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Wyrmalla wrote:
^^ In 3.5 Chaos didn't have a dedicated "Chaos Terminators" unit, much like they didn't have dedicated "Khorne Berserkers", or"Plague Marines". You would take terminator armour as an upgrade for particular models within a unit of Chosen. Each chosen was pretty much an aspiring champion, with all the perks, thus you could have a unit with half special weapons, and the other half in terminator armour. I guess it caused difficulties with all the differing armour saves and wargear, but the old chosen were a really fun unit to field with all their diversity and it was a shame to see them go. =/

That sounds like they'd do real well to come back as a Wolfguard-style unit.

Funny but i have no memory of this...

I remember that Chosen in PA or Termi where limited as own many you could take per 500pts slices.

That when you took Chosen you had the option to give them Termis, don't remember if you could take one armor and the rest be in PA or if you had to buy the armor for the whole unit...

And THEN you could make them all Aspiring Champs or just a few.

But the good stuff backthen was that if you took them as Bodyguards for your Lord, they din't count as Elite or in the limit of how many Chosen you could have.

Chosen as bodyguard retinue would be awesome, I feel their so lack luster currently. They get infiltrate and can stockpile up some powerfists, swords, lightning claws, melta.. anything you want but they are just as weak as normal CSM, talk about putting your eggs all in one basket! Even if they were 20pts or something. more but had Artificer armor, or some kind of chaos version of it!

Personally I've only used chosen a handful of times, most involve infiltrating meltagun 5 mans that basically scare people away from rolling past them.

^^ What like "Chaos Armour"?

They used to have the ability to take any number of the veteran skills that any marine unit could take. These were things like tank hunters or infiltrate. Normal units could only take one of these to my recollection, and by doing so became elites choices (though I haven't read 3.5 in years, so don't quote me on that). It would have been nice in the latest edition if they got some kind of age old veteran skill (ie a weapon skill boost + furious charge/fearless/perhaps eternal warrior) and had more emphasis on their individuality. The whole hand picked by the gods thing's been played down a little in the current codex, so it'd be nice to see something emphasing it in the next one (6+ save on death like bionics to represent the gods saying no no, or the ability to call on the god's favour like the Witch Hunter's acts of faith/re-rolls of dice every now and then). ^^

Wyrmalla wrote:They used to have the ability to take any number of the veteran skills that any marine unit could take. These were things like tank hunters or infiltrate. Normal units could only take one of these to my recollection, and by doing so became elites choices (though I haven't read 3.5 in years, so don't quote me on that). It would have been nice in the latest edition if they got some kind of age old veteran skill (ie a weapon skill boost + furious charge/fearless/perhaps eternal warrior) and had more emphasis on their individuality. The whole hand picked by the gods thing's been played down a little in the current codex, so it'd be nice to see something emphasing it in the next one (6+ save on death like bionics to represent the gods saying no no, or the ability to call on the god's favour like the Witch Hunter's acts of faith/re-rolls of dice every now and then). ^^

Just to clarify:

1. Any unit that was allowed to take Veteran Skills could take as many Veteran Skills as it wanted.
2. Unless it had a Mark of Chaos, in which case it could only take one. That was the trade off.
3. Taking a Mark of Chaos (except the MoCU) made you an Elite choice (unless you were an HQ choice or already an Elite choice).
4. If your HQ had the same Mark though, then you went back to the original slot you came from (so if you were Troops, you stayed in Troops).

It was a system that worked wonderfully except for one area where it broke down, the Chaos army that had 3 units of Havocs (Heavy Support) and three units of Havocs with the Mark of Slaanesh (Elites). And people complained about 4 HS Iron Warrior armies... honestly... you could play a 6 HS regular Chaos Army.

BrassScorpion wrote:As usual for a rumors thread, this is one or two rumors posts followed by pages and pages of bad jokes, wish lists and general off-topic nonsense. I checked this page to see if there was anything substantive and new, but discovered the usual stream-of-consciousness debris. And if we check back in another 7 pages or so I'm sure it will be the same. These threads ought to be closed after the first one to six posts, everything after that is generally useless (or worse).

'Bout time you stormed off then Scorp. Gotto keep that rep up!

BrassScorpion wrote:

Deadshot wrote:OK, I am not sifting through this thread, though I.love the memes. Can I get a quick.overview please?

As usual for a rumors thread, this is one or two rumors posts followed by pages and pages of bad jokes, wish lists and general off-topic nonsense. I checked this page to see if there was anything substantive and new, but discovered the usual stream-of-consciousness debris. And if we check back in another 7 pages or so I'm sure it will be the same. These threads ought to be closed after the first one to six posts, everything after that is generally useless (or worse).

Strong irony. Or should I say, the irony is begin to grow?

Kind Regards,
Vladsimpaler

One of my first memes I created:
http://memegenerator.net/instance/18602165

Stupid link not embedding properly.

Actually, in 3.5, Tzeench could take cult terminators but they were the only legion that could. 32ish points for 2 wound terminators with slow and purposeful? What a bargain!

mortetvie wrote:Actually, in 3.5, Tzeench could take cult terminators but they were the only legion that could. 32ish points for 2 wound terminators with slow and purposeful? What a bargain!

Anything with a God-specific Mark became a 'Cult' unit. That's what was so elegant about the old system - none of this Non-Marked/Icon Unit/Cult Unit half-way nonsense where people forget what God they serve when the dude with the banner wanders off. Chaos Space Marine squads with the Mark of Nurgle became Plague Marines. Chaos Biker units with the Mark of Khorne became Khorne Berzerker Biker units.

Tzeentch weren't unique in this regard, they just had additional rules for Rhubric units.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

mortetvie wrote:Actually, in 3.5, Tzeench could take cult terminators but they were the only legion that could. 32ish points for 2 wound terminators with slow and purposeful? What a bargain!

Anything with a God-specific Mark became a 'Cult' unit. That's what was so elegant about the old system - none of this Non-Marked/Icon Unit/Cult Unit half-way nonsense where people forget what God they serve when the dude with the banner wanders off. Chaos Space Marine squads with the Mark of Nurgle became Plague Marines. Chaos Biker units with the Mark of Khorne became Khorne Berzerker Biker units.

Tzeentch weren't unique in this regard, they just had additional rules for Rhubric units.

Rubric marines are legion specific cult troops just like plague marines, noise marines and berzerkers. Only Tzeench had an option to make cult/legion specific terminators was my point (Rubric terminators upgraded from rubric troops). No other cult/legion had that option =).

Chaos had 2 wound terminators before GK made it cool.

You're missing my point.

There were no 'Cult Troops' as actual choices in 3.5. Every unit was a generic unit with a Mark added, and that Mark changed that unit into a Cult unit.

H.B.M.C. wrote:You're missing my point.

There were no 'Cult Troops' as actual choices in 3.5. Every unit was a generic unit with a Mark added, and that Mark changed that unit into a Cult unit.

Ah, I see. Then Tzeench was the only faction/legion who could get marked terminators?

I have to say I'm very proud of the memes this thread has produced. Great job!

mortetvie wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:You're missing my point.

There were no 'Cult Troops' as actual choices in 3.5. Every unit was a generic unit with a Mark added, and that Mark changed that unit into a Cult unit.

Ah, I see. Then Tzeench was the only faction/legion who could get marked terminators?

Terminator: Standard base

Add Nurgle Mark

Fearless, +1 T

Add Tzeentch Mark

Add one wound.

I've lost track as to what people are talking about. But clearly people are mixing 3.5 and 4th edition (I have the 3.5 codex on my lap as I'm typing this)

1) There were only three troop choices. Chaos space marines, deamon packs, and nurglings. Specific only to the chaos space marine, if you gave them a mark of a choas god they became and elite choice (chaos marines with marks could then take wargear from the approparte gifts section). But thats it. Havoks/raptors/chosen/bikers/possessed etc. all stayed in their own sections. It was not possible to have 6 units of havoks (Ie. a squad of guys all using heavy weapons) in 3.5, that is a 4.0 thing. The only things that could jump around is the Chaos Space Marine turned into a cult choice, however if the HQ of the army had a god mark any chaos space marines with the same god mark reverted back to troop choices. There were also rules that disallowed certain marks to be present in the same army.

2) Terminators - Terminators came from chosen. You upgraded them for +19 points. You could then spend another 10 points to make as many or as few as you liked into aspiring champions (basically just giving them another attack). Chosen could also take a mark of a god. Thus giving them the weargear options in the approperate god section. So you could have slannesh/nurgle/khorne/tzeench terminators with the bonuses that go with them.

3) Cult armies - Thousand sons, Emperors Children, Death Guard, and World Eaters armies could be make by following the rules in the back of the book. Essentially if every model in your army had the same god mark you were playing a Cult army and got some bonuses like free aspiring champions and deamon packs in sacred numbers got +1 to their summoning rolls. For example in my EC army I could not have obliterators or Raptors because neither of those units were allowed the mark of Slannesh. My two units of damonettes had 6 and 12 models respectivly so they could have the bonus to summoning and my three units of chaos space marines, havok, and bikers all got free aspiring champion upgrades because they each only numbered 6 guys strong.

Jayden63 wrote:I've lost track as to what people are talking about. But clearly people are mixing 3.5 and 4th edition.

1) There were only three troop choices. Chaos space marines, deamon packs, and nurglings. Specific only to the chaos space marine, if you gave them a mark of a choas god they became and elite choice (chaos marines with marks could then take wargear from the approparte gifts section). But thats it. Havoks/raptors/chosen/bikers/possessed etc. all stayed in their own sections. It was not possible to have 6 units of havoks in 3.5. That is a 4.0 thing. The only things that could jump around is the Chaos Space marine turned into a cult choice.

2) Terminators - Terminators came from chosen. You upgraded them for +19 points. You could then spend another 10 points to make as many or as few as you liked into aspiring champions (basically just giving them another attack). Chosen could also take a mark of a god. Thus giving them the weargear options in the approperate god section. So you could have slannesh/nurgle/khorne/tzeench terminators with the bonuses that go with them.

Yes but Thousand Son cult troops (i.e., rubric marines with 2 wounds) could be upgraded to be rubric terminators. No other cult troop could be upgraded to be the equivalent terminator. It was either marked Chosen or Thousand Son rubric terminators.

mortetvie wrote:

Jayden63 wrote:I've lost track as to what people are talking about. But clearly people are mixing 3.5 and 4th edition.

1) There were only three troop choices. Chaos space marines, deamon packs, and nurglings. Specific only to the chaos space marine, if you gave them a mark of a choas god they became and elite choice (chaos marines with marks could then take wargear from the approparte gifts section). But thats it. Havoks/raptors/chosen/bikers/possessed etc. all stayed in their own sections. It was not possible to have 6 units of havoks in 3.5. That is a 4.0 thing. The only things that could jump around is the Chaos Space marine turned into a cult choice.

2) Terminators - Terminators came from chosen. You upgraded them for +19 points. You could then spend another 10 points to make as many or as few as you liked into aspiring champions (basically just giving them another attack). Chosen could also take a mark of a god. Thus giving them the weargear options in the approperate god section. So you could have slannesh/nurgle/khorne/tzeench terminators with the bonuses that go with them.

Yes but Thousand Son cult troops (i.e., rubric marines with 2 wounds) could be upgraded to be rubric terminators. No other cult troop could be upgraded to be the equivalent terminator. It was either marked Chosen or Thousand Son rubric terminators.

Ok, yeah, Tzeench was special that way, so you could field a whole bunch (60) terminators at 42 points each (without weapon upgrades) as elites because even if the HQ had the same mark I do not believe they stayed troops as it specifically says otherwise in the Book of Tzeench section.

mortetvie wrote:

Jayden63 wrote:I've lost track as to what people are talking about. But clearly people are mixing 3.5 and 4th edition.

1) There were only three troop choices. Chaos space marines, deamon packs, and nurglings. Specific only to the chaos space marine, if you gave them a mark of a choas god they became and elite choice (chaos marines with marks could then take wargear from the approparte gifts section). But thats it. Havoks/raptors/chosen/bikers/possessed etc. all stayed in their own sections. It was not possible to have 6 units of havoks in 3.5. That is a 4.0 thing. The only things that could jump around is the Chaos Space marine turned into a cult choice.

2) Terminators - Terminators came from chosen. You upgraded them for +19 points. You could then spend another 10 points to make as many or as few as you liked into aspiring champions (basically just giving them another attack). Chosen could also take a mark of a god. Thus giving them the weargear options in the approperate god section. So you could have slannesh/nurgle/khorne/tzeench terminators with the bonuses that go with them.

Yes but Thousand Son cult troops (i.e., rubric marines with 2 wounds) could be upgraded to be rubric terminators. No other cult troop could be upgraded to be the equivalent terminator. It was either marked Chosen or Thousand Son rubric terminators.

Well this way of doing was because their where no Chosen squads for Tzeentch, so if you wanted to have Termies, you then upgraded a Rubric unit into it, but they became Elite.

So nothing "unique" or wunderbarr here.

And rubric Termies was more fun in the 3rd Ed dex, only S5 weapons could hurt them, the old "All is but Dust" rule.

Slayer le boucher wrote:And rubric Termies was more fun in the 3rd Ed dex, only S5 weapons could hurt them, the old "All is but Dust" rule.

I loved the All is Dust rule, it was better than the 2W interpretation in 3.5 and the 4++ interpretation in 4.0. I wouldn't mind if the classic All is Dust was restored in 6.0.

When you take into account the current mech-infested, FNP, 3++ environment we have now, All is Dust is not so bad.

Beasts of War is reporting necron 2nd wave on May 5th, so no new codex for us traitors just yet.
http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/necrons-may-5th/

Rbb wrote:Beasts of War is reporting necron 2nd wave on May 5th, so no new codex for us traitors just yet.
http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/necrons-may-5th/

*shrugs* maybe later in the month?

Rbb wrote:Beasts of War is reporting necron 2nd wave on May 5th, so no new codex for us traitors just yet.
http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/necrons-may-5th/

I'm glad to hear it. I'd rather we get a bonafide 6th edition book instead of a poorly thought out "made with 6th in mind hurr durr" book.

Kind Regards,
Vladsimpaler

Personally I think you'll wait untill after DA and 6th. 6th to introduce new codexes (how aweful to have 6th come out weeks after 5th Ed Chaos?). Then DA will be out so they can sell loyalists and push towards Ultramarines with Box Pictures and fluff. Then Chaos.

Vladsimpaler wrote:

Rbb wrote:Beasts of War is reporting necron 2nd wave on May 5th, so no new codex for us traitors just yet.
http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/necrons-may-5th/

I'm glad to hear it. I'd rather we get a bonafide 6th edition book instead of a poorly thought out "made with 6th in mind hurr durr" book.

Kind Regards,
Vladsimpaler

Supposedly the book is done and ready, so it doesn't matter when it comes out.

Vhalyar wrote:

Vladsimpaler wrote:

Rbb wrote:Beasts of War is reporting necron 2nd wave on May 5th, so no new codex for us traitors just yet.
http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/necrons-may-5th/

I'm glad to hear it. I'd rather we get a bonafide 6th edition book instead of a poorly thought out "made with 6th in mind hurr durr" book.

Kind Regards,
Vladsimpaler

Supposedly the book is done and ready, so it doesn't matter when it comes out.

Key word there. Hypothetically if the book is done already then them's the breaks....hypothetically, of course.

Kind Regards,
Vladsimpaler

Rbb wrote:Beasts of War is reporting necron 2nd wave on May 5th, so no new codex for us traitors just yet.
http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/necrons-may-5th/

DAMMIT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I promise you all... When the new CSM come out... There will be blood... lots of blood... FOR THE BLOOD GOD !
Khorne damned Necrons...

Rbb wrote:Beasts of War is reporting necron 2nd wave on May 5th, so no new codex for us traitors just yet.
http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/necrons-may-5th/

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!

Mark my words (with khorne), when chaos is finally unleashed, the rivers shall run green and black with circuits from the many many many many many dead necrons, oh those tinheads are going to get some PAIN

Damn though, would've been perfect, chaos on my birthday. Has there ever been a codex and a wave release in the same month?

Hey now, the Cron second wave was rumoured to be coming up even sooner than this, so don't blame the ancient-undead-space-mummy-robots!

Slayer le boucher wrote:

mortetvie wrote:

Jayden63 wrote:I've lost track as to what people are talking about. But clearly people are mixing 3.5 and 4th edition.

1) There were only three troop choices. Chaos space marines, deamon packs, and nurglings. Specific only to the chaos space marine, if you gave them a mark of a choas god they became and elite choice (chaos marines with marks could then take wargear from the approparte gifts section). But thats it. Havoks/raptors/chosen/bikers/possessed etc. all stayed in their own sections. It was not possible to have 6 units of havoks in 3.5. That is a 4.0 thing. The only things that could jump around is the Chaos Space marine turned into a cult choice.

2) Terminators - Terminators came from chosen. You upgraded them for +19 points. You could then spend another 10 points to make as many or as few as you liked into aspiring champions (basically just giving them another attack). Chosen could also take a mark of a god. Thus giving them the weargear options in the approperate god section. So you could have slannesh/nurgle/khorne/tzeench terminators with the bonuses that go with them.

Yes but Thousand Son cult troops (i.e., rubric marines with 2 wounds) could be upgraded to be rubric terminators. No other cult troop could be upgraded to be the equivalent terminator. It was either marked Chosen or Thousand Son rubric terminators.

Well this way of doing was because their where no Chosen squads for Tzeentch, so if you wanted to have Termies, you then upgraded a Rubric unit into it, but they became Elite.

So nothing "unique" or wunderbarr here.

And rubric Termies was more fun in the 3rd Ed dex, only S5 weapons could hurt them, the old "All is but Dust" rule.

Actually, Tzeench could take chosen squads, each chosen became a sorcerer. So Tzeench had the option of like a full huge Chosen unit with thrall wizards shooting 2X bolt of change a turn which was pretty crazy. They then had the option for pure cult/rubric termiantors. Other legions only had the chosen option to get terminators and noting unique about those chosen to their god specific legion.