neutralize the Looted Wagon and even the most careful deployment by the Ork player can be ruined if you roll a 1 and zoom forward, exposing your AV11 vehicle to shooting AND preventing you from firing your Boomgun in the process!

Likewise, it’s not a very fast vehicle, being a normal tank that with Red Paint can run around at 13” a turn maximum. Another “tempting” option is that it can take a Grabbin Klaw to try and nail skimmers, but with AV11 and at best a closed top, it can hardly be relied upon for that job.

And the final potential use of the Looted Wagon is as a Transport, except it is an epic failure here almost more than in the other two possible areas of use for the unit. It’s only barely more survivable than a Trukk but it doesn’t bring the amazing Ramshackle rules with it. At least the Battlewagon brings the AV values of a Leman Russ to make it tempting to use as a transport, but the Looted Wagon is just at terrible choice for a transport, offering none of the durability of the Battlewagon and none of the speed or reliability of a Trukk, all while costing the same amount of points as a Trukk and taking a heavy support slot.

This is honestly the worst unit in the Codex and I can’t imagine how someone in Games Development could honestly look at the entry and imagine someone using this unit. It literally has no application in the list other than potentially being something cheap to draw fire from other units and present the threat of being a Battlecannon.

While this sounds good on paper, you can do the same thing with much better results with a Battlewagon with Killkannon.

Heavy Support Summary

There really are only two units in contention for being “good” in this section, which is rather sad, but out of the two options you can get a surprising amount of variety.

Battlewagons have a myriad of uses, so much so that it’s evaluation takes up more space than almost any other in the Takktica. There is literally a ton of applications for this tank and many different configurations that you can take. When taking a Kult of Speed list based around Trukks for delivery, I see taking some Main Battle Tank style ‘Wagons with Killkannons to both draw fire and screen some units.

Conversely in a horde style list you want to deny your opponent any big targets with an AV value and high points cost that make their anti-tank guns actually do something effective. For this I’d consider taking Killa Kanz as they’re cheap, numerous, and provide good shooting support and a decent CC punch. The fact that you can take up to 9 in an army list is pretty good in terms on making them live long enough to achieve something effective. Plus they should draw fire from the horde of Boyz.

Other entries like Flash Gitz & Dreads aren’t very good but can make for interesting choices in fun games. Flash Gitz in a Killkannon Battlewagon is actually a pretty fun if way overcosted combination and a Deff Dread taken as a troops choice with a Big Mek HQ selection can make for a fun way to fill FoC requirements if you’re building a themed list.

Sadly you’re also looking at units like Big Gunz and Looted Wagons which are among the worst entries in the new Codex, with the Looted Wagon being an epic failure at almost any task you could try and put before it. At least Big Guns could be put down as an arguable unit choice in a horde list to draw fire or provide some support and target overload, but even then you’ll find it’s better to spend the points on more of already good support units like Lootas.

This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2007/12/18 17:10:54


 
   
Made in us
[ARTICLE MOD]
Fixture of Dakka






Chicago

I have to disagree with your analysis on how to equip trukks.

First, the weapon;
In the old codex, the rokkit was the cheaper option. In the new codex, it's the big shoota. So, sure, the default "cheap gun" is the big shoota. However, I don't think that's the best way to run them. In my experience under the old codex, and playing kult of speed, you hid your trukks during deployment, moved 24" on the first turn, hopefully hidden somewhere, and moved 12 and disembarked and charged on the third turn.

Now, you've got an empty non-scoring trukk, that can fire that turn. A big shoota really isn't all that interesting. It doesn't add anything that anything else in the army can't also do. A rokkit, however, can do good things. And, three rokkits can actually accomplish some goals. Since empty trukks are both non-scoring and barely a threat, I'm all for spending the few points to get them a gun that might actually hurt anything. And, if that draws any fire away from the boyz because the trukk has a threat now, even better.

Second, on Red Paint Jobs. I feel this is a complete waste of points on a trukk. It's already a fast vehicle. An extra inch moving is not worth 15% of the vehicle's cost. Even when you're not moving over 12", it only gets you a 8% speed increase. Save the red paint for non-fast vehicles, which get a very tangible bonus to being able to move 7" and shoot. You're much better off with a reinforced ram for these points, as, unlike imperial rams, you get the re-roll regardless how far you moved during the turn. That makes trips through terrain much easier, and going through, rather than around, is likely to result in a savings of much more than the one inch that red paint gets you.

Third, the armour plates are no longer worth it. I mean, you're an AV10 vehicle. Any penetrating hit forces a disembark anyway. So, you're only protecting yourself against one potential result out six on the glancing table. For that, you're paying 28% of the vehicle's cost. Not worth it in my book. I went without armour plates under the old codex and did just fine, I see no reason to take more-expensive, less-useful ones in the new codex.

   
Made in us
Krazed Killa Kan






South NJ/Philly

Redbeard wrote:I have to disagree with your analysis on how to equip trukks.

First, the weapon;
In the old codex, the rokkit was the cheaper option. In the new codex, it's the big shoota. So, sure, the default "cheap gun" is the big shoota. However, I don't think that's the best way to run them. In my experience under the old codex, and playing kult of speed, you hid your trukks during deployment, moved 24" on the first turn, hopefully hidden somewhere, and moved 12 and disembarked and charged on the third turn.

Now, you've got an empty non-scoring trukk, that can fire that turn. A big shoota really isn't all that interesting. It doesn't add anything that anything else in the army can't also do. A rokkit, however, can do good things. And, three rokkits can actually accomplish some goals. Since empty trukks are both non-scoring and barely a threat, I'm all for spending the few points to get them a gun that might actually hurt anything. And, if that draws any fire away from the boyz because the trukk has a threat now, even better.


The Big Shoota comes on the vehicle for free, the Rokkit costs points. I don't see much utility to spending the points per Trukk to upgrade each gun to a Rokkit for a BS2 Shot. Yes it helps them do things after transporting the unit, but I'd rather have them go off and become a wall to block LOS somewhere or hide to deny VP's, or be there to get the unit and redeploy them. Giving them Rokkits makes them more expensive and a target to be shot at where as they may otherwise be ignored all together.

Second, on Red Paint Jobs. I feel this is a complete waste of points on a trukk. It's already a fast vehicle. An extra inch moving is not worth 15% of the vehicle's cost. Even when you're not moving over 12", it only gets you a 8% speed increase. Save the red paint for non-fast vehicles, which get a very tangible bonus to being able to move 7" and shoot. You're much better off with a reinforced ram for these points, as, unlike imperial rams, you get the re-roll regardless how far you moved during the turn. That makes trips through terrain much easier, and going through, rather than around, is likely to result in a savings of much more than the one inch that red paint gets you.


I can't agree at all here. That extra inch for the charge goes a mile, literally. When you're playing against other skilled players, making charges and movement is going what is going to decide the game, and extending your charge range is well worth the small points cost. Sure it's 14% of the base cost of the Trukk, but the Trukk is dirt cheap! If I had to decide on one upgrade at all to give the thing it'd be the Red Paint Job and that's all.

Third, the armour plates are no longer worth it. I mean, you're an AV10 vehicle. Any penetrating hit forces a disembark anyway. So, you're only protecting yourself against one potential result out six on the glancing table. For that, you're paying 28% of the vehicle's cost. Not worth it in my book. I went without armour plates under the old codex and did just fine, I see no reason to take more-expensive, less-useful ones in the new codex.


I never liked them in the old codex, but I'm seeing your point. I mentioned this much in the Takktica and I am considering using the Reinforced Ram instead, which will drop the cost of the Trukk down overall. Arguably I can see adding the Stikkbomb Chukka to bring the cost back where it was and giving yourself an added capability. I will modify the Trukk entry in light of this and start playtesting without Extra Armor.
   
Made in de
Dominating Dominatrix






Piercing the heavens

well, I guess that sums it up pretty well. thanks voodoo for your really interesting thoughts.


one thing though...am I the only one who can't find that Zzap Guns have the melta rule? I just don't see it.
   
Made in us
Krazed Killa Kan






South NJ/Philly

Well damn, you're right. Someone had it in a summary I saw, but looking through the rules, it's not there. Editing Takktica.....
   
Made in us
[ARTICLE MOD]
Fixture of Dakka






Chicago

Voodoo Boyz wrote:
The Big Shoota comes on the vehicle for free, the Rokkit costs points. I don't see much utility to spending the points per Trukk to upgrade each gun to a Rokkit for a BS2 Shot. Yes it helps them do things after transporting the unit, but I'd rather have them go off and become a wall to block LOS somewhere or hide to deny VP's, or be there to get the unit and redeploy them. Giving them Rokkits makes them more expensive and a target to be shot at where as they may otherwise be ignored all together.


Different strokes for different folks then I guess. I think the ork list is currently weak against vehicles in general. If I can pack three of four more rokkits into my list for 20 points by sticking them on trukks, I'm going to do so.



I can't agree at all here. That extra inch for the charge goes a mile, literally. When you're playing against other skilled players, making charges and movement is going what is going to decide the game, and extending your charge range is well worth the small points cost. Sure it's 14% of the base cost of the Trukk, but the Trukk is dirt cheap! If I had to decide on one upgrade at all to give the thing it'd be the Red Paint Job and that's all.


You can get almost an inch simply by putting your nobs on 40mm bases, without spending the points. I dunno, I've never found the extra inch to make any difference at all in terms of making, or failing, to make a charge. The 24" move on the first turn, plus the 12" on the second, plus the 2" disembark + base width + 6" + (now) fleet, should be more than sufficient. I ran one red trukk and a bunch of other coloured trukks under the old codex, and the extra inch really isn't that important. I cannot recall a single game where it made a difference. (And, yes, that includes against good players. I played Centurion99 in the adepticon gladiator last year with my KoS, and the red paint didn't help or hurt me there either) And it costs more now than it did then too.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2007/12/18 17:01:06


   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





One thing about the Deff Rolla to remember is that it is good against skimmers. A skimmer generally wants to be 15-18" away to be optimal in dropping it's load. 13" move plus a possible 2-3" for the pivot towards the skimmer means that Wagon has a good chance of shocking the skimmer. Depending on what's in the skimmer (Harlies?) Getting closer isn't a problem
   
Made in us
Krazed Killa Kan






South NJ/Philly

Unit Evaluation: HQ Special Characters

Unlike the Eldar Codex, Phil Kelly didn’t really give us any incredible special characters that are almost always better than the standard choices available. The choices we have bring their own benefits and weaknesses to the list and are pointed probably more than their worth most of the time. Still some of them allow for some very interesting changes to the Ork army list and in higher point games they can prove to be extremely valuable.

Given this, I’m not really going to give each character a Utility rating. They are something that is more of a grey area in the list in terms of how good they are and many times it’s very points dependant.

Ghazghkull Thraka

For a little more than the cost of 30 Boyz w/ a Power Klaw Nob with Bosspole you can take the Grandest Warboss known to all of Ork Kind. What you get here is a slightly beefed up Warboss in Mega Armor with some unique special rules.

First off we start with a giant loophole in the rules for Ghazgkull. He’s got a special rule that gives him +2 Attacks when charing instead of the usual +1. The problem here is that he wears mega armor, and as such gets no bonus attacks for charging, per the Universal Special Rules in the BGB. We can only guess that this is something that will change in 5th Edition, when it’s released. Go-Go GW Games Development!

Next off is the fact that Ghaz has 4 Wounds and is immune to instant death and he’s got an extra attack on his profile. This makes up for the fact that a normal Warboss in mega armor is pretty well gimped compared to one on foot or on a Bike. He still has less attacks in CC after charging than a normal boss will when equipped with a Power Klaw + Slugga though. Ghaz does have WS6 however, which is something over a normal Boss.

But none of this has anything to do with why Ghaz is so expensive and why he will be desired by Ork players. This lies in his Prophet of the Waaagh! Special rule.

When Ghaz calls the Waaagh, it replaces the normal Waaaagh rules in the book and a few extra things happen. Most notably all units count as having rolled a 6 for their fleet move. That’s the big one right there. After that you’re looking at some other benefits such as units not fleeing become fearless until the end of the opponents next turn, and likewise Ghazgkull’s saving throw becomes invulnerable for this period as well.

So while he costs a boatload of points, he has the power to turn a game around for the Ork player in a single shot, which is pretty substantial.

Personally I see him being most useful in Apocalypse games where his high points cost and the larger number of Boyz fielded can be more useful. Plus it probably would take a large apocalypse game to represent the amount of Boyz Ghaz probably has at his disposal anyway.

Mad Dok Grotsnik

The Good Doktor is back and he brings with him a mixed bag of abilities and special rules.

He is essentially a stock Warboss with ‘Eavy Armor except he’s only S4 and I3. What he does bring is the ability to join himself to any unit, which he confers the Feel No Pain ability to. The problem here is that he also makes the unit Fearless but makes them subject to being led around. They must always move as fast as possible towards the nearest enemy, assaulting if possible. This brings with it a problem that it becomes extremely easy to lead the unit he is with around.

Granted this could be mitigated somewhat by putting him in a Trukk unit or a Battlewagon, where you can let him out more on your terms and get him stuck in where he’ll do damage with his mob of Boyz.

The other thing he brings to the army is that he allows any unit in the army to take Cybork Body for a certain cost per model (Guardsman -1 Point). This isn’t exactly a great ability and it’s not that great on normal Boyz, but it could be good for themed armies using say Mega Armored Nobz or something along those lines.

Because of his limitations and pretty high cost I see him as the weakest special character, but he could be pretty fun in a themed list.

Wazdakka Gutsmek

A Biker Boss Special Character, with some pretty unique special rules to boot!

Wazdakka is essentially a Warboss but with only I3 and S4, meaning his Power Klaw is only S8 (S9 on the charge) and he has no invulnerable save. He does come with Meks Tools, a Bosspole, and a Kustom Mega Blasta, but none of those are actually all that good. Because of this, in terms of being a Close Combat Killer, he is inferior to the standard Biker Warboss that can be built from the unit entry as detailed in the HQ section of this Takktica. However there are a few tricks and rules that Wazdakka has that make him appealing to Ork players.

The first ability that many people will notice is that he has a Dakkakannon on his Bike. This is an Assault 4 S8 AP4 gun that he can fire after Turbo boosting. Some people see this as some kind of godsend ability, but I’m thoroughly unimpressed. So he can Turbo Boost and shoot a 4 Shot gun at BS2, he needs an escort to not be the closest target to use his IC rules to full effect, and even with this gun he’s better off in combat killing troops than he is trying to get some S8 shots off. My point here is that to use this supposedly wonderful ability you need to buy him an escort that has to turbo around with him and essentially do nothing while he shoots a gun at BS2.

The real reason people will want Wazdakkka is because he’s “Da Biker Boss” and allows you to take Warbikes as Troops instead of Fast Attack. Now if you’ve read the Takktica you’ll know that Warbikes aren’t the best choice in the codex, but it is a relatively fun choice and makes for a hell of a themed list.

In summary he’s not that good but for themed armies or for some general hilarity he will be taken by some Ork players addicted to high-speed mayhem.

Old Zogwort

The Wierdboy Special Character, Zogwort is actually pretty good. He’s got a nifty ability that you can’t get anywhere else, is the most reliable Wierdboy you can take, and unlike Ghazgkull his points cost doesn’t break the bank.

He’s still pretty expensive, working out to be 60 Points more than a Warphead, but he will essentially never suffer the negative effects of an ‘Eadbang roll. Furthermore he is absolutely deadly to any enemy Independent Character within 18”. This is because he may replace any roll he gets for his psychic power with “Zogwort’s Curse” which forces a dice off between the Ork player and their opponent. If the Ork player rolls higher, the enemy IC is turned into a Squig that you must provide the model for. They have no wargear or special rules anymore, and count as infantry from that point forward.

Granted that will be hard to use sometimes, and it only works on IC’s not on any enemy model, so against things like Tyranids it’s going to be a waste, but at least it prevents you from suffering a ‘Ead Bang result.

Furthermore Zogwort has a poisoned staff that always wounds on a 2+, so if he’s in CC and you roll a 1-3 for his powers, he has a power weapon that always wounds on a 2+, not too shabby!

Likewise he’s a Warphead and can re-roll a result he doesn’t like, and can replace the power with his Curse power at will. So this is the only case where you can say that if you’re considering taking a Warphead for an HQ slot and have 60 Points to spend, it’s almost always better to take Zogwort if you can afford him. He’s the only case where this is true over a normal counterpart in the list, but his points cost is high enough where you have to think twice about taking him.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





I can't see any reason in the world not to use Reinforced Ram. Without it the Trukk can't tank shock. Remember that it isn't just a reroll on 6" moves through terrain like dozer blades, but the full distance. Its 5 points. Who in the world wouldn't use it? I regard it as mandatory.

All in all, fact is that Warhammer 40K has never been as balanced as it is now, and codex releases have never been as interesting as they are now (new units and vehicles and tons of new special rules/strategies each release -- not just the same old crap with a few changes in statlines and points costs).

-Therion
_______________________________________

New Codexia's Finest Hour - my fluff about the change between codexes, roughly novel length. 
   
 
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