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Requin wrote:So did anyone else notice that you can double your psychic powers by splitting into combat squads? Two 5 man purifier combat squads can charge into a horde and put a wound on 75% of them (which counts towards combat resolution, of course) before combat even starts. Poor orks and nids.

Yes, I've noted this in another topic. Although you have to split them when the unit deploys.

Good point about grenade caddies, but i'll probably always take a Grand Master just for the tactics he can give out. Since it's done before deployment, you can really spread the bonus' with Combat Squading. If you go first, you can pick scout and get some Interceptors and a Dreadknight on a first turn charge on something.

Plus, you can give the GM a Master Crafted Psycannon, which is nice =P

I like the Stormraven too, it's been pretty successful in my BA games, coming in from reserve and dropping termies and a Dread into close combat.

A Grand Master psycannon costs 45 points, 50 points with mastercrafting. That's 5 times the cost of a powered-armour psycannon, and 2.5 times the cost of a terminator psycannon. Totally not worth it.

Save your points and kit him out for close combat.

Jaon wrote:

ph34r wrote:Yeah? You can instakill everything in the game with every unit in your army. Guess what: Every Single GK Has A Force Weapon.

Ohh everything in the game? with every unit in my army? Oh and all GK have force weapons? I guess that PAGK with incinerator has a nemesis force index finger, what about crowe?

Ok Ill go instakill Marneus Calgar with an Inquisitorial Servitor.

Or maybe I could TRY to instakill a trygon with my Grand Master, then realize I am wounding on 6's unless I have a DH (the trygon will have killed me by now if so) and cant get a wound in.

You speak as if reducing the toughness of an enemy unit for 15 points is a bad thing.

Everything in your post is legitimately wrong. Anything else you'd like to share?

(Sorry guys, just had to teach ol' ph34r a lesson in flaming)

Hahahaha, man you pull off intentionally obtuse well. Have you been practicing?
(In during you are butt hurt)

Here's what I'm thinking right now:

++HQ++
Lord Kaldor Draigo, Supreme Grand Master- 275

++Elites++
8 Purifiers with two psycannons, five Nemesis force halberds, one Nemesis dæmonhammer, Rhino- 267
8 Purifiers with two psycannons, five Nemesis force halberds, one Nemesis dæmonhammer, Rhino- 267
8 Purifiers with two psycannons, five Nemesis force halberds, one Nemesis dæmonhammer, Rhino- 267

++Troops++
Paladin with Nemesis Dæmonhammer- 55
Paladin with Nemesis Dæmonhammer- 55
Paladin with Nemesis Dæmonhammer- 55
Paladin with Nemesis Dæmonhammer- 55

++Fast Attack++
10 Interceptors with two psycannons, Justicar with master-crafted Nemesis Dæmonhammer- 295

++Heavy Support++
Dreadnought with two twin-linked autocannons, psybolt ammunition, and searchlight- 136
Dreadnought with two twin-linked autocannons, psybolt ammunition, and searchlight- 136
Dreadnought with two twin-linked autocannons, psybolt ammunition, and searchlight- 136


++Summary++
45 models (39 infantry, 6 vehicles)
1,999 points total

That actually looks pretty interesting, not going to lie. The main problem would be if your opponent actively searched out your terminators with heavy weapons.

Also, I would recommend upping the Purifiers to squads of 10 so you could combat squad them if need be.

Personally, I would drop the psycannons on the Interceptors in favour of an incinerator, but that's me.

I would try to up those purifiers to units or 5 and 10, Fetterkey.

So I was looking at making a small force of GK when they come out since I'm interested in painting them. I'm looking to make a cheap force. That probably means a termie army, or maybe something else? I guess the list would be between 500-1250? I don't want to spend too much on them right away. Just something to try out while I'm learning with my wolves.

If someone asked this in here sorry, I just can't read 7 pages to catch up.

Seriously, with just a HQ and 2 troops choice for a legal army, you'll be within touching distance of 500 points anyway.

So, there's a lot of talk about what's useless and got nerfed, but (without seeing the codex yet) what about some sort of hybrid forces?

Could you not ignore Crowe, still take 3 squads of purifiers and then use Draigo to make Paladins troops? Too expensive to be useful?

I hear that Strike Squads have the Deep Strike rule in the unit description. Does this mean that they can Deep Strike, but need to be 'Interceptors' in order to shunt? Or is it that only the Interceptor variety can Deep Strike and Shunt?

After reading Crowe's rules again, it turns out he can be useful. He has Cleansing Flame and the Brotherhood champion rules, so you just run him into a big mob of Orks, Guardsmen, Gaunts, Kroot, etc, pop Cleansing flame, and then go into Blade Shield stance.

A 2+/4+ re-roll-able seems plenty survivable and Cleaning Flame will clean out some attacks before anybody gets to swing. If he lives he'll most likely win combat and then might be able to run the unit down or force a bunch of fearless saves.

Crowe charges 30 Orcs, Cleansing Flame kills 12 (rounding down)

18 swing back, 0.22 wounds, PK nob does 0.315. As long as the Power Klaw doesn't land, he'll win combat by about 12 and kill another 10 through fearless saves.

If he gets charged on the other hand, he's screwed.

Cerebrium wrote:Seriously, with just a HQ and 2 troops choice for a legal army, you'll be within touching distance of 500 points anyway.

Well I'm trying to figure out if it'll be 2 boxes of termies or not, what to equip them with so I can use them in a bigger army without buying new ones. Also which HQ to get. I feel like it would be easy to hit 750 or 1000 without much more than that with maybe one other unit of something else.

Termies would mean I don't have to buy vehicles right away. At most I'd spend $200, not sure if I'm including the codex in that or not.

Termies and a Brother-Captain or a Grandmaster are a solid choice.

The intruduction of GK will force the metagame that is already boring full with mech into even more mech extremes.
Sad.

I like infantry orks.

Pyriel- wrote:The intruduction of GK will force the metagame that is already boring full with mech into even more mech extremes.
Sad.

I like infantry orks.

I know

I was hoping that 36" psycannons would make mech armies worried, but they never came...

Fetterkey wrote:
++Summary++
45 models (39 infantry, 6 vehicles)
1,999 points total

How will you win if you roll a 1 for Grand Strategy in an objectives based mission?

Pyriel- wrote:The intruduction of GK will force the metagame that is already boring full with mech into even more mech extremes.
Sad.

I like infantry orks.

I know right? I was interested in running a horde ork list but I know everybody and their mother will be taking purifiers, yeeouch.

Cerebrium wrote:Termies and a Brother-Captain or a Grandmaster are a solid choice.

Brother Captains are never a solid choice. 25 points gets you the invaluable Grand Strategy, which is well worth the cost (if you roll a 3, it's worth well beyond 25 points). You should always be able to make room for a Grand Master over a Brother Captain.

ph34r wrote:

Jaon wrote:

ph34r wrote:Yeah? You can instakill everything in the game with every unit in your army. Guess what: Every Single GK Has A Force Weapon.

Ohh everything in the game? with every unit in my army? Oh and all GK have force weapons? I guess that PAGK with incinerator has a nemesis force index finger, what about crowe?

Ok Ill go instakill Marneus Calgar with an Inquisitorial Servitor.

Or maybe I could TRY to instakill a trygon with my Grand Master, then realize I am wounding on 6's unless I have a DH (the trygon will have killed me by now if so) and cant get a wound in.

You speak as if reducing the toughness of an enemy unit for 15 points is a bad thing.

Everything in your post is legitimately wrong. Anything else you'd like to share?

(Sorry guys, just had to teach ol' ph34r a lesson in flaming)

Hahahaha, man you pull off intentionally obtuse well. Have you been practicing?
(In during you are butt hurt)

I learnt from the master Ph34r.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
RAW, taking 2 grand masters = x 2 grand strategy.

Fafnir wrote:

Cerebrium wrote:Termies and a Brother-Captain or a Grandmaster are a solid choice.

Brother Captains are never a solid choice. 25 points gets you the invaluable Grand Strategy, which is well worth the cost (if you roll a 3, it's worth well beyond 25 points). You should always be able to make room for a Grand Master over a Brother Captain.

So how does one represent a Grandmaster? I can't seem to find a generic one on GW.

Brother Captains are never a solid choice. 25 points gets you the invaluable Grand Strategy, which is well worth the cost (if you roll a 3, it's worth well beyond 25 points). You should always be able to make room for a Grand Master over a Brother Captain.

Well not all armies will need grand strategy, if you plan on DSing with multiple GKTs and just stand there with the rest thre is no real need for scout or what not.

But I agree, the captain is yet another dumb choice nobody (except me) will take.

Ward should have made one of those HQs into a kittable melee or shooty monster and the other into a supporting character for a wider variation of builds instead he made them exactly the same except for a stat point, strategy and 25p.

Portaljacker wrote:

Fafnir wrote:

Cerebrium wrote:Termies and a Brother-Captain or a Grandmaster are a solid choice.

Brother Captains are never a solid choice. 25 points gets you the invaluable Grand Strategy, which is well worth the cost (if you roll a 3, it's worth well beyond 25 points). You should always be able to make room for a Grand Master over a Brother Captain.

So how does one represent a Grandmaster? I can't seem to find a generic one on GW.

Very simple. The sergeant with some fancy paladin shoulderpads from the Terminator sprue will be absolutely fine.

Terminator armour? Check.

NFW? Check.

Storm Bolter? Check.

Possible Bare Head? Check.

If you want, steal an Iron halo from the Space Marine commander sprue or terminator sprue if you REALLY want to be super WYSIWYG, but otherwise, its 100% legal. AND PLASTIC!

Portaljacker wrote:

Fafnir wrote:

Cerebrium wrote:Termies and a Brother-Captain or a Grandmaster are a solid choice.

Brother Captains are never a solid choice. 25 points gets you the invaluable Grand Strategy, which is well worth the cost (if you roll a 3, it's worth well beyond 25 points). You should always be able to make room for a Grand Master over a Brother Captain.

So how does one represent a Grandmaster? I can't seem to find a generic one on GW.

The Brother-Captain model with a few extra bits would do fine. Some extra purity seals or whatnot.

Jaon's idea works too, and I'm considering the same thing

Pyriel- wrote:

Brother Captains are never a solid choice. 25 points gets you the invaluable Grand Strategy, which is well worth the cost (if you roll a 3, it's worth well beyond 25 points). You should always be able to make room for a Grand Master over a Brother Captain.

Well not all armies will need grand strategy, if you plan on DSing with multiple GKTs and just stand there with the rest thre is no real need for scout or what not.

But I agree, the captain is yet another dumb choice nobody (except me) will take.

Ward should have made one of those HQs into a kittable melee or shooty monster and the other into a supporting character for a wider variation of builds instead he made them exactly the same except for a stat point, strategy and 25p.

Agreed Pyriel, but a spare 25 points is nice to have if you want some scoring units. I think thats what he meant anyway. Better take something potentially useful for a small amount of points (relatively) than go with out.

Quick question coz I cant be bothered opening my rulebook. Can you assault on the same turn you outflank?

If you want, steal an Iron halo from the Space Marine commander sprue or terminator sprue if you REALLY want to be super WYSIWYG, but otherwise, its 100% legal. AND PLASTIC!

Aaargh, those are supposed to be "Icon of the Just" and not "iron halo". lol

Quick question coz I cant be bothered opening my rulebook. Can you assault on the same turn you outflank?

Yes provided you follow the rules for moving etc.
A transport with assault ramp flanking 12 can have its dudes charge but a rhino cant.

Pyriel- wrote:The intruduction of GK will force the metagame that is already boring full with mech into even more mech extremes.
Sad.

I like infantry orks.

Is this some kind of joke, or what? Grey Knights look to be promoting the nonmech side of the game more than any recent Codex, discounting Tyranids.

I didn't see deep strike in the troop termie entry in the back. Is it in the wargear section?

Also that plan for a grandmaster sounds excessively expensive to someone who just started.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
In terms of the many boxes I don't need to own required to build it.

Fetterkey wrote:

Pyriel- wrote:The intruduction of GK will force the metagame that is already boring full with mech into even more mech extremes.
Sad.

I like infantry orks.

Is this some kind of joke, or what? Grey Knights look to be promoting the nonmech side of the game more than any recent Codex, discounting Tyranids.

For GK, yes. However, GK are countered by mech more than by infantry, forcing the meta even further down the mech road.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Jaon wrote:I learnt from the master Ph34r.

Aww, I'll make sure to never point out you're wrong again! I hope you don't stay mad

For GK, yes. However, GK are countered by mech more than by infantry, forcing the meta even further down the mech road.

Ph3ar speaketh da truth.

Orks and other footslogging dudes dont particularily tend to like being shot at by stormbolters and incinerators.
Ergo: they ass up in transports, tanks, flotation devices and what have you to avoid getting smallarms massacred and voila, you end up not with a bad joke but with even more armies cramming in mech into their builds.

To be honest, I don't think that Codex: Grey Knights will have much of an effect on the proliferation of 180-Ork armies or blob IG. A much more significant factor limiting those armies, at least in competitive play, is the tendency of tournaments to hold to strict time limits. Overall I think that Codex: GK will increase the number of foot-based armies on the field. However, I also think that, as always, hybrid lists will remain the most effective.